People's Assembly Against Austerity, 22 June 2013, London

[The Idler]

Saturday 22 June 2013, 9:30am – 5pm,

Central Hall Westminster, Storey’s Gate, London, Westminster, London SW1H 9NH



Add your support for the People’s Assembly Against Austerity (http://www.coalitionofresistance.org.uk/2013/02/peoples-assembly-add-your-support/)
Model Resolution in support of the People’s Assembly (http://www.coalitionofresistance.org.uk/2013/02/peoples-assembly-model-resolution/)
People’s Assembly launched in Guardian by trade union leaders, MPs, campaigns and cultural figures (http://www.coalitionofresistance.org.uk/2013/02/peoples-assembly-against-austerity-launched-in-the-guardian/)
Contact us: [email protected] – 07872 481769




People’s Assembly (http://www.coalitionofresistance.org.uk/category/peoples-assembly/)

[ed miliband]

hahahahahahahaa.

[goalkeeper]

"The People" don't want to be up and in central London by 9.30 on a Saturday, thanks.

[bricolage]

"the people" don't want to spend money on being lectured at by tony benn and owen jones

[Le Socialiste]

hahahahahahahaa.

Please don't spam the thread with one-liners like this, thanks.

Keep it civil y'all. I don't want to have to issue any warnings.

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

hmm. It upsets me to see some of those names on the list, but also strikes me as necessary political work that should at least critically be supported. It can't do more harm than good and might open up more radical avenues if it is a success in terms of turnout and direction.

[bricolage]

I don't see how it can do again good. It's a top-down political format where the same names will give the same spiel they've been churning out for the last couple of years and end with some vague calls for some sort of demo or 'standing our own candidates'. what are you meant to do with that?

[ed miliband]

exactly: it's the same old names, asking us to do the same old things. if these assemblies were formed in the midst of real struggle it would be a different thing entirely, instead bureaucrats with tired politics want us to listen to them tell us, for the nteenth time, how much better things would be if they managed capital rather than those nasty tories!

[Blake's Baby]

Maybe we should all turn up and denounce them as agents of capital. But to be honest the idea of paying the train fare to go to London and get a ticket to troll Tony Benn in real life isn't all that appealing.

Le Socialist - I don't think ed milliband was laughing at The Idler (who is posting this for information's sake not in support, I suspect) but at the conference organisers.

[Le Socialiste]

Le Socialist - I don't think The Boss was laughing at The Idler (who is posting this for information's sake not in support, I suspect) but at the conference organisers.

I don't know where you got it that The Boss made that laughing post, because it was clearly ed miliband. Either way, regardless of their intent, posting those kinds of one-liners simply aren't allowed and should be discouraged.

[Blake's Baby]

I don't know where you got it that The Boss made that laughing post, because it was clearly ed miliband. Either way, regardless of their intent, posting those kinds of one-liners simply aren't allowed and should be discouraged.

Yeah, you're right. If you remove the name 'The Boss' and replace it with 'ed milliband' my post makes perfect sense.

Sorry to both The Boss, unjustly accused of laughing at social democrats, and ed milliband, whose actions were taken from him in a bureaucratic cock-up.

[Lord Hargreaves]

Presumably at the end of the session they will decide that "something" must be done, followed by a vote to hold another meeting. Definitely worth the rail fare indeed

[TheRedAnarchist23]

It is planned for 3 months from now?


"The People" don't want to be up and in central London by 9.30 on a Saturday, thanks.

Maybe you haven't noticed but it says it goes on until 5pm. It is of course a strategy to get as many people to come as possible.

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

Hmm, well, this event doesn't suit my ideological interests, so instead of engaging with it, i'm going to sit at home and laugh behind my computer at it.

Apathy reigns, it seems. :rolleyes:

Really what would be better is to group together a committed bunch of people to go and support the areas that are worth supporting, and challenge the probably overwhelming majority area where the Coalition of Resistance is totally inept. Engaging with things like this is probably the only way we're going to even get our ideas aired amongst the many millions of workers who are TU affiliated, as otherwise the TUC and their bureaucratic lackeys in the leadership have a total monopoly on relevant political information disseminated to TU members, and are able to limit political action taken by TU members to tokenistic economic protests.

[bricolage]

Hmm, well, this event doesn't suit my ideological interests, so instead of engaging with it, i'm going to sit at home and laugh behind my computer at it.

