U.S. Schools Teaching that Marxism is "Command Economy"

[Philosopher Jay]

I was shocked that in my daughter's Florida public high school economics course, they devoted one chapter to the history of economics in which they talked about four historical economic theoreticians and described their theories. According to this description, Adam Smith is for a free market economy, where what people desire determines what gets produced, Karl Marx is for a "Command Economy" where the government determines what people should have and sets prices for wages and goods and services. There is no mention that Marx ever said anything about the working class. The other two economists are David Ricardo and John Maynard Keynes who both apparently advocated a "Mixed Economy" where the government leaves people and markets free to determine prices and only steps in when there is an emergency to fix things or to help the poor by setting up things like minimum wage.
In another section, they talk about economic freedom and give an "Economic Freedom" index showing the countries in the world that are most "Free". These countries that are most free are the ones with the least government regulations that interfere with the rights of people to accumulate wealth and the choice of how to spend it (low taxation). The chapter seems to have been written by the Heritage Foundation. It lists Hong Kong as the most free country on Earth.
Another section talks about how poor, hungry and miserable people were living under the "Command Economy" of communism in Eastern Europe. Once Capitalism took over the people became free and are now rich and happy.

I am wondering what can be done about this capitalist brainwashing that is going on in American schools.

[TheGodlessUtopian]

What do yo know, a new brainwashing method: just tell children shit and mix up everything with everything else....oh wait,that has been around for some time.

Well,regardless,this does not surprise me....nothing does anymore.

[Die Neue Zeit]

The chapter seems to have been written by the Heritage Foundation. It lists Hong Kong as the most free country on Earth.

Hong Kong before 1997 or after? :lol:

[Le Socialiste]

Are you really surprised by this? If its any consolation, I don't even remember what my school(s) had to say about communism (not that I cared). Most kids are - for better or worse - indifferent when it comes to these things. The troubling part is, this indifference will lead plenty to take what they read at face value and leave it at that. The education system isn't there to foster a critical thought process, it's there to teach children and teenagers to accept authority.

[Agent Equality]

Are you really surprised by this? If its any consolation, I don't even remember what my school(s) had to say about communism (not that I cared). Most kids are - for better or worse - indifferent when it comes to these things. The troubling part is, this indifference will lead plenty to take what they read at face value and leave it at that. The education system isn't there to foster a critical thought process, it's there to teach children and teenagers to accept authority.

This is exactly why I could give fuck all about high school and even trying in it. Education in this country is so completely pointless that it is not even worth trying to pass because all it is setting kids up to find a place in capitalist society and not actually gain critical thinking skills.

[RedGrunt]

Structured to impart accepting authority and train little worker-parrots. But seriously, stay in school. College is better.

[OHumanista]

This kind of bullshit (among others) is one of the things that ruins education under capitalism.

[Le Socialiste]

This kind of bullshit (among others) is one of the things that ruins education under capitalism.

Don't forget, the ruination of education is vital to keeping capitalism more or less intact. I'm sure if some were to have their way, education for the public would be done away with, leaving only the privileged layers of society in a position to enjoy the benefits. One could argue we're already on our way there...

[Red Commissar]

This sounds like the way it was taught in my schools too. I think it's like this in most schools in the United States when it comes down to basic economic thought. There's a linear line with "Free Markets" on one end and "Command Economy" on the other with "Mixed Economy" in the middle.

The way I was taught was that Communist nations (these included China, Vietnam, Korea, Cuba, etc) existed on one end with the US (and some other countries, can't remember what) on the other, with most of your European nations somewhere in the middle.

You know what's funny though is even with this simplistic explanation that is clearly skweed towards making Communism as dystopian as possible, you'll still get those claiming that schools are indoctrinating students to like socialism. It got enough headway in Texas that there was a successful push to further screw up social studies textbook standards from one that was already pretty 'conservative' as it is.

