french 18yo comrade killed by fascists

[Sasha]

Just getting this in: http://www.lepartidegauche.fr/actualites/communique/l-horreur-fasciste-vient-tuer-en-plein-paris-23587
http://m.20minutes.fr/societe/1168639-20130605-paris-violente-agression-pres-gare-rer-saint-lazare

[Petrol Bomb]

Now I regret not paying attention in French class.

Ugh, just reading this. This is fucking horrible.

[The Feral Underclass]

Clément Méric, active with 'Action Antifasciste Paris-Banlieue' and the student group 'Solidarity'', Clement was attacked by a group of neo-Nazis in central Paris. He was rushed to hospital and later died of injuries.

Leaving a clothing store near the Gare Saint-Lazare, Clement was spotted by a group of neo-Nazis. They atacked him with fists, boots and knuckle dusters. Witnesses said it was a horrific and bloody attack.

Originally from the city of Brest in Brittany in northwestern France, Clement was studying in the Sciences Po.

http://media.rtl.fr/online/image/2013/0606/7762038981_clement-meric.jpg

[Dropdead]

That's fucked up.. Coward fascists..

[Sasha]

"As he was leaving a store in Paris yesterday (5.6.2013), Clément Méric, 18, antifascist and trade-unionist was beaten to death by members of a far right group. He had left the city Brest because he was studying politics in Paris ; and tonight he was a victim of the growing violences of the far right, which has been increasing in the last months. He died tonight at the hospital as a result of his wounds. We wish to express our sympathy and our solidarity to his family and his close friends. His friends and comrades"

[The Cheshire Cat]

Horrible and disgusting for sure, but how is this breaking?

[The Feral Underclass]

Horrible and disgusting for sure, but how is this breaking?

"Breaking" means "happening as we speak." Last night when Psycho posted, it was breaking news...

[The Cheshire Cat]

"Breaking" means "happening as we speak." Last night when Psycho posted it was breaking news...

Oh, sorry, in that case I misunderstood the meaning of 'breaking'.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Fucking fash...I refuse to kill nor wound anyone, but i would like to see them get killed by natural causes asap.

[Zaza]

"As he was leaving a store in Paris yesterday (5.6.2013), Clément Méric, 18, antifascist and trade-unionist was beaten to death by members of a far right group.

Is it known yet which group did this?

[Sasha]

" Violemment frappé au sol par un groupe de plusieurs militants d’extrême droite, manifestement du Groupe JNR (Jeune Nationaliste Révolutionnaire), laissé inanimé, il a été déclaré ce soir en état de mort cérébrale à l’hôpital Salpetrière"

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Revolutionairy Nationalists?? Huh?

[Sasha]

Afaik it is a collection of Paris nazi skinhead groups under the leadership of serge "batskin" ayoub that left the FrontNational youth group for more radical pastures.

[Sasha]

" Calling for a rally Place Saint-Michel on Thursday at 18:30 PG calls the "dissolution of right-wing groups that breed violence." Another rally is planned Thursday at 17h at the scene of the attack, according to page (https://www.facebook.com/RipClementMeric) Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/RipClementMeric) honoring him."

[Questionable]

Liberal shitholes like reddit have been complaining that the kid was "asking for it" by being part of an anti-fascist organization, and are trying to pin them as being both as bad as each other.

I guess that makes sense if not for the fact that the far-rightists deserve scorn by their very existence. It's like saying anti-drug activists shouldn't complain when they get retribution from dealers.

[The Douche]

Liberal shitholes like reddit have been complaining that the kid was "asking for it" by being part of an anti-fascist organization, and are trying to pin them as being both as bad as each other.

I guess that makes sense if not for the fact that the far-rightists deserve scorn by their very existence. It's like saying anti-drug activists shouldn't complain when they get retribution from dealers.

Not to sully the memory of our comrade, but the point they're getting at is valid, though they do it in a crude and disrespectful way.

