Artillery fire off the coast of the Korea

[Rusty Shackleford]

DPRK and RoK fired into the ocean again...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/koreas-trade-artillery-fire-near-disputed-border-island-2335626.html

http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/NKorea-disputes-SKorea-s-artillery-claim-1813898.php

[Revolutionair]

So what is confirmed? Did the North attack the South first?

It's annoying to get decent information on this topic since 99% of it is biased.

[Rusty Shackleford]

DPRK says it was construction blasts that the RoK marines then responded to with artillery fire.

[Nox]

"construction blasts"

rofl :laugh:

[thesadmafioso]

Military posturing and grandstanding in Korea? Who would of guessed such madness could possibly befall us?

[CHE with an AK]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.

[scarletghoul]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.lol good idea except maybe the koreans dont want a bloodbath and nuclear holocaust

[gendoikari]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.

as much as I despise capitalists, in particular capitalist ass kissers like south korea, I think they'd be better than a total monarchy which lets be honest is what the north really is.

[Imposter Marxist]

as much as I despise capitalists, in particular capitalist ass kissers like south korea, I think they'd be better than a total monarchy which lets be honest is what the north really is.

Yeah, lets be honest. You have no idea what you're talking about.

[AnonymousOne]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Forces_Korea

There would be war, and the U.S would fight.

[Fulanito de Tal]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Forces_Korea

There would be war, and the U.S would fight.


More: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulchi-Freedom_Guardian

[CHE with an AK]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Forces_Korea

There would be war, and the U.S would fight.

How long do you think the 28,000 U.S. soldiers could hold out against 1.1 million North Koreans active soldiers, and 8 million in reserve?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea_Army

[Princess Luna]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.
How about shedding tears for all the South Koreans left dead or homeless after the invasion by the north, so a nation that you yourself said was not communist or Marxist can obtain more territory. Also the idea the U.S. would only respond with words is absurd, even 50 years after the Korean war the U.S. still keeps a large number of troops stationed on the border, first NK soldier who sets a foot into SK and NK will face the full wrath of the U.N. like it did 50 years, except this time China won't lift a finger to help.

[Rusty Shackleford]

The US has the RoK and Taiwan under its Nuclear Umbrella. (http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2011/03/120_47427.html)

Just because theres ~30,000 US troops there doesnt mean they are weak. US has forces in Okinawa and a few other parts of Japan plus a whole goddamned fleet.

Seriously, if war broke out, other fleets would be sent to the peninsula. and that is a shitfuckington of firepower. they are all centered around at least one aircraft carrier which is the back bone of the USN.

[Apoi_Viitor]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

1. With twice the population, and substantial technological advantages, South Korea could probably defeat North Korea by itself.

2. The US certainly has the military capability to destroy NK, even with its military spread so thin.

3. In the incredibly unlikely scenario that both the US and South Korea are unable to hold back North Korea, you can be assured that NATO or Japan would step in...

[CommunityBeliever]

It would definitely be nice to have a unified Korea, regardless of rather its under North Korean rule or South Korean rule. Lets get rid of the artificial border between the Koreans.

[Nox]

first NK soldier who sets a foot into SK and NK will face the full wrath of the UN.

Interestingly, a few times in the past 10-15 years a North Korean DMZ guard has crossed the line at that spot where the borders meet with meeting rooms etc (can't remember the exact name), and short exchanges of fire ensued. I have gotta respect the South for their patience, North Korea constantly sends spies, assassins, agents and even artillery shells south of the border.

[Nox]

1. With twice the population, and substantial technological advantages, South Korea could probably defeat North Korea by itself.

2. The US certainly has the military capability to destroy NK, even with its military spread so thin.

3. In the incredibly unlikely scenario that both the US and South Korea are unable to hold back North Korea, you can be assured that NATO or Japan would step in...

1.) No way. North Korea has an active army of over 1 million and a reserve army of at least 8 million. That's 9 million trained soldiers than can be deployed and swarm across the border, plus tons of artillery, planes etc, South Korea will be totally crushed, I don't see how anyone can deny that.

2.) Yes, that's true but North Korea will take the surrounding area down with it. They have nukes that they would use. With a active & reserve army totalling 9 million men, let's just put it simply... they will fuck shit up.

