Reality TV

[DasFapital]

come on comrades! time for a marxist analysis!

[X5N]

I used to go to the auctions held by that one guy on Storage Wars.

[DasFapital]

I used to go to the auctions held by that one guy on Storage Wars.

Oh yeah, well I went to high school with one of the kids on Deadliest Catch!

[Comrade Samuel]

I watch hardcore pawn when nothing else is on for laughs. As if the name wasn't a bad enough joke for you the show mostly consists of racial sterotypes stumbleing into this jackasses store, makeing complete fools of themselves followed proptly by being thrown out.


I really think it would be funny if somebody actually calculated the average amount of bleeps used on an average episode of hardcore pawn

[Revolution starts with U]

petit-bourgeois fantasy land

All either self-employed, small business owners, or rich kids partying... pretty much

Am I doing it right?

[DasFapital]

petit-bourgeois fantasy land

All either self-employed, small business owners, or rich kids partying... pretty much

Am I doing it right?
good analysis, red star for you!

[Revolution starts with U]

I'm torn on Undercover Boss tho.

At first glance you're thinking "big bourgeois for sure."

But then again, it's CEOs working "regular" jobs, and they usually come out of it (whether fake or staged) all "man those workers aren't the scum I thought they were."

[Raúl Duke]

I feel like it distorts the perception of reality at some subtle level.

They remind me of the Situationist Spectacle

[roy]

idk how to analyse marxist-like but i cant think of one reality tv show that doesnt suck. im not saying this to be anti-consumerist or anything; i love tv (breaking bad, weeds, true blood, dexter), but big brother, jersey shore? im never gonna understand the appeal

[ВАЛТЕР]

Bread and circuses.

The reality TV is one of the "circuses".

Not really Marxist, but there's my analysis on it.

[Regicollis]

So let's try to be Marxian (or whatever) on reality TV. Television is the single most important tool of propaganda and most people get virtually all their cultural input through television. As social animals humans gravitate towards behaving and believing as "the group" does. Thus television programmes are not only a way to kill time but a tool for disseminating the ideology - be it consciously or unconsciously - of those behind the television channels. It goes without saying that all media companies are controlled by the bourgeoisie.

I can see three immediate ideologies being propagated through reality television. The most important is the ideology of competition. A show like Big Brother has competition as it basic vibe and makes the contestants behave in a way that puts competition before basic social needs like community or companionship. Thus the viewer gets exposed to the idea that competition is natural and necessary. This in turn translates to an accept of the capitalist system as such.

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

Many reality programmes show people at work. Their work is described as interesting and important. So important that these people become the work and that their other human relations are subordinate and distant compared to their work identity.

[PC LOAD LETTER]

So let's try to be Marxian (or whatever) on reality TV. Television is the single most important tool of propaganda and most people get virtually all their cultural input through television. As social animals humans gravitate towards behaving and believing as "the group" does. Thus television programmes are not only a way to kill time but a tool for disseminating the ideology - be it consciously or unconsciously - of those behind the television channels. It goes without saying that all media companies are controlled by the bourgeoisie.

I can see three immediate ideologies being propagated through reality television. The most important is the ideology of competition. A show like Big Brother has competition as it basic vibe and makes the contestants behave in a way that puts competition before basic social needs like community or companionship. Thus the viewer gets exposed to the idea that competition is natural and necessary. This in turn translates to an accept of the capitalist system as such.

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

Many reality programmes show people at work. Their work is described as interesting and important. So important that these people become the work and that their other human relations are subordinate and distant compared to their work identity.
Gramsci, is that you?

Can ... can I have your autograph?

[Revolution starts with U]

So let's try to be Marxian (or whatever) on reality TV. Television is the single most important tool of propaganda and most people get virtually all their cultural input through television. As social animals humans gravitate towards behaving and believing as "the group" does. Thus television programmes are not only a way to kill time but a tool for disseminating the ideology - be it consciously or unconsciously - of those behind the television channels. It goes without saying that all media companies are controlled by the bourgeoisie.

I can see three immediate ideologies being propagated through reality television. The most important is the ideology of competition. A show like Big Brother has competition as it basic vibe and makes the contestants behave in a way that puts competition before basic social needs like community or companionship. Thus the viewer gets exposed to the idea that competition is natural and necessary. This in turn translates to an accept of the capitalist system as such.

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

Many reality programmes show people at work. Their work is described as interesting and important. So important that these people become the work and that their other human relations are subordinate and distant compared to their work identity.

Excellent! :D

So what's you analysis of Undercover Boss. It sort of fits into the final analysis, but it is supposed elites doing "menial" jobs and learning respect for labor.

