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Skyhilist
15th April 2013, 03:22
http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/world-on-course-for-catastrophic-6deg-rise-reveal-scientists-1822396.html


The world is now firmly on course for the worst-case scenario in terms of climate change, with average global temperatures rising by up to 6C by the end of the century, leading scientists said yesterday. Such a rise – which would be much higher nearer the poles – would have cataclysmic and irreversible consequences for the Earth, making large parts of the planet uninhabitable and threatening the basis of human civilisation.
We are headed for it, the scientists said, because the carbon dioxide emissions from industry, transport and deforestation which are responsible for warming the atmosphere have increased dramatically since 2002, in a way which no one anticipated, and are now running at treble the annual rate of the 1990s.
This means that the most extreme scenario envisaged in the last report from the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, published in 2007, is now the one for which society is set, according to the 31 researchers from seven countries involved in the Global Carbon Project.
Although the 6C rise and its potential disastrous effects have been speculated upon before, this is the first time that scientists have said that society is now on a path to meet it.
Their chilling and remarkable prediction throws into sharp relief the importance of next month's UN climate conference in Copenhagen, where the world community will come together to try to construct a new agreement to bring the warming under control.
For the past month there has been a lowering of expectations about the conference, not least because the US may not be ready to commit itself to cuts in its emissions. But yesterday President Barack Obama and President Hu Jintao of China issued a joint communiqué after a meeting in Beijing, which reignited hopes that a serious deal might be possible after all.
It cannot come too soon, to judge by the results of the Global Carbon Project study, led by Professor Corinne Le Quéré, of the University of East Anglia and the British Antarctic Survey, which found that there has been a 29 per cent increase in global CO2 emissions from fossil fuel between 2000 and 2008, the last year for which figures are available.
On average, the researchers found, there was an annual increase in emissions of just over 3 per cent during the period, compared with an annual increase of 1 per cent between 1990 and 2000. Almost all of the increase this decade occurred after 2000 and resulted from the boom in the Chinese economy. The researchers predict a small decrease this year due to the recession, but further increases from 2010.
In total, CO2 emissions from the burning of fossil fuels have increased by 41 per cent between 1990 and 2008, yet global emissions in 1990 are the reference level set by the Kyoto Protocol, which countries are trying to fall below in terms of their own emissions.
The 6C rise now being anticipated is in stark contrast to the C rise at which all international climate policy, including that of Britain and the EU, hopes to stabilise the warming – two degrees being seen as the threshold of climate change which is dangerous for society and the natural world.
The study by Professor Le Quéré and her team, published in the journal Nature Geoscience, envisages a far higher figure. "We're at the top end of the IPCC scenario," she said.
Professor Le Quéré said that Copenhagen was the last chance of coming to a global agreement that would curb carbon-dioxide emissions on a time-course that would hopefully stabilise temperature rises to within the danger threshold. "The Copenhagen conference next month is in my opinion the last chance to stabilise climate at C above pre-industrial levels in a smooth and organised way," she said.
"If the agreement is too weak, or the commitments not respected, it is not 2.5C or 3C we will get: it's 5C or 6C – that is the path we're on. The timescales here are extremely tight for what is needed to stabilise the climate at C," she said.
Meanwhile, the scientists have for the first time detected a failure of the Earth's natural ability to absorb man-made carbon dioxide released into the air.
They found significant evidence that more man-made CO2 is staying in the atmosphere to exacerbate the greenhouse effect because the natural "carbon sinks" that have absorbed it over previous decades on land and sea are beginning to fail, possibly as a result of rising global temperatures.
The amount of CO2 that has remained in the atmosphere as a result has increased from about 40 per cent in 1990 to 45 per cent in 2008. This suggests that the sinks are beginning to fail, they said.
Professor Le Quéré emphasised that there are still many uncertainties over carbon sinks, such as the ability of the oceans to absorb dissolved CO2, but all the evidence suggests that there is now a cycle of "positive feedbacks", whereby rising carbon dioxide emissions are leading to rising temperatures and a corresponding rise in carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.
"Our understanding at the moment in the computer models we have used – and they are state of the art – suggests that carbon-cycle climate feedback has already kicked in," she said.
"These models, if you project them on into the century, show quite large feedbacks, with climate amplifying global warming by between 5 per cent and 30 per cent. There are still large uncertainties, but this is carbon-cycle climate feedback that has already started," she said.
The study also found that, for the first time since the 1960s, the burning of coal has overtaken the burning of oil as the major source of carbon-dioxide emissions produced by fossil fuels.
Much of this coal was burned by China in producing goods sold to the West – the scientists estimate that 45 per cent of Chinese emissions resulted from making products traded overseas.
It is clear that China, having overtaken the US as the world's biggest carbon emitter, must be central to any new climate deal, and so the communiqué from the Chinese and US leaders issued yesterday was widely seized on as a sign that progress may be possible in the Danish capital next month.
Presidents Hu and Obama specifically said an accord should include emission-reduction targets for rich nations, and a declaration of action plans to ease greenhouse-gas emissions in developing countries – key elements in any deal.
6C rise: The consequences
If two degrees is generally accepted as the threshold of dangerous climate change, it is clear that a rise of six degrees in global average temperatures must be very dangerous indeed, writes Michael McCarthy. Just how dangerous was signalled in 2007 by the science writer Mark Lynas, who combed all the available scientific research to construct a picture of a world with temperatures three times higher than the danger limit.
His verdict was that a rise in temperatures of this magnitude "would catapult the planet into an extreme greenhouse state not seen for nearly 100 million years, when dinosaurs grazed on polar rainforests and deserts reached into the heart of Europe".
He said: "It would cause a mass extinction of almost all life and probably reduce humanity to a few struggling groups of embattled survivors clinging to life near the poles."
Very few species could adapt in time to the abruptness of the transition, he suggested. "With the tropics too hot to grow crops, and the sub-tropics too dry, billions of people would find themselves in areas of the planet which are essentially uninhabitable. This would probably even include southern Europe, as the Sahara desert crosses the Mediterranean.
"As the ice-caps melt, hundreds of millions will also be forced to move inland due to rapidly-rising seas. As world food supplies crash, the higher mid-latitude and sub-polar regions would become fiercely-contested refuges.
"The British Isles, indeed, might become one of the most desirable pieces of real estate on the planet. But, with a couple of billion people knocking on our door, things might quickly turn rather ugly."