If you part of AFA, or in general a militant of the class, you should be conscious of what the enemy will do to you if they have the chance. Especially if you're into anti-fascism.

Take a look around revleft and see how people here react when a fascist dies...



La lotta continua, Clement!

[BIXX]

Fuck. You know, I always expect this shit to happen, but every time it does, somehow it still feels like it was unexpected. I can't believe this shit. If the fascists get away with their actions I will be angry beyond belief.

We just have to remember that this should be a call to action, and that any chance we get we should oppose fascists in some way, be it violent or non-violent, it is our responsibility.

Solidarity, Clement.

[Brutus]

The douche makes a brilliant point. We're all looking at this subjectively...
He knew the risks, and unfortunately paid the price for his anti fascist activities.
Solidarity, Clement

[Questionable]

Some news sources are saying the fascists initially refused to fight, but were goaded into it by Antifa taunts and threats.

Is there any truth to this?

[Zaza]

The douche makes a brilliant point. We're all looking at this subjectively...
He knew the risks, and unfortunately paid the price for his anti fascist activities.
Solidarity, Clement

How do you want to look objective on this? Since when is it a provocation to go somewhere shopping?

He would have paid the price for his anti-facist activities if he was somewhere protesting against it, and not if a group comes at him and beats the life out of the guy after he left some clothing store.


I have enough people hating me for my political opinion but they still sit there next to me.

[The Douche]

How do you want to look objective on this? Since when is it a provocation to go somewhere shopping?

He would have paid the price for his anti-facist activities if he was somewhere protesting against it, and not if a group comes at him and beats the life out of the guy after he left some clothing store.


I have enough people hating me for my political opinion but they still sit there next to me.

He's part of AFA. I am quite confident that he has at some point, with a group of comrades, jumped a smaller group or single fascist when the opportunity presented itself. Sometimes that is a demo, sometimes its the metro station.

We are combatants in a war, we ought to conceive of ourselves as such, and act accordingly.

[Comrade #138672]

I have enough people hating me for my political opinion but they still sit there next to me.I doubt you are sitting next to outright Fascists.

[Zaza]

I doubt you are sitting next to outright Fascists.

Doubt it if you want to.
I know people who are facist,Pro-AKP, anti-communism and some other directions too.

Even some years ago I had a bigger conflict with some turkish nationalist because my people are a minority there in turkey.
Today we don't care about eachother, neither talk about politics.



He's part of AFA. I am quite confident that he has at some point, with a group of comrades, jumped a smaller group or single fascist when the opportunity presented itself. Sometimes that is a demo, sometimes its the metro station.

We are combatants in a war, we ought to conceive of ourselves as such, and act accordingly.

It happened most likely, but he was a student. I doubt he wanted to make himself problems there in paris with such an attidute.

[The Feral Underclass]

We're fighting a war. There will be casualties. It's fucked up, but that's what happens when you go to war.

[The Douche]

Doubt it if you want to.
I know people who are facist,Pro-AKP, anti-communism and some other directions too.

Even some years ago I had a bigger conflict with some turkish nationalist because my people are a minority there in turkey.
Today we don't care about eachother, neither talk about politics.




It happened most likely, but he was a student. I doubt he wanted to make himself problems there in paris with such an attidute.

Dude, you don't go around attacking people from violent political sects if you don't want "to make problems" for youself.

[Dropdead]

Liberal shitholes like reddit have been complaining that the kid was "asking for it" by being part of an anti-fascist organization, and are trying to pin them as being both as bad as each other.

I guess that makes sense if not for the fact that the far-rightists deserve scorn by their very existence. It's like saying anti-drug activists shouldn't complain when they get retribution from dealers.

Well what do you except from reddit liberal dumbshits? They always say both sides are as bad so it's nothing new really.

[Pelarys]

Well, he fought the good fight, it puts thing into perspective when a comrade dies like that in the country you live in. La Lutte continue camarade!

[Geiseric]

Fucking fash...I refuse to kill nor wound anyone, but i would like to see them get killed by natural causes asap.

