Most Evil Capitalists

[Stain]

There are numerous lists of name "The Most Evil Men!" that tries to slander communism as evil by naming Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot (who wasn't even a communist), etc. Or those who rose against imperialism such as Khomeini. Then there are direct creations of US imperialism that were called evil one they turned on US, such as Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. So as a counter, who are the most evil capitalists who first create these situations which gives rise to "evil" retaliation? King Leopold II comes to mind. Henry Ford perhaps. thing is capitalistic exploitation so diffused and covert that it's hard to name single persons.

[The Idler]

The idea of a list of the most evil is flawed anyway, but for teh lulz, you've pretty much covered the most evil capitalists, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Leopold II etc. AFAIK Henry Ford was never accused of war crimes or genocide and was merely a successful significant game-changing industrialist. He didn't even exploit as much surplus value from workers as Stalin or Mao.

[Klaatu]

Ford may not have been an "evil" capitalist in the sense of war crimes, but he sure was one hell of a control freak. For example, he would send his agents to his workers' homes on Sundays to make sure they were not drinking. I guess he didn't want anyone to show up to work on Monday drunk.
In fact, Ford was a key activist in getting Prohibition passed. He also hired thugs to beat up union organizers (evil? could be after all)

[wsg1991]

the idea is to remember their crimes not ours

one of the most hypocritical moments is hearing a French 'intellectual' whining about Nazis crimes , while the same guy seems to forget about French genocides in Algeria
Or some USA ''intellectual'' whining about Terrorist arabs , and forgetting the biggest Bully in the world

you will always hear about Fascist and Nazis crimes , Evil communist crimes , who know who is the next loser we will hear his crimes ?


but honestly you can't blame them , it appears it's some kind of psychological thing , the selective memory and selective forgetting , stuff that is so embarrassing or you consider irrelevant , your memory will just erase

there is some proverb here , a camel can't see his bent neck

[Conscript]

I'd go with churchill. He's a piece of shit of the highest order.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Reagan, McCarthy, Churchill.

[wsg1991]

I'd go with churchill. He's a piece of shit of the highest order.

Those insolent Arabs, Winston Churchill had urged in 1951, should be driven "into the gutter from which they should never have emerged". ( John Pilger article )

indeed , a piece of shit of the highest order

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Not to forget good ol' Tatcher.

[Eagle_Syr]

George Bush
Bernie Madoff

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Gorbachev

[jookyle]

Let's not forget Carnegie and Rockefeller who used their money to fund eugenics research and experiments. Not to mention selling supplies to places like Nazi Germany.

[Anarcho-Brocialist]

Ronald Reagan is my most despised enemy! Ever chance I get, I assail him in front of the 'Reagan' style conservatives. Tripled national debt, the country's biggest businesses went on the largest merger binge in history, more control of the economy in fewer hands. Multi-billion dollar corporate war chests were assembled to finance takeovers of large oil and coal companies, communications giants, and prestigious financial institutions. His war on labor etc.

They even try to claim he thought of the MAD doctrine, and he destroyed the Soviet Union; when Gorbachev planned on doing it by himself.

[Drosophila]

Almost all of the American presidents & statesmen, and let's not forget their allies. I don't buy into "good vs evil" though.

[Eagle_Syr]

Who can forget the Rothschilds?

Funding both sides in a war and tricking people into selling assets with outright lies

[Klaatu]

Ronald Reagan is my most despised enemy! Ever chance I get, I assail him in front of the 'Reagan' style conservatives. Tripled national debt, the country's biggest businesses went on the largest merger binge in history, more control of the economy in fewer hands. Multi-billion dollar corporate war chests were assembled to finance takeovers of large oil and coal companies, communications giants, and prestigious financial institutions. His war on labor etc.

They even try to claim he thought of the MAD doctrine, and he destroyed the Soviet Union; when Gorbachev planned on doing it by himself.

Agreed. Reagan started this long slow decline of America. And we now have a fresh new batch of clueless uneducated fucks on the way up (Paul Ryan and Mit Romney for example)

We should worry less about the evil people of the past, and start worrying about the new evil people of the present and future. (We know who they are)

[Positivist]

So no one's mentioned Hitler yet?

[wsg1991]

So no one's mentioned Hitler yet?

