Chemtrails! real threat or not? I want evidence

[R_P_A_S]

Ahhh! Where do I start? I've encounter these chemtrail advocates at various demonstrations. They set up their booths and have literature explaining or telling you how these things are bad for us. Some of the info reads very good and it makes sense. However some of the stuff sounds/like crazy far fetch conspiracy theories. I was actually surprised how short and straight forward the wikipedia article on the subject was. It just calls them "conspiracy theories".

So there are no controversial findings or possible truths out there?

This is straight up a conspiracy theory?

Why are people SO suspicious?

and Who wins here and who loses?

Do you guys have any good links on this stuff? thank you!

[Sinister Intents]

So there are no controversial findings or possible truths out there?
I don't think so, I've been to rense website when I was younger and I read that they put blood in the chemtrails and infectious diseases.


This is straight up a conspiracy theory?
I feel its a purely backward conspiracy theory imo.


Why are people SO suspicious?
People are so suspicious because you can see them all over the sky, also they tend to be in a grid pattern over settlements.


and Who wins here and who loses?
What do you mean?


Do you guys have any good links on this stuff? thank you!
You could go to yahoo answers or that shitty site rensedotcom

[Ele'ill]

One of the issues would be that when a conspiracy theorist tries to explain why chemtrails are bad it suddenly relates to another conspiracy theory instead of some basis in reality.

[Sasha]

Any conspiracy that would require the seamless cooperation between all major government and countless independent companys could never be kept a secret.

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

Dispersion of chemicals from the height of commercial aerotraffic would be extremely inefficient.

Sometimes these wackos will claim that condensation trails are a new phenomenon, but they are not. They just happen to be so much more noticeable now that flight traffic is so considerable.

[Revolution starts with U]

They will make the sky overcast though. Only some of them. Most just disappear. It's just those few that don't, then criss cross, 3 hrs later it looks like it's about to rain.

I tend not to get bothered by things I don't know about, and I'm not worried about this. But I have noticed what I mentioned above, so it makes me in a position to not be surprised if something is going on.

Never read any info on them. I mean, I like to read fringe whacko's as much as the next guy, but this one seemed boring.

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

They will make the sky overcast though. Only some of them. Most just disappear. It's just those few that don't, then criss cross, 3 hrs later it looks like it's about to rain.

I tend not to get bothered by things I don't know about, and I'm not worried about this. But I have noticed what I mentioned above, so it makes me in a position to not be surprised if something is going on.

Never read any info on them. I mean, I like to read fringe whacko's as much as the next guy, but this one seemed boring.

Those aren't chemtrails. They are condensation trials. Whether they appear or not depends on the atmospheric conditions.

Condensation trials are in areas of heavy commercial air traffic a concern however when it does come to the issue of the cloud coverage, as the volume is so immense that it does affect the climate and cloud accumulation (this is a problem over parts of Western Europe, particularly the Netherlands & Belgium, and around major air routes in the U.S. Some report spoke of temperature changes of up to 1-2 degrees for the affected areas and a significant increase in the persistence of cloud coverage.

[Revolution starts with U]

Ty. And now we can shuffle this conspiracy to file 13

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

Can someone link to some literature on this please? I was arguing with someone about these the other day, they were absolutely adament that chemtrails are real. I'd like to read some stuff on it if anyone has any good links. Cheers.

[Yazman]

Any conspiracy that would require the seamless cooperation between all major government and countless independent companys could never be kept a secret.

That's all well and good but there are very few if any conspiracy theories that are so broad in scope as to claim "all major government and countless independent companies" are involved, and certainly most chemtrail conspiracies are not of this type at all. Probably the NWO chemtrail conspiracy fits that type, however, but not all of them do as there isn't some sort of unified chemtrail conspiracy theory.

There are a few conspiracy theories involved here of course, and at varying degrees of truth. One of the more common ones seem to be that some sort of geoengineering is going on - as in, climate and weather altering operations - which there is actually some grain of truth to, as such operations really are practiced in many parts of the world. The conspiracy part comes in to this one where they start to claim that there are chemicals involved that are supposedly dangerous, carcinogenic, etc. This tends to be a more self-contained one and doesn't posit some sort of vast conspiracy at all. Whether there is any truth to it or not I can't say as I just don't know enough about a lot of the geoengineering programs.

I've seen other types of chemtrail conspiracies, one of the other more common ones is part of the NWO conspiracy realm, where it is often claimed that there are diseases or fertility-reducing agents in the chemtrails due to the population reduction agenda that proponents of this type of theory often state as central to their hypothesis. While there is a lot of talk about population reduction thrown around in some quarters as we all know, I don't think there's any evidence that any organised effort has really occurred to bring it about outside population control measures like restrictions on child birth as in China. So I think this type of chemtrail theory bears little if any evidence, not to mention the NWO aspect of it which I don't agree with.

