Woman dies after abortion request refused

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

You want control over your own body and to end the distress and pain of miscarriage? Sorry, wrong country. Just can't believe this is still going on..it's 2012 for fuck sake, to hell with your Catholic dogma.

The death of a woman who was 17 weeks pregnant is the subject of two investigations at University Hospital Galway in the Republic of Ireland.
Savita Halappanavar's family said she asked several times for her pregnancy to be terminated because she had severe back pain and was miscarrying.
Ms Halappanavar, a 31-year-old dentist, was refused because there was a foetal heartbeat. She died on 28 October.
An autopsy carried out two days later found she had died from septicaemia.
Her husband, Praveen, told the Irish Times that medical staff said his wife could not have an abortion because Ireland was a Catholic country and the foetus was still alive.
University Hospital Galway is to carry out an internal investigation. It said it could not comment on individual cases but would be cooperating fully with the coroner's inquest into Ms Halappanavar's death.

(more at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20321741)

[Aurora]

Fucking bullshit, 20 years ago it was decided by the supreme court that abortion could be carried out in case of risk to the life of the mother and today there is still no legislation putting it into action, the bastards in six successive governments have been quite happy to bury the question.
A couple months ago there was a private members bill put forward by Clare Daly that would have dealt with this exact situation.

The first abortion clinic in Ireland opened in Belfast on the 18th of October, a couple of hours drive could have given this woman a chance.

There have been many polls taken and the majority of the public support limited abortion services, there was even a poll taken in September that showed that 80% of the public support access to abortion in case of risk to the life of the woman.

The fault for this lies completely on the government and the ruling parties who have failed to legislate, FF, FG, Labour and Greens fuck them all.

[pastradamus]

You want control over your own body and to end the distress and pain of miscarriage? Sorry, wrong country. Just can't believe this is still going on..it's 2012 for fuck sake, to hell with your Catholic dogma.

The death of a woman who was 17 weeks pregnant is the subject of two investigations at University Hospital Galway in the Republic of Ireland.
Savita Halappanavar's family said she asked several times for her pregnancy to be terminated because she had severe back pain and was miscarrying.
Ms Halappanavar, a 31-year-old dentist, was refused because there was a foetal heartbeat. She died on 28 October.
An autopsy carried out two days later found she had died from septicaemia.
Her husband, Praveen, told the Irish Times that medical staff said his wife could not have an abortion because Ireland was a Catholic country and the foetus was still alive.
University Hospital Galway is to carry out an internal investigation. It said it could not comment on individual cases but would be cooperating fully with the coroner's inquest into Ms Halappanavar's death.

(more at http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20321741)

I never felt so embarassed to be Irish to be perfectly honest about it. She was an absolute asset to our country and her life could have been saved quite easily with a very simple procedure. Its the Irish government dropping the ball again really. They promised that they would have another referendum about this issue and as usual, waited until it was once again too late. The Fine Gael/Labour governemt already shot-down a proposal brought up by the Socialist party earlier this year concerning the infamous case x report. They have serious blood on their hands over this. To think this all occured on October 28th and only made the news yesterday prompts to me that there was a very-in depth investigation into this. Nevertheless, the Government can feel absolutely ashamed that they by proxy caused this womans death and there is a serious question of their intregrity on hands after failing in their promise on this one.
The one thing that I can say is that there is no evidence that the Bereaved husband was ever fed the whole "Catholic Country" stuff according to the Independant Enquiry (which by the way was set up long ago). That seems to be spin put about by the tabloids and im very surprised the Irish Times printed this. In his news interview Mr.Halappanavar never mentioned anything of the sort and just instead explained what happened.
Anyways, I believe there are a lot of people in this country who finally got the wake-up call they needed and thousands of people around the country have held protest vigils in Savita's memory.
She will not die in vain, we will fight on her behalf and she may very well become a Martyr of Justice for womens rights in the future.
RIP Savita.

Pastra.

[Beeth]

It was a bourgeois lady, or at least petit bourgeois. Thought I should point that out.

[Yuppie Grinder]

It was a bourgeois lady, or at least petit bourgeois. Thought I should point that out.