3.) I honestly doubt that another Korean war would ever happen, but one thing I'd like to say is that I think you have the wrong idea when you say it is North Korea vs South Korea + USA... The real war would be between North Korea and the USA with South Korea as the battlefield, South Korea really would be crushed very quickly and have very little if any influence on the outcome of a war.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Interestingly, a few times in the past 10-15 years a North Korean DMZ guard has crossed the line at that spot where the borders meet with meeting rooms etc (can't remember the exact name), and short exchanges of fire ensued. I have gotta respect the South for their patience, North Korea constantly sends spies, assassins, agents and even artillery shells south of the border.
uh...

[DinodudeEpic]

If a war between the Koreas happens....

it will be like this.

.North Korea blitz and nukes down South Korea
.USA counter charges, and fucks North Korea up

Of course, modern warfare's goal is to AVOID open engagements. Just fight a tiny war that has no purpose, but to get resources or spread influence. No conquests. So, the above scenario is not going to happen. It's still war, but it's smaller and called 'military action'.

[CHE with an AK]

How about shedding tears for all the South Koreans left dead or homeless after the invasion by the north
With every invasion there are regretably dead and homeless. But capitalism already starves to death 18,000 children a day - so it isn't as if the options are death or no death. The status quo is death already and defeating capitalism around the world will take large scale war imo.




a nation that you yourself said was not communist or Marxist can obtain more territory.
They aren't either - but they are anti-Western imperialist, and against the global financial capitalist order. If they want to try and bring down some of the U.S.'s biggest lap dogs, then great and our interests would in that instance overlap.




except this time China won't lift a finger to help.
All China would have to do is say they'll wipe off 1 trillion of U.S. debt to them, and the U.S. would gladly sell out South Korea imo. The U.S. owes China 2 billion $ that it can't pay back. Thus, it will probably have to let China take Taiwan and the Korean penninsula eventually. China's first step to annexing Korea, would probably involve letting the North and South destroy each other - and then taking all of it.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Goddamn i hate how Korea threads turn into war scenario fap-fests. im outta here.

http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/aircraft-pictures/ejectlarge.jpg

[Rafiq]

The bourgeoisie has no limits. We can hope this doesn't get any bigger, or else we'd see another case of workers being sent to die for the bourgeoisie's interests.

North Korea is fucked up, but the bourgeoisie doesn't have any plans on making it any better. The U.S. has spent a lot of resources making the South's economy nice and shiny, if they take ahold the North a United Korea will end up a third world African style shit hole and everyone will forget about it( like Russia in the 90's). We are looking at a heating in class conciseness around the globe so hopefully a war will not be tolerated by the masses.

[Aleenik]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.Ya... not a good idea in the least. Countless millions would die. China would definitely not help North Korea and North Korea would lose in the end.

Kin Jonng Mentally Ills's North Korea is far worse than South Korea. Just look at how he and his goons oppress and brainwash the people of North Korea. There is no comparison between life quality in North Korea and South Korea.


With every invasion there are regretably dead and homeless. But capitalism already starves to death 18,000 children a day - so it isn't as if the options are death or no death. The status quo is death already and defeating capitalism around the world will take large scale war imo.So you want North Korea to invade South Korea and take it over. The millions of deaths are only regrettable losses in the name of... what exactly? Anti Imperialism? Lol. A unified Korea under North Korea would be FAR worse than a unified Korea under South Korea. The quality of life in North Korea and the quality of life in South Korea is no contest. South Korea is a much better place to live by far. On the flipside, South Korea has no good justification for invading North Korea either. Sure, the people in North Korea live horrible lifes. But a war would kill millions. I hate war with a passion.

You are a sick person. You are advocating for the death of countless millions. The next time you prey to Che you should ask him for more clear guidence on this issue.

[CHE with an AK]

China would definitely not help North Korea and North Korea would lose in the end.
Well, I am glad you are a fortune teller. :rolleyes:
Since we are on the issue, how does the weather look for Saturday morning?




Kin Jonng Mentally Ills's North Korea is far worse than South Korea.
"Worse" I guess is relative. Although I would not argue that it is universally worse in every aspect and for every person. In fact, even DRPK's biggest critics admit that those who live in Pyonyang actually have a fairly decent standard of living if compared to the globe as a whole. Your comparison also doesn't take into account Western sanctions, isolation, the costs of forming a DPRK army to prevent invasion by the U$ and their puppets etc. South Korea on the other hand, gets to hide behind Uncle Sam's skirt and gets some of the benefits of being Uncle Sam's whore.