I would get an inanimate object and go to town if i saw some nazi assholes attacking somebody in the street, you're just as bad as the fascists if you don't try to do something, our at least muster help.

I don't think leftists should be acting like a clockwork Orange gang though at the same time. These kinds of things linger for a long time in communities. But If there were fascists causing trouble and attacking people in my neighborhood I would be compelled to stop it. Nazis are unacceptable.

[Orange Juche]

He's part of AFA. I am quite confident that he has at some point, with a group of comrades, jumped a smaller group or single fascist when the opportunity presented itself. Sometimes that is a demo, sometimes its the metro station.

We are combatants in a war, we ought to conceive of ourselves as such, and act accordingly.

Wait, so (and I'm literally, not sarcastically, asking) these groups go back and forth, beating the shit out of each other?

And this accomplishes... what?

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I would get an inanimate object and go to town if i saw some nazi assholes attacking somebody in the street, you're just as bad as the fascists if you don't try to do something, our at least muster help.

I don't think leftists should be acting like a clockwork Orange gang though at the same time. These kinds of things linger for a long time in communities. But If there were fascists causing trouble and attacking people in my neighborhood I would be compelled to stop it. Nazis are unacceptable.

Of course i will act when someone is attacked in the street. If it is not apparent he is a fascist, i'd probably try and help him too.

As a pascifist i believe in protest not war. So no, even though i am 100% anti-fash, i will never attack one (or more) just because. Attacking: no, defending or helping: yes.

[Sasha]

Wait, so (and I'm literally, not sarcastically, asking) these groups go back and forth, beating the shit out of each other?

And this accomplishes... what?

this is going of topic but;
most fascist plan their rise to power through a physical and psychological conquest of the streets, not (primarily) through the ballot-box.
as such militant-antifascists set up organizations that combat this agenda in like coin. firstly to protect ourselves (no fascist ever needed an excuse to attack us and other "undesirables", we could be handing out flowers, we could be cowering in our houses and still the fash and their violence would come and find us) and to throw a wrench in their growth both by sabotaging their actual organizing and by shattering their image of invincible top predators.
some more info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-fascism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Fascist_Action
0Dn2NRvrR-U
rW_niHkEXGM

[Yet_Another_Boring_Marxist]

Wait, so (and I'm literally, not sarcastically, asking) these groups go back and forth, beating the shit out of each other?

And this accomplishes... what?

1.Discourages fascists from being violent to the immigrant and queer communities
2.weakens their ability to operate
3. is jolly good fun

[Tifosi]

In the Rozzano neighbourhood of Davide "DAX" Cesare murdered by fascists in Milan, in 2003, antifascists displayed a banner dedicated to Clement.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/q71/s480x480/944830_567495209940127_1290727764_n.jpg

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Finally a small article about the attack was placed in a Dutch newspaper. It's a newspaper for the northern-part of Holland (which is predominantly leftist). The perpetrators didn't come of too good, thank upper-deity.

Heard France is talking about dismantling neo-nazist and fascist-groups.

[Tifosi]

https://korynmalius.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/rage-at-clement-merics-death/

http://korynmalius.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/984056_616886184990873_245755457_n.jpg

[Pravda]

I dont know why, but this news hit me hard. I was fucked up whole day yesterday.

I hope left in France will do what they should do (brutally).

[Sasha]

moved the annual trot vs militant anti-fascism "discussion" to a separate thread: http://www.revleft.com/vb/militant-anti-fascism-t181298/index.html
please keep this thread further clean from it.

[Lucretia]

moved the annual trot vs militant anti-fascism "discussion" to a separate thread: http://www.revleft.com/vb/militant-anti-fascism-t181298/index.html
please keep this thread further clean from it.

I can see why you'd want to move a subdiscussion between me and TAT off thread, but I'm a little puzzled as to why all my posts on this thread have been relocated, considering that a number of them related specifically to this issue and did not speak to a broader debate about Trotskyism vs. anarchism.

