Defense Industry Faces Profit Losses As Golden Decade Ends

[Klaatu]

This is a start:

Defense Industry Faces Profit Losses As Golden Decade Ends
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/15/defense-industry-profits-911_n_927596.html

[o well this is ok I guess]

Welp, time for another war.

[Os Cangaceiros]

don't worry (http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2011/08/13/sino_us_stephen_glain/index.html)

[Die Neue Zeit]

This is a start:

Defense Industry Faces Profit Losses As Golden Decade Ends
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/08/15/defense-industry-profits-911_n_927596.html

More shit happens when you've got a private sector-based military-industrial complex.

[RED DAVE]

More shit happens when you've got a private sector-based military-industrial complex.Are you suggesting that capitalism has any realistic alternatives? Are you harping back to your stuff about a socialized arms industry?

Get this straight, Comrades. As soon as possible after the revolution, we beat our swords into pruning hooks. Disarmament is now and always should be a key part of a socialist program.

RED DAVE

[RadioRaheem84]

Get this straight, Comrades. As soon as possible after the revolution, we beat our swords into pruning hooks. Disarmament is now and always should be a key part of a socialist program.

The history of revolution is replete with counter revolution.

[RED DAVE]

Get this straight, Comrades. As soon as possible after the revolution, we beat our swords into pruning hooks. Disarmament is now and always should be a key part of a socialist program.
The history of revolution is replete with counter revolution.Really? Please note that I said "[a]s soon as possible after the revolution."

The basic point I am trying to dispute is DNZ's crap about a socialized defense industry.

RED DAVE

[Leonid Brozhnev]

Defense Industry Faces Profit Losses As Golden Decade Ends


Something about me playing the worlds smallest violin? There's plenty more opportunities for America to ruin lives around the world cropping up, it's only a matter of time.

[Psy]

Get this straight, Comrades. As soon as possible after the revolution, we beat our swords into pruning hooks. Disarmament is now and always should be a key part of a socialist program.

RED DAVE

If there is global communism what would be the rush disarm? By that point there would be only one army for all of Earth thus you'd already have peace. The question of disarmament would then be a issue of recycling dead labor (transforming the labor that went into the construction of arms into something more useful) and less about ensuring peace. Not disarming would simply mean the arms of the former Earth revolutionary army would just be rusting away in abandoned revolutionary army bases, as planners wouldn't allocate resources to the revolutionary army if there is peace and no threat of large scale armed conflict (and there would be much more urgent need for labor then having the revolutionary army defending against a threat that doesn't exist anymore).

[The Dark Side of the Moon]

Are you suggesting that capitalism has any realistic alternatives? Are you harping back to your stuff about a socialized arms industry?

Get this straight, Comrades. As soon as possible after the revolution, we beat our swords into pruning hooks. Disarmament is now and always should be a key part of a socialist program.

RED DAVE

CapItialist rebellion: what do we fight them with? Our hands?

[Jose Gracchus]

If the social revolution has been completed than we should have the communist mode of production on a world scale and bourgeois relations extirpated. Where would a "capitalist rebellion" rise out of this alignment of social relations? Seems very un-Marx-like to me, and special pleading for hypertrophic ML military-industrial complexes.

[S.Artesian]

If there is global communism what would be the rush disarm? By that point there would be only one army for all of Earth thus you'd already have peace. The question of disarmament would then be a issue of recycling dead labor (transforming the labor that went into the construction of arms into something more useful) and less about ensuring peace. Not disarming would simply mean the arms of the former Earth revolutionary army would just be rusting away in abandoned revolutionary army bases, as planners wouldn't allocate resources to the revolutionary army if there is peace and no threat of large scale armed conflict (and there would be much more urgent need for labor then having the revolutionary army defending against a threat that doesn't exist anymore).


"All economy is the economy of time"-- Karl Marx

What's the rush? Because not doing it, maintaining the weapons stocks, and the weapons to prevent unintended ignition, chain reactions etc. requires more time in the long run than beginning the work of disarmament immediately, as Red Dave suggest.

Weapons don't just rust when not in use or being transported. They have to be carefully monitored and protected against decay of protective coverings, electrical build-up and discharge, moisture [not simply because of rust]. You want to spend x thousands or millions of hours doing that? Why not use those X thousands to begin eliminating these weapons and the tasks of maintenance?

[Psy]

"All economy is the economy of time"-- Karl Marx

What's the rush? Because not doing it, maintaining the weapons stocks, and the weapons to prevent unintended ignition, chain reactions etc. requires more time in the long run than beginning the work of disarmament immediately, as Red Dave suggest.

Weapons don't just rust when not in use or being transported. They have to be carefully monitored and protected against decay of protective coverings, electrical build-up and discharge, moisture [not simply because of rust]. You want to spend x thousands or millions of hours doing that? Why not use those X thousands to begin eliminating these weapons and the tasks of maintenance?

Most stockpiles are not stored with fuses inserted, they are not like unexploded ordnance on a battlefield.

[Die Neue Zeit]

If the social revolution has been completed than we should have the communist mode of production on a world scale and bourgeois relations extirpated. Where would a "capitalist rebellion" rise out of this alignment of social relations? Seems very un-Marx-like to me, and special pleading for hypertrophic ML military-industrial complexes.

The real problem is that Red Dave confuses the communist mode of production on a world scale with very, very uneven transitions (both politically and socially) toward such.

I mean, even CPGB comrade Mike Macnair writes about the DOTP on a European scale, but with the European movement expressing moral support, solidarity, etc. with movements elsewhere. What does that imply about the regimes those movements live under?

[xub3rn00dlex]

Just a quick question. Let's say hypothetically this does go down, would the US be able to survive a major war with a superpower if there would be serious unrest internally?

[RED DAVE]

The real problem is that Red Dave confuses the communist mode of production on a world scale with very, very uneven transitions (both politically and socially) toward such.No I don't. I understand, unlike yourself, that the elimination of war and war industry is a key part of socialism.


I mean, even comrade MacnairIs that McNair the Kautskyite or McNair the Death Eater?


writes about the DOTP on a European scale, but with the European movement expressing moral support, solidarity, etc. with movements elsewhere. What does that imply about the regimes those movements live under?(emph added)

More important, what does this imply about you and McNair?

RED DAVE