what is the point of the IWW

[campesino]

let's say I join the IWW, now what?

Is the IWW going to negotiate contracts, organize boycotts and strikes, organize the take over of the means of productions?

I understand joining the PSL because they are politically active, and have the intent of creating socialism, and pursue it through electoral means and demonstrations.

but the IWW what is it, a union or a political party? Is it exclusively anarcho-commie or can M-Ls or any other socialist tendency join and participate?

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Joining the IWW is like joining a gang. It basically means you've got a crew to get your back in any conflict with management and bosses. Sometimes the IWW negotiates contracts, but often they just show up and tell bosses something to the effect of ". . . or else" with remarkable success.
It is not a "political" organization, so those of any political persuasion can join, as long as they are committed to direct seizure of the means of production by the working class (and the general framework laid out in the the preamble to the constitution).
I say, "Go for it." It's a great way to learn about workplace direct action, a great crew of people to drink with (if that's your digs), and it's good fun to be able to wave your union card threateningly at belligerent employers.

[campesino]

can't wait too see Noam Chomsky rough up my boss.

I never thought of the IWW as a worker's "gang," they should spread this message around, that would get many people to join. That is a cause many worker's would gladly pay dues to finance.

[Veovis]

Only thing I disagree with the IWW is the fact that they reject contracts altogether. Makes it really easy for the bosses to go back on their word.

[Trap Queen Voxxy]

To go HAM, comrade.

[campesino]

To go HAM, comrade.

what does that mean?

[Trap Queen Voxxy]

what does that mean?

Hard As a Motherfucker

[Questionable]

Joining the IWW is like joining a gang. It basically means you've got a crew to get your back in any conflict with management and bosses. Sometimes the IWW negotiates contracts, but often they just show up and tell bosses something to the effect of ". . . or else" with remarkable success.
It is not a "political" organization, so those of any political persuasion can join, as long as they are committed to direct seizure of the means of production by the working class (and the general framework laid out in the the preamble to the constitution).
I say, "Go for it." It's a great way to learn about workplace direct action, a great crew of people to drink with (if that's your digs), and it's good fun to be able to wave your union card threateningly at belligerent employers.

Are there any stories of this happening? I'm not saying you're a liar but that's such a badass description that it requires proof before I digest it.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Are there any stories of this happening? I'm not saying you're a liar but that's such a badass description that it requires proof before I digest it.

Yeah, there was a story in @news recently about some owner of a vegan restaurant in Portland or whatever who got approached by the IWW one day. He told them to eat shit and die, though. Caused a big stir in the activist ghetto cuz this guy had been under investigation by the feds because of his involvement with the Earth Liberation Front. Oh, how small business ownership corrupts even the staunchest radicals!

http://anarchistnews.org/content/war-calendula

[GiantMonkeyMan]

I'm certain I read somewhere that some workers on a cruise liner had beef with their management but couldn't do anything about it as they were in another country. IWW got involved, organised and co-ordinated strike action, saved the day etc etc...

[Raúl Duke]

If IWW is like a "labor gang"
I wanna join...
too bad I'm unemployed.

[Questionable]

If IWW is like a "labor gang"
I wanna join...
too bad I'm unemployed.

Unemployed people are allowed to join, according to their constitution.

[o well this is ok I guess]

If IWW is like a "labor gang"
I wanna join...
too bad I'm unemployed. Naw man that's perfect that means you only pay 5 bucks a month for membership

[Robespierres Neck]

If IWW is like a "labor gang"
I wanna join...
too bad I'm unemployed.

I'm currently unemployed as well. Florida is amazing, eh? :rolleyes:
Speaking of that, have you been feeling the weather? It's very nice.

Also, I have a friend that's part of the IWW. It's a legitimate group that's very rich in its history.

[Regicollis]

I'm not very familiar with the IWW but the little I know leaves a positive impression. They seem like the kind of unbureaucratic and radical union you would want to be part of.

If they were active where I live I would join.

[Devrim]

Only thing I disagree with the IWW is the fact that they reject contracts altogether. Makes it really easy for the bosses to go back on their word.

