Latinos as whites on government documents.

[Yuppie Grinder]

Why do you think it is that on all government documents Latinos are categorized as whites when they generally don't identify as white?

[Anarchocommunaltoad]

Latino isn't a race, although it is ridiculous that period with an obviously non white skin palette are classified as Caucasian.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Don't they usually have a latino (non-white) option as well on those forms?

[Devrim]

Why do you think it is that on all government documents Latinos are categorized as whites when they generally don't identify as white?

Aren't Latinos white?
Do you consider Spaniards to be white?
What about Turks, or Arabs?
(I am not being sarcastic here. I have always thought of these people as white and am quite surprised to hear that you don't.)

Devrim

[Winkers Fons]

A lot of Hispanics I know do actually consider themselves to be white. Don't see how this really matters though.

[#FF0000]

Aren't Latinos white?
Do you consider Spaniards to be white?
What about Turks, or Arabs?
(I am not being sarcastic here. I have always thought of these people as white and am quite surprised to hear that you don't.)

I don't know about Spaniards but in the US, Turks and Arabs aren't really considered "white".

[Lenina Rosenweg]

Ethnic/racial designation in the US is an odd thing.Hispanics are not one group. There are Mexicans-residents of the "Mexican cession", the area the US seized from Mexico, descendants of older waves of immigration, and more recent undocumented workers. Mexican people generally have a high degree of Native ancestry and are not phenotypically "white".There are large numbers of people from Central American nations, including many Mayans.There are smaller number of European derived people from Argentine, Euro-Amerindian from Chile, Bolivia, etc.

Cuban-Americans, especially the "gusanos" the large immigration after the Cuban Revolution, are largely "white". Puerto Ricans are white/African/Amerindian. Dominicans are white/African.

There is much variety among Spanish speaking groups and within groups.

In the US generally Arabs would not be considered "white" unless they look European. Assad is "white" while Qaddaffi was not. If a person from Turkey looked generally Western European they would be "white".

Of course I think this whole classification is beyond idiotic but it has played a historic role in US society.

[Tim Cornelis]

Neither Hispanic nor Latino is an ethnic classification, nor are Hispanics of Spanish descent. Hispanics can be 'black'/Africans, 'white'/European, or mestizo. Generally Hispanics are mestizo (ca. 70-80%), it makes as much sense to classify them as 'white' as it is to classify them as Amerindian. But racial classification is generally arbitrary. Turks are generally not considered 'white,' whereas Hungarians and Slavic peoples are. In the US, though, Arabs, Berbers, Turks, and Iranians are apparently considered white by the government.

"Hispanics" or mestizo should logically (as far as that's possible with racial categorisations) be categorised as mixed.

EDIT:

As of 2010 Turkish, Iranian, and Arab Americans are apparently not considered white anymore.


As the 2010 census form did not contain the question titled "Ancestry" found in prior censuses, there were campaigns to get non-Hispanic West Indian Americans,[17] Turkish Americans,[18] Arab Americans and Iranian Americans to indicate their ethnic or national background through the race question, specifically the "Some other race" category.

[Devrim]

I don't know about Spaniards but in the US, Turks and Arabs aren't really considered "white".

Famous (non-white) people:

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQVacT6z2IUsrsMbRwChGn0LyCwEghIe VJ42_9_61xpN5kjM86H



http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSEIJkqDJeIpgAQr9isYiWNiCpa2oZfY 2eZOZ5P_2qFOo2F-gl--A

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQY-o9iLA2MGak1UDw7Z8uH4plwZrIp-KF0UC_ekraqDLfSIPAHQQ

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR_MEM2eBiWQxOv4yQJTSbmGOM9EXztN lmIHgy-M2XwgFL7T9NFwA

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT75fxjjyb0dHM9MGgVD3FNhjT70c4UU xmtOYpl_SUkDSsZtMUY

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQQ099ByjFPA0RvmciqlQ639-CoM8fGYH5Shnz8xNMMSi37YKpz

These are all famous Turkish people. What colour do you think they are?

Devrim

[Devrim]

As she has been mentioned in the thread, what colour is this Arab woman?

