What did Jesus say?

[(*]

*I think this is the right place for this thread*

By Jesus, I mean the real one...not the che-lives member :P

In Christianity it is believed that Jesus is the son of God. My question is, did Jesus claim this? What did he say? What does the Bible say?

I was hoping someone could find me verses from the Bible that either support or negate this.

Thanks

[DeadMan]

Hmm....well Marie was inpreganted from the Holy Spirit, one form in which god represents himself....so basically she was the one who said he was the son of god...I mean, why else would a virgin get pregnant?

Bah...I don't even know my own damn religion...forgive me father for I have sinned :P .

DeadMan.

[SonofRage]

"I and the Father are one." The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God." (John 10:30-33)

And so when He had washed their feet, and taken His garments, and reclined at the table again, He said to them, "Do you know what I have done to you? You call Me Teacher and Lord; and you are right, for I am. If I then, the Lord and the Teacher, washed your feet, you also ought to wash one another's feet." (John 13:12-14)

[Domino]

Marie had an affair with a Roman soldier, but had to marry to cover it up. Then claimed that she was inpreganted by the Holy Spirit.

For what my religion says, Jesus was just a very wise Rabi. So wise that a group of jews considerated him the messiah, himself included. He didn't teach the Torah, though, just jewish ethics. When he was crucified, the members of that group of followers continued his teachings creating a new religion with ethics that oppose to the jewish ones.

[ComradeRed]

Yeah. I'd stone jesus, too. You know, if one stops and thinks logically, the 'virgin' mary was adultered/raped by god. They weren't married, oh god sinned.
Jesus was a cult figure who supported civil disobediance against an empire who has fallen nearly 1550 years ago, and since has wandered aimlessly through time.

[Domino]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2003, 02:23 AM
Jesus was a cult figure who supported civil disobediance against an empire who has fallen nearly 1550 years ago, and since has wandered aimlessly through time.
Well, he was just a guy that had some lose screws in his head. There&#39;s been so many men that have claimed to be the messiah. He was just one more, but having a &#39;nice&#39; personality helped him win a group of people that believed him. <_< Just like that group of people that killed themselves not long ago (well, I think there&#39;s been many) cause their &#39;leader&#39; told them he was the messiah and they should all die to go with God. :blink:

[ComradeRed]

Face facts, he had a cult, became a martyr, and people are STILL warshipping him&#33; He is an immortal cult figure who is dead&#33; DEAD, DEAD, DEAD, DEAD, DEAD&#33;
And since the Roman Empire has fallen, what has christianity&#39;s aim been? IT&#39;s AIMLESS&#33;

[Domino]

Completely aimless. Christianity (especially Catholicism) has done nothing but bad to the humanity. Burning scientists, not letting people think and stealing from the poor. They adore to put an image of their &#39;God&#39; bleeding to death on the cross. They love a jew and hate jewish people. They follow the jewish commandments and dare to say Judaism is wrong. Nothing but a bunch of contradictory &#39;laws&#39; created by man to control the people in the name of &#39;God&#39;.

[(*]

I just found this on a site...I wish I had a Bible handy to check the validity.


Jesus called himself son of man and refused to be called son of God.

"And the devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak; for they knew that he was Christ." (Luke 4:11)

and again "He [Jesus] said unto them [the disciples], But whom say ye that I am? Peter answering said, The
Christ of God. And he straightly charged them, and commanded them to tell no man that thing." (Luke 9:20 and 21).

[Domino]

The main reason why they insisted that he was the son of G-d was because they were so oppressed and hunted by the Romans, they had the need to believe in something, someone... so they made him the messiah, which he obviously wasn&#39;t.

For what I&#39;ve read, he did believe he was the son of G-d, but I might be wrong.

[Soviet power supreme]

You know, if one stops and thinks logically, the &#39;virgin&#39; mary was adultered/raped by god. They weren&#39;t married, oh god sinned.

You got it&#33;Jesus was a bastard child.



Marie had an affair with a Roman soldier, but had to marry to cover it up. Then claimed that she was inpreganted by the Holy Spirit.

Never heard that before, but it reminds me how do the bible writers know this kind of things?

[redstar2000]

The problem is, of course, is that no one knows "what Jesus said".

What appears in the "Gospels" are statements attributed to "Jesus". The oldest "gospel" written by "Mark" (not the disciple, of course) was written no earlier than 70CE...nearly 40 years after the crucifixion by someone who had never heard the man speak. The other "gospels" are later still.