Hitler is a Loser , that's why he is mentioned a lot by the winning team (USA \ France \ Britain )

that's the problem with Dictators , Hitler is probably individually , the worse one killer of all . if he was ''democratic'' the blame would be split on several leaders
as USA managed to do ,

overall i think that Nazism is a not of USA League ( did not last long enough )) (if we sum up all this USA evil presidents deeds )

[Stain]

Yeah good points. I don't buy into "good vs evil" arguments either, but they keep bringing it up.

I wanted Liberal leaders who can be classified as "evil." It is the status quo to criticize the fascists and the communists, but the liberals also slip out as the lesser evil or even outright benevolent player. I thought Ford would be a good candidate cos his brutality toward the working class, his anti-semitism and his support of Nazi Germany. Yes Churchill can be included too.

[Eagle_Syr]

Ayn Rand

She didn't do much beyond writing but that literature tries attempts to turn the most vile elements of human psychology into virtues

[Jesus Saves Gretzky Scores]

All US presidents?

[Comrade Samuel]

Mitt Romney

If you dont think he deserves to be hated for being a heartless, lying, bourgeois politician, hypocrite and overall a complete ass just wait until hes got his finger on the nuke button.

Maybe he hasn't committed any atrocities yet but if he was to be elected president I can only see the horrific state the world is in now getting worse.

[Pretty Flaco]

me

[The Intransigent Faction]

Ludwig von Mises.

[wsg1991]

Milton Friedman

[Regicollis]

A list of the "most evil" capitalists doesn't make sense. The problem with the capitalist system is not that it is run by evil people. The problem is that the system is evil in itself. Capitalists are just as good or evil as anybody else. The evils of capitalism are an integrated part of the system as such and there is not much difference to who runs it. If all the "evil" capitalists were to disappear from the face of the earth their place would just be taken by somebody else.

[danyboy27]

reinhard heydrich.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Don't know if it has been said beforw, but Yeltsin certainely deserves a honorable mention on this list.

[Arlekino]

Tony Blair what a guy.

[L.A.P.]

I think who ever are the leading shareholders of Wells Fargo, Bank of America, Citigroup, JPMorgan Chase, ExxonMobil, British Petroleum, Shell, General Electric, Walt Disney, Viacom, News Corp, Ford, General Motors, Chrysler, Microsoft, Apple, etc. are the most evil fuckers alive today.

[Leo]

Actually, I think Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot also deserve to be in a list of most evil capitalists.

[Manic Impressive]

There is no such thing as evil.

[DrStrangelove]

The Somoza's, Antonio de Oliveira Salazar, Reagan, King Leopold II, Francisco Franco, Emilio Garrastazu Medici, Getulio Vargas, Augusto Pinochet, Chiang Kai-shek, the Meiji Emperor, Emperor Showa Hirohito, Georgios Papadopoulos, Mustafa Kemal Pasha, Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, Syngman Rhee, Park Chung-hee, etc.

Someone could probably think of more, but it's a decent start.

[Klaatu]

Mitt Romney

If you dont think he deserves to be hated for being a heartless, lying, bourgeois politician, hypocrite and overall a complete ass just wait until hes got his finger on the nuke button.

Maybe he hasn't committed any atrocities yet but if he was to be elected president I can only see the horrific state the world is in now getting worse.

Romney just wants to get his hands on the U.S. Treasury. Considering what he did at Bain Capital, it would be no surprise if he loots the public funds for his own personal gain.

[human strike]

Lenin and Engels.

[Manic Impressive]

Engels? WTF? :D

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

There is no such thing as evil.

Take Hitler for example, he wasn't evil, just misunderstood.

[Raúl Duke]

Since someone mentioned Mitt Romney (although these days he's mostly a politician), I would like to mention Richard Nixon.

[Eagle_Syr]

Lenin and Engels.

Care to elaborate?

[Manic Impressive]

Take Hitler for example, he wasn't evil, just misunderstood.
Hitler wasn't evil. He was a result of material conditions, he thought he was acting in his best interests.

I challenge you to define evil and prove it's existence and no you're not allowed to use the bible or the koran as sources.

[Eagle_Syr]

Hitler wasn't evil. He was a result of material conditions, he thought he was acting in his best interests.

I challenge you to define evil and prove it's existence and no you're not allowed to use the bible or the koran as sources.

We had a huge debate about this in another thread. I don't think evil is entirely subjective.

Also you are right about Hitler. He had a caring side, believe it or not.

[StalinFanboy]

We had a huge debate about this in another thread. I don't think evil is entirely subjective.

