Fuck the People of America

[milkmiku]

Yesterday at 2pm, CNBC acts as the only mainstream news outlet to upload a release over a new lawsuit claiming evidence of the Federal government and top US banks colluding to launder 43 trillion dollars, enough to pay off the entire US debt almost 3 times over.

The orginal CNBC article was pulled but here is the WSJ
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/major-banks-governmental-officials-and-their-comrade-capitalists-targets-of-spire-law-group-llps-racketeering-and-money-laundering-lawsuit-seeking-return-of-43-trillion-to-the-united-states-treasury-2012-10-25
(http://www.marketwatch.com/story/major-banks-governmental-officials-and-their-comrade-capitalists-targets-of-spire-law-group-llps-racketeering-and-money-laundering-lawsuit-seeking-return-of-43-trillion-to-the-united-states-treasury-2012-10-25)

3 and a half hours later that same day (reported on today), the daughters of the executive of CNBC’s digital division (read: their website) are both killed by the family's nanny who was supposedly “a very nice woman”, “very religious”, and “has always been very, very stable”.
http://www.kvue.com/news/176007461.html

No one will give a fuck about this and wright it off as a coincidence. Fuck the people of America, you deserve every bit of the economic hell that is coming.

No one will be punished, there will be not protest, no out cry, not nothing. Fuck America, fuck the banks.

[milkmiku]

Related

http://sherriequestioningall.blogspot.com/2012/10/cnbc-article-on-43-trillion-lawsuit-has.html

link to the 414 page lawsuit
http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/5857/usaracketeeringonmortga.pdf

Already people are running around screaming "FAKE IT IS ALL FAKE!", Holy fuck, people will gleefully walk towards the gas chambers at this rate, as long as the goverment tells them they are just getting a shower and msnbc or fox tells the it is true.

[Mass Grave Aesthetics]

yeah, as if political backwardness is unique to the US at present.:rolleyes:

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Damn, at least give us a few days before you say nothing will happen, this is the first I heard about this. And can you really blame Americans for not acting when nobody knows about it yet and the media isn't even reporting it?

[hetz]

Somehow I hoped this would be more constructive than "SHEEPLE ZOMG!!!1" but okay...

[Comrade Samuel]

Damn, at least give us a few days before you say nothing will happen, this is the first I heard about this. And can you really blame Americans for not acting when nobody knows about it yet and the media isn't even reporting it?

I'm sure they will, you know how they just love it when the government fucks something up. :rolleyes:

I'm an American and I care just enough to investigate this a little bit more...

[Prometeo liberado]

What is in the water out there in Florida that makes you write like this?

[Zealot]

America is one of the most reactionary places on earth? Well, I never...

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

Fuck the people of America, you deserve every bit of the economic hell that is coming.

No not fuck the people...



Fuck America, fuck the banks.

Now that's more like it.

Don't blame the people, blame the system.



What is in the water out there in Florida that makes you write like this?

I think it's the swamp-gasses...

[doesn't even make sense]

What is in the water out there in Florida that makes you write like this?

I don't know but I sure as hell don't touch the stuff.

[Rafiq]

My oh my, well isn't this cute, a third worldist is spewing all sorts of moralist garbage attacks on American proletarians because they're not as "aware" or "enlightened" as he/she is. And if we're going to morally attack people on this sort of level, we may as well blame them for their social being, after all, to idealists, consciousness determines social being, and not the other way around! Makes you wonder why you'd even call yourself a communist, if you'd ever adhere to such nonsense. Sorry, milkmiku, on behalf of the American proletariat, I'm sorry that they are incapable of fully intellectually repelling bourgeois-state propaganda that is shoved up their asses on a consistent basis, I'm sorry that within the capitalist mode of production, false consciousness is an actual social component of production, I'm oh so very sorry, you're right, it's the fault of the workers themselves on an individual level that they haven't reached even an elementary form of class consciousness.

