Moron with tinfoil hat firmly on speaks of the Illuminati!

[waspman]

I am VERY curious to see what the revolutionary left think about this taboo topic. I hope to see your responses.

First Jews in America are 2-3% of the total population yet:

This is TOO MUCH power for one group of people, especially such a low % of the worlds population

They own:
THE JEWISH 500


BANKING/FINANCE

1. GMAC

Owned by Cerberus Capital Management, which is headed by Steve Feinberg.


RETAIL

1. Sears/K Mart

Sears was controlled nearly from its inception by the Julius Rosenwald family, and then by Max Adler, who married Sophie Rosenwald. A Significant number of the company’s shares are still Jewish controlled to this day.


2. The Home Depot
The Home Depot was founded in 1978 by Bernie Marcus, Arthur Blank (Atlanta Falcons), Ron
Brill, and Pat Farrah. This is the second largest retailer in America, behind Wal-Mart. The
Jewish founders retain substantial holdings in the company.
3. Victoria’s Secret (Les Wexner)
4. The Limited (Les Wexner)
5. Bath & Body Works (Les Wexner)
6. The Men’s Wearhouse ( George Zimmer)
7. Staples Office Supply (Thomas G. Stemberg)
8. Office Depot (Merged with Staples, Thomas G. Stemberg)
9. Bon Ton Stores (Founded by Max Grumbacher)
Also includes the following stores:
Elder-Beerman
Parisian
Saks Inc.
Bergner’s
Boston Store
Carson Pirie Scott
Herbergers’
Younkers
Pomeroy’s
Maxwell’s
Fowler’s Department Store

10. Steve & Barry’s University Sportswear (Steve Shore & Barry Prevor)
11. The Gap (Donald Fisher, founder, holds 37% of stock)
12. Banana Republic (Donald Fisher, founder, holds 37% of stock)
13. Old Navy (Donald Fisher, founder, holds 37% of stock)
14. American Eagle Outfitters (founded 1904 by Edward Beinstein.
Current CEO J.L. Schottenstein)
15. ABC Warehouse
16. Circuit City (founded 1949 as Wards Appliance Store by Samuel S. Wurtzel, Jewish)
17. Costco Warehouses (founded 1954 by Sol Price, Jewish, as Fed Mart)
18. Spencer Gifts (Steve Silverstein, CEO. Privately held corporation)
19. Eddy Bauer
20. Starbucks (Howarad D. Schultz, CEO)


INSURANCE


1. AIG (American International Group)

Director: Marshall A. Cohen, (Jewish), member of Tri Lateral Commission. (source: Wikipedia)

Cohen also sits on the “International Advisory Committee of the Blackstone Group, a Jewish

run “private equity and investment firm.� Blackstone was co-founded by Stephen A.

Schwarzman,


2. Safe Auto Insurance Company (1-800-SAFE-AUTO) Privately held corporation. CEO is Ari

Deshe; Vice Chairman and President is Jonathan Diamond.


SPORTS


1. Miami Heat, 65% owned by the Ted Arison family of Tel Aviv, Israel


2. Washington Redskins, owned by Daniel Snyder (Jewish)


3. Indianapolis Colts, owned by Jim Irsay (Jewish)


4. New England Patriots, owned by Robert Kraft (Jewish)


5. Tampa Bay Buccaneers, owned by Malcolm Glazer (Jewish)


6. Denver Broncos, owned by Pat Bowlen (Jewish)


7. Philadelphia Eagles, owned by Jeffrey Lurie (Jewish)


8. Cleveland Browns, owned by Al Lerner (Jewish)


9. Minnesota Vikings, owned by Zygi Wilf (Jewish)


10. New York Giants, owned by the Mara & Tisch families (Jewish)


11. Atlanta Falcons, owned by Arthur Blank (Jewish)


12. Seattle Seahawks, owned by Paul Allen (Jewish)


13. Philadelphia Flyers, owned by Comcast (Brian L. Roberts, Jewish)


14. Philadelphia 76ers, owned by Comcast (Brian L. Roberts, Jewish)


SERVICES


1. H & R Block Income Tax Service

Founded


2. U-Haul

Founded by Leonard Samuel Shoen, 1945, committed suicide 1999; family still controls around

40% of the corporation’s publicly traded stock.


MEDIA


1. Capital Cities/ABC/Disney [Revenue: $30.8 billion]

President and CEO is Robert Iger

This company controls the following media empire:

Buena Vista Distribution

Walt Disney Pictures

Touchstone Pictures

Pixar Animation Studios

Walt Disney Animation Studios

Miramax Films

Disney Toon Studios

Hollywood Pictures

ABC Network

ABC News

ABC Family

ABC News Now

The Disney Channel

Jetix

Jetix Play

SOAPnet

Toon Disney

Lifetime Entertainment Services (50%)

A & E Television Network (37.5%)

ABC Studios

Disney-ABC Domestic Television

Disney-ABC International Television

Walt Disney Television Animation

Radio Disney

ESPN Networks (80%), to include:

ESPN

ESPN 2

ESPN Classic

ESPN News

ESPN Deportes

ESPNU

ESPN on ABC

ESPN HD

ESPN 2 HD

ESPN Radio

ESPN Deportes Radio

ESPN The Magazine

ESPN Now

ESPN Plus

ESPN PPV

ESPN 360

NASN

Walt Disney Parks & Resorts, to include:

Disneyland Resort

Walt Disneyworld Resort

Tokyo Disney Resort

Disneyland Resort Paris

Hong Kong Disneyland Resort

Disney Cruise Line

Disney Regional Entertainment

Walt Disney Imagineering

ABC-owned Television Stations, to include:

