Campus Political Agitation

[thesadmafioso]

I've been trying to get together a group of individuals to form a socialist organization at my university and I have been met with some mixed results in my attempts to actually find people with politics serious enough to facilitate such. I have mostly been focusing on handing out fliers of my own making and a decent one of the youth program put out by Socialist Appeal/WIL, but I really can't get more than an encouraging conversation or for people to take my lit in passing.

The fliers I have been using have just had some basic information on capitalism and socialism with the inclusion of an email I made for the group in making. I've been considering the possibility of making some which are focused more concisely on student/youth orientated matters as well, to perhaps broaden the appeal.

Link to the Socialist Appeal flier: http://www.socialistappeal.org/images/stories/youth_leaflet_autumn_2011.pdf

So, I guess my intended focus for this topic would be for anyone with experience with this sort of activity or college students in genera to share general tactics, what does and doesn't work, general literature, and other assorted information of that vein. Any assistance, material, or ideas would be most welcome, and if anyone else is trying to do the same I would be more than willing to share what I have learned in the past month or so.

[TheGodlessUtopian]

I wish you luck in your efforts and will be reading this thread as I am looking to do some activity once I get in college.

[the Leftâ„¢]

Try not to come across as too alienating. Host a informational "pow-wow" where you distribute fylers, have food, and meet with potential interested colleagues for an hour or so. Try to keep things brief, once a week, and regular. Even if 2 people are coming it is a start and you have somewhere to go. The hardest part is starting/ getting going.

If you can you could get interested college professors , local activists( a lot of them love to), or any influential person you find relevant to the group to guest speak

good luck ! :D

[thesadmafioso]

Try not to come across as too alienating. Host a informational "pow-wow" where you distribute fylers, have food, and meet with potential interested colleagues for an hour or so. Try to keep things brief, once a week, and regular. Even if 2 people are coming it is a start and you have somewhere to go. The hardest part is starting/ getting going.

If you can you could get interested college professors , local activists( a lot of them love to), or any influential person you find relevant to the group to guest speak

good luck ! :D

Thanks for the encouraging sentiments, I'll probably try to implement things like good and the regular meeting schedules once (or if) I get my group to that point. With regards to avoiding alienation, I have tried to keep my rhetoric and talking points quite broad and separate from some of the more obscure bits of Marxist terminology, but I feel like just the discussion of radical politics itself is a largely a surprise to many. Which is to be expected given the dominant position of capitalist propaganda in cultural, I suppose, but it makes the process of making a group of this nature quite challenging.

Though back to the question of regular meetings, I am sort of faced with quite the obstacle there. My campus (University at Albany if anyone wants to read up on the reams of specific restrictions they have on assembly and speech) requires that you get a group of 5 students together and that you write up a constitution before you can register to use rooms on the campus for meetings. So, I can't really have an informational meeting until I actually reach a basic point of organization, something which is sort of hard to do simply with fliers.

Here's the link to the slew of bureaucratic restrictions they have on student organizing, just to give a quick idea of how extensively one sided it is towards discouraging serious political activity. You can't even utilize a table without having an established group set up and without filling a form with administration.

http://www.albany.edu/involvement/reservations.shtml

And a couple of my personal favorites:
http://www.albany.edu/involvement/documents/Protest%20Activity%20Guide.pdf
http://www.albany.edu/involvement/documents/University%20Sound%20Policy.pdf

The first deals with registering with the schools administration to engage in free assembly and the second declares the existence of a 'free speech' area.

Also, if anyone is particularly interested in the progress of this or wants a template for a constitution for a socialist group, I could post my constitution draft and specific fliers to the topic.

And as an additional note to the mod team, if any of the specific info pertaining to my university breeches the security policy of the board, please feel free to delete them immediately.

[Binh]

Good for you! :)


Couple points:


1. Don't ever let bureaucracy stand in the way of your political work. When I organized an anti-war group at my campus right after 9/11, the meeting space we used was a lounge. No permits required. This was for two reasons: a) right after 9/11, I was unsure of how the administration would react to an anti-war group's application. b) It worked really well. We had 10-20 people every week for meetings in fall and spring. We felt no need to get official club status.


My suggestion is to test this out. See if they send a security person to a meeting in a lounge. If so, say you didn't organize the meeting but you were curious and you have no idea who put the flyers up. Always play dumb with the authorities.


2. This flyer is full of jargon -- capitalism, radicalization, etc. Plus, it's more than one page.


I would create a new flyer. Talk concretely: cuts to SUNY vs. tax cuts for millionaires pushed by Democratic governor Cuomo, bailouts for Wall Street vs. poverty for Main Street. Something people will understand immediately without thinking about it. I think you can do it. :)

[Binh]

Please keep this thread up to date! I will check back periodically.

[thesadmafioso]

Good for you! :)


Couple points:


1. Don't ever let bureaucracy stand in the way of your political work. When I organized an anti-war group at my campus right after 9/11, the meeting space we used was a lounge. No permits required. This was for two reasons: a) right after 9/11, I was unsure of how the administration would react to an anti-war group's application. b) It worked really well. We had 10-20 people every week for meetings in fall and spring. We felt no need to get official club status.


My suggestion is to test this out. See if they send a security person to a meeting in a lounge. If so, say you didn't organize the meeting but you were curious and you have no idea who put the flyers up. Always play dumb with the authorities.


2. This flyer is full of jargon -- capitalism, radicalization, etc. Plus, it's more than one page.


I would create a new flyer. Talk concretely: cuts to SUNY vs. tax cuts for millionaires pushed by Democratic governor Cuomo, bailouts for Wall Street vs. poverty for Main Street. Something people will understand immediately without thinking about it. I think you can do it. :)

The lounge idea could be very useful, it would certainly open up the flexibility of setting up a meeting a great deal. I think I may try to use a group study section of the library or something along those lines and make a flyer which the inclusion of a date for an rough introductory meeting of the sort you described. Thanks for the advice on that.