Just look at how he and his goons oppress and brainwash the people of North Korea.
And you don't think there is brainwashing in South Korea? Or America? Europe? etc Jong Il's is just more overt and honest about their intention.




There is no comparison between life quality in North Korea and South Korea.
If the only goal is to have some people live in luxury, then hell we might as well just keep capitalism - or try fascism. Considering you've been on the site for about a week, I'm not convinced you aren't a troll.




So you want North Korea to invade South Korea and take it over.
Not take it over, but militarially defeat it and remove US troops from it sure, and strip away one of the U.S.'s key economic puppets in the region.




A unified Korea under North Korea would be FAR worse than a unified Korea under South Korea.
Well, that is what the capitalists say, sure. One thing is for sure, it would help the capitalist sex tourism industry and turn Pyongyang into the new Bangkok for Western tourists. Plus I am sure Nike would love to get ahold of North Korean kid's hands to weave sneakers at 1 $ a day.




South Korea is a much better place to live by far.
It depends. I'm not sure a child laborer or prostitute in Seoul lives better than a govt employee in Pyongyang. In fact, you might be able to make the case that the average North Korean in Pyongyang lives better than the bottom 50 % in South Korea. But once again, communism is not about just getting us all shiny new stuff and toys to play with.




the people in North Korea live horrible lifes.
Have you ever been there? How many North Koreans have you ever spoken to? Where has your view of DPRK been spoon-fed from?




I hate war with a passion.
Well I guess that would include class war as well. Hey, good luck with that. Jackbooting Fascists don't have any problem steamrolling peacenik hippies.




You are a sick person. The next time you prey to Che
I'm sick of a world strangled by capitalism is what I'm "sick of". As for praying to Che I don't, but I have little doubt that he would also be calling for the defeat of S. Korea's govt as well, and removing US troops from the penninsula.

[Tommy4ever]

I remember an in depth discussion on another forum about who would win in a new Korean War. What seemed clear was that within 48 hours North Korea's incredible artillery would reduce Seoul to little more than rubble, but in the long run it is almost impossible to think that North Korea could ever win a war against the South, America and whichever other powers would also join in.

The main thing that would seem to make it very difficult for a war to ever actually break out is certainly Seoul. The South cannot attack the North with suprise. If the South evacuates people from the border regions then the North will have several days warning and might choose to strike first anyway. If the South attacks without an evacuation then tens of millions of South Koreans would be left within the range of the North's artillery likely resulting in hundreds of thousands of deaths, never mind the damage.

The only realistic way the Koreas will be united is if the regime in the North collapses on itself.

[Tim Cornelis]

1.) No way. North Korea has an active army of over 1 million and a reserve army of at least 8 million. That's 9 million trained soldiers than can be deployed and swarm across the border, plus tons of artillery, planes etc, South Korea will be totally crushed, I don't see how anyone can deny that.

2.) Yes, that's true but North Korea will take the surrounding area down with it. They have nukes that they would use. With a active & reserve army totalling 9 million men, let's just put it simply... they will fuck shit up.

3.) I honestly doubt that another Korean war would ever happen, but one thing I'd like to say is that I think you have the wrong idea when you say it is North Korea vs South Korea + USA... The real war would be between North Korea and the USA with South Korea as the battlefield, South Korea really would be crushed very quickly and have very little if any influence on the outcome of a war.

South Korea has 700,000 active personnel and 3 million reserve. That's about 1 South Korean soldier vs 2. North Korean soldiers. Plus, South Korea has superior technology. So no South Korea won't be "totally crushed".

[Ocean Seal]

1.) No way. North Korea has an active army of over 1 million and a reserve army of at least 8 million. That's 9 million trained soldiers than can be deployed and swarm across the border, plus tons of artillery, planes etc, South Korea will be totally crushed, I don't see how anyone can deny that.

2.) Yes, that's true but North Korea will take the surrounding area down with it. They have nukes that they would use. With a active & reserve army totalling 9 million men, let's just put it simply... they will fuck shit up.

3.) I honestly doubt that another Korean war would ever happen, but one thing I'd like to say is that I think you have the wrong idea when you say it is North Korea vs South Korea + USA... The real war would be between North Korea and the USA with South Korea as the battlefield, South Korea really would be crushed very quickly and have very little if any influence on the outcome of a war.

I disagree, the South has about 4 million troops in its standing army (this is possibly exaggerated). The South does conscript it's youth though, so I don't know. North Korea wouldn't be able to feed its large army for a long period of time. So I would think that the South would probably win this war especially with UN assistance.

[CommunityBeliever]

The North doesn't seem to be invading the South and vice versa so this is all just hypothetical.

[Invader Zim]

How long do you think the 28,000 U.S. soldiers could hold out against 1.1 million North Koreans active soldiers, and 8 million in reserve?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea_Army


With air dominance, armour and support from the sea? And with the North without any serious means of providing logistical support for its army as it is at the moment, let alone in an invasion? A lot longer than you believe.

[danyboy27]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.

''remember kid, its only imperialism when the capitalist does it, when pseudo left-wing tinpot dictator does it, we call it anti-imperialism''

You dont seem to understand the insane amount of firepower that is surrounding the korean peninsula. Its not really about those 28 000 american soldier, but about the aircraft carrier patrolling the region, the b2 bomber base in guam, the air bases and military bases in Japan, and the great economic ties the U.S share with China.

not so long ago north korea grounded certain type of aircraft beccause they where running out of kerosene, wich further demonstrate the lack of ressources the north korean army and air force have at its disposal.

if there is a conflict, it will be a bloodbath for the working classes of both countries, thousand, million will die under the bomb of american troops and the artillery shell of the north.

I Personally think its just sickening that you are still allowed to post on that website after advocating that kind of reactionary action.

[DarkPast]

I think that if North Korea had a good chance of taking over the South they'd have done it already. Likewise, the US and its client know that attacking North Korea would be extremely risky due to its nuclear weapons, costly because of its huge army and probably pointless because of its poverty.

So the status quo continues, and will do so until one of the regimes collapses from within, or until the global balance of power shifts and outside forces take a greater interest in Korea.

[gendoikari]

Yeah, lets be honest. You have no idea what you're talking about.

Okay then explain to me how it is not a total monarch with one man having all power, being looked at as a god, and passing power on to his children.

construct a logical argument that that isn't a monarchy

[gendoikari]

Kin Jonng Mentally Ills's North Korea is far worse than South Korea. Just look at how he and his goons oppress and brainwash the people of North Korea. There is no comparison between life quality in North Korea and South Korea.

Yeah, on a side note when the ultra high suicide rate dog eat dog capitalist posterboy nation is better than your country you've got problems. as a matter of fact i'll say you're FUBAR


And you don't think there is brainwashing in South Korea? Or America? Europe? etc Jong Il's is just more overt and honest about their intention.

It's also more damaging, the brainwashing the north Koreans employ actively alter a persons conscious personality to revere them as gods, and uses extreme fear of threats to themselves and their family to enforce this brainwashing, where as capitalist brain washing is done through lack of information, which can be researched, and little tricks such as adding a bit more fat to your food to make you more hungry, or changing the colors on a water bottle to make you want to get that as opposed to the next brand.


Have you ever been there? How many North Koreans have you ever spoken to? Where has your view of DPRK been spoon-fed from?

what was it kim jong il told his people to boil so they could have food a while back?

[svenne]

Uhm. Remember how it went down when Iraq's enormous army with old Soviet weapons and doctrines faced a modern force? Kill ratio like 1000 iraqis for every american? North Korea could propably erase Seoul from the face of the earth (as someone already pointed out), but i really can't see them winning a war in any case. And i'm pretty sure it's just some parts of the ML-left who thinks it's possible anyway. And the idea of China going to war with the US over North Korea; the result would be a total crash in Chinas economy, which would make the Great Depression look like the best and brightest of times. Some people here just seems to be living in their own world.
As for the quote "In fact, you might be able to make the case that the average North Korean in Pyongyang lives better than the bottom 50 % in South Korea", i would propably bet my whole collection of books by Marx (and Engels) that you're so incredible wrong that even Mao shudders in his grave.

