Plurality discrimination

[Fnord]

We made this thread to gather opinions and experiences of the revolutionary left on the subject of Plurality, we feel this is very important and has been neglected at large by both the majority of the queer community and the revolutionary left who advocate and fight for liberation from gender roles.

The bare truth is that being plural/multiple in our society is still seen as a disorder, a psychiatric disorder which must be cured regardless of people's experience with it. This is nothing less than the utter bigotry at the hands of the psychiatric facilities, the state, and society at large experienced by the queer community through the mid to late 1900's.

People who are multiple are being commodified by elitist organizations of psychiatrists, just as being homosexual was in the past and using the media to enforce this. Not all people who are multiple have even been raped or abused, or violently switch personalities, destroy things, or are dangerous. The media has taken a small percentage of the multiple community through biased sampling and has created a stereotype.

As we speak, people who are multiple are often forcibly hospitalized and put on medication regardless if they need it or not, just for being multiple. They are stigmatized by the assumption and delusional fantasy, that by some act of fate, once being "cured" of their "plurality" from some an assumed trauma that may or not have happened for that individual that once this has taken place, the individuals making up that human will somehow integrate together. While it is possible to achieve a closer connection between individuals to think as one, one does not simply stop being multiple.

The origin of plurality is often different for many people, and for some it can be caused by sexual and physical abuse, but this does not mean it is that case for everyone. Even for those who are multiple from past abuse; it only serves to stigmatize those who have been raped, and punishes the victim instead of helping them live with who they want to be and are by forcing a diagnosis on them that they may or may not identify with.

We do have links to provide more information and experiences from those who are multiple, there is in fact several forums for people who are multiple. However, we cannot posts links currently because of our post count, if you have any questions, We'd be glad to answer them, as we are multiple ourselves.

Currently we face a dilemma though, in that we either stay closeted or we fully express our individuality and make it easier for us to communicate instead of wearing a mask, which frankly feels terrible, confining, and it hurts. We made this thread both to raise awareness and to find out how accepting the atmosphere of revleft is in this aspect before we out ourselves completely here.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

People who are multiple are being commodified by elitist organizations of psychiatrists, just as being homosexual was in the past and using the media to enforce this.
This is still being done to trans people, as has recently been debated in another thread here.

In general, I'm sympathetic to people who reject being pathologized by the psychiatric industry.

[Landsharks eat metal]

I need to learn more about it I think... from quality sources. The only thing I know about it right now is some people on Tumblr who just go on about how special it makes them... which I know is not exclusive to plurality. It happens a lot in the Tumblr trans community as well, like the people who say they're trans because they enjoy wearing clothes normally worn by the opposite sex.

The biggest problem I have with plurality right now is that some of the cases of what I have seen described as "naturally occurring multiplicity" seems appropriative of people who suffer from trauma-induced plurality/DID (sorry for the psychiatric language...) Like the people who say that multiplicity is a shitload of fun and they just have these cool TV characters in their head or whatever. People with diagnosable Dissociative Identity Disorder aren't aware of their other "personalities" [I know, once again, not the best word]. I hate to bring it back to the trans thing again, but it's like people who say they're excited about being trans. I'm always really suspicious of them. Being trans is not fun at all. It doesn't make me special. It just pisses me off that I don't think I'll ever be able to feel comfortable in my own body.

That's just my, admittedly very limited, experiences. I'm open to learning more.

[Fnord]

I need to learn more about it I think... from quality sources. The only thing I know about it right now is some people on Tumblr who just go on about how special it makes them... which I know is not exclusive to plurality. It happens a lot in the Tumblr trans community as well, like the people who say they're trans because they enjoy wearing clothes normally worn by the opposite sex.

The biggest problem I have with plurality right now is that some of the cases of what I have seen described as "naturally occurring multiplicity" seems appropriative of people who suffer from trauma-induced plurality/DID (sorry for the psychiatric language...) Like the people who say that multiplicity is a shitload of fun and they just have these cool TV characters in their head or whatever. People with diagnosable Dissociative Identity Disorder aren't aware of their other "personalities" [I know, once again, not the best word]. I hate to bring it back to the trans thing again, but it's like people who say they're excited about being trans. I'm always really suspicious of them. Being trans is not fun at all. It doesn't make me special. It just pisses me off that I don't think I'll ever be able to feel comfortable in my own body.

