Revolutionary defeatism

[garrus]

The above is when a revolutionary group advocates the defeat / not victory of their country in a war , aiming towards the collapse of the current regime which they deem unsuitable , according to their ideology.

Kind of what the bolsheviks did in WW1.

What's your take on this?

My take is that it depends on the circumstances.For example such a strategy would be catastrophic from anti-stalinist soviets during barbarossa.You have to consider the opposing force and the results a defeat / occupation would entail.

Thanks.

[Clarion]

Revolutionary defeatism is based on opposition to class rule and the wars of the ruling class so I agree applying such a principle to a Stalinist regime makes no sense at all.

It all becomes somewhat more complicated when you consider what strategy revolutionaries should adopt in, say, the British state during the same war. Should revolutionaries have called for the defeat of their own ruling class and an end to imperialist war?

[subcp]

Example of revolutionary defeatism in the recent past- an excerpt from a statement by the anarcho-syndicalist union KRAS from Russia on the '2008 Caucasian War' (Georgia-Russia over Abkhazia and South Ossetia):



This fight does not bring to working people - Georgians, Ossetians, Abkhasians or Russians - anything, except for blood and tears, incalculable disasters and deprivation. We express our deep sympathy to the friends and relatives of the victims, to the people who have been left without a roof over their head and without any means of subsistence as a result of this war.
We shouldn't fall under the influence of nationalist demagogy which demands unity with ‘our' government, flying the flag of ‘defending the homeland'. The main enemy of the ordinary people is not their impoverished brothers and sisters on the other side of the border or of other nationalities. Their enemies are the rulers and bosses of all kinds, presidents and ministers, businessmen and generals, those who generate wars for the sake of multiplying power and riches. We call on the working people in Russia, the Ossetias, Abkhazia and Georgia to reject the bait of nationalism and patriotism and to turn the anger on rulers and the rich on both sides of the border.
Russian, Georgian, Ossetian and Abkhazian soldiers! Do not obey the orders of your commanders! Turn your weapons against those who sent you to war! Do not shoot the soldiers of your ‘opponents' - fraternise with them: a bayonet in the ground!
Working people in the rear! Sabotage military efforts, leave to go to meetings and demonstrations against the war, organise yourselves and strike against it!
No to the war and to its organizers - rulers and rich men! Yes to solidarity of working people across borders and the front lines!
Federation of Education, Science and Technical Workers, CRAS-IWA
(August 2008)


It's not about the regime necessarily, it is about trying to use war as a weapon in the class struggle (a means to spread communist propaganda and communist intervention in the class struggle) with the aim at destroying all states and classes; not just switching who is in control of the state apparatus.