Should one go to college to get ahead in life, and which degree to pursue?

[campesino]

I used to be of the opinion, that college is for suckers, but now with the low skill labor market flooded with ex-workers, and people with liberal arts degrees, I see a rigorous hard to get college degree, the only way to a better financial state.

I think engineering is good as long as it is, not pursued by too many people, for instance electrical and chemical engineering seems to be very popular, due to Indian/Chinese students pursuing such degrees.

Of course the Marxist answer to get financially ahead, is to become bourgeois or a merchant, but such positions are hard to attain if one is not born into bourgeoisie family or have those connections.

I'd, love to get a job no one wants like mortician's assistant, but now even those people need a degree nowadays.

[Ostrinski]

History student here. Seems like there's always a demand for teachers despite the incessant attacks upon them.

[thriller]

In all honesty people are forced to attain degrees because of the current economic system, which forces wage workers to choose between the two. But why wouldn't it be all right? Some jobs require quite a bit education, such as machining, welding, industrial maintenance, IT Networking, Nursing, etc... To me it seems kind of lifestylist to purposely not educate yourself because education system. As far as getting "ahead" one may not make 6 figures. But having a nursing or machining job is better than gas station clerk job that gets 1/3 of the pay and 1/2 the hours.

[Blake's Baby]

No; you shouldn't go to college to 'get ahead'. You should go to college to expand your intellectual and social horizons. Fuck getting ahead. Hurray for meeting interesting people, having your preconceptions challenged, learning new things, and drinking a lot.

Not that you can't meet interesting people and drink a lot if you don't go to college. But just as travel broadens the mind, there is a value in new experiences that goes beyond anything that could be considered economic.

[campesino]

*in Italics sarcasm


No; you shouldn't go to college to 'get ahead'. You should go to college to expand your intellectual and social horizons. Fuck getting ahead. Hurray for meeting interesting people, having your preconceptions challenged, learning new things, and drinking a lot.

Not that you can't meet interesting people and drink a lot if you don't go to college. But just as travel broadens the mind, there is a value in new experiences that goes beyond anything that could be considered economic.

well how should someone get ahead?

I believe it to be ridiculous to tell someone
No; you shouldn't go to college to 'get ahead'. You should go to college to expand your intellectual and social horizons.
Going to college is a 4 or more year commitment that cost thousand of dollars. Why would any rational person, do such a thing to expand their 'intellectual and social horizons.'

college is a means to get ahead(it is not for everyone, some people would be better of with certifications or technical colleges.)

also telling someone to 'fuck getting ahead,' (because I want to stay in grinding shit-hole poverty) is insensitive.

[Revolution starts with U]

How could anyone do that?

I did it because fuck the govt if they think I'm paying back my student loans :thumbup1:

[#FF0000]

I dropped out and have a pretty good shot at a job w/ a decent salary and benefits that would allow me to move out and live independently with no issue whatsoever. I used to be all "yo college is great everyone should go" but now I find myself in the mindset that, yeah, as it's set up now, higher education is a scam.


Going to college is a 4 or more year commitment that cost thousand of dollars. Why would any rational person, do such a thing to expand their 'intellectual and social horizons.'

because education is good in itself. When I have the money for it, I'm going to go back to college to finish a degree in history and perhaps pick up Education again. After that I imagine I'll just keep collecting degrees like pokemon cards because I like the whole 'learning' thing in a college environment with the professors and w/ fellow students and colleagues and shit like that.

[Blake's Baby]

...
well how should someone get ahead?...

How should I know? I'm on welfare.


...I believe it to be ridiculous to tell someone
Going to college is a 4 or more year commitment that cost thousand of dollars. Why would any rational person, do such a thing to expand their 'intellectual and social horizons.'...

Because being a well rounded human being is more important than being rich, and anyone who tells you different is a fucking moron, and if you believe that being rich is more important than being interesting and having life changing experiences, then you're a fucking moron too.



...college is a means to get ahead(it is not for everyone, some people would be better of with certifications or technical colleges.)

also telling someone to 'fuck getting ahead,' (because I want to stay in grinding shit-hole poverty) is insensitive.

Wow, you mean as I have a degree I get bigger welfare cheques? I'm not sure I do. If you think my commentary from my lavish welfare-funded lifestyle is 'insensitive' then you're a chump.