So, at root, it&#39;s all based on legend, gossip, word-of-mouth.

I think the current scholarly consensus is that Yeshuah ben-Yosif was a "country preacher", a "reforming rabbi", and a pious Jew. His message was most likely a simple one: "Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand&#33;"

He was probably indeed a "rebel"...but a theological one, not a resistance fighter against Roman domination. He represented the "simple peasant" distrust of the sophisticated Jewish theologians of Jerusalem. Indeed, he most likely thought of Jerusalem as a "nest of vipers".

He was certainly not any kind of "communist" and did not think of himself as the founder of a new religion.

After his execution and mythical resurrection (certainly a hoax perpetuated by a few of his followers), he was "promoted" to god-hood...a common enough fate for "great men" in that era. Between 70 and 150CE, all the divine trappings were added to the Christian canon.

Poor unlucky bastard.

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[cubist]

as far as the bible and a christian is concerned its right he did claim it

he also claimed to knock down the church and rebuild it in three days,

death and resurection over eaSTER WEEKEND,

he also stopped jewish priests from stoning adulterous women to death
if you have not sinned cast the first stone scenario can&#39;t think of the verse at the moment,

jesus is not the bad part of the bible

christians are,

tetelives christians were oppressed by the jews not the romans, the romans washed theyre hands of the situation,

[Domino]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2003, 08:52 AM
tetelives christians were oppressed by the jews not the romans, the romans washed theyre hands of the situation
Oh, I know that. Yes. Did I say the opposite? I don&#39;t remember. Sorry. :rolleyes: Jews were oppressed by romans, and christians by jews, right?

[ComradeRobertRiley]

Jesus said - "let there be light" - and there was light

Jesus said - "let there be hell on Earth" - and there was the USA

[Al Creed]

Mistranslation of "The Virgin Mary" (http://www.jesusneverexisted.com/lying.htm#virgin)

"The most colossal blunder of the Septuagint translators, the mistranslation of the original Hebrew text of Isaiah, 7.14, allowed deceitful early Christians to concoct their infamous prophecy that somehow the ancient Jewish text presaged the miraculous birth of their own godman.

The Hebrew original says:
&#39;Hinneh ha-almah harah ve-yeldeth ben ve-karath shem-o immanuel.&#39;

Honestly translated, the verse reads:
&#39;Behold, the young woman has conceived — and bears a son and calls his name Immanuel.&#39;

The Greek-speaking translators of Hebrew scripture (in 3rd century B.C. Alexandria) slipped up and translated &#39;almah&#39; (young woman) into the Greek &#39;parthenos&#39; (virgin). The Hebrew word for virgin would have been &#39;betulah.&#39;"

[cubist]

immanuel jesus so what, jesus is the bit that actually existed, wether he was the son of god is being debated.


funny bible bit,

god said to abraham(aged very old) you are going to have a son, abraham laughed and said that is impossible, god says you shall call him isaac, isaac means he laughs

[redstar2000]

The Greek-speaking translators of Hebrew scripture (in 3rd century B.C. Alexandria) slipped up and translated &#39;almah&#39; (young woman) into the Greek &#39;parthenos&#39; (virgin). The Hebrew word for virgin would have been &#39;betulah.&#39;"

I&#39;m not sure the translators deserve the "blame". It&#39;s my understanding that it was "Matthew" who came up with this mis-translation.

I recall reading that when a new edition of the "Old Testament" was being prepared under the direction of King Alfonso X of Spain...the pious Jews that he had hired to do the work were so afraid of the consequences of a literal translation that they simply left the word "almah" untranslated; thus: "Behold, an almah has conceived..." Supposedly, this book is actually on display in a museum in Madrid...opened to the very page where this sentence appears.


jesus is not the bad part of the bible

christians are

A matter of taste, I suppose. Had I lived in that unhappy place and time, I would have preferred Hillel (father & son). Their ethics were clearly superior to those of Jesus: Do not do to other people what you would not like other people to do to you.

Not that anyone was listening.

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A site about communist ideas.

[Rasta Sapian]

Ok, so if mother mary did in fact give birth to devine life, son of god, messiah, this cannot be proved or disproved

If jesus was mortal (conseption) who became a wise profit, speaking the word of god, and changing traditional jewish beliefs, than that would also be quite relative in retrospect.

