Should we vote for Ron Paul ? In the name of human lives.

[AntifaZG]

Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing... If he, the guardian of capitalism does not make the US a better place, a lot more people will become more left-aware. I'm talking about tactical voting.

Also, voting for him could save lives.. he wants the US to pull out of NATO, and will pull back all soldiers, and cease hostility towards Iran and stop funding Israel.. he will stop the war fuel supply....

Think about it... we are talking about human lives here.. Economically, he is the ultimate anti-left but we should think how him winning could impact the world.

I personally do not vote, but I'm curious about this one.. no more wars !

[Art Vandelay]

Fuck voting and fuck Paul. He certainly would not be saving lives in his own back yard as people who cannot afford healthcare are left to die.

[cop an Attitude]

He also wants to make a impenetrable wall around the country and is a blatant racist.

“The Criminals who terrorize our cities - in riots and on every non-riot day - are not exclusively young black males, but they largely are. As children they are trained to hate whites, to believe that white oppression is responsible for all black ills, to fight the power, to steal and loot as much money from the white enemy as possible. Anything is justified against The Man.’" - Ron Paul

Now tell me how you can support this pig?

[Franz Fanonipants]

Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing...

restrict this dude

[cop an Attitude]

Here's another one

“I wouldn’t vote against getting rid of the Jim Crow laws.” - Ron Paul

[Os Cangaceiros]

Ron Paul reminds me of a kindly old grandparent, who'd you go visit in Ft. Myers Florida, and who'd feed you lemon cookies and tell boring stories about his time in The War.

Which is good enough for me. Ron Paul 2012 baby.

[socialistjustin]

Absolutely. Fuck the fact that he believes in extreme free market ideals. Fuck the fact that he believes in an extreme form of property rights. He wants to cut the defense budget so that's good enough for me!

[Искра]

This is going to be amusing thread :)

[Art Vandelay]

Ron Paul reminds me of a kindly old grandparent, who'd you go visit in Ft. Myers Florida, and who'd feed you lemon cookies and tell boring stories about his time in The War.

Which is good enough for me. Ron Paul 2012 baby.

Yeah but who also has the most racist shit come out of their mouth.

[Commissar Rykov]

Fuck that old racist cracka. We should kick his wonderbread teeth in.

[ВАЛТЕР]

Ron Paul doesn't have the power to do shit even if he is elected. With the amount of money that is generated from war, do you really think they would allow him to simply shut the war machine down? Before an action is done it has to go through congress, and believe me just about all of those senators are sponsored by Boeing, Lockheed Martin, etc. They aren't going to allow some guy to stop their cashflow. Not to mention the fact that the guy is a damn racist, reactionary, piece of shit of a human being.

[rundontwalk]

Mitt Romney strikes me as the form Satan took to get Robert Johnson to sell him his soul, but I'm not too big on Paul either.

[PC LOAD LETTER]

Another RP gem: "Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks."

Really?

[Franz Fanonipants]

Another RP gem: "Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks."

Really?

can i get a cite on this i need to troll a dude w/it

[Os Cangaceiros]

Fuck that old racist cracka. We should kick his wonderbread teeth in.

THAT'S RACIST! :ohmy:

[Marxaveli]

I think I'd rather vote for a cockroach.

[NewLeft]

Voting for Ron Paul will not end the wars.

[Krano]

Voting for Ron Paul will not end the wars.
Voting for Ron Paul won't change anything, it's funny seeing people hype him the same way they hyped Obama and look what happened.

[Commissar Rykov]

Voting for Ron Paul won't change anything, it's funny seeing people hype him the same way they hyped Obama and look what happened.

I find it more amusing that they champion a raving psychotic racist dipfuck to be honest. I mean if he had the sheets he would fit right in with the Klan and their bullshit they spout everyday.

[NewLeft]

I find it more amusing that they champion a raving psychotic racist dipfuck to be honest. I mean if he had the sheets he would fit right in with the Klan and their bullshit they spout everyday.

What! Ron Paul didn't write those racists comments, they were added in by his socialist editor. He swears! Oh and by the way, repeal the civil rights act, Ron Paul said so.

[~Spectre]

Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing... If he, the guardian of capitalism does not make the US a better place, a lot more people will become more left-aware. I'm talking about tactical voting.

