Communes under Capitalism

[Positivist]

The other day I was watching the show called doomsday preppers where the show follows doomsday theorists stocking up on resources and becoming independent of civilization. This gave me the idea that communes that say 5-15 families (numbers are totally hypothetical) could exist self sufficiently within the modern economy. This way we could begin to push the communist lifestyle prior to the revolution, and attract people to the movement. The communes could operate on democratic community planning where each member of the commune met some social need(s) and in return had his/her needs met by the other members of the community.

[The Guy]

The other day I was watching the show called doomsday preppers where the show follows doomsday theorists stocking up on resources and becoming independent of civilization. This gave me the idea that communes that say 5-15 families (numbers are totally hypothetical) could exist self sufficiently within the modern economy. This way we could begin to push the communist lifestyle prior to the revolution, and attract people to the movement. The communes could operate on democratic community planning where each member of the commune met some social need(s) and in return had his/her needs met by the other members of the community.

It's a great revolutionary idea, yes. There are several in America - oddly - mainly in Pennsylvania, where people have established communes running off the land and by human labour. It's a tough idea to come by as the hegemony of capitalism has blinded us from alternative ways of living. However, not all of the left regard communal living as the way forward. It is a step in the perfect direction, but for some it is a step too far. We can't all be the angels of the revolution but we can certainly try, eh?

Try searching through reports of the situation I mentioned in the States.

[Ocean Seal]

The other day I was watching the show called doomsday preppers where the show follows doomsday theorists stocking up on resources and becoming independent of civilization. This gave me the idea that communes that say 5-15 families (numbers are totally hypothetical) could exist self sufficiently within the modern economy. This way we could begin to push the communist lifestyle prior to the revolution, and attract people to the movement. The communes could operate on democratic community planning where each member of the commune met some social need(s) and in return had his/her needs met by the other members of the community.
They aren't a bad idea, even partial communes could be useful in preparing us for communism.

[Positivist]

Anyone who has knowledge on these experiments in America or on the forms that socialist organization took during the Spanish civil war please contribute! I'll be looking for precise methods employed in said movements as well as in the Ukrainian Free Territory and I invite everyone else to join me.

[ellipsis]

Communes "outside of capitalism" are a flawed idea, one of the old mods posted something here about why, I'll try to pull it up.

[ellipsis]

Found it: http://www.revleft.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1667816&postcount=17

[ellipsis]

I'll post more thoughts soon.

[Positivist]

The link held a lot of good points. I'll admit I hadn't considered some of the expenses that would follow the commune. I wasn't however suggesting that socialism could be established by communes existing under capitalism but rather that communes could serve as platforms for anti-capitalist activism and centers for education. Though I did also believe it was possible for cooperative resource sharing based on techniques most often employed by doomsday preppers. Since reading the link above I am skeptical of how effectively the last element of my idea could be implemented but perhaps it is possible to a small extent. This would boil down more to mutually beneficial organization of activists which appears to be a more practical option.

[ellipsis]

I don't agree with all of prairie fires points, but I liked her analysis and thought process.

[Positivist]

They aren't a bad idea, even partial communes could be useful in preparing us for communism.

I really want t know more aboard t partial communes? Just a random idea your throwing out there or do you know anything about these?

[Revolutionary_Marxist]

The other day I was watching the show called doomsday preppers where the show follows doomsday theorists stocking up on resources and becoming independent of civilization. This gave me the idea that communes that say 5-15 families (numbers are totally hypothetical) could exist self sufficiently within the modern economy. This way we could begin to push the communist lifestyle prior to the revolution, and attract people to the movement. The communes could operate on democratic community planning where each member of the commune met some social need(s) and in return had his/her needs met by the other members of the community.

That's a great idea actually, I can see that working. As for ideas, I believe for location wise something like this would have to occur in a secluded area with lot's of woods, but not far from civilization as supplies will be needed such as phrameceuticals, building materials, and food as well.

Someone mentioned prior to this post that there can't be communes inside a "Communist" nation, as far as my knowledge goes there is a "Maoist Style" Commune in South Western China. I don't know if you would count that since China is largely State Capitalist these days, but still.

[Positivist]

That's a great idea actually, I can see that working. As for ideas, I believe for location wise something like this would have to occur in a secluded area with lot's of woods, but not far from civilization as supplies will be needed such as phrameceuticals, building materials, and food as well.

Someone mentioned prior to this post that there can't be communes outside of Communism, as far as my knowledge goes there is a "Maoist Style" Commune in South Western China. I don't know if you would count that since China is largely State Capitalist these days, but still.

