Turkey rises in mass protests and in violent clashes with police

[KurtFF8]

(Edit: Here's a timeline that RT put together that can perhaps be helpful http://rt.com/news/istanbul-park-protests-police-095/)

Source (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/may/31/istanbul-protesters-violent-clashes-police)


Turkey (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/turkey) was engulfed by a series of protests across several cities after riot police turned Istanbul's busiest city centre hub into a battleground, deploying tear gas and water cannon against thousands of peaceful demonstrators.
In one of the biggest challenges to the 10-year-rule of the prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/recep-tayyip-erdogan), demonstrators took to the streets of Ankara, Izmir, Bodrum and several other cities as well as Istanbul to vent their frustration at what is seen to be an increasingly authoritarian administration.
The air of government nervousness was reinforced by the relative lack of mainstream media coverage of the drama in central Istanbul, fuelling speculation that the Erdogan government was leaning on the main television stations to impose a blackout on the ugly scenes.
Following several days of dawn police raids on the protesters seeking to occupy a park on Taksim Square in Istanbul city centre, the clashes escalated violently, leaving more than 100 people injured, several of them seriously.
Police went on the rampage against protesters who had been sitting reading books and singing songs.
There was widespread criticism of the heavy-handed intervention and of the government, which is committed to demolishing the park to erect a shopping centre.
A US state department spokesman said: "We certainly support universally peaceful protests, as we would in this case."
In Brussels MEPs raised the alarm and called on the European Union to act.
What started at the beginning of the week as an environmental protest (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/protest) aimed at saving an Istanbul city centre park from shopping centre developers backed by the government appeared to be snowballing into a national display of anger at the perceived high-handedness of the Erdogan government.
"They have declared war on us," said an Istanbul shopkeeper in a back street, as he handed out lemon juice to protesters. "This is out of all proportion."
"Today is a turning point for the AKP," said Koray Caliskan, a political scientist at Istanbul's Bosphorus University. "Erdogan is a very confident and very authoritarian politician, and he doesn't listen to anyone anymore. But he needs to understand that Turkey is no kingdom, and that he cannot rule Istanbul from Ankara all by himself."
Ugur Tanyeli, an architecture historian, said: "The real problem is not Taksim, and not the park, but the lack of any form of democratic decision-making process and the utter lack of consensus. We now have a prime minister who does whatever he wants."
The protests started late on Monday after developers tore up trees to make way for the controversial construction project featuring a shopping centre in nostalgic Ottoman style and building a replica of an old military barracks.
Police staged consecutive raids on protesters, using tear gas and water cannon, but the protests grew in scale, with artists, intellectuals and opposition MPs joining the ranks.
According to the Istanbul Medical Chamber, at least 100 people were injured during the police raids on Friday . Some sustained injuries when a wall they were trying to climb collapsed as they fled from the tear gas. At least seven people were treated for head wounds. Later on Friday police also used tear gas against protesters in Ankara.
In Istanbul, Sirri Süreyya Önder, an MP from the Kurdish BDP party, was taken to hospital after he was reportedly hit in the shoulder by a tear gas cartridge.
Amnesty International condemned the "use of excessive force" by police.
There were reports late on Friday of a woman having died. In a sign of the tension, amateur video footage showed Turkish military personnel refusing to help the riot police, as well as handing out gas masks to demonstrators. There were also reports that some of the police had switched sides and joined the protests.
With the Erdogan government facing an uncommon popular challenge after 10 years in power, an MP from the governing AK party angered the protesters, tweeting: "It looks like some people needed gas." Sirin Ünal added: "If you go away, you will have a nice day. One has to obey the system."
For the burgeoning protest movement, the park issue is the tip of the iceberg. Another building project, the construction of a bridge spanning the Bosphorus, was launched this week, with Erdogan dismissing public opinion.
"They can do whatever they want," he said. "We've made our decision, and we will do as we have decided," he said. He defended the reconstruction of the Ottoman barracks as a matter of "respecting history". Opponents argue the project will destroy one of the last green spaces in central Istanbul for the sake of private profit.
"How can you show respect for something that does not exist?" asked Tanyeli. "We don't even know what the barracks looked like exactly. To say that this project has anything to do with the reconstruction of a historical building is ridiculous.
"We all know how starved Istanbul is for green space. It needs this park so much more than yet another shopping mall."
Several retailers announced they would not open stores in the planned shopping centre. "I would not open a store in a place where blood has been shed," businessman Selami Sari told the Turkish press.
The park protests show signs of escalating into demonstrations against a prime minister who remains popular and dominates national politics, but is seen as increasingly authoritarian.
"Turkey is not doing well, not doing well at all," said Coskun Ince after several days protesting. "We have to fight for our rights, and now they deny us the few rights we still have."
The protest was unusual in that it brought together young and old, the rightwing and leftists, and nationalist Turks and Kurds. They complained of issues beyond the planned shopping centre from government policy on the war in neighbouring Syria to new curbs on alcohol and a recent row about kissing in public.
"We are fed up," said Cansu Kahvecioglu, a student. "They don't give us any breathing space anymore."
Surprised I haven't seen a thread about this yet (if there is, my apologies)

[Zaza]

Turkey is finally waking up.

[Prof. Oblivion]

AFAIK it's more widespread than this meager article. Perhaps some of our Turkish users could fill us in?

[human strike]

Police have killed certainly at least one protester and possibly several others.

I don't know about the fate of the man in this video:
1JcAYApeiOo

THis photo was taken at 3:40 am:
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/247660_524060174308526_551520489_n.jpg

1:50 am:
https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/931229_531970443525983_505855045_n.jpg

[Red Commissar]

These things are from a Kurdish site but it's relevant:

http://en.firatnews.eu/news/news/police-attacked-demonstrators-in-gezi-park-video.htm



4wmoMwv-AwA
pVYavqQa_Yo
Taksim Gezi Park protestors have not left the park area for the last three days, resisting to prevent the demolition of the park as part of Taksim pedestrianization project. They have been facing brutal police violence since the beginning of the mass protest.

Police threw tear gas and went on destroying demonstrators' tents at 5 am Thursday morning, seizing and destroying protestors' tents, burning some. The demolition of the park was halted on Tuesday as Peace and Democracy Party (BDP) Istanbul deputy Sırrı Süreyya Önder stood in front of a bulldozer and didn't leave the area, insisting that the demolition of the park and the uprooting of the trees was unlawful. Önder was at the area together with the people yesterday as well, supported by artists, intellectuals, workers and students as well.

Police has once again attacked hundreds of demonstrators on Friday morning, at around 4 am, using intense tear gas in which over 20 people were injured, including CHP (Republican People's Party) deputy Gürsel Tekin who fainted during the brutal police terror. The intense tear gas police used has started a fire in the Maçka Park nearby. Mass incident intervention vehicles (TOMA) are trying to extinguish the fire in the wood.

Some people, wearing city police uniforms and gas masks, have torn the tents of park protestors among whom those joining the vigil were forcibly taken out of the area by riot police.

Police also targeted the press members in the area, hitting them with a tear gas during their conversation with CHP deputy İlhan Cihaner.

The police mobilization in the area has been multiplied on Friday, with the police having closed the ways into and out of the park area.

Clashes broke out in Taksim, Dolmabahçe and Harbiye following the police attack.

Demonstrators issued a press statement condemning the police terror against park demonstrators who demand the ending of demolition of green areas.

This was not the first disturbance in recent months, IIRC some battles with police and nationalists erupted in many cities in Turkey after the government abruptly prohibited May Day rallies in Taksim Square in Istanbul.

[human strike]

This page is especially good for updates, photos and videos: https://www.facebook.com/internationalriot

Also RT liveblog: http://rt.com/news/istanbul-park-protests-police-095/

[blake 3:17]

Financial Times:

Thousands call on Turkey’s leader to quit
By Daniel Dombey in Istanbul

Protests swept Turkey on Friday and deep into Saturday morning as thousands of demonstrators called on prime minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan to resign.
What began as a rally against a shopping mall project turned into one of the biggest challenges in recent years to Mr Erdogan’s rule, as whole districts of Istanbul resounded to the banging of pots and pans into the early hours of the morning. Drivers hit car horns in support of the demonstrators.

For more than 12 hours Turkish police had sprayed tear gas against crowds trying to reach Taksim square in the centre of the city. There were widespread reports of injuries among protesters and bystanders.
Protests sprang up in other cities including Ankara, the capital, but Turkish television reporters largely avoided broadcasting coverage of the events. Many local journalists complain they are under pressure to censor the news.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/ed55f378-c9f7-11e2-af47-00144feab7de.html#axzz2UwLqWLvq

[Rocky Rococo]

Istanbul at 2:30am

_6kYY8fMbV0

[blake 3:17]

From an old friend, currently living in Turkey,

ALL FRIENDS ABROAD ACTION NOW:
CALL THE TURKISH EMBASSY IN YOUR COUNTRY NOW AND ASK WHY POLICE IS GASSING DEMONSTRATORS IN TAKSIM AND WHETHER ISTANBUL IS SAFE ANYMORE. PROTEST USE OF FORCE AGAINST PEACEFUL DEMONSTRATIONS.

DO IT NOW PLEASE! for contact numbers:
http://www.mfa.gov.tr/turkish-representations.en.mfa

Link will send you to a consulate or other diplomatic agency. Please call

[Le Socialiste]

From the Daily Kos:


There are 40,000 people crossing from Asia to Europe on a bridge across the Bosphorus. According to tweets they are joining protesters in Istanbul. These protesters occupied Gezi park for days, battling police in riot gear. Many were injured and there are reports of people having been killed.

Rest of article here (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/06/01/1212984/-Something-Tremendulous-is-Happening-in-Turkey#).

Picture of the bridge crossing hidden in spoilers:

http://i552.photobucket.com/albums/jj321/jpmassar/Turkey-istanbul-bridge_zps5d191c4a.jpg

[Le Socialiste]

From a BBC article/analyst:


Environmentalists have been joined by gay and lesbian groups, as well as socialists, union workers, members of opposition parties from across the political landscape and even so-called "anti-capitalist Muslims". The excessive use of force by the riot police and the insistence of the government to pursue their plans for the park have escalated tensions.

[Le Socialiste]

More than 2,000 protesters reported to be moving on the Turkish Parliament and Cabinet of Ministers (http://en.trend.az/news/incident/2156728.html). Barricades are said to have gone up in some places.

[Brutus]

Barricades on which side?

[B5C]

The Arab Spring finally made it to the Turks.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Could a turkish poster please properly translate this?

http://www.tkp.org.tr/basin-aciklamalari/akp-defolup-gitmelidir-2122

[Le Socialiste]

Barricades on which side?

Anti-government protesters.

[Rusty Shackleford]

#Occupygezipics (http://occupygezipics.tumblr.com/)

[Sasha]

As far as i can follow massive groups are still trying to reach taksim, heavy tearsgas, even my totaly non-political Turkish facebook friends are going out to get involved and calling on their friends. Rumors of the army handing out gasmasks to protesters and cops refusing to deploy.
This is getting huge.

[KurtFF8]

Quite an impressive showing by the people of Turkey.

I would caution against assuming this is "The Turkish Spring" however. The problems with the vague term of Arab Spring aside (including the direction of the Arab Spring, the fact that Turks are not Arabs, etc.), it's a bit soon to proclaim a protracted movement.

We all may hope for that but let's observe (and give support) this moment before we claim this is "the awakening of Turkey" and all, because we just don't know yet.

[Per Levy]

As far as i can follow massive groups are still trying to reach taksim, heavy tearsgas, even my totaly non-political Turkish facebook friends are going out to get involved and calling on their friends. Rumors of the army handing out gasmasks to protesters and cops refusing to deploy.
This is getting huge.

i've just read from a german newspaper that tenthousands have stormed taksim and the police is retreating.

edit:

Riot police in Istanbul are withdrawing from Taksim Square and allowing the mass protest to continue unabated, Turkish state media reports.
Confronted with the growing street opposition, Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan remained defiant, demanding that protesters “stop their demonstrations immediately."

"Police were there yesterday, they'll be on duty today and also tomorrow because Taksim Square cannot be an area where extremists are running wild," the PM warned.

http://rt.com/news/turkey-protests-second-day-114/

well hopefully the military wont be used to supress the protest.

[Deity]

Remember kids, the "freedom gas" being used is courtesy of our good friends at the US of A!

[Sasha]

They won't use the military, contrary to the Arab nations the government and the army don't trust each other one bit in turkey. While the ruling Islamist party purged the military recently of its most outspoken critics the army is still a bastion of secularism and sees it as its fundamental duty to safeguard the legacy of ataturk. While no love for junta prone, hypernationalist army the fact that they have a big base right on taksim square might mean they will protect the protesters of the worst deadly force..

[human strike]

Remember kids, the "freedom gas" being used is courtesy of our good friends at the US of A!

I believe Turkey is the second largest recipient of US military aid after Israel.

Livestream from Taksim Square: http://www.vgtv.no/#!/video/65035/live-direktebilder-fra-istanbul-live-video-from-istanbul

EDIT: I've realised since that what I said about Turkey being the second largest recipient of US military and police aid is inaccurate. Turkey in 1998 was the largest but was replaced by Colombia in 1999 - both of these were behind Israel and Egypt, however, who are counted in a separate category. I'm not even sure Turkey is in the top 10 anymore.

[Deity]

Have you guys seen this bull shit Erdogan is spewing?
Mr Erdogan vowed order would be restored "to ensure the safety of people and their property" and that police would stay in place "because Taksim Square cannot be an area where extremists are running wild".

He said of the protests: "All attempts apart from the ballot box are not democratic", adding that he could summon a million pro-government protesters if he wanted to and accusing his opponents of using the issue as an excuse to create tension.

Despite the damage done to property, the police force "continues to operate with the authority it was given," said Mr Erdogan.

[human strike]

Photoset: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.179851208844694.1073741859.161998677296614&type=1

[Le Socialiste]

There's been an opening for strike actions (http://socialistworker.org/blog/critical-reading/2013/06/01/birth-turkish-spring) from Turkish Airline, metal, and KESK workers:


There have been several important industrial actions lately. These may very well radicalize the attitude of some sections of the working-class, including the workers of Turkish Airlines. They have been on strike for a fortnight putting forth serious demands, albeit with limited participation. Their central demand is the reinstatement of 305 from among the work force, fired a year ago for a wildcat strike protesting the partial prohibition of strikes in civil aviation, which has always been a recognized right in the last half century. The prohibition of strikes has had to be rescinded, but the workers laid-off have yet to be reinstated.

More Strikes

Another strike is waiting in the wings, one with potentially devastating consequences for the government. This is the metal workers’ strike which has already been announced (a legal precondition), but not yet put into practice. If all the workers involved go on strike (for legal reasons this has to be some time in the course of June), this will amount to over one hundred thousand workers, in a sector that has become the main export engine of the country's manufacturing industry in recent years. Although there are immensely complicated factors to be taken into account when analysing this potential strike, not least the clearly reactionary political stance of the ruling bureaucracy in the major union in the industry, the results may be dire in the context of this explosive situation.

History seems to be aiding the popular masses of Turkey. KESK, the Federation of Public Employees’ Unions, one of the fighting organizations within the union movement, had already declared a sector-wide strike for 5 June. This needs to be transformed into a general strike, adopted by the whole union movement, putting forth demands in the political sphere as well as voicing the considerable grievances of the workers of different sectors and industries. The present moment witnesses a people's revolt in the face of the arrogance and repressive practice of the government. Should this be combined with an insurgent working-class movement, Turkey would become open to all kinds of revolutionary change.

[Sir Comradical]

So what are the political parties behind this?

[Rusty Shackleford]

So what are the political parties behind this?

CHP (People's Republican Party) and TKP (Turkish Communist Party) as far as i know.

[Tim Cornelis]

CHP (People's Republican Party) and TKP (Turkish Communist Party) as far as i know.

Most seem to be "warriors of Kemal Attaturk," unfortunately.
I also saw the symbol of what I'm pretty sure is another Marxist-Leninist party (a legal one), whom seem to be very visible in demonstrations (including the "anti-imperialist" demonstrations), but I forgot its name. I believed its name doesn't include communist, and I remember its wikipedia page being relatively large and mentioning LGBT rights. I can't find it on wikipedia now though. Abbreviation with an H I believe, three letters -- this is going to drive me crazy trying to find it.
I also saw the Freedom and Solidarity Party flag.

[cyu]

Two blogs from someone who isn't a revolutionary (or at least, someone who didn't used to be a revolutionary):

http://rezzanatakol.deviantart.com/journal/I-M-GOING-TO-PROTEST-THIS-DICTATOR-375080775

http://rezzanatakol.deviantart.com/journal/WE-ARE-READY-TO-DIE-FOR-OUR-FREEDOM-375319687

Her full journal:
http://rezzanatakol.deviantart.com/journal/

[billydan]

This makes me so pissed i hate police brutality

[B5C]

I would caution against assuming this is "The Turkish Spring" however. The problems with the vague term of Arab Spring aside (including the direction of the Arab Spring, the fact that Turks are not Arabs, etc.), it's a bit soon to proclaim a protracted movement.



