Are there any Monarchies left?

[Yazman]

Yeah, I know these "are there any ________ left?" topics may be getting boring for you guys, but I just thought this would be interesting to find more info on.

Are there any Monarchies left? I'm not talking about Constitutional Monarchies either, like the UK. I mean real monarchies.

Are there any monarchies left, and if so, are they just like the old, classic-style monarchies, or are they different from the old ones?

I ask how different they are from the classic monarchies simply because I saw somewhere that in Saudi Arabia their Interior Minister (an interior minister in a MONARCHY?) was a PRINCE?

[Maynard]

Saudi Arabia I would regard as a monarchy of the old style in many ways , it's not completely the same though, where a monarch is a head of the state. There are over 5000 members in the Saudi Arabian Royal family I do believe, which have effective control over the country. The royal family there has complete control, with no elections at all.
Swaziland has an absolute monarchy most like the old ones I do believe. The leader has all the power without legally-organized direct opposition telling the monarchy what to do. King Mswati III is the leaders name. Vatican City. an actual country would also be regarded as one according to what I read and Liechtenstein recently became one, if I am not mistaken.

[Saint-Just]

Are you suggesting that constitutional monarchies are not real?

[Jesus Christ]

Bhutan

[redstar2000]

I think that all of the tiny states on the fringe of the Arabian peninsula are absolute monarchies, as is (to all intents and purposes) Morocco and Jordan.

But here's one I'll bet you never heard of...

Brunei (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/country_profiles/1298607.stm)

One might well add Syria, Egypt, and North Korea to the list...although they have "parliaments", the real power is in the hands of a despot and is inherited by the despot's son. (Iraq would have qualified as well.)

Only an atheistic cynic like me (:D) would comment on the high positive correlation between despotism and Islam.

http://anarchist-action.org/forums/images/smiles/redstar.gif

The RedStar2000 Papers (http://www.anarchist-action.org/marxists/redstar2000/)
A site about communist ideas

[SonofRage]

Hmm, since it looks like Raul is going to assume power when Castro kicks the bucket, you could argue that Cuba is becoming a monarchy.

[Don't Change Your Name]

- Saudi Arabia
- North Korea (however I'm not sure because it seems there is a small parliament there)
- Brunei
- Oman (with some small corrupted democracy)
- Qatar (almost)

This system is also dying.

[Guest1]

uhh... redstar... I long ago revolted against my family's religious values, but it still burns to hear that.

[{scarface87}]

red star seriously are you trying to offend every muslim and arab in the world? You should be ashamed of youself writing that pile of crap! like america and britian have real democracys anyway. CAN U HONESTLY TELL ME WHY BRITIAN WENT TO WAR WEN A MAJORITY OF PEOPLE OPPOSED IT? IF THATS DEMOCRACY SPANK ME ON THE REAR AND CALL ME CHARLIE!

[Yazman]

Originally posted by Chairman [email protected] 20 2003, 04:50 PM
Are you suggesting that constitutional monarchies are not real?
I never said they were not real. I am simply saying a constitutional monarchy is entirely different.

Redstar, I have heard of Brunei before, but know very little about it. I know their Sultan is very rich due to the oil (I think oil?) they have there, and it is a very small nation.

Could anybody provide more information on Brunei?

[praxis1966]

In terms of the current state of affairs, what he says is accurate. Although, I think one would be hard pressed to establish a causal relationship between the two. IMHO, that relationship is more coincidence than anything else.

[Looter]

The UK doesn't have a constitution. What is more real, your opinions or Winsor castle and Buckingham Palace.

[Invader Zim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2003, 12:51 PM
The UK doesn't have a constitution. What is more real, your opinions or Winsor castle and Buckingham Palace.
Buckingham Palace is owned by the state not the crown, i'm not sure about Winsor Castle but think that is as well.

[Looter]

"And you think you're so clever and classless and free
But you're still fucking peasants as far as I can see"
John Lennon OBE

[Kez]

the UK does have constitution, just that its from loads of different sources, and not written in one piece, and ultimately the parliament can make any change with extreme ease.

the wonders of having done AS level politics...

