Is the economy recovering?

[Rafiq]

Attention all Marxists, economists, etc.

By the looks of it, is the economy going to recovet soon? Somone told me in the next few months a lot of Jobs are going to be created... What does it look like?

[Threetune]

Attention all Marxists, economists, etc.

By the looks of it, is the economy going to recovet soon? Somone told me in the next few months a lot of Jobs are going to be created... What does it look like? :laugh:

[Obs]

Are you actually for real right now

[danyboy27]

Attention all Marxists, economists, etc.

By the looks of it, is the economy going to recovet soon? Somone told me in the next few months a lot of Jobs are going to be created... What does it look like?

What kind of job will be created? what kind of salary those peoples will be paid?

Beccause by the look of it, creating several low paid temporary job will not do much to stimulate the economy, what the capitalists need is to pay their workers more so they can spend more in services and product, and i dont see that happening right now.

[Threetune]

Attention all Marxists, economists, etc.

By the looks of it, is the economy going to recovet soon? Somone told me in the next few months a lot of Jobs are going to be created... What does it look like?
I had to stop for a laugh. Honestly Rafiq, tell us where you got this stupid stuff.

Do you believe it?

[Rafiq]

I had to stop for a laugh. Honestly Rafiq, tell us where you got this stupid stuff.

Do you believe it?


Of course not. I was asking for statistical evidence to counter this. Statistical evidence from a Marxist source

[Rafiq]

Are you actually for real right now

Sort of... I mean, I don't think Jobs are "created" or any of that crap, though I was told the crisis is ending in the years to come and is slowly recovering, and it would be nice to source statistics to counter.this. Look man, I live in Detroit, it has always been a shit hole here so it's difficult to tell whether or not recovery is occuring.

And I was speaking about JUST the U.S.

I, in no way think that "recovery" = recovering from the recession. Merely a bit of an improvement.

Also, this is all posted from tapatalk, hence the poor quality of my OP.

[Threetune]

Sort of... I mean, I don't think Jobs are "created" or any of that crap, though I was told the crisis is ending in the years to come and is slowly recovering, and it would be nice to source statistics to counter.this. Look man, I live in Detroit, it has always been a shit hole here so it's difficult to tell whether or not recovery is occuring.

And I was speaking about JUST the U.S.

I, in no way think that "recovery" = recovering from the recession. Merely a bit of an improvement.

Also, this is all posted from tapatalk, hence the poor quality of my OP.

Nonsense! You have access to the world web, do your own research before posting crap.

[aty]

What has happend in the last month is that both the ECB and the Fed have been starting printing money/buying bonds.
That have led to lower yields in Italy, Spain, etc. But ECB dont have the economic power or mandate to buy a lot of state-bonds to drive down the yield. This is just a temporary fix because yields over 7% as Italy had is totally unsustainable for longer periods.

They want this recovery-found ESFS in place before anything drastic happens, a found with 2000 billion euro. But they need to first finance this found and they have a hard time doing that because were will the money come from?
My country Sweden probably have the best state-finances in Europe but can only contribute with 10 billion euro...and even that sum is huge and will meet a lot of resistance in the parliament, we dont have a majority government. So it will probably dont pass, and if it passes our Left Party will get a huge boost.

So first they need this ESFS-found so they can bail out the banks when Greece defaults. Greece have threatend now to default in march, they will do that if this ESFS-found is in place, or else the EU will not let them default yet.

When Greece defaults a lot of banks will go bankrupt and the states will go in and save them with this ESFS-found for the bigger banks.
The implications of Greece going default will be huge, the euro will crumble and nobody really knows what is going to happen with the euro.

Portugal and Ireland will also default as an effect of Greeces default because they dont longer see why they should pay their loans and cut down in spending when Greece dont have too. They will save themselves and cancel their payments.


Conclusion: You have not even seen the beginning....

[Invader Zim]

Nonsense! You have access to the world web, do your own research before posting crap.


Well yes, but without a certain knowledge already it can be difficult to read specialised literature from economists, marxist economists being no exception. While random internet articles, which may be easy to follow, are often not very trustworthy or present a misleading picture.

[Hit The North]

Read what the financial paper are saying. That'll give you an indication of how confident the capitalist are about the possibility of recovery in the short term. Not very.

[Tatarin]

So capitalism finally collapses?

[Firebrand]

So capitalism finally collapses?

We live in hope.

Seriously though, we have definately not seen the worst of this recession. It hasn't even STARTED yet. We are looking at years possibly decades of cuts, unemployment and poverty. At least people should now stop believing the propaganda that "capitalism is your friend". Aklthough they'll probably be too busy trying to survive to do anything about it. I personally think that the only 2 things that can end this recession in any kind of reasonable timeframe are world revolution or world war. What do you bet the capitalists provide a war, my money's on Iran vs Israel being the trigger, with lots of other countries piling in to support one or the other.

[danyboy27]

So capitalism finally collapses?

Never understimate the elasticity of capitalism.
It might be the end of it, or it will transform itself in someting else.

[danyboy27]

Sort of... I mean, I don't think Jobs are "created" or any of that crap, though I was told the crisis is ending in the years to come and is slowly recovering, and it would be nice to source statistics to counter.this. Look man, I live in Detroit, it has always been a shit hole here so it's difficult to tell whether or not recovery is occuring.

And I was speaking about JUST the U.S.

I, in no way think that "recovery" = recovering from the recession. Merely a bit of an improvement.

Also, this is all posted from tapatalk, hence the poor quality of my OP.
Well, You dont need statistical evidences to understand that even if a shitload of job is created in a verry short time, if the pay is shit, the impact it will have on the economy will be weak beccause people will not spend more, wich mean industries will not manufacture more things, wich mean they will eventually forced to layoff more people to attain their profit margin.

[aty]

So capitalism finally collapses?
Only if we replace it with something else. And I doubt the socialist movement is that strong at the moment.

Will probably transform into a more authoritarian capitalism, like China.

[Rafiq]

That's right, my head was in my ass. Even if Jobs are created with the "tax cuts" This will be the same thing over again: massive debt as a result of wages being so low.

I should have rephrased it: Is the economy going to temporarily recover?

I know very well that even if it does it would only be for a short amount of time, as the nature of the crisis will just return once more. Ah, you know what they say, first as tragedy, second as farce.

[Nothing Human Is Alien]

Bourgeois political commentators have drawn their own conclusions from the crisis and are issuing warnings to the political elite to prepare for major class confrontations. In her prognosis for 2012, Princeton Professor Anne-Marie Slaughter wrote in Tuesday’s Financial Times that austerity and the spread of poverty would provoke revolts in sub-Saharan Africa and further mass protests in Central Asia and South America.

“In the US,” she wrote, “the Occupy movement will operate through rolling flashmob-type disruptions, but we should also see much more concrete actions such as defending against foreclosures—a tactic pioneered in Spain. In European countries that are choking on euro zone-imposed austerity, protests are also likely to turn into coordinated civil disobedience, centered on a refusal to pay new or higher taxes. And the Middle East will continue to burn. … Expect a very turbulent year.”

http://wsws.org/articles/2012/jan2012/euro-j04.shtml

[Firebrand]

The slight flaw in that reasoning althought he rest of it is probably true is that the co-ordinated civil disturbances in Europe won't be over higher taxes, they will be over cuts to welfare. We would rather pay the taxes and have that safety net than have a tax cut and lose it. Besides the idea of taxation is that the rich pay more. The riots and protests will beover welfare cuts and job losses, mark my words.