Anonymous teams up with LulzSec for operation AntiSec

[~Spectre]

http://www.betanews.com/article/LulzSec-Anonymous-team-up-to-steal-and-expose-government-secrets/1308607159


Anonymous, the hacker collective famous for performing cyber attacks as public retribution, has reportedly teamed up with LulzSec, the hacker group that attacks mostly for entertainment, for a mission going by the title AntiSec (Anti-Security) which seeks to expose any government-classified information that can be stolen.
LulzSec, which has recently stolen headlines for a rash of denial of service attacks issued an AntiSec manifesto today, asking everyone to join the rebellion.

"Together we can defend ourselves so that our privacy is not overrun by profiteering gluttons. Your hat can be white, gray or black, your skin and race are not important. If you're aware of the corruption, expose it now, in the name of Anti-Security," the document says. "Top priority is to steal and leak any classified government information, including email spools and documentation. Prime targets are banks and other high-ranking establishments. If they try to censor our progress, we will obliterate the censor with cannonfire anointed with lizard blood."
The first target of the attack was the UK's Serious Organized Crime Agency (SOCA), who endured only a brief Denial of Service attack, and appeared to have suffered no leaked data.
Regarding the attack on SOCA, LulzSec said, "Later we'll unleash fire on multiple targets. That last one is down depending on which area you're from. Lulz Cannon is being upgraded…DDoS is of course our least powerful and most abundant ammunition. Government hacking is taking place right now behind the scenes."
Yesterday, Imperva Data Security compiled a profile of LulzSec, which gives a general idea of the people behind this movement and their preferred techniques. Imperva isolated eight usernames it believes are the "main members," and says the leader is "Sabu," the former Anonymous hacker responsible for the devastating hack on computer security firm HBGary earlier this year.


The first information war has just escalated.

http://twitter.com/#!/LulzSec :

LulzSec The Lulz Boat
We hear our #Anonymous brothers are making progress with #AntiSec, we also have reports of many rogue hacker groups joining in. :D

I can't wait to see what comes of this. This has several implications. Obviously it's good to see such successful subversion of governments and corporations, but we have to be prepared for the backlash that will come.

Their activities will be used to argue for the need to censor and control the internet. We can't afford to be apathetic on this question, and must defend the open internet, and the actions of these hackers as necessary checks against the powerful.

[Sam_b]

Oh, great. Anonymous. This is bound to be productive.

[Sean]

Anonymous teams up with LulzSec for operation AntiSecNo they didn't. Lulzsec were ex-anon and at least the currently arrested member doxxed many anon and attacked anon sites. This was misinfo thrown out there by Lulzsec in a last ditch attempt to muddy the waters around them. Basically, they decided to be too cool to be anonymous and now that their info is out there and the party is nearly over, they're trying to climb back into the mothership/crowd and point at everyone else around them. However, I can imagine quite a few anons taking the bait and getting dragged down too. This is a share the blame/find a stooge move, not a call to arms.
I don't wish them good or ill and its entertaining, but there is nothing political about Lulzsec, the motivation is in the name.

[Martin Blank]

No they didn't. Lulzsec were ex-anon and at least the currently arrested member doxxed many anon and attacked anon sites. This was misinfo thrown out there by Lulzsec in a last ditch attempt to muddy the waters around them. Basically, they decided to be too cool to be anonymous and now that their info is out there and the party is nearly over, they're trying to climb back into the mothership/crowd and point at everyone else around them. However, I can imagine quite a few anons taking the bait and getting dragged down too. This is a share the blame/find a stooge move, not a call to arms.
I don't wish them good or ill and its entertaining, but there is nothing political about Lulzsec, the motivation is in the name.

I wouldn't trust any information put together by the so-called "Web Ninjas". Aside from the fact that they have close ties to the CIA and NSA, they are also the same rightwing fuckers who tried to take down RevLeft some months ago. There's a lot of disinformation out on the Internet about Anon and LulzSec, so take everything you read about them with a huge grain of salt.

[Sean]

I wouldn't trust any information put together by the so-called "Web Ninjas". Aside from the fact that they have close ties to the CIA and NSA, they are also the same rightwing fuckers who tried to take down RevLeft some months ago. There's a lot of disinformation out on the Internet about Anon and LulzSec, so take everything you read about them with a huge grain of salt.
That's not info coming from the "Web Ninjas (http://lulzsecexposed.blogspot.com/)", I'm assuming because I used the term "mothership"?

[Nial Fossjet]

Oh, great. Anonymous. This is bound to be productive.

They've been involved in dethroning several regimes already, at least tangentially.

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

They've been involved in dethroning several regimes already, at least tangentially.

Good joke, sir.

[~Spectre]

No they didn't. Lulzsec were ex-anon and at least the currently arrested member doxxed many anon and attacked anon sites. This was misinfo thrown out there by Lulzsec in a last ditch attempt to muddy the waters around them. Basically, they decided to be too cool to be anonymous and now that their info is out there and the party is nearly over, they're trying to climb back into the mothership/crowd and point at everyone else around them. However, I can imagine quite a few anons taking the bait and getting dragged down too. This is a share the blame/find a stooge move, not a call to arms.
I don't wish them good or ill and its entertaining, but there is nothing political about Lulzsec, the motivation is in the name.

It's also coming from the anon organs:

http://anonops.blogspot.com/


Over the weekend, LulzSec has seemingly finally moved away from being in it "for the lulz" and has acquired a cause: it has announced it has teamed up with Anonymous and other "affiliated battleships" and that it is launching "Operation Anti-Security".

And the name lulzsec, whilst implying that they did4lulz, also implies at the expense of security. As in [email protected] Tampering with governments would seem to fit that.

