Hip-Hop Elitism: Why Soulja Boy is More Hip Hop Than You

[bailey_187]

There's something so incredibly perverse about 30-year-old white suburbans assuming the role of Hip-Hop Fairy, dashing their microphone-shaped wands at black youth and delineating that they're not speaking from the voice of real hip-hop. Can one of you hip-hop purists please tell me, how many Sage Francis albums do you have to memorize before you get to reach "hip-hop enlightenment" and start seeing the real/fake hip-hop binary like Neo? As you stand outside your local divebar's open mic nite and declare with angst that you're going to "take things back to hip-hop's foundation," I'd like to point out that when the Get Fresh Crew first started cyphering in the Bronx, the last thing they were thinking about was your leprechaun ass. If hip-hop is dying, it's more than likely that your 1993-jocking emo rap is only making its death more annoyingly painful.

http://www.wiretapmag.org/arts/43585/


Interesting articles. Relates to what some people were saying about lil b, immortal technique etc in my other thread

[L.A.P.]

This is a pretty pathetic critique by trying to turn it into a race thing of it's white kids trying to tell black kids what to listen to wah wah fucking wah. First of all hip-hop belongs to white suburban kids as much as it belongs to black ghetto kids. Music is not physically entailed to a certain economic and ethnic group. I find it insulting that the author is trying to say majority of black kids listen to Soulja Boy while majority of white kids listen to Immortal Technique. This article fails.

[HEAD ICE]

I think the article is arguing the opposite. It is saying that there is a tendency, and lets be honest I only see this amongst white people, to deride any hip hop that doesn't sound like a Noam Chomsky nursery rhyme to "not be real hip hop", and make blatantly racist statements like when black rappers rap about things that reaffirm "stereotypes" about black people they are "holding themselves back" and are part of the problem.

I know plenty of black people who listen to what is called "conscious hip hop" (though I have not met one who likes Immortal Technique or Jedi Mind Tricks lmao) and I have never heard this argument. Given the obvious fact that I am not black I am not going to explain why this is, so I will speak as a white person and say the reason that white people who call 'conscious hip hop' as 'real hip hop' is due simply because it is most friendly to them.

[HEAD ICE]

btw this is a lot "realer" (realer meaning genuine) than anything vomited by Immortal Technique

h-IYSl4I-4I

[Spawn of Stalin]

It's not solely aimed at white people, white people have as much of a right to whine about Hip Hop as blacks. But the situation has become pretty funny where you have people who are, demographically at least, disconnected from Hip Hop dictating what's hot and what's not. I grew up in a inner city and ethnically diverse neighbourhood, however the people I grew up with were mostly white but there were black kids on my street I was friends with too back. All of my friends who listened to Hip Hop listened to the "popular" Hip Hop that is sneered at by elitists. And this wasn't just because we were young, a lot of us had older brothers and sisters who listened to the same stuff. It's worth noting that most of these people today listen to Wayne and Rick Ross. Now when I was 18 I moved to a working class area in a medium sized town, went to college on the other side of town in a much nicer area, not many Hip Hop fans, mostly shaggy haired kids who smoke rolling tobacco but there were a few who took great pleasure in recommending I listen to more "real shit", meaning Immortal Technique, Sage Francis, anything else political. I agree with most of what the article is saying because I don't like having my music taste sneered at by privileged little boys any more than the next guy.

Fuck that. There is nothing "real" about simply writing what are basically protest songs, listen to GMF's The Message, there is one conscious song, the other six are about partying. The same can be said for pretty much any other early or classic Hip Hop record.

Because honestly if suburban white dudes have a problem with Hip Hop not being conscious enough for them they should go listen to Nickleback.

[Blackscare]

Fuck that. There is nothing "real" about simply writing what are basically protest songs, listen to GMF's The Message, there is one conscious song, the other six are about partying. The same can be said for pretty much any other early or classic Hip Hop record.

Because honestly if suburban white dudes have a problem with Hip Hop not being conscious enough for them they should go listen to Nickleback.


To be honest, I like all that "elitist" shit this article talks about, and I don't go out of my way to tell people what's 'wrong' with their music (yes, I'm biting in this thread :P), but the problem I have with Wayne etc has nothing to do with how 'conscious' they are.

It's the annoying, simplistic, atonal bullshit music they make. I hate club music and dance rap, there's a reason you have to be fucked up to enjoy it being played at a billion decibels in some nasty ass temple of vapidity. Don't get me wrong, this applies to "white" club music too, it all sucks. Oh yea, you have 12 toilets, you can shit all day. Fascinating. Please, rhyme another word with itself, it's really charming.


