Russia: CPRF-Left Front agree on Zyuganov

[FSL]

Russia’s Communists join forces with radicals ahead of polls

Russia’s Communist Party entered into a pact on Tuesday with the radical Left Front movement in a striking show of unity between two generations of opposition forces in the run-up to March’s presidential polls.
“This is a historic and important moment,” Left Front leader Sergei Udaltsov said as he signed an agreement that will see his movement support veteran Communist Party head Gennady Zyuganov’s bid to prevent Prime Minister Vladimir Putin securing a third stint in the Kremlin.
In return, Zyuganov pledged to implement the demands drawn up by the organizers of recent mass protests against alleged electoral fraud at last December’s parliamentary polls if he become president.
These demands include a rerun of the polls before the end of the year, the dismissal of the unpopular election chief, Vladimir Churov, and “fundamental” changes in electoral law.
The rest of the article including some of the paper's "spiteful" comments here: http://en.ria.ru/russia/20120117/170806801.html


The RWCP-RPC doesn't support this move apparently (page is in russian): http://rkrp-rpk.ru/content/view/6595/1/

[Susurrus]

pfeh. Putin with another name and crown.

[Ostrinski]

An interesting development, nonetheless. They still wouldn't be nearly as geopolitically relevant as the Soviet Union in the twentieth century.

[FSL]

pfeh. Putin with another name and crown.

How so?




An interesting development, nonetheless. They still wouldn't be nearly as geopolitically relevant as the Soviet Union in the twentieth century.
Assuming they win? It's just the presidential elections in a bourgeois state and though there might be plans to "democratize it" there are no plans to overthrow it. Until now at least.

Geopolitically it would be like Chavez on steroids. CPRF proposes a federation with Belarus and the government there also wants that (their industry is too dependent on russian oil dating back from the soviet era and this hurts their economy).

It'd also be nice for propaganda purposes. If I had a nickle for everytime I hear someone "wondering" who'd sell oil to Greece if Greece was a "communist state". It would also show capitalism's failure to offer an alternative for the people there. Many people in the former-socialist countries are unhappy but as long as they're apathetic at the same time, that amounts to very little.


Beyond that, it wouldn't be a revolution but it would make things more interesting.

[Susurrus]

How so?


Couple good threads on the reactionary tendencies of the KPRF:

http://www.revleft.com/vb/fascist-influence-cprfi-t166200/index.html

http://www.revleft.com/vb/russian-candidates-t165450/index.html

[FSL]

They would be good if they were able to substantiate their accusations.

[Die Neue Zeit]

Geopolitically it would be like Chavez on steroids. CPRF proposes a federation with Belarus and the government there also wants that (their industry is too dependent on russian oil dating back from the soviet era and this hurts their economy).

It'd also be nice for propaganda purposes. If I had a nickle for everytime I hear someone "wondering" who'd sell oil to Greece if Greece was a "communist state". It would also show capitalism's failure to offer an alternative for the people there. Many people in the former-socialist countries are unhappy but as long as they're apathetic at the same time, that amounts to very little.

It might strengthen reaction in much of Eastern Europe, but on the other hand it might politicize nostalgia and youth opposition in places like Bulgaria.

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Google translate-http://kprf.ru/dep/66412.html

Can someone who knows Russian double check the google translate? They are so conservative that they are unwilling to even criticize Stalin's most obvious mistakes (ie banning of homosexual activity) ...


What dream "bears"? Goluboznamennye faction "United Russia" and LDPR in the Duma refused to fight with the promotion of homosexuality