Also you are right about Hitler. He had a caring side, believe it or not.
there is no evil.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

We had a huge debate about this in another thread. I don't think evil is entirely subjective.

Also you are right about Hitler. He had a caring side, believe it or not.

Yeah, he cared a lot about his "superiour race".

[wsg1991]

Yeah, he cared a lot about his "superiour race".

poor hitler , i was too harsh on him :blushing:

[Goblin]

Obama, Merkel and Sarkozy

[Eagle_Syr]

Benjamin Netanyahou

[NoahZoahaar]

Perhaps Kruschev and Deng Xiaopeng, for reversing socialist gains, and re-installing capitalism and the class system. In regards to pure capitalists, probably Ronald Reagan, Woodrow Wilson, Adolf Hitler, Milton Friedman, and Leopold II, among others.

[Rafiq]

Take Hitler for example, he wasn't evil, just misunderstood.

He wasn't evil. He served the interests of his class, the bourgeois class and capital. All his actions were necessiated by the capitalist mode of production in Germany. Hitler was pretty insignificant in that regards, and people credit him too much. He was an idiot and an awful writer. The only talent he had was painting and giving speeches.

It's not as if Hitler was "evil" and the German Bourgeoisie were "Good". As if without Hitler, the German Bourgeoisie would have not exterminated the Jewish people, etc. :rolleyes:

Evil doesn't exist. There is only class interest. All other acts of supposed "evil" (serial killers) are classified as a result of mental imparity, or, psychological trauma from early age.

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[Rafiq]

We had a huge debate about this in another thread. I don't think evil is entirely subjective.

Also you are right about Hitler. He had a caring side, believe it or not.

You totally took Manics post out of context. And you lost the debate in that thread, by the way. You were fucked pretty badly.

And if you believe in objective morality and consider "evil" objective, and proceed to say Hitler had a "caring side", you're a Nazi shitbag and a Fascist sympathizer.

Not surprising, given your nationalistic tendancies and your sympathy with the far right. Did you not say you came from a classical Fascist forum?

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[Rafiq]

"Evil" is a Religious concept and inherently Idealist. Even Bourgeois thought in it's essence is lacking of such intellectual poison.

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[wsg1991]

"Evil" is a Religious concept and inherently Idealist. Even Bourgeois thought in it's essence is lacking of such intellectual poison.

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Evil is not universal , and the concept of evil change as the time change

we could define Evil according to our time at least
as someone who mass murder several thousand is a war criminal , and thus 'EVIL'
according to several international law right now , or at least the Relatively ''common sense '' of the majority of the population , and not individuals

better Evil according to revleft , which is pretty obvious , a murderer and exploiter of workers

[Eagle_Syr]

You totally took Manics post out of context. And you lost the debate in that thread, by the way. You were fucked pretty badly.
I disagree. There's rarely straightforward "winning" and "losing"


And if you believe in objective morality and consider "evil" objective I think people should do the right thing.

and proceed to say Hitler had a "caring side" It goes without saying. He was a human being.


Not surprising, given your nationalistic tendancies and your sympathy with the far right. Did you not say you came from a classical Fascist forum? So what? How many of the people on RevLeft have always been leftists?

[Firebrand]

Evil is a bit of a loaded term, maybe we should define it as causing a large amount of damage to the working class/peasantry/other people in general.

I'm going to nominate Lord Kitchener for inventing the concentration camp, Oliver Cromwell for various nasty actions that i'm sure i don't need to list, and George Osbourne because every time I see him on the news I want to punch the telly.

[Arlekino]

The Vatican Pope.

[Eagle_Syr]

The Vatican Pope.

I wouldn't say consciously evil as much as misguided.

[Skyhilist]

Surprised no one has mentioned Dick Cheney.

[Yuppie Grinder]

Ludwig von Mises.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f0/Ludwig_von_Mises.jpg/220px-Ludwig_von_Mises.jpg
most punchable face of all time

[Goblin]

Lee Doren

[rednordman]

How dare no-one mention Maggie Thatcher by this long into this thread. Come on comrades.:o

*Oh Sorry @ Negative Creep: But you missed the 'h' lol

[Goblin]

Lyndon B Johnson and Richard Nixon

[Manic Impressive]

Evil is not universal , and the concept of evil change as the time change

we could define Evil according to our time at least
as someone who mass murder several thousand is a war criminal , and thus 'EVIL'
according to several international law right now , or at least the Relatively ''common sense '' of the majority of the population , and not individuals

better Evil according to revleft , which is pretty obvious , a murderer and exploiter of workers
OK so how many people's deaths does someone have to be responsible for before they become evil? If the concept of evil is objective then it must be quantifiable.