Even sadder, your rhetoric about the "American people". It's funny because Third worldists are completely incapable of formulating even the most basic and elementary form of a class analysis, instead, they have to categorize states by their "people", and as a result formulating an obscure geopolitical conception of our world, that it's "X people" vs. "X. people" (First world, vs Third world, etc.). Really, I can't say I blame third worldists, their beliefs are not really just misunderstandings in themselves, they are a direct reflection of their own stupidity. So, milkmiku, who are the "American people" and why do they, of a sudden, share a homogeneous interest? Yes, let's throw away over a hundred years of Marxism in light of this prospect, something which I'm sure no one has ever addressed, previously in the history of our existence.

[Leroy Brown]

In the first place, a lawsuit is not a finding of fact. It's just an allegation or cluster of allegations. Anyone can sue anybody for anything, and they often do. I can file a lawsuit tomorrow alleging that you are mentally disturbed (due to that water supply issue) and that you need to be committed to a psychiatric hospital. Will I win?

Let's see if these plaintiffs prove some part of this lawsuit before we go smashing the windows of Wells Fargo and J.P. Morgan. Since the entire money supply of the entire world is certainly less than $100 trillion, the whole claim sounds preposterous on its face. Maybe I'm wrong. That's what trials are meant to sort out.

What I fear will happen is that the courts will eventually dismiss the suit as crackpot, which will make you think that capitalist judges are in on the big conspiracy, too.


Sorry, milkmiku, on behalf of the American proletariat, I'm sorry that they are incapable of fully intellectually repelling bourgeois-state propaganda

Did you look at the list of defendants? A lawsuit claiming money laundering by the Chairman of Citigroup and the Attorney General of the USA is not "bourgeois-state propaganda." You are far more mis-informed than milkmiku.

[Marxaveli]

My oh my, well isn't this cute, a third worldist is spewing all sorts of moralist garbage attacks on American proletarians because they're not as "aware" or "enlightened" as he/she is. And if we're going to morally attack people on this sort of level, we may as well blame them for their social being, after all, to idealists, consciousness determines social being, and not the other way around! Makes you wonder why you'd even call yourself a communist, if you'd ever adhere to such nonsense. Sorry, milkmiku, on behalf of the American proletariat, I'm sorry that they are incapable of fully intellectually repelling bourgeois-state propaganda that is shoved up their asses on a consistent basis, I'm sorry that within the capitalist mode of production, false consciousness is an actual social component of production, I'm oh so very sorry, you're right, it's the fault of the workers themselves on an individual level that they haven't reached even an elementary form of class consciousness.

Even sadder, your rhetoric about the "American people". It's funny because Third worldists are completely incapable of formulating even the most basic and elementary form of a class analysis, instead, they have to categorize states by their "people", and as a result formulating an obscure geopolitical conception of our world, that it's "X people" vs. "X. people" (First world, vs Third world, etc.). Really, I can't say I blame third worldists, their beliefs are not really just misunderstandings in themselves, they are a direct reflection of their own stupidity. So, milkmiku, who are the "American people" and why do they, of a sudden, share a homogeneous interest? Yes, let's throw away over a hundred years of Marxism in light of this prospect, something which I'm sure no one has ever addressed, previously in the history of our existence.

I agree with all this, but to be fair, I feel the OP's frustration in a way. As an American myself, I see the anti-socialist and Marxist rhetoric around me everyday, and I can't help but think that these people live in one big giant bubble of Stockholm Syndrome. I remind myself though that this is the fault of capitalist hegemony, and not because they are American or any particular nationality. This reactionary tripe isn't unique to America of course, but when you live in a certain place and see it all the time day after day, that tends to be the first thing you lash out at.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I blame the constant pro-capitalist propaganda.
Don't know about the US, but here in the Netherlands, i'd say about 70% only knows the bad-communism, 20% knows the true story but still thinks capitalism is best, 9.5% likes communism but doesn't think it will ever happen and about 0.5% probably visits this site...