Also, voting for him could save lives.. he wants the US to pull out of NATO, and will pull back all soldiers, and cease hostility towards Iran and stop funding Israel.. he will stop the war fuel supply....

Think about it... we are talking about human lives here.. Economically, he is the ultimate anti-left but we should think how him winning could impact the world.

I personally do not vote, but I'm curious about this one.. no more wars !

When my repcannon recharges, I'm going to put you into the red.

[Ocean Seal]

Defend teh Republic. Down with the unconstitutional 14th Amendment. The government is forcing whites to sit next to blacks at restaurants; what would George Washington do.
My name is Ron Paul and I approve this message.

[AntifaZG]

restrict this dude

Bringing socialism because of a failed capitalistic system is a bad thing ? Capitalism WILL FALL.. why not speed it up ?

[AntifaZG]

Defend teh Republic. Down with the unconstitutional 14th Amendment. The government is forcing whites to sit next to blacks at restaurants; what would George Washington do.
My name is Ron Paul and I approve this message.

There are plenty of videos about African Americans who support Ron Paul. He's against the drug war and the imprisonment of non-violent drug offenders, which affects blacks the most.

[Zukunftsmusik]

Bringing socialism because of a failed capitalistic system is a bad thing ? Capitalism WILL FALL.. why not speed it up ?

So you seriously think that voting for Ron Paul will bring about the revolution? I doubt everyone will go "wow, let's become socialists!" just if we get Ron Paul in the white house

[Crux]

Yes there are people lured to support ron paul, against their own interest, in fact I think most who support him are. In the last election paul said, after he to noones suprise had failed to gain the republican noomination, that he supported nader, mckinney of the green party, barr of the libertarian party and baldwin of the constitution party. However when push came to shove and he actually had to endorse someone who did he go for? Why, the far right racist constiution party. Of course. Oh and they are "anti-war", or rather isolationist, too. I suppose you will be asking us to support them next.

[Per Levy]

There are plenty of videos about African Americans who support Ron Paul. He's against the drug war and the imprisonment of non-violent drug offenders, which affects blacks the most.

to my knowledge he also wants to radicaly cut wellfare and stuff like it, wich will affect poor people, many of them african-american even more to say at least.


Also, voting for him could save lives.. he wants the US to pull out of NATO, and will pull back all soldiers, and cease hostility towards Iran and stop funding Israel.. he will stop the war fuel supply....

why are you so sure about that? i mean obama wanted to bring change and hope and the public option, well all of that is gone too. wars still will go on anyway with or without the usa. and with his want(and here i belive him) to cut wellfare and stuff, people will suffer and many will loose their lifes because of this.


Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing... If he, the guardian of capitalism does not make the US a better place, a lot more people will become more left-aware. I'm talking about tactical voting.

hardly, the workers and the poor will just be under a lot more preassure and will spend much more time to survive. some maybe become leftist through this most wont and just try to survive and get by. my opinion.

[Tim Cornelis]

I would vote for Ron Paul if I was American because I am tired of arguing whether free market capitalism can work or not on the internet.

And that's sufficient reason enough for me.

[the last donut of the night]

http://www.itinfomag.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/Loony_Bin.jpg

welcome to revleft, aka the loony bin

[RadioRaheem84]

Good god, I cannot believe Ron Paul is the only thing newly political people think of as a viable alternative!

People really think this dude is revolutionary. Comrades, we have a lot of work to do.

[Kornilios Sunshine]

Voting capitalism? No thanks I can find other ways to feel I am a jerk.

[Franz Fanonipants]

Bringing socialism because of a failed capitalistic system is a bad thing ? Capitalism WILL FALL.. why not speed it up ?

yes let us risk blacks being murdered in the streets for being welfare state leeches just to HASTEN THE REVOLUTION

[TheGodlessUtopian]

He's against the drug war and the imprisonment of non-violent drug offenders, which affects blacks the most.

Source please!

[Franz Fanonipants]

Source please!

no i mean that's p. true

[Metacomet]

Restrict OP please.

[El Louton]

Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing... If he, the guardian of capitalism does not make the US a better place, a lot more people will become more left-aware. I'm talking about tactical voting.