Than, why couldn t Jesus still be the son of God (in the same terms) aren t we all the children of God

[pedro san pedro]

if one leabes asie wether he was the son of god or no, and listens to what jesus said, and how he lived, basically, the guy was a jiobless hippy, who belived in peace over making money and getting on with one another -throwing the mercents otta the temple, the sermonm on the mount, the 10 comandments etc. not all this is from the big fella, but the bible as a whole, as most religous textw, can be viewed as a moral cod.

dont kill, be nice to one another, there are much more important things than money etc....

one thing i enjoy arguing with christians is the quote "behold, for i am the one and the truth and the light, and none shall come ton the father except thru me" (verse unknown).

most "christains" feel this means that onone shall get to hang eith the spirt in the sky unless they &#39;ake jesus untio theirr hearts and repent".

i wou;d feel thatn it means more to live as jesus, whom i consider a greatr socail activist, did, and look to make life better in the here and now.

"for, as some people think, great god will come from the sky, take away every little thing , and make everyone feel high. but if you know what life is worth, u will look fpr yours on earth. and now u feel teh light, u gonna stand up for your right"
Bob.

ps sory for the s[pelling. viva the festive season&#33; viva&#33;

[cubist]

Rasta Sapien,

jesus was mortal he died,

Redstar, hillel father and son wtf? please expand in a PM to me if you don&#39;t want to do a thread

[redstar2000]

On Rabbi Hillel (the elder), try this site...

http://www.spiritwalk.org/hillel.htm

I&#39;ve found, by the way, that when people mention some name I&#39;ve never heard of, it often clears things up to do a Google search.

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A site about communist ideas

[hazard]

i will quote Jesus Chris superstar for the answer

when caiphas asked jesus if he was the son of God, jesus said

"thats what you say, you say that I am"

so I guess he never said that

i will now quote superstar djs

"hey girl, hey boy, superstar djs - HERE WE GO&#33;"

[bazonix]

Originally posted by [email protected] 27 2003, 01:52 PM
The problem is, of course, is that no one knows "what Jesus said".

What appears in the "Gospels" are statements attributed to "Jesus". The oldest "gospel" written by "Mark" (not the disciple, of course) was written no earlier than 70CE...nearly 40 years after the crucifixion by someone who had never heard the man speak. The other "gospels" are later still.

So, at root, it&#39;s all based on legend, gossip, word-of-mouth.

I think the current scholarly consensus is that Yeshuah ben-Yosif was a "country preacher", a "reforming rabbi", and a pious Jew. His message was most likely a simple one: "Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand&#33;"

He was probably indeed a "rebel"...but a theological one, not a resistance fighter against Roman domination. He represented the "simple peasant" distrust of the sophisticated Jewish theologians of Jerusalem. Indeed, he most likely thought of Jerusalem as a "nest of vipers".

He was certainly not any kind of "communist" and did not think of himself as the founder of a new religion.

After his execution and mythical resurrection (certainly a hoax perpetuated by a few of his followers), he was "promoted" to god-hood...a common enough fate for "great men" in that era. Between 70 and 150CE, all the divine trappings were added to the Christian canon.

Poor unlucky bastard.

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A site about communist ideas
Indeed.

Jesus said he was &#39;son of man&#39; not son of god.

There are many more writings on Jesus than those in the Bible of course. One being the Gospel of Mary Magdalene. Look up all the Apocrypha, they are far more telling of the spirituality of Jesus and the &#39;one&#39; message. Many of them being written at the time of his death (or thereabouts). What is interesting is that the church would rule these gospels out of the Bible in the first place. Perhaps a bit too much sex, a bit too much accuracy and denial of what was in the other parts...

Messiah simply means &#39;King&#39; and Jesus was supposedly related to David. Thus the &#39;rightful&#39; ruler of the jews - which leads to &#39;king of the jews&#39; and the crown of thorns. They don&#39;t just execute anyone on the crucifix&#33; They had to have some reason.

There&#39;s nothing quite like the great I am...

