Not About Race?

[¿Que?]

Recently, at the Million Hoodie March, a march in memory of Trayvon Martin, Sybrina Fulton, Trayvon's mother, was quoted as saying,

"Our son was not committing any crime. Our son is your son. I want you guys to stand up for justice and stand up for what’s right. This is not about a black-and-white thing. This is about a right-and-wrong thing. Justice for Trayvon."Of course, I can see the appeal of this kind of rhetoric. It more or less puts white people at ease. It suggests that these are not problems that blacks face, but that something like this could have happened to anyone, white, black, hispanic or whatever. I'd like to point out that such appeasement of white guilt is unnecessary and in fact dangerous to fighting racism and injustice.

Now, the reason I brought this up is because I was perusing some facebook events for Trayvon, and stumbled across another person saying the same thing.

Trayvon Rally is not about Black,white,or any Race.To me it is about OUR CHILDREN ,taken to soon by Violence.We want to Stop these HATE CRIMESAgain, we see the same rhetoric. I should point out that the person quoted was a person of color as well.
Another person on facebook was quoted as saying
NOT TO SOUND RACIST BUT BLACK POWER AND JUSTICE FOR TRAY VON!This is post-racial America. Where phrases like Black power are considered racist even among blacks. Where what is absolutely a matter of race, is whitewashed by african americans themselves, so as to not upset the sensibilities of whites, who might otherwise not support a cause if the environment gets too threatening to their privilege.

It's obvious we don't live in a post-racial America. What we do have is an America so frightened to talk about racial injustice, that even African Americans must tone down their rhetoric lest they be accused of racism themselves. This cannot stand. This must change.

Trayvon's murder was most certainly about race, and until we understand that racial justice does not equal racism, we cannot move forward and demand racial equality. Every action in support and demanding justice for Trayvon must explicitly declare it's racial implicaitons, that blacks have it much worse than whites in the US. That economic, environmental, health and other injustices affect blacks at much more deeply than they do others, and this is due to a system that perpetuates racism against them. Let's not muddy the waters by pretending that this wasn't about race. Our actions in response should reflect that fact.

Any thoughts?

EDIT: I hope this isn't construed as denigration of Trayvon's mother or other people of color. I just think that we need to consider what is happening to black liberation in the US, and how perhaps, post-Obama America is not only not post-racial America, but perhaps, a much more difficult terrain for blacks to take a stand against their white oppressors.

[NewLeft]

You read the 'White Savior Industry Complex' right? Here's a good quote:

But there's a place in the political sphere for direct speech and, in the past few years in the U.S., there has been a chilling effect on a certain kind of direct speech pertaining to rights. The president is wary of being seen as the "angry black man." People of color, women, and gays -- who now have greater access to the centers of influence that ever before -- are under pressure to be well-behaved when talking about their struggles. There is an expectation that we can talk about sins but no one must be identified as a sinner: newspapers love to describe words or deeds as "racially charged" even in those cases when it would be more honest to say "racist"; we agree that there is rampant misogyny, but misogynists are nowhere to be found; homophobia is a problem but no one is homophobic. One cumulative effect of this policed language is that when someone dares to point out something as obvious as white privilege, it is seen as unduly provocative. Marginalized voices in America have fewer and fewer avenues to speak plainly about what they suffer; the effect of this enforced civility is that those voices are falsified or blocked entirely from the discourse.
There is a very low tolerance for colored people. The idea of them bringing up race will always seem like they're just being disrespectful to us whites who do so much to tolerate them. No one can be racist, we're colorblind, but America is racist.

[¿Que?]

You read the 'White Savior Industry Complex' right? Here's a good quote:
There is a very low tolerance for colored people. The idea of them bringing up race will always seem like they're just being disrespectful to us whites who do so much to tolerate them. No one can be racist, we're colorblind, but America is racist.
Yes, that quote is exactly along the lines of what I'm thinking. OTOH, as a non-black, I guess this thread might come across as a little patronizing...

[Per Levy]

It more or less puts white people at ease, making them think that the problems, the heartache, the devastation of losing a child is universal. Aside from the simple fact that it isn't

i probally just read it wrong but are you saying that if a white family is losing a child its not as bad for them as when a black family is losing a child?

[¿Que?]

i probally just read it wrong but are you saying that if a white family is losing a child its not as bad for them as when a black family is losing a child?
No, I'm saying that that anguish is not universal. Some people, be they white, or black, or whatever, don't give a fuck about their kids. Some parents even murder their children. It happens.

[Per Levy]

No, I'm saying that that anguish is not universal. Some people, be they white, or black, or whatever, don't give a fuck about their kids. Some parents even murder their children. It happens.

true that, it just sounded weird to me first time i've read it.

[l'Enfermé]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/qf3fjKP7FyTMJyrfQUMfKQ--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/thelookout/George-Zimmerman.jpg

It wasn't a hate-crime.

[NewLeft]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:

It wasn't a hate-crime.
As if that mattered.

[¿Que?]

The guy was taped calling Trayvon a "fucking coon." Plus this isn't just about the crime. It's about the fact that the murderer walks free. Borz, I hope you're being sarcastic...

[Per Levy]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:

It wasn't a hate-crime.

an article i've read on the matter actually said that the murderer yelled something racist to the teen while on the phone with the cops. so if i take that then yes it was racist thing. not to mention if the guy would have followed and shot the kid if he was white, wich is doubtful.