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQk2mwHBHyg5MPqvRwb8r8ApjiJK-20sLxeot3YgyGRIW4t1HQX

Devrim

[Tim Cornelis]

These are all famous Turkish people. What colour do you think they are?

They are pink-ish. Chinese people have the same skin colour as the people you showed, but that doesn't make Turkish people Chinese. I'm not saying Turks and Arabs are not white, but racial classification has rarely been about skin colour (alone).

I don't think colours should be used to describe people anyway, white, yellow, black, or red sounds a bit dehumanising to me.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Neither Hispanic nor Latino is an ethnic classification

On certain government/administrative forms it is, though.

With regards to who is white and who isn't white, it isn't just about skin color, although skin color is a related feature. As TC mentioned, many east Asians have a skin color hue that's essentially "white", but they are never going to be considered to be "white". Traditionally in the USA, being "white" meant that you were from Anglo-Saxon or perhaps German stock...later on it become more and more inclusive, as other previously maligned minorities (Irish, Jews, Italians etc) were brought it. Irish people have always been white as goddamn snow, so it's not just about that. It's kind of a weird sociological phenomenon, honestly if I think about it too long I get a headache.

I can tell you, though, that there is a fairly large seasonal population of Turks in my town, and they are definitely not considered "white".

[Pravda]

And whole my life i thought i was part of glorious white race. So disappointing:(

[hetz]

And whole my life i thought i was part of glorious white race.

What? Dissapointed? Turks are way more popular right now...:laugh:

http://tvsapunice.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/sulejman_velicanstveni_2.jpg

[Pravda]

Ah, yes:D
But seriously, i never imagined that in USA white means Anglo-Saxon. That is so weird.

[#FF0000]

Famous (non-white) people:
These are all famous Turkish people. What colour do you think they are?

Devrim

yeah, not saying i agree w/ it. It's a hella dumb and extremely arbitrary way of looking at people. If someone "looks white", they're white.

[Devrim]

What? Dissapointed? Turks are way more popular right now...:laugh:

http://tvsapunice.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/sulejman_velicanstveni_2.jpg

I quite like Muhteşem Yüzyıl. :blushing:

Devrim

[Thirsty Crow]

I quite like Muhteşem Yüzyıl. :blushing:

Devrim
Is that the series you're talking about or a person?
If it's the former, I'm disappointed :lol:

[Devrim]

Is that the series you're talking about or a person?
If it's the former, I'm disappointed :lol:

It is the series. I did put the little embarrassed face their for a reason. I suppose it would translate into English as Magnificent Century. Do you have it in Croatia too?

Devrim

[Zealot]

The "official" racial distinctions are pretty lame. In New Zealand, on official documents, there is no option for "New Zealander" or for people of mixed race. You either have to be a European New Zealander, Native, or other. This is fairly unusual since New Zealand no longer has "pure" natives who are all more or less mixed and many of them identify as mixed until they have to sign official documents and take a side.

[Thirsty Crow]

It is the series. I did put the little embarrassed face their for a reason. I suppose it would translate into English as Magnificent Century. Do you have it in Croatia too?

Devrim
Yes, for quite a while now, after the groundbreaking role that "Binbir Gece" played in popular culture here. Turkish tv shows have become quite a thing here, to the point that reference to it ("Magnificent") have found their way to quarrels in the parliament :lol:
Here, they've resorted to simplicity in translation - "Suleiman the Magnificent".

It bored me more than anything else, both shows in fact (something of an exception was "Ezel").

[Omsk]

I must say, Ezel was actually pretty good.

[cynicles]

Such arbitrary classification, I've known greeks who are so dark they get mistaken for arab and they're considered 'white'.

[Anarchocommunaltoad]

Such arbitrary classification, I've known greeks who are so dark they get mistaken for arab and they're considered 'white'.

But Greece is the cradle of western (and due to this white) civilization! They're white even if my eyes say they're not!- The U.S Bureau of Statistics

[Leo]

Oh my god the fucking Turks are taking over the world it's so weird that all you guys are talking about Turkish tv shows.

[Human Lefts]

In the US, it has been my experience that forms ask people to identify as

White
Black
Asian
Native American

Then they ask: Are you Hispanic?