[Jesus Christ]

Originally posted by (*@Dec 27 2003, 02:53 AM


By Jesus, I mean the real one...not the che-lives member :P

awww, i thought this thread was gonna be about me

[Hate Is Art]

watch monty pythons life of brian for a decent explanation as to how christianity got stated

:D

[bazonix]

Originally posted by Digital [email protected] 30 2003, 06:14 PM
watch monty pythons life of brian for a decent explanation as to how christianity got stated

:D
Follow the Gourd&#33;

[katie mccready]

jsus i think did say that he as theson of god

[monkeydust]

Originally posted by Digital [email protected] 30 2003, 06:14 PM
watch monty pythons life of brian for a decent explanation as to how christianity got stated

:D
"He&#39;s not the messiah, he&#39;s a very naughty boy&#33;"

It says it all, thinking about it theres a lot of truth in this comparison.

[revolutionindia]

All i know about jesus is that he spent some time in the himalayas after which he went back to his people with magical powers and performed miiracles which indian saints have been doing for ages

Believe me this is the worlds best kept secret
Jesus was a hindu?? :blink:

[monkeydust]

Originally posted by [email protected] 11 2004, 01:09 PM
All i know about jesus is that he spent some time in the himalayas after which he went back to his people with magical powers and performed miiracles which indian saints have been doing for ages

Believe me this is the worlds best kept secret
Jesus was a hindu?? :D
When did he go to the Himalayas? I&#39;d never heard of this before.

[MiDnIgHtMaRaUdEr]

Who cares what Jesus did or was?

[Soviet power supreme]

Yep Jesus could heal other peoples wounds but not his owns when he was in cross. :D

[Umoja]

It was Thomas ("Jesus&#39; Twin") who went to India to preach. I think this is how a large amount of Hinduism seeped into Christianity.

[Eastside Revolt]

From what I&#39;ve heard, it was the entire reason he was crucified. The Romans didn&#39;t particularly have a problem with jesus. I believe it was markus araelius (I could be wrong, or how does it spells) who would have let him go except that they had to try him under judaic law which considered his claim to be blasphemy.

[revolutionindia]

Originally posted by [email protected] 11 2004, 06:44 PM



When did he go to the Himalayas? I&#39;d never heard of this before. [/quote]
Even i never believed it but i will look up the source again and post it here in the next 24hrs

[hazard]

okay, jesus christ superstar

when jesus is doing his only thing, what are they called, when there&#39;s only one person singing, and then he goes like

"watch me die&#33;"

and then there&#39;s like all these paintings of jesus crucified

like when did that happen in the bible? did jesus say "watch me die&#39;?

[SonofRage]

Originally posted by [email protected] 11 2004, 08:35 PM
From what I&#39;ve heard, it was the entire reason he was crucified. The Romans didn&#39;t particularly have a problem with jesus. I believe it was markus araelius (I could be wrong, or how does it spells) who would have let him go except that they had to try him under judaic law which considered his claim to be blasphemy.
I believe he was crucufied because he said that God was the king of heaven and it was illegal in Rome to call anyone your king besides the Emperor

[hazard]

technically jesus was crucified in order to prevent a riot

[RedCeltic]

Originally posted by (*@Dec 27 2003, 03:00 AM
I just found this on a site...I wish I had a Bible handy to check the validity.


Jesus called himself son of man and refused to be called son of God.

"And the devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak; for they knew that he was Christ." (Luke 4:11)

and again "He [Jesus] said unto them [the disciples], But whom say ye that I am? Peter answering said, The
Christ of God. And he straightly charged them, and commanded them to tell no man that thing." (Luke 9:20 and 21).
The first quote is taken from where Jesus supposedly is tempted by the devil. I don&#39;t know if that person who wrote what you quoted wrote the wrong passage number, or misquoted. It seems to be the right chapeter... but the passage in my Bible (Good News Version) says,

Luke 4:11 It also says, &#39;they will hold you up with their hands so that not even your feet will hurt on the stones.&#39;



As for the second quote:

Luke 9:20 "What about you?" he asked them, "Who do you say I am?" Peter answered, "You are God&#39;s Messiah"

Luke 9:21 Than Jesus gave them strict orders not to tell this to anyone.

Now... this same event was also talked about by Mathew who said,

Mathew 16:15 - 20

15"But what about you?" he asked. "Who do you say I am?"

16 Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."

17 Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven.

18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it.

19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven."

20Then he warned his disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Christ.

Why he didn&#39;t want this mentioned I&#39;m not clear on, but how Luke left out what what had been said in Mathew&#39;s version in verses 17-19 shows how they really were writen by men... after the death of Jesus, who may have remembered events differently.

Some events I think are real, such as Jesus asking his disciples who he was and than asking not to tell anyone. However, other events I believe were purely made up to show a lesson or make some point perhaps... such as Jesus being tempted by the devil.