As of late, I've just been handing out literature with my contact information, which doesn't exactly give people the most concrete incentive for action. I'll probably try to throw a few of them around the various posting areas across campus, but they will be taken down in a day or so as I'm sure I won't be able to get official posting privileges from the administration or anything.

Also, attached are a few pieces of my own making and my draft 'constitution', any critique or input would be welcome. Any fellow students should feel free to use any of these designs, templates, or writing if they are to your liking.

Contributions of this variety, both original and not, would certainly be welcome as well, as our literature stores can never truly be complete.

[Skammunist]

Hi Mafioso, I just had my first high school socialist club meeting today. It went very smoothly. The way we set it up was that even though I started the club up, there would be no club captains. Everything is democratic and everyone can make suggestions. I would recommend leading the club discussions for the first two club meetings, but after that, let interested members lead discussions.

I would recommend when starting your group up, doing action as soon as possible. Volunteer work at a homeless shelter or soup kitchen is a great option. The reason for this is that you want to show your members that you are serious about this. Also, the sooner you do things, the more likely members will stay in the club.

Message me if you have any questions, and we can give each other info on our groups.

[TheGodlessUtopian]

I read your constitution and thought that it was good if not a bit short.Maybe consider replacing some of the Marxist words with more mainstream ones so as to not alienate potential members?

[thesadmafioso]

Hi Mafioso, I just had my first high school socialist club meeting today. It went very smoothly. The way we set it up was that even though I started the club up, there would be no club captains. Everything is democratic and everyone can make suggestions. I would recommend leading the club discussions for the first two club meetings, but after that, let interested members lead discussions.

I would recommend when starting your group up, doing action as soon as possible. Volunteer work at a homeless shelter or soup kitchen is a great option. The reason for this is that you want to show your members that you are serious about this. Also, the sooner you do things, the more likely members will stay in the club.

Message me if you have any questions, and we can give each other info on our groups.

My campus has plenty of clubs for social work, I'm not really aiming to do anything much of that vein. There are plenty of college students who would love nothing more than to feel good about themselves after feeding the poor, there are however fewer who seek to eradicate the root cause for such widespread economic inequality.

I envisioned action more along the lines of demos, holding discussions on Marxist theory and getting it out to the student body, starting up a student paper with a socialist perspective, some entrist activities with some of the clubs on the university with a potential to be turned to organs of the movement, and maybe some planned debates with the more conservative political associations of the campus.

Also, for the sate of basic organization, I included a structure of leadership for the (hypothetical) framework of my clubs leadership. I was sure to establish it upon the basis of democratic centralism and to give it a fundamental connection to the rank in file of the club (which I'm sure will be quite pleased with such, once they come into existence).

But congratulations on getting a complete meeting together, that in and of itself is a tremendous achievement, especially in high school. What does the membership look like so far as ideology is concerned? How many people did you get to attend?


I read your constitution and thought that it was good if not a bit short.Maybe consider replacing some of the Marxist words with more mainstream ones so as to not alienate potential members?

Yeah, I literally wrote the whole thing in one coffee fueled sitting. Naturally, it could probably use some polishing, especially in regard to my haphazard use of leftist terminology.

Glad you thought it was good though, and thanks for the advice on language and breadth.

[Binh]

The flyers were a dramatic improvement over what you posted initially. The best one by far was the last one, which was simple language, dramatic examples. That is what a good communist flyer should look like. Anytime you avoid words on a flyer like imperialism, commodification, alienation, bourgeoisie, etc. go for it. The rich, big business, misery, poverty, hustling from check to check, barely keeping our heads above water are all words and expressions that mean similar things.

As for the constitution, based on my years of experience organizing college clubs (socialist and anti-war), these documents were created for the consumption of the administration. None of the clubs I knew actually stuck by them. They were a bureaucratic formality.

Now if you want to do something different, that is fine, but I would caution against it because having all this set in stone means people who want to join feel they can't change it, everything is set up and pre-structured, and therefore they can't/don't really own it. Democracy and majority rule/control is really important for all socialist organizing.

Another thing is if people want to join your group and they see "we must uphold the dialectical materialist Bolshevik-Leninist line against the Stalinist epigones and their enablers in the trade-union bureaucracy" in the club constitution they'll go :confused::confused::confused::confused::confused: and maybe not join. On the other hand, I would love to have written a constitution like this to see if anyone in the admin could actually read it.

[RED DAVE]

Several points:

(1) Off-campus speakers are always good. Are there any "old farts" in your area who have experience from previous times (60s, 70s, 80s, 90s). They, if they're any good, can provide some perspective.

(2) Avoid Democrats like STDs.

(3) Get off campus ASAP. Link up with whatever activist organizations there are.

(4) One of the things you can do is organize an ongoing demo: one day a week at the same time and the same place on some key issue (war is always good) and publicize it.

(5) Teach-ins are not easy to organize, but if you can organize one, they're excellent.

(6) DO NOT get involved in any kind of social work or so-called community organizing. Leave that to the liberals.

(7) Study groups are always cool.

(8) Do not get caught up in illusions about leaderless groups or participatory democracy. Any group with more than about 10 members requires a structure. If you don't evolve one, one will envolve, and you'll have leadership that is unelected.

(9) I don't know if on today's sex-drug-crazed campuses (:D) parties and what we used to call social-educationals are possible (discussion first – party after), but they used to work very well for internal and external growth.