I know they are not Arabs. I used to live in Izmir for three years. The Arab Spring was the pebble which created the avalanche of "occupy" or "spring revolutions" in the middle east. I was basically saying that Turkey didn't avoid the spring that was launched two years ago.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Here is the video i had posted in another thread that was taken down from a turkish website.


wYTQ61Bc0G0


building a barricade

DKv601khylM

[Rusty Shackleford]

Any info on the socialist democracy party?

EDIT: they seem to be ML of some sort.
http://www.s-d-p.org/program.html

Party of the working people of Turkey, the oppressed, the whole mass of the excluded, and the world socialist movement in the ranks to become a revolutionary internationalist party to take part in a power has been adopted as the basic organizational and political task. purpose of the socialist party, as well as creative Marxist theory on the basis of the above, but can reach organizational and ideological goals . Marxism on its own foundations, and international and national level in the practice of class struggle is carried out, through the generalization of his experiments, capable of renewal in the light of scientific advances lead to only show the action of the party as a revolutionary theory. Party of Marxism as a dogma that is not considered, resulting in the development of its historical reviews of all revolutionary irreconcilably against each other does not put in the lines, between the lively and civilized debate encourages them, through the interaction between them to achieve higher levels of intellectual environment prepares a holistic theoretical joint gains. our party, the women's movement and the environmental movement, social opposition and human culture, these movements are included in their contribution is committed to socialist theory. Party-house training, workers' class consciousness and the beginning of the navy. If training is not party doctrine, political, ideological struggle and concrete depends on the needs of the tasks. The different views of the party as an organization established at the outset, the intra-party training "official doctrine", the "official history", "people" worship will create the prerequisites that will protect against other diseases. The training of a new generation of multi-faceted training Socialists Party, will serve the development of the revolutionary and independent personalities. The first task of the party in this field, in order to raise the level of the Party School to establish an ideological party members in the future to realize the establishment of a scientific academy. purpose of the party socialism. The Great October Socialist Revolution opened the way of salvation to mankind. The first workers 'and peasants' government, all the attacks of imperialism, baltalamalarına, despite efforts to destroy the inside, very large conversions performed under siege. Put an end to unemployment and poverty. Free education, health, recreation and has the right to life. The solution of the housing problem of mass transportation made ​​great strides. This work was initiated by the working people of the state space science. As a whole, patriarchal relations endüstrileşti outweigh a poor country as soon as possible, about the military-strategic balance between the great imperialist powers, and gave the Nazi scourge of humanity by playing a decisive role in liberating the imperialist aggression gemledi. Despite all this, a series of historical, social, political, and cultural reasons, the October Revolution has failed to experience heavy. The ideals of the October Revolution severed the bureaucratic elite, the homogeneity of the USSR and the date the loss of all the gains that they have played a decisive role of the working classes. Soviet experience undoubtedly be addressed and re-evaluated in scientific work of our party. Because this experiment, the working people of socialist democracy organized in the form of state life geçiremediklerini why, why succumb düşüremediklerini bureaucratism, does not mind the physical liquidation campaign against the party cadres geçemediklerini into why, more than a series of ideological, political, economic socialism, this is caused by bugs in the future, try to understand the negative aspects unsolved is of great importance in terms of preparation for purification. Already, I have to say that this experiment of socialist democracy, the party, the state and society, without any complete life, a permanent transition from capitalism to socialism is socialism without securing an international range of enablement is not possible, but also the destruction of human civilization in drag gained an orientation productive forces of capitalism and technology, as well as specific take over, turning it into a well-being capitalist "consumer society" breaking away from the understanding of the criteria that address the production, the center area of people, the natural environment has revealed that a harmonious socialism be realized. Socialist Party will walk in the light of the purpose of these courses. The highest principle of the party's internationalism. Party all the policy would align the interests of the working people of the world, the workers of all countries, international solidarity with the oppressed found. Party all the nations, separation and defend the right to determine their own destiny with the sense of state-building. Party unity of the working people against the onslaught of global capital in general, to coordinate the actions of all the revolutionary socialist sister parties around the world will make its own contribution to the international organization to perform. First of all Eurasia perform such an international regional organization, the burning of the duties of our party.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BLtTtVPCEAE8skw.jpg:large

https://twitter.com/AChristieMiller/status/340958235051823105/photo/1

[Devrim]

Any info on the socialist democracy party?

EDIT: they seem to be ML of some sort.

Rusty, I could give you lots of information about the SDP, but I don't really see the point. Partly because explaining them would involve placing them in their context in the Turkish left, which you don't have the background information on anyway*.

More importantly though is that it is not really the point. I don't think that there is anything useful in people finding one of the myriads of Turkish left wing groups to 'support'. People can rest assured though that whatever your ideological preference the Turkish left is broad enough to have somebody for you to 'support'.

Surely the point though is to understand what the nature of this movement is.

Devrim

*If I were explaining to someone familiar with the Turkish left, I would say that they come from a right-wing split from the ÖDP about ten years ago, but that wouldn't really help you.

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Rusty, I could give you lots of information about the SDP, but I don't really see the point. Partly because explaining them would involve placing them in their context in the Turkish left, which you don't have the background information on anyway*.

More importantly though is that it is not really the point. I don't think that there is anything useful in people finding one of the myriads of Turkish left wing groups to 'support'. People can rest assured though that whatever your ideological preference the Turkish left is broad enough to have somebody for you to 'support'.


Can these groups work together (regardless of their ideological framework) constructively to help bolster a movement? Or are they too caught down in sectarianism, cold war dogma, and an utter lack of self criticism to do so? One thing that should really wake the far-left up in other countries is the sheer mass of people making leftwing critiques of their capitalist states since the financial crisis/Arab Spring, while at the same time historical Leftist organizations have had a very hard time making themselves relevant or using their infrastructure to push the movement (perhaps they come across as too self-serving, corrupt, power hungry or historically out of place to the average citizen)

[Sasha]

SUMMARY OF TODAYS EVENTS


Protests have been going strong in Istanbul non-stop since yesterday. Ankara saw a decline around noon, however regrouped with an even bigger following in Kızılay around 4.
Today, Prime Minister Erdoğan very blatantly threatened to gather his supporters against the main opposition party CHP, who called for an official meeting of the party in Istanbul to support the protests all around Turkey. I can't believe that he actually said "if you bring 10k, we will bring 100k people."
CHP then backed down, and opted for an unofficial gathering rather than an official party meeting.
Things got pretty heated up towards afternoon in Istanbul, which led Erdoğan to back down as well. The police force in Taksim, Istanbul has been called back, and the protest continues in Taksim Square without interference.
Police brutality in Istanbul from earlier today
http://www.e-flux.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/f3de4_june1_turkey_img.jpg
However, it got really ugly in Kızılay, Ankara today with police using the same tactics utilized in Istanbul, such as dropping teargas from helicopters and plastic bullets.
https://twitter.com/TipAdam/status/340855900246007808/photo/1
https://twitter.com/gzdrkt/status/340865604997234688/photo/1
https://twitter.com/cansucomlekci/status/340847603828805632/photo/1 (nsfw-blood)
https://twitter.com/Crypt0nymous/status/340876935351660545/photo/1
Somebody got shot with a REAL BULLET in Ankara today by "accident". Yeah, right. Don't mind the photo, he's not dead, but wounded.
https://twitter.com/eccyilmaz/status/340864790257864704/photo/1/large
The clash in Ankara between the police and the protesters are still continuing. And it doesn't seem like it's gonna stop anytime soon.
Also worth mentioning is Ankara's major, who have been provocatively tweeting the whole day and saying stuff like "You're lucky that we believe in democrasy, otherwise we would have drown you in a spoon of water."(turkish proverb, literally implies killing someone figuratively implies crushing/destroying/hurting someone)** COVERAGE ** - Mainly Ankara with few posts about Istanbul and other cities.
[20:04]: These are UTC +2 (or +3 not sure because of the summer time)
Police have returned to Beşiktaş(near taksim), clashes continue.
Protests happening in Adana, Samsun and Kayseri as well.
[20:11]:
Live stream from Karanfil street, right next to the Kızılay Square in Ankara where the clashes are still continuing.(the stream fades in and out approx. every 3-5 minutes.)
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/karanfilcanli
[20:23]:
This guy is saying that 4000 of them just left METU, and marching towards Kızılay. https://twitter.com/Cem_Baker/status/340880546953588736
[/URL][20:39]:
Footage from Kızılay, half an hour ago.
https://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=638487016181407 (https://twitter.com/Cem_Baker/status/340880546953588736)
(still not public, hopefully will be in a while.)
Photo from half an hour ago. http://i.imgur.com/klLikkO.jpg
[21:09]:
Pretty big crowd in Tunalı. Will post pictures when I can.
The crowd is still angry in Kızılay because of the occasional teargas coming from the cops. It's like they're trying to provocate on purpose.
Apparently things are pretty heated up in Adana as well, a friend just said that there's blood everywhere.
[21:17]:
Another group of protesters gathering in Çayyolu, one of the suburbs of Ankara.
http://imgur.com/MKjsSLv (http://i.imgur.com/klLikkO.jpg)
Aerial photo of the Taksim Square after the police backed down today.
http://imgur.com/iquJP3O
The force is strong with Ankara.
http://imgur.com/ua3PU4s
[21:28]:
Apparently metro is closed, looking for confirmation. Also, the same violent tactics are happening all over again in Ankara. This guy claims they're pushing pepper spray through subway ventilation.
https://twitter.com/RoboTamer/status/340894352496807936 (http://imgur.com/ua3PU4s)
There seems to be general internet connectivity issues in Ankara and Istanbul, ping times are a bit high. I should also mention that some people were unable to connect to Facebook or Twitter in Istanbul today. Not sure what to make of it.
[21:42]:
Just got in touch with a source in Bar Association. All the people that were arrested/detained today were being released one by one. They're pretty well organized in Law Enforcement Offices, personally overseeing the booking process.
The charges are some nonsense bullshit. Apparently the cops said that they won't be making any more arrests. We'll see.
I can hear Kuğulu Park loud & clear from my home. Sounds like a pretty fucking big crowd.
Several points were closed to traffic in Ankara.
[22:08]:
Protests in Antalya as well.
The clash continues in Beşiktaş, İstanbul. Live video footage:
[URL]http://rt.com/on-air/turkey-protest-istanbul-park/
Pretty big crowd in Bahçelievler, Ankara as well.
https://vine.co/v/b3zWxTJTI3X
[22:15]:
Meşrutiyet Caddesi, Kızılay. Half an hour ago.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152866024970453
Still a big crowd in Kuğulu Park.
Another crowd in Ayrancı.
[22:28]:
Footage from Ankara, earlier today. Fuckers ran over a protester with a fucking tank ( edit: tactical vehicle. Does it matter much at this point?). The guy was hiding from the water cannon in the barricade. FUCK. THIS. SHIT. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_0AoL72Evw&feature=youtu.be
Smaller protests pretty much in every neighborhood in Ankara.
[22:48]:
I think the guy who was "accidentally" shot with a real bullet just died. Trying to confirm.
Someone just tweeted that a group of Ankaragücü fans dressed as the police, infiltrated their ranks, and then beat the crap out of them. If true, hilarious.
[22:57]:
Just a single neighborhood from Istanbul.
http://instagram.com/p/aB1-4EKc2R/
The whole city of Ankara is going nuts right now, slogans and car horns EVERYWHERE.
People all around Turkey is calling for Erdoğans Resignation. Seems like it's the campaign motto now.
[23:02]:
I'm sorry guys but I just can't stand to be here and not out there right now. My friends are out there still clashing with the police. I will try to post from the street but I can't say how often. I'll pick it back up when I get back. So long fellas.

Message from Müştereklerimiz (Our Commons) (https://www.indymedia.nl/node/16241)

(very rough translation of the text by Müştereklerimiz - a coalition of different movements in Istanbul that want to think, act and collaborate, the group includes anti-gentrification, migrant support, animal rights groups and more. )


We are all new people today!
Many things can be said about these four days: 'big' analysis can be made. But, what has happened in those four days? Gezi Park resistance made a big explosion in all of our, i.e. regular people's, collective action and organization capacity. Just with a spark... We saw the body of the resistance while walking through Bosphorus Bridge and while being fearless of the police brutality in Istiklal Street (in Taksim). We saw people supporting eachother while being exposed to gas, the shopkeepers distributing free food, and opening their doors to the wounded, doctors being there for help. Police declared a war against us; they ran out of their gas stocks, used rubber bullets, but could not stop the resistance. This collective body, which started with a spark, resisted for days. What has been experienced is in out collective memories; it became a life in itself circulating in our vains. While a new way of resisting is written in our memories, what is left from previous resistances was remembered as a simple fact: We can decide on our faith!
The resistance that started as a defense of Gezi Parkı, gave all of us trust with its dedication, insistence, its belief in its rightfulness, and creativity. The resistance spread from Gezi to Taksim, from Taksim to Istanbul, and from Istanbul to all over the country. Taksim Gezi Park Resistance became the place where we showed our anger against everything that prevented us from deciding on our own faith. Nothing will be the same, after this anger and this solidarity is voiced in such a way. None of us will be the person we were before this resistance. We saw something we have not seen before. We didn't only see it, we experienced it, we did it together. We saw our bodies moved by a spark, we were the collective body of resistance.
Gezi resistance provoked a youth upraising. It became the meaning and the place where one, or maybe two, generations - who in their lifetime never saw any other government/power but AKP, who identified authority with Erdogan-, showed their anger against this government, and possibly against any government. Any resistance in the near future will be enriched by this new generation. Gezi Parkı and Taksim Square resistance, at the same time, brought about the meaning of public space for us. Taksim Square is transformed, from a square around which AKP government is reinstating its own hegemony, into a square of resistance.
We saw the flame of resistance, and we know that we can create new flames. We felt our collective bodies against the seizure of our common areas/public spaces. We felt the resistance, we will not step back. New flames live in our bodies; we know that any moment is enough to turn that spark into a flame.
This is only the beginning, resistance continues!
Müştereklerimiz (Our Commons)
source: https://www.indymedia.nl/node/16225

[Sasha]

Someone just tweeted that a group of Ankaragücü fans dressed as the police, infiltrated their ranks, and then beat the crap out of them. If true, hilarious.between this (if true) and the pictures of the gallataseray fans high-jacking a police pantzer to break the kessel of a group of a few hundred demonstrators it seems the ultra's are having an awesome private competition going :D
why fight each other if you can just as well dick measure by who can fuck up the cops the best....

[Sasha]

amnesty international is saying at least 2 people died and a 1000 injured :sneaky:

[billydan]

Is the T.K.P helping out in these riots?

[Sasha]

5FaXDaON3-8

istanbul citizens showing their support for the demonstrations by flicking their lights on and off :)

[Sasha]

*edited the thread title because the protests moved far past the demolition of taksim park*

[Zaza]

So what are the political parties behind this?


CHP (People's Republican Party) and TKP (Turkish Communist Party) as far as i know.

Theres more.
The nationalists ( Bozkurts or MHP ), the Kemalists ( CHP ), the Workers Party ( IP ) , the TKP and even people from the Kurdish Workers Party. ( Not sure if this is legit, but I saw this morning while watching the news even people who raised the Apo Öcalan flag ).
Other than those, there is even the Alevite-Community but those are mainly protesting because of a Bridge name.




AFAIK it's more widespread than this meager article. Perhaps some of our Turkish users could fill us in?

If I could help here;
Apparently I heard that Erdogan said "Do whatever you want to do, we already made our decisions."
Seems like he still wants to complete his project. Good enough that he won't be able to.

The media also says that thousands of soldiers quitted their job because of this protests and maybe even want to join them.

Turkish media also says that the protests in Istanbul are not that much as in the last days, while in other turkish cities ( And in other countries ) the protests keep going as they did before.
But German media reports that the brutality started again in Istanbul.


I suggest reading/watching the Ususal Kanal and Aydinlik.
Both are from the Turkish Workers Party and the only turkish media I would trust.


By the way, ask me if you want news to something happening there, I can a little bit turkish and have turkish channels here.



I would love to share pictures of the events, but sadly I can't with this amount of posts.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Rusty, I could give you lots of information about the SDP, but I don't really see the point. Partly because explaining them would involve placing them in their context in the Turkish left, which you don't have the background information on anyway*.

More importantly though is that it is not really the point. I don't think that there is anything useful in people finding one of the myriads of Turkish left wing groups to 'support'. People can rest assured though that whatever your ideological preference the Turkish left is broad enough to have somebody for you to 'support'.

Surely the point though is to understand what the nature of this movement is.

Devrim

*If I were explaining to someone familiar with the Turkish left, I would say that they come from a right-wing split from the ÖDP about ten years ago, but that wouldn't really help you.

i wasnt really looking for a group to support. I was just curious because when looking at the turkish left, its split up almost more than the US left.

looks like youve been busy though, and you arent too sneaky about things!
http://24.media.tumblr.com/9fe553107a8b39170d6d57c774d3d61e/tumblr_mnrkv0VspQ1ste7qoo1_500.jpg I know it just means revolution,but its funny when you are exposed to another word by revleft and therefore that word is associated with that user.



if people want to see some parties...

http://24.media.tumblr.com/a6d2c3f3cc8c3ac727cc8a24bbc99b2d/tumblr_mnrl6pWlaB1ste7qoo1_500.jpg

[Zaza]

By the way, the left and right winged people are sticking together now.
"Sag-Sol yok. Vatan savunmasi var." Translated: There is no left or right, there is the protection of the homecountry.