A very rough estimate by me. (no official figures, but it sure feels this way)

[Leroy Brown]

You don't still think the OP has proved his case I hope?

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

You don't still think the OP has proved his case I hope?

Hell no! Just stating some numbers.
Much like Rosa's~Dream i understand his frustrations.

[Beeth]

Although the op is wrong in targeting workers of one particular nation, he is right in a general sense that workers are essentially ignorant, violent, and reactionary. No amount of denial will change that. Lenin and Trotsky recognized this, hence the idea of vanguard. Workers cannot be trusted to do anything right - they need a guiding hand from the enlightened class among them, namely the class-conscious vanguard.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Fuck the people of America, you deserve every bit of the economic hell that is coming.
Gee, and you're restricted. I can't guess why.

[Art Vandelay]

Although the op is wrong in targeting workers of one particular nation, he is right in a general sense that workers are essentially ignorant, violent, and reactionary. No amount of denial will change that. Lenin and Trotsky recognized this, hence the idea of vanguard. Workers cannot be trusted to do anything right - they need a guiding hand from the enlightened class among them, namely the class-conscious vanguard.

Fuck off with this nonsense, you have neither a conception of the working class, or of the Vanguard party; your comment is an insult to the many members of the working class who populate these boards and are intelligent and dedicated Marxists.

[Ostrinski]

Holy shit, and I read this as "Fuck the police of America." I was like, yeah, I can go with that. Fuck the police everywhere, but fuck the police of America especially.

Then I re-read the title of the tread and I shamed myself for a minute accepting the possibility that milkmilku could say something that socialists would find reasonable.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

...workers are essentially ignorant, violent, and reactionary...Workers cannot be trusted to do anything right - they need a guiding hand from the enlightened class among them, namely the class-conscious vanguard.
Further proof that vanguardists have a petit-bourgeois mentality with contempt for workers.

[Ostrinski]

What Beeth said isn't a representation of what vanguardists think. I wouldn't consider myself a vanguardist myself, but that's just dishonest.

[Beeth]

Further proof that vanguardists have a petit-bourgeois mentality with contempt for workers.

Are you denying that most workers the world over aren't given to reactionary thoughts and ideals? Are you saying most of them are class-conscious? If you are, consider this. Who is racist toward immigrant workers? Other workers ... which is why the bourgeois' anti immigrant policies are often successful. The same goes for sexism, homophobia, pretty much everything. It is easy to blame the ruling class, but the truth is that workers actively rather than reluctantly participate in this system.

[Beeth]

Fuck off with this nonsense, you have neither a conception of the working class, or of the Vanguard party; your comment is an insult to the many members of the working class who populate these boards and are intelligent and dedicated Marxists.

Dude, calm down. Not many ppl on this board are intelligent or dedicated. Most of them are morons, not very different from other morons who form the working class the world over.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

I love how none of you even cared to read the fucking first post, instead insisting on jolting mockeries at the title and bringing this into a field of third-worldist strawmen where everybody can poke sticks at nonexistent claims.

Alright, we get it - not all of the American working-class is reactionary. Now talk about what MM actually posted (which is quite disturbing), and drop the topic-derailing, sensationalist bullshit.

[Mettalian]

Further proof that vanguardists have a petit-bourgeois mentality with contempt for workers.

I believe this is referred to as a hasty generalization.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Are you denying that most workers the world over aren't given to reactionary thoughts and ideals?
Do you understand how ideology functions in a class-based society?

[Os Cangaceiros]

yeah, as if political backwardness is unique to the US at present.:rolleyes:

It's a good comment and I think it should be repeated.

OP, the condition of the US public getting obviously screwed, and yet being oblivious to said screwing, is really a condition of people the world over. Some say that it's just the way the human race is: a majority of people get screwed, and then there's a much smaller class of people who are doin' the screwin'. I think it's a little more complicated than that, but you get the idea.