KABC, Los Angeles

KFSN, Fresno

KGO, San Francisco

KTRK, Houston

WABC, New York City (Live With Regis & Kelli)

WJRT, Flint, Saginaw, Bay City (Michigan)

WPVI, Philadelphia

WLC, Chicago

WTVG, Toledo

ABC-owned Radio Stations, to include:

KDIS, Pasadena

KDIZ, Minneapolis, St. Paul

KESN, Dallas/Fort Worth

KMIK, Tempe, AZ

KMKY, Oakland, CA

KNIT, Dallas/Fort Worth (Spanish language ESPN)

KSPN, Los Angeles

WDDY, Albany, NY

WEAE, Pittsburgh

WEPN, New York City

WFDF, Farmington Hills (Detroit), MI

WMKI, Boston

WMVP, Chicago

WQEW, New York City

WRDZ, Lagrange, IL

WRDZ FM, Indianapolis, IN
WSDZ, Belleville, IL

WWCS, Pittsburgh

WWMK, Cleveland

ABC News Radio

Disney Interactive Studios

Hyperion

Muppets Holding Company

Reedy Creek Energy Services

Walt Disney Theatrical








2. Viacom/CBS

CEO/major stockholder: (Sumner Redstone, changed name from Murray Rothstein)


3. The New York Times

Controlled by the Arthur Sulzberger family


4. The Washington Post

Controlled by the Katherine Graham Mayer family


5. U.S. News and World Report

CEO and major stockholder Mortimer Zuckerman


6. CanWest (Canada’s second largest media conglomerate)

Founded and run by the Jewish Asper family


7. The NFL Network

Currently run by Stephen Bornstein, who was formerly head of ESPN and president of ABC


8. Google

Co-founded by Sergey Brin (Jewish) and Larry Page


9. Advance Publications (Samuel Newhouse)

The company owns/controls the following newspapers:

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Indianapolis/Marion IN)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Orlando, FL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Bakersfield, CA)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Pensacola, FL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Elmore County, AL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company, (Eufaula, AL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company, (Birmingham, AL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company, (Farmington, Novi, Livonia, Redford, MI)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company (Tampa Bay, FL)

Brighthouse Networks Cable Television Company, (Palm Beach County, FL)

The Business Journal (Austin TX)

Baltimore Business Journal (Baltimore, MD)

Birmingham Business Journal (Birmingham, AL)

Buffalo Business Journal (Buffalo, NY)

Charlotte Business Journal (Charlotte, NC)

Cincinnati Business Journal (Cincinnati, OH)

Columbus Business Journal (Columbus, OH)

Dallas Business Journal (Dallas, TX)

Dayton Business Journal (Dayton, OH)

Denver Business Journal (Denver, CO)

Eastbay Business Journal (Oakland, CA)

Triad Business Journal (Greensboro, NC)

Pacific Business Journal (Honolulu, HI)

Houston Business Journal (Houston, TX)

Jacksonville Business Journal (Jacksonville, FL)

Kansas City Business Journal (KC, MO)

Business First of Louisville (Louisville, KY)

Memphis Business Journal (Memphis, TN)

Milwaukee Business Journal (Milwaukee, WI)

Minneapolis/St. Paul Business Journal (Twin Cities)

Nashville Business Journal (Nashville, TN)

Orlando Business Journal (Orlando, FL)

Philadelphia Business Journal (Philadelphia, PA)

Phoenix Business Journal (Phoenix, AZ)

Pittsburgh Business Journal (Pittsburg, PA)

Portland Business Journal (Portland, OR)

Triangle Business Journal (Raleigh, NC)

Sacramento Business Journal (Sacramento, CA)

St. Louis Business Journal (St. Louis, MO)
San Antonio Business Journal (San Antonio, TX)

San Francisco Business Journal (San Francisco, CA)

San Jose Business Journal (San Jose, CA)

Seattle Business Journal (Seattle, WA)

South Florida Business Journal (Miami, FL)

Tampa Bay Business Journal (Tampa, FL)

Washington DC Business Journal (Washington DC)

Wichita Business Journal (Wichita, KS)

The Birmingham (AL) News

The Patriot-News (Harrisburg, PA)

The Express-Times (Easton, PA)

The Allentown (PA) Times

The Huntsville (AL) Times

The Press-Register (Mobile, AL)

The Jersey Journal (Jersey City, NJ)

The Star-Ledger (Newark, NJ)

Gloucester County Times (Woodbury, NJ)

Today’s Sunbeam (Salem, NJ)

Bridgeton (NJ) Evening News

The Times (Trenton, NJ)

Mississippi Press (Pascagoula, MS)

The Oregonian (Portland, OR)

The Hillsboro (OR) Argus

The Plain Dealer (Cleveland, OH)

Staten Island Advance, (New York City)

Syracuse (NY) Post-Standard

The New Orleans (LA) Times-Picayune

The Springfield Republic (Springfield, MA)

Sun Newspapers (Cleveland area)

Ann Arbor News (MI)

Bay City Times (MI)

Flint Journal (MI)

Grand Rapids Press (MI)

Jackson Citizen-Patriot) (MI)

Kalamazoo Gazette (MI)

Muskegon Chronicle (MI)

Saginaw News (MI)

Sports Business Journal

Sports Business Daily

NASCAR Scene

NASCAR Illustrated

Street & Smiths Sports Annuals

Hemmings Motor News

Hemmings Muscle Machines

Hemmings Sports & Exotic Cars

Hemmings Classic Car

The Sporting News

Allure

Architectural Digest

Bon Appetit

Brides

House & Garden

Conde Nast Traveler

Glamour

Gourmet

GQ

Jane

Lucky

The New Yorker

Parade

Self

Tatler

Vanity Fair

Vogue

Wired

The World of Interiors

W

Women’s Wear Daily

Daily News Record

Footwear News

Home Furnishings News

Highpoints

Executive Technology

Children’s Business

Supermarket News

&nb sp; Brand Marketing

&nb sp; Salon News

&nb sp; Details

Elegant Bride

&nb sp; Golf Digest

&nb sp; Golf for Women

&nb sp; Golf World

&nb sp; Golf World Business

&nb sp; Pivot Cellphone Service

&nb sp;