[hazard]

ever hear the idea that Jesus was like socrates?

he surrounded himself with idiots so he would look smart

its easy to interpret some of these quotes as proof of that

like, he asks his apostles who he is. and then they all say he&#39;s christ. HE DONT SAY THIS. and then he says something screwy like "lord in heaven told you this". and then, like, he tells them not to tell anybody. so if anybody asks, Jesus can just say its them&#33; not me. which might explain why one of them ratted him out. one too many "who&#39;s on first" routines.

[RedCeltic]

Originally posted by SonofRage+Jan 12 2004, 12:22 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (SonofRage @ Jan 12 2004, 12:22 AM)
[email protected] 11 2004, 08:35 PM
From what I&#39;ve heard, it was the entire reason he was crucified. The Romans didn&#39;t particularly have a problem with jesus. I believe it was markus araelius (I could be wrong, or how does it spells) who would have let him go except that they had to try him under judaic law which considered his claim to be blasphemy.
I believe he was crucufied because he said that God was the king of heaven and it was illegal in Rome to call anyone your king besides the Emperor [/b]
I don&#39;t remember ever reading about Rome having this type of a policy at all. Besides, Jupiter was the "King of the heavens" for Rome. Rome actually a policy of not interfering with the religions of people who came under their "benevolent rule." they would also often take on the Gods of another culture into their pantheon, and alow them to continue as before.

Houndreds of years later on... Christians under Roman rule would find themselves in conflict with the empire when the refused to give aditional sacrifice to the Emperor&#39;s God.

(I&#39;m not sure if it was supposed to be the God Emperor worshiped or the "Emperor God" meaning Agustus Caeser who made himself a God.)

I think the Christans were totally unresonable about the whole situation really. It seemed like a great policy to me, and practicly freedom of religion. Worship whoever you want, as long as you honor the feast day of my god.

[hazard]

the best thing about Jesus was the fact that he is the last superhero. unless you count saints. after this, as all post christian religions are the lack of any religion, superhero&#39;s have been relegated to the realm of movies and comics.

Jesus could heal, turn undead, lay hands, induce food, ressurect, summon, and many more cool superhero type things like walking on water and predict fishing patterns. he was also very popular until the pharisees and saduccess and high priests all got jealous of his super human powers and started spreading vicious rumours about him so that his fanbase would become a blood thirsty flock of jackals. and to think Jesus ending up saving them anyways. in the long run. in an unverifiable way, in that their salvation occured AFTER they were to, ah, die. which is convenient considering THEY were responsible for his death. what would have happened if Barabas was crucified instead? what would HE have given them after they were to, um, die? probably nothing. so when you look at all the occurances you can easily conclude that it all came together fairly well. except for Jesus having to, er, die. but he rose from the dead so that makes it allright anyway.

[Soviet power supreme]

A new religion was created from jewish.Christianity.How can anybody know which one is right when the Jewish was the original religion that come from god.(remember those stone plates that he gave to Moses :lol: ).Now some bearded guy comes and tells that god has changed his mind and the bearded guy will tell you the new rules.Just wait and see when a new spiritual leader comes and tells you how god has changed his mind again. :D


so a question to christians in Che-Lives
Who you believe
A. bearded guy that tells he is son of god and he tells you that god has changed his mind.
B.Jewish people that has been connected with god for centuries and they know god from experience.

[ComradeRed]

C) none of the above, hehehe.
Seriously, i said it before and i&#39;ll say it again, christianity was originally a cult, with jesus as a martyr, the cult supported non violent resistance against the roman empire and since its fall, christianity has been wandering aimlessly.

[hazard]

jesus was a very popular religious figure. he has more influence than any other figure of religious importance. though he never wrote a word, just like socrates, he did inspire many others to write for him. like mark and luke and those guys. the gospell writers.

what I like most about jesus was the way that he spoke to people in parables. my favourite parable was the one, um, yeah, the one about the seed. he said &#39; when I find out just what we&#39;re on". no, that was OLP.

though jeszus spoke in parables he didn&#39;t speak in song lyrics. which is strange because there must be a million songs written about him. modern songs still sing about jesus. modern songs still sing about other things too. but how many songs sing about Buddha? or mohhamada?

to quote Judas in JCS

"could mohhamad move a mountain, or is that just PR?&#33;"

I leave that question to be answered by the board

[ComradeRed]

but how many songs sing about Buddha? buddha didn&#39;t say,"warship me, for i m the son of god, and you&#39;ll go to hell, blah blah blah..." he told us how to become enlightened. not to mention the redundancies in the bible (http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/donald_morgan/inconsistencies.shtml), buddhism is the fastest rising religion in america. ;) christianity has songs, but it does not have enlightenment.

