American Exceptionalism

[Hexen]

All my life, I've been hearing "American is the freeist country in the world" and similar nonsense, is this a example of American Exceptionalism?

Also is there anyway to counter it? Also what's the origins of this?

[VirgJans12]

Wikipedia: "American exceptionalism refers to the theory that the United States is qualitatively different from other nations. In this view, America's exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation", and developing a uniquely American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire."

So yeah, it is. It's difficult to counter as that country does everything to keep that image. Just think of the kids having to sing the Stars and Stripes at school, for example.

[Hexen]

So yeah, it is. It's difficult to counter as that country does everything to keep that image.

Well just incase if I run into this "American is the freeist country" nonsense (and other things) one more time, is there a comeback or how should I respond to that that will leave them dumb folded? Or should I ignore it (if I do it's just bothers me as if I lost the argument)?

[VirgJans12]

Well just incase if I run into this "American is the freeist country" nonsense (and other things) one more time, is there a comeback or how should I respond to that that will leave them dumb folded? Or should I ignore it (if I do it's just bothers me as if I lost the argument)?

I don't want to stick them all in one corner, but in my experience most Americans won't listen to anything you have to say anyways if they feel it's not the "American way".

For example: You say communists want to establish a temporary dictatorship of the proletariat, which will transform into a free society where everyone is equal, everyone gets to vote on any law proposal, and there is no exploitation whatsoever.

Most of them would give this reaction: "Oh my god! they want a dictatorship!"

So unless you want to argue for a while, don't counter it. Just say "sure" or whatever.

[Lacrimi de Chiciură]

You could point out that America imprisons more of its population than any other country on the planet. That certainly goes against freedom... although it does still make it exceptional!

[Shaggy17]

As a fellow American, I feel your pain, Hexen. :(
When they say the America's the freest nation in the world, that we have more rights than anybody else, blah, blah, just casually mention the PATRIOT ACT, the establishment of the TSA, our refusal to allow gays the right to marriage, and all the other affronts to personal freedom we allowed as of late. It's actually pretty fun to see them try to rationalize all of these things while holding on to the contradictory belief that we're the freest nation in the world :lol:

[graymouser]

America is, per capita and by percentage, the leader in imprisoning human beings. As others have pointed out, that's a problem for the precious thesis of the most free country. So is Immigrations and Customs Enforcement, the stormtroopers of an anti-immigrant crusade. And then there's the nation's problem with dissent.

Before World War I, members of the IWW were persecuted as "criminal syndicalists." During the war, radicals and socialists were persecuted under the Sedition Act for speaking out against it, most famously Gene Debs but also a lot of other individuals. Afterward, the Palmer raids rounded up many reds, deporting some and letting others rot in jail on trumped-up charges. Sacco and Vanzetti were executed because of their beliefs, and the Scottsboro boys were nearly executed for their blackness. During the late '30s, the US again stepped up persecution of reds, calling leftists before the House Un-American Activities Committee to intimidate dissenters.

During World War II, the leadership of the Socialist Workers Party was imprisoned for over a year and a half for their principled opposition to the war. Afterward, the leadership of the Communist Party was likewise imprisoned and the largest red scare, its biggest figure being Joe McCarthy, was stepped up. When the Red Scare ended, the FBI began its program COINTELPRO that meant the direct observation and spying on, disruption of, and occasionally murder of, domestic dissenters. This ranged from the CPUSA and SWP to nationalist groups like the Black Panthers. COINTELPRO had an official end after it was revealed but there is nothing to suggest that surveillance of dissenters ever ended. Certainly Central America solidarity protesters in the '80s and anti-globalization and antiwar protesters in the '90s/'00s faced surveillance and police repression.

We are in a period of upswing of these crackdowns on domestic dissent. The FBI has raided the homes of international solidarity activists and called them before grand juries. Tell anyone who thinks we're in a free country to go to http://www.stopfbi.net/ - it's simply not true. In fact it's outrageous to suggest that the US is a free country. But of course these things don't count. People feel "free" as long as their discourse is within the narrow confines of capitalist politics. It's only when you step outside those boundaries that it becomes obvious that this freedom means precisely nothing.

[Forward Union]

It's also the third highest executioner after Iran and China. Fortunately Trade Unions are doing a lot to stop this, by encouraging their Doctor-members to refuse to participate on ethical grounds. This Union initiative has held up hundreds of executions.

[Reznov]

You could point out that America imprisons more of its population than any other country on the planet. That certainly goes against freedom... although it does still make it exceptional!

America is one of the largest countries on earth and subsequently, population.