That's just my, admittedly very limited, experiences. I'm open to learning more.

There are some links that may be helpful, we're not sure if they will show up though.
(it seems they did not, I just need one more post so I post them in the next one)

Being plural doesn't make you anymore special than someone who is left-handed, etc. But this doesn't mean that all multiples automatically are happy about being multiple, people who are publicly multiple are often stigmatized and there is unfortunately a large number of people who would judge them for being multiple. There are however those lucky enough to have accepting friends, for me personally, I don't think that being multiple should automatically be a problem for the people, societal relations just make it that way.

As for the second paragraph, multiples not being aware of each other is not necessarily exclusive to those with DID, as there are some multiples with less connection between individuals with or without having past trauma naturally. I have heard from other multiples as well that for some the connection between the individuals could deteriorate with age, but this is likely a consequence of age-related memory loss between the shared memory of individuals and is not universal for all. Some things apply to some and others do not, I only know three other people personally well enough, all of them do not seem to think themselves as "special", but this does not mean there are not those who do think they are "special", there will always be those types of people regardless of the movement, group, or identity.

[Fnord]

http://www.whatisgender.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=166&t=4030
http://www.karitas.net/blackbirds/layman/whatis.html
http://www.astraeasweb.net/plural/faq.html

The first one is a collection of links of plurality collected by people who are multiple, the second one is a useful site with information contributed by multiples in an educational format on the subject. The third link is similar to the second but provides much more information, it appears to have been written by a multiple, We'd advice researching more into the subject also, so you get more of a full picture instead of a single site, as not all things apply to all multiples.

[Sean]

You do not have five different personalities and you are a damn liar.

From the way you're trying to wrap this up no one is allowed to call you out on this or its the exact same thing as homophobia, transphobia and racism. Good job on exploiting people with mental disorders and those who face genuine discrimination to try and burrow your way in to a hidey hole where everyone has to pretend to entertain this baloney.

You owe every single person you have talked to as one of your characters a goddamn apology you selfish, embarrassing idiot.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

You do not have five different personalities and you are a damn liar.
What's your basis for making those claims?

[Sean]

What's your basis for making those claims?
Just to save the next twenty questions and answers on this line:
I'm not playing "you can't prove/disprove anything I say", assume you won and caught me out on both being unnecessarily antagonistic to people who suffer from mental disorders and proved that my faulty line of disagreement indeed was a slippery slope meaning I do not accept/embrace gender identity either by extension of not believing everything anyone has ever said.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Just to save the next twenty questions and answers on this line:
I'm not playing "you can't prove/disprove anything I say", assume you won and caught me out on both being unnecessarily antagonistic to people who suffer from mental disorders and proved that my faulty line of disagreement indeed was a slippery slope meaning I do not accept/embrace gender identity either by extension of not believing everything anyone has ever said.
Um, what? :confused:

[Fnord]

You do not have five different personalities and you are a damn liar.

From the way you're trying to wrap this up no one is allowed to call you out on this or its the exact same thing as homophobia, transphobia and racism. Good job on exploiting people with mental disorders and those who face genuine discrimination to try and burrow your way in to a hidey hole where everyone has to pretend to entertain this baloney.

You owe every single person you have talked to as one of your characters a goddamn apology you selfish, embarrassing idiot.

Eric:It's difficult to take this seriously when your clearly flaming without any reasons, experiences, or even opinions to back this up. We never said that we had DID or five personalities, as we don't consider ourselves personalities, we feel and think just as any other person would, as individuals. I can explain anything you want if your skeptical, being skeptical is completely fine and dandy but pointless flaming without anything to add only detracts from the thread.
We will not apologize for being true to ourselves, I was the one who wanted to become more politically involved in the first place, so I refuse to back away silently into the closet just because you do not acknowledge us for who we are.