[Catma]

Kim's regime is already on shaky ground. Do you really think he'd be able to suppress the inevitable insurrection by millions upon millions of South Koreans? There are tons of unhappy people in the north who would collaborate as well.

A northern invasion would result in the collapse of the Kim regime.

[Robocommie]

How long do you think the 28,000 U.S. soldiers could hold out against 1.1 million North Koreans active soldiers, and 8 million in reserve?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea_Army

Numbers alone confer no advantage. - Sun Tzu

[Tomhet]

With every invasion there are regretably dead and homeless. But capitalism already starves to death 18,000 children a day - so it isn't as if the options are death or no death. The status quo is death already and defeating capitalism around the world will take large scale war imo.



Wait what is that a justification for invasion of another country? why do people insist on picking sides in this conflict?

[thesadmafioso]

I am at a loss as to how this thread actually developed into a full on discussion of possible war scenarios between the two Korea's. I hate to burst some bubbles here, but neither side actually wants to see a situation of armed conflict break out on the peninsula. The North is fully aware that the US and other NATO powers will intervene on the behalf of the South and the South simply doesn't want to put its economic development in such a perilous position.

Both nations are fully aware that they stand to gain nothing from open warfare, but they realize the political benefits of this sort of posturing. Thus we are met with the current state of affairs in the region, where it often seems as if conflict may break out when in reality it is far from reaching such a point. It is sort of like a miniature version of MAD keeping both sides in line.

[CHE with an AK]

I Personally think its just sickening that you are still allowed to post on that website after advocating that kind of reactionary action.
So it is now "reactionary" to advocate that in your words a "pseudo left-wing tinpot dictator" attack a capitalist U.S. puppet regime which lets US troops occupy its territory for $? Did you sleep through 20th century history? Those are often the only kind of regime that can even mount any reasonable (but usually futile) offense/defense against U.S. imperialism and global capitalism. Left-wing "dictators" (to use your terminology) are what the West fears most because they are usually harder to buy off and more difficult to manipulate with outside pressure. Do you consider Hugo Chavez a dictator (I don't but you probably do)? If you do, then would you support him if he decided to go to war with the U.S. lap dog Colombian regime? I certainly would.




the brainwashing the north Koreans employ actively alter a persons conscious personality to revere them as gods, and uses extreme fear of threats to themselves and their family to enforce this brainwashing,
Have you ever heard of this movement called Christianity? A large number of South Korea now believes in a 2,000 year old Jewish zombie who they are expecting to fly down on earth and kill off all the non-beievers in a final battle.




A northern invasion would result in the collapse of the Kim regime.
Well, if you hate the North Korean regime, then shouldn't you also favor an invasion so he can be toppled?

[gendoikari]

Have you ever heard of this movement called Christianity? A large number of South Korea now believes in a 2,000 year old Jewish zombie who they are expecting to fly down on earth and kill off all the non-beievers in a final battle.

yeah but you don't see any government overtly shoving christianity down peoples throats. if you want to make that analogy it would only hold true if every american were forced to be christian or be sent to prison camps.

[CHE with an AK]

yeah but you don't see any government overtly shoving christianity down peoples throats.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Ok, we clearly live on different planets.

[gendoikari]

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Ok, we clearly live on different planets.

It's not SHOVED down our throats, you have the freedom to belong to whatever religion you want. Just because it's emphasized in pop culture as being the #1 does not mean that making the analogy between it and the cult of personality in north korea is valid. For one a buddhist over here isn't thrown in jail with the rest of his family where they will likely die.

[danyboy27]

So it is now "reactionary" to advocate that in your words a "pseudo left-wing tinpot dictator" attack a capitalist U.S. puppet regime which lets US troops occupy its territory for $?.

Its fucking reactionary to support any form of jingoistic or imperialist actions, if you dont agree ask to the admin about that.



Did you sleep through 20th century history? Those are often the only kind of regime that can even mount any reasonable (but usually futile) offense/defense against U.S. imperialism and global capitalism.

I just dont really see any concrete exemple where it was actually the case.
Last time i checked 99% of the world was still owned by the fucking U.S.A, vietnam included.

[CHE with an AK]

Its fucking reactionary to support any form of jingoistic or imperialist actions
So you think if North Korea attacked one of Imperialism's biggest Asian puppets (S. Korea) that it would be "imperialist"? It would not be imperialism imo for the North to try and unify the Korea's which were divided by the U.S.

[danyboy27]

Left-wing "dictators" (to use your terminology) are what the West fears most because they are usually harder to buy off and more difficult to manipulate with outside pressure.

Its one thing to advocate self defense, its another one to promote an imperialistic action.



Do you consider Hugo Chavez a dictator (I don't but you probably do)? If you do, then would you support him if he decided to go to war with the U.S. lap dog Colombian regime? I certainly would.

no he is not a dictator, and no i would not support him for invading columbia.

beccause, unlike you, i am a real anti-imperialist, i do not want a country fuck up another country working class in a stupid fucked up war of expension.

[danyboy27]

So you think if North Korea attacked one of Imperialism's biggest Asian puppets (S. Korea) that it would be "imperialist"? It would not be imperialism imo for the North to try and unify the Korea's which were divided by the U.S.

Saddam had the same kind of argument after he annexed coweit.

i bet you support russia action in chechenya.

[Metacomet]

Kim Jong Il should just call the West's bluff and invade South Korea. I think the South would fall in about a month and that the U.S. would mostly just denounce it with words (they certainly can't afford to directly take on the DPRK with the U.S. spread so thin).

I don't consider Kim Jong Il a communist or even a Marxist - but I won't shed any tears if he decides to topple South Korea - one of the regions most entrenched capitalist economies and the U.S.'s second most important regional lap dog after Japan.


South Korea would rip North Korea to shreds, are you serious? All the war would accomplish for the DPRK is a hell of a lot of civilian casualties.

I guarantee you the last time North Korea fired on that little island there, the South smashed that artillery position with radar guided counter battery fire and air power. But the North wouldn't acknowledge it. Instead it was a glorious victory for dear leader.


And South Korea has Christians? So what? They've been there for longer then the U.S has.


And the JSDF would provide about all the air-power and naval power South Korea might need that they couldn't provide themselves, it would be a rout, even though initially the North might do alright (alright as in, causing a heck of a lot of damage to one of the planets mega cities)

[CHE with an AK]

Its one thing to advocate self defense, its another one to promote an imperialistic action.
If North Korea attacked the South it could be seen as defensive. The South and the U.S. have carried out actions against N Korea that if done to anyone in NATO/E.U. etc - would be considered an act of war.




unlike you, i am a real anti-imperialist, i do not want a country fuck up another country working class in a stupid fucked up war of expension.
:laugh: That's cute. So I guess the Red Army was "imperialist" for going all the way to Berlin? American imperialism does not respect borders, so neither should anti-imperialism.

[gendoikari]

If North Korea attacked the South it could be seen as defensive. The South and the U.S. have carried out actions against N Korea that if done to anyone in NATO/E.U. etc - would be considered an act of war.




:laugh: That's cute. So I guess the Red Army was "imperialist" for going all the way to Berlin? American imperialism does not respect borders, so neither should anti-imperialism.

yeah, but it should also respect basic human rights, which the north clearly does not.

[CHE with an AK]

Saddam had the same kind of argument after he annexed coweit.
Kuwait was a feudal theocratic monarchy, designed by the U.S. to fulfill oil contracts. That area historically was part of Iraq, and Iraq had just as much of a claim to it as the Kuwaiti royal family did. Would I necessarially support Saddam in this instance? No. But strategically it would have torn away one of the U.S. military's low-price "gas stations", which would have benefited anti-imperialism globally.




i bet you support russia action in chechenya.
Actually no. In this analogy North Korea is Chechnya and Russia is the U.S./South Korea. I would support for instance, the Chechens making offensive attacks into Russia, since they are systematically under siege - and if they did, it would not be "imperialism".

[Skammunist]

even DRPK's biggest critics admit that those who live in Pyonyang actually have a fairly decent standard of living if compared to the globe as a whole.



Yea? Well people who live in Pyonyang enjoy massively better living conditions than most of North Korea. The only problem is, living in Pyongyang is mostly reserved for state workers or the most loyal civilians.




And you don't think there is brainwashing in South Korea? Or America? Europe? etc Jong Il's is just more overt and honest about their intention.


Yea, well you can freely refuse to believe in the brainwashing in these countries without getting killed.