Also, voting for him could save lives.. he wants the US to pull out of NATO, and will pull back all soldiers, and cease hostility towards Iran and stop funding Israel.. he will stop the war fuel supply....

Think about it... we are talking about human lives here.. Economically, he is the ultimate anti-left but we should think how him winning could impact the world.

I personally do not vote, but I'm curious about this one.. no more wars !

Sorry darling, but I think you are lost! Were you looking for this website?

http://www.teaparty.org/

[AntifaZG]

When my repcannon recharges, I'm going to put you into the red.

thanks... solidarity to you also

[blah]

I agree with the OP. Ron Paul is the best of the worst, and when we cannot pick something good, we must pick the least bad one. If not Ron, then who? Find another candidate which has a chance to win, and wants to end wars (both foreign and war on drugs), and we can talk. Until then, RON PAUL 2012! :thumbup1::D


yes let us risk blacks being murdered in the streets for being welfare state leeches just to HASTEN THE REVOLUTION

Yes, because if Ron Paul gets elected, people will start to murder blacks in the streets for being "welfare state leeches". Now they dont do it, because Obama protects them. :D
Do you seriously believe this bullshit?

[AntifaZG]

Source please!

Google:
US: Drug Arrests Skewed by Race

[W1N5T0N]

This guy would not even be a valid candidate for the nationalist democratic party of germany - he is just too embarassing!


fuck american politics. i mean europe - pretty bad sometimes.

But when it gets bad in america, you get ppl like RP - CLUSTERRFFFUUUUCK

[AntifaZG]

So its true... rev-left truly is a den of narrow minded idiots... My simple idea concerning tactical voting made me look like a tea partier... how slick of you comrades... perfect example of the straw man fallacy

[Franz Fanonipants]

So its true... rev-left truly is a den of narrow minded idiots... My simple idea concerning tactical voting made me look like a tea partier... how slick of you comrades... perfect example of the straw man fallacy

stick around bro

[AntifaZG]

stick around bro

you want me to stick around but thanked the poster who wanted me restricted ? thanks bro

[Franz Fanonipants]

you want me to stick around but thanked the poster who wanted me restricted ? thanks bro

shit, i want you restricted too. it would give you an opportunity to not be a dumbass.

e: smokin weed and thinking about "The gubmint" does not make for a political praxis comrade. ron paul is a monster.

[AntifaZG]

Fuck voting and fuck Paul. He certainly would not be saving lives in his own back yard as people who cannot afford healthcare are left to die.

Where is your solidarity towards the middle-eastern people ? I think they have been harassed enough...

[AntifaZG]

shit, i want you restricted too. it would give you an opportunity to not be a dumbass.

for suggesting something out of the ordinary ?

[Franz Fanonipants]

for suggesting something out of the ordinary ?

for suggesting something reactionary

[Franz Fanonipants]

Where is your solidarity towards the middle-eastern people ? I think they have been harassed enough...

i agree which is why i think that the free market that resulted in their being invaded is not going to subside when you elect a worshipper of the free market

[Lucretia]

It would absolutely be counter productive to support either faction of the bourgeois party, either in primaries or in general elections. You don't create revolutionary situations by voting to make the economy shit. If a shitty economy created a revolutionary situation, then we'd be in one right now. Revolutionary situations are created by organizing the working class for the task of self-government.

[W1N5T0N]

ok look antifaZG.
i see the point you were trying to make about tactical voting,
yet only voting for somebody because he is a dumbass and will get your cause stronger is not the way voting is supposed to work.

:cool:

and try seeing it from OTHER peoples perspective too.
if you are a young black male on this forum, this kind of talk could easily make you look like an RP fan - which I hope youre not?

[AntifaZG]

ok look antifaZG.
i see the point you were trying to make about tactical voting,
yet only voting for somebody because he is a dumbass and will get your cause stronger is not the way voting is supposed to work.

:cool:

and try seeing it from OTHER peoples perspective too.
if you are a young black male on this forum, this kind of talk could easily make you look like an RP fan - which I hope youre not?