[hazard]

bullshit

ever hear this one, in reference to the bible

"search in and ye shall find the secret to eternal life"

if thats not enlightenment I don&#39;t know what is

maybe you just don&#39;t read jesus right

maybe when you get a litle older you&#39;ll see what i mean

buddha? what the fuck

[ComradeRed]

maybe it is you who does not read the sutras properly, churl. the christian church killed, raped, pillaged and looted during the crusades; they said that peasents would go to heaven if they took oppression from the aristocrats and go to hell if they didn&#39;t. one cannot describe enlightenment to anyone who has not been enlightened, just like how one cannot describe fire to one who has not felt the heat of it, or the cool feel of water if they have not been around water.
who said that quote, a priest?
jesus? Wtf?

[hazard]

how can a church kill?

you mean like omega supreme? the cathedrals tarnsform into a giant robot and go around killing people? you are an imbecile.

buddha looks like he&#39;d eat anybody who disagreed with him. he&#39;s so fucking fat. what does a buddhist worship but the overindulgence of any possible thing imaginable?

how cnvenient. typical eastern circular stupidity. you cannot teeach someone who is not enlightened about enlightenment. believe me. that sort of nonsesne don&#39;t fly.

[Eastside Revolt]

Originally posted by [email protected] 12 2004, 09:00 AM
the best thing about Jesus was the fact that he is the last superhero. unless you count saints. after this, as all post christian religions are the lack of any religion, superhero&#39;s have been relegated to the realm of movies and comics.

Jesus could heal, turn undead, lay hands, induce food, ressurect, summon, and many more cool superhero type things like walking on water and predict fishing patterns. he was also very popular until the pharisees and saduccess and high priests all got jealous of his super human powers and started spreading vicious rumours about him so that his fanbase would become a blood thirsty flock of jackals. and to think Jesus ending up saving them anyways. in the long run. in an unverifiable way, in that their salvation occured AFTER they were to, ah, die. which is convenient considering THEY were responsible for his death. what would have happened if Barabas was crucified instead? what would HE have given them after they were to, um, die? probably nothing. so when you look at all the occurances you can easily conclude that it all came together fairly well. except for Jesus having to, er, die. but he rose from the dead so that makes it allright anyway.
What about King Arthur? :D

[ComradeRed]

buddha looks like he&#39;d eat anybody who disagreed with him. he&#39;s so fucking fat. what does a buddhist worship but the overindulgence of any possible thing imaginable?
that&#39;s not the shakyumuni buddha, this is buddha (http://seasiancrafts.com/spiritworld/buddha.htm). Buddhists don&#39;t warship buddha, they try to attain enlightenment and encourage others to become enlightened. read a book before u burn it next time.
church ( P ) Pronunciation Key (chûrch)
n.

1. often Church
1. The company of all Christians regarded as a spiritual body.
2. A specified Christian denomination: the Presbyterian Church.
3. A congregation.
2. Public divine worship in a church; a religious service: goes to church at Christmas and Easter.
3. The clerical profession; clergy.
4. Ecclesiastical power as distinguished from the secular: the separation of church and state.

Well, gee, the church, or the clergy, had mov&#39;ts of pious idiot knights to rape, die, and kill for "christian lands" and god.


you mean like omega supreme? the cathedrals tarnsform into a giant robot and go around killing people? you are an imbecile. people in glass houses shouldn&#39;t throw stones.


typical eastern circular stupidity. don&#39;t be rascist, it makes you look more stupid.


believe me. that sort of nonsesne don&#39;t fly.what seems to be more ironic is that the bull shit in the bible condemns one from being proud, yet you take pride in denouncing other religions, which was misinterpreted from the ten commandments. My main question is if god was as "all mighty powerful" as nuts proclaim why doesn&#39;t "he" sort out the mess on earth, killing those who have "scorned and denounced his all mighty grace" bullshit.


bullshit denying the fact that your religion does not have redundancies is hard to prove when it comes from the book you warship by. u can deny it, but it does not change the facts.