(10) Have fun. And remember, the revolution is not around the corner.

RED DAVE

[Binh]

I don't agree with #2-4, 6.

2. A campus Democratic group might protest Obama's visit or march for the repeal of the Defense of Marriage Act. It would be sectarian not to get involved.

3. Building a base of student activists usually requires staying on campus and having campus-based activites.

4. A weekly demo can be draining and demoralizing. It depends on circumstances.

6. This seems to contradiction #3, "get off campus ASAP" and "link up with" other organizations. The Black Panthers ran a breakfast program; the Young Lords got their start picking up trash and distributing trash bags to residents in Harlem. I guess that makes them liberals?

Here's a link to something I wrote that might help you (or not):
http://www.planetanarchy.net/handbook.doc

[thesadmafioso]

I don't agree with #2-4, 6.

2. A campus Democratic group might protest Obama's visit or march for the repeal of the Defense of Marriage Act. It would be sectarian not to get involved.

3. Building a base of student activists usually requires staying on campus and having campus-based activites.

4. A weekly demo can be draining and demoralizing. It depends on circumstances.

6. This seems to contradiction #3, "get off campus ASAP" and "link up with" other organizations. The Black Panthers ran a breakfast program; the Young Lords got their start picking up trash and distributing trash bags to residents in Harlem. I guess that makes them liberals?

Here's a link to something I wrote that might help you (or not):
http://www.planetanarchy.net/handbook.doc

I have very dim hopes for the College Dems club on the university, as I had the misfortune to have a most discouraging conversation with the vice president of the club last Thursday wherein he made an offhand equivocation between fascism and communism. He also made a mildly harassing comment over my literature, asking me if I needed a Student Administration stamp on each piece before I could distribute it. In addition to this, he even proceeded to find some anarcho-capitalist to debate me on the spot, during which time I was subjected to arguments which were all based around the theme that every issue caused by capitalist can only be solved by even more capitalism.

If I see info for a meeting of the group, I'll probably still crash it and see if there are any members who are not that horribly deluded in their political thought, but as I said before, my hopes are reserved.

As for the matter of social work, I'm inclined to think that such might not be a route which would really be very productive in the building of an effective organization of revolutionary and politically conscious students. On my campus, I know there are already a number of clubs/fraternities which engage in considerable social services in the local community which are wholeheartedly endorsed by the Student Administration and the schools administrative apparatus. I have some serious doubts over the usefulness of those sorts of activities for disseminating revolutionary theory and forming an organization based on such. My aim is not to focus on the alleviation of the ills caused by capitalist society, but rather to aim at the very cause of those endemic elements of capitalism.

I do think your counter to the 4th point in question is quite valid though, I can't see something like a weekly demo being maintainable for quite some time and until a good deal of basic organization has led to the creation of an educated and politically structured group. I mean, I don't even have a solid second member for my group yet, I don't want to wither away any potential momentum after a few ill fated attempts at protest.

And thanks for the link to the organizing information, most all of it looks quite applicable to my current situation and I'm sure plenty of others could get some use out of it as well.

Lastly, here's a link to my latest flyer. I think it's the most focused of the bunch, though I'm not sure it had any added effect to it as compared to my other works. I've yet to get any contacts through email, but hopefully turnout for my first de facto meeting will be decent enough.

[Binh]

All I was saying in my previous post is to keep an open mind and be flexible.

This flyer is good but I would say it is too plain looking. Good luck with the meeting!

[Wanted Man]

Hard-delete the "constitution" from your PC and never think about it again. I mean, just a couple of articles that kind of made me laugh:


12. Stalinist deviations from the development of leftist revolutionary theory will not be allowed entry into the group nor will they be allowed to persist in the group under any circumstances. Any member who displays such sympathies upon attaining membership will be subject to an immediate vote of expulsion.

13. Reformist deviations from the development of leftist revolutionary theory will not be allowed entry into the group. This includes any instances wherein internationalism may be ignored in the name of nationalism of any color. Any member who displays such sympathies upon attaining membership will be subject to a vote of immediate expulsion.

Besides the fact that it's very unlikely that your average fellow students will actually be hardcore Stalinist or reformist "deviants" (lol), these articles basically say: "If you want to join, you must have the same opinion as I do about very specific issues. Anyone who disagrees will be chucked out."

Somewhere else, it also says that the "Central Committee" can keep people out for "not being fit for membership" or kick them out for any reason they want, and kicking them out only requires a "Central Committee" vote. You don't put any democratic checks on this, you don't give your own members the chance to defend themselves from expulsion, except for the "right" to appeal, but the decision about the appeal is once again made by, wait for it... the Central Committee! It's a pretty funny document anyway, and I thought it was satirical first. "It shall" this, "will not be tolerated", "Commissariat", "members are expected to", etc. It reads like some kind of McCarthy-era parody of communism, comrade-commissar!

But the real problem with the "constitution" is not really the whole "making yourself the all-powerful dictator of the organisation" thing, it's that it basically demonstrates that you're not particularly serious (or at least misguided). I mean, I also sometimes get the idea that my room is an independent Soviet, that the house is the Central Committee and the city is a Soviet republic of which I am the supreme ruler who can send people to the Gulag for any or no reason at all, but it's generally a good idea to not inform the general public of your deranged fantasies, otherwise the response will mostly be like: "Fuck off, you're mental."

So yeah, ditch the "constitution", ditch the "League" with its imaginary Soviets and Central Committees, ditch the requirement that everyone who joins must be a hardline disciple of Ted Grant, ditch the idea of trying "entrism" within student associations (especially when you state on a public internet forum that it is your intent to coup them for yourself :lol: ), and basically start off from scratch.