Apathy reigns, it seems. :rolleyes:

Really what would be better is to group together a committed bunch of people to go and support the areas that are worth supporting, and challenge the probably overwhelming majority area where the Coalition of Resistance is totally inept. Engaging with things like this is probably the only way we're going to even get our ideas aired amongst the many millions of workers who are TU affiliated, as otherwise the TUC and their bureaucratic lackeys in the leadership have a total monopoly on relevant political information disseminated to TU members, and are able to limit political action taken by TU members to tokenistic economic protests.
have you ever been to any of these things? there'll be like five minutes of questions at the end of every sessions, and half the time the speakers will pick people they know, it'll end with a big rally where everyone cheers and that's that. they aren't actually assemblies, you don't actually get to engage with anyone.

[brigadista]

all the damage has been done more by june

[Futility Personified]

When the cuts happen we should start picking our own mad max outfits. I call dibs on the bondage with exaggerated codpiece combined with an 80's pimphat, because it's so off the wall and wacky it could, hey, be like the coalition!

But really, I want to see how we can actually stop the cuts besides a series of meetings, it seems occupation needs to be a bit more of an encouraged strategy. That can't last either, but this hatchet is a swinging and if any of the soc dem benefits to capitalism are going to stay something has to happen. Council occupations, hall occupations.... as far as non violent strategy goes I don't know what else can be done

[Sam_b]

Well I for one will be there so if anyone is going let me know and we can maybe go for a pint after. I think it will be good. I think people talking about how it will do nothing actually seem to forget that CoR has in fact been very active in taking things forward out of meetings to real life, especially when industrial action is concerned. With the bedroom tax looming we need to get together and be organised - we should be using this as a chance to get a national demo and movement sorted, a non-compliance to pay initiative, and get resolutions drafted to take to the unions.

Maybe these people that becry that it will do nothing are the people that let these things do nothing, by not engaging and putting the work into it that ensures a response, and setting up anti-cuts and/or CoR groups in their local area (I would say this, but there you go, not a CoR branch secretary for nothing).

[brigadista]

There are a LOT of bedroom tax active groups made up of Claimants and community activists however where is trade union support for the groups? but providing resources and support for a national campaign?

Special respect goes in particular to groups in Liverpool and Scotland

Legal Aid cuts start in April-no legal aid for debt, welfare benefits limited housing and most of all v little immigration, the ability to judicially review decisions has also changed and cuts to legal aid to do it.

It needs pro bono representation to judicially review decisions of this gov .

the TUC are culpable in not acting quick enough and following Lab party line .

I dont think that people should stop organising but the damage to come is huge and with respect another meeting to talk about what ever has been done is too little too late -

tbh the current interparty squabbles between the Tories are the only light at the end of the tunnel
forgive me for my cynicism but seeing the effects of these cuts makes me sick to my stomach.

[ed miliband]

you have to pay if you wish to attend this btw. so again, hahahahahahahahaha.

[The Idler]

Just looked at their events calendar for June and nothing is there.

[ed miliband]

according to young owen jones on twitter (and he would know). £8 waged, £4 unwaged.

[hatzel]

£8 waged, £4 unwaged.

Technical question: could an unwaged business owner get in for less than their waged employee? If they were to argue according to the letter of the law, so to speak, 'I am, in fact, unwaged, therefore I deserve the reduction'? Because I'm not going to lie I'd kind of admire them for the sheer effrontery there :lol:

[Blake's Baby]

'unwaged' is a euphemism for unemployed/pensioner/student. I doubt it would stand up in law. Anyway, a dole card, a senior-citizens' buspass or student card would be proof. Difficult to prove you're not getting a wage otherwise.

[ed miliband]

here you go, if there was any doubt about it being a charged event: http://www.eventbrite.com/event/5373440104?ref=ebtnebregn

i don't necessarily think £4 is extortionate or anything, but for a "people's assembly" (btw, who are "the people"? that in itself says it all...) there should be no charge whatsoever.

plus, who is really pushing this? coalition of resistance, or... swp split counterfire's anti-austerity front, which has been floundering about for the past three years. the green's are also muscling in on it, presumably to get some of the "left vote" -- despite, y'know, enforcing austerity in brighton. ken loach has a new film to flog. it's a sham.

[bricolage]

thing is, despite their obvious limits, im pretty down with assemblies (although I hate the name) and unlike was insinuated about people criticising this I've been plenty involved with local anti-cuts groups, one of them actually disrupted a council budget meeting forcing them to leave the building and turning the chamber into an real life 'people's assembly'. this is nothing of the sort, and I can't see what anyone gets out of paying money to listen to top table speakers peddle their crap.

[bricolage]

mass demonstration as sussex uni today against outsourcing and privatisation, all cafes occupied, riot police on campus, documents taken from management offices and burnt, MPs booed, omnia sunt communia banners... ended with an enlarged 650+ person occupation discussing where to go next etc. student politics has all kinds of problems, but that's far closer to a 'people's assembly' than this thing will ever be.

