Guantanamo Bay

[(*]

Why is the US still operating a base there? (Are there other reasons besides logistics etc?)
Cuba has sovereignty over all the land.
Why are they bound to the lease? The US did break the terms, correct?

I'm really curious about this.

[el_profe]

Cause CUBA doesnt have the balls to kick them out, that is why.

[Jesus Christ]

NO, its because Cuba DOESNT have sovereignty over the Guantanamo area, its technically US property

[Hampton]

http://www.che-lives.com/forum/index.php?a...=ST&f=4&t=19446 (http://www.che-lives.com/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=4&t=19446)

:o

[Fidel Castro]

Once again el_profe provides an intellectual argument lol.

The terms of the lease I believe are that it can only be ended with the consent of both parties. No, dispite the fact that the US do not pay what they should for the area, the Cubans simply do not supply the base with anything. I have heard that the burning of effergies of Bush and co are a popular local attraction for Cubans :P (despite the fact, el_profe, that they are all so miserable and hate Fidel)

[Jesus Christ]

el profe rox my sox with his strong arguments lol

[timbaly]

Cuba really doesn't need the base and it would be futile to attempt to cease it. They aren't losing anything by not having it. If they tried to cease it, it would be the end of Castro and socialism in Cuba. The US would definetely end a war with cuba with an overthrow.

[el_profe]

I knew they had a base their, i just thought Castro coudnt get them out. But i did not know about the treaty. :huh: .

[praxis1966]

Didn't that have something to do with the peace accord signed after the Spanish-American War?

[apathy maybe]

There is another thread around on this.

In my opinion from what I understand of the treaty, Cuba had ultimite sovereignty over the area and so the people held against their will could go to a Cuban court and whinge about it (or their lawers could anyway).
And apparently the land was going to be handed back until some people decided that it would make a nice picture to fly some planes into some buildings.

[shakermaker]

Originally posted by [email protected] 19 2003, 02:11 AM
Cause CUBA doesnt have the balls to kick them out, that is why.
I think it's 'cos Cuba doesn't have able to kick USA out, 'cos USA pays (if pays) about that area and Cuba need those moneys??!
and of course USA would attack then.......what USA is going to do anyway, sooner or later!

[{scarface87}]

yer it would be potential suicide for castro to take the bay bak. but if bush really h8ed castro like saddamy he would have convinced america to invade cuba neway. Arabs seem to be top of the agenda so i think cuba is safe for the moment.

I think it is disgraceful the way they are holding taliban members. they dont even have human rights. if we were a democratic people we would understand that people believe in different things. SINCE WEN WAS DEFENDING YOUR COUNTRY A F***ING CRIME????


I HOPE THAT BUSH GETS WASTED AND THE WHOLE FOX NEWS CORPORATION CRAWLS BAK INTO THE ARSEHOLE FROM WHICH IT CAME AND DIES!

[cormacobear]

I'm sure Bush would have put Cuba on their if he thought the rest of the world wouldn't have said something(I'm sure someone had to tell him that an axis traditionally has three members, He's kindof slow). The U.S. has open and amicable relations with many countries with far worse Human rights records (that let the U.S. loot from them) than Cuba I'm sure someone in Washington realized this fact is best left in the dark if they hope to continue to starve the Cuban people because their beleif system is different.

[cormacobear]

How do you think Cuba will fair when their is a change in leadership after Castro, and who do you think will succeed him?

[Fidel Castro]

Raul is officially next in line, but he does not share his brother's popularity with the people. I think he will still be heavily involved but I doubt he will be president.

[Knowledge 6 6 6]

I think after Fidel, Raul might be even worse....

Damn man, Che Guevara should've led that country man...(sry, just finished reading up on some of his writings on socialism. DAMN, that guy's smart!)

Seriously though, I'm scared for Cuba's sake if Raul's in power...

[Fidel Castro]

Well, I get the impression that you are anti-Castro, and we would differ there. However, I would agree that Raul is not the best man for the job, mainly because he does not have the popularity of Fidel, also because he is no spring chicken himself.

[Knowledge 6 6 6]

yeah, don't get me wrong, I totally dont think America was right in any way in the way they treated Cuba as a whole. Bay of Pigs, the Cuban Missile Crisis, etc...all prove this.

Castro was a cool guy when he was with Che, they both knew that the Batista gov't needed to be overthrown. However, Castro just replaced an old tyrant with a new one in himself. In some circumstances, he has benefitted the people of Cuba, but he has ravaged that country, leaving some starving and dying every day. I strongly doubt Che would ever want that for his country...

Even during the Cuban Missile Crisis it was rumoured that he jailed and executed all those in opposition to him, which again prove the point of the tyrant that he is. I dont think his actions are justifiable, but that's me.

[Yazman]

El Profe, I could NEVER argue against such an incredibly powerful statement.

[Fidel Castro]

Knowledge, I agree that Castro can be criticised on his policies, expecially economic. However, note if you will that after the Bay of Pigs Castro did not torture or execute prisoners, but traded them for food and medicine. I don't view him as a tyrant, perhaps a strict ruler yes, but certainly not a tyrant.

[(*]

I find it very hard to describe what Cuba is. The amount of propaganda emanating from the US has blurred any accurate portrayal of the nation. It seems like one of those places where you have to go to find the truth.

[ComradeRobertRiley]

Cuba defeated the US before, why cant it do it again?

There could be a "Che-Lives" regiment.

[Knowledge 6 6 6]

yeah, Castro can be considered a 'strict ruler' in some instances...

He has a large following, maybe it was because he was a very instrumental leader in anti-imperialism, etc..

As I said, he has done such bad things to Cuba when you look at their poverty and the people dying every day because of Castro's decisions. Living conditions are horrendous in some states. Communism (even though it is argued that Cuba ISN'T a Communist state) isn't supposed to have this,...yet in Cuba it does, as the result of Castro's decisions...

I stand behind my point that had Guevara led Cuba, it would be stronger than America not in terms of economical strength, but would be more efficient politically and socially.

I think why the CIA organized Bolivian soldiers to kill Guevara was because they knew this man was speaking the truth, that America was trying to colonialize a country, which refused to be colonialized. Had Guevara been put in the position that Castro basically took, Cuba would be a million times better today.

Again, this is just me and my opinion. :)

[Deniz Gezmis]

Originally posted by Knowledge 6 6 [email protected] 20 2003, 06:20 PM
yeah, Castro can be considered a 'strict ruler' in some instances...

He has a large following, maybe it was because he was a very instrumental leader in anti-imperialism, etc..

As I said, he has done such bad things to Cuba when you look at their poverty and the people dying every day because of Castro's decisions. Living conditions are horrendous in some states. Communism (even though it is argued that Cuba ISN'T a Communist state) isn't supposed to have this,...yet in Cuba it does, as the result of Castro's decisions...

I stand behind my point that had Guevara led Cuba, it would be stronger than America not in terms of economical strength, but would be more efficient politically and socially.

I think why the CIA organized Bolivian soldiers to kill Guevara was because they knew this man was speaking the truth, that America was trying to colonialize a country, which refused to be colonialized. Had Guevara been put in the position that Castro basically took, Cuba would be a million times better today.

Again, this is just me and my opinion. :)
Because of Che's liberty of language (Big mouth) Cuba would have broke with the Soviet Union. Bear that in mind.

[Fidel Castro]

For the moment all judgements I make on Cuba are based on what I have read in books and heard from other people. I am visiting Cuba in the summer, on a work brigade rather than a holiday, this will give me a great chance to ask Cubans themselves about Fidel, Che and their country. I will also be visiting Cuban schools and hospitals for myself, which will also help me make my own judgements.