2009-05-08 18:50
Press office of the Communist Party faction - kprf.ru
May 8 The State Duma considered the first reading of a draft federal law "On amendments to the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation, criminalizing promotion of homosexuality." He was rejected by a strange position taken by the deputies of the "United Russia" and the Liberal Democratic Party.
By the way, no action sverhsurovyh bill did not provide. Only offered to supplement the Criminal Code Article 242.1: "Promoting homosexuality contained in a public speech, publicly performed work, or the media, including as expressed in public displays of homosexual lifestyle and homosexual orientation is punished by deprivation of the right to occupy certain positions or engage in certain activities period of two to five years. "
However, even this innovation has displeased the profile of the Duma Committee on Civil, Criminal, Arbitration and Procedural Legislation. This is not fail to inform the First Deputy Chairman of the "United Russia", VS Gruzdev. What specifically do not like the proposed bill, it is true, could not be explained, referring only to formal reasons. This position has caused bewilderment among the Communist deputies NA Ostanina and NV Kolomeitsev, in their speeches supported the proposed changes to the Criminal Code.
N. Ostanina (Communist faction).
- Dear colleagues, I would like to express rebuke of the committee that presented here Vladimir Gruzdev ("United Russia").
From my point of view, the committee took the bill to the surface only for the reason that the object of this law was interpreted Vladimir Sergeyevich very arbitrary. Because the bill we are talking about is not responsible for the fact of gay, not for the fact of homosexuality, and for the promotion of homosexuality. In this sense, the author of the law proposal is very short. The aim is to reduce the penalty for a ban on employment of certain posts, including leadership positions, people who are engaged in propaganda of homosexuality.
I think the problem is so ripe, that the access it had not today, not yesterday, but much earlier.
References Committee that this issue is governed by the law "On mass media" are untenable for the reason that the law regulates only the prohibition on propaganda, propaganda limitation porn, violence, cruelty, but does not regulate the promotion of homosexuality.
Therefore, from our point of view, it is necessary to support this bill, and I would place Gruzdeva Vladimir Sergeyevich, like this, through his lip, as they say, did not apply to anxiety and doubts of his colleagues, who made today in the form of questions.
If you want to really get the legal perfection, then it would be more responsible as a representative of the committee that deals with these issues professionally and not plead ignorance of the facts or events that are now occurring in our society. In fact, a very great public interest aroused now appeal as gay on the parade in Moscow. Acted against the public and against the leadership and acted as Moscow's mayor's office in Moscow, were against religious organizations. And I think that members of the legislature, including your committee, not just good to be educated in this area, but also to have their views, their opinions.
We will vote for this bill because it would impose punishment for the mere fact gay, and for the promotion of homosexuality.
NV Kolomeitsev (Communist faction).
- Dear colleagues! In fact, I think we have seen some bad practice in the recommendations of the committees to enact laws. We have a maximum of committee, which makes - states the problem and offer to someone to solve it. I think we are not appointed to this committee chairpersons and their deputies, that they stated and advised.
The second point. Inadequate response to negative legislative processes in the society just shows that we live as if in a parallel universe and actually do not react quickly to urgent and overripe have questions. I think all of you would agree that if eight thousand tons of drugs are flooded into our territory, and we restrict ourselves to a ringing statement that at least the sublime nonsense.
If we include TV, you will see on all the music channels on «Ren-TV», that any transfer of humor is not without order there a few vulgar jokes were not just on the part of the propaganda, I stress, of propaganda is this vice. Television shapes the subconscious. The vast majority of those present at the school probably had no idea what the blue, and that is not blue.
Today we have the disastrous results of sociological research. That was only yesterday I reported one such study conducted in 55 schools. Deadly, every third student at least once tried the drug. The vast majority of students with criminal street lingo more familiar than with Russian literature. Therefore, I believe this superficial attitude of the committees to have the proposed legislation is unacceptable.
I am convinced that we are with you, in fact, be more likely to look in the mirror and ask yourself: what do we want to leave future generations? Scorched earth and twisted mind, or something else?
I am convinced that psevdoravnenie in Europe or in all its worst vices is not that what he wants most of our voters. I am convinced that the preservation of our moral values ​​of all time is the main driving force, which would allow us to emerge from the crisis. Immoral because society is not capable of revival. Immoral society is able to die. I therefore propose to support the bill.
* * *
Communist faction in full composition has voted for the law. Supported it and 32 of the 38 "spravedlivorossov." However goluboznamennye "United Russia" and the Liberal Democratic Party did not heed the arguments of the Communists. What they had for this reason - is unknown, but the vast majority of the "Bears" and all "zhirinovtsy" hid behind the line protocol "did not vote." Of all the "United Russia" only member of SS Govorukhin supported the bill. In the "bear" faction found a real man.




http://gaycitynews.com/articles/2011/12/07/gay_city_news/news/doc4edf9159d9b40904125965.txt