10. Block Communications (Allen Block, Jewish)

This company owns the following media assets,

according to Hoover’s Handbook:


The Toledo Blade newspaper

The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette newspaper

Buckeye Cablesystem (Toledo, OH)

Buckeye Telesystem (Toledo, OH)

Buckeye Express High Speed Internet (Toledo, OH)

Buckeye-Access Dial-up Internet (Toledo, OH)

Metro Fiber & Cable Construction Company (Toledo, OH)

KTRV (Nampa-Boise ID, Fox TV Affiliate)

WAND (Decatur, IL, NBC TV Affiliate)

WDRB (Louisville, KY, Fox TV Affiliate)

WMYO (Louisville, KY, My TV Affiliate)

WLIO (Lima, OH, NBC Affiliate)

WTO5 (Toledo, OH, CW Cable Channel)


11. Comcast (Brian L. Roberts, Jewish)

Comcast is the largest provider of cable television

in the United States; it is also the second largest provider

of internet service in our country. (Source: Wikipedia)

Revenue: US$24.97 billion (2007)


In addition to its massive cable and internet business,

Comcast owns the following media properties:


E! Entertainment Television

Style Network

The Golf Network

OLN

G4

AZN Television

PBS Kids Sprout

TV One



Roberts also sits on the corporate board of the Bank of New York




&nb sp;

&nb sp;


MANUFACTURING


1. Chrysler LLC

Owned by Cerberus Capital, which is headed by Steve Feinberg. Cerberus owns/controls a

multitude of other companies as well, included GMAC. Source: Wikipedia


TECHNOLOGY


1. Intel

founded by Andrew Grove (Jewish) Source: Wikipedia


2. Oracle

founded by Larry Ellison (Jewish) Source: Wikipedia


3. Dell Computer

founded by Michael Dell (Jewish) Source: Wikipedia

Dell computers are sold through Office Depot (also Jewish owned, see Retail list)


4. United Online

founded by Mark Goldston (Jewish) Source: Wikipedia

Subsidiaries of this company include Netzero, Bluelight Internet Services, and Juno


TRAVEL & LEISURE


1. Carnival Cruise Lines (80% ownership by the Ted Arison family of Tel Aviv, Israel

[Mythbuster]

Looks like an interesting topic.

Zionist Media Control=NOT GOOD. I am against amy religious movement having media control; or the gov't having media control.

Ay any rate, I can only imagine how terrible it would be...

[Nox]

It's a silly myth. Fascists use it as an excuse to victimise Jews.

[jake williams]

The media is mostly controlled by capitalists. Capitalists (in the West, so not, say, in the Arab states, where Al Jazeera and Al Arabia are clearly not pro-Zionist) tend to be "Zionists" in some minor sense because it's in their class interests. Modern "Zionism" is about Israeli state militarism and expansionism, which are useful to the bourgeoisie for all sorts of reasons.

I'm sure you can find lots of Jews in media, but I doubt you could make the case that it's relevant at all. The support for the state of Israel in the Western capitalist media has little to do with Jews being in positions of power in the media business. In fact, I woudn't be surprised if you could find lots of liberal Jews being major proponents of moderate criticism of Israel in the bourgeois press, if you cared to look.

[MarxSchmarx]

I am assuming that question is basically about the news media.

The capitalist press, at least in the global north, is squarely in the camp of the ruling class and the state. Their basic support for the Israeli state is no more troubling than their basic support for say El Salvador or Canada.

You have to understand that Israel is unique because there are lots of non-Israelis that are staunch supporters of Israeli state policies - there is for example no real group that is a staunch supporter of Thailand made up of non-Thais. On this issue, I think the apparently greater coverage that the zionists get is due more to this objective dynamic than any systemic bias on the part of the media.

[waspman]

The media is mostly controlled by capitalists. Capitalists (in the West, so not, say, in the Arab states, where Al Jazeera and Al Arabia are clearly not pro-Zionist) tend to be "Zionists" in some minor sense because it's in their class interests. Modern "Zionism" is about Israeli state militarism and expansionism, which are useful to the bourgeoisie for all sorts of reasons.

I'm sure you can find lots of Jews in media, but I doubt you could make the case that it's relevant at all. The support for the state of Israel in the Western capitalist media has little to do with Jews being in positions of power in the media business. In fact, I woudn't be surprised if you could find lots of liberal Jews being major proponents of moderate criticism of Israel in the bourgeois press, if you cared to look.

Any opposition to Israel and millions will be given to your opponents if you are a politician. 40% of Republican party funds come from Jewish sources and Obama's biggest contributers were Jewish.

[Nuvem]

Any opposition to Israel and millions will be given to your opponents if you are a politician. 40% of Republican party funds come from Jewish sources and Obama's biggest contributers were Jewish.

Not...sure...if....anti-Semitic...

[waspman]

Not...sure...if....anti-Semitic...


Anti-Semitic would mean I have a dislike or hate of Jewish people. In fact I am ethnically Jewish, and I sure as hell dont hate my own people. I am not saying anything oppressive I am simply stating facts.

[Nox]

Not...sure...if....anti-Semitic...

As soon as he listed all of those companies, I knew for sure. :cool:

[Nox]

Anti-Semitic would mean I have a dislike or hate of Jewish people. In fact I am ethnically Jewish, and I sure as hell dont hate my own people. I am not saying anything oppressive I am simply stating facts.