[l'Enfermé]

The guy was taped calling Trayvon a "fucking coon." Plus this isn't just about the crime. It's about the fact that the murderer walks free. Borz, I hope you're being sarcastic...
I wasn't aware of that. Maybe I need to read more on this, it seems I'm betraying my ignorance.

[Per Levy]

its a rather good video on the matter:

GWwQqIRuTWU

[antiracist]

Of course it was about race.
Do you really think that the poor kid would have been killed like that if he was white?

[¿Que?]

its a rather good video on the matter:

...
"Fuck the police. Fuck the entire justice system if they can't arrest this guy." Is it that they can't or won't?

[Franz Fanonipants]

I wasn't aware of that. Maybe I need to read more on this, it seems I'm betraying my ignorance.
lol

also, in the united states race complex blacks can deploy racism against mexicans, latinos can deploy racism against blacks, and asians can deploy racism against both while getting racism deployed against them by both at the same time

the key is that as much as we may dislike or give static to whites, nine times out of ten most people of color aren't going to do it because institutional racism is so strong that there's not a lot you can do to white people

anyways back on topic yeah its a way to make sure that white people can feel comfortable w/being outraged over this shit

black rage is a terrifying thing to a lot of white folks

[¿Que?]

lol

also, in the united states race complex blacks can deploy racism against mexicans, latinos can deploy racism against blacks, and asians can deploy racism against both

the key is that as much as we may dislike or give static to whites, nine times out of ten most people of color aren't going to do it because institutional racism is so strong that there's not a lot you can do to white people
Not to mention bougies that denigrate their lower class brethren. My particular breed of Latino is quite notorious for that...

[Franz Fanonipants]

Not to mention bougies that denigrate their lower class brethren. My particular breed of Latino is quite notorious for that...

yeah that too

[NewLeft]

its a rather good video on the matter:
That phone call was difficult to watch..

[gorillafuck]

I find the idea of a bunch of radicals talking about how the mother of a teenager slain for his race is just trying to appeal to white people really stupid.

[Zav]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:



It wasn't a hate-crime.
Whether it was a hate crime or not I don't know, but does the color of his skin somehow exclude him from the possibility of being racist?

[Drosophila]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:



It wasn't a hate-crime.

A lot of Hispanic-Black gang violence in L.A. and elsewhere is race-based.

[Danielle Ni Dhighe]

The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name).
As I pointed out in another thread, Zimmerman is a surname common to non-Jewish Germans and Ashkenazi Jews alike. It's not specifically Jewish.

Also, being Hispanic or Jewish doesn't preclude one from being considered white, nor does it preclude one from being a racist against black people.

[Os Cangaceiros]

I don't know, the social category of "white" is really pretty narrow...

[¿Que?]

I find the idea of a bunch of radicals talking about how the mother of a teenager slain for his race is just trying to appeal to white people really stupid.
I know it may seem a little cold to criticize, but I was trying to see what people thought about this. I put a disclaimer at the end, specifically for people like you who, in their good natured self righteousness, can't seem to understand that criticism can be just as much a form of solidarity than pretending everything is kosher. It's like when Zionists accuse you of being anti-semitic because of the holocaust. What are you supposed to say to that?

EDIT: You got the pathos down, now go for some logos.

EDIT2: Idk, I definitely do see your point, and seriously considered not posting it. I just wanted to get some feedback, and see what others thought about this. It was sort of bugging me, because it kept coming up.

[Martin Blank]

It wasn't about race. The shooter isn't 't even white, he's half Hispanic, half Semitic("Zimmerman" is a Central European(Ashkenzi) Jewish name). This is how he looks like:

http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/qf3fjKP7FyTMJyrfQUMfKQ--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYzMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/en/blogs/thelookout/George-Zimmerman.jpg

It wasn't a hate-crime.

Zimmerman called Trayvon a "fucking coon" during the 911 call. Don't tell me this wasn't a hate crime.

[¿Que?]

I'm sorry for this thread, Zeekloid's right. It was insensitive for me to criticize the mother of a dead teenager. Please trash this abomination and remove all your thanks. thanks.

[Martin Blank]

I'm sorry for this thread, Zeekloid's right. It was insensitive for me to criticize the mother of a dead teenager. Please trash this abomination and remove all your thanks. thanks.

I'm not going to trash this thread ... yet. And I ask all other mods and admins to hold on doing so as well.

There are two things to keep in mind about the statement Trayvon's mother made at the march in NYC: 1) she made the statement before Zimmerman's racist comment was discovered in the 911 call, and 2) there is some misunderstanding about what she meant, IMO.

To say that "this is not a black-and-white thing, this is a right-and-wrong thing", is not to say that she is necessarily dismissing the idea that racism was involved. From my experience, it's meant to say that everyone, both Black and white, should demand justice for Trayvon -- that everyone should be outraged that such a racist murder happened, that for something like this to happen in this day and age is simply wrong, that this is not just something that African Americans should be upset about. I agree with that sentiment completely.

Now, perhaps I can be accused of reading into it my own perspective. That might be a fair criticism if it wasn't for the fact that similar statements have been made by the families of victims of racist attacks, whether by the cops, by fascists, etc., for decades.

And, again, let's not forget that she made those comments before Zimmerman's racist epithet was found in the audio recordings.