Just to save the next twenty questions and answers on this line:
I'm not playing "you can't prove/disprove anything I say", assume you won and caught me out on both being unnecessarily antagonistic to people who suffer from mental disorders and proved that my faulty line of disagreement indeed was a slippery slope meaning I do not accept/embrace gender identity either by extension of not believing everything anyone has ever said.

Eric: I am not alone in that other people in this thread including us had some trouble deciphering what exactly you meant by this.. I could be wrong but I think basically your saying that you believe your right and I'm wrong, but if you are actually wrong then you think people would catch you as a bigot because you believe everything everyone in the world ever existing says is contradictory to what you believe, that being acceptance of all gender identities..?
I'm not sure if I'm interpreting this right, because the way I'm hearing it sounds exaggerated, I don't think everyone in the world accepts all gender identities, this is easily shown if you walk out of your house to any local republican conference, your local church, etc. or even many people walking by the street.
If you have any questions or reasoning, you can ask me, but you seem to be skirting the issue so if you feel more comfortable, you can ask around here, there are a few multiples there and I'm sure they would be glad to answer if you were asked politely.
http://www.whatisgender.net/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=166&sid=774f6955e196b502322825504a02da18

[Tenka]

The linked section of that forum (http://www.whatisgender.net/phpBB3/viewforum.php?f=166&sid=774f6955e196b502322825504a02da18) appears full of awful roleplaying, and bordering on the phenomenon of "Otherkin". This is my honest opinion after extensive perusal. I do not believe that transgender identity has anything in common with DID or having multiple "personalities" (in some cases potentially being an aspiring writer hoping in vain that roleplaying different people will aid one's ailing fiction...), though they may of course occur together.

Isn't it interesting how alters never come from outside of the cultural background/experiences of the main body/person? I do not believe that alters are real people, and I simply disagree with whoever calls this discrimination.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Isn't it interesting how alters never come from outside of the cultural background/experiences of the main body/person?
Actually, that's what I would expect to see, because the alters experience the world through the same physical body, which means they come from the same cultural background that the body experiences.

[Tenka]

Actually, that's what I would expect to see, because the alters experience the world through the same physical body, which means they come from the same cultural background that the body experiences.

Yes, because they are the same person. What else would they be? Someone on that forum has even said they'd been "integrated" for a long time now, which I suppose means they got better, or stopped roleplaying, or stopped talking to a particular therapist for a while, depending on how the alters were developed.

Sean's last post was not well-constructed, but the gist seems to be that they'd rather not play what they see--possibly with good reason--as a sort of game wherein non-acceptance of people's "alters" is equated with non-acceptance of transgender identity and queerness. Would appreciate some correction or clarification from Sean on this point, if they can be arsed.

[Kenco Smooth]

Actually, that's what I would expect to see, because the alters experience the world through the same physical body, which means they come from the same cultural background that the body experiences.

They also share 100% of their genetic code yet don't seem to obey the well validated link between personality and genetics. If the condition makes sense at all there's no need for cultural expression to be consistent.

[Sean]

Eric:It's difficult to take this seriously...
Oh right, you formatted your text differently so this is one of your characters. I'll take this seriously.

Sean's last post was not well-constructed, but the gist seems to be that they'd rather not play what they see--possibly with good reason--as a sort of game wherein non-acceptance of people's "alters" is equated with non-acceptance of transgender identity and queerness. Would appreciate some correction or clarification from Sean on this point, if they can be arsed.
That was exactly what I was saying and should have taken the time to write it out properly. I was tired, sorry.

The whole notion of Pretend Internet Multiple Personality Disorder is embarrassing to read and a massive insult to other people's intelligence. I'm cringing at myself for ever even engaging with this level of stupid. But I honestly don't think that pretending to have multiple personalities -and again, they are pretend, absolutely no one over the age of 16 believes you - is even half as fucked in the head as attempting to equate it with discrimination just so that you can roleplay long through adulthood.

[Fnord]

Alex: First of all Sean, stop sending me hate messages in our inbox, your awfully hypocritical to call us embarrassing when your the one who has to harass people in private on the internet. Get your facts straight, Eric is the only one that even writes shit anymore, you would have known that if you just asked me. In the previous post discrimination was referring to the fact that there is a stigma associated with those diagnosed as DID, whether they accept the diagnosis or not they are often seen as dangerous and involuntarily hospitalized just for the fact that they have DID, regardless if they need it or not. The fact that they have DID can be used against them in court cases and lead to them being taken advantage of.
I did experience trauma many times in my life, as I was sexually and physically abused as well as beaten for a large portion of my childhood, but despite that we have all existed for as long as we can remember, we've always had a 'joint memory' so to speak, in that we can share information easily. We function just fine without the diagnosis of DID and carrying that diagnosis would carry stigma so we feel it's irrelevant if we have DID or not, the point is, is that regardless we are here so we are going to make the best of it, diagnosis or not. I do not go around sharing this information with anyone, usually I am very introverted, but it took alot of courage to go here and share this information, regardless of the outcome.
I expect you to reasonably analyze what I say and make a rational opinion on this founded on reason, not simply flame our inbox. You have not shown this, you have only shown that you are genuinely upset at us for something we can't change, which you think we can, but since we can't you only get more upset. Do your own research and use it.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

I'm curious - how does one distinguish between genuine plurality and sophisticated play-acting?


They also share 100% of their genetic code yet don't seem to obey the well validated link between personality and genetics. If the condition makes sense at all there's no need for cultural expression to be consistent.

What well-validated link between personality and genetics? If you are talking about the fact that conditions such as schizophrenia (which is not the same thing as MPD/DID) appear have a strong genetic component (which is to say, if your relatives have it, that increases the chances of you having it), then that is fine as far as it goes, but to extend that to all the facets of human personality is a step too far. Several steps, in fact.

[Decolonize The Left]

We made this thread to gather opinions and experiences of the revolutionary left on the subject of Plurality, we feel this is very important and has been neglected at large by both the majority of the queer community and the revolutionary left who advocate and fight for liberation from gender roles.

The bare truth is that being plural/multiple in our society is still seen as a disorder, a psychiatric disorder which must be cured regardless of people's experience with it. This is nothing less than the utter bigotry at the hands of the psychiatric facilities, the state, and society at large experienced by the queer community through the mid to late 1900's.

People who are multiple are being commodified by elitist organizations of psychiatrists, just as being homosexual was in the past and using the media to enforce this. Not all people who are multiple have even been raped or abused, or violently switch personalities, destroy things, or are dangerous. The media has taken a small percentage of the multiple community through biased sampling and has created a stereotype.

As we speak, people who are multiple are often forcibly hospitalized and put on medication regardless if they need it or not, just for being multiple. They are stigmatized by the assumption and delusional fantasy, that by some act of fate, once being "cured" of their "plurality" from some an assumed trauma that may or not have happened for that individual that once this has taken place, the individuals making up that human will somehow integrate together. While it is possible to achieve a closer connection between individuals to think as one, one does not simply stop being multiple.

The origin of plurality is often different for many people, and for some it can be caused by sexual and physical abuse, but this does not mean it is that case for everyone. Even for those who are multiple from past abuse; it only serves to stigmatize those who have been raped, and punishes the victim instead of helping them live with who they want to be and are by forcing a diagnosis on them that they may or may not identify with.

We do have links to provide more information and experiences from those who are multiple, there is in fact several forums for people who are multiple. However, we cannot posts links currently because of our post count, if you have any questions, We'd be glad to answer them, as we are multiple ourselves.

Currently we face a dilemma though, in that we either stay closeted or we fully express our individuality and make it easier for us to communicate instead of wearing a mask, which frankly feels terrible, confining, and it hurts. We made this thread both to raise awareness and to find out how accepting the atmosphere of revleft is in this aspect before we out ourselves completely here.

Look Fnord, you can be whoever you want to be. And if that means you want to be 5 different people, then go for it. I, personally, don't care so long as you are content and happy.

But that said, I too am interested in your response to ÑóẊîöʼn's question:

I'm curious - how does one distinguish between genuine plurality and sophisticated play-acting?

And I also would like to know what you gain from maintaining these different personalities (forgive me if that's the wrong word) - would it not be easier to simplify?

[Kenco Smooth]

What well-validated link between personality and genetics? If you are talking about the fact that conditions such as schizophrenia (which is not the same thing as MPD/DID) appear have a strong genetic component (which is to say, if your relatives have it, that increases the chances of you having it), then that is fine as far as it goes, but to extend that to all the facets of human personality is a step too far. Several steps, in fact.

Specifically between well constructed trait measures (the five factor model is pretty much dominant nowadays). Such factors provide a wide range of valid predictions for behavioral and cognitive behaviours and the genetic component like I said is well established. See the opening section of the paper below before it moves into specific discussion of molecular genetics.

http://www.nature.com/mp/journal/v8/n10/pdf/4001367a.pdf

[Fnord]

I'm curious - how does one distinguish between genuine plurality and sophisticated play-acting?



What well-validated link between personality and genetics? If you are talking about the fact that conditions such as schizophrenia (which is not the same thing as MPD/DID) appear have a strong genetic component (which is to say, if your relatives have it, that increases the chances of you having it), then that is fine as far as it goes, but to extend that to all the facets of human personality is a step too far. Several steps, in fact.

Eric:The problem in deciphering whether it is genuine plurality or play-acting is a dilemma, there is little reliable information as it is still early on in understanding how plurality occurs, although many have theories that lack testing. We have been put back significantly by hoaxes in recent years. There are certified tests to be used as a screening test for those who may have DID, although not all symptoms experienced by multiples with DID are experienced by multiples without it, it is not 100% reliable though and requires further examination.

http://counsellingresource.com/lib/quizzes/misc-tests/des/ -the screening test itself.

http://www.ask.com/wiki/Dissociative_Experiences_Scale?qsrc=3044 -information on the screening test

The question of how do we know for sure though, is similar but different in several ways to sexuality and gender identity, in that besides the possibility of tests which may not include all identities, the individual's acceptance of their identity in whatever form that may be and that they feel comfortable with it, would ideally be proof enough that, that person is telling the truth. There will always be people who use labels for their benefit even if they do not identify with it regardless of the label itself, whether it be for "play-acting" or for other purposes.



But that said, I too am interested in your response to ÑóẊîöʼn's question:

And I also would like to know what you gain from maintaining these different personalities (forgive me if that's the wrong word) - would it not be easier to simplify?

Eric: It would only serve to simplify things for other people to have us integrate, we all have different dreams, goals, emotions and ideas and if we all integrated, we would lose aspects of ourselves that we need while we exist here. So we all have a reason to continue living, we are capable of functioning just as well as anyone else so there is no need to integrate for this reason for us personally. To forcibly conform is to give up, we cannot do this, not until we die and there are some important things we have to do before that happens someday.

[Tenka]

http://counsellingresource.com/lib/quizzes/misc-tests/des/ -the screening test itself.

http://www.ask.com/wiki/Dissociative_Experiences_Scale?qsrc=3044 -information on the screening test


I advise everyone with some free time on their hands to take the above-linked internet quiz, and answer honestly. Here are my results:


These Are Your Dissociative Experiences Scale Test Results
By CounsellingResource Research Staff
Dissociative Experiences Scale Test Results: the results of this psychological quiz are described below. Please be sure to check “Disclaimer: Limitations of Psychological Self-Tests” and “Psychological Self-Tests and Your Privacy”.

Return to Take this Quiz Again
Dissociative Experiences Scale Test Answers

Total score of: 54
(30 or Above, Higher Association With DID)
Your answers to this Dissociative Identity Disorder screening test fall into the range with a higher association with DID. (Please see below for more specific information on what your score on this screening test may mean.)

If you would like to take this psychological screening test again in the main CounsellingResource.com quizzes section, just click “Dissociative Experiences Scale”. Alternatively, please read on below for additional information on how this test was scored, for notes on limitations of this and other such quizzes, and for links to other related resources.

Additional Information About Scoring and Validity

Full details about how this dissociation screening test is scored, together with additional information and caveats about validity, are included on the main quiz page: “Dissociative Experiences Scale”.

Important Note About Psychological Screening Tests

Always consult with a trained mental health professional if you are experiencing depressive feelings and/or difficulties in your daily functioning that cause you anxiety or worry.

This test is meant to be used as a starting point, not as a diagnosis tool. This score is not intended as a mental disorder diagnosis, or as any type of healthcare recommendation.

Many of the questions are related to short-term memory, which is quite strained for most people in today's civilisation, so it would not be surprising if a significant proportion of people fell into a "range with a higher association with DID". I do not have these things called "alters", btw, and I do not appreciate "alters" trying to be given the same recognition as transgender people's identities and such. Next thing you know, Fursonas will try to get in on the action. I can't help suspecting that this would be an effective way to troll revleft's inner bleeding heart liberal.

[khad]

I sampled that test and it's almost entirely contingent on short term memory.

Give yourself a concussion. Congrats, you're multi!

[Decolonize The Left]

Total score of: 10



Came out as I thought it might. That said, the questions seemed a little simplistic to me...

[Quail]

I got a score of 48. I think that most of those questions are very vague and could apply to anyone, really. I experience some I guess trauma-related dissociative symptoms, and also when I'm feeling very anxious, so perhaps that skewed my result, but it doesn't seem like a very accurate screening test to me because I reckon pretty much everyone would end up in the higher risk category for DID.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

I have some experience with DID, having two family members who were diagnosed with it before being "integrated."

[DancingEmma]

I don't know enough about this to say the reasons why people report having multiple personalities. In any event, I don't support the involuntary psychiatric treatment of any person for any reason. No one should have to be in a hospital, or on a drug, or in counseling unless they want to be, regardless of what mental illnesses they may or may not have. Finally, I have no problem with referring to someone in the terms that person prefers for themselves, unless their self-identification is racist or sexist or something. I call people out for inaccurate things they say about me or about the world, but when they're talking about themselves I figure they are the expert.

[TheRedAnarchist23]

He who does not say he agrees completely is not anarchist.

[Sean]

He who does not say he agrees completely is not anarchist.

You can put on a bible thumping voice for your no true Scotsman comment if you want. I'm not really sure how role-playing and embracing every new internet subculture qualifies or disqualifies a person's politics.

[Forward Union]

It seems to me that you have confused the issue.

The key difference between this form of "discrimination" and say, the fact that homosexuals used to (and often still are in some parts of the world) put into psychiatric care is that the latter is completely harmless to all people involved if you remove the legal and social consequences created by other humans. While Dissociative Identity Disorder can be a crippling mental issue which leaves the sufferer completely unable to function in life, to work, persue interests or build relationships.

Now. The real issue is, and the question you should have asked, is whether or not people with this disorder who deny help, should be forced to receive it. As they can be a danger to other people as well, I'd say yes. But they must absolutely not be treated as lesser people, or be discriminated against.

The implications of anything else are absurd, would they get more than one vote? could the individual hold multiple positions of authority? Escape crimes such as murder? Adding to the fact that the brain damage in such a disorder is physically visible .. I don't think you could build a successful claim of discrimination akin to that suffered by Ethnic minorities or Homosexuals - let alone win.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Now. The real issue is, and the question you should have asked, is whether or not people with this disorder who deny help, should be forced to receive it. As they can be a danger to other people as well, I'd say yes. But they must absolutely not be treated as lesser people, or be discriminated against.

What evidence do you have that people with DID necessarily present a danger to others? Would this not also apply to people with sociopathic tendencies? What is the seperation between "can be an arsehole and/or difficult to deal with" and "danger to others who must be treated, possibly against their will"?


The implications of anything else are absurd, would they get more than one vote? could the individual hold multiple positions of authority? Escape crimes such as murder?

What's absurd? With voting, there's one body, so they get one vote. It's not that unusual for people with only one personality to have more than one job. As for murder, the personalities can't hop bodies, so I don't see how it could be used to escape charges.


Adding to the fact that the brain damage in such a disorder is physically visible ..

Really? Because my understanding is that there are no consistent neurophysical symptoms associated with DID.


I don't think you could build a successful claim of discrimination akin to that suffered by Ethnic minorities or Homosexuals - let alone win.

Perhaps not, but maybe the point is more about where society draws the line between divergence and pathology. If such a line can even be drawn.

[Thelonious]

http://counsellingresource.com/lib/quizzes/misc-tests/des/ -the screening test itself.


I got a 5.

[Firebrand]

Interesting arguments. I personally think no-one should ever be forced on to any kind of medication, especially not mind or personality altering medication (that's why I won't take ritalin). I think compulsory detainment should only be applied when people pose a threat to the safety of others around them, (e.g. running around with an axe trying to kill people with blue socks), or possibly for suicide watch purposes. Aside from that I don't see why anyone should be hospitalised or medicated for something they don't see as a problem. TBH most of this stuff is really no-one elses business.

[Fnord]

Eric: I apologize if I was not able to respond to everyone's questions for the past 3-5 days, Peace and Alex didn't feel up to it and usually they do not enjoy answering questions concretely when not in the mood.
I agree, the questions are rather basic, as I said before, they are unreliable when used on it's own, it's a screening test, not a diagnosis tool, only 17% of those with scores over 30 actually have DID, because it requires further examination.
Personally, when I took the test I had a score of 68, but I don't feel DID would apply to me because I do not have what they call "inter-personality amnesia" significantly beyond frequent daydreaming, spacing out and frequent forgetfulness currently as when one of us is "fronting", the others are in the background watching. As a completely personal matter for me also, I'd rather not medicalize my plurality, which doesn't mean others can't if they need help with it, it's just a matter of a different paradigm in how I view myself but that's more personal and not as relevant to discussing plurality on a wider scale.


I do not have these things called "alters", btw, and I do not appreciate "alters" trying to be given the same recognition as transgender people's identities and such. Next thing you know, Fursonas will try to get in on the action. I can't help suspecting that this would be an effective way to troll revleft's inner bleeding heart liberal.

Eric:I fail to see how people in general having the freedom to not be forced into medical treatment when they are not a harm to themselves or others because of an identity or condition and being treated like everyone else would somehow be trolling revleft. It doesn't matter what it is that people identify with, if they prove that they are that identity, feel comfortable with it, follow through with it and it's not racist, sexist, or homophobic, etc, then they should be given the same respect as everyone else, regardless of identity or not. This is freedom from discrimination and should be fought for as a revolutionary leftist.


It seems to me that you have confused the issue.

The key difference between this form of "discrimination" and say, the fact that homosexuals used to (and often still are in some parts of the world) put into psychiatric care is that the latter is completely harmless to all people involved if you remove the legal and social consequences created by other humans. While Dissociative Identity Disorder can be a crippling mental issue which leaves the sufferer completely unable to function in life, to work, persue interests or build relationships.

Now. The real issue is, and the question you should have asked, is whether or not people with this disorder who deny help, should be forced to receive it. As they can be a danger to other people as well, I'd say yes. But they must absolutely not be treated as lesser people, or be discriminated against.

Eric:: The problem with this is that it does not account for those with DID with no history of violence and no suggestion that those people may harm someone. It doesn't matter if you have a condition or not, everyone deserves the right not to be pathologized against their will if they do not pose an endangerment to others or themselves.



The implications of anything else are absurd, would they get more than one vote? could the individual hold multiple positions of authority? Escape crimes such as murder? Adding to the fact that the brain damage in such a disorder is physically visible .. I don't think you could build a successful claim of discrimination akin to that suffered by Ethnic minorities or Homosexuals - let alone win.

Eric: ÑóẊîöʼn makes a clear and simple explanation of this and covers the point I was going for well. So I'll simply reverberate it for now, I'm curious about your counter for this Foward Union, would you still feel it is absurd for people who are plural to have freedom from discrimination and rights as everyone else, if they did not have the ability to escape charges because they share the same body, one vote per body and had the right to have multiple jobs just as everyone else?