Ask yourself what the situation on your campus is in terms of militancy and groups that already exist, and where you can fit into that, especially if you're serious about starting a socialist group. Start by considering the issues and interests of the student population and work outwards from there, instead of starting with some very specific Trotskyist "tendency" and trying to force that on an uncaring target audience.

In everyday conversation (note that conversation means listening, being open and not talking down to people just because you're the almighty master of Ted Grantism), find ways of organising them around the things that they care about and take it further from there. But how to do that is already far beyond the scope of one forum post by a guy on the other side of the world. The most important thing is don't be discouraged and don't isolate yourself from the outset (as your material posted so far will inevitably do).

Also, I don't know what student life is like in America, but if you can't be bothered with "the false confines of the standing institution of this university", why not just meet up with people in a bar or something and give people the opportunity to discuss how to organise, instead of creating some kind of Soviet LARP framework all by yourself? Surely it's not necessary to have extremely official meetings in university rooms? You'll only be with a few people initially anyway.

[thesadmafioso]

Hard-delete the "constitution" from your PC and never think about it again. I mean, just a couple of articles that kind of made me laugh:



Besides the fact that it's very unlikely that your average fellow students will actually be hardcore Stalinist or reformist "deviants" (lol), these articles basically say: "If you want to join, you must have the same opinion as I do about very specific issues. Anyone who disagrees will be chucked out."

Somewhere else, it also says that the "Central Committee" can keep people out for "not being fit for membership" or kick them out for any reason they want, and kicking them out only requires a "Central Committee" vote. You don't put any democratic checks on this, you don't give your own members the chance to defend themselves from expulsion, except for the "right" to appeal, but the decision about the appeal is once again made by, wait for it... the Central Committee! It's a pretty funny document anyway, and I thought it was satirical first. "It shall" this, "will not be tolerated", "Commissariat", "members are expected to", etc. It reads like some kind of McCarthy-era parody of communism, comrade-commissar!

But the real problem with the "constitution" is not really the whole "making yourself the all-powerful dictator of the organisation" thing, it's that it basically demonstrates that you're not particularly serious (or at least misguided). I mean, I also sometimes get the idea that my room is an independent Soviet, that the house is the Central Committee and the city is a Soviet republic of which I am the supreme ruler who can send people to the Gulag for any or no reason at all, but it's generally a good idea to not inform the general public of your deranged fantasies, otherwise the response will mostly be like: "Fuck off, you're mental."

So yeah, ditch the "constitution", ditch the "League" with its imaginary Soviets and Central Committees, ditch the requirement that everyone who joins must be a hardline disciple of Ted Grant, ditch the idea of trying "entrism" within student associations (especially when you state on a public internet forum that it is your intent to coup them for yourself :lol: ), and basically start off from scratch.

Ask yourself what the situation on your campus is in terms of militancy and groups that already exist, and where you can fit into that, especially if you're serious about starting a socialist group. Start by considering the issues and interests of the student population and work outwards from there, instead of starting with some very specific Trotskyist "tendency" and trying to force that on an uncaring target audience.

In everyday conversation (note that conversation means listening, being open and not talking down to people just because you're the almighty master of Ted Grantism), find ways of organising them around the things that they care about and take it further from there. But how to do that is already far beyond the scope of one forum post by a guy on the other side of the world. The most important thing is don't be discouraged and don't isolate yourself from the outset (as your material posted so far will inevitably do).

Also, I don't know what student life is like in America, but if you can't be bothered with "the false confines of the standing institution of this university", why not just meet up with people in a bar or something and give people the opportunity to discuss how to organise, instead of creating some kind of Soviet LARP framework all by yourself? Surely it's not necessary to have extremely official meetings in university rooms? You'll only be with a few people initially anyway.

I never even included the word tolerated once in that documented, you don't get to falsely attribute whatever language you may please to my name. Why don't you back off of the quotation marks the next time you formulate a response to my work.

Additionally, I did include a clause in a later edit allowing for the immediate recall of anyone holding a post of leadership, so as to further the degree of democratic centralism present in the groups structure. How this makes me some despot of Stalinism is well beyond me, especially given the fact that in the entire document in question I do not once specify nor imply that I will have any more a right to leadership over this organization than any other potential member. I actually noted that this committee would be comprised of multiple members and that it would be popularly elected by the rank and file of the group, once more, quite far off from your infantile assertions of autocracy.

And why is it that any reference to the historical development of the lineage of Marxist theory must automatically be subjected to the libel of analogy to a rabidly reactionary US senator? I cannot use the term soviet or commissariat no longer as a result of a slew of cold war propaganda? Yes, it was probably unnecessary flourish, but that does not afford you the position to so crudely term it as such a one sided caricature.

Also, I had the fullest intent on this document providing a theoretical framework for the student movement on my campus, as without such it would be bound to falter and wither. Vaguely defined activism without theory is pointless as it inevitably collapses as a results of its unfocused composition, because of this material fact of political activity I have consciously made an effort to arm the student body of my campus with the proper theory to help formulate and give meaning to their actions.

[Wanted Man]

I never even included the word tolerated once in that documented, you don't get to falsely attribute whatever language you may please to my name. Why don't you back off of the quotation marks the next time you formulate a response to my work.

Additionally, I did include a clause in a later edit allowing for the immediate recall of anyone holding a post of leadership, so as to further the degree of democratic centralism present in the groups structure. How this makes me some despot of Stalinism is well beyond me, especially given the fact that in the entire document in question I do not once specify nor imply that I will have any more a right to leadership over this organization than any other potential member. I actually noted that this committee would be comprised of multiple members and that it would be popularly elected by the rank and file of the group, once more, quite far off from your infantile assertions of autocracy.

