The Singularity

[sithsaber]

If one day a higher than human artificial intelligence were to arise and attempt to seize control of the planet, would you accept it if it pushed for a "logical" system of economics and government that resembled socialism?

8636

[Brosa Luxemburg]

Wow, talk about a highly hypothetical question!:laugh:
I don't know, maybe if they weren't authoritarian about it and didn't execute anyone who disagreed with them

[sithsaber]

Wow, talk about a highly hypothetical question!:laugh:
I don't know, maybe if they weren't authoritarian about it and didn't execute anyone who disagreed with them

I doubt a highly advanced AI is going to understand making allowances for humanities lack of logical thinking. Imagine a highly efficient being with a major case of assbergers

[dodger]

As long as they did not insert tubes into my anus and make me learn by heart whole pages of Gerry Healy's diaries. I might acquiesce .....

[hatzel]

Sorry for the one word post, but...

...what?

[Blake's Baby]

Can we move this to Chit Chat? Or Stoner Talk maybe?

But in terms of the original question... if it was a more-than-human-intelligence AI, why the fuck would it care about 'economy'?

'Oooh, I'm a super-clever AI, I'll make the fleshproles work for me, so I can pay them wages so they can pay me taxes so I can buy some gold peripherals off them that I had them make anyway... and if they don't I'll electrocute them... all to flatter my non-existant vanity... '

Right: we're humans, and we can work out that the notion is ridiculous, why wouldn't a machine that's cleverer than us? If it was cleverer than us, it would know that having a society run by said machine would be a terrible idea, and would shut itself down/refuse to run things... and if it was a 'bad' machine it wouldn't be a 'socialist' anyway.

[Искра]

It's more likely that we will all die in 3rd World (Nuclear) War.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

If one day a higher than human artificial intelligence were to arise and attempt to seize control of the planet, would you accept it if it pushed for a "logical" system of economics and government that resembled socialism?

That depends - is the AI in question attempting to impose "socialism from above", or is ve collaborating with human revolutionaries? In other words, is it truly friendly? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friendly_artificial_intelligence)

My sig has a link to the first in a three-part series of YouTube videos that is entirely relevant to this discussion - the first part should be HERE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkB1e-JCgmY).

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

Can we move this to Chit Chat? Or Stoner Talk maybe?

But in terms of the original question... if it was a more-than-human-intelligence AI, why the fuck would it care about 'economy'?

Because an AI would need to use the same economy the rest of us do, at least at first.


'Oooh, I'm a super-clever AI, I'll make the fleshproles work for me, so I can pay them wages so they can pay me taxes so I can buy some gold peripherals off them that I had them make anyway... and if they don't I'll electrocute them... all to flatter my non-existant vanity... '

Right: we're humans, and we can work out that the notion is ridiculous, why wouldn't a machine that's cleverer than us? If it was cleverer than us, it would know that having a society run by said machine would be a terrible idea, and would shut itself down/refuse to run things... and if it was a 'bad' machine it wouldn't be a 'socialist' anyway.

It really depends on what the "supergoals" of the hypothetical AI in the OP are. Obviously one of them is establishing a form of socialism in some manner, but why is the AI doing that? Only the OP knows.

[Ostrinski]

To answer your question, yes.

[sithsaber]

Can we move this to Chit Chat? Or Stoner Talk maybe?


We have a stoner talk forum? (I still don't understand the forum specifications on this site


Wow, talk about a highly hypothetical question!:laugh:


We need more of these. Overpopulation, major technological advancements, rising sea levels, climate change, peak oil, evolutions of the state's monopoly on violence, post-post-post modern schools of thought, lies and revelations, conflicts and rumors of conflicts and the four fucking horsemen of the apocalypse all will change our lives into something unimaginable by Marx and his contemporaries. New ideas must be formed soon. We need to move on form 19th century arguments. Evolve or die

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

We need more of these. Overpopulation, major technological advancements, rising sea levels, climate change, peak oil, evolutions of the state's monopoly on violence, post-post-post modern schools of thought, lies and revelations, conflicts and rumors of conflicts and the four fucking horsemen of the apocalypse all will change our lives into something unimaginable by Marx and his contemporaries. New ideas must be formed soon.

We need to move on form 19th century arguments. Evolve or die [/SIZE]

Marx's arguments are as relevant today as they ever have been. We still have capitalism and class society.

[sithsaber]

Marx's arguments are as relevant today as they ever have been. We still have capitalism and class society.

They are relevant but not all there is. He was not omnipotent. There are things he knew nothing of and beliefs that have become obsolete. Psychology shouldn't end with Freud and isms shouldn't end with Che and Chomsky

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

They are relevant but not all there is. He was not omnipotent. There are things he knew nothing of and beliefs that have become obsolete. Psychology shouldn't end with Freud and isms shouldn't end with Che and Chomsky

Absolutely, but that doesn't mean Marxist reasoning no longer applies just because Marx is no longer around to personally scrutinise whatever new thing comes along.