[Sasha]

ill have a look around, maybe i moved some prematurely, which posts in particular? because afaics only maybe the first two/three post are still nominaly about what happened in paris but still are more relevant in the split thread as context/origin of the discussion than that they are an essential contribution to the original

[Lucretia]

ill have a look around, maybe i moved some prematurely, which posts in particular?

I am thinking specifically about my initial exchanges with bcbm and The Douche.

[Sasha]

https://korynmalius.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/rage-at-clement-merics-death/




full text of that link since its relevant information:


Rage at Clément Méric’s death

Posted on June 7, 2013 (https://korynmalius.wordpress.com/2013/06/07/rage-at-clement-merics-death/)
“Wednesday, June 15 2013, leaving a clothes shop, near Gare St Lazare, Clément Méric, a young 18 year old trade unionist and antifascist militant was beaten to death by members of the radical extreme right. He had come from Brest to study in Sciences Po, he was a victim of the context of extreme right violence which developed over the past few months. He died from his injuries in the night at the Hospital Pitié-Salpétrière. All our thoughts are with his family and his loved ones to whom we express all our solidarity. His friends and comrades.”
After this murder, information was carried over the internet and social media, and sometimes transformed. This is a bit of rumour control/further info about what appeared in English on twitter, facebook and all, and that Clément’s comrades deny (http://www.regards.fr/videos/Mort-de-Clement-Meric-des,6729). Obviously, I can only do so much for checking the reliability of sources, some of this could be inacurate, but this is what can be read or heard in the French-speaking media (bourgeois and/or revolutionary). On top of only being human, I am tired and upset, and I guess many comrades whose words are repeated here are too.
1. He was not a member of an extreme left party.
He was a member of a trade union (SUD/Solidaires Sciences Po), and joined Action Antifasciste Paris Banlieue. His comrades say he had “libertarian” tendencies.
2. It was not an accident during a fight.
His comrades have described him both as “not a warrior” and “not a fighter”, saying he weighed about 60 kg, and that he had apparently recently been treated for leukemia. The neo-nazi recognized the group of Clément and his friends, either from demonstrations or from stalking on social media. They gathered more people and weapons, waited outside the shop, and killed him, laughed, started running, realised no-one was after them, stopped and congratulated each other, according to witnesses. The neo-nazis’ defence is to paint it as a fight, possibly provoked by the victim, which led to a ‘tragic necessity’. It was not, his comrades insist that it was a political attack which ended in political murder. The police also briefly said they were treating it as “a fight between the extreme right and the extreme left”.
3. Who are JNR/Serge Ayoub?
Jeunesse Nationale Révolutionnaire is a group of neo-nazis led by Serge “Batskin” Ayoub, which has a shopfront in Paris. In the past few years he tried to unite the extreme right, but seems to have once again alienated all other groups. The most recent videos of him on YouTube are from the extreme right MayDay parade and the march in support of the Syrian governement. He has been a bonehead [apologies for the earlier use of "skinhead"] leader since the 1980s and declared in interviews that a physical confrontation to immigration was necessary and that his group was ready to do it. Serge Ayoub says he somehow had the accused on the phone before they were arrested, but denies knowing their names or that they are members of his organisation. Politicians are calling for the dissolution of this group, a number of antifa groups are reminding people that such groups have been banned in the past and it never prevented their resurrection, it seems more like politicians trying to be seen as doing something than any form of “solution”.
4. Clément and Breton nationalism?
No-one among his Paris comrades mentions anything about that afaik. They say he arrived from Brest (in Brittany) in September. His last name is apparently from the South West of France, and people say his family lives in the Gers (Occitania). Some Irish comrades have emphasised he was Breton and mentioned that his parents were into the defence of the Breton language. That may or may not be true.
5. Was he a member of the CNT?
Le Monde says he used to do some militantism with the CNT when he was in highschool in Brest, Brittany. However he does not seem to have been a current member of that organisation since he moved to Paris last September. 800 people were commemorating his death in Brest, where CNT members accused the Socialist mayor of political recuperation. The articles gave no indication on which CNT.
6. Are the JNR and JN the same organisation?
No, Jeunesse Nationaliste is a different organisation, a re-creation of Jeunesse Identitaire after some political infighting and the arrest of some of their members (who are at present still free) related to the attack in Toulouse on a Chilean post-grad student who was left in a coma, then was hemiplegic and thankfully seems to be recovering. I’ve been posting about them because Jeunesse Nationaliste had planned to hold a demonstration on Saturday in Toulouse before Clément’s death. Local authorities are trying to ban it in some way. An anti-fascist counter-protest was and is also planned.
http://korynmalius.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/984056_616886184990873_245755457_n.jpg?w=300&h=225 (http://korynmalius.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/984056_616886184990873_245755457_n.jpg)
Nothing can or should appease our rage as long as fascism has not been definitely made something of the past. This anger must fuel our fight against fascism, and in that spirit commemorative marches against fascism have been promptly organised in around 27 cities in France, as well as in Montreal, Madrid, and this list will no doubt get longer. The picture is from the one in Toulouse on Thursday, another one is called on Saturday. Also, many people will comemorate him during the various Pride marches this month. That’s all I can do to try and end on a “positive” note…. Never forget, never forgive.