What point are you trying to make with this thread? As far as I can see (please correct me if I'm wrong), you're an anti-semite who's showing us a list of jewish-owned companies to try and persuade us that jews are evil and zionism is taking over the world... ;)

[Nuvem]

^That's the impression that I got as well. You're presenting the issue more in light of the ethnic composition of the business owners rather than their status as political Zionists, which makes me ask the above question.

[waspman]

What point are you trying to make with this thread? As far as I can see (please correct me if I'm wrong), you're an anti-semite who's showing us a list of jewish-owned companies to try and persuade us that jews are evil and zionism is taking over the world... ;)

Please dont say i am an anti-semite. There are TONS of Jews like my self who are against Zionism and Jewish control. Look it up. In Israel we have a lot of Jewish groups who protest the far right wing Israeli government to stop ethnically cleansing Palestinians. It is simply covered up in the media. Also our government only lets in Ethnic Jews. We should embrace a multicultural stance like the western world in my opinion and be a more free society.

[Nox]

Please dont say i am an anti-semite. There are TONS of Jews like my self who are against Zionism and Jewish control. Look it up. In Israel we have a lot of Jewish groups who protest the far right wing Israeli government to stop ethnically cleansing Palestinians. It is simply covered up in the media. Also our government only lets in Ethnic Jews. We should embrace a multicultural stance like the western world in my opinion and be a more free society.

Read Nuvem's post, I think he explains it better than me.

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and believe you seeing as I've been in a similar situation before:)

[waspman]

^That's the impression that I got as well. You're presenting the issue more in light of the ethnic composition of the business owners rather than their status as political Zionists, which makes me ask the above question.


You do no think it strange that such a small minority owns so much? African Americans outnumber us by about 6 times and look at how many corporations they own! Same with Hispanics and Asians!

[Nuvem]

We understand this point, I work with a lot of anti-Zionist people of Jewish descent. One of my party's local branch leaders is an ethnic Jew. We're simply questioning your presentation of this in light of ethnicity rather than political alignment; the implication of your claim that -
Jews in America are 2-3% of the total population yet:

This is TOO MUCH power for one group of people, especially such a low % of the worlds population- would be that you're suggesting taking some sort of action aimed directly at people of Jewish ethnicity. So what is it exactly that you're getting at?

[Nox]

waspman, one inconsistency I see is that you list people who are ethnic jews, therefore assuming all of those jews are zionists and therefore de facto assume all jews are zionists, which doesn't make sense seeing as you claim to be a jew who isn't a zionist

[waspman]

We understand this point, I work with a lot of anti-Zionist people of Jewish descent. One of my party's local branch leaders is an ethnic Jew. We're simply questioning your presentation of this in light of ethnicity rather than political alignment; the implication of your claim that -- would be that you're suggesting taking some sort of action aimed directly at people of Jewish ethnicity. So what is it exactly that you're getting at?


I simply wish to inform. If we could only somehow banish all types of class this would not be a problem. I think it should not be blacks for blacks jews for jews asians for asians etc etc.. it should be humans for humans. Any people that declare themselves a "group" who only wish to help their own and only their own should be stopped.

[waspman]

waspman, one inconsistency I see is that you list people who are ethnic jews, therefore assuming all of those jews are zionists and therefore de facto assume all jews are zionists, which doesn't make sense seeing as you claim to be a jew who isn't a zionist

To be honest I made the title "Zionist" in order not to offend by saying the word "Jew" which some people find offensive.

[Nuvem]

That's why we ask why this thread exists. The ethnic composition of business ownership is a moot point when our goal is the abolition of private capital and the seizure of all means of production by the Proletariat. It's ultimately a non-issue.

[Nox]

To be honest I made the title "Zionist" in order not to offend by saying the word "Jew" which some people find offensive.

So you've just backed up everything I said...

You're assuming all Jews are zionists, which is hypocritical seeing as you claim to be a jew who isn't a zionist.

So really you're just saying "something must be done about all these jews owning this huge list of companies", if that isn't anti-semitic i dont know what is...

[waspman]

So you've just backed up everything I said...

You're assuming all Jews are zionists, which is hypocritical seeing as you claim to be a jew who isn't a zionist.

So really you're just saying "something must be done about all these jews owning this huge list of companies", if that isn't anti-semitic i dont know what is...

The only thing I said about zionism is the title which I explained earlier why I made that the title. I of course was talking of Jews if you read my previous thread. What if black people who are 12% of the population owned this vast amount of companies/media conglomerates. There would be an outrage by most people

[Nox]

The only thing I said about zionism is the title which I explained earlier why I made that the title. I of course was talking of Jews if you read my previous thread. What if black people who are 12% of the population owned this vast amount of companies/media conglomerates. There would be an outrage by most people

...No it wouldn't, you're on a very-very-left forum, nobody here distinguishes between races, especially not on issues like this.

[waspman]

...No it wouldn't, you're on a very-very-left forum, nobody here distinguishes between races, especially not on issues like this.

It would obviously not outrage anyone on this forum, but the common capitalist man would be......

[Nox]

- You replace the word 'jew' with 'zionist' in yout title, thus implying you think all jews are zionists.

- You claim this thread is about zionists, yet you just list companies that are owned by jews, thus implying you think all jews are zionists

- You claim that something "MUST BE DONE" about the jews owning all of these companies, thus implying you are anti-semite

- You claim to be a jew and not a zionist which contradicts what you implied before about all jews being zionists

- You then assume people would be outraged if blacks owned companies, thus implying you are racist.

I haven't made any of this stuff up, all of this has been stuff you have said/implied.

[Die Rote Fahne]

Check out "Peace, Propaganda, and the Promised Land". It's a documentary on the very issue.