Yea but check out the link above too. It poses some problems in the realm of expenses. I now believe you'd need to be sitting on a substantial amount of money not only to buy the necessary materials (medical supplies mostly) but to meet property taxes. Any illegal activities couldn't work but if you have any ideas, shoot! Maybe we should look in how to doomsday preppers pay their property taxes. (Income dependent solutions should be avoided because then we have that tax too.)

[Positivist]

What qualifies an organization for religious tax exemption? Not calling communism a religion but it is an all encompassing perspective that prescribes certain behaviors. What else can religion be defined as?

[Revolutionary_Marxist]

What qualifies an organization for religious tax exemption? Not calling communism a religion but it is an all encompassing perspective that prescribes certain behaviors. What else can religion be defined as?

Well the religious organization has to be affiliated with a larger community, like say Christianity. So, a Church claiming to be Catholic, will recive religious tax exemption.

Communism, or any sort of leftist ideology, would not fit into that category and a theoretical commune would not recive Government assistance.

(Oh and I did check out the link, intresting ideas that could be useful)

[Positivist]

Well the religious organization has to be affiliated with a larger community, like say Christianity. So, a Church claiming to be Catholic, will recive religious tax exemption.

Communism, or any sort of leftist ideology, would not fit into that category and a theoretical commune would not recive Government assistance.

(Oh and I did check out the link, intresting ideas that could be useful)

Alright thanks. I'm going to look into non-profits too. I doubt it would work but a commune would certainly have a claim to being a non-profit with a reasonable audience. Unfortunately America is in low supply of reason.

[Bostana]

The other day I was watching the show called doomsday preppers....
You watch that show too?
:lol:

[Os Cangaceiros]

Communes are a great way to get high/get laid. Granted it's with other neo-hippies, but whattayagonnado.

Other than that there isn't much value in them.

[Positivist]

You watch that show too?
:lol:

My favorite was the guy who was prepping for when "the new president (Obama) takes a lot of freedoms away and makes an economic collapse"

[Bostana]

My favorite was the guy who was prepping for when "the new president (Obama) takes a lot of freedoms away and makes an economic collapse"

That was the first episode I saw
:lol:

[Hermes]

If you had enough organization in several large areas, then it could work as a sort of prolonged 'general strike', I guess. I mean, if you have communes established in every state with a large number of people in each (mostly from the lower class), then they can't really be working for the upper class, but they could still provide their own food.

[ellipsis]

In this line of thought, I am been considering what an occupy movement in a rural setting would look like, Occupy the Hills, folks interested in homesteading, etc. can squat land and abandoned cabins in rural vermont. i am not thinking about complete off the grid living, but have rural/wooded squats that function collectively, much like any urban counterpart although obviously adapted to local conditions.

[00001]

I guess it is a nice pipedream for some people, but the sort of communes you have in mind, i.e. people 'dropping out', have absolutely nothing to do with communism or working class self emancipation. There can be no islands of communism in a sea of capitalism.

[Zav]

The criticisms in the link really only apply if one's commune isn't a threat to the systems in power and is open about its operations, and they hint of the tired 'Socialism isn't possible in one country' thinking. Anyway if you want to set up a Communist commune and not contribute to the wellbeing of Capitalism, your options are:
1. Be somewhere far enough away from anyone else that no one cares. Montana, Nunavut, maybe northern Maine, maybe parts of Africa, Siberia, or Antarctica would be the best locations. (/little bit of humor)
2. Be invisible, especially literally and from the sky. Forests would do.
3. Have lots o' guns.
4. Declare independence.

Option 3 would give you a commune like Anarchist Catalonia if you had enough people. The problem is it would be like Anarchist Catalonia, and most likely be invaded by surrounding Capitalist countries because they will have bigger militaries. The problem with 1 is that everyone will know you're there, and you'll be highly suspect and subject to WACO-like encounters. The problem with 2 is food. Properly-designed permaculture gardens may be indistinguishable from surrounding woodland. My own are designed for output, not camouflage, and stand out quite a bit on Google maps. On a large scale, I suspect it could be done, but it would require a lot more land and necessitate a much smaller population than the other options. Perhaps five acres per person as opposed to one, and that assumes everyone is vegan. There simply isn't the space anywhere to hide a tribe of hunter-gatherers. Traditional animal farms move the commune from option 2 to 1, and make it obvious that something is afoot. Option 4 is serious Micronationalism. This is the boldest of the four as you will literally face the world head on and receive the social acceptance it has for the DPRK, if you're lucky. Because most Micronationalists are RPers and political enthusiasts, you won't be taken very seriously without a 1000+ population, major infrastructure, and a sizable militia.