[Zealot]

I'm pretty sure they did team up as there was something about it in the IRC of anon and the lulzsec website

[Sean]

I'm pretty sure they did team up as there was something about it in the IRC of anon and the lulzsec website
Well, we'll wait and see...

[xub3rn00dlex]

I also think it's legit since on the list of ops that anon is involved in, the joint effort is up there

[Sam_b]

They've been involved in dethroning several regimes already, at least tangentially.

No they haven't. But nice of you to downscale the working people of the Arab world who have organised and resisted to agitate for change you idiot.

[Yazman]

Two groups sourcing from the network of chan sites. "Anonymous" likes to call itself that but in reality they are not Anonymous, and I think most people already know that they are really just /b/tards and people from other sister sites like ED. That LulzSec even has "Lulz" in the name is pretty indicative in and of itself that they too are from the same community.

This announcement strikes me as somewhat like the left hand shaking the right hand.

[AmericanSocialist]

I like them. Stop hatin.

[Yazman]

I didn't say that they were bad or anything, just that they're part of the same community. Its like saying the Revleft Theory board is teaming up with Revleft. Its still Revleft. This "LulzSec" are part of "Anonymous" already.

[Martin Blank]

The longer threads like this get, the more bothered I am by them. The idle speculation, disinformation and a priori assertions are beginning to wear on me. I'd rather that such threads be closed or allowed to die than continue as they are.

[Yazman]

The longer threads like this get, the more bothered I am by them. The idle speculation, disinformation and a priori assertions are beginning to wear on me. I'd rather that such threads be closed or allowed to die than continue as they are.

We don't close threads just because we don't agree with people's posts. If you disagree, then make a point. To be quite honest I can't see why you even bothered to post this at all - quite frankly its off-topic and bears no relevance to the discussion at hand. If it was a mod action then it would be ok but you've just made a completely pointless post.

[~Spectre]

First victim of #AntiSec is the Arizona police:

Hacking group LulzSec took aim at law enforcement in the state of Arizona on Thursday, saying it was releasing "hundreds of private intelligence bulletins, training manuals, personal email correspondence, names, phone numbers, addresses and passwords" belonging to those in law enforcement.
The group, which has claimed responsibility for various denial-of-service attacks in recent weeks, ranging from the CIA and U.S. Senate's public websites to those of various video game companies, said it specifically targeted Arizona "because we are against SB 1070 and the racial profiling anti-immigrant police state that is Arizona."
SB 1070, a tough immigration law, was passed a year ago by state legislators, but immediately challenged. A preliminary injunction by a federal judge has blocked most of the law from going into effect. Arizona is planning to ask the U.S. Supreme Court to lift the injunction.
The information LulzSec said it obtained — 714 files totaling 446 megabytes — is posted on a file-sharing website. LulzSec has posted various information from other hacked sites on different file-sharing sites, rarely sticking with the same one twice.
Steve Harrison, a spokesman for Arizona's Department of Public Safety told Reuters: "We are aware of computer issues ... We're looking into it. And of course we're taking additional security safeguards."
In a press release LulzSec said the documents are classified as "law enforcement sensitive," "not for public distribution" and "for official use only," and are "primarily related to border patrol and counter-terrorism operations." The documents also describe the "use of informants to infiltrate various gangs, cartels, motorcycle clubs, Nazi groups and protest movements."

They're promising more on monday.

http://technolog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/06/23/6928929-lulzsec-claims-hack-of-arizona-law-enforcement-info

[Martin Blank]

We don't close threads just because we don't agree with people's posts. If you disagree, then make a point. To be quite honest I can't see why you even bothered to post this at all - quite frankly its off-topic and bears no relevance to the discussion at hand. If it was a mod action then it would be ok but you've just made a completely pointless post.

You missed my point, Yaz. I'm fine with posts I disagree with, as long as they are based on facts. The problem is that a lot of the comments made about Anon and LulzSec are not based on facts. They are based on idle speculation, disinformation and a priori assertions. The last thing we need to be doing on here is spreading falsehoods.

[bcbm]

The last thing we need to be doing on here is spreading falsehoods.

we better delete the history forum then

[Martin Blank]

we better delete the history forum then

Don't tempt me. :D

[¿Que?]

If there's so much disinformation, as Uncle Sam suggests, then why not, instead of closing/deleting these threads, demand that people back up what they say with facts. I mean, if all this shit happened on the interwebs, then it must be pretty well documented and corroborated with the mere click of a mouse, no?

So, I'm going to go back and check out some of that web ninja blog.

EDITA: I hate web ninjas!

[Os Cangaceiros]

what's wrong with speculation?

[Martin Blank]

If there's so much disinformation, as Uncle Sam suggests, then why not, instead of closing/deleting these threads, demand that people back up what they say with facts. I mean, if all this shit happened on the interwebs, then it must be pretty well documented and corroborated with the mere click of a mouse, no?

No. That's the thing. It's pretty clear that Anon and LulzSec use disinformation to their own advantage, as an extra layer of security, and they actually promote it to a large degree. The problem comes in when generally decent and honest people take the disinformation as good coin and formulate their judgments based on them. I would say that the most reliable information about these groups comes from their own statements, but even those use a measure of disinformation.

All in all, it's a fucking mess trying to formulate an independent opinion about them that is based on the full facts. And it sure as hell cannot be done relying on what you find on the Internet.

Thus, my frustration.

[bcbm]

if they use disinformation to their advantage it seems like adding to the background noise can only be beneficial. i mean shit one person has already been busted, the more disinfo and speculation that can be pumped out and lead down false trails the better it seems like?

[Martin Blank]

if they use disinformation to their advantage it seems like adding to the background noise can only be beneficial. i mean shit one person has already been busted, the more disinfo and speculation that can be pumped out and lead down false trails the better it seems like?