[Tim Cornelis]

i wasnt really looking for a group to support. I was just curious because when looking at the turkish left, its split up almost more than the US left.


if people want to see some parties...


Almost more? Definitely more.


http://static3.volkskrant.nl/static/photo/2013/1/11/14/20130602184624/media_xl_1681634.jpg

Here more Marxist-Leninist sects.
SKYP, Sosyalist Yeniden Kuruluş Partisi.
HKP, Halkın Kurtuluş Partisi.

[Skyhilist]

Just came across this video made by a Turkish protestor regarding the protests:

aEapNRakzDI

[Devrim]

i wasnt really looking for a group to support. I was just curious because when looking at the turkish left, its split up almost more than the US left.

I would imagine that the Turkish left is much bigger than the US left.


I know it just means revolution,but its funny when you are exposed to another word by revleft and therefore that word is associated with that user.

You know it is a name, don't you? Turkish names have meanings. For example this guy is called Devrim Evin though it is probably a little too small to read on the poster.

http://www.majalla.com/eng/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/fetih.jpg

It can also be a girls name. Demonstration is also a popular name.

Devrim

[Devrim]

By the way, the left and right winged people are sticking together now.
"Sag-Sol yok. Vatan savunmasi var." Translated: There is no left or right, there is the protection of the homecountry.

This is an İşçi Partisi (Workers Party) slogan. They are a pseudo-left nationalist party.

Devrim

[Leo]

Just came back from the demonstration in Ankara. I'm very tired and full of tear gas so this will be quite brief. The movement is very heterogenous, with a previously apolitical majority. Very widespread, lots of people are very excited. In Istanbul, over a milion demonstrators overwhelmed the police and took over Taksim square. In Ankara violent clashes have been occuring over the demonstrators intent to occupy Kizilay square and march on the parliament. Today, after hours of clashes and tons of tear gas, the police attacked the demo here very violently and took over Kizilay square.


Just came across this video made by a Turkish protestor regarding the protests:Entirely coincidentally, I know that guy. He's an alright fella.

[Sasha]

The guy in the vid already explained why many urban people voted for erdogan the first time but i still wonder how his party got so big while its base is conservative-rural... Is the rural population so big in turkey that their popular votes can rival or even surpass the urban vote? Or is there some district system that favours the rural vote?

[Devrim]

The guy in the vid already explained why many urban people voted for erdogan the first time but i still wonder how his party got so big while its base is conservative-rural... Is the rural population so big in turkey that their popular votes can rival or even surpass the urban vote? Or is there some district system that favours the rural vote?

AKP does well in the cities too. This is the map of the last election (2011) results:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0c/2011_T%C3%BCrkiye_genel_se%C3%A7im_sonu%C3%A7lar%C 4%B1.svg/370px-2011_T%C3%BCrkiye_genel_se%C3%A7im_sonu%C3%A7lar%C 4%B1.svg.png
As you can see AKP won majorities in both İstanbul and Ankara.

Devrim

[B5C]

The guy in the vid already explained why many urban people voted for erdogan the first time but i still wonder how his party got so big while its base is conservative-rural... Is the rural population so big in turkey that their popular votes can rival or even surpass the urban vote? Or is there some district system that favours the rural vote?

Let's see:

2008:
http://wwws4.eea.europa.eu/soer/countries/tr/country-introduction-turkey/2.jpg/image_large

2011 Election: It looks like he was able to get enough cities. Rual population could never get enough votes.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a5/2011_Turkish_general_election_english.svg/400px-2011_Turkish_general_election_english.svg.png

[billydan]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c7c_1370115967

[Leo]

More news about Ankara - haven't seen all this but its on leftist news sites: yesterday and today, the number of total people demonstrating in and around Kizilay is reported to be over 100,000. Today, the police only managed to disperse the demonstration with the aid of soldiers.

[Zaza]

This is an İşçi Partisi (Workers Party) slogan. They are a pseudo-left nationalist party.

Devrim


Doubt that. This didn't came from the IP. Atleast not from where I saw it.
Someone made a picture in the mass of some Bozkurts which made their handsigns with some communists near them which made the "communist handsign". Above it was this text.
Which even makes sense if you think about how they are sticking together.

Why should we be pseudo-left anyway?

[L.A.P.]

what's the TKP's politics like?

[Sasha]

AKP does well in the cities too. This is the map of the last election (2011) results:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/0c/2011_T%C3%BCrkiye_genel_se%C3%A7im_sonu%C3%A7lar%C 4%B1.svg/370px-2011_T%C3%BCrkiye_genel_se%C3%A7im_sonu%C3%A7lar%C 4%B1.svg.png
As you can see AKP won majorities in both İstanbul and Ankara.

Devrim

The "independent" areas are mostly Kurdish I presume? And how come that the fascists have a majority in that one specific area in the north-east?

[hatzel]

As you can see AKP won majorities in both İstanbul and Ankara.

The two cities we've heard most about these last few days. Does anybody know what's going on in Izmir, though? With it falling in CHP territory according to that map, it might be presumed that anti-AKP/-the-current-government sentiment runs slightly higher there than in Istanbul or Ankara, but I haven't heard so much about what's going on there. All I know is that something is happening, but I have no idea about the scale or nature of the protests...

[Zaza]

The two cities we've heard most about these last few days. Does anybody know what's going on in Izmir, though? With it falling in CHP territory according to that map, it might be presumed that anti-AKP/-the-current-government sentiment runs slightly higher there than in Istanbul or Ankara, but I haven't heard so much about what's going on there. All I know is that something is happening, but I have no idea about the scale or nature of the protests...

Was looking throught the reports from some pages, nothing about Izmir. But in Antalya people are protesting as well.
Kartal ( Istanbul ) has now a protest as well, if there wasn't before.

By the way, FEMEN are supporting turkey now.

[Devrim]

The "independent" areas are mostly Kurdish I presume? And how come that the fascists have a majority in that one specific area in the north-east?

Independent means Kurdish nationalist, yes. In Turkish general elections a party needs to get 10% of the national vote to enter parliament. They don't get that much across the whole country, so they stand as independents.

Igdır is the province where the MHP won. It isn't a traditional stronghold of theirs. I think it used to have a Kurdish nationalist MP before. They also used to have more provinces. I think it is just by chance. Basically AKP did so well that it ended up looking like that.

Devrim

[Devrim]

Doubt that. This didn't came from the IP. Atleast not from where I saw it.

The last time I read Aydınlık, which was a long time ago, it had a lead article with a title something like 'Şuanda sağ ve sol yok, sadce yurtseverler'*. This is a very similar slogan.



Why should we be pseudo-left anyway?

Because basically İP is a Turkish nationalist party these days with a little added leftist rhetoric.

Devrim

*At the moment there is no right or left, only patriots.

[Devrim]

The two cities we've heard most about these last few days. Does anybody know what's going on in Izmir, though? With it falling in CHP territory according to that map, it might be presumed that anti-AKP/-the-current-government sentiment runs slightly higher there than in Istanbul or Ankara, but I haven't heard so much about what's going on there. All I know is that something is happening, but I have no idea about the scale or nature of the protests...

There have been protest right across the country, the figure I heard was in over 50 of Turkey's 81 provinces. Naturally İstanbul and Ankara get the most coverage as they are the biggest cities.

Devrim

[Zaza]

The last time I read Aydınlık, which was a long time ago, it had a lead article with a title something like 'Şuanda sağ ve sol yok, sadce yurtseverler'*. This is a very similar slogan.



However, my one came from a kemalist page.
And as I don't know the article you are talking about, I can't talk about it.

[Devrim]

There have been protest right across the country, the figure I heard was in over 50 of Turkey's 81 provinces. Naturally İstanbul and Ankara get the most coverage as they are the biggest cities.

The minister of the interior says (http://www.radikal.com.tr/turkiye/icisleri_bakani_guler_67_ilde_235_eylem_ve_etkinli k_yapildi-1135983) that there have been 235 demonstrations and activities in 67 provinces.

Devrim

[Zaza]

there have been 235 demonstrations and activities in 67 provinces.

Devrim

How long will this last. What do you think?

[Leo]

Does anybody know what's going on in Izmir, though? With it falling in CHP territory according to that map, it might be presumed that anti-AKP/-the-current-government sentiment runs slightly higher there than in Istanbul or Ankara

The police brutalized the protesters in Izmir as well, we've heard. Apparently plain clothes infiltrated the demonstration and directed people to a trap. I don't know about how strong the demonstration there was. I doubt it was stronger than Ankara though.

[Tim Cornelis]

Local elections do not have a threshold I presume? That would make the local elections more representative:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/79/29MartIlGenelMeclisi.png
Compare this to the Human Development Index:
http://quakesos.sosearthquakesvz.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/cedim-25102011-3.jpg

Three provinces to the far-right/fascists.
There seems to be a slight correlation with development and CHP support, or perhaps it's coincidental.

[Zaza]

The two cities we've heard most about these last few days. Does anybody know what's going on in Izmir, though?

New reports are saying that in Bornova,Izmir the main streets are filled with protestors

[human strike]

More news about Ankara - haven't seen all this but its on leftist news sites: yesterday and today, the number of total people demonstrating in and around Kizilay is reported to be over 100,000. Today, the police only managed to disperse the demonstration with the aid of soldiers.

Soldiers are aiding the police? Do you know if this the case in just Ankara or a general trend?


between this (if true) and the pictures of the gallataseray fans high-jacking a police pantzer to break the kessel of a group of a few hundred demonstrators it seems the ultra's are having an awesome private competition going :D


Where can one find these pictures?

[Bronco]

Funny thing is the West often hold up Turkey as an example of a stable, moderate, Islamic democracy that they can be friends with, kinda also how they viewed Mubarak Egypt while it was convenient (maybe not democratic)

(not really comparing the two just making the point that the way the west present attitudes towards their governments & ruling classes in middle eastern & african countries is often very different to the reality)

[Leo]

Soldiers are aiding the police? Do you know if this the case in just Ankara or a general trend?

Just in Ankara as far as I know.

[Leo]

By the way, a protestor was shot with a real gun on the head in Ankara yesterday,and is in hospital right now, expected to die. Thousands were taken into custody today, thousands - probably tens of thousands injured.

[Zaza]

Woah. According to some pages, the protestors set the AKP HQ to fire NOW in Izmir- Karşıyaka

[Leo]

Calls for a general strike are spreading on facebook, twitter and all.

[human strike]

Woah. According to some pages, the protestors set the AKP HQ to fire NOW in Izmir- Karşıyaka

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/p480x480/945076_265519393591328_570365478_n.jpg

[LoveNotIndustry]

This had to happen. Everyone in Turkey has been plagued with greed and the interests of arrogant government leaders. The oppressors really don't have any right to interfere with these riots, they are pretty much the only way the people can maintain justice from such petty crime. The resistance should continue, in any case. If the fascists are fighting with martial law and tear gas, spread the unrest.

What's next? The US and the big boys start getting involved with Eastern Europe and the Middle East? Sounds like it's not the first time an uprising proved a real threat to the capitalist empire powers. Maybe the government stands for something with an ideological title and it's really just a false mask, capitalism is most often the root of injustice. The bankers in the 20th century vatican used their capitalist system to fund the European axis powers in World War II. Their true nature is nazi murderers. The wealthy pigs involved with the vatican were indeed followers of Satanism. The story of vatican-reich interaction is mentioned frequently in the sources of modern Satanism, such as The Satanic Bible and The Devils Notebook. Although believers in Satanism believe in standing above materialism, they believe in a negative effect towards the prospering of humanity. Seems like the Turkish Oppressors are similar to the Satanist Nazis.

[billydan]

do you think Abdullah Gül will get overthrown?

[Tifosi]

Where can one find these pictures?

Here (http://www.ultras-tifo.net/news/1714-turkish-supporters-united-against-government.html) and here (http://z6.invisionfree.com/UltrasTifosi/index.php?showtopic=25842)

http://img.onedio.com/img/719/bound/2r2/51ab52a52d7527776d000036.jpg

lol

[Os Cangaceiros]

Wow, I had no idea about any of this, hadn't heard much on the news. Solidarity from the other side of the planet!

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Last I saw protestors had jacked construction vehicles and were driving them at those police trucks with the water cannons. Bulldozer>forklift.

[Tifosi]

In spoilers because the footage is brutal. If anyone thinks that these people have limits and morals. Fuck cops, ACAB!

sbYQ_dzFniY

[Yet_Another_Boring_Marxist]

Last I saw protestors had jacked construction vehicles and were driving them at those police trucks with the water cannons. Bulldozer>forklift.

Revisionist!

[khad]

Taken from a Turkish discussion:

LDnrcsrhxGg

"Here you have a cop yelling at some residents who got stuck between the protestors to "come come we're not going to do anything" and then the police take aim at their heads and fire the gas bombs, thankfully it misses the people."

[Paul Pott]

Solidarity to the Turkish revolution.

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22749271

in the video on that story, it's noticeable how many TKP flags are being waved. Also the fellow who says he wants a "socialist revolution".

Question for the Turkish Left - what's the link between the "major" Turkish Left groups participating in the protest and the Kurdish movements? What's the chance that this issue will bring a more unified Leftist opposition to the government that brings together otherwise disparate ethnic (Kurdish, Turkish) or religious (secular, Alevi, Sunni, Christian) interests, or is it too soon to say?

[Le Socialiste]

Article from Links on the unrest with a brief description of its effect on elements within the Left:


The Gezi Park resistance has brought much needed Turkish-Kurdish unity to the left opposition. Kurdish cities have joined the solidarity protests. Kurds, Turks, secularists, social democrats and nationalists merged in the clashes against police brutality. The left, with its “Taksim passion”, has played a leading role in the protests.

The mainstream media’s blackout of the protests – which is unprecedented – has brought the leftist media to the fore. Left-wing Hayat Television has been covering the protests non-stop, live.

There has been a protest outside the headquarters of national broadcaster NTV for turning a blind eye to the protests.

More here (http://links.org.au/node/3373).

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

Late on Sunday, the White House said in a statement that all parties should "calm the situation", and reaffirmed that peaceful demonstrations were "part of democratic expression".
The US previously criticised the security forces for their initial response to the protest.

*cough* Occupy? *cough*...Hypocritical fucknuggets.

Mr Erdogan says the protesters are undemocratic and have been provoked by the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP).
Speaking in a televised interview on Sunday, the prime minister dismissed those taking part in protests as "a few looters" and strongly criticised social media sites, singling out Twitter, which he said was "an extreme version of lying".

(BBC NEWS)

A few looters? Hmm...famous last words?

[Wash Me]

Are the demands to overthrow the current ruling party??
and could someone explain to me why has the issue risen at this specific time.

Thanks!

[Sasha]

Are the demands to overthrow the current ruling party??
and could someone explain to me why has the issue risen at this specific time.

Thanks!

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/06/03/world/middleeast/development-spurs-larger-fight-over-turkish-identity.html

[Wash Me]

So basically it's about the party's ideology.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Saw this on the news today. It's the first time I've seen footage of people waving socialist flags on television.

[Dropdead]

Hopefully something big will happen.

[Sasha]

So basically it's about the party's ideology.

More its increasingly authoritarian tendencies, someone described the attitude of the government as "for the people, despite the people", don't forget that many people in turkey are fiercely secular, they see themselves far more as part of Europe than the middle east.

[The Douche]

Devrim's still in turkey isn't he? Somebody must have contact with him outside of here. I'm sure he's busy, but somebody should ask him for some notes, and tell him to stay safe.

[Devrim]

Devrim's still in turkey isn't he? Somebody must have contact with him outside of here. I'm sure he's busy, but somebody should ask him for some notes, and tell him to stay safe.

No, I am living in central Europe at the moment. Leo is in Turkey. He wrote me a couple of times after he came home last night, and I chatted to a few people there on Skype.

Devrim

[Craig_J]

Wishing all the best luck to our Turkish brothers in their fight for freedom, and I hope you and your families are all safe and well.

