Why do poor people vote for right wing?

[Take The Long Way Home]

Just an question why do poor people vote for right-wing,do they want to have private schools,private heaths care,bigger taxes,.... just dont say that they arent educated,and you dont need to be a genius to tell the difference between a guy that wants to give you heath care,public schools,... and a guy who wants to take all this from you.


just look at this its just an example but just look
elections.huffingtonpost.com/2012/romney-vs-obama-electoral-map

here you see how fucked up USA really is,EU isnt really any different but still. I dont say that obama is any good but he is still much better than romeny and people still vote that republican douche. More than half of your states are freaking *****

[Questionable]

False consciousness is a part of social reproduction.

In a way the workers aren't so stupid for pursuing the "right-wing" agenda. As workers, it is, in a way, within their interests to insure that capitalism is functioning so they can have jobs. I'm not saying that this should be a long-term strategy but there is some logic when workers behave this way, even if it will turn back to bite them in the ass.

As proletarians though, the abolishing of private property is within their class interests, but most people don't get that far because they're constantly bombarded with bourgeois propaganda from the day they're born.

[x-punk]

Im sure everyone has their own specific reasons for doing it. Some may believe the propaganda that the economy will be better run under a right wing govt. Others may do it because they want to associate themselves with the wealthy, upper class types to try and boost their egos. Im sure you could make a fairly long list of different reasons.

[campesino]

emulation of the ruling class, this is why many poor people shop as if they were rich, have political views as they were rich, want to be rich.

[Thirsty Crow]

Im sure everyone has their own specific reasons for doing it. Some may believe the propaganda that the economy will be better run under a right wing govt. Others may do it because they want to associate themselves with the wealthy, upper class types to try and boost their egos. Im sure you could make a fairly long list of different reasons.
But of course, the underlying point is that this can be attributed to the fabled false consciousness.

I'm wondering how does that notion tie in with Marx's remark that the ruling ideas in any given society are those of the ruling class, or to paraphrase, those that perform the function of an ideological defense of the existing conditions.

[TheRedAnarchist23]

Poor people in my country don't even vote. In the last election (2011) 40% of the population did not vote.

None of our major parties are right-wing, some are centrist, others are social-democrats.

[Questionable]

Poor people in my country don't even vote. In the last election (2011) 40% of the population did not vote.

But voting is a sacred privilege and a sign that we're free!

[Philosophos]

Well people are uneducated about the way they should think. They don't have critical judgement and only a few very gifted on the mind people can actual start THINKING without a lot of help. The rest of the people keep on believing the things other people tell them as they are the truth.

Also people can't realise they are in the working class. They just don't seem to understand it.

Those same people believe that we need a capitalist government no matter what because nothing else works (they think they know all the systems even though they haven't studied/tried something different. It's like saying "I don't like chocolate even though I haven't tasted it"...).

In addition not all people have the knowledge needed to fight the capitalists' propaganda even if it's on the news or the ads or anything else. Not even half of the adults on this planet can realise (without a proper education) that there are emotional tricks/quotes and the worst kind of psychological techniques in advertisements so the big heads can control you and all the people around you, so these people become the victims of the right wing, the fasist groups etc.

If you terrorise people and put fear in their hearts you are going to control them completely just for a few years the most. If you control their mind making them think they are free you can do whatever the hell you want with them, aka voting the same ol' same ol'

[thriller]

Social issues sometimes play a big part in elections. Many poor people are religious. Marx pointed this out. If it comes to issues on gay marriage and abortion, they vote in accordance to there religious views. When it comes to economic issues, I think many poor people know that democrats really don't give a fuck. But when they see a republican saying "see, you can be like me too! A rich person who came from nothing and rose to this height" the lower echelon of people will vote for them. It's part of the American psyche. Even though it is not true, we are brainwashed into thinking that the "American dream" is accessible to everyone at anytime. Obama has not done a good job of portraying a rags to riches story/policy. So if one is in rags, why vote for someone who doesn't say they can become extremely rich?