I can genuinely understand that argument. I just don't want comrades to be making false judgments and taking disinformation as fact.

OK, I'll shut up about this now. :closedeyes:

[Yazman]

You missed my point, Yaz. I'm fine with posts I disagree with, as long as they are based on facts. The problem is that a lot of the comments made about Anon and LulzSec are not based on facts. They are based on idle speculation, disinformation and a priori assertions. The last thing we need to be doing on here is spreading falsehoods.

Point taken. I just think its better to argue against something you perceive to be disinfo - that way its easier to have a positive outcome, imo.

[tracher999]

i love anonymous 4 live lulzsec rockz:cool:

edit: check this site you can folow all anonymous and lulzsec shizzle 4 real
http://www.thehackernews.com/

greetings

[Yazman]

i love anonymous 4 live lulzsec rockz:cool:

Aren't they just DDOSing servers and getting people's personal information? I tend to think these groups aren't really helping us, but are rather giving ISPs and more authoritarian types in government more fuel for the internet regulatory fire. This wouldn't matter if they were accomplishing something worthwhile, but they don't seem to be doing that. Seems like they're just trying to be annoying.

If they were getting documents like Wikileaks and releasing them it would be one thing, but it seems that all they are doing is DDOSing and getting personal information from game developers & publishers, like they have recently with Sony, Nintendo, Bethesda, and a few others.

Whether they actually do get documents or not in this "operation AntiSec" remains to be seen. If they do any good in that respect they'll have my support - until then, I remain critical, especially since they seem to be not motivated by principles but merely "for the lulz"

[W1N5T0N]

the more they censor, the more we fight. The more we fight, the more they censor...ALL OUT CYBER WAR!!

[thefinalmarch]

the more they censor, the more we fight. The more we fight, the more they censor...ALL OUT CYBER WAR!!
Quit it; you're embarrassing yourself.

[W1N5T0N]

troll :laugh:

[W1N5T0N]

by being so serious, you embarass yourself.

EDIT: not the most intelligent argument, in hindsight. apologies!

[Salyut]

thefirearmsblog has obe of the leaked things from Arizona up. Apparenty some "friendly" regime is selling 40mm grenades to the cartels on the down-low.

[~Spectre]

lHApqy3n3Fs

[Decolonize The Left]

i love anonymous 4 live lulzsec rockz:cool:

edit: check this site you can folow all anonymous and lulzsec shizzle 4 real
http://www.thehackernews.com/

greetings

So in an effort to fight "corrupt governments" and "censorship" they targetted..... PBS! That's right, the folks who brought you such terrible and corrupt shows such as Sesame Street and Reading Rainbow are the targets of these noble knights.

Seriously... I'm not anti-anon or any of this, I respect actual anti-censorship and the leaking of actual documents etc... but this shit is just silly.

- August

[~Spectre]

So in an effort to fight "corrupt governments" and "censorship" they targetted..... PBS! That's right, the folks who brought you such terrible and corrupt shows such as Sesame Street and Reading Rainbow are the targets of these noble knights.

Seriously... I'm not anti-anon or any of this, I respect actual anti-censorship and the leaking of actual documents etc... but this shit is just silly.

- August

Anonymous didn't do that.

[Decolonize The Left]

Anonymous didn't do that.

Dude I'm just referring to the most recent post on the hacker website which I quote in my previous post. I'm not saying anyone did anyone - I obviously don't know who did, I'm just saying that hacking PBS is fucking stupid and a pointless waste of time.

- August

[~Spectre]

http://www.boingboing.net/2011/06/24/hackers-publish-priv.html

Team Poison releases Tony Blair's personal contact book:
http://www.boingboing.net/images/Screen%20shot%202011-06-24%20at%206.33.18%20PM.png


Team Poison, one of hacking outfit LulzSec's rivals, has published what it claims is private information about former British Prime Minister Tony Blair and other British government officials.

In this Zine: - Tony Blair Office Members Information - Tony Blair Address & Phone Book (Includes family, friends, MPs & lords) - Katie Kay Curriculum vitae (Tony Blairs special adviser)
Posted to pastebin, the release contains the names, address and other contact info of numerous people and a detailed resumé said to be Kay's. It also states that the information was obtained in December 2010 and that Team Poison still has access to the webmail server that yielded it.

In an earlier tweet, the group (styled TeaMp0isonN_) earlier promised that Blair "and his cockroaches are getting owned tonight. - War IS Terror."

Link to leaked info here:
http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=mn6Dhgcd

[Tablo]

Like lulsec or anon could crack anything. Calling them "hackers" is a overstatement. Most of them are 14 year olds that spend too much time on /b/ and think they are "uber cool" using the loic.

[bcbm]

they just released a lot of interesting arizona docs...

[Yazman]

they just released a lot of interesting arizona docs...

Could you get a link to this? I'm curious to see.

The main thing that worries me about these guys, is that they don't give a shit who they hack or who has to deal with the consequences.. they don't operate like a normal hacking group does (in private) but rather in public, announcing everything, making a big show of it - i.e. they are "show hackers", and their attacks do not seem to have any clear motivation or intention most of the time, it all seems to just be "for the lulz." It might seem like they are 'fighting for freedom' by targeting the enemy, but they are not targeting the real enemies, let alone doing it for the right reasons.

If they do manage to target government organisations and release classified material, I will be supportive, but at this point it seems like some icing on a coal cake.

This is all just my impressions, I might be wrong about anything I've stated here. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[Dr Mindbender]

Fuck anonymous.

I would be on Prestige level 4 in Black ops by now if it wasnt for their stunts.

[Steve_j]

Could you get a link to this? I'm curious to see.