Honestly, I don't see any really hopes of any strong eco-socialist revolutions taking hold in any of the developed countries that are putting out all these greenhouse gases anytime soon (and we all know that capitalism will never be truly "sustainable"). Looks like we're pretty much fucked, even in more optimistic scenarios.

Danielle Ni Dhighe
15th April 2013, 03:31
It's hard to stay optimistic when science points to a negative conclusion. It's disheartening that carbon dioxide emissions have increased so much in the last decade, when science had been pointing toward a negative outcome even before then. But that's capitalism. Profit trumps everything, even sustainability of human civilization.

Asmo
15th April 2013, 03:36
Can we just send the people who don't think climate change is our most urgent problem or deny its existence to Antarctica and watch them eat each other on live tv? I'd watch that.

Red Nightmare
15th April 2013, 03:41
It's hard to stay optimistic when science points to a negative conclusion. It's disheartening that carbon dioxide emissions have increased so much in the last decade, when science had been pointing toward a negative outcome even before then. But that's capitalism. Profit trumps everything, even sustainability of human civilization.

I fear that we may soon have that "barbarism" that Rosa Luxemburg talked about when she said "socialism or barbarism". The depressing thing is that most people will not realize this until it is too late.

L.A.P.
15th April 2013, 04:03
Marx was wrong, capitalism will be the last stage of human society and then we'll go extinct. It was a good run, I guess.

Danielle Ni Dhighe
15th April 2013, 04:34
I just noticed the article is from 2009, so how much worse things now?

Skyhilist
15th April 2013, 04:52
I just noticed the article is from 2009, so how much worse things now?

I didn't catch that actually as I saw it posted somewhere else recently and had assumed it was a more recent article. But from what I've heard, things have probably gotten worse, as that's been the general trend thus far. My father is a climate scientist and I can certainly say that he has not gotten any more optimistic since 2009.

Jimmie Higgins
15th April 2013, 08:53
I fear that we may soon have that "barbarism" that Rosa Luxemburg talked about when she said "socialism or barbarism". The depressing thing is that most people will not realize this until it is too late.Huge numbers of people realize the potential of "barbarism" but they don't have any conception of a possible alternative that could avert this.

The sucess of humans at using our power and creativity to turn the natural world into profits and pollution, could be flipped and turned into the power and creativity to make the world healthier and more habitable. Even now there are many potential solutions that have been put forward, but we lack the ability to actually implement any of them while the profit-system still rules the relationship of humans to nature. So the solutions we tend to hear of are market-friendly half-steps.