[Sam_b]

this is nothing of the sort, and I can't see what anyone gets out of paying money to listen to top table speakers peddle their crap.

Please let me know what crap is being peddled by speakers and supporters of:
BARAC
National Unemployed Workers Centres
Disabled People Against the Cuts
National Pensioners Convention Keep our NHS Public
CND
War on Want

Because they're all involved and all supporting it. Why are you so opposed to groups meeting on a national scale to coordinate activity? Are speakers who are involved in organising against the bedroom tax 'peddling crap' as well?

[bricolage]

except these groups are so important they only get a mention after celebrities, mps, and of course mr tony benn: http://www.coalitionofresistance.org.uk/2013/03/peoples-assembly-supporting-organisations/

if people met on a national scale to really coordinate activity ok, but I've had enough experience of these types of meetings before (didn't coalition of resistance already do this same thing a couple of year ago?) and anti-cuts groups i've been in have been sabotaged in the past by people going on about abstract national coordination to the extent that actual tangible activity gets sidelined.

i've mentioned things in this thread already that I think count as actual 'people's assemblies', but I still don't see how one led by top table speakers that you have to pay for(!) counts as one.

[Sam_b]

but I still don't see how one led by top table speakers that you have to pay for(!) counts as one

Can you please show me the copy of the timetable for the People's Assembly? If not how do you know it will be 'led by top table speakers'?

[bricolage]

Can you please show me the copy of the timetable for the People's Assembly? If not how do you know it will be 'led by top table speakers'?
i'm going on what all the promotion has revolved around and what previous coalition of resistance events have looked like.
maybe i'll be proven wrong, i'm not going to pay eight quid for the privilege.

[Sam_b]

Last proper big CoR events I went to involved 100 people wanting to mobilise against the bedroom tax, and a strike bus for rolling pickets.

[ed miliband]

alright, so what's going on here then:


John Rees, a national officer for the Stop The War Coalition, said the planned march on 22 June would “have to be bigger than the ‘stop the war’ march”, which took place on the 15 February 2003, in protest at the growing likelihood of an invasion of Iraq, a march which “we now know” he says, “came very close to stopping the war”. Estimates for numbers at that rally range from 750,000 to 2,000,000 people.

22 june is the day they're asking people to pay up to £10 to attend this "people's assembly" in london. an all day event. so either that's off -- why? or, rees has let it out the bag that regardless of what goes on at this "people's assembly" it's already been decided that there will be another a-b march (with speeches from that lovely strike breaker tony benn? of course), and an editor at the independent (or rees himself) has simply got the date wrong.

lol:


“We are not radicals,” said Francesca Martinez, who is most recognisable for her role in Ricky Gervais’s Extras, “the Government are the radicals. Stop people in the street and ask them are you in favour of the NHS, for example, and they will say ‘yes’”.

reminds me of the invite i got to a bedroom tax protest, something like "there will be no violence or criminality on our protest, we leave that to the criminals in government". lol.

lol:


The People’s Assembly are of the view that there is an alternative to austerity which is not being articulated by the three main “corporate-led” political parties, or “corporate-led” media.

great analysis guys!

[The Idler]

Can anyone explain how the people will march through London on the same Saturday 22 June 2013 as being at Central Hall, Westminster 09:30 til 17:00?

[TheRedAnarchist23]

Seriously? What are these guys thinking?

We have assemblies like that here all the time, and I never heard of anyone having to pay.

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

the payment aspect is admittedly suspect, especially if they want it to be HUGE protest, I wonder where all the money goes (/suspicious).

However, you can't kick a protest because it posits itself as an 'alternative to austerity' rather than being 'pure Socialism' because the reality is that the latter doesn't just spontaneously erupt, that's not how class consciousness goes. If it was, then working people would have risen up in 2008 in their masses demanding an end to capitalism. They haven't, because they've in the main been too busy trying to survive to think about political philosophy in the way that some others have more time/resources to think about.

[ed miliband]

the payment aspect is admittedly suspect, especially if they want it to be HUGE protest, I wonder where all the money goes (/suspicious).

well theoretically the money is going to pay for the venue that will hold the assembly, which i believe cost the organisers £25,000. let us bear in mind that the assembly has a number of millionaire backers, and the support of a number of organisations that are hardly grovelling in poverty.

i don't think the issue is so much "where the money goes", but the fact that money is involved at all; people should not have to pay to attend a "people's assembly". the fact they have to just serves to highlight the true nature of this event, which has been dreamt up in the heads of a few leftist bureaucrats. can you imagine if the bolsheviks had gone "yeah, we're gonna be setting up soviets in a few months time, fiver a head"? it doesn't work like that...