[Sasha]

turkish cops kicking and beating a protester completely to shit: http://www.zie.nl/video/turkije/Protesten-in-Turkije/m1nzgekfj1of

[Sasha]

3 June
The demonstrations continue..
The streets and districts controlled by people in many cirties, there were demonstrations in more than 65 cities in Turkey, and the violence gets higher as the night comes, last night more than 1000 protesters were arrested in Ankara and brought into a big gym and held there, their photos were taken by the police, and around 200 lawyers were waiting in front of the building, not being let in by the police.
the mobile first aid units that are formed by medical students and doctors were raided in Ankara, and both doctors and the wounded people were arrested.
2-3 escavators were taken over by the protestors in Istanbul and Ankara, one of them was following an TOMA(ME unit) in the streets in Istanbul yesterday night.
-Ege university in Izmir is occupied.
-since this morning in front of one of the main TV stations (Dogus Holding - NTV) people came together to protest media blackout, the tv station ignored the masses protesting in front of the building for a long time, they showed sport news instead, and they had to make the news about the situation in the end, possibly because they thought otherwise when things go wrong they might not make it to the news(!), and mainly because many companies withdrawing their advertisements from the channel (and that is due to the companies' fear of the crowds' anger towards the media blackout!).
Photo says 'Protesters in front of NTV building, protesting against the media blackout', you can see the NTV logo on it.
at the moment the situation in Ankara Guvenpark(a park close to Kizilay) is going bad, many arrests.
a hackers group from Turkey-RedHack- threatened to publish the names of the higher police officers and their addresses, and asked for police violence to stop. People are asking what they are still waiting for!
A website where police violence images are collected: delilimvar.tumblr.com
today Taksim Dayanismasi called for a protest against police violence, at 19hrs at Taksim. they also announced a list of demands.
there is call for general strike by the major unions.
-there is a general call for withdrawing accounts from certain banks and boycotting certain brands.
the first funeral today at 17hrs in Istanbul, of Mehmet Ayvalitas died yesterday after a car run into the demonstrators. The number of deaths are unclear at the moment, at least to me.
-one of the many slogans of the protestors says: "tayyip O. Ç." meaning 'tayyip(erdogan) is son of a prostitute", it is unfortunately a commonly used saying. Today a group of protesting prostitutes from Dikmen had a sign that says they are sure tayyip is not their son.;)
-people marked the trees in Gezi Park with names of kurdish people who were masacred in Roboski with chemical bombs on 28th December 2011, this was done with the order of army and government, and later it was claimed that those people were 'mistaken' with PKK members.
- at the very moment big clashes in Kizilay, Ankara. Many seriously injured, and ambulance not able to reach them, and mobile diy emergency units were raided yesterday!!. (14:30 NL time).
so far...
Foto:
https://www.indymedia.nl/indyfiles/imagecache/cropstrip/raw/ntv%20onu%20-3%20haziran%20-%20BL0_9irCIAAv8pX.jpg
https://www.indymedia.nl/indyfiles/imagecache/cropstrip/raw/Screen%20shot%202013-06-03%20at%201.21.11%20PM.png
https://www.indymedia.nl/indyfiles/imagecache/cropstrip/raw/ele%20gecen%20kepce%20inonu%20stadi%20-%20BLyc9FDCYAA4l_T.jpg_large.jpg




....

[Sasha]

direct link to the tumblr with footage of police violence: delilimvar.tumblr.com/
(http://www.revleft.com/vb/delilimvar.tumblr.com/)

[Zaza]

in the video on that story, it's noticeable how many TKP flags are being waved. Also the fellow who says he wants a "socialist revolution".

Question for the Turkish Left - what's the link between the "major" Turkish Left groups participating in the protest and the Kurdish movements? What's the chance that this issue will bring a more unified Leftist opposition to the government that brings together otherwise disparate ethnic (Kurdish, Turkish) or religious (secular, Alevi, Sunni, Christian) interests, or is it too soon to say?

I think it's too soon to say.
But by the way, Alevites mainly support the secular interests.

[Delenda Carthago]

KKE and KNE are having a demonstration towards the Turkish embassy in solidarity with the turkish people and against repression. I will post photos later.

[Leo]

Calls on a general strike are intensifying: KESK, the leftist public workers union, has declared that it will merge its one-day warning strike with the demonstrations, and the KESK general strike will take place on the 4th and the 5th, bringing a total of 240,000 public workers on a strike. Meanwhile, DISK, the leftist private sector union which said it can mobilize up to 150,000 workers, has announced that it will be organizing warning demonstrations, with the slogan: "we will stop life if the government doesn't stop attacking demonstrations", reading leaflets in workplaces tomorrow and starting to take action on the 5th. KESK apparently called for a general strike for all unions on the 5th and the 6th, and I've read that DISK, TMMOB (engineers and archithects union) and the TTB (doctors union) are warm on the idea. Calls are made on Turk-Is, the mainstream public workers union, to join in as well although I don't think anyone aside from the opposition unions within Turk-Is (the Syndical Power Unity Platform) will even participate in the demonstrations.

My personal opinion: KESK's limited general strike won't have a large effect, unless the 240,000 striking remain on strike after the 5th or the 6th, quite possibly against the wishes of KESK leaders themselves. The demonstrators probably will urge them to do so, which they well might - and if they do, other workers there might follow.

Additional news: more police brutality in Ankara, the Rector's Office of the Aegean University in Izmir has been occupied, and the demonstrators in Taksim gave the names of the Kurdish victims of the massacre in Roboski (Uludere) and the Turkish and Arab victims of Reyhanli to the trees - a meaningful demonstration of internationalism.

[Zaza]

Ungeachtet der Spannungen in der Türkei ist Ministerpräsident Erdogan zu einer Reise nach Nordafrika aufgebrochen. Er rief zur Ruhe im Land auf.

"The Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan left the country for a visit to northafrica ( Morocco ). He called for peace in the country."

If this is true, that's very good.

[Sasha]

"The Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan left the country for a visit to northafrica ( Morocco ). He called for peace in the country."

If this is true, that's very good.

it is a planned visit, it does show his arrogance though that he expects to maintain control and loyalty and that it will not escalate further while he is gone. previous turkish "democratic" leaders would never leave the country amids a crisis like this lest the military wouldnt let them return.

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

Piece from the BBC by travel writer Angelica Malin who was in Istanbul, note the dim view taken of the unruly 'anarchists'.

The excitement was contagious. At 14:00 we were standing on Dolmabahce Cadessi, the road leading to Taksim Square, a mere 2km (1.4 miles) away, in our best sandals and sun dresses, watching thousands and thousands of people pour into the streets.
The same repetitive chant, demanding Erdogan's resignation, could be heard all across the city - along with car horns, rioters hitting saucepans, pots and drums.
It was exciting. Tour buses had been taken over, filled to the brim with rioters, and people waved their flags gleefully in the air.
But as we had lunch at a rooftop bar things started to get serious.
We watched in horror as staff pointed out the clouds of tear gas floating our way from Taksim, asking us to move inside the restaurant. Someone told us that the items we had seen being sold on the street earlier - bottles of milk and halves of lemons - were being used to counteract the effects of the gas.
Within hours, everything had descended into chaos. Back at our hotel, we were forced out of the terrace bar as our eyes stung and it felt like we'd swallowed pepper.
As soon as we were inside, we realised the full extent of the conflict. Right in front of the lounge bar window, the courtyard was a site of utter chaos - thousands filled the street, as the riot police outside the Shangri-La hotel were violently pushing protesters further into the side streets with tear gas and water cannons.
We watched in horror as men covered in sweat poured lemon into their eyes, women clutched their friends, and some of the bravest of the protesters who had been at the very front, their shirts torn, sat on the floor in fits of coughing.
As night began to fall, it brought with it anarchists and more violent protestors.
The more peace-loving protesters in the lounge next to uscondemned this violence. We witnessed rioters pulling security cameras off the walls and yelping with joy, graffiting the walls, and picking up pavement slabs to throw at the riot police.
At this point, the lounge contained a mix of a Turkish protesters - what we believe were friends and family of hotel staff - and horrified tourists wearing gas masks.
We felt trapped. We had no information - the Turkish news channels seemed to be focusing on other stories, and we could not reach the British Embassy on the phone.
We turned to Twitter as a news source, using the hashtags #direngeziparki or #occupgezi to find the most up-to-date information and posting live reports on social media ourselves.
It was hard to know what was fact - reports that the police were using Agent Orange had us spooked.
But there was a real sense of camaraderie in the hotel, as we all poured around a single TV in the lounge, desperate for information.
The bottom floor had been turned into a make-shift hospital, with the in-house hotel doctor treating the effects of gas.
At one point, when the room service arrived (after five hours, but this was hardly a time to complain), we realised the extent of the damage inside the hotel - the waiter apologised profusely, explaining that it had be hard to prepare the food as the gas had got into the kitchen. His eyes were red and swollen and we gave him our gas masks - the least we could do.
By the early hours of the morning, the hotel had become a conflict zone in its own right as the riot police had managed to push all the protesters up a side street to its right.
We were told to stay away from the windows, as a brick came crashing towards us at one point. The gas was too strong and we could not stay in the lounge without weeping.
A Turkish person informed me that the group we saw protesting was the youngest, most fundamentalist group, known for its violence.
When we left at 04:00, desperate to catch the first plane out of Istanbul - direct flights to the UK were full so we had to go via Paris - the streets were eerily quiet. There were barricades, a few small fires dotted around, and only a handful of protesters still in the streets.
Everything had been scrawled with an "A" for anarchy, and the city we had seen earlier in the day was unrecognisable.

[Zaza]

it is a planned visit, it does show his arrogance though that he expects to maintain control and loyalty and that it will not escalate further while he is gone. previous turkish "democratic" leaders would never leave the country amids a crisis like this lest the military wouldnt let them return.

Yes a planned visit, but he decided it for a really bad situation. Doubt there is anything more important than making this revolution against him stop.

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Piece from the BBC by travel writer Angelica Malin who was in Istanbul, note the dim view taken of the unruly 'anarchists'.

God damn this piece just reeks of privilege. "We were all so excited, me and my girlfriends in our best outfits just enjoying the nice weather and crowds when these rioters ruined everything. The food to our room was late(not complaining though!)"

Sorry for the inconvenience "journalist" Angelica Malin.

[Tifosi]

Last I saw protestors had jacked construction vehicles and were driving them at those police trucks with the water cannons. Bulldozer>forklift.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/482610_655133151182607_1758470065_n.jpg

[Le Socialiste]

"The Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan left the country for a visit to northafrica ( Morocco ). He called for peace in the country."

If this is true, that's very good.

Those plans were already in place well before the demonstrations...

I doubt he's fled the country.

Edit - Nvm, Psycho covered it.

[Crux]

A bunch of unions, including KESK and DISK have declared a general strike. I made a thread on it in the ongoing struggles forum.

[Arlekino]

Solidarity with Turkish people, Ah I wish something more in Europe, enough is enough sick of capitalist life. You can watch life from square here for the moment is peaceful.
http://rt.com/on-air/turkey-protest-istanbul-park/ )

[Delenda Carthago]

KKE and KNE are having a demonstration towards the Turkish embassy in solidarity with the turkish people and against repression. I will post photos later.
http://www.902.gr/sites/default/files/styles/902-original/public/Media/20130603/athhna_3.jpg?itok=IO8Pt_6y


http://www.902.gr/sites/default/files/styles/902-original/public/Media/20130603/athhna_5_0.jpg?itok=O0qwtMt9


http://www.902.gr/sites/default/files/styles/902-original/public/Media/20130603/athhna_19.jpg?itok=Dj1kxXOW


mind you, this was a few hours call. So yeah it went pretty well.

[Arminius]

And its not only in Istanbul or Ankara, smaller protests all around Turkey. Just talked to a relative in tourist city Marmaris. About 500 people there too. No response from the police. People are fed up by goverments policy on crisis in Syria. Also the bombings, suggestion of banning kissing in public, new alcohol laws etc.

Seems quite clear AKPs power is slipping from its hands.

(Excuse my english)

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

AKP got greedy ... banning booze and public kissing? Their whole case to begin with was that they were "liberal" Islamists and would not harm Turkish Secularism despite the fact that they are a religious party. I guess it didn't take long to go from "women should be able to wear headscarves in public buildings" to "people shouldn't have liquor because everyone who drinks alcohol is an alcoholic" (something Erdogan apparently said recently)

[Vercingetorix]

I want to caution everyone from drawing any conclusions from the current situation.

It is incredibly complex. There are people across the political spectrum active in these demonstrations, with each group claiming to be the "leaders" of the real movement.

I can see the fall of Edrogan through an election and his replacement with a more left-wing figure as a possibility. I can see a return to military dictatorship as a possibility, with the military being anti-theocratic.

This is very interesting, but definitely a wait-and-see situation.

It's clear from what I've been reading from my left-wing contacts I made during the Arab Spring that nobody outside of Turkey really knows what's going on. All my international contacts are giving conflicting information.

And I don't have any trustworthy contacts in Turkey yet.

[Zaza]

It's clear from what I've been reading from my left-wing contacts I made during the Arab Spring that nobody outside of Turkey really knows what's going on. All my international contacts are giving conflicting information.

And I don't have any trustworthy contacts in Turkey yet.

Apparently Al-Jazeera doesn't show any information about it as I know.
In the first days alot turkish channels refused to report about it as well.


By the way, right now there is a big protest in Antalya. And one in same size in Eskişehir an hour ago.
And not sure if this is true, but there are reports of police officers which startet to shoot with real bullets in Dersim ( Tunceli )

[Vercingetorix]

There *are* bloggers in the Middle East.

It's going to take a lot more substantive posts on my account before I can start posting links to them.

I would check progressive and socialist left-wing blogs in the United States and UK for links to trustworthy sources.

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Apparently Al-Jazeera doesn't show any information about it as I know.

Al Jazeera did have a pretty epic account (with footage) of the protesters using the construction digger to burst through police lines and nearly get to the PM's office.

[Blake's Baby]

Crux's thread on the call by different unions for a general strike:

http://www.revleft.com/vb/turkeys-trade-unions-t181232/index.html

[Leo]

Workers in several working-class neighborhoods in Istanbul have taken to the streets, shouting general strike, general resistance.

[Leo]

The opposition within Turk-Is, the main public sector trade-union in Turkey, have declared that they will be going to work late, slowing work, demonstrating before going to work or afterwars, reading leaflets or striking.

[Anti-Traditional]

Workers in several working-class neighborhoods in Istanbul have taken to the streets, shouting general strike, general resistance.

Are they acting independently of the unions? Is this the sort of mobilisation you were hoping for?

[Leo]

Are they acting independently of the unions? Is this the sort of mobilisation you were hoping for?

Yes, they are acting independently of the unions but also are trying to push the unions into declaring a general strike. This being widespread is the sort of mobilisation I'm hoping for. So far, very important, very good but not enough, not yet.

[Leo]

This just in: DISK and TMMOB (leftist private sector workers union and the engineers and architects union) will also be going on strike tomorow.

[human strike]

This just in: DISK and TMMOB (leftist private sector workers union and the engineers and architects union) will also be going on strike tomorow.

How many members do they have?

[Red Commissar]

How many members do they have?

According to DISK's website (http://www.disk.org.tr/default.asp?Page=Content&ContentId=699) they claim 407,000 members across all their member unions. TMMOB (http://www.tmmob.org.tr/index_en.php) claims 402,000.

Also I believe this thread warrants to be in ongoing struggles.

[Leo]

These might be their membership claims, although they aren't realistic. DISK announced that they are able to mobilize only 150,000 workers. The doctors union will be mobilizing 90,000, and the public workers union, KESK will be mobilizing its 240,000 members. TMMOB will mobilize tens of thousands, and bring the total number of strikers above half a million however they won't bring 400,000 out.

[ckaihatsu]

General strike in Turkey - our solidarity needed right now


This is what solidarity looks like.

Is this email not displaying correctly?
View it in your browser. (http://us2.campaign-archive1.com/?u=f3995b46c18cb039818f29a32&id=7b8deda1db&e=4e93ef2fad)


http://gallery.mailchimp.com/f3995b46c18cb039818f29a32/images/turkeyprotest.jpg (http://labourstart.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=f3995b46c18cb039818f29a32&id=7a5d242a83&e=4e93ef2fad)


Two national trade union centers in Turkey have announced general strikes in the wake of police violence and widespread arrests of protestors.

The International Trade Union Confederation (ITUC), which represents 175 million workers in 156 countries has called for union members to support our brothers and sisters in Turkey by signing up to the online campaign we launched yesterday. (http://labourstart.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=f3995b46c18cb039818f29a32&id=cf7f92beef&e=4e93ef2fad)

You can read the ITUC statement here. (http://labourstart.us2.list-manage.com/track/click?u=f3995b46c18cb039818f29a32&id=f096e3bf88&e=4e93ef2fad)

I know that thousands of you reading this message have already sent off your messages -- to you I say, thank you, but let's do more.

Please get your union on board -- help us get the word out that we need thousands more supporters.

This is the web address we should be sharing with all our members:

http://www.labourstartcampaigns.net/show_campaign.cgi?c=1840

In addition to the nearly 7,000 of you who responded in the last twenty-four hours, I want to make a special appeal to the more than 70,000 who will read this message but have not yet responded.

It will take you only a minute to show your support for our brothers and sisters in Turkey.

Please don't wait -- do this right now.

The workers on strike, the young people behind the barricades, the hundreds of protestors now in jails -- they all deserve our support right now.

I know I can count on you. Thank you.



