What is the largest ethnic goup without their own country?

[Moskitto]

Does anyone know what the largest ethnic group without their own state?

[RedCeltic]

According to the 2000 census the largest ethnic group in the United States if labeled as ‘White’… and of that group… there are more females than males. However this is the nation as a whole, and statistics may differ when looking at individual states… NY for example is more ethnic diverse than may other states.

[Moskitto]

I was actually talking about the group with the most numbers without their own country rather than state as in US. it's just that people refer to the area where this group comes from as a country.

Anyone know?

[Guest]

Most Indigenous tribes; Native Americans particularly came into mind, are a large ethnic group without their own state, though certain tribes have partial self-determination.

[Moskitto]

surprisingly enough it's not them (although they're probably second) the first group is heavily distributed across Europe.

[RedCeltic]

Sorry I totally misunderstood that question there... lol

(Edited by RedCeltic at 3:10 pm on Oct. 31, 2001)

[CommieBastard]

the Rom peoples?

[Moskitto]

nope.

I'll give you a clue. They were in the news about a year ago because many of them were protesting outside an Embasy in London.

[CommieBastard]

Tibetans?!? yet they arent heavily distributed about europe...
the only ethnic minority that is that i can think of is Africans, but they have plenty of states of their own...
well, nope, completely stumped here :/

[Moskitto]

Ok i've got you all. The awnser is...

Kurds.

Many of them began protests outside the Greek embasy in London after the Greek government helped capture the leader of the Kurdish Workers Party (PKK).

[Kez]

I knew that :D

There like in Turkey Iraq all over middle east in Germany and Holland and they just get the shit kicked outta them everywhere. Which is nice.

Freedom for the People of ..............., The Kurds
Comrade Kamo

[CommieBastard]

The Kurds? are you sure the Rom aren't a larger group?

[RedCeltic]

Does anyone know what the population figures are for the Kurds vrs the Rom?

(Edited by RedCeltic at 12:58 pm on Nov. 1, 2001)

[CommieBastard]

the figure i just looked up for kurds said 17.6 million worldwide...
but i am finding it hard to pinpoint a number for Gypsies...
It looks to be somewhere around 15 million, but numbers for them are difficult to make...

[libereco]

the kurds were the first ethnik group i thought off.

they also protested in front of embasys throughout germany after Öcalan (no idea how his name is spelled) was captured.

by the way, does anybody know what happened to him?
If he was executed I missed it.

[Moskitto]

I heard that the European Court of Human Rights wanted to review the case and wouldn't let the sentance be carried out.

But the main problem with the Kurds isn't that they should have independance but that they don't even officially exist according to the Turkish constitution.

[SellasieI]

the native americans probably would be first if we werent all slaughtered, its amazing how few there are these days ...

[Moskitto]

Quote: from SellasieI on 6:21 am on Nov. 2, 2001
the native americans probably would be first if we werent all slaughtered, its amazing how few there are these days ...

probably true. Have you seen the estimates of the death toll 1500-1900? it's estimated to be around 100 million by some and the entire populations of several islands such as Haiti were whiped out..

[TNapoleon]

When you say native americans, remember it's not just those who lived in what we now call USA. Five hundred years ago, there were 5,000,000 indians in Brazil; there are less than 200,000 now.

Not to mention Incas, Aztecs and all the other civilizations slaughtered in such a short time...

I think there are more than 20 million kurds in Turkey, Iraq and Syria. IIRC, 12-15 million roms live in Europe. There are approx 5 million people in Tibet, many of whom are not really tibetans (they were brought by Mao). I'd say there are 3.5 million tibetans.

[gogo gomez]

Quote: from Moskitto on 8:19 pm on Oct. 31, 2001
Does anyone know what the largest ethnic group without their own state?


yeah! LEFTIES! HAW HAW!

[Moskitto]

yeah! LEFTIES! HAW HAW!