There ya go
http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/6490796/Chinga_La_Migra


they are "show hackers", and their attacks do not seem to have any clear motivation or intention most of the time, it all seems to just be "for the lulz." It might seem like they are 'fighting for freedom' by targeting the enemy, but they are not targeting the real enemies, let alone doing it for the right reasons.

From the release

Hackers of the world are uniting and taking direct action against our common oppressors - the government, corporations, police, and militaries of the world.

An interesting statement.

[¿Que?]

My problem with these groups is that they don't have a clear coherent theory to support what they do. Hacking "la migra" and Tony Blair is good stuff, don't get me wrong, but their rationale, their videos and statements, sound like they were written by confused teenagers. Where's the class analysis. Where are the scathing critiques of capitalism. It just seems that they want freedom of information, but why, what's the justification for that, how would that benefit working and oppressed people. I think the arguments that these groups are immature and childish are warranted, in spite of the fact that they pull off some amazing disruptions to a closed system of information within governments and corporations. They are amazing hackers and social engineers, they are pathetic social theorists.

A lot of socialists, communists, and anarchists, complain about armchair revolutionaries who spend inordinate amounts of time pouring through tracts of dead philosophers, but do little else to support the cause. It would seem with these groups the exact opposite is going on. With anonymous, their only reference to a tradition of resistance comes in the mask of Guy Fawks, but most likely not from arduous research into the history of this figure, but more so as a reference to the movie V for Vendetta.

And as a result of this lack of intellectual direction in reference to their actions, they're forced to go into their actions sort of half in jest and half serious, part lulz and part resistance, but without the philosophical basis that would make their movement more than just political theater.

[black magick hustla]

idk it seems some of you folks have grown up too quickly. scathing class analysis? what motivates hacking subcultures is similar to what motivated the edelweiss pirates to beat up hitlerjungen and white teens to take speed and raise the anarchist flag in punk shows. the existent gets too weary and shitty and some people are just like "im gonna make it burn like a fabulous roman candle". anon is not a political group, nor were the pirates nor where punks. they were kids who fucking hate this world and i dont blame em and im supportive

[¿Que?]

idk it seems some of you folks have grown up too quickly. scathing class analysis? what motivates hacking subcultures is similar to what motivated the edelweiss pirates to beat up hitlerjungen and white teens to take speed and raise the anarchist flag in punk shows. the existent gets too weary and shitty and some people are just like "im gonna make it burn like a fabulous roman candle". anon is not a political group, nor were the pirates nor where punks. they were kids who fucking hate this world and i dont blame em and im supportive
But I'm not talking about political groups, but political movements. There's a difference. And in any case, look what happened to punk culture after Green Day. It's been totally incorporated into the narrative of dominant white culture. There isn't a single white teen in America that doesn't go through some punk/metal phase at some point, and yet these same teens grow up to be the oppressors of tomorrow.

A political movement springs from a theoretical base that makes sense to dispossessed groups, but is also interpreted correctly by them. Naturally it must come from them. But also, the historical conditions have to be favorable. I think with anonymous, the conditions are there, and we have seen the impact of a more refined philosophical approach in wikileaks.

In terms of historical conditions, we know that, for example, computers are ubiquitous in the US and other parts of the world. There are systems programmers finding security holes every day, and it is only a small step to exploiting those vulnerabilities. However, the price of getting caught carries with it some heavy penalties. So, I'm supposed to risk federal prison for the lulz? However, the temptation is there. The act is so easy and accessible for even the most marginally intelligent person, it is a wonder that this has not already become a major, catastrophic political movement.

What I'm saying is that the average person with a computer can do what these guys are doing. It's not hard. To me, it seems that the point is to create a movement where the average person with a computer is motivated to act out as and with anonymous. But this is never going to happen without a strong theoretical basis.

[La Comédie Noire]

Aren't a lot of them libertarian whack jobs?

j_9T1SPJXRI

"Invest in precious metals." :lol:

But hey, they're disrupting the systems of control such as the media and the state. That's more than I've ever done.

[Mr. Cervantes]

Some conspiracy theorists have stated that this would be just enough motivation for governments to clampen down on the internet all the more.

For all we know it could be government agents posing as hackers to achieve that mission.

[¿Que?]

Some conspiracy theorists have stated that this would be just enough motivation for governments to clampen down on the internet all the more.

For all we know it could be government agents posing as hackers to achieve that mission.
If they were government agents, why would they be releasing personal information about police informants. That doesn't sound like it would help them, even if they did want to use it as an excuse to clampen down on the internet. Also, the name and addresses of members of the Highway Patrol? Honestly, I doubt it's the government. This ain't the black block :lol: Even though I'm skeptical of those claims as well.

[Yazman]

If they were government agents, why would they be releasing personal information about police informants. That doesn't sound like it would help them, even if they did want to use it as an excuse to clampen down on the internet. Also, the name and addresses of members of the Highway Patrol? Honestly, I doubt it's the government. This ain't the black block :lol: Even though I'm skeptical of those claims as well.

Yes, but they're releasing personal information from all sorts of shit that has no impact of worth on anything. Bethesda? Sony's Playstation Network? Nintendo? Other game developers & publishers? Why?

[¿Que?]

Yes, but they're releasing personal information from all sorts of shit that has no impact of worth on anything. Bethesda? Sony's Playstation Network? Nintendo? Other game developers & publishers? Why?
Well, social movements in my opinion don't always make sense. It could be that different people are motivated by different things but towards the same acts. I don't know. I think it's like when kids decide to graffiti and do street art. It's an act of resistance, albeit often times without much meaning or purpose. One thing you'll notice about graffiti in the US south is that it's usually cryptic and poetic, sort of has a mysterious aura but without too much making sense (unless you're privy to the underground graffiti cliques and whatnot, which I am not). Go to some parts of Latin America, on the other hand, and the graffiti is completely different. It often has a clear and straightforward political message, often with obvious party affiliations or political sympathies, while not sacrificing itself as an art form. I think the hacker activity we're talking about here takes the characteristics of the former, with ambitions towards the latter.