The vast majority of people on this site believe that the only way for revolution to be accomplished is for a global civil war where millions will die. They also believe that reactionaries and counter revolutionaries are justified in being killed in order to achieve communism. Are they evil? Or do the ends sometimes justify the means?

Just as killing people can be in the interests of our class it can also be in the interests of the ruling class. This doesn't make them evil, it makes them, from their perspective justified and us evil. One man's righteous act can be another man's evil act. Therefore I would put it to you that the word evil is just another way of expressing extreme dislike.

Rafiq sums it up very well when he rightly calls it idealism and idealism is the rejection of materialism.

[wsg1991]

I wouldn't say consciously evil as much as misguided.

Khomeini

[Tim Cornelis]

I wonder if those "evil doesn't exist" folk here also go around in real life telling people who are making value judgments that their value judgments don't exist.

"Oh look, he's giving 10$ to that homeless man, what a good guy."
"He's not good, he is merely acting out of the prevailing material conditions. His charity is the product of false consciousness that substitutes class consciousness. Saying this person is good is entirely subjective and not based on any objectively verifiable property."

This is not a philosophical discussion. We know that "evil" doesn't objectively exist, but you can't go around avoiding value judgments your entire life now can you?

[Manic Impressive]

actually I'd explain that the act of giving to charity is an economic exchange which entitles the giver to ignore the person they are giving money to and to feel better about themselves. If someone was silly enough to make moral judgements around me then yes I would point out why they are wrong.

That being said I realize that this thread is a bit of fun, as the Idler said at the start just for teh lulz. But I feel I was right to raise the point as some people obviously do not see evil in the context of this thread as just for teh lulz but are treating it as an objective fact that good and evil actually exist. So this seems as good an opportunity as any to debate their idealism and help them to see why they are wrong.

that's what the learning forum is for ;)

[Sixiang]

There are numerous lists of name "The Most Evil Men!" that tries to slander communism as evil by naming Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot (who wasn't even a communist), etc. Or those who rose against imperialism such as Khomeini. Then there are direct creations of US imperialism that were called evil one they turned on US, such as Bin Laden and Saddam Hussein. So as a counter, who are the most evil capitalists who first create these situations which gives rise to "evil" retaliation? King Leopold II comes to mind. Henry Ford perhaps. thing is capitalistic exploitation so diffused and covert that it's hard to name single persons.
The idea that there is any non-evil capitalist is absurd. The entire system itself is what is exploitative and oppressive and must be destroyed. Capitalism as a system itself engenders the creation of capitalists, who are exploitative and oppressive. There were lots of people (mostly men) who were instrumental in pushing along the monopolization and imperialization of capitalism. I'm going to quote Engels on this matter: "we [Marx and I] only regarded the bourgeoisie as a class and hardly ever involved ourselves in conflicts with individual bourgeois."

Absolute and utter lol at the people trying to say Stalin was worse than Henry Ford.


I wonder if those "evil doesn't exist" folk here also go around in real life telling people who are making value judgments that their value judgments don't exist.

"Oh look, he's giving 10$ to that homeless man, what a good guy."
"He's not good, he is merely acting out of the prevailing material conditions. His charity is the product of false consciousness that substitutes class consciousness. Saying this person is good is entirely subjective and not based on any objectively verifiable property."

This is not a philosophical discussion. We know that "evil" doesn't objectively exist, but you can't go around avoiding value judgments your entire life now can you?
Yes, well, this is a totally different environment. This forum is a venue for debate on such matters between interested people. I don't start arguing with people on the street about stuff like that.

[Rafiq]

Alright, timmy. Go around telling people you're n anarchist and see how much they'll take you seriously, see how they'll think you're a distinguished theoritician and not a window smashing punk-esque minion of chaos.

In truth, the common people are tainted with bourgeois thought. I don't give a shit about how anyone percieves me. This is a leftist forum, and the hell if I'd expect to be judged on the basis of not being "normal" or not in correspondance with the common mode of thought (bourgeois thought).

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[Tim Cornelis]

Alright, timmy. Go around telling people you're n anarchist and see how much they'll take you seriously, see how they'll think you're a distinguished theoritician and not a window smashing punk-esque minion of chaos.

