The Hypocricy of this Site

[Guest]

The people that run this site alogn with all the stupid college kids who are blinder by rampant romantism are the height of hypocrisy. Why the hell is that when you first login there is a pop-up ad trying to sell you shit? I thought socialists were against mindless consumerism? and what about all the banner ads for blatently capitalist corporations? Let's just face that fact you like to feel righeteos and you guys like the colrs of red black and yellow. You people are mostly little suburbanite kids who act out of their bordem by embracing killers "che" and idolising them. Only these people can view che, mou and others as heros and notfor the murderers that they are. I've even heard people trying to praise Joseph Stalin!!!! Ever wonder why there are so many communist organizations onn college campuses but so few in ghettos? That's right the people in the ghetto that you so admire have to deal with real life instead of playing communist activist hero on the weekends. Please do the world a favor and go back to the suburbans where you belong.

[Kez]

well guest, i have to agree with u, that malte is prone to getting capitalism to fukk all over this place, and im sure im gonna get booted for expressing my views. especially the casino ads,wtf is going on.

but io dont agree with the shit bout uncle joe, he was a star

comrade kamo

[CommieBastard]

Stalin was a fascist.
As for our 'embracing the murderer che', he fought to end the rule of tyrants and murderers. You of the right wing embrace instead such figures as Bush. Bush? yeah, he's not at all a murderer....

[Moskitto]

I think you'll find that the TOS of the banner extange program opperated by this site says "No commercial sites" so unless Malte hasn't been sorting it out properly they shouldn't really be there

And about us embracing murderers like Che and Joseph Stalin I think you'll find that very few of us embrace Stalin and some of us (like me) don't embrace Che. I am an admirer of Rosa Luxemburg who was a Pacafist.

[DaNatural]

guest what is your problem? you have a problem with people talking about equality? you also generalize, i live in canada come from a working class family and do not enjoy the bullshit luxuries life has to offer. i think the way that i do because i see that their is a better life. as for people in the ghetto not being communist, ever heard of Dead Prez? there a rap group who blatantly admit that their down with the socialist cause. Malcolm X towards the end of his life was a socialist. the reason kids in the ghetto arent socialist's or embrace the left wing is because they are unorganized and brainwashed. They think the only way to make things better is to have material possessions. Some of my friends are on social assistance and they embrace what i say and try to make a difference so lets not start generalizing. peace

[Che Jexster]

I just thought it was ironic you calling Che a murderer. How was it he died again? Maybe when they system you support learns to stop oppressing and employing death squads to keep the poor down, and stops oppressing them economically there will be no need for such "murders".
Secondly you seem to generalize the left alot "i heard some people support Stalin and thats the same as all of you supporting him" and crazy shit like that. Well I've heard skinheads who are extreme rightests support Hitler so using your logic...
Thirdly, I am completly aware of the hypocracy of the site, but we live in a Capitalist society.
Thirdly, for someone whose writing a thread about hypocracy yelling at people saying they have a "holier than art thou" attitude and telling everyone here they're wrong and stupid and you're right... i shouldn't have to elaborate anymore ill just assume you know where that was going.

[Zippy]

Quote: from Guest on 6:16 pm on Nov. 16, 2001
Please do the world a favor and go back to the suburbans where you belong.
Speaking for myself, I have never claimed to be anything more than a middle class white boy.

Zippy.

[El Commandante]

WTF the do the ads matter, if you don't click on them then the ads have been a waste of money. We are provided with an excellant place for debate and your whining about the ads. Get real, where else could we debate like we do, no where. If you don't like the ads ignore them, I do. Malte didn't ask for them, they have to be there for us to keep having to bored, so stop whining and start debating.

[El Commandante]

Quote: from Zippy on 4:05 pm on Nov. 17, 2001

Quote: from Guest on 6:16 pm on Nov. 16, 2001
Please do the world a favor and go back to the suburbans where you belong.
Speaking for myself, I have never claimed to be anything more than a middle class white boy.

Zippy.


It's good that your so honest, I'm the same, I'm middle class and come from a good family but im not for it. I'm completely against it. No one on this forum for be judged for their background or beliefs. We are all equal and all have an equal view point which should be listened to be all.