And why is it that any reference to the historical development of the lineage of Marxist theory must automatically be subjected to the libel of analogy to a rabidly reactionary US senator? I cannot use the term soviet or commissariat no longer as a result of a slew of cold war propaganda? Yes, it was probably unnecessary flourish, but that does not afford you the position to so crudely term it as such a one sided caricature.

Also, I had the fullest intent on this document providing a theoretical framework for the student movement on my campus, as without such it would be bound to falter and wither. Vaguely defined activism without theory is pointless as it inevitably collapses as a results of its unfocused composition, because of this material fact of political activity I have consciously made an effort to arm the student body of my campus with the proper theory to help formulate and give meaning to their actions.

Looks like you only read part of my post, got angry at the first couple of paragraphs, and then decided to write the mouth-breathing bullshit above. So yeah, shit, I'm sorry Mr Lawyer, you didn't use the word "tolerate" anywhere, so that obviously invalidates my whole point!

Your whole "constitution" is the second-longest suicide in history. With this in your hand, you will never even give your crappy "League" the opportunity to "falter and wither" because it will just be you. Does this really need explaining? Are you a bit simple-minded maybe? The fucking document literally says that the "Central Committee" (whose other members beside yourself are purely hypothetical) can decide everything and boot anyone. That people can theoretically recall you after-the-fact doesn't change anything. Why would someone even want to sign up to such conditions in the first place?

You know something, you're a fucking idiot. You can only talk in the same old hackneyed slogans that don't mean anything to anyone and you take all hyperbole and metaphors literally. Just look at your own response to my admittedly harsh, but 100% realistic and sensible advice. Please tell me right now whether you are autistic, because I don't want to attack you for things you can do nothing about. But whatever, have fun building your one-man Soviet.

And the above post is ultimate proof that you are a dumb twat. I "don't get to do" X, I'm "not in a position" to say Y, etc. Fuck you, I'm not a rank-and-file member of your "League" and I'm "in a position" to say whatever I want.

[Binh]

Wanted Man fails to realize he is dealing with someone who wants constructive criticism and support. I suspect thesadmafioso is somewhat new to politics/activism as well. This back and forth is totally unnecessary and unproductive.

[thesadmafioso]

Wanted Man fails to realize he is dealing with someone who wants constructive criticism and support. I suspect thesadmafioso is somewhat new to politics/activism as well. This back and forth is totally unnecessary and unproductive.

I'm certainly not new to politics itself, just the on the ground organizing bit of it. My understanding of theory and history is a bit ahead of my knowledge on practical action and the application of such, I would say.

But yeah, that's basically what I had intended this topic to be a host for. I'm fully aware that I can get carried away to certain theoretical and historical excesses in my writing and I don't mind that being pointed out, I would just prefer it to be done in a more helpful manner. For instance, I probably could of done without the crude analogy to senator McCarthy on the question of my use of language.

[thesadmafioso]

Looks like you only read part of my post, got angry at the first couple of paragraphs, and then decided to write the mouth-breathing bullshit above. So yeah, shit, I'm sorry Mr Lawyer, you didn't use the word "tolerate" anywhere, so that obviously invalidates my whole point!

Your whole "constitution" is the second-longest suicide in history. With this in your hand, you will never even give your crappy "League" the opportunity to "falter and wither" because it will just be you. Does this really need explaining? Are you a bit simple-minded maybe? The fucking document literally says that the "Central Committee" (whose other members beside yourself are purely hypothetical) can decide everything and boot anyone. That people can theoretically recall you after-the-fact doesn't change anything. Why would someone even want to sign up to such conditions in the first place?

You know something, you're a fucking idiot. You can only talk in the same old hackneyed slogans that don't mean anything to anyone and you take all hyperbole and metaphors literally. Just look at your own response to my admittedly harsh, but 100% realistic and sensible advice. Please tell me right now whether you are autistic, because I don't want to attack you for things you can do nothing about. But whatever, have fun building your one-man Soviet.

And the above post is ultimate proof that you are a dumb twat. I "don't get to do" X, I'm "not in a position" to say Y, etc. Fuck you, I'm not a rank-and-file member of your "League" and I'm "in a position" to say whatever I want.

You may be interested in hearing that I actually got some pretty decent responses from the small cross section of the student body I was in contact with today. Some guys from the 'Save our Suny' group, a loose coalition of students protesting rising tuition costs and other cuts to education, offered me some table space for my lit and showed some interest in working together in the future. I was also approached by a comrade who after reading my literature asked to help pass it out to others, which has to say something positive for the practical potential of my writing.

So, pardon me if I am a bit skeptical about your claims that my writing it too detached to have any sort of impact or resonance with the learning masses, as I've enough direct experience to disperse the absolute validity of that assertion.

As for the matter of recall votes, they can be called immediately at any time to remove a member of this committee in the making. So, if the central committee were truly falling out of line with the revolutionary aims of the group, they could be brought to account without any delay and before they could act in a manner which would seriously aggrieve the majority of the groups membership.

But as for content more directly related to the topic, the Save our Suny group I previously mentioned has a state wide walk out planned for October 5th to protest rising tuition costs and severe measures of austerity to educational budgets. I was helping them pass out fliers with the date and time for it just today and received some rather positive responses. Hopefully I will be able to make some solid contacts through the walk out as well, given the fact that many in this group did appear to be the most politically advanced students on the campus.

Here's a link to anyone interested in the details planned: http://www.saveoursuny.org/2011/09/22/state-wide-student-walk-outteach-in/

[Binh]

I'm certainly not new to politics itself, just the on the ground organizing bit of it. My understanding of theory and history is a bit ahead of my knowledge on practical action and the application of such, I would say.