Eric Lee

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[ckaihatsu]

[LaborTech] a report on turkey



A Report on the Situation in Turkey
Irfan Erdogan, [email protected], http://irfanerdogan.com/

I am writing this to inform you that people in over 65 cities of 81 in
Turkey are demonstrating against the reactionary and oppressive regime
of Tayyip Erdogan and his party. We have demonstrations even in the most
reactionary cities in Turkey. People in every neighborhood in the cities
are on the street. Police throw gas bombs at demonstrators, beat and
arrest people. It is not like in the late 1960s, because people did not
care about us much then. We students were demonstrating for independence
and socialism then. Now everybody is on the street. Nobody cheered when
we were demonstrating in the late 60s in Turkey. Now people are cheering
and supporting the demonstrators. Today we have more people on the
street in my neighborhood in Ankara than yesterday. Police are shooting
gas bombs inside the houses because people are providing shelter for
demonstrators who are escaping from gas and police beatings. Youngsters
and people from every walk of life are on the street and want the
Erdogan government to resign. Erdogan uses the classic rhetoric about
demonstrators and he threatens them by saying that he can send one
million supporters to the street (he means, to smash the
demonstrations). He says: "I keep 50 percent of the population at home"
(he means that he can use 50 percent of people who support him against
the other people). His mindset and approach reminds me of Jay Gould who
said once that he is not worried about demonstrations and labor strikes,
because he can hire one-half of the working class to kill the other
half. For a lot of people, Erdogan is a reactionary dictator. In Turkey
people are scared to say something against Erdogan. Television did not
provide any news about the demonstrations except the television stations
of the major opposition party and Turkish Labor party television,
because mainstream media either support the administration or are scared
of Erdogan’s rage/wrath. People in Istanbul walked in front of the major
television stations and announced that if they do not feature them in
the news they will occupy the TV station. Then, TV stations started
reporting, but in a highly distorted manner. After this incident, very
few media personnel resigned from their posts in the TV channel. Erdogan
scolded the Reuters journalist who dared to ask him a question that he
did not like. The Internet is used for the most effective channel of
communication and organization of the protests by everybody. Erdogan
expressed his utmost anger against Twitter and social media. Everybody
uses their mobile phone for communication and recording the events and
putting/disseminating them on the Internet. Mainstream media started
lying as usual. Two main labor unions in Turkey run by those who ask
some meaningless concessions from the government try to stop workers to
demonstrate, but workers are on the street, too. Demonstrations are
rapidly spreading all over the country. Soon, I know, religious
reactionaries (not all religious people are reactionary) will attack
demonstrators. There is a high probability that we will witness a
domestic/civil war in Turkey.

I was at the center of the demonstrations in Ankara yesterday and the
day before. Demonstrators do not do anything wrong, but police
continuously shoot pressured water, gas and noise bombs at them and
attack demonstrators. Police behave like they are fighting an enemy.
They curse at and threaten people by e.g. saying: "get lost otherwise we
arrest you and you know what we do when we arrest you." We know there
are some progressive and conscientious people in the police force, but
they are also under the threat of the empire of fear. But we will see a
differing police behavior as the time goes by in the process. Now, there
is an indiscriminate uss of gas bombs (CS gas). Your eyes get severely
burned and you cannot breathe, you start coughing, and you feel dizzy if
you are close to the fume. Also when it hits you or blows up beside you,
you get shocked (I saw it). So far we have four killings and many wounded.

As usual, they claim that demonstrators/provocateurs destroy and
vandalize everything around. Yes we see a lot of destruction; in fact,
it is started and done by plain-cloth police. How do I know: (1) this is
a historical fact. (2) I know from the late 60s, because we could
recognize the police then, but it is difficult to recognize them now.
(3) How come there is no vandalism, destruction and terror where there
is no police around? Here are few examples: I attend demonstrations at
the center of the city where police provokes, attacks and where plain
cloth police destroys everything aroun,d provoking some young people to
do the same. My daughter and my wife and neighbors attend huge
demonstrations in our neighborhood where there is no police presence
yet: You can see no violence, no destruction and no vandalism in these
demonstrations. Yesterday, I had to come back home early at night
because I almost fainted three times because of the police gas. Later, I
attended two neighborhood demonstrations and there were no destruction
and violence. Last year, I attended two demonstrations in Athens,
Greece. There was no police presence and there was no violence and
destruction. Athens was burning when there was police presence. When
police was involved, Athens was like a war zone, like in Ankara and
Istanbul. Those who rule the police force organize and run the show of
violence and destruction as usual.

People are against "Erdogan’s empire" that is misrepresented in Europe
and elsewhere. This reactionary party clearly stated that they "use the
democracy train until they get the power and reach their destination."
They are misperceived by Europeans who think that this government is
anti-racist and democratic. They are not racist because their political
view belongs to the middle ages of Islamic rule: They think that all
Muslims are the people of God and those who are not Muslim are condemned
by God and will all go to hell. That is why Erdogan is against
nationalism, but his/their nationalism is based "ummad/ümmed" that means
the collective community/nation/commonwealth/empire of Islamic peoples.
Their nationalism is based on a different logic, the logic of Muslim
statehood. A statehood where a prime minister considers himself king and
tells people that he does anything he wants, he builds a mosque there if
he wants (“there” refers to the park where people do not want the
government to cut the trees down). Before the uprising, demonstrators
were sleeping in the park and police attacked them at dawn. The
government uses the known tactics of Hitler: The police invades people's
(e.g., journalists, academicians, army commanders) houses and arrests
them very late at night, especially at dawn. They call it “dawn
operation”. They arrest young people for demonstrating or saying
something against the administration. Students at school cannot wear a
T-shirt with any message that can be considered “political expression”.
Now, there are journalists, academics, politicians, army commanders,
students and other political prisoners who have been in jail for more
than 5 years WAITING FOR TRIAL OR TRIAL IN PROGRESS.

Their rule is based on material plunder and ignorance that is fed by
multi-channeled mis-information, education and re-education. Their
current rule is historically comparable to extensive degrees of material
plunder: They (party leaders and business owners) allocate material
riches to themselves and immaterial values to the true and fake
believers who generally are ready for slaughter while chanting “God is
great” regardless if opponents are Muslims or not - like crusaders in
the middle age who conducted killings in the name of Jesus despite the
fact that Jesus is completely against oppression and killings. We hear
this chanting on TV news when Syrian opposite forces fire guns and kill
people. This also reminds me not only od the War Prayer of Mark Twain
but also the pressure he got from his publisher and family against
publishing it. The policies of the ruling party in Turkey are also
supported by some old so called Marxists and/or, Maoists, “leftists” and
their sons/daughters who mostly reside in Istanbul and live a posh life
(some work for media corporations with 20-30 thousand dollars salaries a
month and/or get paid by the media for their appearances in discussion
shows or get benefits in different ways).

The widespread fear in Turkey is also fed by private enterprises: Once
there was state censorship (it still prevails), now we have censorship
by the rule of private enterprises, so-called auto-censorship
(self-censorship) which is buttressed by organizational and peer
oppression in media and academia. I wrote a book for a university last
year and I had to revise it many times because they are scared of law
suits from private enterprises (especially by the media). You can not
mention a corporation’s name, you cannot criticize a corporation by
providing its name. I sometimes watch the Tonight Show and similar US
shows in English in Turkey and Turkish subtitles do not give any names
of any corporation that is mentioned in the show. I was sued by the show
producer last month for 20.000 dollars for criticizing one of the most
popular TV sitcoms in a meeting (I make about 2000 dollars a month).
Freedom of thought and expression is suppressed not only by the ruling
administration but also by the corporations and those who are scared of
being a target of revenge. Freedom is a right and privilege of the
ruling and powerful forces who can also manipulate and abuse the law for
their own interests. Copyright freedom is not a freedom of the writers,
it rather protects (or turned to be) the property right of the enterprises.

This is the first time I am witnessing a public uprising. It is
different than the one we had in the late 60s.

People all over the world should know. Yet, unfortunately, the “whole
world is watching” carefully packaged factoids. In Turkey, the media was
not proving any news on the uprisings until yesterday, and they were
broadcasting usual series, soap operas, sitcoms, competition programs
and films instead. Now they cannot hide anymore, thus they started their
usual mind management business in the news. To a varying extent, similar
evaluations can be reached about the coverage on international news
channels such as BBC, Al Jazeera, The Press TV and RTV that I watch often.

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[A Revolutionary Tool]

Statement from the Turkish Communist Party:

Statement of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Turkey

The choice for the working class will certainly be created



June 4, 2013
http://www.pslweb.org/liberationnews/assets/images/content/tkp-part-of-mass-struggle.jpg

The following is a statement of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of Turkey (TKP), issued June 4. It has been slightly edited for readability. Follow Liberation News for frequent updates and statements from activists and organizations on the ground in Turkey as the struggle there unfolds.
1. For days now Turkey has been witnessing a genuine popular movement. The actions and protests, which started in Istanbul and have spread all over Turkey, have a massive, legitimate and historic character. The most important of all is the striking change in the mood of people. The fear and apathy has been overcome and people have gained self-confidence.
2. The Communist Party of Turkey has been part of the popular movement beginning from the first day and has mobilized all its forces, tried to strengthen the proletarian and revolutionary character of the movement, endeavored to encourage a mature attitude of discipline, and organized numerous actions and demonstrations. In this process, the police forces carried out a heavy assault on our party headquarters in Ankara. All over Turkey, several party members have been injured and arrested. There have been some attempts of abduction of our party cadres. But the attempts of provocations against our party were defeated.
3. Our emphasis on the role of the TKP does not aim to underestimate the spontaneous nature of the movement or contribution of the other political actors. On the contrary, the TKP stresses that this movement has an aspect that is beyond the impact of any political actor or any kind of political opportunism.
4. The call of the masses for the government to resign is an absolute demand of this movement. Although it is obvious that a leftist alternative cannot be built "right now," this demand should be expressed loudly. This option for the working people can be generated only through benefitting from the energy that came out at this historical moment. The TKP will focus on this and expose the real meaning of alternatives like “the formation of a national government,” which will most likely be put forward to deceive the working masses into thinking that the crisis can be overcome that way.
5. Without a doubt, the holders of political power will try to calm the people down, institute control and even attempt to use the situation to their advantage. They can have temporary achievements. Even in that case, the popular movement would not be wasted. The TKP is ready for a period of stubborn but intense struggle.
6. In order to act in concert, different branches of the socialist movement sharing similar goals and concerns need to evaluate the rise of this popular movement immediately. The TKP, without interrupting its daily missions and activities, is going to act responsibly regarding this issue and endeavor for the creation of a common ground in line with the urgent demands below.
7. In order to nullify the plans of the government to classify and divide the popular movement as legitimate and illegitimate, all forces need to avoid steps that might cause damage to the legitimacy of the movement. It is the political power that attacks. The people should defend themselves as well as their rightful action but never fall into the provocation trap of the government.
The government pretends not to understand the fact that the old balance has been upset fundamentally and cannot be restored.
8. While the masses are chanting the slogan “government, resign,” the negotiations limited to the future of the Taksim-Gezi Park are meaningless. The government pretends not to understand the fact that the old balance has been upset fundamentally and cannot be restored. Everybody knows that the popular movement is not the product of sympathy towards the trees in the Gezi Park. The anger of the people is over the urban transformation projects, the terror of the market, open direct interventions in different lifestyles, the Americanism and subordination to the U.S., the reactionary policies, the enmity towards the Syrian people. The AKP cannot deceive the people with a discourse of “we will plant more trees than the ones that we will chop down.”
9. While rolling up our sleeves in order to create an alternative of the working people, the movement needs to lean on certain concrete demands. These demands are valid in the case of the resignation of the government or of Erdogan:
a) The government must announce that the projects that involve the demolishing of Gezi Park and the Ataturk Cultural Center are terminated.
b) Those who were taken into custody during the resistance must be released, and all charges against them must be dropped immediately.
c) All officials whose crimes against the people are proven by reports of the commissions that are formed by the Union of Bar Associations and local bar associations must be relieved of their duties.
d) The attempts that hinder the right of the people to get true news on the developments must be stopped.
e) All prohibitions regarding meetings, demonstrations and marches must be repealed.
f) All de facto or de jure obstacles that lock out the political participation of the people, including the 10 percent election threshold and the anti-democratic articles of the "law on political parties," must be abolished.
g) All initiatives that attempt to impose a monolithic life style on all people must be stopped.
10. These urgent demands will in no case affect our right and duty to continue the opposition against the political power. The people's reaction to the government must be reinforced, and efforts must be concentrated to bring about a real alternative in the political scene.
11. The star and the crescent Turkish flag that was intended to be used to provide a shield for reactionary and chauvinist attacks against laborers, leftists, and Kurdish people after the fascist military coup of September 12, 1980, has now been grasped by the people from the hands of fascism, and given to the honorable hands of Deniz Gezmiş and his comrades, as a flag in the hands of patriotic people.
12. The people's movement, ever since the beginning, has persistently put down the sinister strategy to play one community against another in Turkey. This attitude must carefully be maintained, leaving no room for chauvinism or vulgar nationalism.
13. Appealing to our Kurdish brothers and sisters, we had already declared, "There can be no peace agreement with AKP." There can be no deal with a political power to which its own people have turned their backs, and the true face of which has been revealed. Kurdish politics must give up "cherishing hopes of proceeding further with AKP," and become a strong constituent part of a united, patriotic and enlightened laborer people's movement.
14. Our citizens who have lost their lives at the hands of the police force of the political power have sacrificed their lives in the name of a just and historic struggle. The people are never going to forget their names, and those who are responsible for their deaths will pay the price before the law.
CentralCommittee
Communist Party of Turkey
4 June 2013

[Delenda Carthago]

mind you, this was a few hours call. So yeah it went pretty well.
And the answer of our brothers and sisters on TKP.

http://www.902.gr/sites/default/files/styles/902-lightbox/public/Media/20130604/sol-portal4.jpg?itok=fbvsYXKw:)

[ed miliband]

interesting to see parts of the "anti-imperialist" left side with the turkish state. hmmm.

[Le Socialiste]

interesting to see parts of the "anti-imperialist" left side with the turkish state. hmmm.

Who, exactly?

[kurtulush]

U cant imagine how many interesting things i saw since it started. Kemalist-nationalist-militarist protestors and anarchists were in action in the same square, for example.

But the best one for me was the first day. Occupy started and the turkish media which is under the control of islamist-neo/liberal coalition fund, was just showing "Miss Turkey 2013" from the tv channels like nothing happened.

I even dont know whoever this girl is but i guess i chose my Miss Turkey 2013

http://muftah.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/occupy-gezi-water-cannon1.jpg

[hatzel]

If you happen to care more about football than crusty old communist parties (and let's be honest, who doesn't nowadays?) this (http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2013/06/instanbul-football-clubs-help-protesters.html) might just be the article for you...

[Zukunftsmusik]

If you happen to care more about football than crusty old communist parties (and let's be honest, who doesn't nowadays?) this (http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2013/06/instanbul-football-clubs-help-protesters.html) might just be the article for you...

supporters of rivaling clubs fight together in the streets, which, according to a norwegian newspaper, at least, is "a reason for Erdogan to worry". I don't know how important it is, but if these are people who earlier beat each other up, it does say something.

EDIT: After actually reading the whole article, it appears this in fact isn't new:

The solidarity between Fenerbahce and Galatasaray fans goes back to May Day demonstrations in 2007 and 2008, when they jointly confronted police near Taksim Square. They now find it strange that this is regarded as something new. Clashing with police after almost every match, those groups have mastered defense tactics. They have become skilled against the police’s pepper-gas grenades and riot control vehicles, the TOMAs. That’s how they emerged at the forefront of the latest clashes,” Ozdal told Al-Monitor.

[Devrim]

Who, exactly?

Well, if you look at the TKP CC statement above these points stand out to me:


11. The star and the crescent Turkish flag that was intended to be used to provide a shield for reactionary and chauvinist attacks against laborers, leftists, and Kurdish people after the fascist military coup of September 12, 1980, has now been grasped by the people from the hands of fascism, and given to the honorable hands of Deniz Gezmiş and his comrades, as a flag in the hands of patriotic people.
12. The people's movement, ever since the beginning, has persistently put down the sinister strategy to play one community against another in Turkey. This attitude must carefully be maintained, leaving no room for chauvinism or vulgar nationalism.
13. Appealing to our Kurdish brothers and sisters, we had already declared, "There can be no peace agreement with AKP." There can be no deal with a political power to which its own people have turned their backs, and the true face of which has been revealed. Kurdish politics must give up "cherishing hopes of proceeding further with AKP," and become a strong constituent part of a united, patriotic and enlightened laborer people's movement.

I don't know what you think about this, but if waving the Turkish flag isn't 'vulgar nationalism', then I am not sure what is.

Basically I read this as saying Kurds shut up and support the nation.

Devrim

[Dropdead]

Here in Finland the media hasn't reported anything about Turkey..

[Sasha]

a new tumblr that documents the police violence, inc footage of cops working together with AKP thugs armed with kebab knives: http://turkishpolicebrutality.tumblr.com/

[MrCool]

Here in Finland the media hasn't reported anything about Turkey..

Helsingin Sanomat (http://www.hs.fi/ulkomaat/Mielenosoitukset+jatkuivat+Turkissa+liennytyksestä +huolimatta/a1370311888127) has reported the events from Turkey, and YLE (http://yle.fi/uutiset/mielenosoitukset_jatkuvat_turkissa_-_varapaaministerin_anteeksipyynto_ei_hillinnyt_hal lituksen_vastustusta/6673439) has also done the same.

[Sasha]

*moved this thread to the ongoing struggles forum and stickied it there*

[Dropdead]

Helsingin Sanomat (http://www.hs.fi/ulkomaat/Mielenosoitukset+jatkuivat+Turkissa+liennytyksestä +huolimatta/a1370311888127) has reported the events from Turkey, and YLE (http://yle.fi/uutiset/mielenosoitukset_jatkuvat_turkissa_-_varapaaministerin_anteeksipyynto_ei_hillinnyt_hal lituksen_vastustusta/6673439) has also done the same.

Oh.. Goddamn it. :closedeyes:

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

I don't know what you think about this, but if waving the Turkish flag isn't 'vulgar nationalism', then I am not sure what is.