[ComradeOfJoplin]

The right politics are about going the try and true ways of the past. Left politics are about change in hopefully a better direction. People naturally fear change. So as a result people will not go in a different direction and will grasp at straws to find anything that proves that the change is detrimental to there government, culture and life.

[Althusser]

I think that the working poor see themselves as less worthy to be outspoken or have political convictions in their class interests because of their current economic state.

I think this is why I mostly see middle class and rather privileged people in the US marching and going to meetings. I feel as if the bourgeois propaganda has put the working class in a mindset that they "don't deserve it" based on the contradictory capitalist ideological point that "working harder than everyone else means more money/better living standards."

This is of course is bullshit, and this is why we need leftists to talk to workers and share knowledge with them, dispel taboos about leftist political thought, point them to a book or two.

Not "educating" them or talking from a pedestal. Aside from economic retardedness, one of the main reason I hate these libertards is their condescending need to point out that everyone except them are sheep.

[jookyle]

A lot of times, especially in capitalist society, people with little means look upon those with everything with jealousy rather than contempt.

[Take The Long Way Home]

ok got it,some people aren't proud of being working class and they want to cover this by shopping for useless stuff,.... they want to get as closer to the higher class as possible so they take bank credits to spend even more and this helps them boost some of their morality up.

So the problem is the education system,the schools the media are teaching us that we need to be better,richer,more powerful and if we dont succeed we are simply human trash ,if the media was teaching that beeing working class is awesome, higher class isnt good its's bad things would be a lot more different.

[Thirsty Crow]

ok got it,some people aren't proud of being working class...
...if the media was teaching that beeing working class is awesome, higher class isnt good its's bad things would be a lot more different.
There's no reason to be "proud" of you class position as there is no reason to fethisize working class identity since, after all, it outright sucks being a wage slave and we actually strive for the elimination of said class.

And how, exactly how would the media, the dissemination machine for the ruling ideas of the day, spread the idea that the ruling class sucks ass? Imagine a journalist answering to her editor who answers to the owner of the paper in the case if a piece reviling the said owner came out.

And this: why do you think that such an impossible thing as media glorification of working class identity would actually contribute something to class struggle?

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I don't know about other countries, but in Holland, poor people (and even not-so-poor people) love to point the blame to others. Preferably other groups of people.
We've all seen it happen in the 1930's in Germany, where Hitler blamed Jews, Blacks, Gays and what not for the miserable economic situation back then.
Here in Holland, there already have been several rightwing parties blaming Muslims after 9-11.

It's all the fault of the immigrants and aid-funds for the third world countries. It's not our fault we're poor now!

Oh it's so easy, isn't it?

[tachosomoza]

In the United States, the white proletariat in the Southern states votes for the major "rightist" party (Republicans) because Presidents John F. Kennedy and Lyndon B. Johnson, who belonged to the Democratic Party, signed the civil rights and voting rights bills which extended the right to vote in the South to people of color. The Republicans under Richard Nixon capitalized on the extreme reactionary and racist nature of most of the white proletariat in the Southern United States, and as a result most of them have voted right wing since 1968, whereas before they were dyed in the wool Democrats. In essence, racism and reaction to equal rights for people of color.

[hetz]

In essence, racism and reaction to equal rights for people of color.
But if you look at American right-wing movements today you'll see that the main issues they care about isn't civil rights but taxation ( poor people basically fighting for less taxes for the rich, heh ), various government programs and so on.

[Take The Long Way Home]

There's no reason to be "proud" of you class position as there is no reason to fethisize working class identity since, after all, it outright sucks being a wage slave and we actually strive for the elimination of said class.

And how, exactly how would the media, the dissemination machine for the ruling ideas of the day, spread the idea that the ruling class sucks ass? Imagine a journalist answering to her editor who answers to the owner of the paper in the case if a piece reviling the said owner came out.

