I Just Upset My Mom

[Ilyich]

Okay, well, I'm sure many of you have been in a situation like this where you're a militant leftist, a loved one (in this case my mom) is a liberal with complete loyalty to the Democratic Party, you get into an argument with her about something small, it grows to be a large, heated, angry political debate, and by the end, when she says 'just drop it,' both your arguments are incoherent and inarticulate and you are both angry.

Here's what happened. I was talking with my mom, and she asked me (by the way, she knows I'm a communist) if I would canvass for Barrett with her. I obviously refused and made a semi-joke about how a worker supporting a Democrat would be tantamount to cross-class collaborationism. She asked me for whom I was going to canvass. I should that if I got the chance, I would try to discourage people from voting, to abstain from the election.

Then she (being a loyal Democrat) became angry and accused me of essentially sitting on the sidelines while Walker strips workers of their rights (not her exact words). Then it escalated into a full-blown argument regarding the relationship between the working class and the Democratic Party. There were a lot of contradictions in her arguments that I didn't think to exploit. First, she makes the "lesser of two evils" argument. Later, she says the Democrats aren't an evil at all and that she actually thinks Barrett will be a good, not just better than Walker but good governor. She decries the deaths in China under Mao (for a reason I can no longer remember) while forgetting that capitalism has killed millions in the past and will kill again if it is not stopped. She says that the workers of the advanced capitalist countries are too stupid to lead a revolution but when I tell her that the German Revolutions of 1919 and 1923 may have failed because of the SPD's betrayal, she says something like "So, the workers weren't smart enough to do without the party?" To be fair, my arguments were no better than hers.

Anyway, we became upset with one another. We'll forgive one another soon enough, though. I still feel pretty bad about it. Does anyone have any similar experiences? I'm sorry if I'm whiny. I'm just blowing off steam.

[Firebrand]

I used to get into these sorts of arguments all the time, a combination of a pathological need to get the last word and very strongly held beliefs. Radical beliefs will always upset a certain kind of person, they aren't bad people and quite often their fundamental beliefs are actually quite similar to yours but they are frightened by beliefs that are outside their comfort zone and it isn't really fair to push ideas they are uncomfortable with at them.

Its a matter of knowing when not to push. It is perfectly ok to raise questions with them but if you push too hard they will just get upset and refuse to listen and then no-one is happy. Just remember you are all fundamentally good people who care about each other, it'll sort itself out.

[Leftsolidarity]

I usually get into those arguments with my parents but my parents are strong conservatives so they usually give a little different arguments.

[Pretty Flaco]

buy her some flowers!

[Leftsolidarity]

buy her some flowers!

pfffttt flowers are so bourgeois :rolleyes:

[wsg1991]

i bribe women with chocolate , it's super effective done it several times

[NewLeft]

pfffttt flowers are so bourgeois :rolleyes:
Roses taste good tho, make a good tea/ice cream/smoothie.. Yum, I'm going to go blend some flowers.

[Pretty Flaco]

pfffttt flowers are so bourgeois :rolleyes:

but i can buy them at walmart :(

[Imposter Marxist]

sounds like a state-capitalist to me. Introduce her to the DSA or ISO. We're friendly to liberals :D

[Misanthrope]

death to your liberal mother

[PC LOAD LETTER]

death to your liberal mother
This post made me laugh IRL for some reason

[Prometeo liberado]

Ya, your mom got mad at me last night as well. Or maybe she was still upset with you? Whatever, we will all get over it together, some more together than others.;)

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

You're a militant, are you?

[TheRedAnarchist23]

I used to get into arguments with my mother about anarchism, not anymore, she now sympathises with anarchism.

All it takes is presistancy and being able to explain your theory in a way that anyone can comprehend.

If you explain your views to your mother maybe she will start sympathising with communism, but i don't know because my mother wasnt a fanatical liberal, and I only explain anarchism:D

[WanderingCactus]

I've never cared enough to argue with family about politics. Seems a waste of time.

[GPDP]

And that's why I no longer give my opinion on politics to family and friends unless I'm specifically asked to.

It's no secret that I'm a communist, and they in fact came to not only tolerate but even accept and respect my views. I'm a man who chooses his words carefully, so I tend to explain things in a very succinct, articulate manner that anyone who cares to listen appreciates, so that may have something to do with it. That said, from time to time it can still lead to conflict, so I pretty much just don't talk about it to save myself the trouble.

[DasFapital]

you're lucky. my mom thinks I'm going to hell and accuses me of trying to "turn my brother into a queer".

[Sentinel]

Can't help you really -- my mother is a leftist, a former activist, and very sympathetic towards my organisation despite coming from a different tradition herself. While she won't join us she helps out financially and by giving advice.