I'm a leftie but I figured that under him people will see that capitalism is a problem... I apologize for my free thinking

[Franz Fanonipants]

I'm a leftie but I figured that under him people will see that capitalism is a problem... I apologize for my free thinking

its not that your thinking is free, its that its faulty

[El Louton]

Sometimes tactical voting is a good idea. But given the consequences that he could and might win. You would be screwed. Your better off voting for the third party if you want tactical voting to succeed.

[IndependentCitizen]

People who believe in absolutely minimal capitalist government are truly lazy fuckers...they just want to be paid well, and do virtually nothing then blame opposition...

[Thirsty Crow]

As I've gathered from bits here and there, Paul is supposed to support an end to American military adventures, cutting the defense budget, and closing off the southern border by a wall. Which sounds like a new American isolationism.

Now, one should not pose the question whether this is acceptable for people self-identifying as leftists to vote for Paul (which implies a possibility of a support campaign on behalf of various orgs and individuals, in whichever ways conducted). The right question is whether the American capitalist class can "afford" such a relative isolationism. And of course, when observed from the perspective of capital accumulation, which propels interantional politics, the only possible answer is a resolute "no". Then, the following question should regard the possible consequences of Paul's presidency.

And I'll let American comrades discuss that. What I find unbelievable is that people still think that all sorts of policies are an option, as if there are no concrete economic constraints on a (bourgeois) party's/candidate's policies.

[Yuppie Grinder]

Working people who think that they are not free because of the regulations on capitalism are... silly. Libertarians who think that capitalism is sustainable without government regulation are even sillier. One of my sisters is a Paulite, another one is a primitivist hippie.

[Inner Peace]

Fuck Democratic System!
Fuck Libertarians!
Fuck Voting!

Do you realize now that all the politics are asslicking so that they are going to brainwash some stupid people to vote for them,and then when they will come to "power" they Wont DO NOTHING!

Each one can promise everything but in reality they cant do nothing.

[AntifaZG]

Fuck Democratic System!
Fuck Libertarians!
Fuck Voting!

why fuck the democratic system ? would you prefer a monarchy ?

[Thirsty Crow]

for suggesting something out of the ordinary ?
You might as well suggest a united front with ultra-nationalists who advocate retaining labour rights and aspects of a welfare state - for a particular ethnic working class (you might be aware that here where we live some ultra-nationalist parties have been running on a platform similar to that one, albeit with no impact). Though, of course, such politics would represent either a disastrous blow to proletarian internationalism and a move towards nationalist positions, or at best, a terrible confusion within communist ranks. Your proposition is also a product of confusion - imlying that advocating Ron Paul means saving human lives, while disregarding the more or less obvious unviability of realizing these policies from the perspective of capital, and on the other hand disregarding the disastrous effects on the working class in the US.

[Искра]

why fuck the democratic system ? would you prefer a monarchy ?
No - theocracy.

Just jokeing. Democratic system is just an ideological concept which makes capitalist system look like sucess of "civilisation" and it's denying any alternative as totalitarian, un-democratic etc. What we want is dictatorship of proletariat.

[L.A.P.]

Ron Paul reminds me of a kindly old grandparent, who'd you go visit in Ft. Myers Florida, and who'd feed you lemon cookies and tell boring stories about his time in The War.

Which is good enough for me. Ron Paul 2012 baby.

I live about 20-40 minutes away from there, just wanted to say that.

[ВАЛТЕР]

You know, I made a similar thread a while ago on the subject of a Ron Paul victory. However, I worded myself far better and did not call on anybody to assist in his victory.

We came to the consensus that we do not need to wait for things to get worse before they get better. We also concluded that a Ron Paul victory, would only strengthen the Democrats as the whole two party system is the only options the public has and would not radicalize and revolt, but rather simply move to the next party. As has been the case thus far.

My thread (notice how I did not announce a call to actively support Ron Paul as you did, but rather suggested a possible course the US would take if he was elected. We concluded that it would most likely not radicalize the working class, and left it at that.):

http://www.revleft.com/vb/good-thing-if-t161224/index.html?t=161224

[Anarchostalinist]

The OP must die. Come the revolution we'll be sending people down the salt mines for less!

[rylasasin]

It's not like voting for paul will do anything anyway, since it's pretty obvious that he's not going to get the nomination even if he could.

Semi related note: It really pisses me off that the world union of desists yahoo group has fallen into such a lovefest with that guy. So much for a faith based on reason eh?