And this: why do you think that such an impossible thing as media glorification of working class identity would actually contribute something to class struggle?


i said if the media,...

because man people take tv so serious they do everything the tv tells them to do they think as the tv says,...

[Regicollis]

In Denmark we are blessed with a social democratic party that is amazingly incompetent at governing. The people experience the leftist parties making big promises before elections only to dump them all and adopt neo-liberal policies once they are in power. Thus the left looses credibility and makes themselves unpopular among the people.

People then vote for the openly bourgeois parties. At least they are not lying and incompetent. Also there is some nostalgia towards the bubble economy of the 00's where middle class and upwards people experienced great increases in personal wealth. Maybe people dream of getting the housing bubble back by voting for the bourgeois parties.

A huge part of the explanation to why poor people support bourgeois policies is the massive propaganda machine that is a part of every capitalist society. The bourgeois media have a narrative where rich people are described as successful individuals who are a benefit to all of society. Furthermore the media is overpopulated by 'experts' who present bourgeois policies as if they were scientific truths.

I think there is a lot of truth in the statement that poor people don't think they deserve to hold political views. They are constantly being told that they are to blame for their own situation and are a burden on society. The entire way the bourgeois system talks about poverty is designed to induce low self-esteem and shame into the poor.

So if we assume the problem is due to propaganda the obvious way to fight back would be to fight for free and diverse media. Back when leftist parties or unions controlled their own media class consciousness was much higher than it is today. If we were some way to get back to that situation much would have been won.

[Workers-Control-Over-Prod]

Because the right wing express the hatred that the working class feel but cannot define. So instead of hating your boss who is actually responsible for your oppression, you hate on the gays, the unionized teacher, the immigrants.

[Geiseric]

emulation of the ruling class, this is why many poor people shop as if they were rich, have political views as they were rich, want to be rich.

^This. It's a concept that Antonio Gramsci called "Cultural Hegemony." It's why everybody hates folk music, because it has more to do with their lives than idealist hair metal.

[Yuppie Grinder]

The resentment the American working class has towards the liberal left exists for a very good reason. The white working class are seen as infantile inbred moonshiners and bible beaters. If only they listened to what the learned academic liberals had to say they'd be fine.
The liberal left is just as condescending to the black working class, but aren't as up front about it. Overall the story is a lot worse, though. The democrats hijacked the black liberation movement, robbed it of its revolutionary potential to preserve the white supremacy integral to western capitalism.
People are right too be distrusting of the left establishment, they are just to discriminatory with who they blame for their oppression.

[hetz]

It's why everybody hates folk music, because it has more to do with their lives than idealist hair metal.
That would make sense if gangsta rap, hip-hop, basically pop music in general weren't so popular.
And what the hell is "idealist" about metal?

[Yuppie Grinder]

^This. It's a concept that Antonio Gramsci called "Cultural Hegemony." It's why everybody hates folk music, because it has more to do with their lives than idealist hair metal.

ow, my brain
have you even read Gramsci?

[Ethics Gradient, Traitor For All Ages]

But if you look at American right-wing movements today you'll see that the main issues they care about isn't civil rights but taxation ( poor people basically fighting for less taxes for the rich, heh ), various government programs and so on.

The taxes are a smoke screen, they aren't upset about the government programs so much as who they perceive as being the primary beneficiaries of those programs. If taxes remained at their current levels but the money was piped entirely into the military instead of social programs a lot of that resentment would disappear overnight.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I mean, take our (Holland's) new parliament.
In today's newspaper, the leader of the biggest (and also the most right-winged party around) was compared with Karl Marx! Marx of all people!
Why?
Because of their new taxing changes. The rich are going to be paying a bit more and the poor are going to pay a teeny tiny bit less.
The rich assholes called it "levelling" ("Niveleren" for us Dutchies) and thus they compared him with Marx' socialism.
I mean...how!?

And you know what is worst?
The workers here are actually mad about the leveling!
They are desperately defending the class that submisses them.
Is it a sort of social-S&M?

