Revolution in the arctic

[Profunc]

So, I was reading this Wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_the_Arctic), and thought to myself, could these indigenous tribes be the first to realise a "pure" communist society?

I point you to another project, called Open Source Ecology (http://opensourceecology.org/), one I've been paying attention to a lot as I've been developing my modern understanding of communism. Obviously the OSE would have to be adapted for a harsher environment, but there are resources up there that could sustain a basic existence. And those people, particularly are not nearly as prejudice to our way of thinking than people in front of a TV in the Americas and elsewhere.

Imagine combining the two... and setting up a communal socialist society in the Arctic? They're suffering up there, worse than in Africa in some areas.

I'm sure they'd be willing and open to this solution to their currently harsh and poverty-stricken way of life.

I just thought it'd be an interesting discussion topic.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Most people (myself included) would prefer to live under capitalism than in one of the most inhospitable places in earth with almost complete scarcity and comfort under the idea that such a depraving and overly difficult way of life was 'fully realised communism'.

The whole point of communism is so that we don't have to labour away every waking moment of the day to survive. :rolleyes:

[Profunc]

Most people (myself included) would prefer to live under capitalism than in one of the most inhospitable places in earth with almost complete scarcity and comfort under the idea that such a depraving and overly difficult way of life was 'fully realised communism'.

The whole point of communism is so that we don't have to labour away every waking moment of the day to survive. :rolleyes:

Yes, no, I understand that. But there exists research facilities throughout the Antarctic for example, where people could theoretically live all year round in a comfortable atmosphere without working day in, day out. Yes, I realise they are given resources by their governments.

Now, this is not something you can do overnight, obviously. But, just from a theoretical perspective: Imagine constructing a communal facility in the Arctic, for a small group of people. Solar-powered. Greenhouses for food. I'm sure snow can be melted into water.

I'm not saying these societies would be the sizes of entire nations. I'm not saying we all have to go move to the Arctic to be happy communists.

I'm saying that for people living there, perhaps a communal OSE type of society is the answer. Just one. One that can work to create others, and in time, hundreds of them. How else does one live without rise and fall in quality of life without guarantees? They need to be able to rely less on hunting and fishing and they need more shelter from the weather. I'm saying it's a good start. There's no political contortion or war up there, there's no mass murder and terrorist attacks.

It has potential.


Also, I've been to the Arctic, there's many regions where it's perfectly hospitable. There's just virtually no focus on people who live up there, and no forces of production. So, they need an alternative. Communal self-sustaining facilities seems to be a good answer.

Remember the Earth is warming up.


** Also, much of the Arctic is owner-less land

[Rusty Shackleford]

generally most people here are advocates of non-scarcity based communism where the forces of production are well developed. another part would be to not secede from human society at large by living in the arctic.


also, there did exist a pre-industrial communism. it was a scarcity based communism where the need to just survive at a most basic level prohibited division within a society for the most part.

[MarxArchist]

Primitive communism has already existed. We're into progress. The flow of history. Like a river into industrialization which has set the stage to end scarcity (globally).

[Os Cangaceiros]

Resources in the Arctic? I live about a hundred miles away from the Arctic Circle, and trust me, there's not much here in the way of resources. Except if you mean oil or natural gas. Other than that, though, the Arctic is just about as close to being unfit for human habitation as you can get, even though humans have a talent for stubbornly clinging to the most godawful spots on planet earth. It's basically a desert of moss (or ice) covered tundra, tortured pathetic trees that stand about waist high, and it's locked in darkness for literally months straight during the winter. I can think of literally hundreds of places in the world that would be better to form some sort of ecological society, including just a few hundred miles south of the Alaskan Arctic Circle, in the Mat-Su Valley, which is actually arable for a time period during the year.


They need to be able to rely less on hunting and fishing and they need more shelter from the weather.

Most native peoples here who hunt and fish don't do it out of bare necessity, they do it to preserve some of their culture.

[MarxArchist]

I can think of literally hundreds of places in the world that would be better to form some sort of ecological society
Guyana. We can call it....Jonestown?

[Sidagma]

"Hey, let's go to a remote region of the world. I'm sure it'll be easy to get the people from there to adapt to our way of life. What could POSSIBLY go wrong?"

Columbus got this idea like five hundred years before you did.

If you move somewhere new and try to start a new way of life, all that will happen is that you end up replicating the same structures elsewhere. We have to learn how to build this new society through revolutionary struggle, together, or all we're doing is becoming some irrelevant hippie commune.

[RedHal]

Have a look at these documentaries on traditional Netselik Inuits way of life.

http://www.nfb.ca/subjects/inuit/netsilik

If you don't trade with the outside capitalist world, you'll only be able to maintain a form of primitive communism in the harsh Arctic.

[Bardo]

generally most people here are advocates of non-scarcity based communism where the forces of production are well developed. another part would be to not secede from human society at large by living in the arctic.

Indeed.

Small, isolated and impoverished communes already exist around the world anyhow. Communal living is literally as old as humanity. The idea is to move beyond modern, heavily industrialized capitalist society into a classless global society.

[Profunc]

If you don't trade with the outside capitalist world, you'll only be able to maintain a form of primitive communism in the harsh Arctic.

I would argue that a primitive form of communism in the harsh Arctic would bring about a better standard of living than whatever it is they have now.

Or is communism not the answer for every global economic crisis?

[Art Vandelay]

I would argue that a primitive form of communism in the harsh Arctic would bring about a better standard of living than whatever it is they have now.

Or is communism not the answer for every global economic crisis?

It is, but you can't create communism by dropping out of society and living in autarky in some remote region. An egalitarian society, sure; communism, no.

[Profunc]

It is, but you can't create communism by dropping out of society and living in autarky in some remote region. An egalitarian society, sure; communism, no.

Fair point.