[Invader Zim]

Originally posted by [email protected] 21 2003, 02:06 PM
the UK does have constitution, just that its from loads of different sources, and not written in one piece, and ultimately the parliament can make any change with extreme ease.

the wonders of having done AS level politics...
Yeah, I learned that in general studies... the biggest micky mouse subject ever.

[Saint-Just]

Originally posted by El Infiltr(A)[email protected] 21 2003, 05:06 AM
- Saudi Arabia
- North Korea (however I'm not sure because it seems there is a small parliament there)
- Brunei
- Oman (with some small corrupted democracy)
- Qatar (almost)

This system is also dying.
A small parliament? It has around 500-600 deputies, that is hardly small. It is the Supreme People's Assembly, and North Korea is not a monarchy. Kim Jong Il was elected, not chosen by his bloodline. Kim Jong Il was the fittest person to become Party Leader, he was obviously in a good position in his learning and upbringing since his father was Kim Il Sung, that is all. This is simply a way of poking fun at North Korea.

[BOZG]

From what I'm aware of, after the Nepalese Crown Prince murdered 10 members of his family including the King and Queen in 2001, the new King disolved the parliament and dismissed the Cabinet, reintroducing monarchial rule, supposedly until elections can be called at a future date. As to whether this has been resolved now, I'm not sure though.

[toastedmonkey]

Swaziland

[Jesus Christ]

once again, Bhutan

[James]

hmm, "constitutional monarchy" implies the kind of monarchy there is in Scandinavia.

The british monarchy is very unusual... it has some power and some influence...


Maybe you should have said "absolute monarchy"?

[Hiero]

Some islands in the polyneisia still have monarchy

[redstar2000]

Originally posted by {scarface87}@Dec 21 2003, 05:21 AM
red star seriously are you trying to offend every muslim and arab in the world? You should be ashamed of youself writing that pile of crap! like america and britian have real democracys anyway. CAN U HONESTLY TELL ME WHY BRITIAN WENT TO WAR WEN A MAJORITY OF PEOPLE OPPOSED IT? IF THATS DEMOCRACY SPANK ME ON THE REAR AND CALL ME CHARLIE!
I see that you are a new member on this board and consequently unaware of both my position on bourgeois "democracy" (a fraud and a delusion) and on U.S. imperialism in the Middle East and elsewhere (unconditionally opposed).

But if you are looking for someone to "avoid giving offense" to people mired in superstitious nonsense, I will invariably disappoint you.

Islam is a great reactionary force wherever it exists...I do not see how any objective observer could deny this. It opposes, as a matter of theological dogma, any form of secular government at all. Its "law code" is barbaric. Its comfortable acceptance of slavery and absolute monarchy is scandalous.

And its treatment of women firmly places Islam dead last on the list of world religions--only the Hindus gave it any competition at all for that infamous "honor".

If you find these truths "offensive", too bad. But know that after the revolution, Arab communists are going to put that "holy meteorite" in a natural science museum where it belongs. And the mosques, just like the cathedrals, will all be demolished.

I dare say you will kick and scream a great deal when you are dragged by the scruff of the neck out of the 14th century and into the modern world.

That always happens.

http://anarchist-action.org/forums/images/smiles/redstar.gif

The RedStar2000 Papers (http://www.anarchist-action.org/marxists/redstar2000/)
A site about communist ideas

[Guest1]

You still make me squirm with your extreme anti-religious attitude. I'm pretty anti-religious myself, but this is just too much.

It is not our place to destroy anything. If people want to practice Islam, it is up to them. As for your criticism of Islam, I will concede the inherent patriarchy and extreme sexism in Islam, but slavery is explicitly banned in the Quran. The practice may have been different, but that is the religion.

To imply, however, that Islam somehow is more effective in creating despots than any other religion is rediculous. Despotism has been the history of Christianity for millenia, same with Judaism. Every religion favours iron-fisted rule.