Basically I read this as saying Kurds shut up and support the nation.

Devrim

I have no stake in the issue either way but couldn't they have been saying that the Kurdish movement shouldn't seek a separate peace with the AKP? Though there is that remark there about how Kurds must be a part of a "patriotic" worker's movement.

The comment about the Turkish patriotism and the flag was certainly jingoistic for a supposed Communist movement, considering the fact that nationalism is a modern, bourgeois ideology and the worker's movement is international.

Does the TKP take a very nationalist line? There does seem to be a kind of patriotism among many radicals around the world. It certainly wouldn't be the first Communist Party to do so (Cuba, China, NK, Laos and Vietnam all do to varying extents) but it's a shame nonetheless. It seems like a consequence of false consciousness among party members and radicals. I find all this love of homeland jazz to be painfully silly myself.

[Devrim]

The TKP is basically a left nationalist party, which at its very worst verges on virtually open chauvinism. This bit about the national flag and Kurds becoming part of a patriotic opposition is bad enough in itself, but I have seen far worse.

Their main front organization is called the Yurtsever Cephe, which translates as something like 'Patriotic Front', which says it all really. Unfortunately they are far from the most nationalistic organization on the Turkish left.

Devrim

[kurtulush]

"patriotic" worker's movement.

Does the TKP take a very nationalist line?

Most of the times unfortunately they do.

Patriotism is a capitalist holiness and the enemy of freedom. I tried to explain this to these authoritarianism lover lefties alot but cant say could succeed so much till now.

But whatever, the sociological structure of the party is mostly apolitical young students and they are learning. Also im not sure about if its the right time to discuss about it.

[Tifosi]

Denizli

http://imgim.com/5997incih8431178.jpg

Izmir

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BL2zyoPCMAAiYv0.jpg

Eskişehir

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/179715_486746961409374_81461450_n.jpg

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Is it out of political opportunism or misguided theory? What are the ramifications of it in their political program? What's the TKP's justification for appealing to jingoism?

Cuban and Venezuelan leaders for instance both make nationalist defenses of their government, but this is shown as somewhat opportunistic based on their policies of mutual dependency. In that case, nationalism is used as an ideological crutch by a rickety old Marxist Leninist government and a chaotic left-Social-Democrat government to prop up their rule in the face of economic challenges and political challenges from the United States. On the other hand, the CCP uses Chinese nationalism to justify the continued occupation of territories inhabited by ethnic minorities. In that case, Chinese nationalism is used to justify a unified political entity which represents some kind of cultural continuity to preserve the PRC's rule over the world's third largest country (geographically). Both of these cases show an opportunistic use of nationalism, but for very different reasons. In each case, some kind of false consciousness on the part of party supporters plays a critical role, in that the nationalism is used to mobilize them even if those supporters nominally adhere to an ideology based in a critique of the "nation" as such.

They seem to be a tiny party in terms of membership and vote turnout, but they had a big presence at the protests (I saw their flags in many of the photographs). How are they and other Leftist parties attached to the protest movement, other than in bringing their own people out? Aside from appeals to petty nationalism, what are these political movements actually like? Are they irrelevant and not worth the time? Are they led by people still hung over from the fall of the USSR? Or something else?

[kurtulush]

When the question is wrong all the answers come wrong i think. What matters "opportunistic use" or not?

For instance does this clean PRC's hand when they made the massacre in Urumqi if its just for opportunism?

In my opinion the right question is what is the main motivator of your left? Human being or the country?

If your answer is the country there is always a possibility for you to flirt with neoliberalism, corporatism or capitalism.

[kurtulush]

Anyway i need to go to the action. To not leave the Park just to opportunists. :)

Gonna write tomorrow longer.

[Dropdead]

Most of the times unfortunately they do.

Patriotism is a capitalist holiness and the enemy of freedom. I tried to explain this to these authoritarianism lover lefties alot but cant say could succeed so much till now.

But whatever, the sociological structure of the party is mostly apolitical young students and they are learning. Also im not sure about if its the right time to discuss about it.

What if it is socialist patriotism? Is it still capitalist?

[Devrim]

They seem to be a tiny party in terms of membership and vote turnout,

I think that the Turkish election gives a rather false impression here. The KKE in Greece is considered to be one of the stronger communist parties and tend to get between 5 and 10% of the vote, and with this they have seats in parliament. In Turkey you need to get over 10% of the national vote to qualify for parliament. This tends to put people off voting for parties who have no chance of winning anything. In the last three elections TKP have picked up between 60,000 and 80,000 votes, which though tiny as a recentage is not an insubstantial number if the only people voting for them tend to be pretty committed.


Is it out of political opportunism or misguided theory? What are the ramifications of it in their political program? What's the TKP's justification for appealing to jingoism?

Like all major political parties in Turkey the TKP has is nationalist to the core. Exactly how they theoretically justify it is only relevant if you think there isn't anything communist about this party. I don't.

Devrim

[Sasha]

Dutch news is reporting that the police came down hard on the union march in Ankara today. I hope Leo will be able to fill us in further soon.

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

When the question is wrong all the answers come wrong i think. What matters "opportunistic use" or not?

For instance does this clean PRC's hand when they made the massacre in Urumqi if its just for opportunism?


The question is still relevant because it explains (1) why the party would chose it as a part of their dialogue and (2) what the impact is on the political consciousness of those identifying with the "left" while voting for these parties.


In my opinion the right question is what is the main motivator of your left? Human being or the country?

If your answer is the country there is always a possibility for you to flirt with neoliberalism, corporatism or capitalism. Very true.


I think that the Turkish election gives a rather false impression here. The KKE in Greece is considered to be one of the stronger communist parties and tend to get between 5 and 10% of the vote, and with this they have seats in parliament. In Turkey you need to get over 10% of the national vote to qualify for parliament. This tends to put people off voting for parties who have no chance of winning anything. In the last three elections TKP have picked up between 60,000 and 80,000 votes, which though tiny as a recentage is not an insubstantial number if the only people voting for them tend to be pretty committed.


Interesting, that explains the low voter turnout. Does this voting system help to drive secular workers to the CHP?



Like all major political parties in Turkey the TKP has is nationalist to the core. Exactly how they theoretically justify it is only relevant if you think there isn't anything communist about this party. I don't.
Is this because of the nationalist roots of post-Ottoman Turkish political discourse, or something about how the state functions, or both? Do nationalists dominate the discourse in the Turkish socialist crowd, or just the parties?

I'm curious about the theoretical justification and conditions for why because I think its important to understand the missteps of these parties and why they do this, and the reasons why it's politically appealing in the first place. It seems like an important first step in rooting out nationalism and blind patriotism from the masses, especially those who are ideologically sympathetic to socialism yet remain loyal to these movements.

[Devrim]

An article entitled 'Doctors, Workers and Teachers Stop Work' is reporting there being 850,000 strikers today: http://m.radikal.com.tr/iphone/NewsDetail.aspx?ArticleID=160879&CategoryIDs=1
Devrim

[Comrade Samuel]

I do not know if this has been posted yet but it's worth a read.

http://redantliberationarmy.wordpress.com/2013/06/04/statement-of-the-central-committee-of-the-communist-party-of-turkey/

[Sasha]

qqkIJhYs2Q0

7 minute recap/timeline of what, how and why happend till now

[Rates]

I'm curious about the theoretical justification and conditions for why because I think its important to understand the missteps of these parties and why they do this, and the reasons why it's politically appealing in the first place. It seems like an important first step in rooting out nationalism and blind patriotism from the masses, especially those who are ideologically sympathetic to socialism yet remain loyal to these movements.

To sum it up,they justify their nationalist tendencies by saying that nation state model must be preserved against all kinds of imperialist attacks and it would be impossible to have a socialist revolution in a country that still can't shake off its feudal bonds and has little to none class consciousness,such as Turkey.

From what I've observed they also seem to believe that anti-imperialist struggles in "third world countries" would cut off the priveleges that imperialist powers give to their workers by exploting said countries. And that would inevitably lead to a worldwide socialist revolution. While I agree with some of the points they make,and don't doubt their sincerity,i think most of it is just plain wishful thinking.

[Paul Pott]

Nationalist? Jingoist? Typical, vacuous ultra-left reading of events.

First of all, the idea that all patriotic sentiments must give way to some sort of universal cosmopolitanism is alien to Marxism. The task of Turkish communists is to build a communist party of the Turkish proletariat under the material conditions present in Turkey. In Turkey, as anywhere, the working class has to constitute itself as the nation.
Whether or not the Turkish flag should be used as a symbol of the Turkish people is a debate the revolution will take up in the future, but in the meantime someone better explain why it means everyone is a "nationalist" in the face of attempts by the people on the streets to divorce it from its history as a symbol of Turkish and Ottoman power over other oppressed peoples.

Does TKP hold that the Ottoman genocides never happened? Does it hold that the Kurds are "Turks" who have forgotten what they are? If not, then it isn't nationalist.

The Kurds are occupied by the Turkish bourgeois state, so working very closely with them is necessary. The Turkish communists' call reflects the fact that the Turkish revolution is potentially also the revolution in part of the Kurdish national homeland, so the Kurds must not fall into the trap of reconciliation with the ruling cliques in the name of short-term Kurdish gains when the ruling class finds itself in a weak position vis a vis the Turkish masses.

The TKP is calling for unshakeable solidarity between Turks and Kurds. The ultra-left on this forum, true to its historic character in the real world, manages to hallucinate the opposite.

Internationalism can't be reduced to simply solidarity and cooperation, but it's not the denial of the nation, which is a useless line at best.

[Devrim]

Nationalist? Jingoist? Typical, vacuous ultra-left reading of events.

Obviously, that of course is what the 'ultra-left' do.

Let's look at your own criteria for whether the TKP is nationalist.


Does TKP hold that the Ottoman genocides never happened? Does it hold that the Kurds are "Turks" who have forgotten what they are? If not, then it isn't nationalist.

To deal with the second question first as it is easier, nobody apart from isolated lunatics holds this position today. Even the self declared ultra-nationalists have admitted that there are such things as Kurds, so I don't think we can use this as a determining factor.

As for whether the TKP hold that the Ottoman genocides never happened, it is a more difficult question. They prefer not to use the word genocide, and stress that it can't really be used in the same sense that it was used in the Second World War. They prefer to use the term massacres, and explain that they were forced on the state by wars. They stress the difference between the Ottoman State, and the Turkish Republic ignoring the fact that the genocides were organised by the same military many of whom went on to set up the republic. They say that today the Armenia Genocide is used as a tool by the Western imperialists, primarily France, and the USA to attack Turkey. Just to show that it is not only historic events where they take this sort of line, a few years ago when a famous Turkish-Armenia journalist was assassinated, and people spontaneously took to the streets with the 'slogan we are all Armenians', the TKP denounced this slogan.

Now, I understand that you have exactly no idea at all about Turkish politics, so let's make an analogy.

Imagine, if you will, an alternate reality*, where leading figures in the Nazi regime had been allowed to take over the defeated Germany state in 1945, and a 'left-wing group', for the sake of the analogy I will call them the 'pro-deutsche', are making statements like this:

"Yes, there were some massacres of Jews during the Second World War, but they were forced upon the Nazi regime by the circumstances of the war, and I don't think that we can really call them genocide. Of course, the new German state, the first president of which just incidentally happened to be a leading general in the Nazi regime, and the new Republic continued with a policy of murder and ethnic cleansing, has got nothing to do with the old Reich at all. America and the Imperialists are just using this as a stick to beat Germany with.When that Jewish journalist was murder by fascists in collaberation with the Police, we thought it was a bit of a bad thing, but certainly people should not use slogans like "We are all Jews".

Would you imagine that they were not nationalists?

Of course there are even more openly nationalist 'left' parties in Turkey. One of them is the İşçi Partisi (Workers' Party) earlier referred to in this thread. Their leader is not only somebody who denies the genocides, but somebody who travelled to Switzerland to publicly deny it contrary to Swiss law, and became the first perso to be convicted of Armenian genocide denial.

Devrim

*I don't like to make analogies with the Nazi's, but in the case of the genocides committed in Turkey, I think the comparison is justified. Millions were murdered. It was perhaps not quite as big as the Holocaust, but is of the same order of magnitude, and was directly used by Hitler as a model.

[Devrim]

Interesting, that explains the low voter turnout. Does this voting system help to drive secular workers to the CHP?

Yes, though curiously in the last election it had the strange effect of making some CHP voters vote MHP (Ultra-nationalist) as they were worried that the MHP wouldn't achieve the 10% minimum, which would have indirectly resulted in the AKP getting a constitution changing majority (66%).


Is this because of the nationalist roots of post-Ottoman Turkish political discourse, or something about how the state functions, or both? Do nationalists dominate the discourse in the Turkish socialist crowd, or just the parties?

I think it is because they are a Kemalist Party, pure and simple. The TKP of today is not the historic TKP, and have only been using this name for about a decade. They are essentially a left Kemalist Party.

Devrim

[Sasha]

News coming in that in Adana (south Turkey) a cop died during a demonstration, he reportedly "fell from a bridge", no details as of yet

[ulf]

apparently the german website nadir.org which hosts twitter news about the uprising in various languages is also blocked in turkey. mirrors can be found here: linksunten.indymedia.org/de/node/88197

[Leo]

Dutch news is reporting that the police came down hard on the union march in Ankara today. I hope Leo will be able to fill us in further soon. Yes they did. KESK, the main trade-union confederation, had made a deal with the police that the police wouldn't attack as long as they remained there. At around 18:30, the KESK left unannounced, and the police attacked the demonstration in an extremely brutal fashion. They also attacked the gathering in Tunali which where there were many children, even babies.


An article entitled 'Doctors, Workers and Teachers Stop Work' is reporting there being 850,000 strikers todayA correction: it is saying that these unions have 850,000 members - which actually isn't true in itself according to official figures but anyway. I would be surprised if half that number actually went on strike.


Does TKP hold that the Ottoman genocides never happened? Well, yes. They have never called it a genocide for one, they tend to call it forced deportation (tehcir), criticize countries that recognize the Armenian Genocide for doing so and put the main blame on Germany rather than Turkey anyways.


Does it hold that the Kurds are "Turks" who have forgotten what they are? Well no, but neither does the ruling Justice and Development Party and even the kemalist Republican People's Party anymore.

The TKP says Kurds should stick with the Turks and fight for a fully independent Turkish Republic. They also been in many fights with Kurdish nationalists and other leftists over their Turkish nationalist slogans, though not as intense ones as the Turkish left in general tends to have with the ex-maoist Workers Party, which openly colaborates with the fascist Grey Wolves.


What if it is socialist patriotism? Is it still capitalist?

Yes.

[kurtulush]

What if it is socialist patriotism? Is it still capitalist?

This question has couple of answers.

1- Historically, the term patriotism borned and used by the political powers with industry revolution for the needs of national capitals.

2- Whats the definition of "socialism" for you is important. If its a little bit better balances between social classes. From my looking point something like more social democracy or social state. This question can have a meaning for you maybe. But still inside capitalism. Because as the term social democracy is exiting inside capitalism, not out of.

I guess you are from Finland and as the social rights of the working people against the capital is better maybe although its a still capitalist country. But here in Istanbul we are living with the wild capitalism from kemalizm to tayyipizm. So this reality again makes Turkey patriotism is a bullshit.

3- If you are asking my personal opinion. My aim is, my dream is borderless and classless world. Even just because this argument the term patriotism gets meaningless for me too personaly.

[Yet_Another_Boring_Marxist]

From the Maoist Communist Party of Turkey. Translated by Communists working in the Canadian indigenous community.

http://onkwehonwerising.wordpress.com/2013/06/05/statement-of-the-maoist-communist-party-on-the-turkish-uprising/



The following statement from the Maoist Communist Party/Turkey-North Kurdistan (MKP) is a translated version from the original Turkish. The translation was carried out by the comrads of Towards a New Dawn, which some minor additional edits to enhance readability. Much thanks go towards TND for this translation work of this document from an important Turkish revolutionary organization in this time of great upheaval in that south west Asian country.

Also be sure check out our posting from yesterday Background on Events in Turkey: İbrahim Kaypakkaya’s (Re)conception of Turkish Society.

The MKP along with the Communist Party of Turkey/Marxist-Leninist and the Marxist-Leninist Communist Party are outlawed revolutionary organizations in Turkey that upholds the anti-revisionist legacy of the martyred İbrahim Kaypakkaya, including the necessity of armed struggle against the Kemalist state.

To our Struggling Comrades!

Those who should be leading, are acting as followers of masses today!

Communist and revolutionaries going through another exam today. This is the time for selfless struggle without dismissing the movement as self manifested. The definition of revolutionary movement or the revolutionary wave is the practice that masses exhibit. Masses are revolutionary, their reaction is democratic, rebellion and uprising is legit!

As our leadership role requires, we have to be in the front of the struggle with the masses even though it developed with our absence. We will resist, struggle, and pay the price! As long as the masses are being tortured, shot down and massacred, the Proletarian revolutionist’s cannot be a spectator!”

