A question for Marxist-Leninists and any other Anti-Trotskyists

[Aussie Trotskyist]

A while ago, I came across a group of MLs trying to "Expose Trotskyism". When I began to question them about it, I received the reply:

"...[Trotskyists are] expecting workers to happily allow themselves to be ground into dust beneath the wheels and cogs of "progress", globalism, feminism, LGBTQ ideology..."

My question is, how widespread is this kind of thought? Are attacks against feminism and homosexual rights common? And perhaps more importantly, how is this justified?

Edit: In the case that there is overwhelming support for this type of thought, I have answered I disagree with it, simply so i can see the results. Also, could I please ask that no Trotskyists answer the poll, as I'd like an accurate representation of ML ideology.

[Flying Purple People Eater]

A while ago, I came across a group of MLs trying to "Expose Trotskyism". When I began to question them about it, I received the reply:

"...[Trotskyists are] expecting workers to happily allow themselves to be ground into dust beneath the wheels and cogs of "progress", globalism, feminism, LGBTQ ideology..."

My question is, how widespread is this kind of thought? Are attacks against feminism and homosexual rights common? And perhaps more importantly, how is this justified?

Edit: In the case that there is overwhelming support for this type of thought, I have answered I disagree with it, simply so i can see the results. Also, could I please ask that no Trotskyists answer the poll, as I'd like an accurate representation of ML ideology.

Holy shit. I don't support Marx-Leninism at all, but I'm quite sure they don't keep to viewpoints as reactionary as that!

Perhaps you've had a nice little run-in with Nazbols? Either that, or it's some arse making blind, stubborn sectarian jabs.

[Rusty Shackleford]

some fucking idiots who probably are MLs to the extent that they have a hard-on for soviet militaria.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Those are not MLs.

I have had a talk with a left-com recently, he was against LGBTQ because it was reformism.

[Rusty Shackleford]

you also have some of those folks at the north star arguing in favor of US and NATO intervention in the political and military affairs of Syria and Libya as revolutionary. Even going as far as misusing Malcom X's "By any means necessary" (i believe) to justify their fucketry.

[Aussie Trotskyist]

Those are not MLs.

I have had a talk with a left-com recently, he was against LGBTQ because it was reformism.

The page seemed rather ML orientated.

And of course, if we're talking reformism, the page 'liked' another page called 'Class cooperation' as an alternative to Class War.

[Rusty Shackleford]

The page seemed rather ML orientated.
the point is that each 'tendency' has its share of fools and tools.

[Zealot]

Most of us don't have such reactionary views, fortunately. I'm not even sure why you've asked this question as if you may have had a seed of doubt. I've come across a few idiots from various tendencies before but I don't assume that I need a poll on Revleft just to "make sure" that, for example, Anarchists aren't pro-capitalist.

Let me repeat, these views are not common amongst contemporary Marxist-Leninists.

[Aussie Trotskyist]

Most of us don't have such reactionary views, fortunately. I'm not even sure why you've asked this question as if you may have had a seed of doubt. I've come across a few idiots from various tendencies before but I don't assume that I need a poll on Revleft just to "make sure" that, for example, Anarchists aren't pro-capitalist.

Let me repeat, these views are not common amongst contemporary Marxist-Leninists.

I felt slightly insecure about it, and was sort of afraid that this was a common argument.

I mean no offense, honestly.

[Q]

I don't understand the quote, even after re-reading it several times. Maybe it's a saying I'm not familiar with. Could you rephrase it?

[Aussie Trotskyist]

I don't understand the quote, even after re-reading it several times. Maybe it's a saying I'm not familiar with. Could you rephrase it?

He was saying the LGBTQ and feminist movements were both 'trotskyiste' and grinding the working class into the ground.

[Questionable]

As another Marxist-Leninist I feel that I should step in and say that I don't agree with this at all either.

[Comrade Hill]

"...[Trotskyists are] expecting workers to happily allow themselves to be ground into dust beneath the wheels and cogs of "progress", globalism, feminism, LGBTQ ideology..."


Are you sure these people are Marxist-Leninists? This obviously must be some sort of mistake. This word up here rings a lot of bells.....but they don't sound very pleasant.

[Ostrinski]

It appears we've reached a settlement.

[Rusty Shackleford]

let me guess, was the website red *******? fay-lanks (spelled like the very old military unit involving many spears or pikes) (wow its censored?)

[o well this is ok I guess]

Man I wish we had a comprehensive list of the craziest groups on the left.

[Aussie Trotskyist]

let me guess, was the website red *******? fay-lanks (spelled like the very old military unit involving many spears or pikes) (wow its censored?)

I can give a link to the site, but I have so far been avoiding doing so because it may allow people to easily figure out who I am with minimal effort (considering I commented on it).

I admit, I probably jumped to conclusions because he called me a 'Bourgeois airhead using pesudo-marxist terminology'.

[jookyle]

Don't worry, the LGBTQ community and feminist community are both anti-trotskyism too. We're all together :laugh:

[Permanent Revolutionary]

I have heard it said that ML's have these views, as here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DusX2VeSm-I

But I am skeptical about such generalizations.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

I have heard it said that ML's have these views, as here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DusX2VeSm-I

But I am skeptical about such generalizations.

That guy moves too much.
Can't he get some nice cosplay outfit that is a bit too tight, like MRN, so he won't move as much as my eight year old nephew with ADD?

[The Douche]

Anybody who tried to claim that gay people were oppressing workers would be banned from here. So yeah.

And no, those people you talked with are not MLs or communists at all.

[Rusty Shackleford]

on the social side of things (as opposed to the political and economic side of things) it is a shame to see self proclaimed communists adhere to outdated resources.


id have to say social liberalism is something that should not be opposed. of course, single-issue social liberal movements can be massively wasteful or counterproductive (though not all the time). There is a connection between workers oppression and sex/lgbtq/national oppression in that those other forms of oppression help to intensify workers oppression as the majority of people with 'different' identities are in fact workers as well.

these various movements have intersections with many other movements and if those intersections can become something of an adhesive, then you have the potential for a much more powerful movement.

[hetz]

I suspect this is a troll thread.
If you google " "...[Trotskyists are] expecting workers to happily allow themselves to be ground into dust beneath the wheels and cogs of "progress", globalism, feminism, LGBTQ ideology..." you won't find anything.

Most if not all ML parties today support LGBT rights.
Of course 50-60 years ago there was homophobia in various leftist parties, from Trotskist to Stalinist ones.