[W1N5T0N]

Ive had enough of this shitty arguing and "tac voting" rethoric.

why the fuck would you vote for somebody who stands against all that we are fighting for????? i mean, revleft is REALLY divided on most stuff but this is one issue i imagine everyone agrees on:

PEOPLE LIKE RON PAUL SHOULD NOT BE VOTED BY ANY MEANS POSSIBLE -

rather, go and have urself a nice demo/fashbash,

but seriously.

why is your name even antifa? RP is pretyt fash to me in most of his stuff.
so voting fash makes you antifash?

didnt think so brother.
now, before you call US narrow minded morons or whatever, closely examine your own political views, the views of our opposition (rightwing cappies) and then come back and ask yourself:


ARE WE REALLY GOING TO VOTE FOR THIS DUDE?

(even if solely hypothetical, considering a pretty big chunk of RL is not us citizen).



thankyou, and good luck.

[S.Artesian]

You wanna vote for guy who thinks that racial discrimination, nightrider assaults on people of color etc. are fundamental aspects of freedom?

Should be enough to get you restricted, I would think.

[AntifaZG]

You wanna vote for guy who thinks that racial discrimination, nightrider assaults on people of color etc. are fundamental aspects of freedom?


Link or it didn't happen.. and give me a good source ,not a Stalinist blog or smtn similar.

[AntifaZG]

Ive had enough of this shitty arguing and "tac voting" rethoric.

why the fuck would you vote for somebody who stands against all that we are fighting for????? i mean, revleft is REALLY divided on most stuff but this is one issue i imagine everyone agrees on:

PEOPLE LIKE RON PAUL SHOULD NOT BE VOTED BY ANY MEANS POSSIBLE -

rather, go and have urself a nice demo/fashbash,

but seriously.

why is your name even antifa? RP is pretyt fash to me in most of his stuff.
so voting fash makes you antifash?

didnt think so brother.
now, before you call US narrow minded morons or whatever, closely examine your own political views, the views of our opposition (rightwing cappies) and then come back and ask yourself:


ARE WE REALLY GOING TO VOTE FOR THIS DUDE?

(even if solely hypothetical, considering a pretty big chunk of RL is not us citizen).



thankyou, and good luck.

If his victory means paving the road to socialism then yes, he should be an option. We all agree capitalism will fall.. I repeat again, why not speed shit up ? If Ron Paul fails the masses will wake up.

Oh and I'm an anarchist-pacifist

Stop thinking about your ass and start thinking about the MILLIONS OF MIDDLE EASTERN whose life depends on him. No more wars !

[AntifaZG]

No - theocracy.

Just jokeing. Democratic system is just an ideological concept which makes capitalist system look like sucess of "civilisation" and it's denying any alternative as totalitarian, un-democratic etc. What we want is dictatorship of proletariat.

Could you tell me a little about the difference between the democratic system and ate the dictatorship of the proletariat ? Is there a difference ? Both cases include the people picking their leader....

[Искра]

Point of proletarian dictatorship is that proletariat becomes rulling class. There's no voting for people and different programs, because there's only one Party with their program - how to reach communism. In "democratic" systems you can pick different representatives from different parties, but their politics is in the end the same - to keep capital safe.

[AntifaZG]

Point of proletarian dictatorship is that proletariat becomes rulling class. There's no voting for people and different programs, because there's only one Party with their program - how to reach communism. In "democratic" systems you can pick different representatives from different parties, but their politics is in the end the same - to keep capital safe.

Thanks

[DaringMehring]

Stop thinking about your ass and start thinking about the MILLIONS OF MIDDLE EASTERN whose life depends on him. No more wars !


You could easily make the same argument, for voting for Obama. In fact, the stronger version of your argument is to vote for Obama.

1) Obama will be slightly less warlike, or slightly more skilled in his militarism, than the Republican candidate. Gingrich, Romney, etc. have slightly more of a "kill-em-all" attitude than the slicker Obama.

2) Ron Paul has no chance of winning.

3) Obama has a chance of winning.

Therefore... a vote for Obama is a vote that could save many lives in the Middle East.

Do you see why this argument is rejected by most revolutionary leftists?

Once you understand why revolutionary leftists reject voting for Obama, you will see why we also wouldn't vote for Ron Paul.

[Franz Fanonipants]

Link or it didn't happen.. and give me a good source ,not a Stalinist blog or smtn similar.

this is the best thanksgiving gift ever

[S.Artesian]

Link or it didn't happen.. and give me a good source ,not a Stalinist blog or smtn similar.

Ron Paul's Political Report in 1992: "Order was only restored in LA when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks...."

More at: http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/88421/ron-pauls-racism

Guy's a racist, has been a racist, will be a racist.

And this nonsense that he's going to prevent future wars....right, sure he will, like Johnson kept Goldwater from getting us involved in Vietnam; like Carter didn't get us involved in Afghanistan; like Obama was going to end the war in Iraq, close Guantanamo etc etc etc.

And this:


If his victory means paving the road to socialism then yes, he should be an option. We all agree capitalism will fall.. I repeat again, why not speed shit up ? If Ron Paul fails the masses will wake up.


is nothing but another iteration of the famous CP "tactic"-- "Nach Hitler, uns

[AntifaZG]

this is the best thanksgiving gift ever

Why are you trolling this tread all the time ? Go away and stop being rude

[Franz Fanonipants]

Why are you trolling this tread all the time ? Go away and stop being rude


Ron Paul's Political Report in 1992: "Order was only restored in LA when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks...."

More at: http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/88421/ron-pauls-racism

the national republic is nothing near a stalinist blog. that is the joke comrade.

[Raúl Duke]

Ron Paul reminds me of a kindly old grandparent, who'd you go visit in Ft. Myers Florida,


I live about 20-40 minutes away from there, just wanted to say that.

I live there...
The local Occupy is seemingly dominated by Ron Paulites, if not than those Venus Project people who might have a good idea but have no idea how to realize their ideal society. Also the majority are so painfully pacifist.
They're (the Paulites) the most hilariously politically ignorant and/or narrow-minded people.

They focus on all the interesting nice things that Ron Paul speaks about (End Wars, End corporate subsidies, End the drug war, etc) yet are curiously ignorant on his economic policies and other negative shit.
What makes it so amusing is they believe they're so politically clever and "smarter than the rest of the sheeple" all the while they have drank the Ron Paul Revolution kool-aid and really know nothing about their preferred candidate.


Oh and I'm an anarchist-pacifist

*facepalm* :rolleyes:

grow up
we're not going to create a new society by holding hands and singing kumbaya with wall st, banksters, and cops.

[AntifaZG]

Ron Paul's Political Report in 1992: "Order was only restored in LA when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks...."

More at: http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/88421/ron-pauls-racism

Guy's a racist, has been a racist, will be a racist.

And this nonsense that he's going to prevent future wars....right, sure he will, like Johnson kept Goldwater from getting us involved in Vietnam; like Carter didn't get us involved in Afghanistan; like Obama was going to end the war in Iraq, close Guantanamo etc etc etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKBlk1Vpeuw

1:30 "I didn't write those letters"

Whats not important is the color of someones skin but his character - Dr. Paul

So enough with the racist BS

[AntifaZG]

*facepalm* :rolleyes:

grow up
we're not going to create a new society by holding hands and singing kumbaya with wall st, banksters, and cops.

What should we do ? act like the naxalites in India ? murder police officers ?

[S.Artesian]

Right, he didn't write them, they just appeared in his political newsletter under his name. How about these: http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/09/07/10-quotes-that-make-ron-paul-sound-racist/ (http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/09/07/10-quotes-that-make-ron-paul-sound-racist) .He didn't say those things either.

As for the crap that he didn't write them-- that's just what that is crap-- it appeared in his newsletter, unsigned. When an unsigned, original article is published, that means it is the work of either the editor or the identified sponsor of the publication. Quit trying to camouflage your tea-partyism

http://www.tnr.com/article/politics/angry-white-mantp://

[Искра]

What should we do ? act like the naxalites in India ? murder police officers ?Hahahahaha It's odd that you call yourself AntigaZG :D What would your commesars from Young AntiFascists say on this one? :)

[Commissar Rykov]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKBlk1Vpeuw

1:30 "I didn't write those letters"

Whats not important is the color of someones skin but his character - Dr. Paul

So enough with the racist BS
Sure he didn't that is why he is the preferred canidate of Stormfront because he has nothing in common with them. He even openly accepts donations from Don Black and Stormfront. So kindly fuck off.