As far as chemtrails go, they do actually exist in the sense of chemical aerosols being deployed via air, although they aren't very common and what most people think is a chemtrail is usually just a strange looking cloud or a contrail. But there are actual aerosol deliveries of chemicals into the atmosphere sometimes, usually for crop dusting, but also with military experiments & testing (usually in their testing ranges, but not always) and geoengineering (climate control, etc)

Official responses from what I know tend to just say they are contrails, which is often the case but as with official responses to many issues, it isn't really the complete truth as there actually have been various military programs over the years that involve spraying of various chemicals, sometimes over US territory, and sometimes even involving human experimentation, some of this led to the chemical spraying in Vietnam for example.

My personal thoughts on the matter are that probably most of the sightings in the US are contrails. Some of them, especially from the 50s and 60s, were probably stuff like operation LAC or SHAD. Some of the more modern chemtrail sightings, such as in China, are probably just geoengineering ops to clear up smog or bring rain, we also know there's been proposals to spray shit in the atmosphere to cool the climate, although as far as I know that hasn't really been acted on. You never know though. So I think the majority of it is contrails, with probably some of it, mainly during the Cold War, being potential sightings of military operations that are public knowledge nowadays. I don't believe that disease is being spread though and as far as dangerous or carcinogenic stuff in the geoengineering aerosols or military ops, I don't really know.

On another note it's good to see some people being serious with their critique and analysis here, good job to those actually discussing instead of just being like "lol conspiracy!" Debunking fraud and challenging ignorance needs to be central to what we do as revolutionary leftists, we shouldn't be encouraging ignorance by having an ignorant attitude ourselves. Even when it comes to conspiracy theories.

[R_P_A_S]

Can someone link to some literature on this please? I was arguing with someone about these the other day, they were absolutely adament that chemtrails are real. I'd like to read some stuff on it if anyone has any good links. Cheers.

yes! links please!

[Psy]

They will make the sky overcast though. Only some of them. Most just disappear. It's just those few that don't, then criss cross, 3 hrs later it looks like it's about to rain.

I tend not to get bothered by things I don't know about, and I'm not worried about this. But I have noticed what I mentioned above, so it makes me in a position to not be surprised if something is going on.

Never read any info on them. I mean, I like to read fringe whacko's as much as the next guy, but this one seemed boring.

The only chemical trails aircrafts create is that of unburnt fuel for those with untuned engines or when the pilot is pushing engines above 100% power and the engines are being flooded with fuel. Yet these trails are not white but dark (white trails are water vapour).

I.E below is B-52s flooding their engines with jet fuel leaving trails of unburnt fuel just so they can a wee bit more thrust at the cost having crap fuel economy.

http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3e768c61f500.jpg

[Regicollis]

You should be much more worried about the insane amount of greenhouse gasses the planes emit...

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Chemtrails conspiracy theorists seem to forget that the people running the conspiracy breathe the same air as the rest of us. It's not as if when you dump toxic chemicals high up in the sky, they're going to just neatly fall down into only the poor areas/undesirables/whatever. They're going to be blown every which way.

[Spirit]

Chemtrails conspiracy theorists seem to forget that the people running the conspiracy breathe the same air as the rest of us. It's not as if when you dump toxic chemicals high up in the sky, they're going to just neatly fall down into only the poor areas/undesirables/whatever. They're going to be blown every which way.


that's the very same thing I mentioned to a few chemtrails lunatics...they were a bit confused after that :laugh:

[Workers-Control-Over-Prod]

It is true that governments have taken measures in the name of science over the last decades towards researching and experimenting with methods of how to control our atmosphere. In the 1950's the German government released an interview with a atmosphere scientist (I don not know the specific english term) who explained that roughly what their goal was, is to use aircrafts to spread various elements into the atmosphere and record their effects on the atmospheric temperature and natural conditions. In 2008, in light of increasing temperatures due to global warming, the german Federal Bureau of agriculture reported coordinated actions with jet fuel companies and aviation organizations towards releasing copper minerals and other solid elements into the atmosphere through contrails. The idea that it could be done to exert enough small particles to reflect intruding sunlight has been a long standing one, and has only in the last decade really been initiated. I don't doubt that certain released elements could be harmful to humans, but i don't really care, the point is to lower atmospheric temperatures and to gain more knowledge through practical experience on atmospheric engineering, which will definitely be needed in future socialist globe if capitalism isn't overthrown immediately.

[Spirit]

atmosphere scientist (I don not know the specific english term)

meteorologist

[Permanent Revolutionary]

The thing is, if Kent Hovind advocates something, it's most likely not true.

x_8o89Cj-Vc

[maskerade]

can someone explain what chemtrails are? is the conspiracy that airplanes are purposely dropping poisonous gases/chemicals?

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

can someone explain what chemtrails are? is the conspiracy that airplanes are purposely dropping poisonous gases/chemicals?

Got it in one.

[maskerade]

Got it in one.

and for what (alleged) purpose? something nefarious, no doubt