[Tifosi]

http://oi44.tinypic.com/2n8ouic.jpg

[MarxArchist]

I don't much understand some aspects of European culture. Is the 'green brigade' a soccer fan/anarchist group? I guess it's football' not soccer. Here in the US football (as in NFL) fans will actually kill other fans from opposing teams. It, for some, is like a gang mentality absolutely separate from any sort of politics. If an anti-fascist NY Giants organization sprung up people would think it quite strange. Does the right wing latch onto football (soccer) in Europe? Forgive my ignorance on the subject.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I don't much understand some aspects of European culture. Is the 'green brigade' a soccer fan/anarchist group? I guess it's football' not soccer. Here in the US football (as in NFL) fans will actually kill other fans from opposing teams. It, for some, is like a gang mentality absolutely separate from any sort of politics. If an anti-fascist NY Giants organization sprung up people would think it quite strange. Does the right wing latch onto football (soccer) in Europe? Forgive my ignorance on the subject.

European Soccer fans will kill each other (see the mass-fightings between Ajax- and Feyenoord-fans in Holland and the fights between English teams and between Turkish teams).
Some soccer-teams have a highly fascist fanbase (there is one soccerteam in, i think, Croatia. Can't remember it's name though, since i'm no soccer-fan), some others (like the Green Brigade) are anti-fascist.

Still, most soccer-fans are quite peaceful.

[Tifosi]

London a couple of days ago.

http://londonantifascists.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/clement_rip.jpg?w=640

[ChiefTiburon]

RIP to comrade Clement
Let them try that to a brother down here. Ccowardly scum better be rolling a hundred strong...

[An archist]

I don't much understand some aspects of European culture. Is the 'green brigade' a soccer fan/anarchist group? I guess it's football' not soccer. Here in the US football (as in NFL) fans will actually kill other fans from opposing teams. It, for some, is like a gang mentality absolutely separate from any sort of politics. If an anti-fascist NY Giants organization sprung up people would think it quite strange. Does the right wing latch onto football (soccer) in Europe? Forgive my ignorance on the subject.
Green Brigade is one of Glasgow Celtic's most vocal fan groups and yes, obviously, they're anti-fascist. Around Europe, loads of teams have several fan groups, some more and some less vocal in their support and the majority of fan groupsn are pretty apolitical, but since football is passion and since there's so much teams, inevitably you'll get politicised fan groups.
There's a thread about it here: http://www.revleft.com/vb/left-and-right-t151834/index.html

And for the US: Portland Timbers have some pretty left-wing supporters.