I have a project stored on my computer from 2004 from when I was in a 9th grade geography class (I would be 15 around that point) that also doubled as history. We had to do a 'profile' on a European nation when we were covering that region; I was assigned the nation of Slovenia. I scored high on that project but reading through it I had to resist slamming my face on the desk. I harped on the successes the nation ahs gone through after passing through its dark period under 'Communism', how nice it has done with democracy and capitalism! From what I described of the "Communist" system it was basically do as your told and shut up... not much else.

Again, it's still funny to see these people think there's some massive brainwashing scheme in school to make kids 'like' socialism (CULTURAL MARXISM, the ultimate revenge of a hunchbacked Italian!), I just can't see it. If I didn't break from the school's slant on things and read up on things my self, I'd've never ended up here.

But again, what else is the school's role in a state? It's supposed to make 'citizens' who will operate within that state, or at least be indifferent towards it. There's nothing to be gained by making them against the fundamental aspects of the state from that viewpoint.

As for what can be done? TBH when I get children and they have to go through this, I'll at least make it a point to know what they are learning and talk to them about it. Get them to 'explain' it to me and go from there, help them out. Try to get them to think critically at least. I'd like for them to be Marxist or at least some kind of socialist too, but I can't force that upon them (nor would I want too, one must arrive at socialism on their own). At the very least just to be able to think for themselves and not just have things go in one ear and out the other.

[A Revolutionary Tool]

That's basically how my econ class was Red Commisar. I remeber the chart the teacher made said Hong Kong and the U.S. were "free-market" capitalist systems, Sweden and Norway were "mixed" economies and all of our "enemies" including NK, Venezuela, Cuba, and Iran were "command" economies. I swear economics was pure right-wing propaganda that touched on stuff not even about economic theory.

[citizen of industry]

Well, I'm sure most of us here are products of the capitalist schooling system, and we turned out to be communists. So I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's obviously not public education that determines our politics. I don't think we can expect public schools to teach an economic system that spells the doom of the governments and corporations they are funded by.

[Red Commissar]

That's basically how my econ class was Red Commisar. I remeber the chart the teacher made said Hong Kong and the U.S. were "free-market" capitalist systems, Sweden and Norway were "mixed" economies and all of our "enemies" including NK, Venezuela, Cuba, and Iran were "command" economies. I swear economics was pure right-wing propaganda that touched on stuff not even about economic theory.

This was my geography/history class. The economics class I took in my senior year (when most people took it in my area... this would be four years ago for me) and honestly I can't remember much from it. The textbooks we rarely referred to but it was definitely a glamorization of the free market as expected.

As the teacher taught it to us it was more an understanding of how the US economy works currently, rather than 'economics' in general. As I recall it, socialism was taught to us as a doctrine that, ultimately, only functions by making people want less and achieving 'equality' by making everyone 'less' rich. Basically make everyone give up their 'free' choice in the market and lower their living standards.

Again as others have already pointed out though, education is a tool of the state. It'd be self-defeating for it to make anything else but its own policies, or at least general range of policies, look 'good'.

[Le Socialiste]

I was fortunate when it came to taking economics my senior year - our original teacher suddenly quit and the school's football coach ended up being our instructor (you can just imagine how that was). All we did that first semester (one semester was dedicated to American government, the other Economics) was sit around and do nothing, with the coach reading us the answers for our quizzes and final. :D

[Nox]

>USA brainwashing population

Nothing new here.

[Die Rote Fahne]

The use of misinformation by bourgeois textbooks is nothing new. If students were told what Marx actually advocated, that Stalin and Mao weren't the only communists ever, that the USSR was in fact a capitalist society then they would be more likely to support Marx.

This isn't just text books, but teachers themselves, who are so brainwashed from the cold war era, who don't actually know what they're talking about.

Misinformation in texts would be easy to combat if we had objective teachers ensuring that students know that text books can be biased.

[IndependentCitizen]

Well, it's correct about Ricardo and Keynes. They advocate intervention when there's downturn, but to leave the markets as they are when they're stable.