[Nox]

It would obviously not outrage anyone on this forum, but the common capitalist man would be......

Well the common capitalist man is stupid/brainwashed ;)

[jake williams]

I'm not convinced you're not a troll and I'm not convinced this thread will last long enough for me to reply, but for what it's worth.

Your numbers are definitely a bit sketchy. You're practically listing every company you could find that ever had a Jew in a position of authority - you're not listing companies with Jewish owners, you're listing companies with owners, directors, CEOs, founders, and so on. And as has been pointed out, your assertion that Jews are some how directing media coverage in some unacceptable and otherwise inexplicable way, and your implication that Jews in particular are unsuited for positions of authority and suggestion that they ought be replaced, is indeed disturbing.

That said, there's no use denying that Jews are overrepresented in US business in proportion to their share of the US population, in a similar sense that white people in general are overrepresented, while blacks and hispanics (to use the venacular) are underrepresented. This in no way suggests some special antipathy to white people (myself included) on my part, but it's a fact that is easily demonstrated. And in all cases the facts have complicated historical reasons. The relationship between a particular social marginality, mercantilism and the development of European finance is amply discussed in the historical literature, and not really contested. I think significant ethnic over/underrepresentations are symptoms of the iniquities of capitalism, unless one actually believes that one's parents or ethnicity should substantially affect one's hopes of material success and access to political power, which it's obvious being Jewish rather than Irish Catholic does. But the picking out of Jews in particular has a long history of being used to forward a particular political agenda, specifically the deflection of rage against capitalism onto Jews, and the targetting by non-Jewish businessmen of Jewish competitors. The same history makes it quite clear that the presence of Jews in business doesn't substantively affect how the business operates, that Jewish bankers don't act any differently than WASPy or Catholic or even Islamic bankers (except that the latter love anti-Semitism as a weapon against their competitors), and so on.

In light of the prevalance and utility of anti-Semitism in throwing working class politics off course, it's important to be subtle, cautious and honest about all this. The fact that Jews are, or at least seem, to be overrepresented in the ruling class means that anti-capitalist policies can easily be misconstrued as anti-Semitic. In fact we have some experience of this in regards to Israel. (There's also an increasing "scientific racist" literature arguing that European Jews are genetically superior and that's why they're overrepresented in business). It's important to make clear that we're really not especially concerned about the ethnic composition of the bourgeoisie, that we are committed anti-racists who won't tolerate anti-semitism but will neither tolerate racist exclusion nor the economic and political structures which give rise to it. Including those which in part allowed some Jews to do unusually well in business, speaking historically.

[waspman]

- You replace the word 'jew' with 'zionist' in yout title, thus implying you think all jews are zionists.

- You claim this thread is about zionists, yet you just list companies that are owned by jews, thus implying you think all jews are zionists

1.I said several times I changed the word JEWS to ZIONISTS in order not to offend. It was a mistake. I apologize.

- You claim that something "MUST BE DONE" about the jews owning all of these companies, thus implying you are anti-semite

2.If you are really anti-racist you should oppose any ethnic group controlling too much/having an inproportionate amount of power,even if its your own ethnicity


- You claim to be a jew and not a zionist which contradicts what you implied before about all jews being zionists

3.See number 1.

- You then assume people would be outraged if blacks owned companies, thus implying you are racist.

4.Implying other people are racist makes me a racist?

I haven't made any of this stuff up, all of this has been stuff you have said/implied.
you are obviously trying to slander me. I am going to bed ill respond to all posts in the morning. P.S. no hard feelings

[waspman]

I'm not convinced you're not a troll and I'm not convinced this thread will last long enough for me to reply, but for what it's worth.

Your numbers are definitely a bit sketchy. You're practically listing every company you could find that ever had a Jew in a position of authority - you're not listing companies with Jewish owners, you're listing companies with owners, directors, CEOs, founders, and so on. And as has been pointed out, your assertion that Jews are some how directing media coverage in some unacceptable and otherwise inexplicable way, and your implication that Jews in particular are unsuited for positions of authority and suggestion that they ought be replaced, is indeed disturbing.

That said, there's no use denying that Jews are overrepresented in US business in proportion to their share of the US population, in a similar sense that white people in general are overrepresented, while blacks and hispanics (to use the venacular) are underrepresented. This in no way suggests some special antipathy to white people (myself included) on my part, but it's a fact that is easily demonstrated. And in all cases the facts have complicated historical reasons. The relationship between a particular social marginality, mercantilism and the development of European finance is amply discussed in the historical literature, and not really contested. I think significant ethnic over/underrepresentations are symptoms of the iniquities of capitalism, unless one actually believes that one's parents or ethnicity should substantially affect one's hopes of material success and access to political power, which it's obvious being Jewish rather than Irish Catholic does. But the picking out of Jews in particular has a long history of being used to forward a particular political agenda, specifically the deflection of rage against capitalism onto Jews, and the targetting by non-Jewish businessmen of Jewish competitors. The same history makes it quite clear that the presence of Jews in business doesn't substantively affect how the business operates, that Jewish bankers don't act any differently than WASPy or Catholic or even Islamic bankers (except that the latter love anti-Semitism as a weapon against their competitors), and so on.

