Pre-1905 Russian noblemen

[The Cheshire Cat]

Hello everyone,

I am currently working on an essay for school about the Russian Civil war and now I am writing about the political situations of pre-1905 Russia. I have read two things concerning the noblemen, one stating that they had very much influence and one stating the opposite, claiming that there were many communes of (religious) peasants where wealth was shared. I know the noblemen ruled the country with the Czar, but how much influence did they have in the every day lifes?
Thank you!

[GoddessCleoLover]

The Tsar ruled the country. Nobles ruled the peasants and had a great deal of influence over their lives. Although serfdom was abolished prior to 1905 the vestiges and customs of the serf-tonoble relationship still infected Russian popular culture.

[The Cheshire Cat]

Thank you! So does anyone know wether the stories about the communes are true then?

[Yuppie Grinder]

They were the same sort of communes that existed in pre-industrial Germany. And yes, they existed. In the early 1900s Russia was the fastest growing industrial power in the world, but the vast majority of Russians still lived a simple agrarian life. Marx and Engels speculated that the communes could survive through a proletarian revolution. The Socialist Revolutionaries (basically a peasant party) were for preserving and empowering them.

[GoddessCleoLover]

One has to remember that prior to the Revolution, and of course prior to 1905, these communes existed within the context of Tsarist autocracy and the nobility dominating the countryside. In 1917 Lenin promised land to the tiller not land to the communes. Lenin did this because he knew that Russian peasants, like farmers all over the world, wanted their own land to till above all else, including communes. This is basic Marxism.

[Yuppie Grinder]

Propertied peasants, even communal ones, have a vested interest in the preservation of property.

[hetz]

These "communes" were called mirs.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obshchina

[Bronco]

The peasant commune would handle things such as the payment of taxation, local justice etc. the Nobles were still very much masters of the peasantry though, although it's true that their power and land decreased after the Serf Emancipation in 1861. The Tsarist government actually favoured the Commune in the latter half of the 19th century as a means of preserving stability in the countryside; those who authored the Emancipation decree hoped that over time it's importance for peasants would gradually wane, because it went against the ideas of private property and individual entrepreneurship that they were trying to instil, but actually under Alexander III they took measures to reinforce the Commune again out of fear of instability in the country

Don't think that the Nobles and the Tsarist government were never at odds by the way, a lot of the Nobles were very unhappy at the Emancipation reform and there was a lot of tension and conflict between them and the Bureaucrats who authored the reform, it's not entirely accurate to say the noblemen ruled the country with the Tsar. Nikolay Milyutin for instance, who was a main architect of the reforms under Alexander II said that "never, never, as long as I have power will I allow the nobility to have any initiative in matters regarding the interests and needs of the people"

[GoddessCleoLover]

Excellent posts Bronco and Gourmet Pez. Student has a good foundation for his paper. Don't help any more unless Student agrees to become a paying customer.:D

[The Cheshire Cat]

Thanks again everyone!

[l'Enfermé]

These village "Communes", by the way, and this very rarely noted, were a creation of the nobility. They increased the prosperity of the peasants, made taxation easier and so on, all this for the benefit of the nobility and the court.