[W1N5T0N]

FYI, Tsukae, anon cracked Sony's internal severs. They also cracked Visa/Mastercard servers, just to mention some of the most high-profile recent ones. That rather speaks for their ability to crack anything than against it.

[Steve_j]

Some conspiracy theorists have stated that this would be just enough motivation for governments to clampen down on the internet all the more.

For all we know it could be government agents posing as hackers to achieve that mission.

Some of their chat logs that got nicked indicated that they themselves were involved in spreading those rumours, as previously mentioned there is so much disinformation that they themselves put out, its hard to tell what their agenda is, chances are its just a bunch of mates online who share a mutual distaste for authority and enjoying stiring up a shitstorm.

[Steve_j]

Why?

Because they can, for some that is reason enough.

[RED DAVE]

http://www.thehimalayantimes.com/

Here's an example of one of their hacks. Himalayan Times is a liberal newspaper that often carries important political news about developments in Nepal.

RED DAVE

[Obs]

Anonymous and all these other "hacktivist" fucks are worthless pieces of shit who imagine themselves as fucking masters of the universe when they really have nothing that fucking resembles relevance exactly because they're not part of a larger movement. They only hack, because that's all they can be assed to do - none of all that tiresome thinking or protesting. Their only function is to act as an excuse for the state to enact more and more restrictions on use of the Internet.

Of course, one could always argue that any attack on the state, no matter its outcome, should be supported. One could also go fellate mules and die. (I'd advise the latter over the former.)

[Steve_j]

Anonymous and all these other "hacktivist" fucks are worthless pieces of shit who imagine themselves as fucking masters of the universe when they really have nothing that fucking resembles relevance exactly because they're not part of a larger movement.

Sheesh, projecting somewhat?

[Martin Blank]

Sheesh, projecting somewhat?

No kidding! At this point, I'm reading these pathetic attempts at explaining and understanding Anon and LulzSec purely for "teh lulz" ... because that's all they're good for.

[Obs]

Sheesh, projecting somewhat?
But I am part of a larger movement. :confused:

[Nial Fossjet]

No they haven't. But nice of you to downscale the working people of the Arab world who have organised and resisted to agitate for change you idiot.

I meant very tangentially, not that they were hacking the secret mainframe that could trigger a chain reaction to explode Mubarak, jeez. Anon seems to have several sub-groups that favor actual political hacktivism, including the Arab uprisings. Way to make it seem like I was saying that they were responsible for dethroning those regimes. I said involved, qualified by tangentially.

[bcbm]

Anonymous and all these other "hacktivist" fucks are worthless pieces of shit who imagine themselves as fucking masters of the universe when they really have nothing that fucking resembles relevance exactly because they're not part of a larger movement. They only hack, because that's all they can be assed to do - none of all that tiresome thinking or protesting.

uh hacking isn't something you just pick up overnight, requires a bit of thinking and given some of the targets they've taken down i think it is clearly a form of protesting. not to mention they're risking some very serious time if they get busted for things like hacking arizona police or fbi associated comapny's docs.


Their only function is to act as an excuse for the state to enact more and more restrictions on use of the Internet.


so we shouldn't ever do anything to challenge the social peace because it will inevitably lead to a crackdown? you might want to calm down with the "thinking and protesting" then, you're just inviting the state to enact more and more restrictions on our lives/minds.

[~Spectre]

Like lulsec or anon could crack anything. Calling them "hackers" is a overstatement. Most of them are 14 year olds that spend too much time on /b/ and think they are "uber cool" using the loic.

Conclusion: You don't like group efforts. Only a small vanguard of elites can wear the title.

I am Spectre's complete lack of surprise.

[~Spectre]

Yes, but they're releasing personal information from all sorts of shit that has no impact of worth on anything. Bethesda? Sony's Playstation Network? Nintendo? Other game developers & publishers? Why?

This sounds like the type of scattergun of rhetorical questions that you see in the bourgeoisie periodials like the WSJ and NYtimes.

1) The claim of the sony hack stems from Sony themselves after both groups had initially denied.

That said. Fuck Sony, and whoever hacked them deserves a metal. Sony viciously pursued hacker Geohot, because he had the audacity to show people how to get more out of their playstations. They used the legal system to obtain ip adresses from visitors to his site, and those who donated via paypal.

Fuck that. That type of eggregious over reach by a corporation like Sony must be fought at every turn.

2) The culpability of all the "malicious" hacks isn't easy to determine. Who did what and when? Regardless, who gives a shit? Why are you trying to throw the baby out with the bath water? Some of the hacks people do are pointless, that doesn't mean we shouldn't support the ones that are doing legitimate good.

[~Spectre]

But I am part of a larger movement. :confused:


No you're not.

[~Spectre]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/bofamerica-had-data-t149834/index.html?t=149834

BUT FUCK SCOOPS LIKE THAT!!! ACCORDING TO SONY ANON DIDNT LET YOU PLAY ON YOUR PS3 FOR A FEW DAYS BRAH!

:rolleyes:

[AnonymousOne]

Anonymous and all these other "hacktivist" fucks are worthless pieces of shit who imagine themselves as fucking masters of the universe

:laugh:

Let's see, I don't think any of us imagines us as "masters of the universe", we're doing increasingly greater and better things. Perhaps one of the biggest was getting the head of HBGary to resign and revealing a plot by the Fed Gov't, HBGary and Bank of America to attack Wikileaks and it's supporters.

