Have you ever lost hope?

[Philosophos]

Lately I've been feeling really stressed and angry and so on so on so on and that's one of the reasons that I went to a therapist. I have some issues that have to do with myself and other people around me.

First of all I think that people around me don't seem to realise at all what politics is all about (they still think that the governments are in charge of everything) and they don't want to realise that. When I'm talking to them I'm trying to be as polite as I can (you know I'm not grabbing them from the head when I'm having a conversation) I'm calm and noone seems to understand my views not because I'm bad with words but because they don't want to. As a result I tend to see other people that don't have the same ideas as I do as they are lower-class/animals you know worse quality than I am. I know it's wrong but I can't help it.

This situation is making me lose my hope to humanity (you know I'm 18 and I want to change the world). Have you ever felt this way? Have you overcome it? What did you do?

I want my peace but my mind keeps thinking like it's in ultra-turbo-godlike mode and I can't stop even for a second, so any advices will be welcomed.

Thanks in advance.

[ind_com]

High levels of class consciousness are not easy to achieve for large sections of the working classes. Long periods of leadership through example are required.

[Comrade Jandar]

Have I ever lost hope? Yeah. It happens about every fucking day.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Not really lost hope. At least not for a long time.
I do doubt my own ideas very often, which is a good thing.

[rylasasin]

I basically have.

Hence I spend most of my time gaming/imagining/engaging in other forms of escapism.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Oh yeah, only every other month...

No seriously, i've had to cope with a little burn-out a while ago and for all my life i once in a while i loose hope.
I feel like i am insignificant, just a cog in the machine and i can never make a difference.
My mind always is on overdrive.
People around me know shit, at least not about the things that make me go :thumbup:

There are some differing reasons for that.
I know mine now.
Get to know yours.

Sounds easy but it isn't.
I saw a psychiatrist, the guy was only interested in why my wife and i fought a lot.
I told him it was because i had no job at that moment, money was tight and i was depressed.
So instead of treating the cause, he treated the symptom.
Asshole...

So i googled, read a lot of pages and wikipedia, got to learn a lot and made my own conclusions. I'm happy and i accepted what i am now.

What i'm trying to say that you have to be lucky in seeing the right specialist, but please do so.
Don't be a fool...help yourself.

[The Jay]

I focus on individuals rather than everyone.

[Art Vandelay]

Whenever I lose hope I read some Stirner and remember that to a certain extent I need to elevate myself above society, while still attempting to change it; kinda a synthesis between Marx and ole Max.

[Robespierres Neck]

I feel that way every day, especially lately. The lack of class/political consciousness of my environment gets to me too. Stay strong. :star3:

[Rafiq]

Firstly, learn to separate your personal, emotional dillemas with your theory, which should be completely objective and scientific, devoid of any emotional influence.

Secondly, remember this is not about an end goal. Remember that life is not a static state of affairs, it is a constant process, and you must indefinitely struggle. It is not about achieving personal happiness or harmony in your life.

[Dean]

Lately I've been feeling really stressed and angry and so on so on so on and that's one of the reasons that I went to a therapist. I have some issues that have to do with myself and other people around me.

First of all I think that people around me don't seem to realise at all what politics is all about (they still think that the governments are in charge of everything) and they don't want to realise that. When I'm talking to them I'm trying to be as polite as I can (you know I'm not grabbing them from the head when I'm having a conversation) I'm calm and noone seems to understand my views not because I'm bad with words but because they don't want to. As a result I tend to see other people that don't have the same ideas as I do as they are lower-class/animals you know worse quality than I am. I know it's wrong but I can't help it.
I have had the exact same feelings as you. But I think its important to understand that the people you are talking to are not only to blame. So are you.

I know I come off as very offensive a lot of the time now. It is the only way I can find to make it real to people. So when I talk to people about preeminent politicians, I am very graphic in how I describe them. So I might describe contemporary US policy in Honduras as forced abortions under the guise of DEA-paramilitary enforcement of rich landowners' rights. This particular characterization is of an multi-national joint DEA operation that killed two pregnant women in Honduras, who received no comment even when the US DEA official was confronted with the issue.

Often its much more descriptive than that. I went through a phase where I ceased to call the US nation as fascist, because it is one of those things that make you appear unduly radical. But the problem is that it fits, and at 26, I've decided to reintroduce the term to how I describe US national policy. Surprisingly, the ethnic character is still strongly correlated with US foreign policy and capital movement.