So really there's nothing to single out America for in this particular regard...

[Art Vandelay]

Do you understand how ideology functions in a class-based society?

Do you understand what a vanguard is? Clearly not....

[The Jay]

Do you understand what a vanguard is? Clearly not....

There are multiple interpretations. Which one do you think the response is directed towards?

[#FF0000]

Dude, calm down. Not many ppl on this board are intelligent or dedicated. Most of them are morons, not very different from other morons who form the working class the world over.

"everyone is dumb but me. im different and special u see im smart everyone else dumb" - a dumb person

also are you a sock of that nerd from awhile back who was all "ohh im a freudian now most workers want to be exploited cause they get off on it gbgubgubg"

[Beeth]

"everyone is dumb but me. im different and special u see im smart everyone else dumb" - a dumb person

also are you a sock of that nerd from awhile back who was all "ohh im a freudian now most workers want to be exploited cause they get off on it gbgubgubg"

In that case we must change the slogan to: wankers of the world, unite. You have nothing to lose but your sperm.

[Beeth]

Do you understand how ideology functions in a class-based society?

Yes, yes, workers are innocent little angels, and their pure hearts are corrupted by capitalist propaganda.:rolleyes:

[LiberationTheologist]

A lawsuit that is sure to get tossed unfortunately.


I fully disagree with the badly misprogrammed and misguided so called communists who are unable to correctly blame a large section of the US populace namely every registered and voting Democrat and Republican. That large group of people endorse the crimes of murderous wars and capital conquest carried out by their government.

I have little doubt that the most vociferous people in this thread and on this board saying don't blame the people are registered and/or voting Republicans and Democrats. People call cry reactionary all day, that slur is meaningless in the face of reality.

[Marxaveli]

Indeed they are corrupted by capitalist propaganda and culture. They sure as hell weren't born that way, and as a Marxist you should know this very well.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Yes, yes, workers are innocent little angels, and their pure hearts are corrupted by capitalist propaganda.:rolleyes:
So your answer is no, you don't understand how ideology works in a class-based society. As a member of the working class, I think you're a pseudo-revolutionary who feels the need to have someone to look down on.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

Do you understand what a vanguard is? Clearly not....
Vanguard as in the most advanced section of the working class or vanguard party who sees its leadership as the essential part of revolution?

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

I love how none of you even cared to read the fucking first post, instead insisting on jolting mockeries at the title and bringing this into a field of third-worldist strawmen where everybody can poke sticks at nonexistent claims.

Alright, we get it - not all of this country are reactionary. Now talk about what MM actually posted (which is quite disturbing), and drop the topic-derailing, sensationalist bullshit.

I don't think they really care... :(

[Beeth]

Indeed they are corrupted by capitalist propaganda and culture. They sure as hell weren't born that way, and as a Marxist you should know this very well.

Even an expert hypnotist cannot make you do things against your will. So if a hypnotist makes you commit murder, it means deep down you always had that desire. Blaming propaganda is an excuse. Truth being, even without propaganda, people will act this way.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Vanguard as in the most advanced section of the working class or vanguard party who sees its leadership as the essential part of revolution?

That's a pretty vast oversimplification of what the vanguard is. It is not the 'most intellectually advanced heroes of socialist thought that will lead the ape-like working people to revolution', as comrade Beeth, the 'Green Socialist' pigs of the middle-east and many other autocrats will tell you. It is a mass movement composed of the working class in it's near entirety. An empowering force that expands to all political, economic and social levels, it is the ultimate form of proletarian organisation.

The stuff about 'enlightened intelligentsia' is a disgusting abberation of what is supposed to happen at the beginnings of the class consciousness' spread: a minority of communist proles who try their best to educate and agitate the working class around them so as to add said working class to their make. This is naturally the case with every organisation on the planet, and is in no way, shape or form anything like the petit-bourgious crap that this 'trot' is unloading.