Which isn't the same as being a moron, I'll grant you; the two aren't mutually dependant.

I think your constant harping on about how college is a way of getting ahead is very insensitive and indeed impertinant to an unemployed graduate.


...

because education is good in itself. When I have the money for it, I'm going to go back to college to finish a degree in history and perhaps pick up Education again. After that I imagine I'll just keep collecting degrees like pokemon cards because I like the whole 'learning' thing in a college environment with the professors and w/ fellow students and colleagues and shit like that.

This, totally this. I understand that it's a big financial commitment for some people but there's no 'x-amount of education investment = y-amount of financial return'. You're not a commodity, you're a human being, why treat yourself as a product? Education helps you to become more than you are. If it's just 'I want to make myself more attractive to employers' then you're doing yourself a disservice.

[campesino]

Because being a well rounded human being is more important than being rich, and anyone who tells you different is a fucking moron, and if you believe that being rich is more important than being interesting and having life changing experiences, then you're a fucking moron too.
I think your constant harping on about how college is a way of getting ahead is very insensitive and indeed impertinant to an unemployed graduate.

I recognize that there are many unemployed graduates, that have huge amounts of debt and suffer very much, I didn't say college leads to success.

let's clarify some things:

I am not a defender of the college system

I am looking for ways to get ahead, not just college

By getting ahead, I mean be financially independent and able to live a decent life. I don't want to be rich.

I am not against people learning about the world and becoming well rounded. I do hold the opinion that college is the most expensive way to become a well rounded individual. you said so yourself travel is a better way, and cheaper. so lets not speak about the merit of college on the idea that it makes individuals well rounded.




This, totally this. I understand that it's a big financial commitment for some people but there's no 'x-amount of education investment = y-amount of financial return'. You're not a commodity, you're a human being, why treat yourself as a product? Education helps you to become more than you are. If it's just 'I want to make myself more attractive to employers' then you're doing yourself a disservice.

It sucks to be a commodity in the capitalist system and it is humiliating to have to make ourselves more attractive to employers, But the revolution has not begun and staying in my current station in life, is doing a disservice to myself.

[Blake's Baby]

Well, your original question was 'should one go to college to get ahead...?' and my reply was 'no, one should go to college to gain new experiences'. If you're just after increasing your employability then you should work out which jobs are best paid, work out how to break into them, and go an do that. But the question you asked could be understood as either 'is going to college necessary to become better paid?' (which seems to be how you meant it) or 'is becoming better paid a good reason to go to college?' (which is how I answered it).

Going to college is no guarantee you'll get a job so if you're doing it for that reason you need to carefully consider the likely outcomes. Is my degree worth anything in today's jobmarket (or the jobmarket of 3-6 years' time)? Am I going to be able to put up with it long enough to pass? etc.

The best reason to go to college is for the experience of going to college. The intellectual stimulation, the opportunity to meet people who aren't the people you already know, to go to a different city and live there, to make friends that you'll have the rest of your life, to immerse youself in an exciting new (or old) field of study and to challenge yourself. If that's not why you're doing it then probably it's a waste of time and money. If you remove the notion of college being a situation in which personal (intellectual, social) development is absolutely paramount, then college is probably quite a stupid idea. Because you've already removed from the debate the primary reason for going, in my opinion.

[Dumb]

Going to college is a really piss-poor way to get ahead, pragmatically speaking; that's four years of your life you could spend establishing yourself in the job market. If you go to college, you'd better get at least a 3.8+ GPA or a degree in a hard science/engineering, or else you're just screwing yourself over. I went to UC Davis, amassed a 3.5 and graduated with a BA in Political Science, and now I'm bagging groceries part-time under a boss who's both younger than me and doesn't have a degree...job-wise, money-wise, I'd be so much further ahead if I'd just started working full-time straight out of high school. College is probably the worst life choice I've ever made...which is saying something...

[Ele'ill]

I can't find any reasons to go back to college.

[Lynx]

In Canada:
The trades do not require college, but some colleges offer pre-apprenticeship training courses that may last up to a year. They also offer the theoretical portions for indentured apprenticeships.
Technicians and technologists require 1-3 years at college. This is for entry level work in the technical fields.
Engineering and other professions typically require university degrees. Engineers can find employment with a Bachelors; other areas of science are primarily academic, thus a PhD is required.