But the thing is that you really do have to come above the dominant narrative. The best advice I can give you to be more successful with your discussions with other people is to completely cut out mainstream US media from your news diet, and when you describe issues, make a strong attempt to distance yourself from prominent narratives of the political parties or the establishment.

For instance, this is how NOT to describe the collapse of the USSR: "It was a consequence of capitalist pressure and global domination." This may have truth to it, buts its needlessly polemical.

A better explanation: The USSR collapsed so that private corporations could acquire the capital and wage labor of the state-built industries in the former soviet states, and for this reason Yeltsin handed control over the economy to Chicago School academic idealists that had already destroyed the Chilean economy and sent the Children back into the mines after kicking out the democratically elected Marxist Allende, whose major crime was the attempt to acquire national economic independence, which is precisely what the USSR had stolen from it up until Putin re-centralized that power.

The specificity of the second narrative helps it, and whats better, it is known and acknowledged by the state. Better, the leading parties and media have little opinion on the issue since investigative or historical journalism doesn't really exist.

The biggest problem is in giving any weight to the narratives of the leading parties and propagandists. Although it can help to slip in vague overtures to the narratives your particular partner believes in; I wouldn't abuse this or say anything you don't believe at all, though.


This situation is making me lose my hope to humanity (you know I'm 18 and I want to change the world). Have you ever felt this way? Have you overcome it? What did you do?

I want my peace but my mind keeps thinking like it's in ultra-turbo-godlike mode and I can't stop even for a second, so any advices will be welcomed.

Thanks in advance.
Well, you're passionate. I strongly recommend not losing that attitude. I don't think you're looking at people right, though. Its important to keep in the front of your mind that people believe in bullshit, and often very vile bullshit, because the alternative appears to be worse: being morally alone. Being alone in seeing that the dems and republicans are both evil, brutal politicians who slaughter peasants for no good reason but the stock values of mining firms or similar petty concerns. I mean, this shit is obvious, and the best example for this is that very few people actually come up with support for this kind of slaughter without a deliberate, strong propaganda campaign to portray people as enemies or otherwise subhuman. It's definitely a fascist system, but like all fascist systems, the evil comes from up top.

Stay away from the shit they feel like they have no choice but to believe in. If you have to stick to those issues - make it clear just how vile the masters are. Frame it as the brutal, evil regime it is, and stay clear of terms like "imperialism" and "fascism" unless they come near the end of a convincing exposition of how S. African peasants are ground up for Anglo American profits or our entire framework of privacy and judicial rights have been usurped in a bipartisan implementation of corporate totalitarianism. If you can't be diplomatic, make sure that they'll be embarrassed to support the worthless fucks on top of the dog pile.

[Ele'ill]

Aside from what I pm'd you I'd say find other people that you can relate with and not just other generic leftists but leftists that you can love. Equally as important is maybe finding non-leftists that you can love and genuinely connect with because radicals get so fucking annoying.

[Questionable]

Secondly, remember this is not about an end goal. Remember that life is not a static state of affairs, it is a constant process, and you must indefinitely struggle. It is not about achieving personal happiness or harmony in your life.

Struggle for the sake of itself, or towards some ultimate goal?

[Philosophos]

I think what he wants to say is that we will struggle for the ultimate goal but when we reach it we won't stop there and leave it static because life is always changing and we have to adopt new policies/attitude... That's what I got at least :)

[TheRedAnarchist23]

Whenever I lose hope I read some Stirner and remember that to a certain extent I need to elevate myself above society, while still attempting to change it; kinda a synthesis between Marx and ole Max.

Best solution! When feeling like you have lost hope, just read some books to refresh the dogma!

[Ler]

Speaking from self experience, and from the experience of my closer comrades, long periods of depression are fairly common for most socialists. It makes sense that it would happen - The system is designed to keep people uneducated, and to punish those who refuse to conform to said ignorance. It is also, perhaps a lot harder for the average socialist to deal with depression, because we can't fake the mindset of 'Everything is going to get better on it's own'.

When it comes to trying to make your friends understand your political beliefs, I believe Lenin put it best, when he said "Patiently explain".

[freethinker]

When it comes to trying to make your friends understand your political beliefs, I believe Lenin put it best, when he said "Patiently explain".

To fit your point today I asked someone what they knew about Marx and I had to explain to him that Marx wasnt Russian.. :blink:

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

To fit your point today I asked someone what they knew about Marx and I had to explain to him that Marx wasnt Russian.. :blink:

Oh damn...