I've never met anyone in the Anon IRC who believed himself to be a master of the universe. We're 2,500 people fighting for a free Internet and working to do damage to governments and corporations. Every day the Internet becomes a more important piece of infrastructure for Capitalist organizations and entities.

Today a simple DDoS attack can cost corporations billions in lost dollars and can be a huge public relations nightmare. When Government documents are leaked it weakens the Government.

So no, we're not masters of the universe, but we're also not just a group of 14 year olds, or whatever stereotype you have. We represent all ages, backgrounds, genders, orientations, religions, and people.



they really have nothing that fucking resembles relevance exactly because they're not part of a larger movement. They only hack, because that's all they can be assed to do - none of all that tiresome thinking or protesting. Their only function is to act as an excuse for the state to enact more and more restrictions on use of the Internet.

To claim we're not part of a larger group is silly. We have 2,500 members from across the world and we're growing daily. People are learning the skills they need to strike back at global capitalism and governments. We're attacking all companies and governments specifically security firms and government security bureaus under Operation AntiSec. We're going after oppressive governments in the Middle East with Operation Freedom. We're getting more people involved in our actions and getting them skills they need in Operation New Blood.

Which is more effective:

1. Protesting against Capitalism and getting the shit beaten out of you at a G20 protest.

or

2. Getting the CEO's of major companies to resign, causing those companies to lose billions of dollars, and making people question how much information they trust these corporations with.

Hey, we can compare results, what happened the last time you rallied at the GOP Convention or the Dem. Convention? What was the result of the latest G20 protest?

In less than a year we have made more progress on weakening corporate America than the last 30 years of political agitation in the western world.

This doesn't mean that protesting and direct action in the "real world" doesn't have meaning and doesn't have it's uses, but if you're going to be attacking us for using the Internet and allegedly not doing anything because of it you should take a long hard look at what your Marxist reading circle or Party has done lately.

[~Spectre]

I think Assange got it right when he said this:


"The west has fiscalised its basic power relationships through a web of contracts, loans, shareholdings, bank holdings and so on. In such an environment it is easy for speech to be "free" because a change in political will rarely leads to any change in these basic instruments. Western speech, as something that rarely has any effect on power, is, like badgers and birds, free. In states like China, there is pervasive censorship, because speech still has power and power is scared of it. We should always look at censorship as an economic signal that reveals the potential power of speech in that jurisdiction. The attacks against us by the US point to a great hope, speech powerful enough to break the fiscal blockade."

Governments, through their actions, are telling us all that this sort of direct action really hurts. I see no reason to doubt them!

Actions that hurt governments and corporations the most, are those that effect their bottom line. Such direct action should always be encouraged, never shunned.

[Yazman]

This sounds like the type of scattergun of rhetorical questions that you see in the bourgeoisie periodials like the WSJ and NYtimes.

lol. Reading back on it, it really does. I didn't intend it to sound that way.



1) The claim of the sony hack stems from Sony themselves after both groups had initially denied.

That said. Fuck Sony, and whoever hacked them deserves a metal. Sony viciously pursued hacker Geohot, because he had the audacity to show people how to get more out of their playstations. They used the legal system to obtain ip adresses from visitors to his site, and those who donated via paypal.

Fuck that. That type of eggregious over reach by a corporation like Sony must be fought at every turn.

Totally agree. I don't disapprove of cracking Sony's security, really. Speaking of Sony, I want to address that other thing you said, just for accuracy:


ACCORDING TO SONY ANON DIDNT LET YOU PLAY ON YOUR PS3 FOR A FEW DAYS BRAH!

Actually, it was about an entire month, and it wasn't "according to sony", it was according to reality. Every single person who had a PS3 was unable to access online services for that period. Now, I dont really have a problem with this because people should give a shit about the real problems we face in the world today, but if you're going to talk about that PS3 episode get your facts straight.. and before you say it - yes, I DO realise you were being sarcastic in that post.



2) The culpability of all the "malicious" hacks isn't easy to determine. Who did what and when? Regardless, who gives a shit? Why are you trying to throw the baby out with the bath water? Some of the hacks people do are pointless, that doesn't mean we shouldn't support the ones that are doing legitimate good.

You're totally right. However, I'm talking about the hacks they claim responsibility for.. and the majority of these were completely pointless attacks on game developers like Bethesda, and weren't even targeting the businesses so much as the customers themselves (giving out their personal information and account details incl. passwords via torrents online).

If they want to label themselves as anti-corporate freedom fighters, they'd bloody well better back it up with something substantial. A few attacks, worthy of support, on the FBI or Arizona police are great! I do support them. But their credibility is destroyed in my eyes when considering the majority of hacks they claim responsibility for, things which have no relevance to any sort of political movement.

Its the context here. There ARE ways in which their attacks on game developers & publishers could be justified, for example if they were white hats hoping to improve security systems in a roundabout sort of way.

But they don't seem to be placing things in that context.

[Martin Blank]

This doesn't mean that protesting and direct action in the "real world" doesn't have meaning and doesn't have it's uses, but if you're going to be attacking us for using the Internet and allegedly not doing anything because of it you should take a long hard look at what your Marxist reading circle or Party has done lately.

Leaving aside the little jab at Marxists (oh! what some people don't know!), Anonymous has been one of the groups that has rightly pointed out something very important that all of us who are revolutionaries need to consider. With the rise of the Internet and the associated technological changes, we have seen the means of production revolutionized once again, just as we saw with the Industrial and Automation revolutions, and just as Marx talked about in the Manifesto.