Those are the prerequisites generally demanded by employers just so they can consider you. The good old days of on-the-job training for middle class wages are over.

[Firebrand]

Hey i'm going to uni at least in part to delay my entry into the wonderful world of wage slavery. Yes i will end up with a load of debt but on the other hand if I use enough delaying tactics the revolution may happen before I pay any of it back. and that will be three years spent drinking and learning new things rather than letting the daily grind turn me into one of those plastic plants they keep in offices.
Live now, find excuses not to pay later, the key to an enjoyable and fulfilled life.

[lenin1988]

There are people who ate unemployed with college degrees who cant even get a job so I say pass on that and plus you woll be in debt

[Magón]

Going to college won't even get you ahead anymore. At least in the US. It's worth it for learning, but really a degree won't get you ahead like you think.

I'm going to uni, doing communications as my main point of interest, mainly because I want to use what I learn from it, to be able to into traveling, and find something in the travel business that allows me to go around the world, doing something I think it decent enough. But knowing what I do know (and have actually known for awhile), that the traveling I looked so forward too, isn't going to be easy even with the degree I get.

College/Uni is good for the learning experience, and what you can gain if you work hard enough, and have a decent professor. You get more from it, I think, than you would high school, but it's not for everyone. I did it, because like I said, my goal is to travel around, and having just a high school diploma isn't going to cut it for what I'm looking towards.

[Os Cangaceiros]

I'm thinking about going back to school. I was originally a history major, but I'm thinking about going into marine biology, because I want to use that skill set to help try and manage my own career, which is commercial fishing. I want to be more involved in the industry politically and scientifically, and I think getting some experience as a biologist may be a way to do this. (Plus the current fisheries managers in the Department of Fish and Game are total bozos).

But college is definitely not the only route to a good career. When this fishing season is over I plan on entering an eight month period of voluntary unemployment...not to sound like a jackass or anything, but I've been raking it in this year, which is refreshing because the last few years have nearly made me apply for welfare, they were so poor...but now I'm going to make it rain in the club when I get done with fishing. :cool:

Fuck school!

[o well this is ok I guess]

Find something you're good at and do that
high GPA=don't pay for shit
Any degree is a good degree if you don't pay shit for it

[Hit The North]

Of course the Marxist answer to get financially ahead, is to become bourgeois or a merchant, but such positions are hard to attain if one is not born into bourgeoisie family or have those connections.


That's not a "Marxist answer", it's a bourgeois answer.

The Marxist answer to getting ahead is to join a union , join a political party of the workers and FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT! this rotten system.

As for college, I'm with Blake's Baby, take advantage of it to stuff your mind with knowledge and meet cool and interesting people.

[Igor]

Find something you're good at and do that
high GPA=don't pay for shit
Any degree is a good degree if you don't pay shit for it

It's fucking annoying how basically every single people (outside academia) keeps telling me how I should get my degree in fucking engineering, computer science or hard sciences because otherwise all I'd have ahead of myself would be a long, miserable life of no money and no jobs.

If I ever actually went to study shit like engineering, I know I'd drop out within a year or so, because I'm shit at it and it interests me about as much as having kidney stones would. Not to mention that if I actually managed to graduate, a job as an engineer sounds like the worst thing ever - for me, personally.

The idea of "good" and "bad" degrees annoys me so much especially because at least in UK, where I'll be employing myself in the future, for many or if not most jobs that require a degree it's more important to have a degree, not a degree that people perceive as something that's bound to earn you mad cash. Even people with liberal arts degrees tend to employ rather well in reality, and make on average better wages than people who never go to uni. But I still for some reason should choose the hard sciences because hey that's real science and is the only reason for me to ever get a job.

So I guess my point is that study what the hell you want to if that's what you want and you're good at it. The latter part is kind of important to remember especially if you're paying anything at all for your degree.

[eric922]

My advice is go to college to get an education and hopefully find a career you will enjoy. Don't go through the trouble of getting a degree in a job that will make you miserable. Hopefully, you won't end up like me, where the one thing I want to do (go to law school) will cost a bloody fortune and have no guarantee of actual financial security, despite the popular myth.

[Dumb]

Even people with liberal arts degrees tend to employ rather well in reality, and make on average better wages than people who never go to uni.