[starmix]

Well america is the freeist country in the world, it's true that that freedom has been cut back recently with the patriot act the removal of haebeus corpus and so on but it's still better than comparable societies.

Of course i'm talking about negative freedom, if you want to talk about freedom to have healthcare or a certain standard of living or to organize and so on it's one of the worst industrial nations.

[Impulse97]

America is one of the largest countries on earth and subsequently, population.

Yea well china has four times the population of the US and we're doing a damn good job of keeping pace with executions.

[Die Rote Fahne]

Reply: "Go buy a joint, light it up, video tape the cop that tries to arrest you and burn an American flag. When that cop beats your ass you can tell me about your freedom first hand. Then appeal to someone in the only two parties that can form the government in your country. Go die you stupid cock".

[piet11111]

America is one of the largest countries on earth and subsequently, population.

Its has the largest % of population in prison.

[Blake's Baby]

America is one of the largest countries on earth and subsequently, population.

This post is one of the shortest in the thread, and subsequently, meaning.



Fundamental error of fact and a fundamental misunderstanding there Reznov.

1 - America, even though it's number 3 in population terms, in fact has a rather small population compared to China and India - they're a long way ahead. Only 5% of the world's population is American. China has around 1.4 billion (about 20% of world population), America has 0.3 billion; China therefore has 4 times the population of America.

2 - However, the numbers of prisoners in America (around 2 million or 0.8% or one person in 120) is much greater than China (around 1.5 million or 0.1% or one person in 1,000). In other words America locks up 8 times as many people as China. Indonesia's population is close to America's, and yet Indonesia has only 4% of the number of prisoners America has (85,000 v 2,000,000). So America is 25 times less free than Indonesia - conversely, Indonesia is 25 times freer than America.


Another American exception: 5% of world population, 40% of world miltary spending. It's also the biggest seller of arms on the planet.

[scourge007]

American Exceptionalism is a lie. America isn't better than everybody else. It's just propaganda really.

[Impulse97]

American Exceptionalism is a lie. America isn't better than everybody else. It's just propaganda really.


Your preaching to the choir broha.

[unfriendly]

Hilariously enough, the term American exceptionalism was first used by the Communist Party USA to describe the idea that
"thanks to its natural resources, industrial capacity, and absence of rigid class distinctions, America might for a long while avoid the crisis that must eventually befall every capitalist society."

Oh, woe! :laugh:

[Mr. Contradiction]

In my experience at a far-right liberal arts college (which I have escaped, thankfully), American exceptionalism does not refer merely to the US' present superiority but in a greater sense to the idea that the US is supposed to be superior--"supposed" in the double sense of "ought" and of "posited at the beginning".

All defenders of the US, Democrat or Republican, use American exceptionalism to justify their platform; Democrats say we need more spending, social services, etc., to retap human potential which is part of the American character, or that their policies are necessary to move the country in the direction of its ideal form, the greatest and most praiseworthy of liberal democracies. Republicans say that we need to return to the way things where when we were actually the best, via family values, strong defense, free-market capitalism, etc.

Of course in fighting the idea of exceptionalism there are important lessons for the broader anti-nationalist and anti-capitalist struggle. It is never enough to say "lol America sucks, we're not exceptional lol" in this or that area, because there are millions of liberals in the US who agree with you. We have instead to fight the idea that America should be or is supposed to be exceptional, which is the infinitely more difficult task. We have to fight much of what is written into the beliefs and assumptions of most US citizens.

For example, the liberal justification for better educational policy is partly in search of higher achievement but is almost always related as a problem of competiveness: "why is America behind"? The implication of course being that the US must be ahead.

[AthenaAwakened]

I always see exceptionalism as walking hand in hand with the belief that this God's Country.

Gee I wonder why?

[freya4]

I think that most people would think that they're country is something special or has a unique history. Objectively speaking, there's no such thing as any exceptionalism, whether it's American, Chinese, Russian, Nigerian etc. It's simply an excuse for the nationalist and imperialist propaganda being pushed down everyone's throat. Most Americans grow up with the idea that their country and government is the best in the world, and the best that it possibly could be. Any criticisms of the American government's behavior, especially of the military or their actions abroad, is looked down upon as unpatriotic and traitorous.
America is certainly not a "free" nation, no matter much the right wingers and liberals claim that it is. The only ones who are truly free in this country are the top 2% that own basically all the wealth, and decide who runs in the elections. The bottom 98% gets to choose which individual from the other 2% gets to start pointless wars and bail out their fellow billionaires, while average working class citizens barely make it by each day. Oh, the freedom :rolleyes: