Gun Control

[Jason]

How do you all feel about gun control, in light of the tragedy in CT. Could other factors be at play in creating dangerous minds besides guns?

[Blake's Baby]

Well, yeah, obviously.

For someone to go on a gun-rampage, they need two things, motive and oportunity. Ease of access to guns only factors into one of those. People still have to think it's good idea.

[Sheepy]

The capitalist governments of the world rely on manipulation of resources and utilities in the name of capital, whether they are for or against it. Whether it's marijuana or guns, there's always another reason for it, and the excuses you hear on TV are obvious lies.

The U.K bans firearms nationwide, with the only exception are for farmers, and their choice is limited already. The ban is in place mainly because of the amount of anti-monarchy dissidents that live in the country. This doesn't mean that the U.K is without gun violence however, as criminals will always be able to get their hands on one, but for the U.K's part they're only used for smaller crimes. Since the Queen and her enterprises are not in danger, and the British Police State being as vigilant as it is, they're not considered a threat.

The U.S on the other hand is the total opposite. Gun sales are profitable and the government, bourgeoisie, and the media make sure to alienate the population in order to defend their sales. Arms companies, like Bushmaster for example, make a lot of money from selling assault rifles to civilians. The right to bare arms is a constitutional right, and since the constitution is "always right", there be no one dare to take away a constitutional right. Plus right-wing media and their puppet politicians of choice will fear monger the lumpens that "the government is gonna take away yer gunz" which will make people paranoid and as records show: Buy more guns. Now while all these shootings are happening, and the Liberal and Conservative puppets are arguing on your television, nothing generally happens and gun sales continue to go up.

For a real solution is not to ban nor deregulate fire arms, but to ensure a tool required of utmost responsibility is removed from the hands of the capitalists and nationalize all weapons for the sake of a people's militia. the misuse of weapons in 21st century USA comes from the romanticizing and trivializing weapons by the media. People don't properly train and qualify for their weapons, but instead just flat out buy them. Of course there are states that make you go through courts, but this is just capitalist bureaucracy looking for more money. Nations like Switzerland provides a militia in which any citizen, mentally and physically capable at the age of 18, can be trained to properly operate a rifle and safety, to which they will receive their own rifle to keep in the safety of their own homes. This is efficient because the weapons, while not generally owned by the people, are stilled nationalized to an extent. Their weapons are still made by corporations of course, but they're not so easily bought.

With a people's militia, we could nationalize our rifles, put them in common, and through qualification and education, we can ensure not just the safety of our people from outside hostilities but those within our borders as well with safety and effectiveness. This is how it worked in many socialist revolutions and has proven to work. The capitalists do not care for the people's well being, therefore why violence can escalate whether weapons are banned or unregulated through their would be omnipotent hands.

[Luís Henrique]

The U.K bans firearms nationwide, with the only exception are for farmers, and their choice is limited already. The ban is in place mainly because of the amount of anti-monarchy dissidents that live in the country.

Do you really believe this?

Luís Henrique

[Sheepy]

The British population are pretty anti-Monarchy as it is, so it only makes sense that the Royal Family be paranoid.

[Jason]

The British population are pretty anti-Monarchy as it is, so it only makes sense that the Royal Family be paranoid.

So I take it that most revolutionaries are more "open minded" toward owning guns than other lefties.

[ed miliband]

The British population are pretty anti-Monarchy as it is, so it only makes sense that the Royal Family be paranoid.

haha, no they aren't.

[Jason]

haha, no they aren't.

How so?

[Blake's Baby]

The British population are pretty anti-Monarchy as it is, so it only makes sense that the Royal Family be paranoid.

I'm sorry, if you believe this you have no knowledge of social attitudes in the UK.


How so?

What does the question mean? 'How so are the British population not anti-monarchy?' Errm, in the fact that the majority of people in the UK aren't anti-monarchy.

[JPSartre12]

How do you all feel about gun control

Generally speaking, I'm opposed to it, because I would rather have the working class be armed when it comes time for the revolution.

That being said, it's all well and good to be a purist and protect gun rights for that reason, but will arming the working class actually do much? The State has police brigades, drones, missiles, etc. The right to own a gun seems to pale in response to what an armed working class would face if it was revolting.

[FL_Guerrilla]

Gun Control to defend others is like shooting yourself in the foot to kill a spider on it. In the end you should have just left it alone.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

I'm opposed to gun control for the simple fact that there's no good reason why responsible adults should not have access to firearms. It's an extension of the principle of "all that is not forbidden is permitted" as opposed to "all that is not permitted is forbidden".

Incidents like school shootings grab the headlines, but to argue that firearms should be taken from individual hands on that basis is to ignore the fact that overall violent crime has been decreasing since the mid-80s, and also contains the implicit assumption that individual firearms possession is more dangerous than the possession of firearms by cops, soldiers and mercs. Which I think is ridiculous.

[Luís Henrique]

The British population are pretty anti-Monarchy as it is, so it only makes sense that the Royal Family be paranoid.

The Royal Familiy can be paranoid all they want, but this has zero impact on legislation. Indeed, the Royal Family is irrelevant to British government and legislation. Britain is governed by a prime-minister and his/her cabinet, responsible towards the Parliament. If the British population actually opposed monarchy, they would vote republican Members of Parliament, and monarchy would be gone before they could say "God Save The Queen".

Luís Henrique

[Cyclone1776]

I'm am opposed to gun control. In my honest opinion, I think banning concealment is kinda contributing to the increase in gun violence.

[milkmiku]

reminder, that all the gun control in the world will not stop those with the convection and will to do what they will. Such as our friend Anders Behring Breivik, who lived in a place with very strict gun regulations don't even bring up "getting rid of guns!", you're fucking insane if you think the US goverment can gather up even half of the four-hundred million guns in America.

I'm all for better regulation, such as back ground checks for ALL firearm buys, but banning "assault" weapons is too far, because the policy makes don't have a fucking clue what the fuck they are talking about. "shoulder things that goes up, ak47, assault weapons, pistol grips make you aim better from da hip, automatic weapons ect ect"

For fucks sake, people have not called semi-auto guns "automatics" since the fucking 50s.

Isn't immediately calling for action with out retrospective and critical analyses reactionary?

[Yet_Another_Boring_Marxist]

I'm opposed to gun control because where the hell do you think FARC gets their guns from?

[TheGodlessUtopian]

“Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary.”
- Karl Marx, March, 1850 (http://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/communist-league/1850-ad1.htm)
I am opposed to gun control in every sense of the word; the working class must be armed otherwise expect counterrevolutionaries to win the day. Many seem to forget that the proletariat must be able to defend themselves against bourgeois assault, fascist gangs, and general disorder. Either this or they idealistically believe that come the revolution the working class will, despite bans, be able to magically lay their hands on weapons (such as some comrades on Facebook tout). This is not the case: if there are no weapons they are no weapons. Then there is the divide between those obtained illegally and legally in that those counterrevolutionaries will not follow procedure anyway, while the majority of the working class will, thus placing the "law abiding" segment at a significant disadvantage.

Comrades bring up tragedies like the recent school shooting as ammunition for their reactionary beliefs concerning this topic yet overlook both the mental health equation as well as the overreaching goal of revolutionaries. It is as though comrades forget that nothing good can possibly come from the bourgeois state disarming the working class.

Building on this I am equally puzzled as to why Leftists who argue against any kind of transitional state support this position. Do they believe that the working class will be able to overthrow the ruling class peacefully, establish communism in a sea of hostility, and defend their gains through non-violent means while counterrevolutionary armies seek to demolish communist social-relations and restore capitalism? It seems to me that comrades are literally drowning in their strange concoction of ultra-leftism and revisionism.

In short: there is no reason why any revolutionary should support any kind of restriction on guns. An article from return to the source I found interesting...

http://return2source.wordpress.com/2012/12/19/three-positions-on-gun-control/

My thoughts on the matter anyway. Since I am burnt out on this topic I will not argue with comrades who put forth different views.

[Luís Henrique]

I'm opposed to gun control because where the hell do you think FARC gets their guns from?

I don't know, if I did know I wouldn't tell, but I'm pretty sure it isn't at Wal Mart.

Luís Henrique

[p0is0n]

I must agree with TheGodlessUtopian wholeheartedly. Whilst I do not believe that our currently legal semi-automatic AR15s or WASRs are ultimately going to win an eventual battle on a large scale, I think that communists should defend gun rights direly. And I feel it is absolute lunacy for any communist to willingly give the state, which as Marxists we recognize is a bourgeois institution of class rule, the monopoly on firearms.

They have not been afraid to use firearms on us before, and it is highly unlikely they will ever be afraid to, when necessary, do so again.

[blake 3:17]

Death to all guns

Is it time? Can we just say it outright? Let’s try it:

Guns are, socially and ethically, devastating. Worthless. They add nothing of positive, intrinsic value to a culture, a people, a country. They only diminish, destroy, display an awesome sense of malformed ego and disastrously warped humanity.

Too much? Too far? Not really. I’m sure you already sense that all those cartoonish action movies, thuggish hip-hop songs, clunky old westerns, ultra-violent video games and the racks of high-caliber weaponry over at Cabela sporting goods and the local gun show – all of which we’ve been led to believe are so essential to our national identity – none of them offer anything of deep worth to the culture; no authentic masculinity, no real patriotism, no genuine power or strength or class. Heart, soul or integrity? Don’t be absurd.

It’s all a vulgar illusion, Hollywood glitter-bombing, manufactured mythology in service of shameless capitalism and a false, bloody American ideology that’s never served us well and only made us the ugly, violence-drunk stepchild of the civilized world. Don’t you already know?

Here is the truth: Guns are pain. Guns are impotence masquerading as virility, shame masquerading as valor, the devil disguised as an outrageously misinterpreted chunk of the Constitution that was never meant to suffer what the fat lords of the gun lobbies have made it suffer.

Do you wish to speak of false gods? Things virulently anti-Christian? The antithesis of everything a peaceful, advanced country is ideally supposed to be founded on? Because guns are all that and more. Jesus would be disgusted.

Perhaps you think guns and the current cluster of feeble laws on the books are generally fine, and it’s the mental health industry that needs the help? Perhaps you think Sandy Hook, Aurora, Colorado, Virginia Tech, et al could be better prevented by improved treatment for the mentally ill?

Maybe. But a culture of gun fanaticism feeds insanity. Put the other way: insanity loves guns. They are interlinked and inextricable. Too-easy access to guns is a huge part of the problem, but even bigger is the gun fetishism so brutally interwoven into our society and popular culture, from childhood on up, that provides the hateful lie that guns aren’t just macho and all-American, they’re downright required for ensuring your sadism is remembered forever.

Sandy Hook isn’t just about mental illness. It’s about mental illness shot through with endless images of ultra-violence and 300 million guns currently in American hands. It’s about insanity allowed to multiply its destructive powers by a factor of 61 mass murders in the past 30 years. It’s about gun-loving survivalist mothers of mentally ill kids stockpiling weapons for herself, teaching her kids to shoot, preparing for society’s collapse, all surely fed by right-wing fearmongers and idiots.

Full article: http://blog.sfgate.com/morford/2012/12/18/death-to-all-guns/

[milkmiku]

Full article: http://blog.sfgate.com/morford/2012/12/18/death-to-all-guns/


Very cute, lots of huff and puff in that article, he has a way of saying things in just the right amount if unnecessary. I suppose China has a knife insanity, what with all the Chinese people going into day cares and stabbing babies.

I agree though, these mass shootings are bad, but not really that big of a deal when you get down to it, they do help with keeping the public focused off of the other dealings in the goverment and pass laws. The 20s we're America bloodiest time when it came to gun violence.

"Guns are pain. Guns are impotence masquerading as virility, shame masquerading as valor,"

This guy is like soooooo deep, I always thought guns were weapons.

[Trap Queen Voxxy]

How do you all feel about gun control, in light of the tragedy in CT. Could other factors be at play in creating dangerous minds besides guns?

I think the idea of blaming guns is ridiculous for the SH shootings considering I think guns (humor me) are irrelevant to the conversation just as violence in the media also seems to be irrelevant. Why? The Bath School disaster seems to be the perfect historical example as to why. The incident happened in 1927 in which Andrew Kehoe, a school treasurer or some shit, blew up a school with dynamite killing 58 men, women, and children. All before gun restriction laws, video games, internets, TV, rock'n'roll, and any other silly thing you want to throw up usually in this conversation. What should really be analyzed is violence in general, the causation of violence and in particular both under capital. Addressing and or recognizing the underlining issues as to why this may have happened may be more productive than scapegoats or pontificating about your prearranged political agendas on the corpses of children; whole thing disgusts me, really.

Everything related to the gun control debate seems stupid and fucked to me.

[Let's Get Free]

More people die from work-related injuries than from guns. How about a little boss control?

[p0is0n]

I wonder, what are everyones thoughts on teachers/administrators being armed in schools? I hear there is a lot of propagating for that in America.

My first reaction is that it is quite sad that it comes to the point where people are arming faculty in schools to defend them against school shootings and such.

[Cyclone1776]

I wonder, what are everyones thoughts on teachers/administrators being armed in schools? I hear there is a lot of propagating for that in Amareica.

My first reaction is that it is quite sad that it comes to the point where ponies are arming faculty in schools to defend them against school shootings and such.

It makes sense. Mass shootings are becoming common now, and schools and day cares are really the most vulnerable targets because the faculty, including the security guards, don't have firearms to mount a proper response, so the killer can go on a rampage w/o any resistance

[Luís Henrique]

I wonder, what are everyones thoughts on teachers/administrators being armed in schools? I hear there is a lot of propagating for that in America.

That sooner or later there will be school shootings perpetrated by teachers and school support personel. What are the rates of mental illness among teachers, compared to other categories of workers? In Brazil they are pretty high; school can be a very maddening environment.

Other thing that might go wrong is students stealing guns from teachers, and then using them for who knows what ends.

Many mass shootings are workplace shootings; in the list of mass shootings provided by Mother Jones site there are 21 (out of 62) workplace-related shootings; on the other hand there is only one perpetrated by a teacher - which wasn't at his workplace. There is one other episode of mass murder perpetrated by a school teacher, which also wasn't at workplace, but it wasn't a shooting (a former - and mentally ill - school teacher went on a rampage killing seven people - and injuring 24 - by trampling them with her car). Maybe the only reason why we haven't had a school shooting perpetrated by a teacher is blind statistic chance, working place shootings being 1/3 of all mass shootings, and only one having been committed by a teacher, there are two chance in three that it would be committed outside of the workplace. Or perhaps it is because many workplace shootings are reactions to being fired, and teachers are less likely to be fired than other workers. Or perhaps it is the fact that guns in schools aren't culturally accepted.

(On the other hand, three workplace mass shootings were committed by postal employees and former employees. Perhaps it is worth checking the labour conditions in the postal system?)

Luís Henrique

[o well this is ok I guess]

I don't think high-powered guns should be so easy to obtain. There needs to be control by how dangerous a certain firearm is over another. I believe in monitoring guns and taking actions to make sure they don't get into psychopaths' hands but I'm not for illegalization of guns. But then how are we going to shoot down police helicopters

[Jason]

I agree with many posters on here that gun control isn't in the far left's interest.

Now Blake was saying that guns represent some gangster/redneck culture that reactionary Americans like. Well, that's true, but beside the point. I don't care if our opponents have guns, but we should also have as many or more.

The right is correct in saying guns aren't causing crime, but they offer no strong solutions to prevent crime from arising. In other words, they foster an environment which causes crime, and then lock up the criminals. Which, well that does lower crime, but it would be even better to prevent people from becoming criminals.

[milkmiku]

Mass shootings are becoming common now

The media is doing its job I see..

They are not becoming more and more common.

[The Jay]

It makes sense. Mass shootings are becoming common now, and schools and day cares are really the most vulnerable targets because the faculty, including the security guards, don't have firearms to mount a proper response, so the killer can go on a rampage w/o any resistance

They are not becoming more common. Now, let's think for a minute; how many schools are there? How many school shootings are there? How many school shootings are there per year?

I doubt that there are very many. If there were then it would be on the news every night, or multiple times per night.

The worse cause of gun violence, and the bigger problem, is poverty, just look at the murder statistics of big cities.

Count that number of people and compare one year's total to the number of school shootings in the last decade.

[Rottenfruit]

It's good that gun control is now in opposing ideologies because it is counterrevolutionary,

Also why are people freaking out because of this?

84 people have died in America this year by spree killers
1000 people this year in america have been hit by a ligthning.

yeah that means its 10 times more likly to get hit by a lightning then getting killed by a spree killer,

[Aussie Trotskyist]

I'd have to base my opinion on my personal morals.

I've been shooting at a range since I was 12. In that time, I've developed a respect for guns, and a love for the sport.

A person should own a gun, only if he respects it. But that, of course, is very hard to implement in legislation. I think what was said before about workers militias is pretty much accurate, mentally sound people should be permitted to be trained to use (and respect) a firearm, and as such should be permitted to keep one.

[I'm Gay.]

I wonder, what are everyones thoughts on teachers/administrators being armed in schools? I hear there is a lot of propagating for that in America.

It'd be a textbook case of security theater. I can't post links yet, so google if you don't know.

[milkmiku]

84 people have died in America this year by spree killers
1000 people this year in america have been hit by a ligthning.

yeah that means its 10 times more likly to get hit by a lightning then getting killed by a spree killer,


You're forgetting one thing, guns are scary, soft bellied liberals and soccer moms hear things like "military style automatic assault weapon with a Barrel shroud, pistol grip and high capacity clips" and start to think "omg what if it was me who was shot, it could be me next, why do we need military weapons"

I said it before, best way to get something passed in America is attaching "think of the kids", "to protect iseral" , or "fighting terrorism" to the end of your speech.

thankfully, the only thing that will come of this is a ammo price hike and AR price hike, which benefits me greatly, as I've a lot of ARs in stock.

[#FF0000]

Folks on the gun control wagon sorta have to deal with the unfortunate fact that gun regulations and bans do less than nothing to stop mass/spree killings.

EDIT: Plus I don't like the state disarming the working class and marginalized people in general. Yeah yeah "U RNT GONNA OVERTHROW THE GUVNEMT W/ AR15". Well no shit but I bet we'd see a lot less police brutality if folks open carried assault rifles e.g. the black panthers

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

The 1950s saw 20 school shootings, more than any other decade. So much for the "good old days".

[Luís Henrique]

But then how are we going to shoot down police helicopters

With illegal weapons, I suppose? Or it is morally inadmissible to illegally shoot down things with equally illegal guns?

But indeed, it would be a pity to put an end to the longstanding American tradition of shooting down police helicopters. How are Americans going to live if they can no more shoot down a police helicopter every other week?

Luís Henrique

[Luís Henrique]

EDIT: Plus I don't like the state disarming the working class and marginalized people in general. Yeah yeah "U RNT GONNA OVERTHROW THE GUVNEMT W/ AR15". Well no shit but I bet we'd see a lot less police brutality if folks open carried assault rifles e.g. the black panthers

I bet the opposite. The police would have more reason to shoot before asking questions.

Luís Henrique

[DasFapital]

I might get shit for this but I believe in enacting more reasonable regulations on guns in the United States. Not an outright ban, just more sensible controls; primarily dealing with the gun show loop holes and the ease of access to assault rifles, which, unlike the anti-gun control claim, are more than just dressed up hunting rifles.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

I might get shit for this but I believe in enacting more reasonable regulations on guns in the United States. Not an outright ban, just more sensible controls; primarily dealing with the gun show loop holes and the ease of access to assault rifles, which, unlike the anti-gun control claim, are more than just dressed up hunting rifles.

How? It's my understanding that a proper assault rifle is fully automatic, and those haven't been available since 1986.

[DasFapital]

How? It's my understanding that a proper assault rifle is fully automatic, and those haven't been available since 1986.
assault rifles were specifically designed to not be used for accuracy, the idea being that soldiers in the middle of a firefight would be less likely to have time to aim for a target. Therefore, the goal is to try to maim as many of the enemy as possible. In hunting rifles accuracy is considered far more important.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

assault rifles were specifically designed to not be used for accuracy, the idea being that soldiers in the middle of a firefight would be less likely to have time to aim for a target. Therefore, the goal is to try to maim as many of the enemy as possible. In hunting rifles accuracy is considered far more important.

What a load of rubbish. While an assault rifle might not be quite as accurate as a bolt-action, they are designed more for accuracy rather than sheer volume of fire, which is why they are select-fire weapons that can often be fitted with something better than the standard iron-sights. As opposed to machine guns, which are designed more for volume of fire rather than accuracy and hence have large box magazines or linked ammunition belts and are rarely, if ever, fitted with anything more than an iron-sight.

[o well this is ok I guess]

With illegal weapons, I suppose? Or it is morally inadmissible to illegally shoot down things with equally illegal guns?

But indeed, it would be a pity to put an end to the longstanding American tradition of shooting down police helicopters. How are Americans going to live if they can no more shoot down a police helicopter every other week?

Luís Henrique It's not that it's not possible or impermissible to acquire illegal weapons to shoot down police helicopters, but that's it's probably more difficult than going through the necessary legal procedures to procure one, as well as limiting the supply of what can be gotten illegally. And that's rubbish.
I dunno about you lot, but I'd be pretty cross if I were told that there was little I could do in the way of shooting down police helicopters.

[Proukunin]

I think everyone agrees with some form of gun/weapon control. We obviously don't think everyone should own their own military tank. This is directed more towards those reactionary people who freak out when any kind of assault weapon control is spoken of. I personally think it should be harder to get an assault weapon than a handgun.

That being said, I'm getting a Saiga-12 asap and converting it to fully auto..shit is going to be sick!

[milkmiku]

assault rifles were specifically designed to not be used for accuracy, the idea being that soldiers in the middle of a firefight would be less likely to have time to aim for a target. Therefore, the goal is to try to maim as many of the enemy as possible. In hunting rifles accuracy is considered far more important.

wow, that is the most incorrect thing I've read on this site.

think about what you just said.


assault rifles were specifically designed to not be used for accuracy

Just because suppressive fire is the tact of the day does not make this true, the modern assault rifle was built around the doctrine of "accurate kills", assault rifles were made to put more rounds down range and increase the chance of a kill. where lmgs are made to suppress and hmgs such as the big brown are made to kill things from far far away. DMs are typically assault rifles chambered in larger rounds or Battle rifles such as the venerable M14.


Therefore, the goal is to try to maim as many of the enemy as possible.

you seriously believe a weapon of death was made to "maim" rather than kill? You believe this? 5.56 was made to be light and to murder things efficiently, thus the arching it does as it breaks up in side of someones body causing a larger wound channel.

A job it does poorly, as 5.56 deflects outrageously off of glass and pretty much anything.


In hunting rifles accuracy is considered far more important.

No, power and accuracy are the two most important factors. Most hunting rifles are chambered in 7.62 or above 5.56 is a poor hunting round and is better off as a defensive round because of its shitty shit shit penetration.

Hunting rifles are faaaar deadlier than "military style assault weapons with pistol grips and high capacity clips"

[milkmiku]

We obviously don't think everyone should own their own military tank.

I'll buy a tank if I damn well please, thank you very much!

http://www.mortarinvestments.eu/products/tanks-2#currency=USD


That being said, I'm getting a Saiga-12 asap and converting it to fully auto..shit is going to be sick

that is not possible and also illegal, I'm contacting BAFT as I type. enjoy your 25 years in prison!

[Proukunin]

Actually it is not hard at all to convert a saiga-12 into fully auto and perfectly legal by Federal 922r standards at least for sure in Louisiana. You, of course, have to get a 200 dollar permit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxslOcJ9M3s..I don't think this is illegal one bit.

[milkmiku]

Actually it is not hard at all to convert a saiga-12 into fully auto and perfectly legal by Federal 922r standards at least for sure in Louisiana. You, of course, have to get a 200 dollar permit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxslOcJ9M3s..I don't think this is illegal one bit.


I was not aware of this, but you need pre-86 parts and that is where the problem lays, as those are expensive

Or you can be a registered dealer or gun smith, in which case you can do as you please.

this is not cheap endeavor, I'd rather buy a T-55

Still called the BATF, just in case.

[Proukunin]

All the parts equal to about 350 plus shipping...

[Proukunin]

I'm sure you'd rather spend 40,000 on a tank than spend about 1,300 on a fully auto Saiga-12..

Anyways. I'll just stick to my guns..no pun intended.

[Luís Henrique]

I dunno about you lot, but I'd be pretty cross if I were told that there was little I could do in the way of shooting down police helicopters.

I have never shot down a police (or non-police, indeed) helicopter. I have however helped put down a dictatorship. The American left, the way I see it - but maybe I'm wrong - does not shoot down police helicopters, and is quite unlikely to put down the present regime of two State-parties any soon. Why would one worry about being unable to do things that one is not doing, and is not going to do in any predictable future?

Luís Henrique

[milkmiku]

Great going reactionary public, now firearms will only be in the hands of those who they rightfully belong, The Wealthy, I'm glad those no class poor riffraff do not have access to firearms and I can afford to be a gun user on top of getting preferential treatment by Local police and having an armed body guard. This way oppressing you will be so much easier.

Truly it is good to be rich in America, where the common man can only own firearms if he saves a months worth of pay and jumps through a lengthy process.


Thanks to hysteria caused by the semite gun banners, massive price gouging is taking place by many of the major firearms supply companies in the USA.

"Cheaper than Dirt" has taken standard GI 30 round Mags that sold for 8 dollars on their web site only a week ago, and marked them up to 100 dollars each.

The Beta-C mag 100 round drum that they sold for 120 dollars is now priced at 500 dollars each.

A single mini-14 20 round mag is priced at 80 dollars.

.223 ammunition is "discount" priced at 1 dollar a round if purchased in a bulk 1,000 round lot.

http://www.guns.com/2012/12/28/cheaper-than-dirt-stays-in-the-gun-game/

[Will Scarlet]

"hysteria caused by semite gun banners" ?

Wow. And you're only restricted, not banned? Cool, cool.


I don't really have a hard position on gun control, a lot of statistical horseshit is spouted about this and it annoys me even more when it comes from the left, but I don't know if many people really make up their minds because of statistics, they decide and then cherrypick. In principle the main leftist argument is we need guns for self defence/revolution/self defence again. The problem I have with this is that I can't imagine a modern state being outgunned by its populace (at least without military and police defections but that's a whole other thing). The authorities have no problems breaking up protests and serious strikes with force, if you're just an unarmed mob that usually means riot shields, truncheons, horses, dogs, tear gas, maybe rubber bullets and water cannons. But if you bring guns to the picket, they're gonna bring more and bigger guns. Do they sell you anti tank or anti aircraft weaponry?

On the other hand I don't have any alternatives and we're not gonna get communism by asking nicely or all wishing at the same time. So I dunno. .
Less guns would reduce shit like this though. OK BYE

[milkmiku]

The problem I have with this is that I can't imagine a modern state being outgunned by its populace


What is every middle eastern act of aggression by the west in the past 60 years? The fact is, modern military for all its billions of dollars and tonnes of explosives, cannot deal with insurgency. It would require genocide of populations, which the world would not sit by and let happen.

The good thing about America, is that most law enforcement has weapons that are just a step above what civies have, National Guard is what you need to worry about in this scenario, but their armories are under staffed and very obvious in their locations.


I was quoting some post on a blog that had all the information I needed. Why are people so quick to have others banned or restricted here I will never know.

[Will Scarlet]

Why would you quote from an anti-Semitic/Nazish blog without comment? I don't know anything about you except you're restricted and then you did that.

I did think about Afghanistan, Vietnam style insurgency but it wasn't very clear, and their victory condition is the enemy packing up and going home, I think sapping the will of the American state to fight on American soil would be many times more difficult.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Be realistic, guns are made to kill or maim humans or animals...i hate 'em.