They're not an ethnic group though, But I heard that there's 4 million Muslims who consider themselve Socialists, 4 million Americans who consider themselves Socialists and 8 million who consider themselves Progressives.

But then again no one's going to say that we haven't got our own country because they'll just say, China.

[ShadowOfGuest]

Cuba?

[Guest]

i didnt read the whole thread so i apoligize if someone already said this but what about the kurds.

[Moskitto]

i didnt read the whole thread so i apoligize if someone already said this but what about the kurds.

That's allright. and you're correct.

[celticsocialist]

It doesn`t quite reach millions but the Irish in the North of Ireland are an ethnic group.

[gogo gomez]

Quote: from Moskitto on 9:32 pm on Nov. 13, 2001

yeah! LEFTIES! HAW HAW!

They're not an ethnic group though, But I heard that there's 4 million Muslims who consider themselve Socialists, 4 million Americans who consider themselves Socialists and 8 million who consider themselves Progressives.

But then again no one's going to say that we haven't got our own country because they'll just say, China.


NEITHER ARE HOMOSEXUALS!!!

[gogo gomez]

seriously, thanks for the information it is facinating "the Kurds" who knew?

[Maaja]

Maybe Kurds, Assyrians, Uyghurs

[ShadowOfGuest]

CelticSocialist, the people of the ethnicity known as Irish have a country, it's called Ireland.

[celticsocialist]

They have only part of a country. As long as the british occupation is in force Ireland is not the 32 counties it rightly should be.

[Guest]

no, i think you'll find it's impossible to have 'part of a country', it's either a country or it isn't. Your expanstionist desires are no different than those of the NAZIs when they tried to take the parts of Czeckoslovakia which had ethnic germans in it. Or in fact their conquering of Austria.
The IRA are imperialists who wish to conquer more land for themselves, whiel selling out on any kind of principles they might claim to have. They are not socialist, for if they were they would try to make ireland socialist, instead of trying to conquer more land. The IRA and all other such organisations (like the RIRA) are nationalist and socialist, and we all know what THAT means....

[Moskitto]

I think the blame for the problems in Northern Ireland are the result of the Highland clearances.

That's where most of the protestants in Ireland are desended from

Then again there was a pope in 13 someodd who declared that ireland was the property of England.

[celticsocialist]

No, I think you will find that you can have part of a country. Like Britain has Ulster. My desire is not for Ireland to take over parts of other countries but to take back what is their land.
Ulster is Irish. The fact that it has more brits in it does not make it right for Britain to claim it as British.
If I broke in to your home and moved my family in would it eventually belong to me? Well it is the same idea. For you to compare this to the Nazis is unbelievable.
I have not mentioned the IRA and certainly never claimed they are socialist.
It is very honourable of you to want to save ulster from imperialists. Because every one knows that Britain has no time for imperialism.
The IRA have one goal, to reunite Eire. No one thinks they are then going to govern the country.
I really cannot believe some of the comments you have come up with. If it is either a country or isn`t what does that make Scotland,Wales or England.
Moskitto, you have a good point but I think alot of Scots that moved to Ulster were also from Ayrshire and the south of Scotland.

Go on home British soldiers go on home...

[Guest]

no, you cannot have 'part of a country'. You can own illegitimate territories, but i think you will find that the people of northern ireland don't even want to be part eire.
It does not have 'Brits' in it, as there is no such ethnicity as brits. It has Irish people in it. Irish people who want to be part of the multi-national organisation called Britain.
Actually, ever heard of squatter's rights?
If you do occupy a set of land owned by someone else for a length of time, and they do not reoccupy the land, it does in fact become your property.
I think a few hundred years qualifies.
You don't mention the IRA, but you insinuate them by spurting their doctrine.

Yes, i do fear for the people of Ulster as far as imperialists goes.
And no, I am not, as you seem to beleive, Britain. Nor am i, in fact, a british patriot. Nor do i in fact beleive in the validity in any terms of nations. They are artificial boundaries set up in the mind. You show a very primitive form of nationalism, in which you seem to have this peculiar beleif that certain ethnicities have rights to certain lands. All men as brothers have all rights to all lands.