[Edelweiss]

I know the ads suck, but it's the only way to finance this site. Che-Lives has a data volume of over 20 GB per month and it's getting more. The hosting costs are high and I don't have the money to pay it by my own. I'm just using the tools of capitalism to work against it.
And TavareeshKamo, I'm not running any casino ads, what the hell are you talking about? I have never run any casino ads and I will never run any. I have the option to deselect this kind of ads along with pop-ups and pop-unders, and I'm always using this option.
I'm not running this site to make money, I'm running this site because I'm a convinced socialist and Che admirer. Do you have an idea how much time it took to make this site and to maintain it?
And TavareeshKamo, I'm not a Stalinist like you, I'll not boot you for your opinions.

[Guest]

Quote: from Malte on 10:48 pm on Nov. 18, 2001
And TavareeshKamo, I'm not a Stalinist like you, I'll not boot you for your opinions.Then what's the *Commie Club* about?

[Freiheit]

yes, what do i have to do to get entrance to the CommieCLub?

[Son of Scargill]

Get to 50 posts and if you're not a blatant right-winger you should have access.You shouldn't have a problem.

[gooddoctor]

exactly malte! do you want malte to pay for all this out of his own pocket, you think it comes free? let's be a little grateful atleast.
furthermore, i am proud of both my middle class upbringing and my working class roots. why shouldn't i be? should i be ashamed of that which i can't help? we, as socialists, should be open and honest, we should hide nothing and try to avoid hypocracy at every turn because that puts us on the moral high ground and makes sure that we cannot be compromised. that is why i only shop fair trade and don't eat meat. i lead a simple life and try not to use up too much of society's resources by recycling and reducing energy waste. basically, i try to practise what i preach and try not to take too much, whilst giving back as much as i can.
democracy isn't about reaching a compromise between interests, it's about doing what's in the majority's best interests. corporate interests are what takes precedence in today's society and corporate interests are diametrically opposed to people's interests in every way. the corporations form powerful lobbies in the highest echelons of domestic and international government because they must fight against democracy in order to achieve their goals. corporations only have one goal, to increase market share and maximise profits for their shareholders at all costs. that is their function, they do not compromise, and they will exploit every single aspect of society if we let them.
sometimes the majority isn't powerful enough to resist the corporations, so that is why we must ally ourselves and fight the common enemy together because it's for everyone, working or middle class. it is capitalism that forces people in the ghettos to deal with so-called "real life". they have been sidelined by society, but are told that this is just the way it is and they must live with their lot, or as our ignorant guest puts it "real life". the tabloids teach them to hate immigrants and blame their problems on them, but the real enemy is capitalism and globalisation. that is real life, and we must take our message to them, show them there is another way if we all work together, even if they be the hardest section of society to reach. they have been heavily indoctrinated and do not have the same opportunities as most to understand the way the world works. it takes time and patience, and that is something working people do not have.
but it's not just people in the ghettos we're fighting for, it's all oppressed people. these are some of the reasons why i give up so much of my free time, when i have many better and more important things to be doing, to fight capitalism. i don't expect thanks, i don't want any reward, i just feel like i have to because otherwise, who would care? in the economy under capitalism, which has invaded every single facet of people's lives, economic benefit takes precedence over social and environmental costs. this is wrong and causes much suffering and oppression around the world. we fight for for peace-loving people who want an end to the perpetual violence of imperialism, for the billions of people who must live on less then a dollar a day whilst the richest three men control more wealth than the 43 poorest countries, for the 19,000 children who die each year as a direct result of globalisation and "structural reforms", for environmentalists who want our world to exist for more than a few hundred years more, for those who believe in global justice but must tolerate american double standards and the vetoing of an internationally recognised judicial body, for those watching our culture be cheapened by yankee (alright, not just yankee) pop-culture, for ordinary people who have to sit by and watch their public services being compromised by private finance initiative, for trade unionists who are slowly seeing their powers subverted by corporate expansion, for people who are fed up of being lied to by the corporate press and for all those who have been alienated by capitalism because it puts profits before people, the environment, freedom and democracy.
this is the reality of the world today and it's up to all of us to decide whether we're going to ignore it because it might not affect us today, or fight it because it will kill our brothers and sisters tomorrow.

(Edited by gooddoctor at 3:32 pm on Nov. 19, 2001)

[Son of Scargill]

Couldn't have put it better,Gooddoctor!

[RedCeltic]

LoL.... It must get on your nerves having to restate yourself on the reason for the add... over and over again Malte. It's only to be expected I suppose. Some people think they are rather clever.

You couldn't truly expect Malte to bring such a site for you without in some way trying to make it pay for it's own costs.