If the only goal is to have some people live in luxury, then hell we might as well just keep capitalism - or try fascism. Considering you've been on the site for about a week, I'm not convinced you aren't a troll.


Sorry, I forgot that anyone who differs in opinion with you or has different beliefs as you do is a troll/right-winger/reactionary.





Have you ever been there?


Nope, never been to North Korea, and I probably wouldn't want to either.







but I have little doubt that he would also be calling for the defeat of S. Korea's govt as well, and removing US troops from the penninsula.

I don't think he would be for the deaths of possibly millions of people in the result of a nuclear shitstorm. But you probably know him better than I do.



Have you ever heard of this movement called Christianity? A large number of South Korea now believes in a 2,000 year old Jewish zombie who they are expecting to fly down on earth and kill off all the non-beievers in a final battle.


You can choose to not believe in that leader. However, you can't choose to not believe in the "Dear Leader". Well you could, but you know what happens to them.

[CHE with an AK]

Sorry, I forgot that anyone who differs in opinion with you or has different beliefs as you do is a troll/right-winger/reactionary.
Awesome, the South Vietnamese american-exile Diem apologist who traffics in U.S. anti-communist propaganda has arrived ... :rolleyes:

I've given up on debating right-wing hacks.

[Skammunist]

Sorry, I forgot that anyone who differs in opinion with you or has different beliefs as you do is a troll/right-winger/reactionary.




I've given up on debating right-wing hacks.

Exactly. Point proven.

[danyboy27]

If North Korea attacked the South it could be seen as defensive. The South and the U.S. have carried out actions against N Korea that if done to anyone in NATO/E.U. etc - would be considered an act of war.

and you could use that logic to justify israeli action against lebannon has well!
Brillant!



:laugh: That's cute. So I guess the Red Army was "imperialist" for going all the way to Berlin? American imperialism does not respect borders, so neither should anti-imperialism.
and i guess dividing europe like a Risk game board during the postam conference wasnt imperialism either?

Going to Berlin had nothing to do about anti-imperialism, It was land grab, pure and simple, just like the american intervention in europe was another form of land grab.

[CHE with an AK]

and you could use that logic to justify israeli action against lebannon has well!
Brillant!
No! In that analogy Lebanon would be North Korea, and Israel would be S. Korea and the U.S. - In fact, Israel is a strong ally of the U.S. and South Korea.

You are either the worst analogizer ever - or not very bright.

[danyboy27]

No! In that analogy Lebanon would be North Korea, and Israel would be S. Korea and the U.S. - In fact, Israel is a strong ally of the U.S. and South Korea.

You are either the worst analogizer ever - or not very bright.

The argument that its okay to invade another country for self defense has been used time and time again trought history to justify murder and genocide trought the world.

and yet, you still cling to it.

[electro_fan]

wtf is this i dont even

[electro_fan]

So it is now "reactionary" to advocate that in your words a "pseudo left-wing tinpot dictator" attack a capitalist U.S. puppet regime which lets US troops occupy its territory for $? Did you sleep through 20th century history? Those are often the only kind of regime that can even mount any reasonable (but usually futile) offense/defense against U.S. imperialism and global capitalism. Left-wing "dictators" (to use your terminology) are what the West fears most because they are usually harder to buy off and more difficult to manipulate with outside pressure. Do you consider Hugo Chavez a dictator (I don't but you probably do)? If you do, then would you support him if he decided to go to war with the U.S. lap dog Colombian regime? I certainly would.




Have you ever heard of this movement called Christianity? A large number of South Korea now believes in a 2,000 year old Jewish zombie who they are expecting to fly down on earth and kill off all the non-beievers in a final battle.




Well, if you hate the North Korean regime, then shouldn't you also favor an invasion so he can be toppled?


Umm I take it you're american and live in the US right? if you're ok for north korea to attack south korea for being a "US puppet" then would you be ok for north korea to attack the US itself?

and so what if there are christians in south korea, there are christians in every country, probably even north korea. and wtf has the fact he was Jewish got to do with it, are you racist or something?

[electro_fan]

Well, if you hate the North Korean regime, then shouldn't you also favor an invasion so he can be toppled?

Lol, go and join the AWL or something, you seem to like wars so much you'd probably be at home there !