To Our Valued Masses;

The masses who are filled with hate because of reactionary oppression and violence have shaken the ruling class and the Turkish Government. The massive rising caused by destruction attempt of Gezi Park for the benefit of the bourgeoisie is moving forward. Once again, the screaming masses have showed the neo-liberal bottom feeders that people can take their own fate into their own hands. AKP government’s savage fascist oppression wasn’t able to stop the resistance. The masses continued to fight and wouldn’t let go of their democratic requests even though they have been wounded, arrested, beaten and tortured. Despite turkeys sell out media and silence of bourgeoisie writers, the resistance was able to get the attention and support of the world.

Presence of enormous masses have become the nightmare for the AKP and reactionary and oppressive ruling class, who don’t even recognize their own laws. On the firth day, the masses who started off with protesting destruction of the nature have turned into revolutionary and the masses claimed victory by forcing AKP to take a step back!

The reactionary, corporate, bureaucrat and bourgeoisie-feudal supporters of AKP have done their historical tradition and tried to surpass the democratic requests of the masses by using violence and bloodshed. On the contrarily the rising determent masses have caused the movement to grow and continue despite paying the price for it. Thousands of people in dozens of different cities have united as one in the streets to join Taksim Gezi Park Resistance.

The history of reactionary classes have always been oppressing, exploiting the masses and its proper to cause any kind of pain to them. In order to keep their rule and their domination, they have never shied away from using reactionary violence against the oppressed and poor people. The organized reactionary classes that are receiving the benefits of capitalism have always looked down upon the masses and caused them barbaric pains. They have pushed alienation toward proletarians and forced them to live in hunger and poverty.

But the people have reminded the reactionary class that it is the people who are the real heroes and with their own fate in their own hands through revolutionary actions, they have caused system to be upside-down. Revolutionary masses have proven in unforgettable way that the mockery of the ruling class, such as ” three five bare legged” and “looter” is baseless. This historical fact have materialized against fascist AKP through the resistance of the masses of ethnicities and marginalized groups in Turkey- North Kurdistan altogether!

AKP leader and “Turkish Republic” president Erdogan shamelessly and arrogantly insulted/humiliated the rising masses by claiming they are “dozens of looters”. Even taking it further by threatening “As a party I can gather one million”.

Unfortunately for him, once these “Bare legged looters” are awakened; threats nor blood stinking vampire fangs of yours will stop them! The same warmongering two-faced Erdogan criticised Essad dictatorship for brutalizing its people, have sank low enough to call its own revolting masses “couple of looters”. What makes him so raged is nothing but the fear of its own people uprising!

Two-faced AKP government is using “priest-executioner”(Aztec Spanish massacre reference) tactics to suppress the fires of uprising while trying to please its own masses. While Bulent Arinc, speaker of the government Cemil Cicek and couple of AKP mc have tried to soften the masses by telling them peoples request is democratic, Erdogan is not taking any step back by showing his fangs.

Proletarian and the masses are not gullible enough to fall for these tricks. All your tactics will hit that bronze wall of yours and shedder your power. Resistance is not over, it continues on. The nightmare of the reactionaries that called the masses “looters” will continue. Who is looter who is the hero has already been revealed and will continue to be revealed.

In Conclusion:

Us the proletarian revolutionaries are absolving the bourgeoisie fascist parties such as CHP, MHP while seeing the mass’s democratic rebellion as a revolutionary reaction, and are greeting uprisings of all oppressed people. We have vowed to fight the tyranny side by side with the masses as its our revolutionary duty!

With the same attitude, we are condemning the fascist torture and violence used against people, and forming a rank to oppose these fascist oppression. In order to accomplish more efficient, eligible and more organized revolutionary movement, with the leadership of proletarian we are calling all democratic and revolutionary powers to unite! For this reason, alone we are calling all the Turkey- North Kurdistan proletarian , the oppressed poor people and the comrades to make war on the reactionary ruling class as well as the capitalist system.

We know that with our Peoples war and its blazing fire, we will be able to shatter this reactionary system. Rule of the people and building of socialism and finally communism will be accomplished through Peoples War! It’s our duty and necessity to wage revolutionary struggle by uniting rebellions of all the democratic and revolutionary masses with Marxism-Leninism-Maoism ideology under proletarian flag. No obstacle can stand before the masses of people! Reactionary force will materialize the revolutionary one. The revolutionary force that materialized in the hand of masses is legit and necessary. Because it’s the method that will stand against reactionary classes and lead to democracy, freedom and communist society. The masses that unites, resist and fight will not lose. Just like this one, all the reactionary forces and the classes that relies on it are condemn to lose sooner or later!

Its the revolutionary masses and their revolutionary actions that writes history!

Long live the legal- democratic resistance and the struggle of the people!
Long live the united revolutionary rebellion of the People !
Long live the peoples war!

[kurtulush]

identifying with the "left" while voting for these parties.

Im sure elections would be banned if it could change somethings in Turkey.

All the legal parties in Turkey are the children of 12 september military coup because the political parties law of Turkey is still existing since 1980.

It think by looking just votings we cant understand anything about whats going on in Istanbul.

For istance;


Does TKP hold that the Ottoman genocides never happened?

This is what they learn from the party which is almost the copy of official kemalist defensive reflex.

For them just to be against genosides made by Ottoman's is enough. But hands of Mustafa Kemal's country are clean, military is clean.

Briefly all polical parties of Turkey 33 years behind the community i think.

[Dropdead]

This question has couple of answers.

1- Historically, the term patriotism borned and used by the political powers with industry revolution for the needs of national capitals.

2- Whats the definition of "socialism" for you is important. If its a little bit better balances between social classes. From my looking point something like more social democracy or social state. This question can have a meaning for you maybe. But still inside capitalism. Because as the term social democracy is exiting inside capitalism, not out of.

I guess you are from Finland and as the social rights of the working people against the capital is better maybe although its a still capitalist country. But here in Istanbul we are living with the wild capitalism since kemalizm till tayyipizm. So this reality again makes Turkey patriotism is a bullshit.

3- If you are asking my personal opinion. My aim is, my dream is borderless and classless world. So this patriotism term gets again meaningless for me.

But I am a marxist-leninist so I have different views on ''social patriotism'' etc
I'm observing the situation from my own point of view, I guess.

[kurtulush]

ultra-left

I took it as compliment, thank you. :)

This reminded me in the past when we were defending homosexual rights they were calling us to make fun in their minds "Norwegian-Lefties." We were calling them "Ba'ath Party".

But at least today jargon is changing, slowly bu changing. :)

[kurtulush]

I am a marxist-leninist.

"working men have no country"

Communist Manifesto (Chapter 2)

Engels & Marx

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

I think we've seen enough failures on the Left due to the inability to move past various forms of bourgeois discourse. The flirting with or outright embrace of nationalism by parties in places like China, the DPRK, Mozambique and Angola among other places as opposed to a consistent critique of these ideologies has created numerous problems. In all of those countries, we have nationalist parties with widespread economic exploitation and entrenched class interests because the national struggle was given priority over the class struggle. If we focus on class struggle, the struggle between nations falls away.

Thus, I think the concern of our Turkish posters about any Kemalist leanings of the Turkish Left parties is more than understandable.

[kurtulush]

U know what, i'm gonna feel like a priest who is discussing about sexuality of the angels if we keep on talking on this. Because yesterday night Sultan Erdogan returned and made a very aggressive speech about us. The "us" means all about us here. Ultra-left or non-ultra left is same for him today.

I guess this is what made him so angry. This is something new for him too. He was used to fight with kemalist, stalinist, authoritarian ( whatever ) side of the left and always winning. And i think he was even enjoying of this simple fight alot.

Also this time he tried to give the same shape to the movement and still trying to understand with his old parameters but it doesnt fit. Old habits and strategies are not working for him too. Because as much as i see the left is changing in Turkey. Do we still have problems? Yes we do, like every re-born we have many.

But maybe its better to live instead of talking or thinking today.

[Sasha]

Dispatch from Istanbul: The Square and the Park (http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/06/07/dispatch-from-istanbul-the-square-and-the-park)

Posted by Ned Entrikin (http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/ned-entrikin/Author?oid=16956743) on Fri, Jun 7, 2013 at 11:16 AM

(The author is a Seattle native who moved to Istanbul in January of 2006. Find his first report right here (http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/06/05/dispatch-from-istanbul).)
http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/thumb-1370626971-dsc_0485.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/1370626971-dsc_0485.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
An overturned police vehicle in Taksim Gezi Park has become a sort of message board.


Since the city government yielded control of Taksim Square to the protesters on Saturday (http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/06/05/dispatch-from-istanbul), things have changed remarkably. While Siraselviler Street in Cihangir, which was a battleground on Saturday, has returned to complete normalcy, Taksim Square and Taksim Gezi Park have changed in ways that I never imagined possible.
On a visit to the Square and the park yesterday evening (Thursday) here is what I witnessed. The Atatürk Culture Center, which has been derelict for years now thanks to the AKP’s systematic closures of such facilities, is covered in banners bearing everything from pictures of Turkish revolutionary hero Deniz Gezmis to a central statement of “Shut your mouth, Tayyip!”
http://www.thestranger.com/binary/12a5/1370625939-dsc_0452.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/binary/12a5/1370625939-dsc_0452.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
The Atatürk Culture Center in Taksim Square, covered in banners.


Walking up the marble steps from the square into the Gezi Park, the tone quickly changed. The pre-fab buildings the protesters had been ransacking on Saturday have now been converted to the “Museum of the Revolution.” Just beyond this, the vendors who ordinarily sell umbrellas are now selling Guy Fawkes masks à la V for Vendetta along with goggles, face masks and cans of spray paint. The abandoned police paddywagon from a few days ago has been overturned and converted to a message board. The park has become home to thousands of people, with tents set up on every square foot of grass. At one end, fans of the Besiktas soccer team (one of the big three teams in Istanbul, whose involvement in the demonstrations has been a crucial part of their success) have hung up a giant Besiktas “CARSI” sign marking their presence.
http://www.thestranger.com/binary/4479/1370626192-dsc_0463.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/binary/4479/1370626192-dsc_0463.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
Tent city, Taksim Gezi Park.


Not only the park was reclaimed on Saturday. The government has taken to calling protesters “capulcu” (pronounced chap-ool-joo), meaning vandal. The word has been re-appropriated and is used everywhere. Music videos like “Everyday I’m Capuling” have appeared online:

64q2GIqH7S8

I even saw a watermelon vendor with “capulcu karpuz” (vandal watermelon) carved into one of his melons (http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/1370626408-dsc_0464.jpg).
Taksim Gezi Park is a complete world in and of itself. There is a lending library full of donated books. Free food is passed out to the 24-hour occupiers several times a day. There is a Gezi Park chess corner. A makeshift hospital has even been built. A doctor working there, who asked me not to photograph the doctors and whom I will call Dr. Cem, spent a few minutes explaining how he came to be there. He told me he was a medical student at a local university and said that “when I saw what was happening, I couldn’t just stay home and watch. When I got here, I thought, this must be what the Paris Commune was like.” The doctors wish to maintain their anonymity because many work at government hospitals and could risk losing their jobs. When asked what the most common injuries included, he said, “The first day it was mostly hysteria cases,” but went on to say that he has dealt with a number of wounds related to people being hit with tear gas canisters. A foreign reporter complaining of a toothache took his attention before I could ask him anything more.
http://www.thestranger.com/binary/9d98/1370626043-dsc_0459.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/binary/9d98/1370626043-dsc_0459.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
Wares for sale in Taksim Gezi Park.


The comparison between the Gezi Park occupation and the Paris Commune of 1871 is apt. The park is anarchy in its purest form: a tremendous demonstration of human cooperation. There are no laws except a series of “rules” written on a poster of which the only true commandment is “No stones, no clubs.” The park is also notably clean, its thousands of residents picking up after themselves, with reminders not to throw any trash on the ground announced at mealtimes.
http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/thumb-1370626527-dsc_0472.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/1370626527-dsc_0472.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
Makeshift library, Taksim Gezi Park.


Circling back to the stairs leading into Taksim Square, the feeling was decidedly more political. I witnessed a man and woman with microphones atop a bus overlooking the square, speaking to the people. When a scuffle broke out among the crowd, one of the two shouted, “He’s throwing stones! Stop that man in the orange mask!” How well the crowd complied with his request was beyond my range of vision, but the protesters have been excellent at stopping violence among their own ranks. There were a number of “single issue” groups along the edges of the park who were clearly pursuing their own agendas, including the controversial Kurdish liberation movement, among others. If there is one thing that might stand in the way of the success of Occupy Gezi, it is the disparate interests of the involved parties. What I saw in the park was perfect harmony, but out in the square there were countless different flags being flown.
http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/thumb-1370626843-dsc_0474.jpg (http://www.thestranger.com/images/blogimages/2013/06/07/1370626843-dsc_0474.jpg)

Ned Entrikin
Pondering the next move, Taksim Gezi Park




Link (http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/06/07/dispatch-from-istanbul-the-square-and-the-park)
source: http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2013/06/07/dispatch-from-istanbul-the-square-and-the-park

[The Douche]

I love the white washing of history in that article.

Saying its like the Paris commune, and then talking about how great this crowd is for self-policing and "stopping violence"...

[Rusty Shackleford]

AKP supporters and Anti-protesters are attacking demonstrators in Adana.

Country folk are bringing tractors.


http://24.media.tumblr.com/3c6dfb6851a9077bc3ca5d7c09da9592/tumblr_mo3lh40RGB1ste7qoo1_500.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/8d649a4a155a9029c3f82ce7a4e18453/tumblr_mo3mlwjpWv1ste7qoo1_500.jpg
http://24.media.tumblr.com/126f273bcebcac92ea7e9e68bfe468c6/tumblr_mo3pxpudiD1ste7qoo1_500.jpg
http://25.media.tumblr.com/631b76faaf2c9bab6408d1060a643cd7/tumblr_mo3pz8VwhB1ste7qoo1_500.jpg


source: http://occupygezipics.tumblr.com/

[Rusty Shackleford]

For some context on the issue of infrastructural development and plans going on in turkey, especially in the istanbul area.


i know its a double post

mR2SuCJ8610

[Le Socialiste]

Reports of renewed riot police force against protesters in Ankara surfaced on Saturday evening, with tear gas and water cannon apparently sprayed at people gathering in the capital's Kizilay Square.

In Istanbul meanwhile, crowds were said to be at their highest levels on the ninth straight day of protests, with football fans and feminists taking to the streets.

People began arriving in the city's Taksim Square in the morning with food and blankets to settle in for demonstrations, adding to the growing tent city in nearby Gezi Park.

"A week ago, I could never imagine myself sleeping out on the streets of Istanbul," said 22-year-old Aleyna, wrapped up under a blanket with a stray kitten, pointing to her dirty clothes. "Now I don't know how I can ever go back."

But the lingering rallies, heaviest in Turkey's main tourist hubs such as Istanbul's main Taksim Square, are starting to negatively impact business for many.

Al Jazeera's Hashem Ahelbarra, reporting from Istanbul, said that "the whole area houses hotels, restaurants and shopping malls, and there are concerns that tourism might decline if the unrest continues.

Huseyin Celik, the deputy chairman of Erdogan's AK party, said local and presidential elections would be held next year as planned, and a general election in 2015. "The government is running like clockwork. There is nothing that necessitates early elections," he said after a meeting of the party's executive committee in Istanbul on Saturday.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2013/06/201368121910137157.html

[kurtulush]

Anyone can help me to download this video?

Link (http://www.vice.com/vice-news/istanbul-rising)

I have to translate the turkish parts to english.

[Sasha]

Police Attacks in Ankara

Police attacks have started in Ankara. After a day long peaceful protests police have started attacking the protestors. As if now, police is attacking protestors with tear gas and water cannons. Arrests are being reported.

21.18 Tens of thousands of protesters gathered in Kugulu Park.

21.40 Police is attacking the demonstrators with tear gas and water cannons in Kizilay square, Ankara. Some arrests reported.

21.45 Police is barricading the streets in Adana, getting prepared for intervention.

21.55 As police brutally attacks the protestors in Kizilay square Ankara, thousands are gathering in Dikmen, Ankara.

22.52 Around 20.000 people from various neighbourhoods in Dikmen (Ankara) have gathered at the intersection of the Dikmen and Emeç avenues.

22.59 The police in Kızılay have once again targeted news reporters. The following is a tweet by Evrensel reporter Hasan Akbaş:

#direnankara The police in Ankara have once again targeted journalists. We, the reporters of Radikal, Evrensel, DİHA, BirGün and Bianet reacted to this only to face face the threats of the police officers. The officers apologised at first then said "you should be glad that you are still able to walk. Net time we will shoot you in the heels. Don't forget us, for we will not be forgetting you." Later the officers explained that the reason for their agressiveness was that they had not slept for days.

23.04 The clashes in Ankara have spread to Kurtuluş Square. Police are reportedly using immense amounts of gas. Panzers have arrived.

23:38 Thousands of people once again assembled on Kennedy Street.

From a new, English blog on the situation: http://occupiedtaksim.blogspot.nl/2013/06/police-attacks-in-ankara.html?m=1

[Manar]

Sultan Erdoğan is importing thousands of pro-AKP country rednecks. Party's over, liberals.

[Sea]

But I am a marxist-leninist so I have different views on ''social patriotism'' etc
I'm observing the situation from my own point of view, I guess.
No, you're letting your point of view define what you think of the situation. You should be doing the reverse. Sometimes I can't help but marvel at the great job that so-called "Marxist-Leninists" are doing at perverting Lenin's legacy.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Sultan Erdoğan is importing thousands of pro-AKP country rednecks.