With the exploiting and oppressing classes becoming more reliant on these new technologies to manage and sustain global production and the international credit system, they have also opened up a new arena of the class struggle (well, more like a series of sub-arenas, each attached to the political, economic, cultural and social arenas). Much like it was when industrial machinery and automation were each introduced into the workplace, the resistance to its use as a cudgel against the exploited and oppressed has hitherto been atomized and individualistic. It lacked class consciousness and organization. Say what you will about the specific politics of its members, but Anonymous is probably the first serious organization that expresses a rudimentary consciousness about the role of the technological revolution in the class struggle -- in this sense, akin to the first radical workers' circles that emerged in the early 19th century.

Instead of attacking and dismissing Anonymous and similar organizations, it would be more to the advantage of working people and the struggle against capitalism if we recognized that their arena of work is part of the larger class struggle -- if we as revolutionaries engaged them and sought to work out a common platform, one that looked beyond reforming society into "capitalism + free information" and understood that, as long as capitalism exists, neither human beings nor the information they produce can really be free.

[¿Que?]

Hey, we can compare results, what happened the last time you rallied at the GOP Convention or the Dem. Convention? What was the result of the latest G20 protest?

Yeah, because nothing happened when thousands of North Africans rallied against their corrupt governments? Or is happening? It's silly to try to separate the two, as if either strategy could exist and be successful without the other...

[~Spectre]

Yeah, because nothing happened when thousands of North Africans rallied against their corrupt governments? Or is happening? It's silly to try to separate the two, as if either strategy could exist and be successful without the other...

In places such as Egypt, the tipping point was when the workers engaged in direct action and began striking. That accomplished what several rallies at Tahrir square failed to do, and forced at least a semblance of change. Not much, as Egypt remains a military dictatorship, but the point is:

Direct action gets the ball rolling in the right direction. Educate, agitate, organize, and attack the enemy where it hurts the most - in their wallets.

Rallies are fine too for raising awareness of certain issues, but the elevated consciousness they create needs to be backed up with some direct action. The point I think our Anonymous comrade was trying to make, is that they're getting some good results with their hacktivism, so people shouldn't try to shit on it by playing the "prolier than thou" game. It's not very helpful, and it reeks of petty jealousy.

[AnonymousOne]

Yeah, because nothing happened when thousands of North Africans rallied against their corrupt governments? Or is happening? It's silly to try to separate the two, as if either strategy could exist and be successful without the other...

Err, well if you read what I actually wrote I specified "western world" and protest and rallies.

There was, as Spectre points out, a lot more than just people protesting at the G20. I'm in favor of all direct action. It's easiest for me to do online but I hit the streets in a Guy Fawkes mask on occasion or stand in a black bloc.

But here's the crucial difference, I do more and accomplish more using my skills towards direct action on the internet, through DDoS, teaching classes, and some other things :sneaky:.

I mean, yes in an ideal world we'd have the strength of numbers to overthrow and remove capitalism and governments through "real world" action. But we can't, so we should just do what works.

[¿Que?]

Err, well if you read what I actually wrote I specified "western world" and protest and rallies.
Yeah, but to me it seemed like you were making an arbitrary distinction, just to avoid an obvious counter example that you knew about but didn't want to consider.

So let me get this point clear. Are you saying that in the Western World, protests and rallies don't matter, but in the Middle East and North Africa they do. And is there any evidence to this claim. Did you miss Wisconsin, Greece, Spain, France, UK, etc. where delivering information about corrupt officials is about as relevant as The New Kids on the Block at a Justin Bieber concert. Seriously, people know government and corporations are corrupt. It takes more than information to make a revolution.


There was, as Spectre points out, a lot more than just people protesting at the G20. I'm in favor of all direct action. It's easiest for me to do online but I hit the streets in a Guy Fawkes mask on occasion or stand in a black bloc.
Respect.


But here's the crucial difference, I do more and accomplish more using my skills towards direct action on the internet, through DDoS, teaching classes, and some other things :sneaky:.
In some cases I would agree, at other times I can't. For example, I remember when you guys were targeting Egyptian government web servers during the protests. Honestly, I believe the last thing on Mubarak's mind during that whole time, was whether or not his WordPress blog was allowing registrations.

All kidding aside, I think you are over emphasizing the impact your direct action is having, particularly without a basis in some form of class analysis.



I mean, yes in an ideal world we'd have the strength of numbers to overthrow and remove capitalism and governments through "real world" action. But we can't, so we should just do what works.
In my opinion, you can get a few high level officials to resign, that really isn't going to change the big picture. High level officials, corporate fatcats, et al. get caught doing shit all the time, and are always resigning for various reasons. That's the nature of the game, it's very cutthroat. Someone's failure is another's success. How does that affect the fundamental basis of broader society. Not much, really.

[AnonymousOne]

Yeah, but to me it seemed like you were making an arbitrary distinction, just to avoid an obvious counter example that you knew about but didn't want to consider.

So let me get this point clear. Are you saying that in the Western World, protests and rallies don't matter, but in the Middle East and North Africa they do. And is there any evidence to this claim. Did you miss Wisconsin, Greece, Spain, France, UK, etc. where delivering information about corrupt officials is about as relevant as The New Kids on the Block at a Justin Bieber concert. Seriously, people know government and corporations are corrupt. It takes more than information to make a revolution.

Not really. The fact of the matter is that there is very little to no class conciousness in the western world. What levels of class conciousness do exist get thrown into side channels or weird conspiracy theories/populist movements. It's almost as if those people know that something is wrong with the way the world works, but they can't quite put their finger on it.

Yes, I saw Wisconsin (failed), Greece (Austerity just got passed), Spain (very interesting and Anons in Spain are doing very cool things but nothing that will seriously dent global capitalism), France (retirment limits got set), Britain (University cuts and tuition hikes are still ocurring).