In light of the prevalance and utility of anti-Semitism in throwing working class politics off course, it's important to be subtle, cautious and honest about all this. The fact that Jews are, or at least seem, to be overrepresented in the ruling class means that anti-capitalist policies can easily be misconstrued as anti-Semitic. In fact we have some experience of this in regards to Israel. (There's also an increasing "scientific racist" literature arguing that European Jews are genetically superior and that's why they're overrepresented in business). It's important to make clear that we're really not especially concerned about the ethnic composition of the bourgeoisie, that we are committed anti-racists who won't tolerate anti-semitism but will neither tolerate racist exclusion nor the economic and political structures which give rise to it. Including those which in part allowed some Jews to do unusually well in business, speaking historically.

q

[Motown]

This "Jews own the media!" conspiracy has always been stupid fascist spewed shit. You also ignore the fact that there are virtually no Jews in the South or in rural areas. They represent a large portion of the populations in LA and NYC, the entertainment capitals. I think the are around 30% of NYC's population or something.

[Nox]

No, waspman, no hard feelings.

1.) Zionist really isn't a good substitute for 'jew', it does imply to a certain degree that you think all/most jews are zionists.

2.) As far as I see it, there are only the exploiters and the exploited. It doesn't matter what ethnicities make up the exploiters, it would make no difference to me if they were all black, all white, all jew, all asian, or a mixture.

3.) You implied all jews are zionists because you made a huge list of companies owned by 'zionists', but really you just looked for companies that had a jew in a high position in that company. (also see number 1)

4.) see number 2


I am not trying to slander you, I'm just trying to weigh up the argument and see if you are 'for real', if you were to tell me that you were an ex-fascist who recently turned to communism, then I might believe that you aren't trolling because some of your old beliefs would still linger.

[ComradeMan]

Wooooooooooo

We're "publishing" lists of "Jews" in "powerful/influential" places and saying something must be done about it?

Why does that ring an historical bell?

What exactly should be done about it then?

This thread should be trashed for the anti-semitic junk it represents.

[Welshy]

I'm doing what you guys should have done from the get-go on this anti-semitic trash thread.

http://www.animals-zone.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Baby-Animals-24.jpg

[Jimmie Higgins]

This is really just an old anti-Semitic line. It could be argued that people from Jewish bacgrounds dominated early Hollywood but that's simply due to the way the industry developed and the effects of anti-semitism in society forcing Jewish immigrants to find non-mainstream "niches" to make money and survive.

So Jewish people ran dive-y ghetto nickelodeons and began running films mostly in Eastern US Jewish enclaves. But the Edison company claimed to own the patton to all moving pictures because they had developed an early film recording and projecting technology and so they sent detectives out to smash up the bootleg theaters and drive people out. By then these small filmmakers had already begun to make a lot of money and so they moved to California where it would be harder to be caught (some people say it was so they could relocate to Mexico if needed). So as Hollywood became huge, most of the original moguls were Jewish (I think all but one, in fact). Despite this, these Jewish owners were also huge in promoting soft anti-semetic ideas in their movies and they actively promoted non-Jewish talent and US protestant conformity in order to try and dodge the antisemitism of the day.

As far as the media - I have no idea where this myth ever came from... Murdoch, Hearst, the media in the US has always been really hostile to all minorities and for most of the 20th century were happy to scapegoat jews and spread conspiracies about communist jews/aliens who are a threat to puppies and babies.

It is true that the US press is unapologetically pro-Israel... but they are also unapologetically in favor of ANY important aspects of US forgin policy! They cozy up to Iraqi dissidents with shoddy credentials when the US wants to go to war, but no on argues that the media is controlled by Iraqis! The US gives aid to Taiwan and Colombia, but no one says that Colombians dictate forging policy and control these policy decisions!

[RGacky3]

If most of the Capitalists were Mexicans, it would'nt change anything at all, I don't care what ethnic group happens to have what number of seats in the ruling class, the point is get rid of the ruling class, btw, Jews are not a homogenous group, there are non religious jews, anti-zionist jews and so on.

Who cares what number come from what ethnic group.

[Jimmie Higgins]

If most of the Capitalists were Mexicans, it would'nt change anything at all, I don't care what ethnic group happens to have what number of seats in the ruling class, the point is get rid of the ruling class, btw, Jews are not a homogenous group, there are non religious jews, anti-zionist jews and so on.

Who cares what number come from what ethnic group.There were more jewish people who were workers than worked in movies at any level and there were more Jewish immigrants who became active revolutionaries than ever owned any media service. Of course the anti-Semites also blame Jews for US communism, so you just can't win against their circular conspiracies.


...hmm, and now the people who would have been writing anti-Semitic columns in a Hearst-owned newspaper are on AM radio screaming about how liberal elites own the media and Hollywood and are communists and alien to wholesome American values. It's either code-words or just dusting off an old scapegoating formula and modernizing it for a contemporary audience.

[ZombieRothbard]

The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII.

[Hoipolloi Cassidy]

Meanwhile, there have been massive demonstrations in Israel - about 30,000 people in Tel-Aviv, but many sporadic outbreaks elsewhere. What are they demonstrating against? The RICH and powerful folks who own the media, etc. in Israel and in the US, and who are driving up the price of housing and much else. (There are whole apartment complexes that are empty most of the time because they're owned by rich Americans who want to have a place in the Holy Land but can't even be bothered to rent.)

So when are you going to list the name of all 30,000 Jews who are controlled by the media and big business? Just asking...

[RGacky3]

The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII.


Really? Thats what Jews did? I thought it was neoconservatives that did that.

Whats next will we say that Christians fathered fascism?

[Rafiq]

The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII.

Actually, Zombie, like Right Wing LIbertarianism, like Anarcho Captialism, that is complete bullshit.

[Rusty Shackleford]

WASPman

White Anglo-Saxon Protestant Man

complaining about zionist control of media and then listing a position where a jewish person has ownership in something.

anti-semetic.

should be banned for extremely racist views.

[Sasha]

he is..

[Sasha]

The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII.

banned too.

I was planning to trash this thread but now i'm contemplating to keep this thread open a bit longer too see what else comes crawling out of the woodwork..

[Kiev Communard]

The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII.