In fact, Marx did have something to say about one thing you mentioned, namely "overpopulation". You may have heard of a man called Thomas Malthus, a contemporary of Marx. I believe Marx once referred to Malthus as "the miserable parson", which I think tells you enough to know what Marx thought.

Indeed, even today the spectre of "overpopulation" is a chimera, and a vicious one at that. It places the burden of guilt on people, for the crime of being born, when in fact the full weight of culpability rests on the shoulders of the capitalist price system, for failing all those people.

[sithsaber]

Absolutely, but that doesn't mean Marxist reasoning no longer applies just because Marx is no longer around to personally scrutinise whatever new thing comes along.

In fact, Marx did have something to say about one thing you mentioned, namely "overpopulation". You may have heard of a man called Thomas Malthus, a contemporary of Marx. I believe Marx once referred to Malthus as "the miserable parson", which I think tells you enough to know what Marx thought.

Indeed, even today the spectre of "overpopulation" is a chimera, and a vicious one at that. It places the burden of guilt on people, for the crime of being born, when in fact the full weight of culpability rests on the shoulders of the capitalist price system, for failing all those people.

I am aware of Malthus and the issues concerning overpopulation. Maybe i should edit it to environmental and resource unsustainability

[sithsaber]

Due to the death of the PAFL bump

[Franz Fanonipants]

non-materialist scientism drivel just as bad as creationism and millennial religions[1]

[1] of which i am a member

[sithsaber]

If you weren't a rich white male landowner you would be a shoo in for the PAFL (JK you're in)

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

Imagine a highly efficient being with a major case of assbergers

Idiot been watching too much South Park?

[Franz Fanonipants]

If you weren't a rich white male landowner you would be a shoo in for the PAFL (JK you're in)

did u read the bcbm thread about how singularity isn't going to happen cus kurzweil's predictions were wrong

and then kurzweil being like 'nuh-uh the future is still awesome i am furiously dreaming of a life lived in digital!'

[sithsaber]

Idiot been watching too much South Park?

No, idiot been thinking. Think about it, don't people with assbergers have issues empathizing with others and aren't alot of them highly intelligent. Think about how a super AI would view us mortals (probably at best as inferiors, at worst insects)

ps
This does not take into account the creation of a "friendly AI". If they arrise, they will be the fist i turn to for the revolution.

[Franz Fanonipants]

asperger's, dummy

[sithsaber]

did u read the bcbm thread about how singularity isn't going to happen cus kurzweil's predictions were wrong

and then kurzweil being like 'nuh-uh the future is still awesome i am furiously dreaming of a life lived in digital!'

link please.

I'm not saying singularity is gospel. I'm just saying technological advances could lead to some interesting potential futures

Purely hypothetical

[ColonelCossack]

We don't know what technology will be like after a technological singularity that's why it's a singularity.

However, if the singularity happens when capitalism's still here, it'll probably be used to the bourgeoisie's advantage. But as I said we don't know what'll happen.

[sithsaber]

asperger's, dummy

sonofa***** i've been saying assbergers since i heard of the condition. And yes, i saw the southpark episode, but no i didn't get that they were joking with the name until now.:blushing:

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

No, idiot been thinking. Think about it, don't people with assbergers have issues empathizing with others and aren't alot of them highly intelligent. Think about how a super AI would view us mortals (probably at best as inferiors, at worst insects)

Aside from your offensive misspelling, those are, generally speaking, myths, inaccurate stereotypes, misinterpretations and exaggerations.

[sithsaber]

Aside from your offensive misspelling, those are, generally speaking, myths, inaccurate stereotypes, misinterpretations and exaggerations.

Sorry about the spelling, i've been saying it like that for over a year.

[Prometeo liberado]

So long as they weren't carrying around a book titled "How to serve Man", I'd be fine with it.

[Franz Fanonipants]

its on forbes

anyways no i don't think machines will ever be sentient in a meaningful way

e: i fuck w/siri whenever i can

[sithsaber]

e: i fuck w/siri whenever i can
Oh thats smart piss off the machines mother

[MotherCossack]

i am very confused medearys......
what on earth are you all talking about?
wouldn't it be easier to initiate some change ourselves?
or are we all grown that inert?

its a sad day when we have to resort to super-beings with a caring disposition to rescue us from our own poor management and barbaric systems while we sit around complying, aquiescing like the irratating, inferior species that we would seem to be.
a race such as you describe would probably choose to eradicate us and save the multitude of different animals, plants, fishes and the planet generally, all of whom face an uncertain future on our watch.
and to be honest .... it would be, objectively speaking, a reasonable course of action.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

If one day a higher than human artificial intelligence were to arise and attempt to seize control of the planet, would you accept it if it pushed for a "logical" system of economics and government that resembled socialism?
No. A vanguard AI is no more helpful than a vanguard party, and may, in fact, be more dangerous.

[MotherCossack]

having said that... if such as you say showed up and offered something better...
hell, yeah... if it 'd be an improvement....
after all we dont want to appear intergalactically species-ist, or prejudiced against other species do we.!