What I meant was the practical/organizing end of it, which in the final analysis, is the most important part. I can tell you've read and absorbed a lot of "high level" Marxist literature.

Keep us updated and best of luck.

[Victory Of The People!]

As someone who's done their fair share of campus organizing in New York I can tell you that starting up such an organization from scratch without any organizational experience whatsoever and all by yourself will be extremely difficult. Not to say that its impossible, but it will be a slow, arduous affair.

Why not get into contact with an already-establsihed party or group in the New York area and do your organizing on campus through them? You wouldnt have to write every flier yourself, design all your own signs, do all the paperwork, come up qwith all the ideas, etc, etc. Also, people are very wary about joining a group with one member. When you do outreach as a group it is MUCH more effective. Most importanty, you would be able to draw from the collective experience of many other activists and organizers, and not have to learn everything the hard way. It would also lend greatly to your campus group's credibility. By the time you get a group off the ground and recruit a small handful of people you could be almost ready to graduate, only to then have to start all over again after you get out of college and are no longer on-campus all the time.


From what you wrote you seem to be a Communist with a strong leaning toward the teaching of Trotsky. Therefore you would fit in with most Marxist-Leninist-type parties/groups. There are quite a few of them in New York, and working alongside one would greatly increase your political effectiveness. At the end of the day its about furthering the socialist cause, not about being able to say you started your own group from scratch.

For example, I know for a fact that the Party for Socialism and Liberation has active branches in both Syracuse and New Paltz, not to mention New York City. If you began working with them i guarantee they would help you build a strong campus organization, this way you wouldn't be all by yourself up there with no logistical or personal support. There are also plenty of other groups out there you could link up with.

I say join an already existing organization because i did the whole "do-it-yourself" thing and even managed to get a handful of people on my side, but i realize now it all could have been accomplished with much less headache and sooner had i had the support of other people behind me from the start. And trust me, in Albany... your gonna need all the help you can get.

Comrade, I wish you the best of luck.

[thesadmafioso]

As someone who's done their fair share of campus organizing in New York I can tell you that starting up such an organization from scratch without any organizational experience whatsoever and all by yourself will be extremely difficult. Not to say that its impossible, but it will be a slow, arduous affair.

Why not get into contact with an already-establsihed party or group in the New York area and do your organizing on campus through them? You wouldnt have to write every flier yourself, design all your own signs, do all the paperwork, come up qwith all the ideas, etc, etc. Also, people are very wary about joining a group with one member. When you do outreach as a group it is MUCH more effective. Most importanty, you would be able to draw from the collective experience of many other activists and organizers, and not have to learn everything the hard way. It would also lend greatly to your campus group's credibility. By the time you get a group off the ground and recruit a small handful of people you could be almost ready to graduate, only to then have to start all over again after you get out of college and are no longer on-campus all the time.


From what you wrote you seem to be a Communist with a strong leaning toward the teaching of Trotsky. Therefore you would fit in with most Marxist-Leninist-type parties/groups. There are quite a few of them in New York, and working alongside one would greatly increase your political effectiveness. At the end of the day its about furthering the socialist cause, not about being able to say you started your own group from scratch.

For example, I know for a fact that the Party for Socialism and Liberation has active branches in both Syracuse and New Paltz, not to mention New York City. If you began working with them i guarantee they would help you build a strong campus organization, this way you wouldn't be all by yourself up there with no logistical or personal support. There are also plenty of other groups out there you could link up with.

I say join an already existing organization because i did the whole "do-it-yourself" thing and even managed to get a handful of people on my side, but i realize now it all could have been accomplished with much less headache and sooner had i had the support of other people behind me from the start. And trust me, in Albany... your gonna need all the help you can get.

Comrade, I wish you the best of luck.

I've been in pretty regular touch with the Workers International League, the American section of the International Marxist Tendency, on a fairly regular basis. I actually sat in on one of their branch meetings last weekend in NYC and talked a decent bit about organizing on campus with one of their members. In addition to this, I've been in touch with some of the people from the Save our Suny group, which like I said is made up of a diverse group which is rather sporadic in its general ideology but certainly not without the potential to be radicalized along broader Marxist lines.

I really don't have any sort of attachment to the idea of starting my own group on the campus, but at the same time I don't have much of a choice so far as socialist political organizing is concerned. There is a massive disparity in student organizations with pronounced leftist content to there program, so I really didn't have much to work with. The help I've gotten from the WIL and from other users here has been quite useful, but it's still been somewhat of a challenge.

And much thanks for the wishes of luck and advice, next week I have an open meeting set up for a general area in the library on Monday and there is a walk out planned for Wednesday, hopefully they will help to give my organizing attempts a much needed burst of momentum.

[Binh]

One thing you might want to consider is doing activist work within a non-socialist group (say against budget cuts) and find people there who are left-wing and start a reading group. I did that in the anti-war group I launched after 9/11. Out of a group of 15-20 there were 3-5 who wanted to read socialist literature and talk about it.

[Die Rote Fahne]

A reader/book-list may be a good idea for your group. Suggesting authors and specific books to read, and maybe discuss.

For example, suggest the following...

Authors:
- Marx
- Orwell
- Lenin
- Trotsky
- Luxemburg

Books:
- The Communist Manifesto
- 1984
- The State and Rwevolution
- The Revolution betrayed
- Marxism or Leninism?

As well as a movie/film list and discussion, such titles as:

- Rosa Luxemburg (the biopic)
- Reds
- The Trotsky
- Che

[Aleenik]

A reader/book-list may be a good idea for your group. Suggesting authors and specific books to read, and maybe discuss.