Fuck off.
"Let bouergeuis dentists die cuz hurrrr"

[Beeth]

Fuck off.

I didn't say bourgeois or petit bourgeois folks deserved to die. I was pointing out that info. for proper context.

[Yuppie Grinder]

She was a fucking dentist.

[GPDP]

I didn't say bourgeois or petit bourgeois folks deserved to die. I was pointing out that info. for proper context.

What context does pointing out her class provide, pray tell? When a person dies because of bullshit, and someone comes in and says "she was bourgeois btw," what do you think people are going to think you're implying other than "well, if she was bourgeois, then it's not that much of a tragedy."

It was an unnecessary comment to make, regardless of whatever your intentions were.

[Beeth]

What context does pointing out her class provide, pray tell? When a person dies because of bullshit, and someone comes in and says "she was bourgeois btw," what do you think people are going to think you're implying other than "well, if she was bourgeois, then it's not that much of a tragedy."

It was an unnecessary comment to make, regardless of whatever your intentions were.

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

I do get what your driving at and there is a valid point there.

But I would say that the definition of news is..that it's new. That's why it's called news. I mean, to 'petty bourgeois' westerners this kind of thing is very shocking; "a 'middle-class' woman dying because of being denied an abortion that's well within the term limit, at least in British law, in a developed European country...wtf?" , hence it's news.
There should be headlines everyday about the plight of thousands of people all over the world suffering needlessly.but that's not what news is, or how it works at the moment.

[Yuppie Grinder]

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

Forr you own sake stop

[pastradamus]

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

No.

Im from Ireland and im living here and reading the newspapers every day. The fact that she was a Dentist (a public one at that) has been barely mentioned here. I dont define dentist as being bourgeois in any context, they work to earn a living.
Actually the fact that she was a dentist meant she would have had some grasp over what was going on (being a medical professional and all) and would have probably made things that bit more traumatic for her.

On another note, one reaction I like. I was expecting some people to play the "she was a foreign national" card. But this has not been the case. Most people here are just considering the tragedy and looking at the human side of things as if she was one of their own - which is encouraging considering the usual bickering I hear on those cheap late night radio phone-ins about foreign people.

[Psy]

The fault for this lies completely on the government and the ruling parties who have failed to legislate, FF, FG, Labour and Greens fuck them all.
The doctors are also to blame to not conducting the abortion anyway.

[Beeth]

No.

Im from Ireland and im living here and reading the newspapers every day. The fact that she was a Dentist (a public one at that) has been barely mentioned here. I dont define dentist as being bourgeois in any context, they work to earn a living.
Actually the fact that she was a dentist meant she would have had some grasp over what was going on (being a medical professional and all) and would have probably made things that bit more traumatic for her.

On another note, one reaction I like. I was expecting some people to play the "she was a foreign national" card. But this has not been the case. Most people here are just considering the tragedy and looking at the human side of things as if she was one of their own - which is encouraging considering the usual bickering I hear on those cheap late night radio phone-ins about foreign people.

Dentists and sweatshop workers both earn wages. They both work for very little, do a lot of backbreaking labor, live in precarious conditons. They are both very, very poor, have no access to basic amenities, and their children usually starve. They are equal.

[BOZG]

No.
On another note, one reaction I like. I was expecting some people to play the "she was a foreign national" card. But this has not been the case. Most people here are just considering the tragedy and looking at the human side of things as if she was one of their own - which is encouraging considering the usual bickering I hear on those cheap late night radio phone-ins about foreign people.

You can correct me on this if I'm wrong but I've got the impression (from afar) that the reverse has generally been the case, that there's been more of a "what does the world think of us?" attitude emerging


Dentists and sweatshop workers both earn wages. They both work for very little, do a lot of backbreaking labor, live in precarious conditons. They are both very, very poor, have no access to basic amenities, and their children usually starve. They are equal.

And this forum regularly talks about them. What's your point? Or are you arguing that we should have personalised threads for every single person?

[Don't Swallow The Cap]

Dentists and sweatshop workers both earn wages. They both work for very little, do a lot of backbreaking labor, live in precarious conditons. They are both very, very poor, have no access to basic amenities, and their children usually starve. They are equal.