As for the IRA's cause, they claim to be socialist, they have a legitimate political wing and they call themselves revolutionary. Their cause as you identify it is exactly why they are not these things. They should seek to change the governance of their country, instead of seeking to expand it's borders.

And my comments? i think it's perfectly legitimate to call nationalist socialists NAZIs, because thats what NAZI stands for, or didnt you know that?

Scotland, Wales and England? Non-entities that exist only in mind and in the actions of men. All of which (as institutions) deserve to be destroyed, as does Eire. I would not condone any killing in the name of those 'nations' either.

And yes, British soldiers should go home, but what is their home? As i have already said, all land is everyone's, unless you're a nationalist socialist. Are you? If not, then anywhere they go is rightfully their home.

[celticsocialist]

The people in the North of Ireland who dont want to be part of Eire are british not Irish. I suggest you tell people in certain parts of West Belfast they are Irish and see the reaction you get.
As for squatters land. The Irish have never left the north and never will.
The only thing the IRA are really fighting for is to remove the British from Ireland. And I do not show a very primitive form of nationalism as I am not Irish and at no point have claimed to be.
Yes all men should have rights to all land. Just as wee girls should have the right to walk through the front gate of their school. But a nation should have self determination and your arguement that after a certain amount of time this land can`t be considered Irish is ridiculous.
The IRA are seeking to change the governance of their country.They are seeking to change it from a british governmet to an Irish government.

Tiocfaidh ar la
ALE

[CommieBastard]

There is no such ethnicity as 'British'.

Yes, wee girls should have the right to wlak through a gate to school, but people completely unrelated to something should have the right to not be blown up for it.

No nation should have self-determination, because nations are an invented fable that the capitalist overlord uses to control the masses.
Ofcourse it can't be considered Irish, in the same way no land can be considered belonging to a nation.
Actually, i will think you will find that in Northern Ireland they have their own governing assembly, which works in co-operation with both the British government and the Eire government.

However, thats still shite, because it is a 'liberal democracy' (i use the term to refer to that kind of society which PRETENDS to be liberal and democratic, but which isnt) and what would the IRA rpelace it with? shock! another 'liberal democracy'.

It matters not to me what the ethnicity of the people sitting in a liberal democratic government are, it is evil, wrong, and needs destruction.

[celticsocialist]

Commiebastard if nationality is an invented fable then so to is ethnicity.
I do not support all of the IRAs tactics ie the bombing of unrelated people. I do agree with their cause however.
Only someone who does not live in a country with a devolved parliment could really believe that they have any power. These assemblies in Scotland Wales and the North of Ireland are only gestures to try and stop the coming break up of the UK.
I don`t know why so many people on this board feel that you should have no feeling for your country. I will always be proud of my nations past and culture just as the Irish are of theirs. As long as you are not xenophobic or believe you are superior to other nations there is no problem. Possibly the reason you feel like that is that because Britain is probably the most xenophobic nation in the world. This is part of the reason I hate Britain so much, all that Brittania empire crap. Ulster is one of the last parts of the empire and the sooner it returns to its own people the better.

[Maaja]

Dear Commie,
Maybe I should cry because of what you said but I won't. You seem to hate all kind of differences, do you think that your ideas are so good that other people have all mistaken? It seems so... too bad... for you. ha-ha

Well, if you say that nations doesn't exist then what will you say about peoples? Probably you won't say anything deeply intellectual but I still would like to know.

Celticsocialist, I am very happy because you are proud of your nation. Everyone should be and I am sure that in their heart they are!

[CommieBastard]

Well, i had stopped posting in this thread because i was having the same argument in another one in the chit chat section, and i dont particularly want the same argument in two places at the same time... so would you do me a favour and bring it up there?

[Maaja]

It was my pleasure to do the favour!