This isn't actually true. The IWW accepts contracts, and even has a few no-strike deals.

Devrim

[Raúl Duke]

Speaking of that, have you been feeling the weather? It's very nice.

:)
I've been waiting all summer for the weather to get like this!

[The Douche]

The IWW is less of a gang and more of a historical society which occasionally functions in the same manner as most other unions.

[Art Vandelay]

The call for one big union is not only outdated, but futile; that being said, given that the IWW allows dual membership and that one understands the organizations limitations, becoming a member can be a positive thing in the overall class struggle.

[Prometeo liberado]

The call for one big union is not only outdated, but futile; that being said, given that the IWW allows dual membership and that one understands the organizations limitations, becoming a member can be a positive thing in the overall class struggle.

I'm not getting how the call for "One Big Union" is outdated and futile. Isn't the idea of one giant organized body what we are all about? Be it a class, union or Party it's about all of us acting as one, organized as one. Unity is only outdated and futile when defeatism becomes relevant and progressive. You gotta look beyond the narrow prism of word definitions and focus more on the enlightened phrase. IMO.

[Art Vandelay]

I'm not getting how the call for "One Big Union" is outdated and futile. Isn't the idea of one giant organized body what we are all about? Be it a class, union or Party it's about all of us acting as one, organized as one. Unity is only outdated and futile when defeatism becomes relevant and progressive. You gotta look beyond the narrow prism of word definitions and focus more on the enlightened phrase. IMO.

The call for one big union is rooted in economism; rejecting the necessary political struggle which must be engaged.

[Prometeo liberado]

The call for one big union is rooted in economism; rejecting the necessary political struggle which must be engaged.

I think you may be assuming that they are dogmatic syndicalists. The phrase has a much larger meaning than to just form a union and call it a day. It's not a simply literal phrase is what I'm saying.

[citizen of industry]

Well, there's the IWW archive on Marxists.org for theoretical questions and their website and paper "Industrial Worker" for modern stuff. They are a union independent of any federation that emphasizes direct action and abolition of wage labor. Their pamphlet "How to fire your boss" is a good guide to unionism. They are basically what communists demand from a trade union, and generate a lot of hate from communists for some reason, even though they don't discriminate by party affiliation and support dual carding, I guess because they are a union and not a party.

[citizen of industry]

Actually it's a pattern I've noticed a lot. Parties endlessly criticize the labor aristocracy, but when unions split from it and adopt a militant platform, they are criticized by parties for being syndicalist. And for focusing on fighting in the workplace instead of abadonding that for struggles against the leadership of the federations, which is like trying to win a presidential election in the US.

[Rugged Collectivist]

The call for one big union is rooted in economism; rejecting the necessary political struggle which must be engaged.

Can a union not engage in political struggle? Or, by political struggle, do you mean parliamentarianism?

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Syndicalists don't reject political struggle - it's one of the things that makes them different from normal unions.:closedeyes:

Also, the IWW is not an An-Synd group. It's economist, but that doesn't mean it isn't useful.

[bricolage]

The IWW is less of a gang and more of a historical society which occasionally functions in the same manner as most other unions.
I think this is slightly unfair in that the IWW also occasionally functions in a completely different manner to most other unions (more common wildcats, activity in precarious sectors, illegal activities). The problem is that this is generally part of a process to get it into a position where it can function much like other unions and when certain sections have signed no-strike pledges and the like this isn't the result of a long running desire to nefariously fuck over the workers it claimed to represent but rather a reflection of the social position the organisation has managed to raise itself too. But I mean in the UK recently workers at some Pizza Huts organised as part of the IWW and did all kinds of wild actions and got a pay rise, if I was working somewhere like that at the moment I'd want a pay rise and the mainstream unions aren't gonna touch it so I'd seriously see what the IWW could offer. When people join just as political militants though and not cos the IWW is somehow useful as a tool to gain better working conditions where they are, I think it's all a bit misguided. I'd also add that the IWW seems really decentralised so different groups in different areas appear to be massively different.

And yeah, of course the historical society bit is true as well.