As I said earlier, rallies and protests are important and in a society with enough class conciousness and activism they are I can say confidently one of the few things that will turn Capitalism to Socialism. When the day comes where a G20 protest has the potential of turning Capitalism about face I'll go to one again.

Information is one of the biggest things that leads to revolution. Our numbers have swelled since people discovered the HBGary plot and Wikileaks is not under as intense attack. When people realize what Gov'ts and Corporations do behind our back, they begin to see the flaws in Capitalism. Information is the precursor to the revolution.



In some cases I would agree, at other times I can't. For example, I remember when you guys were targeting Egyptian government web servers during the protests. Honestly, I believe the last thing on Mubarak's mind during that whole time, was whether or not his WordPress blog was allowing registrations.


...
This is the biggest problem I have with criticisms of Anonymous. If you seriously think all we do is DDoS websites, than yeah we're pretty fucking useless.

"As [Anonymous] struggled to get volunteers to join the attacks, there were also providing “care packages” (COD gamers will recognise the term) of anonymisation tools and advice to Egyptian geeks, as they had done in Tunisia and Algeria, spamming Egyptian police email, fax and phone numbers and filtering information about how to work around Egyptian censorship."

"At first, they sent out Wikileaks cables to these numbers, but then they determined the Egyptians didn't need additional motivation. Instead, they were interested in information on how to communicate with each other and the outside world. The activists thus began providing instructions for using dial-up modems and amateur radios, known as Ham radios, which the Egyptian people could use to communicate.

The group says it's also worked on receiving and decoding amateur radio messages, sent on frequencies recommended by the group of activists. While these groups have only been able to receive a small amount of messages of a short length with an unknown source, the Egyptian people's use of amateur radio to transmit messages represents an interesting utilization of old-fashioned technology to circumvent government restrictions.

Most activists behind these messages tell The Huffington Post they wish to remain anonymous. But besides Telecomix, other Internet groups have assisted, including "Anonymous," which has helped by sending out large amounts of faxes into Egypt. "Anonymous" was also involved in denial of service operations against organizations who took actions against Wikileaks. They've also participated in many other operations, with targets ranging from Scientology to Gene Simmons. "

Through Telecomix, a leaderless collective, we provided free DialUp internet access for the egyptian people in addition to other information and tools.

We do a lot more than just get a few Execs to resign and shutdown a website. :/

[W1N5T0N]

@Obs


Anonymous and all these other "hacktivist" fucks are worthless pieces of shit who imagine themselves as fucking masters of the universe when they really have nothing that fucking resembles relevance exactly because they're not part of a larger movement. They only hack, because that's all they can be assed to do - none of all that tiresome thinking or protesting

1. Not part of a larger movement? As far as i know, anonymous is pretty big, they have people in a lot of countries. Also, support for them/imitation is also not to be underestimated.

2. None of that tiresome thinking or protesting? Well, mate, if you can write me 50 000 lines of code in your sleep, you ARE the master of the universe. And yep, as you can see from their website, they are protesting against censorship, control and scientology. Anonymous is another form of protesters organizing (albeit, with some neat hacker skills and a weakness for the dramatic).

3. All i hear from you is "fucking" "worthless" and "shit".

[Sean]

No they didn't. Lulzsec were ex-anon and at least the currently arrested member doxxed many anon and attacked anon sites. This was misinfo thrown out there by Lulzsec in a last ditch attempt to muddy the waters around them. Basically, they decided to be too cool to be anonymous and now that their info is out there and the party is nearly over, they're trying to climb back into the mothership/crowd and point at everyone else around them. However, I can imagine quite a few anons taking the bait and getting dragged down too. This is a share the blame/find a stooge move, not a call to arms.
I don't wish them good or ill and its entertaining, but there is nothing political about Lulzsec, the motivation is in the name.
So, that's how I called it almost a month ago. I got a little flak but here's the story from the horse's mouth:


...on 25 June, LulzSec (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/lulzsec) suddenly said it was disbanding.Just hours before this announcement, the Guardian had published leaked internet chat logs (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/jun/24/inside-lulzsec-chatroom-logs-hackers) revealing the inner workings of the group, which appeared to consist of six to eight members. The logs showed that authorities were often hot on their heels, and that after an attack on an FBI-affiliated website two hackers had quit LulzSec as they were "not up for the heat". As media attention mounted, Ryan Cleary, an Essex-based 19-year-old suspected of affiliation to LulzSec, was arrested (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/jun/22/ryan-cleary-charged-lulzsec-hacking) in a joint UK-US "e-crime" investigation. Had the pressure simply got too much to handle?

To find out, the Guardian tracked down one of LulzSec's founding members, "Topiary". A key figure in the tight-knit group, he was revealed in the logs to have managed LulzSec's Twitter account (http://twitter.com/#%21/lulzsec) and to have written their press releases. After verifying his identity by asking him to send a direct message from the account – "This is the captain of the Lulz Boat," he confirmed – we began a long conversation by Skype.
"I know people won't believe this, but we genuinely ended it [LulzSec] because it was classy," he says. "The leaks we promised happened . . . 50 days were reached, we just about hit 275,000 Twitter followers, things were on a high, so we redirected our fans to [hacker collective] Anonymous (http://twitter.com/#%21/AnonymousIRC) and [hacking (http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/hacking) movement] AntiSec (http://www.anti-sec.com/) and wrapped it up neatly . . . A high note, a classy ending, a big bang, then a sail into the distance."
Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2011/jul/14/why-lulzsec-decided-to-disband

A nice spin, but basically to reiterate, reality caught up with them and got everyone to fly the anon flag they had shirked off initially so they could get back out of the limelight and hopefully stay out of jail.