For example, suggest the following...

Authors:
- Marx
- Orwell
- Lenin
- Trotsky
- Luxemburg

Books:
- The Communist Manifesto
- 1984
- The State and Rwevolution
- The Revolution betrayed
- Marxism or Leninism?

As well as a movie/film list and discussion, such titles as:

- Rosa Luxemburg (the biopic)
- Reds
- The Trotsky
- CheDon't forget some Anarchist works, like those of Peter Kropotkin.:)

[thesadmafioso]

Brief update on the state of my organizing efforts, I had my first meeting on campus today which was attended physically by 5 people. I also ran into a handful of others who were very interested but unable to attend due to classes.

But of the group present, we officially coalesced under the League for Student Socialism and Democracy banner, adopted my constitution and the youth program of the WIL, and established an ideological basis of revolutionary socialism for the groups political framework. We had a productive discussion and analysis of the occupy movement among other matters and established another date for meeting.

I plan on getting into a more detailed dissemination of our aims and activities on campus at the next meeting and maybe vote on a chairman or something for basic organizational matters.

[RHIZOMES]

I tried to create a socialist group on campus for 2 years before I gave up. Not so much out of defeatism as much as I realised I wanted to be involved in a campus movement rather than create a sect for the students who have read all the right books.

I'm now involved in a group with differing ideologies but unification on one issue that affects students: an opposition to the commercialisation of tertiary education in New Zealand. I feel like my activist work is actually fruitful now since we've been able to start a movement that has politicised/radicalised lots of students on my campus.

I've started to realise that a radical base needs to be created first for a functional socialist group to actually work.

[thesadmafioso]

http://i1227.photobucket.com/albums/ee425/thesadmafioso/maketherichpayII.jpg
Above, a pic of one of my fliers.

I've been meaning to post about the walkout for the past few days, but my schedule has been somewhat chaotic.

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Student-protest-wins-hearing-2204197.php

The protest itself was without any sort of identifiable leadership and thus was rather inconsistent in the sense of its political demands and decisions, but I still managed to get in touch with a great number of interested individuals and got to spread the word of my own organizing efforts to a large and engaged audience. I passed 80+ quarter sheet fliers throughout a group of about 100+ students coalesced in the administration building during a forum with the university president.

I also utilized one chance to speak to the university president and the forum for 90 seconds to impose the demands of youth program adopted by the League at its first meeting (http://www.socialistappeal.org/solidarity/solidarity-general/956-a-program-of-struggle-for-youth-and-students) and to expose the argument for a socialist alternative to the crisis of capitalism. I also called the president an engorged capitalist and called for the elimination of his position, to be replaced by workers and students control over education, which prompted him to call me an anarchist in his 10 minutes of response in the forum. I yelled at him to give me a forum to response, which he didn't, and ended up labeling his failure to allow me to counter his slander as typical capitalistic cowardice.

Of course, my inability to speak further in very much the responsibility of the cabal of graduate students running the protest as well. The handful that were calling on individuals to speak (yes, they actually issued this much damned control over the protests proceedings) applied a methodical approach to distribution of floor time. Basically, when one of the members of their clique of graduate students wanted to speak, they got to speak. It didn't matter if they just spoke up or if they raised their hand, they always were afforded precedent. The speakers with the microphones were all from their ranks, the ones choosing who got the floor were of their ranks. The self appointed PR team, the negotiators, the ones with the agenda setting power, the ones issuing the demands of the protest, were all members of this little cabal of unelected graduate students. So naturally, when we were responding to the president, they gave the floor to their reformist allies, not to me. This despite of the fact that the president singled me out for slander directly in the course of his responses.

They also screwed me over by agreeing to terms which locked the media out of the forum, basically handing the ability to tell the story to their personal clique of PR reps as opposed to the legitimate press corps. (A decision I argued against with the plain clothes cops on hand and the SOS 'leadership')

So yeah, in short, the leadership behind the protest was shit but I still made some decent contacts. This is what happens when you take a militant student body and you subject them to the leadership of a bunch of wishy washy liberals who say the movement is leaderless to shut out any democratic threat to their hold over it.

I've since followed up with the student press to attempt to get my side of the story out and I plan airing these grievances at the next meeting held by the Save our Suny bunch. Hopefully my group will be able to host its own demos in the future so as to avoid dealing with this wretched planning.

And a round of my latest literature is included as well. Most of it is pretty centric to my university, so anyone should feel free to edit them for their own uses if they please.

[Binh]

How many students do you think you won to your position on the university president?

Why would you want to hold a separate demonstration down the road? This is not the united front method. You have to prove that you are a better fighter, not use more radical-sounding rhetoric, if you want to win majorities away from liberals.

[thesadmafioso]

How many students do you think you won to your position on the university president?

Why would you want to hold a separate demonstration down the road? This is not the united front method. You have to prove that you are a better fighter, not use more radical-sounding rhetoric, if you want to win majorities away from liberals.

I'm not quite sure on the answer to the first question, I did receive some positive feedback from some members of the crowd afterwards as well as initial approval of my point, but I don't know to what extend the larger solidification of my point reached.

And I would like to organize my own demonstration to truly expose the nature of the capitalist crisis and its impact on the student body in terms more refined and concise. The SOS group seems to think that we can end the impacts of the exploitation and corruption of capitalism by having a mild mannered discussion with the university president and then walking away after an hour of passionately stating our cases to a closed room. Those tactics are bound to scuttle the movement and lead to its inevitable failure. The student body is not going to keep engaging in these nominal protests which offer no viable solutions or alternatives once they realize the utter ineffectiveness of action without theory.