We argued a lot when I was younger, but never over politics as far as I can remember, even back when I was teenager and hardly identified as a leftist (I guess that was my way of rebelling against her).

But yeah, the most important thing when you are having a political debate, especially with someone close to you, is to try and keep calm even though it of course can be very hard. If it's impossible at the given time, excuse yourself and bring the matter up when you have had time to prepare for the argument.

In this case, when it's too late for that, the best course of action would likely be to apologise for getting angry/rude etc, while maintaining that you still feel your position is the correct one. After that wait until things are back to normal and then bring it up again when you are prepared, if you feel like doing it.

[Sentinel]

Also, Non-Political is a forum for serious discussion, for example for people like OP to turn to the community with actual concerns. Therefore please refrain from Chit Chat type oneliners.

This is a general verbal warning, any more posts such as # 10 will lead straight to infractions.

[ellipsis]

Ya, your mom got mad at me last night as well. Or maybe she was still upset with you? Whatever, we will all get over it together, some more together than others.;)

additional verbal warning for this, this is patriarchal bullshit "humor" which shouldn't even be found in chit chat.

[The Intransigent Faction]

"I'm tired of your cynicism"- My mom on my saying how the capitalist job market (specifically the unemployment level) is ridiculous in this day and age when the resources exist for a system where we don't need to rely on a boss to "give us a job".

"That's not realistic. This is just the way things are."- My mom's reaction to the idea of replacing capitalism with a system where goods are produced for needs, not for profit.

So, yeah...good luck. Sometimes family really seems to enjoy messing with ya more than anyone.

[Agent Ducky]

Similar thing has happened between my mom and I. She kinda freaked out after ComradeGrant and I were both arguing against her when he was on Skype...

[Positivist]

My mom once told me that "you can take your left wing stuff to a small island but America is for free enterprise." I looked at her like she was 5 and then she got mad.

[Zav]

My mom once told me that "you can take your left wing stuff to a small island but America is for free enterprise." I looked at her like she was 5 and then she got mad.
Lol, seasteading.

Apparently I force my views on the family when I verbally disagree with them, and every person with an opinion is opinionated. There is simply no reasoning with them.

[Le Socialiste]

These things happen, particularly in the company of those whose beliefs are directly opposed to yours. It can be especially hard if said company is comprised of family and loved ones, as any argument runs the risk of 'personal engagements,' wherein matters of character, morality, and conduct worm their way into the conversation. My parents, both liberals, appeared fine when I first mentioned I was a communist, but once it became clear that it wasn't a phase they began openly questioning my reasons for becoming one. My mom was especially upset, and would continually try to goad me into debates I had no interest in. At first I was eager to express what I'd learned and come to, but it quickly became apparent that she wasn't interested so much in what I had to say as she was in 'dispelling' my arguments.

I mention this because it's important that you not lose your head when confronted by one or more individuals who oppose the basic fundamentals of your politics. Some genuinely want to learn, but come across as combative (due in large part to years of conditioning); others just want a fight. Regardless of the personality, it's essential that you articulate your points well, while refraining from 'lofty' and/or 'confusing' rhetoric. I think every leftist has to find this out the hard way, as it may be tempting at times to launch straight into a lengthy diatribe concerning the "rudimentary foundations of finance capital" without first understanding your audience. It's often easier if you ease them in gently, as opposed to waving a hammer and sickle in their face. That said, you still stand the risk of hurting or upsetting someone - this is the sad reality of debate. Chances are you or someone else will emerge less happy than before you started talking. It happens. The best you can do is learn from it and move on. I usually approach a friend or family member with a conciliatory drink and/or card game when such things happen. It works most of the time.

[Peoples' War]

I got in a very heated discussion over drug legalization with my soon-to-be step-mother.

She was already pissed off for some reason, and the topic of marijuana got brought up while myself, my father, her and her son were eating at a Wendy's. I came out in support of legalization or it, and all drugs. Several shitty points from her later, she stood up and stormed out of the place.

Victory for me, in which me and her son basically discussed how I won the argument.

She apologized the next day.

[Prometeo liberado]

My mom once told me that "you can take your left wing stuff to a small island but America is for free enterprise." I looked at her like she was 5 and then she got mad.

That has to be the funniest shit I have ever heard, ever!

[Trap Queen Voxxy]

In regards to the OP, that's actually way more respectable and coherent then the argument me and my father about Anarchism, I explained everything to him and mentioned various evidences varying in subject and he just denied it, said that there while always be hierarchy and a state and that it didn't really matter they are all shitty. The disconnect between his responses and opinions are just like wtf, how are you not agreeing and into this? Then again, between us both we killed a 1.75 litre bottle of vodka in like 30 minutes and were smoking and debating.