However, you can't kick a protest because it posits itself as an 'alternative to austerity' rather than being 'pure Socialism' because the reality is that the latter doesn't just spontaneously erupt, that's not how class consciousness goes. If it was, then working people would have risen up in 2008 in their masses demanding an end to capitalism. They haven't, because they've in the main been too busy trying to survive to think about political philosophy in the way that some others have more time/resources to think about.

i didn't kick the protest for that reason, i took the piss out of the claim that "we aren't radicals, the radicals are in government" or whatever, which is a joke for so many reasons.

the issue with the march is that john rees announced that it would be taking place on the same day as the "people's assembly"; as i outlined above this implies the "assembly" has been called off in favour of the march, or the march is happening on a different day and saying it would take place on june 22nd was a mistake. why is this an issue? because it implies decisions have already been made by rees and his gang of bureaucrats, when the whole point of the assembly was that it would be a "democratic arena" or some shit for "the left" to "coordinate an anti-austerity movement". if a decision has already been made re: courses of action it is clear that that isn't the case. there's also the wider point about these protests being purely symbolic a - b marches that never achieve anything and end up with people listening to that boring old twat tony benn.

i don't know where you got the idea that i want people to march for "pure socialism" from, but i do think there is a big issue with the idea of an "alternative to austerity" within capitalism, which is what is ultimately being pushed by the leftists organising these events, despite their pretence of being "revolutionaries". considering i've always been very clear - to the point that it's absolutely pivotal to my politics - that i don't see communism (rather than socialism, which i don't identify with) as an idea to be put into place, but rather the real movement which abolishes the present state of things, i don't know why you imagine i have that conception of struggles.

also, re: your last sentence, i think it's a bit condescending and, on the whole and at this point in time, a bit hyperbolic.

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

[QUOTE=ed miliband;2598298]well theoretically the money is going to pay for the venue that will hold the assembly, which i believe cost the organisers £25,000. let us bear in mind that the assembly has a number of millionaire backers, and the support of a number of organisations that are hardly grovelling in poverty.
i don't think the issue is so much "where the money goes", but the fact that money is involved at all; people should not have to pay to attend a "people's assembly".

yeah, I broadly agree with all of this.


the fact they have to just serves to highlight the true nature of this event, which has been dreamt up in the heads of a few leftist bureaucrats. can you imagine if the bolsheviks had gone "yeah, we're gonna be setting up soviets in a few months time, fiver a head"? it doesn't work like that...

However, this is a non-sequitor. That it's a paying event, rather than as you say using the backing of wealthy millionaires, doesn't serve to what you say.

The bolshevik situation was also totally different - they were in a revolutionary situation and were largely forced by a russian working class and poor peasantry that was agitating. The British working class currently is not, in general.


i didn't kick the protest for that reason, i took the piss out of the claim that "we aren't radicals, the radicals are in government" or whatever, which is a joke for so many reasons.

yeah but that doesn't have much to do with the whole event so it's sorta irreelvant; there are always dickheads and idiots at any sort of political action, spouting their bullshit.


the issue with the march is that john rees announced that it would be taking place on the same day as the "people's assembly"; as i outlined above this implies the "assembly" has been called off in favour of the march, or the march is happening on a different day and saying it would take place on june 22nd was a mistake. why is this an issue? because it implies decisions have already been made by rees and his gang of bureaucrats, when the whole point of the assembly was that it would be a "democratic arena" or some shit for "the left" to "coordinate an anti-austerity movement". if a decision has already been made re: courses of action it is clear that that isn't the case. there's also the wider point about these protests being purely symbolic a - b marches that never achieve anything and end up with people listening to that boring old twat tony benn.

this is broadly fair, aside from calling contemporary tony benn a twat. He's not really been one, in terms of his politics, for the past 30 odd years. Just a well-meaning but utterly naive left-of-labour politico.


i don't know where you got the idea that i want people to march for "pure socialism" from, but i do think there is a big issue with the idea of an "alternative to austerity" within capitalism, which is what is ultimately being pushed by the leftists organising these events, despite their pretence of being "revolutionaries". considering i've always been very clear - to the point that it's absolutely pivotal to my politics - that i don't see communism (rather than socialism, which i don't identify with) as an idea to be put into place, but rather the real movement which abolishes the present state of things, i don't know why you imagine i have that conception of struggles.

i'm not sure whether the people who have organised this event have placed themselves in the 'revolutionary' segment, though. That's not the issue (I mean, it's certainly a political difference between us and them, but it's not the issue i'm talking about).