Also, could the folks in this topic continue your argument about positions on the above in another thread? It's sad that threads with interesting potential like this get trashed because of an emotional comment at the beginning that everybody pounces on, and we should try to stop it as best we can.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

That's a pretty vast oversimplification of what the vanguard is.
Actually, I gave two very different definitions, and was asking 9mm which one he thought I meant.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Actually, I gave two very different definitions, and was asking 9mm which one he thought I meant.
http://www.revleft.com/vb/revleft/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.revleft.com/vb/showthread.php?p=2526237#post2526237) Vanguard as in the most advanced section of the working class or vanguard party who sees its leadership as the essential part of revolution?

Well, to be honest, the definitions aren't necessarily separate at all. As a mass proletarian movement, the vanguard would be led by that same class alone. All provisional members in charge of regulative positions (some could call them leaders) would not only be put in said positions by the proletariat themselves, but would also be subject to the decision of the remaining members.

[The Jay]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/revleft/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.revleft.com/vb/showthread.php?p=2526237#post2526237) Vanguard as in the most advanced section of the working class or vanguard party who sees its leadership as the essential part of revolution?

Well, to be honest, the definitions aren't necessarily separate at all. As a mass proletarian movement, the vanguard would be led by that same class alone. All provisional members in charge of regulative positions (some could call them leaders) would not only be put in said positions by the proletariat themselves, but would also be subject to the decision of the remaining members.


That is completely different from one in which the group of leaders would manage the proletariat even if the people revoked their support.

[Leroy Brown]

Workers cannot be trusted to do anything right - they need a guiding hand from the enlightened class among them, namely the class-conscious vanguard.

A guiding hand?

"Yo, comrade, come over here and tote this bale."

"Nah I don't wanna."

"Yeah, but you gonna."

[The Cheshire Cat]

How the fuck did we get from an article about 43 trilion 'missing' dollars, which is something quite significant, and the death of 2 children that might have something to do with it, to discussing the vanguard in only 1 page? If this lawsuit is going somewhere, and the deaths of the two children do have something to do with it, this is important. We have enough threads about the vanguard system, go talk about it there.

[Rugged Collectivist]

Who cares about the title of the thread? the actual content is what we should be paying attention to.

I think Milkmiku's hatred is misguided, but I can understand it on a certain level.

[thriller]

Yesterday at 2pm, CNBC acts as the only mainstream news outlet to upload a release over a new lawsuit claiming evidence of the Federal government and top US banks colluding to launder 43 trillion dollars, enough to pay off the entire US debt almost 3 times over.

The orginal CNBC article was pulled but here is the WSJ
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/major-banks-governmental-officials-and-their-comrade-capitalists-targets-of-spire-law-group-llps-racketeering-and-money-laundering-lawsuit-seeking-return-of-43-trillion-to-the-united-states-treasury-2012-10-25
(http://www.marketwatch.com/story/major-banks-governmental-officials-and-their-comrade-capitalists-targets-of-spire-law-group-llps-racketeering-and-money-laundering-lawsuit-seeking-return-of-43-trillion-to-the-united-states-treasury-2012-10-25)

3 and a half hours later that same day (reported on today), the daughters of the executive of CNBC’s digital division (read: their website) are both killed by the family's nanny who was supposedly “a very nice woman”, “very religious”, and “has always been very, very stable”.
http://www.kvue.com/news/176007461.html

No one will give a fuck about this and wright it off as a coincidence. Fuck the people of America, you deserve every bit of the economic hell that is coming.

No one will be punished, there will be not protest, no out cry, not nothing. Fuck America, fuck the banks.

Yeah, fuck the people of that nation, because fuck nationalism! :rolleyes:

[Leroy Brown]

the actual content is what we should be paying attention to.


Well, what do you say about the content?

I say it's arithmetically suspect and evocative of black helicopters and The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

Which doesn't make it wrong, but ... color me doubtful for now.