[Zealot]

Pretty much every day. Regardless of how much hope I have in humanity, I am convinced that Marxism is scientific and objective and I always will be convinced of that.

[Soomie]

I do unfortunately lose hope every once in a while. It doesn't help that I already suffer from depression anxiety, possibly due to me having asperger's (haven't been formally diagnosed yet, but think I have it). Hearing ignorant people try to have a say in anything is painful. I almost feel bad for them, because they truly believe what is coming out of their mouths. For everyone I enlighten or help to understand, there are 10 more who want to remain ignorant and won't pay attention to reason. I would even understand if I explained how something worked, and a person understood and simply said, "You know, that's great, but it's not for me." Honestly, I would understand. What I don't like is people who dispute a fact because they don't like it. You may not like communism/socialism, but this is how it works, this is how it is. You can't argue how it simply IS. If you understand it and just don't like it, that's one thing.

But, really. I've just had to stop myself from thinking about it, or else I just stoop into another depression. I'm 19, at university. I've had to work and go to school to support myself alongside what my parents are able to help me with. I don't own a car, so I have to walk to school 30 minutes one way everyday. I had medicaid until I turned 18, so now I no longer have health/dental insurance. I have racked up a nice amount of student loan debt, and I'm considering moving out of the country one day to avoid it. I hope for a better day, but I just can't dwell on it with everything else that is going on.

Life is too short to be miserable. It's hard, but try not to sit around and mindfuck about things.

[Art Vandelay]

Best solution! When feeling like you have lost hope, just read some books to refresh the dogma!

What the fuck are you on about now?

[Anarchocommunaltoad]

I've gone through a Huey Freeman phase or two (you can't save everybody; and even if you could are they worth it?)but i always recover.

[Red Commissar]

I'm not very well read in philosophy, so I can't really bring much to the table here beyond my personal experience.

I've lost hope plenty of times. When I was first starting into socialism as I was leaving high school and going into college I entered into an optimistic phase that I had it all figured out. I knew why the world was wrong, why it was heading into a bad direction, and what should be done to move it back on track. Of course I had to deal with the reality of having to defend my views against people who could care less for them, as well as having to acknowledge that I don't know everything.

Eventually I just got into a point where I thought everyone else was dumbfucks, pretty much everyone couldn't stand me. I don't think this was good for me because it isolated me socially and even though I thought I could get along without social contact and devote myself completely to the struggle, I ended up getting into more of a dark spell and in a more crabby mood. My parents and friends often say I was a lot more moody and angry at this phase.

Honestly the way I got out of this was shifting around my old friendships. I ditched a lot of my old friends who were conservatives or lolbertarians, and shifted more towards my liberal ones because they were at least more open to talking to me. This forum helped out a lot too- I know people chastise echo chambers like ours but they serve an important role to remind us that we aren't alone in our beliefs, particularly useful if you don't know anyone personally at the time that shared your views- this was true of me two-three years back. It's not healthy to get into constant conflict with people, it just makes everyone in the equation feel bad. Surrounding yourself with people you actually like, not those from your previous years, goes a long way.

On top of that I re-evaluated and solidified my views. Got deep into reading Marx, talked to people more informed on the matter. If arguing with people is bothering you, there could be the matter that you are having doubts with the feasibility and possibility of what ever ideology you subscribe to, you should save yourself a lot of grief and re-evaluate whether you really belong there. I know some my chide me for driving away someone, but you shouldn't force yourself into something you aren't.

I know it's tough over there in Greece (massive understatement), but you should try and find some hobbies to blow off your steam. Books, video games, exercise, nature, what ever- can't be constantly doing one thing. Maybe this is distraction but honestly I think I would be driven mad if it was politics 24/7, if I didn't have some books to read and music to listen to balance out my day. I guess it also helps that I have a fairly chill and relaxed family.

When you get into arguments, don't start with the full 10 point program of x group. Be mindful of what you choose to discuss, try to pick away at stuff like wars like Dean brought up on the last page. Be mindful of language you use, don't get into using things that go over their head or is beholden to mainstream interpretations of an event. Don't become a caricature of the crazed, polemical radical the media often portrays, show them something else. Bring them over to your viewpoint bit by bit. If they are the sociopathic types who apologize for the suffering in the world then move on. You're as likely to convince that person of your points as s/he is to convince you about theirs.

I think almost everyone goes through this at somepoints- what matters really is if you stick my your ideals or if you write it off as youthful ignorance and subsume yourself into the majority as a number of people do.