[Tim Finnegan]

I'm sceptical of all this talk about "brainwashing". That implies that those arranging the material actually give enough of a crap about Marxism to consciously defame it, which seems frankly unlikely in the year 2011. Far more likely that they are the products of the same anti-criticial education that they are now imparting- as Le Socialiste has noted- and so have simply inherited the old nonsenses without much question. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity", as they say, or perhaps in this case "by thoughtlessness".

It is possible to address the education system as an ideological institution without resorting to a vulgar instrumentalism, and in fact, I would go so far as to say, only by developing a more sophisticated critique can we expect anyone to take us any more seriously than the Tinfoil Hat Brigade.

[Omsk]

The bigger problem than idiotic spitting on communism and Marxism is the little attention and a lack of information regarding the Nazi and fascist vermin war crimes,and genocide.I was ashamed when I learned that most of the kids don't know anything about the terror of the Nazis,and the Nazi party.

Another problem is the nihilism and the lack of interest for theory and politics.I'm not saying that little kids need to know about communism,but I think it is normal for young people to be communists,to want change,a better,more free world.But it seems that today,people find dumbing down media and the likes more important than literature and healthy thinking.

[Tim Finnegan]

Another problem is the nihilism and the lack of interest for theory and politics.I'm not saying that little kids need to know about communism,but I think it is normal for young people to be communists,to want change,a better,more free world.But it seems that today,people find dumbing down media and the likes more important than literature and healthy thinking.
Thank god we have people like you to keep us informed about what forms of pass-time are suitably intellectual and "healthy", eh, comrade?

[Ostrinski]

Yep it's like this everywhere. There's nothing you can really do about it except educating people outside of the school environment.

[Omsk]

Thank god we have people like you to keep us informed about what forms of pass-time are suitably intellectual and "healthy", eh, comrade?

Well,I have seen a lot of people on this forum who could use a bit of information of that kind...

[mykittyhasaboner]

So far nobody has talked about how current education (particularly in the US) lies by sheer omission. Does anyone remember where textbooks identified the basic fundamental of "economics" as private ownership of capital?

Or demonstrated how national economies of past and current nations differed? i don't. Just lofty ideas like "command economy" vs "free market economy" and the ever vague "mixed economy". No critical thought. No scientific observation.

Its even worse in the history class room. According to high school history class (at least the ones i had) things like the Allies invading Soviet Russia, genocide of various native American nations, or the Haitian revolution never happened.

[Rafiq]

High School courses involving economics and politics require no serious or critical analysation. We are even tempted to say that high school serves to estabilish it's own twisted presupposation of economics and politics, with college being "side possibilities" but none the less the big other persists.

[Rafiq]

I was fortunate when it came to taking economics my senior year - our original teacher suddenly quit and the school's football coach ended up being our instructor (you can just imagine how that was). All we did that first semester (one semester was dedicated to American government, the other Economics) was sit around and do nothing, with the coach reading us the answers for our quizzes and final. :D

Civics and econ...

[X5N]

American public schools always give a really convoluted account of history. The problem is that fact contradicts a bit with the national mythology.

It annoys me how public schools are either neutral to or supportive of the bullshit idea that communism is an authoritarian ideology.

[Firebrand]

I think a major problem is subject omission. Politics, economics etc aren't actually taught in england until you get to A-level and then its a choice whether or not to take it. Loads of kids go through the whole schooling system without being taught anything about this stuff. It's not even mentioned in a negative way it just isn't a subject. And to be honest most kids who do take economics are posh public school kids who will probably grow up to be bankers. (note for all americans, publics schools in england are the ultra posh schools, what you call public schools are state schools here)

[Desperado]

I'm sceptical of all this talk about "brainwashing". That implies that those arranging the material actually give enough of a crap about Marxism to consciously defame it, which seems frankly unlikely in the year 2011. Far more likely that they are the products of the same anti-criticial education that they are now imparting- as Le Socialiste has noted- and so have simply inherited the old nonsenses without much question. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity", as they say, or perhaps in this case "by thoughtlessness".