So now you have finally slipped the veil of "respectability" and let your really reactionary views be known... Unsurprising though, as I am right now debating on LiveJournal with a certain Russian "national-democrat" (i.e. a xenophobic, anti-Muslim right-"libertarian"), and the level of his bigotry is almost equal to that of a "traditional" neo-Nazi.

[ComradeMan]

banned too.

I was planning to trash this thread but now i'm contemplating to keep this thread open a bit longer too see what else comes crawling out of the woodwork..

Two rightwing trolls with one thread....

Good work Batman.
:thumbup1:

[ZombieMises]

banned too.

I was planning to trash this thread but now i'm contemplating to keep this thread open a bit longer too see what else comes crawling out of the woodwork..

Lol, I won't dispute the ban, and I won't return to revleft to post since it is clear you guys don't want me here. But I would look to at least make a post defending myself here, since I don't want to be known as an anti-semite here or anywhere else in my life. This is especially true since my heroes (the likes of Mises and Rothbard) were jews.

But the point of my statement was to provide a background on the roots of neoconservatism, which were cultivated pre-WWII when many jewish intellectuals of the time were heavily involved in influencing American politics to fight the Nazi's during WWII to liberate the jewish people there. I thought my statement was basically just one of fact, but I guess you guys erroneously interpreted it as anti-semitism (likely because you guys are thought controllers). I also think that American foreign policy today is heavily influenced by pro-Israeli pro-Zionist politicians like Anthony Weiner, who deny that the jews even occupy the West Bank (search it on youtube, I cannot link it here).

And on that note, later guys. Its been fun. ;)

[beeman]

(likely because you guys are thought controllers).



Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas. -Stalin

[MarxSchmarx]

This is really just an old anti-Semitic line. ...

As far as the media - I have no idea where this myth ever came from... Murdoch, Hearst, the media in the US has always been really hostile to all minorities and for most of the 20th century were happy to scapegoat jews and spread conspiracies about communist jews/aliens who are a threat to puppies and babies.

It is true that the US press is unapologetically pro-Israel... but they are also unapologetically in favor of ANY important aspects of US forgin policy! They cozy up to Iraqi dissidents with shoddy credentials when the US wants to go to war, but no on argues that the media is controlled by Iraqis! The US gives aid to Taiwan and Colombia, but no one says that Colombians dictate forging policy and control these policy decisions!

On the whole I agree with you that the assertion of why America supports Israel is due to some secret zionist conspiracy is anti-Semitic at its core.

Yet, the argument against what I'll call, for lack of a better term right now, "undue zionist influence" rests on the assertion that such groups outside the American state department (what in most every other country is called a foreign ministry) are mere distractions and that the US operates by a calculated realpolitik.

The problem is that this assertion is readily contradicted with the leftist's favorite example:

The only other example where American foreign policy is largely a legacy of the cold war - Cuba. There, there is a widely shared consensus that it is not in America's interest to continue the blockade and that the Castro regime is quite ready to adopt Chinese-style capitalism if only given the opportunity. But the way domestic politics in Florida play out, the blockade continues. I would say that this view is quite common on the American left, at least outside the few bastions where people venerate castro's cuba.

So where does this leave Israel? It's not absurd to posit that there are factors other than Washington's cynical realpolitik at play. That distinguishes it from Indonesia or Colombia. To be sure, I think unlike Cuba there is a plausible argument to be made that Israel does serve as America's client state in the middle east, especially against Iran and Syria. But the question of why American policy viz. Israel isn't more like American policy viz. Pakistan - another "natural ally" from the cold war - that the Americans have largely backed away from as more of a liability is hard to answer exclusively from the perspective of realpolitik.

[Jimmie Higgins]

First of all, after actually reading the list of entertainment companies I find it ironic that a huge chunk are Disney properties... a company founded by a notorious anti-Semite. So in the antisemitic paranoid mind... if a movie studio was founded by a jewish person, even if it is now owned by a bunch of WASPs at G.E. or something, it is still a "jew-run" company. Conversly, if a company was founded by an antisemite, but now has a jewish person as the CEO, then it is a "jew-run" company.

Apparently being controlled by "the Jews" just means at some point a Jewish person held a management position of some kind.


On the whole I agree with you that the assertion of why America supports Israel is due to some secret zionist conspiracy is anti-Semitic at its core.

Yet, the argument against what I'll call, for lack of a better term right now, "undue zionist influence" rests on the assertion that such groups outside the American state department (what in most every other country is called a foreign ministry) are mere distractions and that the US operates by a calculated realpolitik.

The problem is that this assertion is readily contradicted with the leftist's favorite example:

The only other example where American foreign policy is largely a legacy of the cold war - Cuba. There, there is a widely shared consensus that it is not in America's interest to continue the blockade and that the Castro regime is quite ready to adopt Chinese-style capitalism if only given the opportunity. But the way domestic politics in Florida play out, the blockade continues. I would say that this view is quite common on the American left, at least outside the few bastions where people venerate castro's cuba.

So where does this leave Israel? It's not absurd to posit that there are factors other than Washington's cynical realpolitik at play. That distinguishes it from Indonesia or Colombia. To be sure, I think unlike Cuba there is a plausible argument to be made that Israel does serve as America's client state in the middle east, especially against Iran and Syria. But the question of why American policy viz. Israel isn't more like American policy viz. Pakistan - another "natural ally" from the cold war - that the Americans have largely backed away from as more of a liability is hard to answer exclusively from the perspective of realpolitik.

I think you are very right that there are a lot of factors at play - but the overriding one is imperial interests, not lobbying or "pressure groups" etc. If the US supports Israel now more than in the past and more than other clients it's because the region is much more important, they lost Iran, and Israel has very little support outside the US and the US pressuring other countries.