That's true for people who got their degrees ten years ago. Not so now.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

Personally, I'm very much enjoying learning about sociology and political theory, meeting interesting people, living in a cool city and having lots of time to either fuck around or do interesting things that most people don't have the time to do.

I started out learning a trade in an apprenticeship at 16 and working long hours, doing hard work for very little money, only to walk into an economy where there is no jobs. Alas, many of my old friends are in dead end jobs now, have families, no free time and no capacity to utilize the time to broaden their intellect or enjoy pursuits outside of work, other than maybe going to the same bars and nightclubs after working their arses off during 12 hour shifts. Is that getting ahead in life? Some people I know did a bit better and got jobs that were a bit higher up in the labour market, but its still the same principle of alienation that applies.

Some of my other friends have had it bad enough that they've ended up in jail or potentially in jail because there is nowhere where they can apply themselves properly, in an economy where there is none of the capacity to establish yourself in a career any more. We have soaring unemployment, cuts on benefits and effectively an atmosphere which demands intellectuals, not more part time retail workers who are completely geared by their wages but which mostly end up on benefits anyway because there is no work and the work that is there is mostly short-term.

I'm not saying that uni is the answer to a desire for a good career, but what I am saying is that it is a great experience that should be open to all people and shouldn't be seen negatively, especially by people on the left who recognize the alienation that comes with labouring and being a cog in the wheel of the economy. Fuck work, most of it is menial bullshit. I could've tried to get myself a job in a supermarket or a warehouse like some of my old friends and have the life sucked out of me for a monthly minimum wage, or I could've worked hard and got into uni and seen a different side of life which I think that everyone should have the chance to experience and should experience if they are capable of doing so.

Its not for everyone though, just a different perspective. Some people are practical, hands-on people that enjoy working in practical, hands on trades and careers and as such, these people should have those opportunities as there is plenty of need for it. We, as leftists, should think about what society needs, not what the state wants. The state wants more people with a capitalistic work ethic and a mindless love of labouring, not people that have the capacity to critically assess the whole nature of labouring in this economic system, because they have the time, intellectual tools and love of knowledge. This work ethic thing is so outdated and doesn't even fit now in the 'western world' - we have industrialised, there is a huge gap in employment due to the big space that has been left behind post-industrialism. What's the solution, endless McDonald's or Tesco employees, or endless unemployment figures which account for the people who 'need' those jobs but can't get them because they are already taken?

As for the debt, we're all in debt anyway. We spend our lives essentially giving our labour power to bosses, seeing no profit. We should be working towards a world without debt, at the very least in education.

But this is just a rant and we may have very different views on what 'getting ahead in life' means. For me, the idea of going straight into the labour market to get ahead in life is like joining a motorway on foot. It depends on how you define life and what you think that it means to live, or should mean to live.

I forgot to mention that some of my closest friends went to the army after following the same sort of part as me: apprenticeship > trade - I very nearly considered it as an option for a working class person to 'get ahead in life' in a climate where there is no jobs. I don't think I would be able to live with that decision now and my old friends look as if their souls have been destroyed - they are the product of the non-economy, the British Army, the war in Afghanistan and they are getting ahead in life, with all of that hell to deal with. These two brothers' father served in Bosnia and suffered from PTSD, with a gambling addiction and ended up in a shitty job driving a van. This, for me, is the most tragic and sickening extension of the work ethic and the capitalist notion of getting ahead in life. As a disclaimer I'll say that I understand the idea that we all have to live comfortably if we can and I agree, but I'm just pointing out the big grey area that is behind the sketchy statement that is 'getting ahead in life', based on my experiences and the experiences of dear friends.

[Nox]

it's more important to have a degree, not a degree that people perceive as something that's bound to earn you mad cash

Yeah, most employers in the UK don't really care which degree you have, as long as you have any degree (depending on the job you are applying for, it doesn't even need to be relevant), which is good for me because I'm doing History. The student loans here are ridiculous (£9k a year) but you don't have to pay them back unless you earn over £22k so I just plan on borrowing as much as possible and if it doesn't work out for me I never have to pay it back :D

I've heard it's the total opposite in the US, thank god I don't live there...

[Blake's Baby]

I was reading the other day that in general it's your class of degree that matters more than the subject - though I guess there are some subjucts that some employers aren't impressed by, like media studies - so in some ways it's better to pick something you want to do because then you're more likely to work at it. Better to get a First or a 2:1 because you're interested in a subject that you want to do than get a 2:2 or a Third in something you think you should do.