[Rugged Collectivist]

Well, what do you say about the content?

I say the claim is arithmetically suspect and evocative of black helicopters and The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

Which doesn't make it wrong, but ... color me doubtful for now.

Well nothing has been proven yet, but I think there's enough evidence here to raise some suspicion. You don't think it's weird that the nanny conveniently chose to strike after this person seriously pissed off some serious moneyed interests? Once again, nothing is proven and a bit of skepticism is always healthy, but I think there's a little bit more here than some lizard men shit.

[Positivist]

I love how none of you even cared to read the fucking first post, instead insisting on jolting mockeries at the title and bringing this into a field of third-worldist strawmen where everybody can poke sticks at nonexistent claims.

Alright, we get it - not all of the American working-class is reactionary. Now talk about what MM actually posted (which is quite disturbing), and drop the topic-derailing, sensationalist bullshit.

Are you fucking joking? He wrote "the Americans deserve the economic hell that is coming to them." Whether or not he calls himself a thrid-worldist or not he sure thinks like one dividing different workers into "peoples" or throwing everything out as a piss from America. In America we are literally taught in school that communism could never work, that communist leaders were worse than Hitler and books like Animal Farm are part of the curriculum with an anti-communist nterpretation of it enforced by the English teachers. And then even if you do go out and independently learn about socialism nearly every available source accepts anti-communists as fact so worry that the idiot Americans maliciously choose to be ignorant. Fuck off.

[Marxaveli]

Even an expert hypnotist cannot make you do things against your will. So if a hypnotist makes you commit murder, it means deep down you always had that desire. Blaming propaganda is an excuse. Truth being, even without propaganda, people will act this way.

So you believe in free will and biological human nature? Sounds pretty un-Marxist to me. In fact, its beyond that - it is simply wrong, both historically and anthropologically.

All human behavior and action is learned comrade. It is a reflection of current economic, political, and social conditions. If people grow up in a socialist society, they are going to be cooperative, respectful and understanding of one another, and just happier in general. Put them in a capitalist society, they are going to be competitive, greedy, individualistic, and murderous towards one another. This is basic Marxist knowledge man, you should know this stuff.

[Domela Nieuwenhuis]

So...
















Fuck the people of America huh?

I know a few i'd like to fuck! :cool:


Noone wondering why Milkmiku hasn't responded yet!?

[milkmiku]

Noone wondering why Milkmiku hasn't responded yet!?

Because this site is sparsely populated and slow as freezing shit, so I don't feel the need to check back every day.

I admit I was very upset when I made the OP post, I apologize, now can we discuss the topic or do you people need to throw more labels and personal attacks around? Make some more strawman attacks and pat each other on the back mayhap? Masturbation of ones ego is important and healthily.


Back to the topic at hand, Still no big news outlet has talked about this, It'll be swept under the rug in a week or tow, just like the Icelandic Revolution, and be called a "hoax" or "error of judgment".

I truly feel bad for the mans family who had to suffer because of this. Goes to show how far the power that be will go and that the will kill you and get away wit it if they need to.

[A Revolutionary Tool]

Because this site is sparsely populated and slow as freezing shit, so I don't feel the need to check back every day.

I admit I was very upset when I made the OP post, I apologize, now can we discuss the topic or do you people need to throw more labels and personal attacks around? Make some more strawman attacks and pat each other on the back mayhap? Masturbation of ones ego is important and healthily.


Back to the topic at hand, Still no big news outlet has talked about this, It'll be swept under the rug in a week or tow, just like the Icelandic Revolution, and be called a "hoax" or "error of judgment".

I truly feel bad for the mans family who had to suffer because of this. Goes to show how far the power that be will go and that the will kill you and get away wit it if they need to.
Yet nobody at Market Watch has been killed yet...

[Beeth]

So you believe in free will and biological human nature? Sounds pretty un-Marxist to me. In fact, its beyond that - it is simply wrong, both historically and anthropologically.