And though we might disagree on a few things, i'd have thought that my conception of socialism/communism/whatever as one of 'abolition' too, rather than 'alternatives', was equally as clear. However, your position on strategy is therefore confusing. Where do you expect working class consciousness to rise from? Participating, critically, in a protest of the type organised here is not the same as validating the politics of those who have organised it. Rather, it's an opportunity to bring together tens/hundreds of thousands of British workers to gauge their level of anger at the present state of things. Whatever the likes of Rees, Jones and Benn have in mind is not hugely relevant; the fees protests - whilst ultimately unsuccessful but not due to the nature of the initial protest - showed that the value in a protest is not who is speaking at the top table, nor its pre-organised format, but that a successful one brings many workers together. Working class unity is probably more valuable than fixating on this or that aspect of those who are organising the protest. Referencing again the fees protest, the NUS bureaucrats spent ages organising it meticulously, yet all it took was some radical action for the protest to take on a mind of its own. We lost the fees battle due to mistakes made after the protest - I hold a lot of blame with the SWP for effectively taking over many local anti-fees and anti-cuts groups -, not because of the protest itself; a protest which whose origins lied in the bureaucratically organised, A-B march style that you're critiquing here, eventually turned into something quite different and much more radical.


also, re: your last sentence, i think it's a bit condescending and, on the whole and at this point in time, a bit hyperbolic.

didn't mean to be condescending, wasn't having a dig or anything. I don't see it as hyperbolic, though.

[ed miliband]

late response -- manic weekend, and i wasn't in a state to respond yesterday.


[QUOTE]
However, this is a non-sequitor. That it's a paying event, rather than as you say using the backing of wealthy millionaires, doesn't serve to what you say.

re: wealthy backing, i was simply pointing out that between ali, benn, etc. it was surely possible to come up with £25,000 and not expect "the people" to cough up to attend?

the wider point was simply the fact it's a paying event highlights its nature: the fact it has been "dreamt up in the heads of a few leftist bureaucrats". personally i think this is pretty obvious -- 1. assemblies emerge from struggles, you don't just "call" an assembly, 2. who is calling the assembly? the same old suspects -- don't believe me? take a look at dave renton's blog:

http://livesrunning.wordpress.com/2013/03/28/the-peoples-assmebly-an-auto-critique/

now renton has been deeply associated with rees and german. if he is saying this i'd take his word for it.


The bolshevik situation was also totally different - they were in a revolutionary situation and were largely forced by a russian working class and poor peasantry that was agitating. The British working class currently is not, in general.

yeah i agree, but i don't see how this refutes what i'm saying about assemblies being things that emerge from struggles. if the struggles aren't there for them to emerge from you don't just "call" them. if you do just call them, you don't ask people to pay to attend them.


yeah but that doesn't have much to do with the whole event so it's sorta irreelvant; there are always dickheads and idiots at any sort of political action, spouting their bullshit.

it's not like the person who made that comment was a random participant but one of the celebs rees and co. are using to tout the event.


this is broadly fair, aside from calling contemporary tony benn a twat. He's not really been one, in terms of his politics, for the past 30 odd years. Just a well-meaning but utterly naive left-of-labour politico.

but his politics of today still rest on the same basic assumptions that his politics 30 years ago did; the same politics that lead him to a decade of attacking the working class, inc. sending troops to break a strike. the problem with people like benn and owen jones is precisely that they are "well meaning", and the really mean it.

he's also unbearably smug. watch an interview with him with that in mind and you'll see what i mean.


i'm not sure whether the people who have organised this event have placed themselves in the 'revolutionary' segment, though. That's not the issue (I mean, it's certainly a political difference between us and them, but it's not the issue i'm talking about).

rees and german? they definitely consider themselves r-r-r-r-revolutionary. burgin and co. all do too.


And though we might disagree on a few things, i'd have thought that my conception of socialism/communism/whatever as one of 'abolition' too, rather than 'alternatives', was equally as clear. However, your position on strategy is therefore confusing. Where do you expect working class consciousness to rise from? Participating, critically, in a protest of the type organised here is not the same as validating the politics of those who have organised it. Rather, it's an opportunity to bring together tens/hundreds of thousands of British workers to gauge their level of anger at the present state of things. Whatever the likes of Rees, Jones and Benn have in mind is not hugely relevant; the fees protests - whilst ultimately unsuccessful but not due to the nature of the initial protest - showed that the value in a protest is not who is speaking at the top table, nor its pre-organised format, but that a successful one brings many workers together. Working class unity is probably more valuable than fixating on this or that aspect of those who are organising the protest. Referencing again the fees protest, the NUS bureaucrats spent ages organising it meticulously, yet all it took was some radical action for the protest to take on a mind of its own. We lost the fees battle due to mistakes made after the protest - I hold a lot of blame with the SWP for effectively taking over many local anti-fees and anti-cuts groups -, not because of the protest itself; a protest which whose origins lied in the bureaucratically organised, A-B march style that you're critiquing here, eventually turned into something quite different and much more radical.

this is another topic altogether, one which i've been thinking about making. i'll sketch out a response here, though.

what i've been trying to stress is that this event is not going to be "an opportunity to bring together tens/hundreds of thousands of British workers to gauge their level of anger at the present state of things". it's going to be a talking-shop for "the left", inc. the labour party. this is made clear by who is organising it, who is backing it, etc. it's made clear by the fact one has to pay to attend. it's made clear by the fact an "action" has been called before the "assembly" has even been held! show me the proof that "tens/hundreds of thousands" of workers will attend this, and you might have a point, but i'm yet to see anything that even remotely suggests this is the case.

saw this in an analysis of the 'indignados' movement in greece, in sic vol. 1:


The new bureaucracy of the assemblies—which hosted leftist mps or
ex-mps, militants, high ranking unionists, local council members, leftnationalist journalists, ‘sensitive’ artists, and so on, who had just left their
party/political banners and logos behind—was actually a coalition of the
parliamentary left (syriza, but not the cp, which was not involved in
the events) with extra-parliamentary leftist parties/groups (after a point,
bitter, but still a coalition). The presence of many younger protesters—
students, or ex-students and workers/unemployed (in Greece, passing
through university does not mean that one is destined to join the middle strata, even less so over the last decade)—in the ‘lower part’ of Syntagma square and the assemblies in the various districts of Athens and
outside the capital facilitated the domination of the assemblies by the
leftists, since the latter traditionally have strong links with universities.
Within the first week, this bureaucracy was already prevalent and propagated the existence and expansion of the assemblies—proclaiming them
a ‘workshop in democracy’—as an end in itself. From this point on it represented and tried to maintain the framework within which the internal
dynamics and conflicts of the movement developed. For the bureaucracy,
everything could be discussed as long as it did not radically question the
line of those who controlled the assemblies, because this would call into
question the assemblies themselves, and therefore democracy. And who
wants to be against democracy?
The ‘real democratic’ discourse was the almost total absence of practical actions in the ‘indignados’ movement. Leaving aside the three days
of general strike and the spontaneous attacks against politicians here and
there that had been taking place for a while in Greece—manifesting a
diffuse, accumulated rage on the part of the working class and proletarianised petit-bourgeois and middle strata—there were no important actions organised by the assemblies, neither the central nor the local ones,
or even more informal groupings of protesters (with the exception of
some interventions in unemployment offices organised by the Group
of Workers and Unemployed). Even the sabotaging of ticket machines
twice in Syntagma underground station was organised by the so-called
‘I don’t pay’ movement which pre-existed the gatherings in the squares.
The bureaucracy of the assemblies, for its part, did its best to block any
such actions. The various ‘thematic groups’ which were created during
the first days of the movement, to the extent that they did not wind up
merely as practical executers of the assembly’s decisions (photocopying
and handing-out leaflets etc) vanished in non-practice. It is true that
swearing at politicians and cops outside Parliament, spending time with
so many other people, eating, drinking, dancing, chatting, and sleeping together is a nice feeling, and a break with the normality of everyday life. However, this movement lacked the practical actions and the
imagination that the December 2008 riots or even the 2006–7 student
movement produced.

http://riff-raff.se/en/sic1/sic-1-06-indignados-in-greece.pdf (apologies for the terrible formatting in my cut'n'paste job).

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

What struggles, though? You are creating an artificial difference between struggles and assemblies; an assembly is an action that is part of a political struggle. Whether or not it is the most effective action, and whether or not this particular action is maximising effectiveness is open to debate, but you cannot arbitrarily deny that an assembly forms part of the political struggle, just because it has been called and hasn't spontaneously come into being.

Renton's blog post is interesting, but he seems to be (unfairly) foreseeing the attempted re-hash of some student-based, top-down SWP rip off party that, as he says, 'uses and exhausts' its members. And even if this is the mindset of the likes of Rees and German (which is where I suppose his inspiration for that 'list' of suspiciously SWP-like aims comes from), it doesn't mean that this will come to fruition, or that by attending/endorsing the assembly, we are endorsing this aim/end.