[Regicollis]

Wow... thank you for the all the nice replies.:)


Excellent! :D

So what's you analysis of Undercover Boss. It sort of fits into the final analysis, but it is supposed elites doing "menial" jobs and learning respect for labor.

In Nazi Germany it was not uncommon for people to say "If only the Führer knew..." whenever they experienced the brutality of the system. "If only Stalin knew..." is also said to have been a common saying in the USSR.

I think a programme like "Undercover Boss" promotes the same mentality just with the boss instead of the Führer or Stalin. The programme shows that when the boss learns how shitty the conditions of the workers are he does something about it and thus restores justice.

The programme admits that workers have shitty conditions but it prescribes the wrong remedy. It prescribes a "solution" of social harmony and tells us that the problem is not exploitation but the unfortunate ignorance of the bosses. The way to improve the lives of workers thus becomes begging for alms from the bosses instead of class consciousness.

[NewLeft]

So let's try to be Marxian (or whatever) on reality TV. Television is the single most important tool of propaganda and most people get virtually all their cultural input through television. As social animals humans gravitate towards behaving and believing as "the group" does. Thus television programmes are not only a way to kill time but a tool for disseminating the ideology - be it consciously or unconsciously - of those behind the television channels. It goes without saying that all media companies are controlled by the bourgeoisie.

I can see three immediate ideologies being propagated through reality television. The most important is the ideology of competition. A show like Big Brother has competition as it basic vibe and makes the contestants behave in a way that puts competition before basic social needs like community or companionship. Thus the viewer gets exposed to the idea that competition is natural and necessary. This in turn translates to an accept of the capitalist system as such.

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

Many reality programmes show people at work. Their work is described as interesting and important. So important that these people become the work and that their other human relations are subordinate and distant compared to their work identity.
This is very true. If you look at this list of shows, there are several competition shows. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_programs_broadcast_by_MTV#Competitive_show s

MTV grew in prominence once it assumed this hegemonic role in American capitalism of promoting competition. The working class is watching the competitive shows while the petite bourgeois are watching reality TV. Thus, class reproduction. This ideology of competition through the state organ [MTV] sustained itself until economic crisis. The financial crisis, where it was no longer necessary to enforce the ideology of competition. It is a period where heightened class consciousness can develop, thus the ideology has a survival mechanism. Instead of connecting the increased competition for employment with this ideology and lead to rebuttal of the ideology, the ideology holds a double function and sustains itself by going into hibernation during times of crisis while resurfacing during periods of growth. This proves that the ideology of competition is a false consciousness to misdirect the working class from the systemic nature of the crisis.

[Psy]

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

It is only unthinkable because the audience is aware of the boundaries of the show and that those in the show have no incentive to attack the system. Yet in fiction long before reality TV really took off we had in fiction reality TV shows that had contestants defeat the system, for example Death Race 2000, The Running Man and Battle Royal to name a few.

[Manic Impressive]

no one mentioned the illusion of democracy element yet. y'know the programs picking the right contestants and then giving people the chance to vote for two extremely similar choices which are packaged slightly differently and made to seem like their vote matters.

[NewLeft]

I'm going to write my doctorate thesis on this.

[Regicollis]

no one mentioned the illusion of democracy element yet. y'know the programs picking the right contestants and then giving people the chance to vote for two extremely similar choices which are packaged slightly differently and made to seem like their vote matters.

If one was particularly malicious one would think that the farcical democracy in reality TV serves to legitimise the farcical democracy of the bourgeois state.

[Revolution starts with U]

Wow... thank you for the all the nice replies.:)



In Nazi Germany it was not uncommon for people to say "If only the Führer knew..." whenever they experienced the brutality of the system. "If only Stalin knew..." is also said to have been a common saying in the USSR.

I think a programme like "Undercover Boss" promotes the same mentality just with the boss instead of the Führer or Stalin. The programme shows that when the boss learns how shitty the conditions of the workers are he does something about it and thus restores justice.

The programme admits that workers have shitty conditions but it prescribes the wrong remedy. It prescribes a "solution" of social harmony and tells us that the problem is not exploitation but the unfortunate ignorance of the bosses. The way to improve the lives of workers thus becomes begging for alms from the bosses instead of class consciousness.

So basically it reinforces the idea of an enlightened despot being the cure to our ills?


If one was particularly malicious one would think that the farcical democracy in reality TV serves to legitimise the farcical democracy of the bourgeois state.

Taking the above with this reality TV as a whole is a full scale apolegetic for the bourgeois political structure, covering both the "failures of democracy" and their solution in the enlightened despot.