When I first went to college 20-odd years ago I went because I thought I should and I flunked it. When I went back it was to do something I was really interested in and I graduated. Who knew that you had to be motivated, huh?

[Firebrand]

The idea of "good" and "bad" degrees annoys me so much especially because at least in UK, where I'll be employing myself in the future, for many or if not most jobs that require a degree it's more important to have a degree, not a degree that people perceive as something that's bound to earn you mad cash. Even people with liberal arts degrees tend to employ rather well in reality, and make on average better wages than people who never go to uni.

Not true, i'm afraid, yes having a degree matters but which degree you do matters just as much, and where you get your degree from is key.
Yes some people with Arts degrees employ well but thats because some arts subjects are pretty highly regarded over here. Theres still a lot of subjects that are considered junk degrees, rule of thumb avoid anything with "studies" in the title. And the university the degree came from matters more than the actual grade.
Trust me, the idea of good and bad degrees is based on reality, in fact there are good and bad A-levels as well, before you even get started on higher education.

People who got their degrees years ago earn more than people without degrees, people who just got their degrees are mostly on the dole or working minimum wage jobs these days.

[black magick hustla]

dont listen to the hippies and weak ppl learn math, there is a lot of $$$$$$ in.

[Leftsolidarity]

I choose not to go to college (just graduated high school). I've never been a school person and figured I have a lot of other stuff I'd rather do with my life then get into massive debt to spend 4 more years of my life doing something I don't want to do to maybe get a job I probably don't want to do.

Fuck that, I'm going to travel, have fun, organize, and try to live my life like I want too. I'll get small jobs to get by but as long as I got rent and food. I'm dandy.

Maybe I'll choose to go in a year or 2 or 5 or never. Maybe I'll look back at this choice as the worst one I've ever made. Don't know, don't care too much right now.

[bcbm]

Fuck that, I'm going to travel, have fun, organize, and try to live my life like I want too. I'll get small jobs to get by but as long as I got rent and food. I'm dandy.

yeah once you are almost thirty and still working shit jobs and have accomplished nothing but a few fun trips and a million black outs things look a little different. but hey have fun

[Leftsolidarity]

yeah once you are almost thirty and still working shit jobs and have accomplished nothing but a few fun trips and a million black outs things look a little different. but hey have fun

I don't doubt that. I also know many people in their 30's still doing it and still loving it. I guess it's one of those things that you just gotta wait and see.

[bcbm]

yeah i mean racking up 50000 dollars in debt isnt very appealing either esp if you know whatever degree you pursued would probably be worthless which is p much why i dropped out

[Leftsolidarity]

yeah i mean racking up 50000 dollars in debt isnt very appealing either esp if you know whatever degree you pursued would probably be worthless which is p much why i dropped out

Yup, that was a big factor in me deciding not to go. I would go if my interests were actually something getting a degree in would help me with but all it would do is rack up debt for no real gain. What did you go for?

[bcbm]

i was in a liberal arts program at a two year school to get some requirements out of the way for less money but planned to go for history (that must be a shock i know)

[Nox]

where you get your degree from is key.

Aah yes, I forgot that part. Where you get your degree from is in many cases more important than which degree you get.

And what you said about certain humanities degrees being highly regarded here as opposed to in America is also very true. History is very highly regarded over here but I've heard that in the US it's practically worthless...

[Metacomet]

Yeah, most employers in the UK don't really care which degree you have, as long as you have any degree (depending on the job you are applying for, it doesn't even need to be relevant), which is good for me because I'm doing History. The student loans here are ridiculous (£9k a year) but you don't have to pay them back unless you earn over £22k so I just plan on borrowing as much as possible and if it doesn't work out for me I never have to pay it back :D

I've heard it's the total opposite in the US, thank god I don't live there...


9K A year is ridiculous? Try tripling that bro. More then tripling it actually.

[Fawkes]

It really depends on what you want to do. In certain fields (any of the sciences, education, bunch of other stuff I can't think of), a degree is pretty much the only option. In other fields (industrial trades, communications/media), experience is far more important than a degree. The two aren't mutually exclusive, obviously, but you've got to decide whether it's a better idea to spend x dollars and 2-6 years getting a degree or trying to enter directly into the field in a low-level position to gain experience.