However, the education establishment's anti-critical teaching is quite certainly a purposeful systemic bias, both because of school's purpose as a disciplining/subduing institution and the need to keep costs down. Certainly though the treatment of "Marxism" is just part of this general trend, it's hardly the bourgeoisie's present concern. As is shown in this article, and as much by the day to day complete perversion of Adam Smith's original thought into some neo-liberalist founder is perhaps an even greater myth than those about Marx's thought (although painting Smith as such has obvious more specific 2011 ideological reasons).

Of course, to what degree "purposeful" implies a conscious conspiracy on the part of the ruling class, or just the system evolving through trial and error defending itself semi-unconsciously is another debate entirely.

[Desperado]

I think a major problem is subject omission. Politics, economics etc aren't actually taught in england until you get to A-level and then its a choice whether or not to take it. Loads of kids go through the whole schooling system without being taught anything about this stuff. It's not even mentioned in a negative way it just isn't a subject. And to be honest most kids who do take economics are posh public school kids who will probably grow up to be bankers. (note for all americans, publics schools in england are the ultra posh schools, what you call public schools are state schools here)

Definitely. The system was one with quite high proletarian participation in the (lying, treacherous, misleading) political cultural sphere: mass parties, mass elections, politics being an issue - obviously, there was never much proletarian participation in actual politics except through genuine threats in radical strikes etc. Now it's evolved to one of keeping politics completely out of people's minds and making them apathetic to everything that goes on - low voter turnout, only focusing on the votes of the richer proles. Not that I'm sure if school had much political education back then, though the lack of it certainly strengthens the more recent situation. I wonder if increased agitation will lead to the system making the population again active in it's pseudo-democracy so that it can channel their anger into areas where it makes little difference, or if that eras most certainly behind us. Not that it's entirely the crafty system nor a negative development - most proles themselves are just sick and wont be fooled no longer by mass bourgeoisie-democracy as a means for change, as they once were. We just need them not to abandon hope for change through different methods.

Went off on a bit of a tangent there..

[ckaihatsu]

I am wondering what can be done about this capitalist brainwashing that is going on in American schools.


I *was* going to say "just let me back into the classroom" but my attitude to my chosen profession has become somewhat more circumspect over the years from past professional experiences -- the points of discussion here ring true.





economic freedom


Another liberalist gem -- we've definitely moved on from simple national mythology propaganda and have now "advanced" to the notion that the point of human society is to empower flows of capital.

On the economics tip, just ask whoever you're talking to if they favor more of a stronger currency or more of a weaker one. Ask them to explain why their economic philosophy / ideology is this way. If they back efforts for a *stronger* currency (U.S. dollar), ask them why this monetarism of theirs is so important, and perhaps to what strength of currency we should be aiming for. If they back a more Keynesian monetary policy, ask them how much of it they think it will take to get things back on track...(!) (!!!)


x D





Don't forget, the ruination of education is vital to keeping capitalism more or less intact. I'm sure if some were to have their way, education for the public would be done away with, leaving only the privileged layers of society in a position to enjoy the benefits. One could argue we're already on our way there...


And (public) education revitalizes our society to do... what, exactly??? (Not that I'm advocating reducing it, of course.)





Misinformation in texts would be easy to combat if we had objective teachers ensuring that students know that text books can be biased.


Has any teacher ever assigned classwork to research the textbook industry -- ???


= D

[Die Neue Zeit]

Can a mod please move this thread to Learning?

[o well this is ok I guess]

I think every social studies teacher I ever had in High School used the class itself as an example of indoctrination.

[ellipsis]

moved to learning

[Tovarisch]

Many Americans in schools are taught to believe that a "free economy" is working fifteen hours a day in a sweaty basement making shoes for two dollars an hour. But that's ok, as long as the government does not intervene, right? RIGHT?

[Ocean Seal]

Yep I learned that too in high school economics. I asked why they didn't call it the planned economy? They said that was sugarcoating? Then I asked why they couldn't call the free market, wage slavery. Fun times, fun times.