“For example, the KPRF –– a very homophobic party, which advocates re-introduction of Soviet-era criminal penalties for homosexuality [repealed in 1993] uses in its campaign the slogan ‘better to be red then blue.’ The double meaning of this phrase is that blue is the party color of United Russia, and at the same time the word blue (in Russian, goluboi) means also a slang word for gay men. So, this is not a surprise that United Russia has used homophobia in this campaign. It was predictable.”
http://www.seeingred.com/Copy/4.1_russian.html


The relation of the RKRP to the country's largest "left" party, the Communist Party of the Russian Federation (KPRF) needs to be examined. Millions of workers have been taken in by the rhetoric of KPRF leader Zyuganov, who like the RKRP, fumes against the oligarchy and promises to fight for justice for working people. However, millions of workers have also shown (even allowing for the corrupt election counting techniques of Putin), that they do not support the KPRF, at least not strongly enough to want to vote for them. And with good reason. The KPRF has demonstrated its commitment to the market, approving every government budget and even entering the government itself during the terms of premiers Kirienko and Primakov, (under the latter the draconian plans for a new Labour Code were first drawn up). Further, many people have experienced the true nature of the KPRF at the local and regional levels, where for example KPRF governors have sent in armed riot police to physically crush workers struggles, as in Yasnogorsk and the Kusbass.From what I can tell, the KPRF is essentially a party of conservative, nationalist social democrats. And the desire to ally with the equally homophobic and authoritarian dictator of Belarus does not sound particularly appealing either. You compare them positively to Hugo Chavez, which makes no sense because at least Chavez is a fairly left-wing social democrat ...

[Crux]

CPRF proposes a federation with Belarus and the government there also wants that (their industry is too dependent on russian oil dating back from the soviet era and this hurts their economy).

And Kazhakstan. They are tools. Boycott the presidential elections. Sad to see the Left Front succumb to supporting the KPRF but then again it was not unexpected, sadly.

[Omsk]

And Kazhakstan


So they are for the Eurasian union?

[ВАЛТЕР]

Part of me likes this news as this means the left is becoming more relevant. However, I still feel that communists can't take power through bourgeois elections and call themselves communists. Communists take power through the barrel of a gun.

[Stalin Ate My Homework]

Part of me likes this news as this means the left is becoming more relevant. However, I still feel that communists can't take power through bourgeois elections and call themselves communists. Communists take power through the barrel of a gun.

I share your sentiment comrade but you make it sound as if we should use guns as a matter of principle rather than necessity.

[ВАЛТЕР]

I share your sentiment comrade but you make it sound as if we should use guns as a matter of principle rather than necessity.

Well of course we don't use guns out of principle. However, I do not see the left succeeding unless they crash the system by overwhelming force. Basically, I don't see the bourgeoisie giving up the keys to the factories and fields without a fight.


I always imagined it going something like this: Hi, I'm a communist...and I'm here to fuck shit up. *proceeds shooting at everything* :lol:

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

Communists take power through the barrel of a gun.

I see Democracy is live and well:rolleyes:

[Susurrus]

Part of me likes this news as this means the left is becoming more relevant. However, I still feel that communists can't take power through bourgeois elections and call themselves communists.

That's not the main reason these are not communists.

[Ocean Seal]

I agree that the KPRF is pretty backwards on some issues, but is there some good to come out of this? I mean could it mean the revitalization of the working class in Russia?

[Die Neue Zeit]

I agree that the KPRF is pretty backwards on some issues, but is there some good to come out of this? I mean could it mean the revitalization of the working class in Russia?

You've got the wrong party in mind. It is the RCWP-RPC that is pretty backwards on some issues, but that there would be some good to come out of increased support for them, linked to the revitalization of the Russian working class.

[Ocean Seal]

You've got the wrong party in mind. It is the RCWP-RPC that is pretty backwards on some issues, but that there would be some good to come out of increased support for them, linked to the revitalization of the Russian working class.
Isn't the KPRF the largest one which allows fascists into their ranks to assault gay pride people/Trotskyists? And don't they also ruthlessly exploit nostalgia? That would make them pretty bad in my opinion.

[Die Neue Zeit]

I refer to the RCWP-RPC because of the word "some." Members here were restricted or banned for homophobia, which the party tolerates.