[Nox]

Ron Paul is a fucking douchebag, if he comes to power he will probably be assassinated or sumut.

[Raúl Duke]

What should we do ? act like the naxalites in India ? murder police officers ?

All I'm saying is that violence is just a tactic, like any other, and at some point we will probably have to consider taking violent actions to assure the end of capitalism. Violence has its right place and time. I'm not personally suggesting that a leftist organization should solely do violence 24/7, however on the flip-side I don't suggest that we stick solely to non-violence. Revolutions aren't dinner parties. A blind principled approach to solely non-violence is silly, dogmatic, and ineffective.

[socialistjustin]

Yep, if Ron Paul brings about extreme austerity so the market can work then the masses will wake up. This is hilarious because Spain has 21% unemployment and guess what? The Conservatives won an absolute majority. So yeah, complete failure doesn't mean shit. Revolutions won't happen because some dipshit makes things worse, if this was the case the entire continent of Europe would be called "Revolutionary States of Europe" or something by now.

[AntifaZG]

So it's agreed.. lets vote for Obama and watch stormfront membership skyrocket like in 2008... Lets risk another world war since Obama is militarizing EU's east border.... So many selfish people here

[Crux]

If his victory means paving the road to socialism then yes, he should be an option. We all agree capitalism will fall.. I repeat again, why not speed shit up ? If Ron Paul fails the masses will wake up.

Oh and I'm an anarchist-pacifist

Stop thinking about your ass and start thinking about the MILLIONS OF MIDDLE EASTERN whose life depends on him. No more wars !

whatever you are smoking I want some. Oh it's koolaid? Oh...I think I'll pass then.

[La Peur Rouge]

So it's agreed.. lets vote for Obama and watch stormfront membership skyrocket like in 2008... Lets risk another world war since Obama is militarizing EU's east border.... So many selfish people here

I've got a better idea. Don't vote.

Was there a single person that suggested "vote for Obama"?

[X5N]

I used to be a huge Paultard before I went from libertarian to left-anarchist.

And how the hell do you get negative rep?

[Crux]

So it's agreed.. lets vote for Obama and watch stormfront membership skyrocket like in 2008... Lets risk another world war since Obama is militarizing EU's east border.... So many selfish people here

you must be in the wrong forum. If anyone came in here suggesting a vote for obama they would probably get an as friendly greeting as you have.

[Crux]

I used to be a huge Paultard before I went from libertarian to left-anarchist.

And how the hell do you get negative rep?
how about that time he was a huge paultard?
The key words in your statement is "used to be". That is not true of our friend here.

[DaringMehring]

you must be in the wrong forum. If anyone came in here suggesting a vote for obama they would probably get an as friendly greeting as you have.

Yeah.

This person comes into a forum of revolutionary leftists who generally don't vote.

And asks them to vote for a right-wing candidate, who is famous for being the most berserk capitalism booster of the whole field.

Clear from person's references to "Dr. Paul" that he/she's a card-carrying Paulista. Just doing the Jehovah's Witness work of the Ron Paul "revolution" I suppose. Or whatever "revolution" you get from electing a capitalist ideologue.

[Burkland]

Well, I used to support Ron Paul until I just realized he was an extermist Tea Partier pretending to be a moderate. He said capitalism would fix the African situation and that the poor should be treated like trash.

[Renegade Saint]

Point of proletarian dictatorship is that proletariat becomes rulling class. There's no voting for people and different programs, because there's only one Party with their program - how to reach communism. In "democratic" systems you can pick different representatives from different parties, but their politics is in the end the same - to keep capital safe.


Thanks

Before you thank him you should be aware that this is one (Stalinist) view of what the Dictatorship of the Proletariat means. There are others (I'd post a link here if I had enough posts).

[Crux]

Yeah.

This person comes into a forum of revolutionary leftists who generally don't vote.

And asks them to vote for a right-wing candidate, who is famous for being the most berserk capitalism booster of the whole field.