[Lanky Wanker]

Back when I broke free of my capitalist indoctrination and realised communism wasn't a synonym for dictatorship, I asked my history teacher about the difference between anarchism and communism (I'd heard about anarcho-communism and communist punk which confused the hell out of me) because we'd just started on the Cold War, and he actually gave me a real answer for it which, to this day, still amazes me. Most history teachers seem to be just as ill-informed on such topics as the rest of the world, so I'm glad not every school/teacher tries to reinforce this "communism = evil fascism!" mentality through history courses.

[Strannik]

Of course, in Russia and Eastern Europe, where it is apparent that capitalism hasn't increased anyone's living standards much except former bureaucrats and new bunch of sociopathic gangster enterpreneurs, the misery is blamed on "heritage" of Soviet command economy. We are supposedly located in "primitive" early capitalism and any day now we will arrive in the "actual" capitalism where everyone's happy and wealthy.

Unfortunately this excuse sounds exactly like the bureaucrats promising communism "day after tomorrow" as long as workers keep following their lead and so is growing old.

On the other hand, the fact that Warshau Block countries are no longer cut off from world economy really did flood the stores with sorely needed consumer goods, which helped to confuse the matter for a while.

[Sixiang]

My high school macroeconomics textbook said practically the same thing. Although it only classified economies into one of two categories: market and command. My teacher was a bleeding Democrat and worshiped John Maynard Keynes like a god. Literally the only criticism he could ever make against Marxian economics was "Gorbachev said that in the Soviet Union their economy was so bad that they couldn't even produce enough shampoo." He said that several times throughout the course as his only criticism. Yeah, cause nothing says Marxian command economics like a self-proclaimed social democrat dedicated to market reforms.

[Ostrinski]

Was taught the same thing. There's not much we can do except counter education.

[Sixiang]

Never let your schooling get in the way of your education, as Mark Twain once said. They still read his books in U.S. schools, right?

[RedZero]

I've only read the first post, but I can attest to another high school doing the same thing. I graduated back in June. I went to a high school in North Carolina, and in my senior year I took a class titled "Principles of Business" and now that you mention it, I recall the very same thing being taught. The teacher (or textbook, or almighty school board, or something) taught us that communism is a command economy.

At the time, I thought nothing of it. I assumed it was true and I had never read much of anything about communism, Karl Marx, or his teachings and critiques (ignorant, I know). It's funny, I've learned much more outside of school and in a lot less time.

That class was a bunch of bullshit, anyway. How can people find pleasure in business (as it currently stands, anyway)? It's disgusting and quite boring.

[The Stalinator]

Ah, we were taught about "command economy" in Canadian geography class too. Marxism was never explicitly stated to be a "command economy", though at age 13, what little I'd been told (or rather lied to) about Marxism seemed similar. Luckily I had a decent teacher who pointed out the flaws of a free market economy as well.

[Drosophila]

The Economics textbook that NJ classes use is written by two assholes from Harvard. Wouldn't be surprised if it's the same one in Florida.

[Erratus]

High school is messed up like that. Mine gave some confused definitions of communism and socialism that would change with the chapters. Left me horribly confused. Also, I had a sub for that class once who taught that Canada was a(n authoritarian) socialist country.

but I will attest that college is much better, and you shouldn't drop out just because high school tends to lie a little bit. In fact it is my sociology professor that pushed me to look into communism (although I think it was unknowingly). I would make some point in class and he would say "That is a very Marxist view". So I decided to learn what Marxism and communism is to prove that I was not one. did not go as planned, but worked for the best.

But he did do a good job at teaching Marxism (even though he more focused on the sociological aspects) objectively. And when he later saw me reading Das Kapital before class he knew what it was about with enough detail that he clearly read it himself. Point: College is much better.

[GatesofLenin]

Seriously, keep your kids away from these right-wing automatons! Home school them and you'll set them right.