What are you doing? No one here is trying to downplay the plight of anybody except you. The fact is, this woman died arbitrarily. It should be an outrage regardless of her occupation.

I truly hope this shreds some light on the necessity of the these procedures.

[pastradamus]

You can correct me on this if I'm wrong but I've got the impression (from afar) that the reverse has generally been the case, that there's been more of a "what does the world think of us?" attitude emerging


Whatever works man. Maybe we needed this internation shame to wake up a lot of people sitting on the abortion fence as it were.

[doesn't even make sense]

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

Or one could say that it shows that under Irish law the lives of all women are equally without value. She certainly wasn't bourgeois enough to get airlifted with top priority to someplace that'd save her life, like some politician's daughter might have.

[pastradamus]

Dentists and sweatshop workers both earn wages. They both work for very little, do a lot of backbreaking labor, live in precarious conditons. They are both very, very poor, have no access to basic amenities, and their children usually starve. They are equal.

So we should not care about this person? Is that what you are saying?
It sets a serious precedent in Irish law to legislate for abortion and you are telling us we shouldnt care about her because she's not living in squalid conditions?

[BOZG]

So we should not care about this person? Is that what you are saying?
It sets a serious precedent in Irish law to legislate for abortion and you are telling us we shouldnt care about her because she's not living in squalid conditions?

I had a quick look at Beetb's previous posts. I wouldn't say it's been the realm of possibility that Beeth thinks that workers in the west are bourgeois...

[Robespierres Neck]

This is sad, disturbing, and unjust. The baby was dead for fuck's sake. Hopefully this story will provide certain changes or protests to Ireland's "Catholic laws". It's a shame it had to happen to anyone.

[BOZG]

This is sad, disturbing, and unjust. The baby was dead for fuck's sake. Hopefully this story will provide certain changes or protests to Ireland's "Catholic laws". It's a shame it had to happen to anyone.

There was up to 20,000 people on the demonstration / vigil in Dublin plus a few thousand more on smaller demonstrations around the country.

The government has already been under limited pressure to legislate for the ruling of the Supreme Court from 20 years ago which ruled that abortion was legal under limited circumstances. This will put quite a bit more pressure on them though they still appear to be dragging their heels.

A Labour MEP has claimed that in the short term, they might introduce a Statutory Instrument, which is like a governmental decree, to give legal protection to doctors who want to carry out a termination. The problem with an SI is that they can be changed again at the whim of the government and is probably more liable for legal challenges.

[A Sovereign Womb]

Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist?
Presumably, had she been on welfare, the state would have been justified in murdering her.

Incredible.

[Luís Henrique]

Just trying to show that if a somewhat privileged person dies, it is a tragedy. It is news. But sweatshop workers suffer every day ... thats not news. Even on a leftist forum, one of the members said she was an asset - why, because she was a dentist? See what I mean? Even leftists are such victims of cappie propaganda that they measure humans in terms of money, success etc., which is dehumanizing.

Yes, the ideas of the dominant class are the dominant ideas.

A few years ago, when Israel invaded Lebanon, people were most disturbed by photographs of shattered middle-class apartment buildings, well-dressed corpses, and destroyed automobiles. Which was one reason that the Israeli government tried hard to censor such images.

Among middle-class Brazilians at least, it was a kind of awakening - they earnestly believed that Israel only killed "beduins" or poor people living in rural environments, shanty towns, huts, etc - people similar to those favela dwellers they are so afraid of. Suddenly they realised Israel was killing people like themselves - shelling apartments like their own, straffing cars just like the ones they drive, killing babies that could be their children.

Of course it didn't help that Israeli official discourse was exactly that of destroying "huts", and was outright unmasked by the images.

It may have been a turning point in the average Brazilian's view on the Middle-East conflicts. Is that good or bad?

So... yes, the death of a dentist may have much more impact on the public opinion than the death of a poor stay-at-home mom, or a prostitute, or a garbage collector.

What I know for sure is that the life of female prostitutes, garbage collectors, and stay-at-home mothers won't be made easier if the State can get away with the bureaucratic murder of a middle class woman.

Luís Henrique