That's it. Nothing about Turkey or China. On some forms, I have noticed that the options are white non-hispanic and white hispanic. That's stupid because someone can identify as black Latino. In fact, there are hundreds of thousands of people in Latin America that identify as black Latino.

Race = based on physical appearance. The US version was invented during the colonial periods to create divides between Western Europeans, Western Africans, and Peoples from the other side of the Atlantic.

Ethnicity = based on culture stemming from common history, values, beliefs, system dynamics, and world view, and people have a common identity

Latino is an ethnicity. It's a pan-ethnicity that encompasses all the major ethnicities of Latin America. Latin America is basically every Spanish speaking country south of the US and includes Brazil. Hispanic excludes Brazil and includes Spain. People can be white, black, Asian, and/or native American and still be Latino.

So, is it a conspiracy of bourgeoisie and authority, or just plain idiocy? I don't know. Who benefits from the only whites being able to identify on paper as Latino? That would be my first direction, but I can't think of anyone at the moment.

[GPDP]

I always find it amusing when I have to put down that I'm a hispanic white, when my skin is almost as dark as the average black person's.

Although to be honest, I haven't had the chance to fill out a form that has an Other option in which you can write down your race. I'll totally write in "human" if I do.

[agnixie]

Aren't Latinos white?
Do you consider Spaniards to be white?
What about Turks, or Arabs?
(I am not being sarcastic here. I have always thought of these people as white and am quite surprised to hear that you don't.)

Devrim


I don't know about Spaniards but in the US, Turks and Arabs aren't really considered "white".

I've met very few arabs in the US, especially recent immigrants, who didn't consider themselves some degree of white (and I have arabic family). The US has a stupid perspective on this shit because they mix up racism and nationalism. In the end it all serves the same purpose.

[Manic Impressive]

This thread reminded me of this


The latest piece of nonsense to come from race-obsessed South Africa is the news that there has been an official ruling that the Japanese are to be classified as white.
Looking for the base economic motive that is usually to be found lurking behind the high-sounding racial twaddle, we find that the South African government is very anxious just now to encourage trade with Japan. Naturally, it would not do to make the Japanese suffer all the indignities which are the common lot of the black part of the population. A Japanese businessman thrown out of a hotel reserved for whites or pushed into the dingy part of a post-office to wait his turn with the downtrodden blacks might cancel his order for South African wool!
As so often happens with this racial nonsense, the perpetrators find themselves getting more and more involved in their own idiocies. On this occasion it appears that the locals find it hard in practice to distinguish between the Japanese and the Chinese. Since the Chinese are officially labelled as non-white, the Japanese are still being insulted since they are continually being mistaken for Chinese.

[Ocean Seal]

Aren't Latinos white?
Do you consider Spaniards to be white?
What about Turks, or Arabs?
(I am not being sarcastic here. I have always thought of these people as white and am quite surprised to hear that you don't.)

Devrim
Most of us living in the US don't identify as white and most people here don't identify us as white either. Considering most of us are mixed race or non-white altogether, its not surprising.

[Louis Riel]

The real problem here is that Latinos are being considered white in the eyes of the law when they don't receive the benefits of white political, economic and social dominance. European Americans have an obvious leg up in American society that Latino peoples don't. This deprives them of government recognition of this because they are lumped in with the WASPs

[Luís Henrique]

Aren't Latinos white?
Do you consider Spaniards to be white?
What about Turks, or Arabs?
(I am not being sarcastic here. I have always thought of these people as white and am quite surprised to hear that you don't.)

Devrim

"Race" is a social construct. What is considered "White" in civilised countries like Turkey or Brazil is not necessarily considered "White" in the United States.

Luís Henrique

[Thelonious]

People who are called Latino can be of any race. I am considered Latino and of mixed race (my mother is Cuban of European descent, my father is Cuban of African descent). If you are Cuban and descended from only European stock, you are a Latino and white.

Lately, the term "hispanic" is starting to become more of a pejorative term.

I don't believe in the concept of separate races anyway. There is only one race: The Human Race.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Hispanic