[Sixiang]

High school is messed up like that. Mine gave some confused definitions of communism and socialism that would change with the chapters. Left me horribly confused. Also, I had a sub for that class once who taught that Canada was a(n authoritarian) socialist country.

but I will attest that college is much better, and you shouldn't drop out just because high school tends to lie a little bit. In fact it is my sociology professor that pushed me to look into communism (although I think it was unknowingly). I would make some point in class and he would say "That is a very Marxist view". So I decided to learn what Marxism and communism is to prove that I was not one. did not go as planned, but worked for the best.

But he did do a good job at teaching Marxism (even though he more focused on the sociological aspects) objectively. And when he later saw me reading Das Kapital before class he knew what it was about with enough detail that he clearly read it himself. Point: College is much better.

I too had a teacher in high school who thought Canada was a socialist dictatorship. Whenever I leveled criticism against the U.S. government and the holy dear leader great Ronald Reagan or George Bush, she would say something along of the lines of, "If you don't like it here, you can go to Sweden with all the other socialists." Good times in the American education system. I became so frustrated with her that eventually I just trolled her about how the more conservative a politician, the higher their chances of messed up sexual scandal and of being a lizardman from outer space.

[Firebrand]

Seriously, keep your kids away from these right-wing automatons! Home school them and you'll set them right.

I speak from experience when I say home schooling is excellent for free thinking but awful for actually learning stuff. Well actually that probably a bit harsh, but its rubbish for teaching you the stuff your parents were never very good at. So I did very well in english when I went back to school, but my maths was utterly appalling. Luckily I ended up with a really inspirational maths teacher who save me from total innumeracy.:D

The moral of the story, its ok to take yur kids out of school to develop free thought, but its probably best to send them back when its time to go to secondary school so that they can actually pass their exams.
The humanities teaching in schools might be biased but they are good at teaching you to add, and various other things yu need to know in life. Just tell the kids to take it all with a pinch of salt and they'll be fine.

[Nox]

I remember some funny shit from my GCSE high school history textbook, apparantly 40 million people died in the famine in the 30's, and 10 million died in the purges

[GatesofLenin]

I speak from experience when I say home schooling is excellent for free thinking but awful for actually learning stuff...

With the way schools teach nowadays, where the school board is so busy trying to please their masters to plump next years budget, no wonder children are learning zilch.

[Sixiang]

I remember some funny shit from my GCSE high school history textbook, apparantly 40 million people died in the famine in the 30's, and 10 million died in the purges
And of course there's no mention of the estimated millions of Americans who died of starvation, malnutrition, and disease in the Great Depression and specifically the Dust Bowl, the estimated 600,000+ Americans who died of influenza from 1918 to 1920 despite cover ups from the U.S. government to try to bolster support for involvement in WWI, the uncountable amount of Africans enslaved, displaced, infected with diseases, murdered, lynched, and all around treated like animals, and the tens of thousands of Filipino people who were killed in suppression of their war for independence under Spanish and U.S. occupation just to name a few. Of course, the list goes on and on.

[Diello]

Last summer I had a professor who described fascism as "an extreme form of socialism." True story.

[The Stalinator]

I too had a teacher in high school who thought Canada was a socialist dictatorship. Whenever I leveled criticism against the U.S. government and the holy dear leader great Ronald Reagan or George Bush, she would say something along of the lines of, "If you don't like it here, you can go to Sweden with all the other socialists." Good times in the American education system. I became so frustrated with her that eventually I just trolled her about how the more conservative a politician, the higher their chances of messed up sexual scandal and of being a lizardman from outer space.

I live in a socialist dictatorship?
Well shit! I never knew!

[VirgJans12]

The school system is an extremely important aspect when steering for long-term dedication to a certain ideology or way of thinking. In today's capitalist society, high school children are taught certain skills and base their college course choice on those and their interests. In the process they are taught that democratic capitalism is the greatest ideology available. They rarely ever question the system despite all the evidence that is right in front of them daily that it contains many flaws. Even when they are broke, sick and watching the world's center of capitalism go to war on the news they won't question the system, but merely the current government. After all, it is peaceful in our western countries and they were never educated on a better system. They want to end poverty, starvation, war, unequality and crime through capitalism, because they lack knowledge of what communism can do for these problems. And they will not end as long as the current systems stand.