[L.A.P.]

Not to mention the recrent of phenomena of reality shows depicting obedient workers who go through a lot of social stigma such as repo men, and dudes who give you parking tickets.

To elaborate on the Situationist stuff, it really does epitomize what Debord meant by people's experiences being replaced by representations. Late Night Big Brother, you're watching a group of people have an awkward conversation around a couch. That's something you're supposed to be doing at 2 AM, not watch.

[Althusser]

American Guns is a pretty cool show. People come to their shop and have custom guns made for them.

As for Jersey Shore type shit... I've never watched an episode.

[Comrade Samuel]

So let's try to be Marxian (or whatever) on reality TV. Television is the single most important tool of propaganda and most people get virtually all their cultural input through television. As social animals humans gravitate towards behaving and believing as "the group" does. Thus television programmes are not only a way to kill time but a tool for disseminating the ideology - be it consciously or unconsciously - of those behind the television channels. It goes without saying that all media companies are controlled by the bourgeoisie.

I can see three immediate ideologies being propagated through reality television. The most important is the ideology of competition. A show like Big Brother has competition as it basic vibe and makes the contestants behave in a way that puts competition before basic social needs like community or companionship. Thus the viewer gets exposed to the idea that competition is natural and necessary. This in turn translates to an accept of the capitalist system as such.

The other ideologies are those of social harmony and glorified labour. You will never hear a character in a reality show question the system, be it the artificial system built by the programme or be it the capitalist system as such. Dissent is not illegal - dissent is unthinkable, and the current system is the only one imaginable.

Many reality programmes show people at work. Their work is described as interesting and important. So important that these people become the work and that their other human relations are subordinate and distant compared to their work identity.

I am genuinely shocked anybody could come together with a half way coherent analysis on reality TV, I honestly thought this thread was all for laughs. Now I must ask what could possibly be said about some of the lowest of the low reality shows (*cough* jersey shore *cough*) I see no Marxist parallels on the face of it, matter of fact I see absolutely nothing about it with any deeper meaning than what is stated out right. What say you?

[Regicollis]

I am genuinely shocked anybody could come together with a half way coherent analysis on reality TV, I honestly thought this thread was all for laughs. Now I must ask what could possibly be said about some of the lowest of the low reality shows (*cough* jersey shore *cough*) I see no Marxist parallels on the face of it, matter of fact I see absolutely nothing about it with any deeper meaning than what is stated out right. What say you?

As I can't watch MTV I live in happy oblivion about Jersey Shore. The worst show I can watch is called Paradise Hotel and is about pretty and stupid young people who are staying at a tropical luxury resort and spend all their time either fucking each other, yelling at each other or getting drunk.

I guess that is a pretty common concept and I have seen many shows that are basically about the same thing with a few twists.

I think these kinds of shows serve to present a false image of reality. We are being presented with people who seemingly can spend all their time partying. The contestants on these shows seem to live in a parallel world completely divorced from economic reality. None of these people are presented as very bright so we are given the idea that if morons like that can have such a life style then we (who can sit in the couch feeling smart) can have just the same. When reality kicks in and we don't get all the nice stuff then it must be our own faults.

Much of these shows also presents us with unrealistic ideas of a normal level of consumption. The people on this kind of shows are never short for money and they always have all the cool gadgets and clothes. We are thus presented with the idea that you need all of that useless junk in order to fit in.

They also presents us with easy objects of hate and ridicule which can serve as lightning rods to protect against criticism of the system. Some of these characters are casted and edited so that everyone can feel better than them. Then people can use all their time talking about how X from the show Y is a moron instead of how the bosses are robbing them.

In short they are designed to keep peoples minds turned away from reality.

[Raúl Duke]

I somewhat agree with Regicollis...although I did spend a whole month once living a kinda reality TV life while studying abroad in Florence...it was ridiculous.

But even in that reality, there are certain things that happen in reality TV that ain't normal and/or rare and yet I believe it "normalizes" to some degree (or makes us jaded to it) those not-normal/rare behaviors, attitudes.

[Deicide]

But even in that reality, there are certain things that happen in reality TV that ain't normal and/or rare and yet I believe it "normalizes" to some degree (or makes us jaded to it) those not-normal/rare behaviors, attitudes.

Give some concrete examples?

[Psy]

I think these kinds of shows serve to present a false image of reality. We are being presented with people who seemingly can spend all their time partying. The contestants on these shows seem to live in a parallel world completely divorced from economic reality.

Same can be said about most fiction, for example sitcoms also was divorced from economic reality.