Nonetheless, despite Trotskyist illusions, this party, even while evoking Stalin-as-icon, is the leading force for the Russian left and the Russian working class.

[Prismane]

From what I can tell, the KPRF is essentially a party of conservative, nationalist social democrats.
Do you speak Russian or live in Russia? How then are you able to make an informed opinion about the KPRF? I don't entirely agree with the Party's views and find that they are too soft and conciliatory in some areas, but they are by far the most progressive of Russia's mainstream political parties: KPRF upholds Lenin and his teachings, the legacy Great October Socialist Revolution, and Soviet power. I read their election program, which describes how the current regime that was established in the early 1990s has a record characterized by failure in all areas of life, ranging from agricultural policies to national defence.

I can't post links yet, but this is from their election program that you can find on the party's official site.



The Russian village has been destroyed. More than 20,000 villages have been wiped off the map of our country. For 20 years, outraged "reformers" attacked the large collective farms. Agricultural machinery has been eliminated, the production of tractors decreasing by almost 20 times. The country has lost its food security, with more than half of our food, often of poor quality, purchased from abroad. This costs us up to $35bn per year.
------
The bulk of Russians live in homes built in the USSR. They haven't been repaired for 20 years. Everything could collapse in an instant. "United Russia" transferred state utilities in the hands of merchants. The maintenance and repairs of homes have been passed on to citizens, despite the fact that 70% of the population have incomes below the average, and a third below the poverty line.
----
Nowhere is payment of the utility bills expensive as in Russia. Many of these costs take up to 40% of the family income and more. In Sweden, it's at least 4% of family income.
----
In the 90s, spending on health care decreased 12 times. Even today, it's 3 times lower than developed countries. Clinics decreased by 3000, and 7000 closed in the villages. In 2010, Unite Russia approved law # 83, which turned the clinics and hospitals into commercial establishments, leading to the abolition of universal health examinations of the population. Pharmacies are overwhelmed with expensive and fake medicines. The Russian population is declining more than 650,000 per year. After 1991, we decreased by more than 10 million. Is it not right to talk about genocide?
----
That level of education determines the place of the state in the modern world and man's position in society. Russia is rapidly losing position in this field. Systematically destroyed the greatest achievement of Soviet power - the world's best system of universal and free education. The current regime imposes commercial provision of educational services. This approach greatly affected the quality of education, depersonalizing the learning process. 25 years ago, all students learned for free, now only 1/3 has this opportunity. Over the past 15 years, the country has lost more than 20,000 schools.
----
In Russia came a time when folk and high culture have been openly suppressed. People now do not see folk dances of hear folk songs. All culture is based on Western models, destroying centuries-old values of kindness and cooperation. Individualism has flourished in the pop and glamor propaganda, and the violence, greed and depravity that comes with it. Profiteering owners of TV channels have eclipsed their sense of responsibility towards society.
----
After the destruction of Soviet Russia, we have lost our security zone in Europe. Our former allies have been absorbed by NATO. Hostile military blocs loom closer and closer to our borders. The armed conflict in connection with the aggression by Georgia agaisnt South Ossetia in 2008 wasn't accidental. At the same time, the "reform" of our armed forces has eliminated their combat capability. A heavy blow was inflicted on the officer corps, from which 200,000 officers with a great Soviet education and experience were cut. The bulk of military equipment was created more than 20 years ago. Without nuclear weapons, Russia would have met the fate of Yugoslavia, Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya.

[Prismane]

Isn't the KPRF the largest one which allows fascists
Where is your evidence for this? This would have to be considered slander, as the Communists are the strongest anti-fascist force that exists in Russia, who regularly combat fascism and its bourgeois-nationalist forms wherever it has reared its head. For example, Communists and their comrades around the region have combated with bourgeois-nationalist thugs that glorify fascists like the Bandera-led gangs in Ukraine and Nazi collaborators in the Pribaltika.

Threre's on the Party's Omsk branch an entry titled "8 февраля - международный день антифашиста." (International day of anti-fascists), which states

"Interethnic relations have become especially acute in connection with the economic crisis in our country. When people don't have enough to meet their basic needs, they resort to scapegoats about Jewish doctors, Tajik builders, builders of "Caucasian nationality". On Sunday 8 February, Omsk's left-wing youth will hold a rally against xenophobia, discrimination on ethnic grounds, and fascism - the most violent manifestations of capitalism..."