Source?

[Leo]

From a new, English blog on the situation: http://occupiedtaksim.blogspot.nl/2013/06/police-attacks-in-ankara.html?m=1

Got too used to all this.

[Anti-Traditional]

Got too used to all this.

What do you mean? :grin:

[Sasha]

Ethem Sarisuluk was shot in the head by a police on 2nd of June. He is still in coma. Certain sources and reports say that his brain death is declared by doctors.

Footage was just released.

0daS16bs6jY

[Sasha]

tonight again heavy police attacks in ankara and istanbul, but intense resistance in the leftist stronghold of Gazi, istanbul again; stone rains, molotovs, slingshots and heavy fireworks gave the cops a small tatse of their own medicine

[Anti-Traditional]

Ethem Sarisuluk was shot in the head by a police on 2nd of June. He is still in coma. Certain sources and reports say that his brain death is declared by doctors.

Footage was just released.

0daS16bs6jY

Look how the coward runs away, no cops say anything either...

[Sasha]

Police is moving at taksim square, officially to "remove the banners covering the Ataturk statue" and not to evict but that would be just silly... Here also fierce resistance with molotovs reported.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Damn Erdogan. He said: "If i react to hard, sorry, i'm Erdogan, that won't change."

My heart is with the Turkish protesters. I have the radio playing loud, inhaling every piece of news i can get of their situation.

Be strong Turkish brothers and sisters! Be strong!

[Sasha]

Journaal24 zendt momenteel live uit van taksim mocht je dat kunnen ontvangen...

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

http://static1.volkskrant.nl/static/photo/2013/8/6/6/20130611113814/media_xl_1697031.jpg

http://static0.volkskrant.nl/static/photo/2013/4/2/10/20130611113814/media_xl_1697350.jpg

http://static0.volkskrant.nl/static/photo/2013/17/7/0/20130611114755/media_xl_1697610.jpg

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Journaal24 zendt momenteel live uit van taksim mocht je dat kunnen ontvangen...

Aan het werk, dus dat gaat niet lukken. Ben al illegaal bezig zo ;)1
Daarnaast, veel pagina's worden hier geblokkeerd. Dat Revleft nog draait is een wonder.

[Leo]

What do you mean? :grin:

Have been living it for days.

It is widely claimed - and with pictures and all - that the police itself if throwing the molotov coctails, and the press is covering it all live, so that the government will be able to say it's the demonstrators are being violent.

[Sasha]

Cops reached the first tents at the entrance of the park.

[Sasha]

Tents being ripped down, watercanons can't reach into park though so cops move slowely

[Sasha]

Rumors about a deal between liberals and cops that the park won't be evicted yet if they retreat from the surrounding roads.. hope it false but liberals being liberal I'm afraid not.

[Sasha]

Big group pushing cops away from entrance park... Further up car tyres are burning

[Sasha]

Massive group now coming out of the park and reclaiming entrance/stairs

[Sasha]

Someone with a rainbow flag is tossing back teargas grenades behind the burning baricade, awesome

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Wish i could watch!:thumbup1:

Keep us posted!

[Sasha]

Bit of a standstill atm it seems... Cops guarding conquered area with watercanons, protesters behind baricades throwing rocks.. I hope they can hold until the end of the workday, than they might have a chance to reclaim the terrain lost tonight.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Found lots of Photo's on this website from a Dutch Newspaper!

See them here (http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2734/Foto/photoalbum/detail/3456629/444760/1/Gevechten-op-Taksimplein.dhtml)!

[Sasha]

live broadcast online: http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/tim-pool-live-streaming-from-istanbul

[Sasha]

dutch news cut their live stream, shame, had a good aerial view....

[Sasha]

It is widely claimed - and with pictures and all - that the police itself if throwing the molotov coctails, and the press is covering it all live, so that the government will be able to say it's the demonstrators are being violent.

maybe at some places but looking at the pictures domela posted here:


Found lots of Photo's on this website from a Dutch Newspaper!

See them here (http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2734/Foto/photoalbum/detail/3456629/444760/1/Gevechten-op-Taksimplein.dhtml)!


and the footage of the Gazi quarter last night i think many are thrown by real protesters with a radical leftist or footbal-ultra background.

[Sasha]

reports of a big group of lawyers arrested in the/a courthouse...

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

reports of a big group of lawyers arrested in the/a courthouse...

Lol!

[Sasha]

after brief rest on both sides clashes are kicking off again

[Sasha]

only good thing about taksim being already mostly ripped up mostly for construction, lots of barricade and projectile stuff lying around.
a drum band is keeping the spirit high..

[Sasha]

mass demonstration called at 19.00 at taksim

[Sasha]

vice reporter: "surprisingly its a lot safer being among the protesters than anywhere near the police"...
no shit:rolleyes:

[Sasha]

live stream from the other side of the square: http://rt.com/on-air/istanbul-protest-tear-gas

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

reports of a big group of lawyers arrested in the/a courthouse...

Some newsfeeds about that:

In English here (http://rt.com/news/turkish-police-lawyers-courthouse-534/)

http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2668/Buitenland/article/detail/3456547/2013/06/11/Advocaten-van-demonstranten-opgepakt-in-Istanboel.dhtml

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

And some more pictures from Taksimsquare. This time by the BBC.

See them here. (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22853007)

[Sasha]

lots of teargass at the baricades at the moment, cops making ready for a push maybe?
seems that cops went up to the sidestreets and are shooting everyone in the park with gass to clear the avenue and isolate the militants.
ill need to go soon.. very curious what will happen tonight at 7....

[Sasha]

yup, seems that the cops moved towards the sidestreet right in front of the side of the park, they wont be able to enter the park there (big drop) but if they can take street in front of the park they will have the park isolated..

[Sasha]

the reuters/RT stream just crashed/went offline, vice is still running though...

[Sasha]

reuters is up: http://reuters.livestation.com/demo

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Just read that one demonstrator is already killed by the use of teargas.
He was struck in the head by a teargas-canister.

Can't find a feed on it in English, so here's (http://www.volkskrant.nl/vk/nl/2668/Buitenland/article/detail/3456547/2013/06/11/Demonstrant-omgekomen-door-traangasgranaat.dhtml) in Dutch.

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

In a televised speech to members of parliament from his Justice and Development Party (AKP) that was frequently interrupted by applause, he asked: "They say the prime minister is rough. So what was going to happen? Were we going to kneel down in front of these [people]?
"If you call this roughness, I'm sorry, but this Tayyip Erdogan won't change."
"To those who... are at Taksim and elsewhere taking part in the demonstrations with sincere feelings: I call on you to leave those places and to end these incidents and I send you my love.
"But for those who want to continue with the incidents I say: 'It's over.' As of now we have no tolerance for them.
"Not only will we end the actions, we will be at the necks of the provocateurs and terrorists and no-one will get away with it," he continued.
"I am sorry but Gezi Park is for taking promenades, not for occupation."

(BBC News)

Hope they re-take the square and there aren't too many moer casualties, solidarity comrades!

[Sasha]

that should go down well tonight...

cops, pigs, murderers!

[Sasha]

toma's, trucks and buldozers are clearing the baricades, most protesters retreated into the park it seems, doubt the bastatrds will be able to finish the operation before the mass demonstration starts in 3 and a half hours though...

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

No timedifference with Turkey for us right?
Totally going to watch it tonight!

[Sasha]

1 hour i believe, So the 19.00 demo will start at 20.00 Dutch time

[Le Socialiste]

Turkish riot police fired volleys of teargas canisters into Istanbul's Taksim Square, centre of protests against Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan, driving thousands into narrow side streets.

Police and water cannon vehicles advanced across the square, entirely clearing the north side after a day of skirmishes that had defied the authorities' efforts to restore full control on Tuesday.

Moments before their advance, police were confronted by protesters jeering and calling for them to leave the square.

Protests two weeks ago over a proposed redevelopment of Gezi Park in Taksim Square escalated into nationwide anti-government demonstrations following a police crackdown.

Police first re-entered Taksim Square early afternoon on Tuesday to remove signs of "occupation" erected by protesters. They fired tear gas and water cannon while being pelted with petrol bombs, fireworks and stones by a small number of protesters.

In a speech to MPs, Erdogan said protesters still in Gezi Park should understand they were being used in a "dirty game" by anti-government groups.

"It's not a place to be occupied…there is a big game being played using Gezi Park as an excuse," he said.

"They are trying to damage the Turkish economy, shut down the growth of Turkey. I want the Gezi Park protesters to understand that they are being used in a dirty game."

After days of blaming extremists and foreigners for provoking the protests, Erdogan extended his ire to "capitalist groups, interest groups and media groups", adding that Gezi Park protesters were "being used openly by people who want to damage the economy, investment and tourism".

Banners removed

The governor of Istanbul, Huseyin Avni Mutlu, said on Twitter that police were in Taksim Square only to remove banners and placards and the action was not targeting the removal of those people in the area. Banners from far-left groups were removed by the police.

A statement from Mutlu's office said the aim of the intervention was to remove the banners of various groups in the square, which were making it look as though it was under "occupation". This was "negatively affecting our country's image in the eyes of the world opinion and leading to reaction from within the society".

Mutlu later said that police would only remain in the square to prevent anyone surrounding the Ataturk Cultural Centre and Republic Monument.

In his to his MPs, Erdogan said that three young people had "lost their lives" in the protests, and a policeman had been "martyred".

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2013/06/201361111245916696.html

[L1NKS]

As a German citizen and Chomskyite, I find it interesting to compare the German mass media coverage of the 2013 Istanbul riots with the German mass media coverage of the Stuttgart riots (2010-2012). Whilst the Turkey riots are being promoted as a prolific example of the rise of democracy and civil disobedience, the Stuttgart riots were overwhelmingly denounced as backward and chaotic. It was also claimed that many protestors were prone to violence, when in fact over 500 protestor were, in part seriously, injured, amongst them children. In general the Stuttgart riots were depicted as a crisis of democracy. It is important to mention that the riots both in Istanbul and Stuttgart are concerned with matters of city planning (Takzim Square and Stuttgart 21 main station).

Turkey of course is economically speaking one of Germany's crucial partners, thus the specific "pro-democracy"-tone of the coverage by German mass media cannot be explained by a fundamental opposition of the German elites and their consent-manufacturers to the neoliberal Erdogan policies. There is no such opposition. The German elite rather seeks to appeal to prejudices against Turks and Islam they think to find established within a broader German public. Germany is to hold its federal election later this year.

[cyu]

"I am sorry but Gezi Park is for taking promenades, not for occupation."

(BBC News)


My mom told me a police force is for protecting people from murder, not for murdering people :laugh:

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

vice reporter: "surprisingly its a lot safer being among the protesters than anywhere near the police"...
no shit:rolleyes:

I love that shocked reaction by liberals when they realize that the tools of the state which they took for granted as necessary to keep order are exposed as exploitative.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

As a German citizen and Chomskyite, I find it interesting to compare the German mass media coverage of the 2013 Istanbul riots with the German mass media coverage of the Stuttgart riots (2010-2012). Whilst the Turkey riots are being promoted as a prolific example of the rise of democracy and civil disobidience, the Stuttgart riots were overwhelmingly denounced as backward and chaotic. It was also claimed that many protestors were prone to violence, when in fact over 500 protestor were, in part seriously, injured, amongst them children. In general the Stuttgart riots were depicted as a crisis of democracy. It is important to mention that the riots both in Istanbul and Stuttgart are concerned with matters of city planning (Takzim Square and Stuttgart 21 main station).


Oh hi Nationalism! Didn't see you standing there!


No but seriously, it is in the ruling party's own interrest to prove the opposition wrong. Doing that by lies is most common in these cases. And that is the most important sign of a missing democracy or the presence of a mockery of it.

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

Istanbul Governor Huseyin Avni Mutlu had earlier struck a conciliatory note, but he went on television on Tuesday night to declare: "We will continue our measures in an unremitting manner, whether day or night, until marginal elements are cleared and the square is open to the people."

Thank god the authorities are working hard to allow 'the people' access to the square for pro-government walks, picnics etc.

"We believe that Turkey's long-term stability, security and prosperity is best guaranteed by upholding the fundamental freedoms of expression, assembly and association, and a free independent media," White House spokeswoman Caitlin Hayden said.

Mmmm, the sweet smell of Western hypocrisy.

(Source - BBC News)

[Luís Henrique]

Lol!

Sorry, what is funny about that?

Luís Henrique

[Blake's Baby]

Where is the working class in all of this? Last week some workers in the working class districts of Istanbul were demanding 'general strike, general resistance', at the same time as the protests in Ankara were being smashed; but though there's undoubtedly a lot of heroism from the protestors around Gezi Park there's no real sign at the moment that the working class is doing more than tailing (as individuals) the broadly 'liberal' agenda of the protests. Is there?

[Luís Henrique]

"We believe that Turkey's long-term stability, security and prosperity is best guaranteed by upholding the fundamental freedoms of expression, assembly and association, and a free independent media," White House spokeswoman Caitlin Hayden said.

Mmmm, the sweet smell of Western hypocrisy.

Perhaps we should support Erdogan, the anti-imperialist, against the zionist-salafist mob who wants to turn Turkey into a neoliberal caliphate...

Luís Henrique

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Sorry, what is funny about that?

Luís Henrique

Lawyers being arrested. It's irony. Just a few hours later i read it were the protesters' lawyers or something, so i take it back.

Thanks for correcting that.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Perhaps we should support Erdogan, the anti-imperialist, against the zionist-salafist mob who wants to turn Turkey into a neoliberal caliphate...

Luís Henrique


Oh, come on, you know the white house means absolutely nothing of that.
As long as they can turn Turkey in a new slave...ehm i mean ally.

[Blake's Baby]

Turkey already is 1 - 'a neoliberal caliphate' and 2 - an ally of the US.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Turkey already is 1 - 'a neoliberal caliphate' and 2 - an ally of the US.

That's why Dennis was being ironic and said:



Mmmm, the sweet smell of Western hypocrisy.

[Luís Henrique]

Turkey already is 1 - 'a neoliberal caliphate' and 2 - an ally of the US.

Well, of course. That would be the point.

But, also of course, we shouldn't be shocked if the argument emerges that, "yes, Turkey is already a neoliberal caliphate, but if we don't support Erdogan against Western aggression, it will become even more neoliberal and caliphatic".

Luís Henrique

[Blake's Baby]

Oh, OK. The essential humour of the argument didn't travel I'm afraid. Maybe I'm just not reading it right.

[Luís Henrique]

Oh, OK. The essential humour of the argument didn't travel I'm afraid. Maybe I'm just not reading it right.

Yeah, I forgot the invisible "" tags. They have been added now; if you still can't see them, that's because they are invisible.

Luís Henrique

[kurtulush]

http://www10.pic-upload.de/12.06.13/zsr7i313y4km.jpg

To follow from facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/TaksimDayanismasi
https://www.facebook.com/OccupyGezi
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Taksim-Solidarity/320882008043110
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Taksim-Solidarity/320882008043110
https://www.facebook.com/TaksimGeziPark?ref=stream

The first one is reporting from inside the park, for the needs also.

[Luís Henrique]

http://www10.pic-upload.de/12.06.13/zsr7i313y4km.jpg

You know a crisis is really, really serious when you see 60+ year old ladies throwing stones at the police.

If I were Erdogan, I would be considering a new job.

Luís Henrique

[kurtulush]

Internet is the only independent media we have here, mainstream media is all under the control of Erdogan.

So, please as much as u can share the sources u get especially about the police violance with your Turkish friends.

http://vimeo.com/67523930

[brotherhood]

Taksim square last night :)

QZfu_qagC7c

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has issued a "final warning" to protesters to leave Gezi Park in Istanbul.
"Our patience is at an end. I am making my warning for the last time," he said.
Clashes between police and protesters in the park and adjoining Taksim Square have continued for nearly two weeks.
Activists have said they will not leave Gezi Park until the government abandons plans to redevelop it. Mr Erdogan has promised a local vote on its future.
Such a plebiscite would not be legally binding but Mr Erdogan implied he would honour its outcome.
"I say to the mothers and fathers please take your children in hand and bring them out," Mr Erdogan declared.
"We cannot wait any more because Gezi Park does not belong to occupying forces but to the people."
His speech at a meeting of his ruling AK Party in the capital, Ankara, received a standing ovation.

(BBC News)

[Sasha]

http://www10.pic-upload.de/12.06.13/zsr7i313y4km.jpg


dev-yolo :D

[Blake's Baby]

Saw on FB this after noon that that old lady was taken to hospital shortly after that photo was taken.

[Luís Henrique]

Saw on FB this after noon that that old lady was taken to hospital shortly after that photo was taken.

Hope she is OK. She's very valiant.

Luís Henrique

[Tifosi]

Don't know if this has been posted yet. A comrade on another forum said that live ammo has been used by pigs in Istanbul while he was there. A protester, Ethem Sarisuluk has shot in the head and died yesterday after time spent in a coma. :(

RIP

http://eksisozluk.com/ethem-sarisuluk--3856960

[ed miliband]

"marxist" academics siding with the turkish state:

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/06/201361272526958584.html

member of the turkish swp has also met with erdogan, i believe.