Don't get me wrong, I am certainly not above continued work with the group and I have no plans to abandon my support of their actions, I just realize that a wider approach to the issues which they seek to fight is needed if they really want to understand how to achieve victory for the student and the worker. You can't simply go around fighting line item policy maneuvers of the bourgeois without looking at the backdrop of capitalism upon which such are based as such tactics will, at best, temporarily alleviate some outward symptoms of a failed order.

[tir1944]

So,did i get you right,your "campaign" didn't quite work out?

[thesadmafioso]

So,did i get you right,your "campaign" didn't quite work out?

No, you did not 'get me right'.

The walk out which I participated in had a placated and ineffective result. I played no part in the direct planning of this action nor did I have any role in the formulation of its ideological platform, hence why the demo was without anything but an invisible leadership and why its demands did not move beyond petty bourgeois reformism.

[Binh]

I would like to organize my own demonstration to truly expose the nature of the capitalist crisis and its impact on the student body in terms more refined and concise.

Again, this is not the united front method. In practice, this will isolate the radical elements from the broader movement you seek to influence.


The SOS group seems to think that we can end the impacts of the exploitation and corruption of capitalism by having a mild mannered discussion with the university president and then walking away after an hour of passionately stating our cases to a closed room. Those tactics are bound to scuttle the movement and lead to its inevitable failure.

So you are disowning them because they are politically naive and yet to learn in practice what works and what won't? You expect them to have 100% Marxist politics even though they are moving into struggle still under the influence of ruling class ideology.


Don't get me wrong, I am certainly not above continued work with the group and I have no plans to abandon my support of their actions, I just realize that a wider approach to the issues which they seek to fight is needed if they really want to understand how to achieve victory for the student and the worker. You can't simply go around fighting line item policy maneuvers of the bourgeois without looking at the backdrop of capitalism upon which such are based as such tactics will, at best, temporarily alleviate some outward symptoms of a failed order.

Again, it seems like you are frustrated with the current leadership and splitting off to do your own thing. That will lead to your own isolation and leave the bulk of the movement under the influence of liberals. I think this is a profoundly mistaken approach. You are welcome to prove me wrong in practice. I will continue to support you and look forward to hearing how it goes.

[thesadmafioso]

Again, this is not the united front method. In practice, this will isolate the radical elements from the broader movement you seek to influence.



So you are disowning them because they are politically naive and yet to learn in practice what works and what won't? You expect them to have 100% Marxist politics even though they are moving into struggle still under the influence of ruling class ideology.



Again, it seems like you are frustrated with the current leadership and splitting off to do your own thing. That will lead to your own isolation and leave the bulk of the movement under the influence of liberals. I think this is a profoundly mistaken approach. You are welcome to prove me wrong in practice. I will continue to support you and look forward to hearing how it goes.

I'm still willing to work with the SOS group, I actually plan to attend one of their meetings this coming Monday, after another attempt at having a LSSD meeting shortly before the SOS meeting is held. The last one I tried to set up was rather disappointing, with only one anarcho primitivist type showing up, but we still had a very productive conversation on politics and revolutionary theory for a solid hour. Hopefully with the meetings being on the same evening this time around, we will see some greater participation and attendance.

But I digress back to the primary discussion, I still support the SOS group and their endeavors. At the same time, I am not opposed to operating separate of their organizational structure and membership, as I truly believe that we need a militant student organization united in its understanding of revolutionary theory and analysis in order to make gains in the struggle for socialism. I'm not trying to isolate my groups activities, just to keep them distinct in the broader front.

[Le Socialiste]

So,did i get you right,your "campaign" didn't quite work out?

Why do you have to go and do that? I wish I had the courage to try and organize my soon-to-be campus (I start in Jan.) like that. It's a start, and while I may disagree with certain elements of thesadmafioso's organization, I can admire and support the effort made. Why are you so quick to dismiss this?

[RedMarxist]

thesadmafioso/anyone, any advice for starting up a student's assembly at a high school?

How would I get student's involved?

[thesadmafioso]

thesadmafioso/anyone, any advice for starting up a student's assembly at a high school?

How would I get student's involved?

I would start with any leftist connections you may have and from there try to establish a core group of interested individuals. It is always easier to build a group with multiple members, as you can convey the image of, well, actually being a group.

Perhaps you could try printing up some flyers containing contact information or a general meeting date in a public area and posting them in miscellaneous locations around the school? I've plenty of templates if you want to apply the LSSD model to your efforts as well, though they really are not the most professional.

But yeah, if you have any specific questions please feel free to PM me to discuss them in greater detail and best of luck if you do decide to try to get a leftist student organization together on your campus.

[Binh]

Any updates here?

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

1. Don't host a "pow-wow" if you're not part of a traditional native culture that hosts pow-wows. That's cultural appropriation, and it's right fucked up.

2. Why do you want to start a group? For sake of having a group? The odds of being successful with such a tack are slim. Instead, pick a concrete task you want to accomplish: A regular newspaper, a free food serving, regular tabling with pamphlets, an occupation, a student strike, a solidarity network, whatever. Once you've got a goal to organize toward, and not just a vague ideological inclination, you can start gathering people who have the skills and motivation to accomplish particular tasks. This has multiple benefits - one, you end up getting something done (as opposed to being another gang of student navel-gazers), and two, you develop political consciousness in the process of political activity (which, inevitably, has better results than the alternative).

3. Look to some recent examples of successful student organizing. The University California Occupations of 2009 and the Quebec "Grève étudiante illimitée" of 2005 are both particularly worth looking at, since they transcended the limits of "student politics" and escalated, at some moments, to open conflict with the state and capital (opening up posibilities that are still being explored).