That's why I think socialist and communist parties should capture as many educational positions as possible within the governmental system. Even if they can only occupy a single ministry it should be education. The power that comes with it will allow them to change the material that is taught and introduce communism and socialism as they truly are to our offspring. Change the texts in the history books to the truth. Teach them the USSR was not a communism and why it wasn't. Devote some time to explain the true nature of our ideology as well as other systems.

Most people nowadays are afraid of communism because they were taught it is something to be afraid of. However, if we reach our children with the true message of Marx, Engels and Lenin, then we will prepare a wave of positive minded towards leftist ideology. They will then do the same to the next generation and thus create a chain reaction that will accumulate massive support for communism.

[Sixiang]

Last summer I had a professor who described fascism as "an extreme form of socialism." True story.
And yet Mussolini said that fascism is in favor of "heroic capitalism."


I live in a socialist dictatorship?
Well shit! I never knew!
Yeah, you should celebrate. Who knew that all our hopes and dreams were in Canada all along?

[cenv]

The school system is an extremely important aspect when steering for long-term dedication to a certain ideology or way of thinking. In today's capitalist society, high school children are taught certain skills and base their college course choice on those and their interests. In the process they are taught that democratic capitalism is the greatest ideology available. They rarely ever question the system despite all the evidence that is right in front of them daily that it contains many flaws. Even when they are broke, sick and watching the world's center of capitalism go to war on the news they won't question the system, but merely the current government. After all, it is peaceful in our western countries and they were never educated on a better system. They want to end poverty, starvation, war, unequality and crime through capitalism, because they lack knowledge of what communism can do for these problems. And they will not end as long as the current systems stand.

That's why I think socialist and communist parties should capture as many educational positions as possible within the governmental system. Even if they can only occupy a single ministry it should be education. The power that comes with it will allow them to change the material that is taught and introduce communism and socialism as they truly are to our offspring. Change the texts in the history books to the truth. Teach them the USSR was not a communism and why it wasn't. Devote some time to explain the true nature of our ideology as well as other systems.

Most people nowadays are afraid of communism because they were taught it is something to be afraid of. However, if we reach our children with the true message of Marx, Engels and Lenin, then we will prepare a wave of positive minded towards leftist ideology. They will then do the same to the next generation and thus create a chain reaction that will accumulate massive support for communism.
Unfortunately, it's not this simple. Explaining Marxist theory to people without addressing the pervasive psychological consequences of capitalism is a waste of time. Telling people "the truth" about communism has no effect when their fundamental thought processes, approach to the world, and relationship to themselves as well as others has been molded to fit the demands of a society where the ultimate goal of human experience is the production of the commodity.

You're right that counteracting the effects of bourgeois education is an essential task for revolutionaries, but the changes have to run a lot deeper than teaching Marxist theory. They require an in-depth understanding of how the commodity form creates people in its own image, how education instills passivity and flattens curiosity; how education interacts with other vectors of bourgeois ideology like the family, the media, language. We have some general ideas, but overall we don't currently have this understanding.

We can't just change people's perspective on what "is the greatest ideology available." We have to provoke them to transcend ideological thinking altogether.

[VirgJans12]

Unfortunately, it's not this simple. Explaining Marxist theory to people without addressing the pervasive psychological consequences of capitalism is a waste of time. Telling people "the truth" about communism has no effect when their fundamental thought processes, approach to the world, and relationship to themselves as well as others has been molded to fit the demands of a society where the ultimate goal of human experience is the production of the commodity.

You're right that counteracting the effects of bourgeois education is an essential task for revolutionaries, but the changes have to run a lot deeper than teaching Marxist theory. They require an in-depth understanding of how the commodity form creates people in its own image, how education instills passivity and flattens curiosity; how education interacts with other vectors of bourgeois ideology like the family, the media, language. We have some general ideas, but overall we don't currently have this understanding.

We can't just change people's perspective on what "is the greatest ideology available." We have to provoke them to transcend ideological thinking altogether.