The only other way would be for him to request donations. The add is much easier.

[Moskitto]

I'm just using the tools of capitalism to work against it.

That is the most excellent policy ever. My theory for the destruction of capitalism uses it's own blood and uses capitalist theories against it.



And TavareeshKamo, I'm not a Stalinist like you, I'll not boot you for your opinions.
Then what's the *Commie Club* about?

Unfortunately due to right-wingers invading us we decided to make a forum for us. It has nothing to do with Stalin.

[David Loco]

I am not white, and not from the middle class. I am a Latino from the poorest poor class...I am a blue collar Social Activist and a life long Communist. The idea is to aspire to the ideals that a person beleaves in. Although everyone doesn't agree with the actions of those you mentioned... they were committed and dedicated to their beliefs. I am happy to have found this forum. I don't know where else I could share my ideas, my past, or my current thoughts. I spent have seen opression since I was a kid and decided when on the playground was a sign that read...NO DOGS OR MEXICANS ALLOWED.... I was going to change things....When we tore down the sign we decided to go after those who put the sign up...I lived in Mexico for more than 12 years....Unless you have lived like we lived then, you cannot imagine what an opressive and corrupt government is capable of. Now, it rights for our race that I work for..rights for undocumented workers, womens rights, and Trade Unionism. I wish I had been from the middle class...My feet wouldn't be giving me the problems that they do now from not wearing shoes until I was ten years old....

[Freiheit]

marx the most famous theorist of communism, even he came from the middle class, he wasnt a worker, but he saw that the world must be changed, and that your roots dont matter. you must try to change the world, you must fight.

[DaNatural]

interesting post david loco, im glad you found the site comrade , good luck with all your endeavours. peace

[gogo gomez]

so then figure it all out and then decide if "communism" is realistic or at all possible on a world wide front. what would actually have to happen to make communism world wide? does anyone even know? how relevant is history to today? im only asking, i mean everyone here has demonstrated potential to an extent but its not fair to label everyone and everything as a hypocrite, but lets be sure we are not spinning our wills or missing out on opportunities. and so what if some outsider wants to come here and criticize, let em or should is say "f" em? hehe

[Guest1]

It's not like we're actually endorsing any of these products. If a big corporation wants to pay for its own eventual distruction... let 'em. Noone is paying any attention to the ads, I haven't found a sudden urge to lower my long distance bill, or hit three ducks to win a prize, so who cares.

[gogo gomez]

Quote: from gooddoctor on 2:45 pm on Nov. 19, 2001
exactly malte! do you want malte to pay for all this out of his own pocket, you think it comes free? let's be a little grateful atleast.

(Edited by gooddoctor at 3:32 pm on Nov. 19, 2001)


i am grateful despite my conflicts with many of the views here but i feel strong of my own so i have no need to critize anyone else, (but i am known to act difficult, only out of personality hehe). gooddocter you make too many points without taking a breath of air, i have trouble keeping up with such a pro.

first of all, have not the corporations already beat us? (non specific in usage of word "us")
second of all, corporations support many of those "ghettos" you speak of so going in and sharing ideas may only work using the school system. honestly, most of what i read here seems hopeless so why exploit it to the exploited?
you are fortunate and at peace to practice what you preach, such as I am fortunate to know inside my self my own path and destiny which is the same as my dreams so i tend not to focus so much on the same things that you do (although i agree they are sound) but rather on the spirit. now what does "spirituality" have to do with "organizing" well maybe not much but it leads to the same "vision" only in a different dimension.

i must break for now, but you make good points, you certainly have my interests. tah ta for now.

(Edited by gogo gomez at 2:06 am on Nov. 21, 2001)

[CommieBastard]

i feel an urge to shoot the ducks, but i only ever shoot 2, just to spite em :)

[Capitalist]

I like this site.

I like the stupid ads - proof that capitalism works! Even your founder agrees that advertising helps finance this site, which in turn helps us express our opinions on communism and Che Guevara. What is wrong with that?

This is the first communist site that has the balls to argue with "right-wingers" like myself. Although I consider myself a moderate "right-winger" and perhaps they really don't want me on this site - and I will most likely be banned soon.

Let's try not try to generalize communists or stupid internet ads. Although I agree - El Che was definitely a murderer and I'm not such a good speller.

[RedCeltic]

Capitalist ------What truck did you fall off of? Of course Malte has adverts on his site... we live in a capitalist world!