The indignados piece is all very nice, but again the situation there is different; the POUM/KKE and the anarchists have a morbid hatred for each other, and accusations of bureaucracy would flow from one towards the other no matter what the action (not that i'm defending the KKE; indeed the opposite, they have proven themselves thoroughly un-trustworthy and piggish in their actions for a long time). However, if this assembly can be large enough and can encompass enough groups, then it has the potential to be something far greater than just a SWP mk.II front.

I agree with you/Renton that if the assembly wants to push every representative of every group, and every individual, in attendance, towards creating a homogenous party-movement, then this should obviously be opposed. But if it actually manages to get a great many groups and workers in one place, and to agree on basic aims ('bring down this government and any government that imposes austerity'), then that will provide a start for proper political struggle that can go beyond crappy anti-austerity talk.

As I said previously, you can't jump from our current situation to demanding revolution (not that we can't maintain and uphold our revolutionary character in the meantime). Rather, we have to start/re-ignite the political struggle somewhere, else we will end up with crappy economic struggles every so often that achieve little but getting crumbs off the table.

I am interested though; if you oppose this assembly on the grounds that it isn't a struggle, then what sort of form would you suggest a political struggle takes in Britain?

[The Idler]

What's this about a march on October 26?
http://ianbone.wordpress.com/2013/03/27/oh-my-aching-sides-john-rees-fucks-up-bigtime/

[LeftEngels]

i decided to go out of mere curiosity as an american. the fact that you actually have really active unions is incredible to me.

you have to pay to attend a number of events like these in the US. it's just how it works. you guys invented capitalism, we stole your thunder and sold it back to you. i'm not going anywhere in particular with this comment :grin:

[The Idler]

I hope you're not flying from the US to attend the Peoples Assembly.

[GiantMonkeyMan]

To call the TUC active unions.... maybe coming to the People's Assembly will be an eye-opener for you.

[LeftEngels]

I hope you're not flying from the US to attend the Peoples Assembly.

ha, oh no, i'm there on vacation. it just happens to coincide with the summit. so i want to do SOMETHING. i'm still looking; i may not bother with this at all.

[LeftEngels]

To call the TUC active unions.... maybe coming to the People's Assembly will be an eye-opener for you.

maybe! in any case it's gotta be better than what we have here. right? at least in the UK you have actual, weeks-long strikes. for my job i don't know how many times i had to explain to customers they weren't getting their orders because Royal Mail was striking. that just doesn't happen here. and general strikes were made illegal in 1947.

[ed miliband]

Please let me know what crap is being peddled by speakers and supporters of:
BARAC
National Unemployed Workers Centres
Disabled People Against the Cuts
National Pensioners Convention Keep our NHS Public
CND
War on Want

Because they're all involved and all supporting it. Why are you so opposed to groups meeting on a national scale to coordinate activity? Are speakers who are involved in organising against the bedroom tax 'peddling crap' as well?

dpac aren't too happy with it:


While recognizing that there is a real need and desire for a movement which mobilizes activists , unions and communities onto the streets together, we are disappointed that the People’s Assembly looks unlikely to bring it about…
at least while it has an entry fee and a cursory nod to inclusion and accessibility.

Any attempt at bringing together all those sickened by this Governments shameful and harmful policies to fightback, should include those who have been fighting this fight in the streets, not just in the broadsheets. Those who have led the resistance have earned the right to be part of any movement worthy of the name.


An assembly of this nature can only work if it’s :
Brought about by a collective of workers, activists, communities together:
With a shared vision of what we are trying to achieve:
Working in an inclusive way:
Using every possible means at our disposal:
In a strategic attack on Governments ability to carry out its work,
And bring about its end.

Members attending will not be offered an opportunity to achieve any of these aims. Without grassroots street activists being part of driving this initiative from the outset, any decisions or outcomes are likely to be repeats of tried and tested failures of the past. Without the risk of radical action, the Government is unlikely to be concerned by another march, petition or one day strike.


DPAC/Black Triangle members will attend the event in an individual capacity to engage with attendees, and encourage others to join us in our call for sustained mass, widespread civil disobedience from every section of society until this Government falls.

DPAC SG
Johnny Void
Taxpayers against Poverty
Black Triangle
Beat on the Street

DPAC wishes to add that despite trying to feed in to ensure adequate access for the event we have not been listened to by the organizers.

http://dpac.uk.net/2013/06/dpac-position-statement-the-peoples-assembly/

[Blake's Baby]

London Anarchist Federation leaflet on the 'People's Assembly' (I don't think they'll mind me posting it even though I'm not a member):

FOR THE GENUINE ARTICLE- REAL PEOPLE’S ASSEMBLIES!