Clear from person's references to "Dr. Paul" that he/she's a card-carrying Paulista. Just doing the Jehovah's Witness work of the Ron Paul "revolution" I suppose. Or whatever "revolution" you get from electing a capitalist ideologue.
I vote. I would just never ever vote for paul. Or obama. I mean where the hell does he think he is if he had us pegged for obama voters? Not that I live in the US. But still.

[the Leftâ„¢]

Yes, he is free-market proponent.. but that does not need to be a bad thing... If he, the guardian of capitalism does not make the US a better place, a lot more people will become more left-aware. I'm talking about tactical voting.

Also, voting for him could save lives.. he wants the US to pull out of NATO, and will pull back all soldiers, and cease hostility towards Iran and stop funding Israel.. he will stop the war fuel supply....

Think about it... we are talking about human lives here.. Economically, he is the ultimate anti-left but we should think how him winning could impact the world.

I personally do not vote, but I'm curious about this one.. no more wars !


:laugh:

[TheGodlessUtopian]

Voting for Ron Paul would be a lot like mutilation...AKA: why would you do that to yourself? More akin to repeatedly smashing your head against the wall and continuously expecting it to feel better with each smash if anything.

Point is: voting is worthless and fuck "Mr.Paul."

[The Young Pioneer]

Isn't it said that a true Marxist hopes for things to get much much worse within the current governmental system so that a revolution will happen sooner/be viewed as more necessary to the masses?

I think (read "hope") that's all the OP is getting at...Though I doubt voting Ron Paul would be enough to cause such. lol

[L.A.P.]

I live there...
The local Occupy is seemingly dominated by Ron Paulites, if not than those Venus Project people who might have a good idea but have no idea how to realize their ideal society. Also the majority are so painfully pacifist.
They're (the Paulites) the most hilariously politically ignorant and/or narrow-minded people.

They focus on all the interesting nice things that Ron Paul speaks about (End Wars, End corporate subsidies, End the drug war, etc) yet are curiously ignorant on his economic policies and other negative shit.
What makes it so amusing is they believe they're so politically clever and "smarter than the rest of the sheeple" all the while they have drank the Ron Paul Revolution kool-aid and really know nothing about their preferred candidate.

Damn, my mom wanted to go to Occupy Ft. Myers but I decided I'd rather do my school work and smoke weed/hang out instead. My mom was pretty dissappointed I didn't want to go but I had a feeling it would be really boring and I would just stand around awkwardly. I guess I made the right decision but is it still going on? Was there any leftist presence at all?

[S.Artesian]

Isn't it said that a true Marxist hopes for things to get much much worse within the current governmental system so that a revolution will happen sooner/be viewed as more necessary to the masses?

I think (read "hope") that's all the OP is getting at...Though I doubt voting Ron Paul would be enough to cause such. lol

No, that's not true. A true Marxist doesn't "hope" for anything. A true Marxist understands where capitalism is going, what its class, the capitalist class must do, and what the workers will be compelled to do to emancipate all from the domination of capital.

Supporting right wing nut jobs who think the world went bad when segregation was abolished and then went worse when the convertibility of the dollar to gold was suspended does not qualify as one of those things workers must, should do or even consider doing.

[Martin Blank]

Ron Paul is a libertarian fascist. His goal, and the goal of his petty-bourgeois "revolution", is to "save capitalism" by radically reactionary means -- including the use of force and violence. He not only opposes any kind of federal civil rights legislation, he also advocates the elimination of any kind of social welfare programs (including Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid) and the abolition of any federal health and safety agencies for food, medications, durable goods, workplaces, the environment, etc. Everything is to be left up to the "market", which really means that the capitalists are able to do anything they want, and any opposition to the capitalists will be forcefully suppressed by the state (and private "security" à la Blackwater/Xe).

The "make it worse to make it better" dogma has been proven false by history. Revolutions and upheavals come after economic and/or political crises have already bottomed out, and have begun to recover (even if it is ever so slightly).

If Ron Paul were to make it all the way and become the Republican nominee, it would be because he embodied what the reactionary-corporatist faction of the ruling classes wanted, and voting for him would be voting for the most brutal and barbaric faction of American capitalism.

And with that, the fun is over. Go discuss something else. Thread closed.