Commitment 2012

[Mythbuster]

Who do you hope runs and wins in 2012? who do you least wanna see in office.

Here are my choices:

Most wanted to see in office:

Gloria la Riva

(if she doesnt run I will attempt to reelect Obama, even though I dint fancy him).

Least wanted:

David Duke
Ron Paul
Sarah Palin

[GPDP]

Who do you hope runs and wins in 2012?

The working class.

[Q]

It doesn't really matter who is running, does it? If communists participate in elections, it is first and foremost for the purpose of waging propaganda for our programme and explaining how parliamentary democracy is not in our interests but in that of the bosses.

[TheGodlessUtopian]

It is ultimately irrelevant since no matter who wins they will not usher in socialism.

[thriller]

I've actually wondered about this. Maybe if Perry or Bachman gets elected things would get worse quicker than having Obama, and then with even more shit piled upon the working class, we can finally wake everyone up. Just an optimistic way of looking at it I guess.

[TheGodlessUtopian]

I've actually wondered about this. Maybe if Perry or Bachman gets elected things would get worse quicker than having Obama, and then with even more shit piled upon the working class, we can finally wake everyone up. Just an optimistic way of looking at it I guess.

That is one way of looking at it but for people to "wake up" in the manner you are referring to they would have to hold onto power for a longer duration than just four years.Seems like a deadly proposition;a lot like gambling.I dunno.

[Logan]

I've actually wondered about this. Maybe if Perry or Bachman gets elected things would get worse quicker than having Obama, and then with even more shit piled upon the working class, we can finally wake everyone up. Just an optimistic way of looking at it I guess.

Too big of a gamble.

[Blake's Baby]

Oh, I was thinking you were talking about the Olympics.

Are you talking about elections somewhere?

[rebel]

I've actually wondered about this. Maybe if Perry or Bachman gets elected things would get worse quicker than having Obama, and then with even more shit piled upon the working class, we can finally wake everyone up. Just an optimistic way of looking at it I guess.

No thanks. Don't vote yourself and keep telling as many people as you can, not to vote, explaining to them why. This is the way to go ...or I am on the wrong forum.

[thriller]

Too big of a gamble.

I know what you, and theGodlessUtopian mean, it is very risky. Just pointing out a way to look at it from a positive light if a Republican gets elected. And besides, what else do we have to loose? Nothing.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Too big of a gamble.
So then what? "fight the right" and vote Democrat?

[Decolonize The Left]

I've actually wondered about this. Maybe if Perry or Bachman gets elected things would get worse quicker than having Obama, and then with even more shit piled upon the working class, we can finally wake everyone up. Just an optimistic way of looking at it I guess.

No, actually that's a highly pessimistic way to look at things and it's extremely dangerous. The notion that 'things have to get a lot worse before they get better' may be true in a grand theoretical sense, but in a real practical sense it's a terrible idea.

Perry/Bachmann will absolutely destroy all social networks/women's rights/collective bargaining/glbtq rights/immigration reform/medical-medicaid/etc... asap. Literally, they will gut these programs until there isn't anything less. Yes it's already happening, but the extent to which these people will take this platform is insane. Now you may not be directly affected by most of these actions, but millions of working class people will - and it is totally unacceptable to advocate that this take place in order to 'raise class consciousness' or some bullshit idea. These are people's lives we're talking about.

- August

[Commissar Rykov]

So then what? "fight the right" and vote Democrat?
We should vote for dead people at least then if they win they will be literally an empty suit.

[Decolonize The Left]

So then what? "fight the right" and vote Democrat?

No. You don't vote because:

1. Representative democracy isn't democracy.
2. Both the parties are basically the capitalist party.
3. Your vote means nothing as presidential elections are determined by the electoral college.
4. Voting is tacitly consenting to being ruled by the government.

- August

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

I hope they all run...into the middle of the Pacific Ocean and fucking drown. Let's face it, every single candidate with a chance of coming in the top 3 places is going to be somewhat of an anti-working class, Capitalist, Big Business-loving, out of touch, careerist prick.

[Panda Tse Tung]

No. You don't vote because:

1. Representative democracy isn't democracy.
2. Both the parties are basically the capitalist party.
3. Your vote means nothing as presidential elections are determined by the electoral college.
4. Voting is tacitly consenting to being ruled by the government.

- August
I think he means it's gonna lead upto 'ohw my god they fucked up, lets vote democrats!'. Rather then, 'hmmmz both suck; lets kick them out'!

[Rocky Rococo]

New and better spokesmodels for hegemonic capital!

[Rusty Shackleford]

It was sarcasm. I apologize for it not being detectable.

[Le Socialiste]

Who do you hope runs and wins in 2012? who do you least wanna see in office.

Here are my choices:

Most wanted to see in office:

Gloria la Riva

(if she doesnt run I will attempt to reelect Obama, even though I dint fancy him).

Least wanted:

David Duke
Ron Paul
Sarah Palin

It doesn't matter, it wouldn't change anything. The only thing different about the parties participating is their names. Their goals (the suppression of working-class power and aims), however, remain very much the same.

[CommunityBeliever]

I am not a bourgeoisie so I don't participate in the bourgeoisie politics, which exists entirely to mediate the antagonism between various sections of capital.

[Dumb]

The only elections I'm going to participate in are the House elections. House Democrats have shown a smidgen of backbone from time to time, and they're probably our best hope to keep the Bush tax cuts from getting made permanent - and if they expire, that will reduce a lot of the fiscal pressure for austerity in the upcoming decade.

Even that, though, is perhaps a flip of the coin at best, and all other elections are utterly worthless.

[eyeheartlenin]

I second what Rebel said: "Don't vote yourself and keep telling as many people as you can not to vote, explaining to them why"

There is a great facebook page, "Vote for Nobody" http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Vote-for-Nobody-Campaign/212874912064941 because nobody listens, nobody cares, and nobody has the answers.

The US poverty figures just came out, with 15.1% of the population living in poverty, the highest level since 1993, as well as an official unemployment rate of 9.1% (which, according to the web, translates to 15.8%, if all the unemployed and underemployed are counted). In my opinion, working people in this country do not deserve more severe economic uncertainty. What we need is a different economic system; a mere change of personnel at the top is not sufficient.

[Lobotomy]

I know they're all scum and we shouldn't vote for any of them and all that, but that Rick Perry guy really is evil.

[Caoimhin]

Its not like it matters much either way

The candidates of both parties are still going to be wholly controlled by interest groups,granted the Democrats are controlled by interest groups that aren't as bad as the Republicans but that is only a marginal difference

Obama has acted in just as much an imperial manner as Bush,he just happens to have a friendlier face

[Dumb]

Obama has acted in just as much an imperial manner as Bush,he just happens to have a friendlier face

And he's significantly smarter and more cautious in his imperialism than Bush was. It's much harder to get the average worker in "Middle America" pissed off about drone strikes in Pakistan than it is to get that same worker angry about a full-on invasion of Iraq with thousands of troops on the ground. Bush made a show of his imperialism, while Obama seems to conduct his foreign policy in the shadows.

[Caoimhin]

It's amazing that people don't recognise what is happening in Pakistan as another war that America is engaged in

Drone and special forces strikes in Pakistan are a clear act of war and the Pakistani government would come out and say as much if it wasn't so reliant on Washingtons largesse