Even with Cuba I think US interests are at play. Cuba wasn't "taken over" as a satellite, it had a revolution - the US doesn't want any examples of successful non-toadie countries in "it's backyard" and I think that's why even today the US would rather keep Cuba as an object lesson. They tried to invade even before "socialism" in Cuba was a factor in the Revolution and Castro was still trying to be a neutral player in the cold war. I think the current debate about weather it's worth it to keep up the embargo has less to do with the political nature of Cuba and more to do with US considerations of if it is still an effective lesson for the Americas as to why you need to play along with the US. The US gives a great deal of support to Cuban ex-pats for political and propaganda reasons, it's not lobbying.

Also it's not that much different than Colombia or South Vietnam for that matter... was there a Diem-lobby that caused the US to support South Vietnam or was it US interests?

[RGacky3]

Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas. -Stalin

And I guess its stalin who gues to choose who are enemies and who are not and what ideas are good or bad, you tool.

[Jimmie Higgins]

Really? Thats what Jews did? I thought it was neoconservatives that did that.

Whats next will we say that Christians fathered fascism?

Jews founded Christianity - it's a plot!:rolleyes:


The jews fathered neoconservatism and are also largely responsible for our involvement in WWII."The jews" founded neoconservatism? There was a big vote somewhere to start that political trend?

And "the Jews" paid too little a part in the US decision to go to war. If the US cared about the plight of European Jews, they would have at the very least opened up the borders to refugees - something they refused to do along with the UK and many other countries even though people knew that they were being repressed in Germany. The US also probably would have bombed the train-tracks to concentration camps instead of just German neighborhoods and factories.

[Nox]

Actually, Zombie, like Right Wing LIbertarianism, like Anarcho Captialism, that is complete bullshit. "

Epic winning

[agnixie]

So now you have finally slipped the veil of "respectability" and let your really reactionary views be known... Unsurprising though, as I am right now debating on LiveJournal with a certain Russian "national-democrat" (i.e. a xenophobic, anti-Muslim right-"libertarian"), and the level of his bigotry is almost equal to that of a "traditional" neo-Nazi.

To be quite fair, Rothbard thought feminism was the work of jewish lesbians. Which he also seemingly thought was an oxymoron and that jewish women were more inclined to lesbianism or something. And by quite fair, I mean, lol Rothbard. I guess the self-deprecating bullshit only works when it comes from Marx.

[Viet Minh]

3 pages and not one mention of the forthcoming 2012 satanist alien apocalypse?! :(

[beeman]

And I guess its stalin who gues to choose who are enemies and who are not and what ideas are good or bad, you tool.


LOL U MAD

Btw l2spell and also your back looks weak. I am 10x the lifter you are.

[Viet Minh]

http://animalluverclub.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/funny-pictures-squirrel-locked-outside-naked.jpg

[#FF0000]

(likely because you guys are thought controllers).

Oh shut up you big baby. Maybe if you spent more time outside instead of in your dumb libertarian neckbeard echochamber you'd know how to communicate so you wouldn't be surprised when people think it's antisemitic when you say "THE JEWS DID X"

[#FF0000]

LOL U MAD

Btw l2spell and also your back looks weak. I am 10x the lifter you are.

oh sup 4chon

[RGacky3]

LOL U MAD

Btw l2spell and also your back looks weak. I am 10x the lifter you are.

Your right, you win.

[ComradeMan]

Zionists lobbies? Jewish media control?

Please...

Let's do some mathematics....

The total world population of the Jewish people is approx 13.4 million. In the US 5.275 million. In US terms that's 1.71% of the US population to two decimal places! Even if one were to suggest that ever last single Jewish person in the US were a rabid zionist (which we know is not the case) then it hardly represents a powerful "lobby" does it? It might be reasonable that US politicians, as all politicians, would be worried about alienating a voter base- but given that the maximum this could reasonably be would be a staggering 1.71% of the population ( the real statistic would be much smaller given the amount of people below voting age) then it's hardly a convincing argument. Now, I found a statistic on the net (can't vouch for accuracy) that about 69% of the US population is eligible to vote- so if we apply that demographic to the Jewish population and the US population respectively we find:- 3 639 750 Jewish potential voters out of 293.6 million potential US voters- so that brings down our "Jewish" lobby to a staggering 1.24%! Given that Italian-Americans make up 6% of the US population and Irish Americans 11.9% of the US population, African Americans make up 13.8-13.6%, and Hispanic/Latino Americans 16.3% it puts it into perspective. There are other groups that could have far bigger "lobbies". Historically there was concern about the Italian lobby in the US during WWII.

Now, I found this statistic too
"As a group, American Jews tend to be better educated and earn more than Americans as a whole.[66] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_America#cite_note-65) Forty six percent (55% of Reform Jews (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reform_Jews)) report family incomes of over $100,000 compared to 19% of all Americans, with the next highest group being Hindu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu) at 43%. And while 27% of Americans have had college or postgraduate education (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postgraduate_education) education, 59% of American Jews have, the highest of any religious group except Hindus.[67] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_America#cite_note-compare-66) Either of these two statistics may be confounded (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confounding) by the fact that the Jewish population is on average older than other religious groups in the country, with 51% of polled adults over the age of 50 compared to 41% nationally.[67] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_America#cite_note-compare-66)"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_America#Education_and_income

How come no one speaks of a "Hindu" lobby? ;)

[Nox]

beeman.... the name sounds kinda familiar... :thumbdown:

[ComradeMan]

beeman.... the name sounds kinda familiar... :thumbdown:

Wasps and bees eh?

[Nox]

White Anglo Saxon Protestant man

and

British English E-thug man

[RedAnarchist]

They're both banned now, so I'm closing this thread.