Over the last five years workers in the UK have experienced massive cuts in their wages and living standards. Many workers are experiencing pay freezes, many have seen both their hours and overtime cut. Many more have lost their job altogether, whilst relatively better paid jobs in the public sector have been replaced by “outsourcing”, privatised jobs with lower pay. At the same time inflation has outpaced average earnings. Overall wages are now less than they were in 2007 by £52 billion.

At the same time the social wage- pensions, the health service, etc. - are under attack like never before. A recent report gave the figure of 500,000 people now using food banks in the UK. The situation is obviously desperate. Eighty per cent of planned cuts have yet to be implemented and the situation will get a lot worse over the next few years.

A scenario for the future would see the Labour Party being elected in 2015, perhaps by a large majority. But what would this new Labour government do? The Labour Party has already said that it will continue with austerity packages and that they will not reverse cuts. It has questioned the whole idea of universal benefits. As Ed Balls, Labour’s Shadow Chancellor, recently said: “We will have to govern in a very different way and in circumstances very different to what we have known for many years. We will inherit a substantial deficit. We will have to govern with much less money around. We will need to show an iron discipline.” Miliband has made a pledge that he will install a three year benefit cap if re-elected. He has checked into the vicious anti- welfare claimant campaign, where those claiming benefits are seen as scroungers. As he said “Labour - the party of work - the clue is in the name. Our party was founded on the principles of work. We have always been against the denial of opportunity through the denial of work. And against the denial of responsibility by those who could work and aren’t doing so...This country needs to be a nation where people who can work, do work. Not a country where people who can work are on benefits.”

AN ALTERNATIVE

And if the Labour Party are ALREADY saying all of this, think what they will be like if re-elected! By then the debt crisis will have worsened, and Labour will use this as an excuse to push through more austerity measures, more cuts.

And yet here at Westminster Hall we have members of the Labour Party like Tony Benn and Owen Jones who will be pushing the illusion that somehow Labour can be pushed left, that workers should get involved in re-electing Labour, that it will somehow be better under a Labour government. This will undoubtedly be one of the key-notes at
today’s Assembly. But Labour Party leadership has the same ideas as the Blair and Brown governments, nothing will change.

Those people attending this Assembly today who are genuinely disgusted with the present state of affairs should have a long hard look at what is going on. Rather than be involved in a static event where a range of washed out Trotskyists, Left Labour celebrities, trade union bureaucrats and film makers yearning for a false “Golden Age” of Labour deliver a series of speeches at a set-piece event where there is little or no input from activists , they should consider another alternative.

They should take inspiration from the movements now sweeping the world, whether it be some of the events associated with the Arab Spring, whether it be Taksim Square, whether it be the series of actions by rank and file electricians here in Britain (despite attempts by trade union bureaucrats to sabotage their actions), the fight against Workfare by the recent occupation at Sussex University and the library occupation in Barnet.

This Assembly will be proposing another demonstration in October. But ask yourselves, did any of the previous A-B demos change anything? The million strong demo in 2003, did it stop the war? Did the huge demonstrations in March 2011 and October 2012 stop the cuts this Coalition government is continuing to push through? Did they hell! No, in all instances, government carried on as before.

What is needed is imaginative action at local and national level. This will mean blockades, occupations and other forms of direct action. It will mean campaigns and movements where decisions are not made by bureaucrats or celebrities but by the mass of people affected by this crisis of capitalism. It means an effective link up between workplace and neighbourhood, between, for example, workers in one industry or workplace on strike and other workers, students whether in school, further and higher education, pensioners, the unemployed. The same goes for people fighting cuts nationally or in a locality, maximum support needs to be striven for.  It means, as our friends at Thurrock Heckler say:

“ More people getting stuck into action, more experimenting and risk taking to see what does and doesn't work, more willingness for groups and individuals to be flexible to join together for actions as and when the need arises  and  above all more militancy and certainly more momentum. A continuous stream of a  diverse range of people  and taking action in a myriad  of  ways  that  will leave the authorities in a state of bewilderment is the key to building that momentum”.

Come and hear what the anarchists have to say, in the open air meeting outside today.

Printed and published by Anarchist Federation (London)

[The Idler]

Come and say hi to the SPGBers outside the meeting tomorrow too.

[Blake's Baby]

I'm gonna be at the ICC dayschool at Kings Cross instead - http://en.internationalism.org/forum/1056/alf/7391/come-day-discussion

Hoped I'd be able to say hi to some SPGBers there. If that's not gonna be possible, I'll say hi now.

Hi!

[The Idler]

An account of what happened outside here
http://www.worldsocialism.org/spgb/forum/events-and-announcements/peoples-assembly-london-900am-june-22nd?page=1#comment-6700