[NoOneIsIllegal]

Are there any stories of this happening? I'm not saying you're a liar but that's such a badass description that it requires proof before I digest it.
Our local branch shut down a Starbucks during morning rush for several hours until the entire Great Plains regional manager, and their personal boss, would agree to sit down and give in to some of their demands.
Was a great, beautiful moment of solidarity. I was honestly surprised how well the customers reacted to the shutdown, as the business-district in this town will kill for a cup of coffee in the morning. It was very well orchestrated and it shows the workers can and will stand up for what they believe in.

[NoOneIsIllegal]

The IWW is less of a gang and more of a historical society which occasionally functions in the same manner as most other unions.
The former: this isn't 2001 anymore. There's a clear difference between the union of pre-2005, and 2005-2012. Although you do have a valid point when it comes to some of the branches with a bunch of old-timers, such as Chicago.

The Latter: fair enough. At end of the day, a lot of the more radical unions still act as yellow-unions to a point because they aren't demanding absolute control over their worker, but rather concessions from their employers. The adoption of "direct unionism" and "solidarity unionism" is a nice stray from the path of business-unions, but it essentially comes down to every local branch and their autonomy and decisions on how to go about things. Some branches are much more passive and reformist than others (Denver, Chicago, Boston). Then some branches are much more outgoing and willing to do shit (typically the Midwest scene besides Chicago).

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

The IWW is less of a gang and more of a historical society which occasionally functions in the same manner as most other unions.

Way to recycle anarchist bookfair trashtalk circa 2007. While I agree that may have been the case, it certainly isn't any longer. IWW Dual-Carders kicked off the wildcats on the praries that lead to the national CUPW strike. Wobblies have won paycheques for personal friends by directly confronting bosses. Wobblies I know personally were on the front lines of the Quebec Student strike, and active in CLASSE.
Get over the boring-ass insurrectionismist rhetoric, and dig the ways the IWW is actually fomenting direct confrontation with capital.

[hetz]

The call for one big union is rooted in economism; rejecting the necessary political struggle which must be engaged.

Class consciousness is a higher form than "trade-union consciousness", but what you're saying doesn't make sense.
Does the PAME in Greece exist to turn the workers against genuine class consciousness?

[The Douche]

Way to recycle anarchist bookfair trashtalk circa 2007. While I agree that may have been the case, it certainly isn't any longer. IWW Dual-Carders kicked off the wildcats on the praries that lead to the national CUPW strike. Wobblies have won paycheques for personal friends by directly confronting bosses. Wobblies I know personally were on the front lines of the Quebec Student strike, and active in CLASSE.
Get over the boring-ass insurrectionismist rhetoric, and dig the ways the IWW is actually fomenting direct confrontation with capital.

Asking for money is what passes as "direct confrontation with capital" now?

Unions gonna union...

Also, you know what I got for my dues in the IWW? A whack newspaper (it was cool to hear about labor struggles around the world, but it had absolutely no theoretical content), and a cute little red card to put in my wallet.

Nobody from any branch of the IWW ever got in contact with me to find out why I joined or if there were struggles I was engaged in where I could use support or anything.

So, organizational issues aside (which very well may have been corrected since I was a member), there is still the issue of the IWW settling contracts, and being a union (an institution which can only exist under capitalist social relations), so thats always going to limit its potential as a revolutionary vehicle.

Interesting projects have grown out of the IWW recently though, like SeaSol, but I dunno if they're still active.

[campesino]

@The Douche
way to kill my enthusiasm, it needed some dampening, though. I looked up seasol, seems like a pretty cool group, it seems they are still active, judging by their website.

[The Douche]

@The Douche
way to kill my enthusiasm, it needed some dampening, though. I looked up seasol, seems like a pretty cool group, it seems they are still active, judging by their website.

I don't want to just dissuade you from joining the IWW, my comments should always be taken with a grain of salt, I'm a pretty jaded and bitter dude.

By all means, join the IWW, I can think of worse ways to spend time and money. But don't expect a red card to bring the revolution closer, know what i mean...