All human behavior and action is learned comrade. It is a reflection of current economic, political, and social conditions. If people grow up in a socialist society, they are going to be cooperative, respectful and understanding of one another, and just happier in general. Put them in a capitalist society, they are going to be competitive, greedy, individualistic, and murderous towards one another. This is basic Marxist knowledge man, you should know this stuff.

You are right that environment shapes behavior. But we shouldn't on this account slip into some sort of determinism - we are not helpless machines programmed by the environment. We are free, thinking individuals who are being influenced by economic conditions and such - which means we do have the capacity to change our thinking patterns, to break free. Else, there would be no commies, since most of them were raised in reactionary homes, anti communist countries.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

Are you fucking joking? He wrote "the Americans deserve the economic hell that is coming to them." Whether or not he calls himself a thrid-worldist or not he sure thinks like one dividing different workers into "peoples" or throwing everything out as a piss from America. In America we are literally taught in school that communism could never work, that communist leaders were worse than Hitler and books like Animal Farm are part of the curriculum with an anti-communist nterpretation of it enforced by the English teachers. And then even if you do go out and independently learn about socialism nearly every available source accepts anti-communists as fact so worry that the idiot Americans maliciously choose to be ignorant. Fuck off.

I frankly don't care where his or your political alignment lies. This thread is about suspicion of a carer murdering a rich couple's kids for economic interests, not about how many reactionaries (protip: there's only one, and they're restricted for being....reactionary!) you can shove on your pike. If you want to have that conversation, have it with him and in another thread.

[Leroy Brown]

I truly feel bad for the mans family who had to suffer because of this. Goes to show how far the power that be will go and that the will kill you and get away wit it if they need to.


Who had to suffer because of what? The money laundering, the story, the "cover up", or the nutty-sounding lawsuit?

The link between the killings and any of these four is not apparent.

[LiberationTheologist]

So you believe in free will and biological human nature? Sounds pretty un-Marxist to me. In fact, its beyond that - it is simply wrong, both historically and anthropologically.

All human behavior and action is learned comrade. It is a reflection of current economic, political, and social conditions. If people grow up in a socialist society, they are going to be cooperative, respectful and understanding of one another, and just happier in general. Put them in a capitalist society, they are going to be competitive, greedy, individualistic, and murderous towards one another. This is basic Marxist knowledge man, you should know this stuff.

When you use the words all and always you are wrong almost all the time. You are speaking in too absolutist of terms and saying that only behaviorism determines what a person does this is simply untrue. You are stuck in A or B thinking on this one. Corruption, greed and murder are human realities that will not disappear under socialism. Building a better system is what is needed, yes socialism is needed but it alone will not change negative human behavior.

[Yuppie Grinder]

What is in the water out there in Florida that makes you write like this?

All the fluoride the Illuminati puts in the water system to keep the sheeple contented, duh.

[Positivist]

I frankly don't care where his or your political alignment lies. This thread is about suspicion of a carer murdering a rich couple's kids for economic interests, not about how many reactionaries (protip: there's only one, and they're restricted for being....reactionary!) you can shove on your pike. If you want to have that conversation, have it with him and in another thread.

What the hell are you rambling about I wasn't saying anything about restrictions or reactionaires or any of that, I was defending Rafiq's accusation of third worldism aginst milkmiku as relevant because of the divisions he drew and commenting that the manner in which he handled the op was both offenisve and worthy of the scorn it recieved regardless of whether or not the topic is important.

[o well this is ok I guess]

Although the op is wrong in targeting workers of one particular nation, he is right in a general sense that workers are essentially ignorant, violent, and reactionary. No amount of denial will change that. Lenin and Trotsky recognized this, hence the idea of vanguard. Workers cannot be trusted to do anything right - they need a guiding hand from the enlightened class among them, namely the class-conscious vanguard. yo wassup Keynes