In truth, the common people are tainted with bourgeois thought. I don't give a shit about how anyone percieves me. This is a leftist forum, and the hell if I'd expect to be judged on the basis of not being "normal" or not in correspondance with the common mode of thought (bourgeois thought).

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My point is, there is a place and time for such discussions, whereas this is just naming capitalists you consider evil (subjectively of course). We all know here that there is no objective standard by which to judge "evil" but it's just a saying, more or less. There is no need to derail the thread for this.

[Manic Impressive]

My point is, there is a place and time for such discussions, whereas this is just naming capitalists you consider evil (subjectively of course). We all know here that there is no objective standard by which to judge "evil" but it's just a saying, more or less. There is no need to derail the thread for this.
I started it not Rafiq he hasn't derailed anything.

I'm sure that you know that evil is a silly term with no material basis but some people don't seem to know that, hence the discussion. If what you say is true then my comment would have been ignored and there would have been no "derailing".

Conversely this is the learning forum a part of the board for serious discussion. If this thread were not intended for that purpose perhaps you should request that it be moved to chit chat. If it does then I promise to STFU and post some pictures of cats ;)

[seventeethdecember2016]

There is no such thing as evil.
Agreed. Claims that people are evil are just subjective twaddles. There is no objective universal truth to what is evil and what isn't, nor is there any objectivity whatsoever to morality.

[Rafiq]

My point is, there is a place and time for such discussions, whereas this is just naming capitalists you consider evil (subjectively of course). We all know here that there is no objective standard by which to judge "evil" but it's just a saying, more or less. There is no need to derail the thread for this.

The point was simple, though. We as communist must not be concerned with the individual "vice" of capitalists. We are targeting the system in which capitalists exist. As far as I'm concerned, with that system in place, there should be no surprise if capitalists eat babies.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Extremely wide tie for first encompassing the entire first-world white labour aristocracy. Fuckers could end capitalism in a day, but prefer fast cars and little houses made of ticky-tack. If we're going to pose this as a moral question (which is maybe kinda silly, IMHO), we have to assume a subject-position capable of acting - since capitalists-proper can't end capitalism, they can't be "evil" per se. - only those with the subjective choice to end capitalism can be "evil". Who then, are the beneficiaries of capital who could choose the do the "good" thing and destroy it? The huge body of white workers who are at the geographical and administrative/judico-political centre of the capitalist apparatus. I blame them. That is to say, probably most of us on this board.

[Geiseric]

Maybe Leopold II since he kinda started imperialism, and was its first pioneer. The congo was the first ever imperialized state, in the modern sense it seems. Hitler was the antipode of communism, its exact opposite in the first revolutionary wave, so he and fascism would be considered "the worst capitalists (fascists)." Liberal democracies are at least in conflict with workers organizations, whereas fascists destroy any single hope of revolution with barbaric violence and totalitarianism (in an orwellian sense).

[Mass Grave Aesthetics]

I nominate Mobutu Sese Seko, Augusto Pinochet and Mao Tse- Tung.
Edit: Silvio Berlusconi gets an honorable mention.

[Drosophila]

I nominate Mobutu Sese Seko, Augusto Pinochet and Mao Tse- Tung.
Edit: Silvio Berlusconi gets an honorable mention.

Mao was a capitalist?

[Stain]

Lol this thread took a turn of its own. I agree to a varying degree with everyone who contributed. This thread was just to get names that I can throw at lay people who aren't really interested in having an intellectual discussion about materialistic condition, class analysis, modes of production, dialectics, etc and have a repulsive reaction towards socialism as they are acting under false consciousness. Once they see that every -ism has it own sets of "evils," then maybe they will be more open in having an open discussion.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

I want to bump this thread because nobody responded to my "workers are the most evil capitalists" bait. C'mon RevLeft - entertain me!

[Igor]

Mao was a capitalist?

He was in charge of what was basically a capitalist state, his function in PRC was that of a capitalist. Communism and being a capitalist aren't mutually exclusive, see Engels.

[Conscript]

Have we mentioned mr. Hearst?

[Marxaveli]

Here's my list:

All of them.

[GiantMonkeyMan]

Rupert Murdock is a slimy insipid fuckface who makes money off lies. I have a strong dislike of the man and his business.

[bad ideas actualised by alcohol]

Karl Marx

[ComradeOfJoplin]

Richard Mourdock and Todd Akins