It's understandable that some Russians criticize the KPRF, but people in the country would not look too kindly towards outsiders with no knowledge about their politics meddling in their affairs.

[Dire Helix]

Do you speak Russian or live in Russia? How then are you able to make an informed opinion about the KPRF?

Funny how you have to resort to the "Do you speak Russian?" argument to prove your point. Well, do YOU speak Russian? Because if you did, surely you`d have taken notice of the downright chauvinist and reactionary rhetoric they employ most of the time. Oh, wait, it`s in the piece that you posted:


All culture is based on Western models, destroying centuries-old values of kindness and cooperation.
After the destruction of Soviet Russia, we have lost our security zone in Europe. Our former allies have been absorbed by NATO. Hostile military blocs loom closer and closer to our borders. The armed conflict in connection with the aggression by Georgia agaisnt South Ossetia in 2008 wasn't accidental. At the same time, the "reform" of our armed forces has eliminated their combat capability. A heavy blow was inflicted on the officer corps, from which 200,000 officers with a great Soviet education and experience were cut.

Don`t tell me you don`t find anything wrong with the above.


By the way, what`s your opinion on these:

http://www.abload.de/img/84674mroiq.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/0_6d888_c8444392_xl8yrnn.jpg

[Crux]

It's understandable that some Russians criticize the KPRF, but people in the country would not look too kindly towards outsiders with no knowledge about their politics meddling in their affairs.
Why hello there mr. Nationalist. I will be most interested to see what you respond to redscare.

[Stalin Ate My Homework]

RedScare1917, what's the story behind those pictures?

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Do you speak Russian or live in Russia? How then are you able to make an informed opinion about the KPRF? I don't entirely agree with the Party's views and find that they are too soft and conciliatory in some areas, but they are by far the most progressive of Russia's mainstream political parties: KPRF upholds Lenin and his teachings, the legacy Great October Socialist Revolution, and Soviet power. I read their election program, which describes how the current regime that was established in the early 1990s has a record characterized by failure in all areas of life, ranging from agricultural policies to national defence.

I can't post links yet, but this is from their election program that you can find on the party's official site.

I don't know Russian but I was able to google translate a link on their homepage complaining that United Russia didn't join them in banning homosexuality in public. It seems reactionary enough to me.

Instead of being a nationalist who doesn't think foreigners have a right to speak on another nation's politics, why don't you (if you do know Russian) read the original language version of that link I had translated and explain how the translation is wrong and KPRF did NOT try to have homosexuality banned in public?

[FSL]

And Kazhakstan. They are tools. Boycott the presidential elections. Sad to see the Left Front succumb to supporting the KPRF but then again it was not unexpected, sadly.

No, it proposes a federation with Belarus and a common economic space among Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine.



The pictures where Zyuganov meets priests are oh so shocking.
Get real.
There are many things wrong with CPRF's reformist platform (same thing applies to the Left Front too), but it becomes impossible to debate them with all the "they're fascists!" screams.

[Welshy]

The pictures where Zyuganov meets priests are oh so shocking.
Get real.
There are many things wrong with CPRF's reformist platform (same thing applies to the Left Front too), but it becomes impossible to debate them with all the "they're fascists!" screams.

If I'm not mistaken, a lot of the criticism of being fascists comes in part from their friendliness with Nazbol's in Russia. There was a thread not to long ago about a conference hosted by the Communist Party of Britian that the CPRF attended that brought in a known Nazbol as speaker. http://www.revleft.com/vb/national-bolsheviks-invited-t165379/index.html?t=165379

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

The pictures where Zyuganov meets priests are oh so shocking.
Get real.
There are many things wrong with CPRF's reformist platform (same thing applies to the Left Front too), but it becomes impossible to debate them with all the "they're fascists!" screams.

OK they're still trying to re-ban homosexuality in Russia, nearly a century after Lenin decriminalized it. They do it because they are not a principled party but opportunists who want the votes of homophobic orthodox pensioners.

[Dire Helix]

RedScare1917, what's the story behind those pictures?