I believe adressing real communism and the defects of capitalism in the classroom will have quite some effect already. You and me both grew up in a capitalist society and in daily life we think and act like wage laborers. Yet we are communists. I think the understanding of a better system will already convert many to our cause. Let's say 2 - 4 percent of the future voters will be convinced. It's a start.

Of course you're partly right. The lifestyles that are promoted, especially by digital media and corporate life, work against us. I won't comment on the instilling passivity and flattening curiosity, as well as the effects of aspects of bourgeois ideology to education. I'm don't know much about that so I'll leave it to the experts. What I do know is that my personal way of thinking is quite passive as well. I read A and B, compare them and draw my conclusions, but I rarely think of creating C.

[NorwegianCommunist]

Basically, USA teaches mostly capitalism and not communism to kids/teens and even adults.
People grow up with that and don't have a chance to think diffrently! If you are a communist in USA you are not going to accomplish as much as you would, if you were a capitalist.

My schools book of social study and society are a bit of capitalism, but also socialism. Norway is a socialist country so we grow up with more info about several topics then being feed up by one.

[Lenina Rosenweg]

Hong Kong before 1997 or after? :lol:

Actually there is not much difference between Hong Kong under the British and Hong Kong under PRC rule. Both are ultra-capitalist undemocratic HK regimes. Indeed the PRC actually sees Hong Kong as something of a role model. HK was traditionally the closest any state got to pure capitalism, corporate taxes are very low. The state gets its revenues from real estate leasing, corporate high rises were built on Crown land. "Crown" ownership of land provided the basis for HK's free wheeling capitalism. The PRC sees this as a model for the mainland.

The PRC also has kept HK's Commonwealth preference system, South Asian immigration is easier than that of other countries I forget the details but under the British Empire people from Nepal who served in the Gurkhas could get permanent Hong Kong residency. The Chinese have kept this system.

The movie "Chungking Express" by Wan Kar Wai (although its over 10 years old) provides an interesting view of modern Hong Kong. Its named after a very trippy hostel I stayed at.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chungking_Express

[Omsk]

Norway is a socialist country


Its not a socialist country,its just rich compared to the capitalist hell that is Eastern Europe.

[eric922]

I agree about the U.S. education system and while college is better, you should still avoid economics classes if possible. They are pure Chicago School propaganda. On the bright side, my AP Western Civ. teacher in high school required us to read the Communist Manifesto since it is extremely important.

[GoddessCleoLover]

Back when I was in HS in the USA 40 years ago a teacher would have probably been fired for assigning the Manifesto.

[Vyacheslav Brolotov]

In another section, they talk about economic freedom and give an "Economic Freedom" index showing the countries in the world that are most "Free".


The chapter seems to have been written by the Heritage Foundation.

That Economic Freedom index is actually done by the Hertiage Foundation!!!

http://www.heritage.org/index/default

It is a bunch of bullshit, no question about it. Apparently, Cuba has even more economic freedom than Zimbabwe, a place where the government probably cannot even tax you. Oh, and Italy has a mostly unfree market system :confused:. I have the same thing in my economics textbook.

[Vyacheslav Brolotov]

Oh, and they also do teach some false stuff about socialism and communism in my school. One of the things they tried to teach us was that the Russian Revolution was not a popular uprising. Then how do you explain the over 4,000 peasant uprisings in only 1917 and the mass strike actions throughout the entire Union of nations? They also did not teach the difference between communism and socialism. Even worst, the textbook actually uses the Black Book of Communism to get figures on how many people died under socialist rule. That is not fair, because just for Stalin's Soviet Union, the estimates on how many people died range from 3.5 million and 60 million, yet they pick to present it as 60 million. They never talk about how many people die from global capitalism or American Imperialism (cough, 100 million every decade, cough, cough). They are liars and slaves of the U.S government's agenda of spreading blind patriotism and love for capitalism.

[gorillafuck]

the people that write economics textbooks aren't out to deliberately misguide people on karl marx. they are people who read these same things when they were in economics class.