Much of these shows also presents us with unrealistic ideas of a normal level of consumption. The people on this kind of shows are never short for money and they always have all the cool gadgets and clothes. We are thus presented with the idea that you need all of that useless junk in order to fit in.

Again this problem also existed in sitcoms.

[Regicollis]

Same can be said about most fiction, for example sitcoms also was divorced from economic reality.


Again this problem also existed in sitcoms.

I agree with you on that. Sitcoms are even worse in my opinion since most of them are set in what pretends to be a realistic setting.

[Psy]

I agree with you on that. Sitcoms are even worse in my opinion since most of them are set in what pretends to be a realistic setting.
Well from I seen grounding fiction in a plausible economic relationship is just something writers don't think about as most writers simply don't think about political economy this is why we have romanticism of feudalism in fantasy fiction as the caste system is ripped out of feudalism when it comes to writing fictional worlds, just like the capitalists/proletariat relationship is ripped out in capitalism when writings set their story in modern times, when they want to have class friction they add it through plot contrivance at the character level rather then having class friction take place across the entire fictional setting.

For example take the long running animated sitcom the Simpsons there were times they threw in class friction but it was never done as a constant relationship on a macro level, we go from Homer having to struggle just to maintain the living standard of his family in one episode to scarcity ignored in the next.

[Lynx]

Reality TV shows cost less to produce.

[Positivist]

I agree with you on that. Sitcoms are even worse in my opinion since most of them are set in what pretends to be a realistic setting.

Damnable Regicollis, your kicking ass on these responses. I would reccommend that you start formalizing these ideas into articles, or polemics of some sort.

The only difference in opinion from myself to you is that I do not necessarily believe that shows are designed to subvert class conscioussness, but rather that there subversive nature is the result if the conscioussness of the bourgiose producers/writers.

[Psy]

Damnable Regicollis, your kicking ass on these responses. I would reccommend that you start formalizing these ideas into articles, or polemics of some sort.

The only difference in opinion from myself to you is that I do not necessarily believe that shows are designed to subvert class conscioussness, but rather that there subversive nature is the result if the conscioussness of the bourgiose producers/writers.
Yet the artists are wage slaves, they have no more control over the finished commodity then a engineer.

[Positivist]

Yet the artists are wage slaves, they have no more control over the finished commodity then a engineer.

May you expand?

[Yuppie Grinder]

Oh yeah, well I went to high school with one of the kids on Deadliest Catch!

The dudes from American Pickers used to be my neighbors.

[Psy]

May you expand?
That artists are hired by capitalists and paid a wage to create art as a commodity their hourly wage doesn't cover the full value they created as capitalists only hired them to exploit their labor. This class relationship means the capitalist master of the artist also has the most say in the end product, if you pitch an your creation to a studio if they see potential they will say they like it but they need to make changes to make it more marketable and like a engineer the artist is simply creating commodities in line with what their capitalist master wants.

While the following video talks about games it does bring up this issue.OaY4W_2NIEM

[Positivist]

That artists are hired by capitalists and paid a wage to create art as a commodity their hourly wage doesn't cover the full value they created as capitalists only hired them to exploit their labor. This class relationship means the capitalist master of the artist also has the most say in the end product, if you pitch an your creation to a studio if they see potential they will say they like it but they need to make changes to make it more marketable and like a engineer the artist is simply creating commodities in line with what their capitalist master wants.

While the following video talks about games it does bring up this issue.OaY4W_2NIEM

Ok thank you, now I understand.

[Regicollis]

Damnable Regicollis, your kicking ass on these responses. I would reccommend that you start formalizing these ideas into articles, or polemics of some sort.

The only difference in opinion from myself to you is that I do not necessarily believe that shows are designed to subvert class conscioussness, but rather that there subversive nature is the result if the conscioussness of the bourgiose producers/writers.

I also don't think that TV shows (or any other manifestations of bourgeois culture) are designed as propaganda. I also think that they are like that as a result of the bourgeois mindset.

I think one relatively easy could expand Chomsky's propaganda model to also cover entertainment.

[Comrade Trollface]

Episode 2 of Black Mirror, "15 Million Merits", is a pretty good deconstruction of reality TV, social networking and obesity panic social trends.

Every comrade must pirate and watch it ASAP.

[Psy]

I also don't think that TV shows (or any other manifestations of bourgeois culture) are designed as propaganda. I also think that they are like that as a result of the bourgeois mindset.

It is not a bourgeois mindset it is that the gatekeepers are bourgeoisie. This is why there the huge gap with the Internet as we see a growing trend towards of Internet shows that deconstruct of mainstream entertainment because the Internet has no such gatekeepers.