In the first picture Zyuganov is shaking hands with a rabidly anti-communist cleric which is a usual thing for him. Unlike all those pesky Marxists Zyuganov loves Russia and wants for it to retain its traditional values and culture, which the Russian Orthodox Church is obviously the main holder of.

In the second picture he is touching the Mother of God`s Belt, a "wonder-making" relic sacred to the hearts of Orthodox Christians. It`s supposed to be a wish granter of sorts. So, when last month the belt was brought to Russia from Mount Athos in Greece millions of brainwashed people flocked to it and so did Zyuganov. I recall reading that he even wished for something. No doubt it was socialist revolution.

[Crux]

No, it proposes a federation with Belarus and a common economic space among Russia, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine.



The pictures where Zyuganov meets priests are oh so shocking.
Get real.
There are many things wrong with CPRF's reformist platform (same thing applies to the Left Front too), but it becomes impossible to debate them with all the "they're fascists!" screams.
And they want an "anti-NATO" military alliance with Kazhakstan and Belarus. I am suprised you do not already know this.

But then again, you would not be a stranger to the term "social fascist", now would you?

[FSL]

In the first picture Zyuganov is shaking hands with a rabidly anti-communist cleric which is a usual thing for him. Unlike all those pesky Marxists Zyuganov loves Russia and wants for it to retain its traditional values and culture, which the Russian Orthodox Church is obviously the main holder of.

In the second picture he is touching the Mother of God`s Belt, a "wonder-making" relic sacred to the hearts of Orthodox Christians. It`s supposed to be a wish granter of sorts. So, when last month the belt was brought to Russia from Mount Athos in Greece millions of brainwashed people flocked to it and so did Zyuganov. I recall reading that he even wished for something. No doubt it was socialist revolution.
There are billions of people who believe in some sort of God. Just calling them brainwashed would probably get them mad at you. If that's your goal, well done.

Now, I'd say that the main thing about someone belonging to the left (if that term has any sort of substance) is property relations and state power. So that's what one should first criticize. Not whether one leader of some party is a christian or acts like one or whatever. I'm quite sure most people whould have a much more mild stance if some catholic priest in a small latin american country preached the "liberation theology" and then run for president with some vague "pro-poor" policies. Why is it that we can't have that behaviour here as well?

Not opposing religion is a symptom -and not even an important one- of the party's general reformist attitude. The anticlericalism you demonstrate is also a symptom of your mistaken approach. But I wouldn't immediately start calling you brainwashed.


Now, we live in this world and at the present time, and this mean many communist parties who still haven't got rid of the reformism of the late soviet era. After this has been made clear, there can be an actual talk on the events instead of everyone acting like they're the next Lenin waiting to shine brightly. What are the prospects of having a somewhat reformist CP with a sizeable support in Russia? What could it hope to achieve through managing the bourgeois state? What does that tell us?

[Dire Helix]

There are billions of people who believe in some sort of God. Just calling them brainwashed would probably get them mad at you. If that's your goal, well done.

This only became possible after two decades of extremely intensive clerical and anti-scientific propaganda campaign on the part of the Russian state. So, yes, an actual brainwashing(or conditioning) took place. And I don`t see how calling religious zealots flocking to "wish-granting" relics brainwashed is in any way more improper and insulting than referring to the religious people as "hypnotized masses"(a Bolshevik definition; was commonly used in early Soviet documents dealing with the destruction of churches and burning of icons and relics) or calling religion "opium of the people".


Not opposing religion is a symptom -and not even an important one- of the party's general reformist attitude. "Not opposing" is putting it very mildly. How about fully embracing militant clericalism together with nationalism and doing their best to drive the few remaining members who still dare to use class approach out of the party under accusations of "neo-trotskyism"(in KPRF`s definition everyone who deviates from the party line; on practice it usually concerns those of the party members who are not right-wing enough and underestimate the importance of the "Russian question").

[zimmerwald1915]

I don`t see how calling religious zealots flocking to "wish-granting" relics brainwashed is in any way more improper and insulting than referring to the religious people as "hypnotized masses"(a Bolshevik definition; was commonly used in early Soviet documents dealing with the destruction of churches and burning of icons and relics) or calling religion "opium of the people".
Minor quibble: the latter referred to religion's anaesthetic more than to its mind-numbing properties.