[Clifford C Clavin]

I didn't go to college because I'm working class. I got kicked out of home at age 18 and I had to get a job to pay for a place to live and food to eat. Wish I had the luxury of such a choice.

And the debt doesn't matter much does it? Can we stop the whining about this already? If you don't pay your student loans nothing happens to you. There is no debtors prison. They do not take you wages. You can't get an American Express gold car? So sad :crying:

[Lynx]

A ruined credit rating can prevent you from finding work. Some employers demand your credit history because they think you are more likely to steal or whatever.

Some jobs require college or university in order to gain entry. That's just the way it is nowadays. If there were a shortage of workers, qualifications would be eased and more training at lower cost would be offered.

[Fawkes]

And the debt doesn't matter much does it? Can we stop the whining about this already? If you don't pay your student loans nothing happens to you. There is no debtors prison. They do not take you wages. You can't get an American Express gold car? So sad :crying:

Try getting an apartment after years of not paying back loans then tell me "nothing happens to you" :rolleyes:

[Clifford C Clavin]

No it won't. Anyway 7 years and all debt is erased from your report. Sooner if you file bankruptcy. Add to this 50% or more students are late on payments means you are just one more in the crowd. No one cares about "debt".

I'm really tired of this middle class whining about debt. OMG you can't pay back the loan for 50,000 YOU ALREADY GOT FOR FREE FROM A BANK?

I got nothing that I didn't work for. STFU already. That's why workers ignored Occupy Whine Street.

You don't like it? Do an apprenticeship in a union and get paid while you learn. Of course middle class yuppies don't wanna do anything that takes them away from their MacBooks and Mike's Hard Lemonade.

[Clifford C Clavin]

Try getting an apartment after years of not paying back loans then tell me "nothing happens to you" :rolleyes:

Working class people do it all the time. Public housing sport. Or any of the millions of work arounds. Subletting, friends, rooomates, family, parents, independent landlords who don't do checks, lies.

Where do you think undocumented workers with NO CREDIT REPORTS AT ALL OR EVEN LEGAL IDENTITIES live?

Your problem is your a middle class kid from the bedroom banker communities of the North East and you can't fathom a world that isn't custom made for you already. After all, you did your part. You WENT TO COLLEGE! THE ULTIMATE SACRIFICE! :crying:

Get a fucking job.

[Lynx]

Student debt doesn't get erased in the US.

[Fawkes]

Working class people do it all the time. Public housing sport. Or any of the millions of work arounds. Subletting, friends, rooomates, family, parents, independent landlords who don't do checks, lies.

Where do you think undocumented workers with NO CREDIT REPORTS AT ALL OR EVEN LEGAL IDENTITIES live?

Your problem is your a middle class kid from the bedroom banker communities of the North East and you can't fathom a world that isn't custom made for you already. After all, you did your part. You WENT TO COLLEGE! THE ULTIMATE SACRIFICE! :crying:

Get a fucking job.

well you got banned pretty fast....

[Pretty Flaco]

college is for rich fuckers.
i wish i was one. :(

[La Comédie Noire]

My suggestion would be to get a trade, save up some money, and pursue a degree in your spare time for recreational purposes or career advancement. Putting off a family and stuff till you're a little older and financially secure.

For instance I am in Nursing, but I read Kant and Wittgenstein in my free time and will probably return to school for a degree in a topic of my choosing.

[Ele'ill]

If you don't know what you want to do yet why would you waste money and go into debt doing just something?

Live until you figure it out. Life experiences aren't worthless at all they're the cheapest degree you can get and actually impact your future more.

[Blake's Baby]

college is for rich fuckers.
i wish i was one. :(

I got a degree and got paid to do it. I was on the dole (ie welfare) when I started, my fees were covered by a grant, and in total I came out one degree and about £400 (what, $600 US?) up.

Rich fucker I ain't.

[Dennis the 'Bloody Peasant']

I wish I had studied more, even if it amounted to little more than some experience in my chosen area and a pointless qualification (in the current job market) I still wish I'd given it a go instead of flunking and just settling into dead end jobs.
I could go back of course, but terrified because have a baby and bills to pay and the usual anxieties about income security...
Bring on the classless society where menial labour is a thing of the past.