[hazard]

listen smilie face

to accuse eastern philosophy of being circular is not racist. to accuse me of being racist because of this is iognorant. circular logic IS stupid. here&#39;s an example.

why did you come here? because I wanted to. why? because. why? because.

it never ends. like when you say that only one who is enlughtened cannot explain to someone who is not enlightened about enlightenment. why? because. why? because.

I&#39;ll flesh it out.

why can&#39;t you teach me about enlightenment? because you are not enlightened. how does one become enlightened? through the process of enlightenment. when can I become enlightened? once you have acheived enlightenment.

under this process, and with the ultimate form of philosophy employed, WESTERN PHILOSOPHY, nobody could ever become enlightened. simply because nobody could ever know or discuss or impart such knowledge upon another. unless, of course, being enlightened means telling people that they cannot be enlightened unless they have already become that, in which case, I am already enlightened and so I fail to see your arguyment anyway.

[ComradeRed]

:rolleyes:
why can&#39;t you teach me about enlightenment? because you are not enlightened. how does one become enlightened? through the process of enlightenment. when can I become enlightened? once you have acheived enlightenment.
one can become enlightened with an open mind and a mentor.
without an open mind, because of its strength of the will, enlightenmt is impossible. believing so firmly that sins will cast one to hell will prevent one from thinking as a true christian, helping your fellow man, regardless of ANYTHING, but rather lead one to live a life of concerns than of happiness, then going to heaven. likewise, to attain enlightenent one must lose the sense that planting one&#39;s will on a thought. here is a priest&#39;s (named takuan soho) thought on it.

To speak in terms of your own martial art, when you first notice the sword that is moving to strike you, if you think of meeting that sword just as it is, your mind will stop at the sword in just that position, your own movements will be undone, and you will be cut down by your opponent. This is what stopping means.

Although you see the sword that moves to strike you, if your mind is not detained by it and you meet the rhythm of the advancing sword; if you do not think of striking your opponent and no thoughts or judgments remain; if the instant you see the swinging sword your mind is not the least bit detained and you move straight in and wrench the sword away from him; the sword that was going to cut you down will become your own, and, contrarily, will be the sword that cuts down your opponent.

In Zen this is called "Grabbing the spear and, contrariwise, piercing the man who had come to pierce you." The spear is a weapon. The heart of this is that the sword you wrest from your adversary becomes the sword that cuts him down. This is what you, in your style, call "No-Sword."

without a native guide to show safe and passages through snowed in mountains, it is more arduous to cross the mountains; likewise, in buddhism a mentor is required, who has attained enlightenment, to guide one through the snowed in mountains of the mind.

[Anastacia]

Now here we got a wise guy.


Their ethics were clearly superior to those of Jesus: Do not do to other people what you would not like other people to do to you.

That is exactly what Jesus said. You are completely against Jesus and then you quote him here and say that it&#39;s superior to Jesus. This is one of the many times I don&#39;t understand you. :huh:

[redstar2000]

Originally posted by [email protected] 15 2004, 05:48 AM
Now here we got a wise guy.


Their ethics were clearly superior to those of Jesus: Do not do to other people what you would not like other people to do to you.

That is exactly what Jesus said. You are completely against Jesus and then you quote him here and say that it&#39;s superior to Jesus. This is one of the many times I don&#39;t understand you. :huh:
How nice of you to ask. :D

Here is why Hillel is superior to "Jesus".

"Do unto others what you would have others do unto you" contains the positive assumption that whatever you prefer others to "do unto you" is a universal preference.

If, for example, you would prefer to have someone nag you to stop smoking or drinking, then you will conclude that you should nag others to stop smoking or drinking...because that&#39;s what you would prefer.

People who nag other people are, in their own eyes, "doing their Christian duty"...that is, imposing their preferences on others, usually in a thoroughly obnoxious manner.

The "negative" version proposed by Hillel is far superior; it suggests that you refrain from action towards others that you would find unpleasant if directed against yourself. You don&#39;t nag other people because you yourself would find generalized nagging unpleasant (even if you might prefer a specific and limited kind of nagging on certain occasions).

Thus, "Jesus" allows you to succumb to the temptation of "improving others" whether they like it or not.

Hillel says "don&#39;t bother other people".

Q.E.D.

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The RedStar2000 Papers (http://www.anarchist-action.org/marxists/redstar2000/)
A site about communist ideas