Skyhilist
15th April 2013, 15:49
Even now there are many potential solutions that have been put forward, but we lack the ability to actually implement any of them while the profit-system still rules the relationship of humans to nature. So the solutions we tend to hear of are market-friendly half-steps.

Very well put. In fact, market palliatives such as the Kyoto Protocal would only lower the projected levels of CO2 in the next century by about a few dozen parts per million at most, which would be quite inadequate in reversing or even really slowing down climate change substantially. Then of course there are asshats like Al Gore who chime in with ideas like "green capitalism" who only exacerbate the ubiquitous yet fallacious idea that we can somehow have a sustainable market.

bcbm
16th April 2013, 03:16
The sucess of humans at using our power and creativity to turn the natural world into profits and pollution, could be flipped and turned into the power and creativity to make the world healthier and more habitable.

the problem is that this needed to happen a decade ago or longer

Asmo
16th April 2013, 03:36
Do you people think that preppers might be on to something? It's probably a good idea to learn to be self-sufficient.
Honestly I doubt that humans will survive the century, but we might as well try, living in communes or some such thing.

ÑóẊîöʼn
18th April 2013, 02:11
the problem is that this needed to happen a decade ago or longer

Yep, we're all fucking doomed and so we can forget about pointless shit like trying to build a more just and egalitarian society. Instead we should be preparing for the fucking apocalypse. [/sarcasm]

If things were really as bad as this media report makes out, then you'd think that climate scientists across the world would be practically kicking down the doors of their governments in an attempt to get them to better deal with this issue.

Hell, the Pentagon has already published a report dealing with the security issues surrounding catastrophic climate change, so if they consider it a possibility worth compiling a report about, then one wonders why more isn't being done, especially as it can tied into all that Homeland Security-type nonsense.

bcbm
18th April 2013, 02:32
Yep, we're all fucking doomed and so we can forget about pointless shit like trying to build a more just and egalitarian society. Instead we should be preparing for the fucking apocalypse. [/sarcasm]

i would appreciate it if you didn't put words in my mouth. quite the opposite is true, this struggle is necessary now more than ever. however my point still stands; if we wanted to see a reduction in greenhouse gases massive enough to slow down climate change it would have needed to start some time ago. instead we emit more greenhouse gases every year, have passed the tipping point of extreme change in all likelihood and things show no sign of changing. reality is harsh.


If things were really as bad as this media report makes out, then you'd think that climate scientists across the world would be practically kicking down the doors of their governments in an attempt to get them to better deal with this issue.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hansen


Hell, the Pentagon has already published a report dealing with the security issues surrounding catastrophic climate change, so if they consider it a possibility worth compiling a report about, then one wonders why more isn't being done, especially as it can tied into all that Homeland Security-type nonsense.

you seem to miss the obvious in what you just said. more is being done, they are preparing for it as a security issue not as anything that needs to effect anyone's bottom line.

zoot_allures
18th April 2013, 11:42
If things were really as bad as this media report makes out, then you'd think that climate scientists across the world would be practically kicking down the doors of their governments in an attempt to get them to better deal with this issue.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Hansen
On this point, see also, for example: http://www.skepticalscience.com/climate-scientists-esld.html

I think there's a more basic problem, though: namely, that it's pretty much impossible, in my view, to give any reliable long-term (say 10 years +) predictions about how a system as complex as our planet's environment will react to radical change. There are just too many factors that we might miss.

Workers-Control-Over-Prod
18th April 2013, 12:38
Look at Greece, Spain, Portugal, look at the life the miners of Bolivia, Rwanda, or the Congo. This is normal "Civilization". Not to say that Climate Change is welcomed, but most of these kind of reports are ignorant liberal fear mongering. And they are succeeding in keeping the people afraid.

Humanity is capable of amazing things. The reality of Global Warming and Climate Change is such a scary horror to the Liberals because it threatens the very survival of their capitalist system, not because it is and will be wiping out numerous spectacular but unadaptable life forms on earth. The Human Race is the most adaptable life in existence. Not only that, it has the means to change the nature of the world.

Change of program RevLeft Liberals: Class Struggle please not Capitalist Propaganda.

bcbm
18th April 2013, 20:49
acknowledging scientific reality makes you a liberal ?