Thus far, I have not argued with you much on your hatred of religions, because it was generally directed against all. Now though, you target Islam specifically, and considering the current attitude towards muslims in the world, there isn't a need for this. All organized religions are equally destructive towards democracy and equality. To assert otherwise is nothing but racism.

[cormacobear]

Islam is in a simialir position of evolution as Christianity was a couple of hunded years ago. Now Christianity fights for democracy, equality, and is the largest humanitarian organization in the world. Giving more in foreign aid from the U.S. alone than the U.S. government. so Ideologies can evolve, hopefully christians will become more Jesus like, and the other religions will also evolve into the moral entities they endeavor to be.

[Guest1]

hah! religions don't evolve my friend. they remain backwards no matter what. the vatican still stands against homosexuality and gay marriage. however, there are religious people who are sensible. that is the difference between me and redstar, while I agree that religion in general is not conducive to equality, I recognize that there are religious people who fight for justice. some of the greatest supporters of the socialist revolution in Chiapas have been priests.

[redstar2000]

but slavery is explicitly banned in the Quran.

link?

Here's one that I read this morning...

Islamic leaders say they have outlawed condoms in Somalia, where the vast majority of the population is Muslim.

The umbrella Somali Ulema Council has said it will use Sharia (Islamic) Law, including flogging, to punish those selling or using condoms.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/africa/3340611.stm


Thus far, I have not argued with you much on your hatred of religions, because it was generally directed against all. Now though, you target Islam specifically...

Actually, the overwhelming majority of posts I have made on religion have focused on Christianity...the dominant religion in the "west" where I live. Only rarely have I mentioned Islam, Hinduism, or even Judaism.

Perhaps that's been a mistake on my part...it's led to some folks with a "soft spot" for other religions to enjoy or at least acquiesce in my "savage attacks" on Christianity and assume that I wouldn't be quite so hard on their sentimental favorites.

So let me be clear about that: everything "bad" that I've said about Christianity also applies to all other religions...and sometimes even more so!

It is not "racist" to point out that despotism remains the standard form of government in the Muslim world--Muslims are not a "race".

Nor does Christian pliability in the face of despotism serve as an "excuse"...as Christianity has declined in the "west", so has overt despotism. In my opinion, that's not a "coincidence".

It's not, by the way, a matter of Christianity "reforming itself" to embrace modern secular thought...it's a matter of modern secular thought forcing Christianity to retreat from its positions of influence.

Similarly, I have zero confidence in Islam "reforming" itself to "accept" the modern world. I think the Islamic clerics will have to be fought "tooth and nail" to "drive them from power". If there is a revolution in Iran, for example, the first thing they better do is shoot all the mullahs. No fooling around!

The same thing applies to the sect that dominates "Saudi" Arabia.


It is not our place to destroy anything.

Oh yes it is!

Arise ye prisoners of starvation,
Arise ye wretched of the earth.
For justice thunders condemnation,
And a better world's in birth.
No more tradition's chains shall bind us,
Arise ye slaves no more in thrall.
The earth shall rise on new foundations,
We have been naught; we shall be all.

There is much that deserves to be destroyed...and will be.

http://anarchist-action.org/forums/images/smiles/redstar.gif

The RedStar2000 Papers (http://www.anarchist-action.org/marxists/redstar2000/)
A site about communist ideas

[BOZG]

There is much that deserves to be destroyed...and will be.

Hear hear......The Phoenix rises out of its ashes.

[Guest1]

well, I consider religion an enemy too. and I do think it should be fought. I agree with your last post almost in its entirety. my point was not to defend Islam, it was to defend it against what seemd to be the implication that it is somehow "special" in supporting despotism. my point was that all religions support despotism, Islam included.

as for it not being our place to destroy it. it is our place to destroy religion, but it is not the place of the government. whatever government rises cannot be involved in the elimination of religion. it has to be us, the people, who work to eliminate it, not by force, but by enlightenment. we must rise above the inquisitions and witch hunts religion is known for.