[Chameleon102]

I'm sorry, but IMHO, Stalin was responsible for turning the Soviet Union from Communist to Fascist w. a Commie face.

Dictators like him and Mao blot the image of an otherwise fine system.

[Moskitto]

Actually I know how you can run a website for Free with No ads, and full CGI and PERL support, and a domain name wouldn't be that much more.

[Kez]

Moskitto, u wanna go into partnership?
i gotta whole load of great commie sites for uploading, im just waiting to find a free domain etc

comrade kamo

[Moskitto]

I don't know where you can get free domain names without ads, Namezero is free but has ads, but my friend has one which he got free because he was one of the 1st 200 customers or something.

As for webspace you can get 20Mb under yourname.f2s.com for free with Perl 5.206 for free with no ads from www.f2s.com

For HTML editing there's a program called EZpad which might be on www.download.com which is a brilliant free one but you have to know some HTML coding to do some complicated stuff but I can send you some template pages.

for CGI scripts there's loads of free scripts on www.cgiarchives.com or www.cgi-resourches.com which has lots of scripts but not all of them are free.

For pictures a good place is redencyclopeadia (www.geocities.com/redencyclopedia) but there is a better quality Rosa Luxemburg picture than the one on that site. Otherwise the best place to get communist or socialist pictures is to nick (sorry I meant download) them from other sites.

If you wnat to fool some capitalists (hmmm) you can get a page on your site with "Click here to win" and set up a spy-ware cookie to tell you which sites they go to (but I heard somewhere that was illegal). Also put on the page a javascript to give them an error message (I did this to someone and their reaction was so funny, It was like "I went to your site and saw something that said don't click so I clicked and my screen went mad.") But I don't want to put an error message into the forum.

Hope this helps.

[Chancho]

Well Malte, perhaps it's time to plaster a disclaimer in relation to the ad when one enters the site - eg ...

WARNING: The presence of advertising on this site in no way impliedly or expressly indicates any belief in capitalistic values and should not under any circumstances be interpreted as a qualification of the socialistic ideals held by the creator of this site. Any assertion that the presence of the advertisement constitutes hypocrisy is hereby repudiated on the grounds of being a non sequitur and inconclusive.


By the way, for those discussing the 'class' origins of various people, you neglected to mention that Che was of upper middle class extraction. Gee, it doesn't seem to determine one's social consciousness, how about that!



(Edited by Chancho at 7:31 am on Dec. 3, 2001)

[booga]

Quote: from Malte on 10:48 pm on Nov. 18, 2001
I know the ads suck, but it's the only way to finance this site. Che-Lives has a data volume of over 20 GB per month and it's getting more. The hosting costs are high and I don't have the money to pay it by my own. I'm just using the tools of capitalism to work against it.
And TavareeshKamo, I'm not running any casino ads, what the hell are you talking about? I have never run any casino ads and I will never run any. I have the option to deselect this kind of ads along with pop-ups and pop-unders, and I'm always using this option.
I'm not running this site to make money, I'm running this site because I'm a convinced socialist and Che admirer. Do you have an idea how much time it took to make this site and to maintain it?
And TavareeshKamo, I'm not a Stalinist like you, I'll not boot you for your opinions.


hey malte, dont worry about it. most of us are forced to do what we have to do just to maintain thats why i have a problem with the word "hypocrite" to me its like "gasp" the word communism or socialism but dont get me wrong im not using that word to define anything or anyone, i hate that word.

anything i can do to help, just let me know, im not rich or smart but i do what i can. im on it!

thanks for the site, i meant to tell you that sooner. :)

[mazahua]

I dont see anything wrong with using the resources of the enemy for gain just like che took the guns of the batista army for his own use.
I think this is a great site keep up the good work.
And if he was referring to che being an assasin because of the fairing squads the trials where always fair, and it was a neccesity to purge the country of people that were bad for the revolution was it the best way who knows, but cuba was never overtrown.
el mazahua

[Moskitto]

whoever mentioned class backgrounds, may I point out that I am upper middle class (not that I believe that makes me better) and a communist and the late Duke of Medina Sidonia was a communist and from the nobility, so please don't say that upper and middle class people are bad or that all communists hate the upper and middle classes.

[Guest1]

Actually, it was the capitalist who started the post that metioned that, but I think he was implying that ONLY priviliged whit college kids come here. I'm not white, I'm not very priviliged and I'm in high school.