Rafiq
18th April 2013, 21:33
the bourgeois state cannot make descisions in the long term. we know this from neoliberalism. their descisons coincide with the intimate necessities for capital, and do not expect anything more.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

Klaatu
19th April 2013, 06:34
If things were really as bad as this media report makes out, then you'd think that climate scientists across the world would be practically kicking down the doors of their governments in an attempt to get them to better deal with this issue.

I know you mean this metaphorically, but still, one wonders that the scientists would be (at best) ignored, or (at worst) be arrested as being terrorists/revolutionaries/socialists/anarchists/blasphemers/kooks/liars/eco-nazis/eco-whacos/boston'bombers...or anything else that FoxNews, Limbaugh, KochBrothers, John Stossel, etc can throw at them. According to these douchebags, (Senator James Inhofe included) there is NO global warming, they even think it is a hoax!

The million dollar question is this: how do we fix stupid???

bcbm
19th April 2013, 06:37
The million dollar question is this: how do we fix stupid???

move it to a nice ocean front property and wait a few years

Hexen
19th April 2013, 06:38
the bourgeois state cannot make descisions in the long term. we know this from neoliberalism. their descisons coincide with the intimate necessities for capital, and do not expect anything more.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

And this is where capitalism fails and this will lead to their own demise.


Look at Greece, Spain, Portugal, look at the life the miners of Bolivia, Rwanda, or the Congo. This is normal "Civilization". Not to say that Climate Change is welcomed, but most of these kind of reports are ignorant liberal fear mongering. And they are succeeding in keeping the people afraid.

Humanity is capable of amazing things. The reality of Global Warming and Climate Change is such a scary horror to the Liberals because it threatens the very survival of their capitalist system, not because it is and will be wiping out numerous spectacular but unadaptable life forms on earth. The Human Race is the most adaptable life in existence. Not only that, it has the means to change the nature of the world.

Change of program RevLeft Liberals: Class Struggle please not Capitalist Propaganda.

Of course after that, we would be in a socialist/communist society by then while looking back much how much of a failure capitalism was and where it lead to.

bcbm
20th April 2013, 07:06
And this is where capitalism fails and this will lead to their own demise.


the problem is how much of humanity it takes with it

Slavoj Zizek's Balls
20th April 2013, 11:29
Of course this doesn't change the realities of things. People don't give a damn yet.

I think that the environment is going to be the area where Capitalism makes the biggest error in it's existence, possibly triggering a mass retaliation by the masses. It might be a global resistance, but it'll also be a global catastrophe environmentally speaking which may leave humanity's existence balanced on a knife edge.

Jimmie Higgins
20th April 2013, 12:59
And this is where capitalism fails and this will lead to their own demise.Well I think a contradiction here is that capitalist problems, if left to capitalism, just becomes new market opportunities. "Clean Coal", Fracking, Carbon-Credit schemes, Corn-based fuel, are all examples of this. Most likely, without a working class movement that challenges control of over use of the natural world, oil will be disincentivised on the market before they actually run out - some other harmful fuel will become more cost effective as the costs rise in seeking out frozen stones to squeeze oil out of.

WWI was a much more immediate and observable disaster - obviously for workers, but also even for the imperial powers. But they could still profiteer off of it and ultimately they were driven to make destruction in order to have the chance to come out of the catastrophy on top of their rivals. But with all the disorder and destruction of lives and capital, only the Russian and German Revolutions (and other similar conflicts around the same time) actually made the Powers "scared" of what they unleashed.

Without a working class challenge, if it comes down to it, they'll create a market for floating homes so we can rest after a long day of drinking our own urine and battling the fish-gilled men of Waterworld.

Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages
20th April 2013, 15:00
Look at Greece, Spain, Portugal, look at the life the miners of Bolivia, Rwanda, or the Congo. This is normal "Civilization". Not to say that Climate Change is welcomed, but most of these kind of reports are ignorant liberal fear mongering. And they are succeeding in keeping the people afraid.

Humanity is capable of amazing things. The reality of Global Warming and Climate Change is such a scary horror to the Liberals because it threatens the very survival of their capitalist system, not because it is and will be wiping out numerous spectacular but unadaptable life forms on earth. The Human Race is the most adaptable life in existence. Not only that, it has the means to change the nature of the world.

Change of program RevLeft Liberals: Class Struggle please not Capitalist Propaganda.

Surely our ability to adapt has nothing to do with the rest of the biosphere, our glorious rugged individualism and all :rolleyes:. What exactly are you on about in this post?