Of course i couldn't help but to react to the piece on their (the newspaper's) website.
There even was a piece of [email protected]#$ Bourgiousist wining about how he thought that 70.000 euro's isn't a high wage! :cursing:
Holland's average is 33.000! He makes over the double!
Or should i count in the unemployed? (i personally think i do!) Than average is 22.000! Then he makes over the triple!!
Poor him...i'd like to shoot the poor bastard! :cool:

Added his reaction (in dutch of course) as an attachment.


I still believe it's because the proletariat still believes that one day they too will belong to the bourgiousie.

[Let's Get Free]

Because of the ideology and ideas of the ruling elite, which is imposed by this dominant elite onto all members of society, and makes the interest of the elite appear to be the interest of all.

The ideology of the capitalist society is enormously important, since it confuses many workers and causes them to vote against their own economic and political best interests.

[Prof. Oblivion]

Just an question why do poor people vote for right-wing,do they want to have private schools,private heaths care,bigger taxes,.... just dont say that they arent educated,and you dont need to be a genius to tell the difference between a guy that wants to give you heath care,public schools,... and a guy who wants to take all this from you.

Why don't you ask a republican? Most of them will gladly tell you. ;)

[GPDP]

The taxes are a smoke screen, they aren't upset about the government programs so much as who they perceive as being the primary beneficiaries of those programs. If taxes remained at their current levels but the money was piped entirely into the military instead of social programs a lot of that resentment would disappear overnight.

This. One has to realize that a lot of right-wing rhetoric, especially in the states, is full of code words and ready-made talking points that say one thing but inwardly mean something else. When Republicans talk of maintaining law and order, they mean to say they're going to make sure disenfranchised people stay that way and don't get too uppity. When they speak of reforming welfare, they mean to make it harder for black and hispanic "welfare queens" (among other oppressed groups) to get government assistance. And reactionary workers implicitly understand these things, and cheer them on.

[TheOther]

The answer is this: "Did you know that we are ruled by television?" -Jim Morrison, The Doors. I think that the real cause of why many poor americans vote for capitalist parties is the very very powerful effect of the newspapers, television and radio stations have on people.

You know where I live, some times I listen to the classical rock music station, and that station has lots of anti-black people, anti-spanish, anti-muslims, anti-gays, anti-poor people jokes. You know jokes in the mainstream media are another way of mind-manipulating the masses toward right-wing parties. Another tool and vehicle used by the US rulers is the movies. Lots and lots of hollywood movies have even anti-Castro, anti-muslims subliminal messages.

The USA as a whole is a hardcore ultra-right wing propaganda terrorism all over the place. The extremism and radicalism of ultra-right wing advertising is all over the place in America.

So I think that the real answer to your question is the high levels of ultra-right wing pro-capitalism anti-socialism psychologic terrorism played on the minds of all americans is really the real reason of why 90% of US citizens vote for capitalist parties (Democrats and Republicans), and only 10% or even less vote for marxist parties (Socialist Party, Green Party etc)


.



Just an question why do poor people vote for right-wing,do they want to have private schools,private heaths care,bigger taxes,.... just dont say that they arent educated,and you dont need to be a genius to tell the difference between a guy that wants to give you heath care,public schools,... and a guy who wants to take all this from you.


just look at this its just an example but just look
elections.huffingtonpost.com/2012/romney-vs-obama-electoral-map

here you see how fucked up USA really is,EU isnt really any different but still. I dont say that obama is any good but he is still much better than romeny and people still vote that republican douche. More than half of your states are freaking *****

[Marxaveli]

^This. It's a concept that Antonio Gramsci called "Cultural Hegemony." It's why everybody hates folk music, because it has more to do with their lives than idealist hair metal.

Gah, you beat me to it. :lol:

Gramsci's work is pretty under appreciated imo.

[TheOther]

You know I have always loved the poor people a lot, I love the poor people a lot, and of course because leftists are supposed to harbor and defend the poor. But there is a problem I've been noticing with the behaviour patterns of poor people. The problem is that poor people, who are not to blame for their poverty really, and are really victims of the capitalist free market oligarchical economic system. Some times, their behaviour patterns tend to be too unfriendly, too social phobic, too anti-social.

And I am agnostic and feel confused how to react in a situation, where you want to be loving and friendly with your poor oppressed unemployed neighbors who are beating the bullets economically, but at the same time, because we are not machines made of metal, but humans with hearts and souls. It is almost impossible to break the ice with poor folks in America, in order to strike a conversation with them about politics, food prices, gas prices, inflation, and the destruction of their buying power of the dollar, and the destruction of real wages and real incomes. And socialism as the solution for that.

But Like i said poor people in America are very violent and unpredictable. And I don't know wether they are guilty of their anger and immoral behaviour or not guilty at all. But to tell you the truth, I live around a lower-middle class neighborhood. With houses around 40,000 to about 80,000 the most expensives. And these people, most of them are nurses, supermarket cashiers, fast food workers. And some might be bank employees (The richest ones), but because of their dubious class possition between lower-class and real middle class like doctors and lawyers. They seem to me too confused about their own class, and that confusion of not being able to identify with the lower-classes and neither with the professional high-salaries doctors, lawyers and professional middle classes, throwns them toward a ROBINSON CRUSOE EXTREME FEUDALIST LONELINESS (HOW SAD). They seem around here too unfriendly, and I've noticed that most of my neighbors around here, hate me, and are very very unfriendly.

I ALSO HEARD STORIES THAT POOR PEOPLE IN TRAILER PARKS HATE EACH OTHER AS WELL. SO, I THINK THAT WITH A POOR POPULATION IN AMERICA THAT IS SO NEGATIVE, SO NARCISSIST AND SO UN-WILLING TO UNITE INTO A MOVEMENT AGAINST THE OLIGARCHIC RULERS OF THE USA, I REALLY DON'T SEE A GOOD FUTURE FOR SOCIALISM IN AMERICA.

AND FROM MY OWN PERSONAL WORLD VIEW OF HOW RELUCTANT THE POOR CLASSES OF AMERICA ARE TO BE FRIENDLY ENOUGH TO UNITE INTO A SOCIALIST POLE AND FROM ALL THESE BEHAVIOUR PATTERNS OF THE POOR SECTORS OF THE COUNTRY, IT WILL BE A LOTEASIER TO SEE THE RISE OF AN ADOLF HITLER AND A NAZI FASCIST DICTATOR DEMAGOGUE IN AMERICA IN A REVOLUTIONARY SITUATION AND IN AN INFLATIONARY CURRENCY MELTDOWN OF THE US DOLLAR AND A DEEPER CRISIS OF THE US ECONOMY. MAY THE LORD PROTECT US ALL FROM A POSSIBLE HITLER !!

SORRY IF I SOUND TO NEGATIVE, BUT THE THING IS THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW PROOF OF HOW 95% OF US VOTERS ARE VOTING FOR CAPITALIST PARTIES, AND LESS THAN 5% ARE VOTING FOR ANTI-WAR PARTIES. THAT IS A PROOF OF HOW AMERICANS STILL LOVE WARS, ZIONISM, BANKS, CORPORATIONS, AND HOW THERE IS AN EXCESS OF RACISM AGAINST BLACK PEOPLE, HATRED AGAINST GAYS, IMMIGRANTS ETC.


.





Just an question why do poor people vote for right-wing,do they want to have private schools,private heaths care,bigger taxes,.... just dont say that they arent educated,and you dont need to be a genius to tell the difference between a guy that wants to give you heath care,public schools,... and a guy who wants to take all this from you.


just look at this its just an example but just look
elections.huffingtonpost.com/2012/romney-vs-obama-electoral-map

here you see how fucked up USA really is,EU isnt really any different but still. I dont say that obama is any good but he is still much better than romeny and people still vote that republican douche. More than half of your states are freaking *****