It's just boring, droning music, it annoys me. I don't care if he's rapping about proletarian revolution, I just hate lil wayne and his annoying ass voice.



Yea, so basically, for me to like a hip hop artist all you really have to do is not sound like you just plugged a bottle of xanax up your ass and grabbed a microphone.

[Delenda Carthago]

No matter if you like Tech or not, Souljah Boy SUCKS.

[Spawn of Stalin]

To be honest, I like all that "elitist" shit this article talks about
Do you mean you like that type of music? Because I listen to stuff like Sage Francis and Immortal Technique too. I bet a lot of Tech fans out there listen to Wayne and love it, they are just too proud to admit it.

and I don't go out of my way to tell people what's 'wrong' with their music (yes, I'm biting in this thread :P), but the problem I have with Wayne etc has nothing to do with how 'conscious' they are.
In that case I don't think the article was aimed at people like you.

there's a reason you have to be fucked up to enjoy it being played at a billion decibels in some nasty ass temple of vapidity.
Probably true for some people.

No matter if you like Tech or not, Souljah Boy SUCKS.
No, you're just jealous because you don't know how to crank that.:)

[#FF0000]

nah souljah boy is bad

at the same time i wish i was smart enough to write songs that were made of nothing but the title repeated for 3 minutes and/or anime and then get hella rich

[Pirate Utopian]

I lol'd at the Jermain Dupri joke. Good article.

[JustMovement]

lil wayne does have one song i really like, go dj
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjjZhIZvZTU
(im steady lighting up the hash and riding in my yacht you gonna need a gas mask man)
also is liking wu-tang elitist? i cant imagine listening to odb rapping/singing about the inane shit he raps/sings about makes me a music snob.

[bailey_187]

It's the annoying, simplistic, atonal bullshit music they make. I hate club music and dance rap, there's a reason you have to be fucked up to enjoy it being played at a billion decibels in some nasty ass temple of vapidity.

be real though, how much lil wayne you listened to?

The Carter III is one of the best hip hop albums of all time IMO, alongside the other classics. But because it wasnt released in the 90s or by some obscure underground act, most people dismiss it.

Its not all just club/party music

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[Vanguard1917]

btw this is a lot "realer" (realer meaning genuine) than anything vomited by Immortal Technique

h-IYSl4I-4I

What's more "genuine" about it? It sounds like self-pitying emo rambling. There are a couple of mildly decent observations in the penultimate verse, and then it all goes downhill with the "girls wanna infect me with AIDS" arsehole-ism.

It makes me laugh how Lil B is taken so seriously by the cultural commentariat. This is the Guardian newspaper's description: "a beatless, Beat poetry-style set where Lil B, voice a-quiver with earnestness, ponders love, beauty and all the bad things in the world over naïf new-age synth washes." Another critic from the Guardian: "when Lil B hits the mark he is a visionary talent".

It reminds me of that South Park episode when Butters writes a novel about taking a shit (The Poop That Took a Pee) which is praised for its profundity by the literary community.

[manic expression]

They all be at me on myspace like, "How do I get on the radio, Wale, how do you do it?" Well, give them a song. But you gotta give them a song that makes you look like a damn fool. You gotta have a dance with it. And then, just look as stupid as possible, I promise you you'll will be on the radio tonight. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toIxVLNlHHA)

:laugh:

[bailey_187]

They all be at me on myspace like, "How do I get on the radio, Wale, how do you do it?" Well, give them a song. But you gotta give them a song that makes you look like a damn fool. You gotta have a dance with it. And then, just look as stupid as possible, I promise you you'll will be on the radio tonight. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=toIxVLNlHHA)

:laugh:

lol, Wale still fucks with Chris Brown and Gucci Mane though
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[bailey_187]

What's more "genuine" about it? It sounds like self-pitying emo rambling. There are a couple of mildly decent observations in the penultimate verse, and then it all goes downhill with the "girls wanna infect me with AIDS" arsehole-ism.

It makes me laugh how Lil B is taken so seriously by the cultural commentariat. This is the Guardian newspaper's description: "a beatless, Beat poetry-style set where Lil B, voice a-quiver with earnestness, ponders love, beauty and all the bad things in the world over naïf new-age synth washes." Another critic from the Guardian: "when Lil B hits the mark he is a visionary talent".

It reminds me of that South Park episode when Butters writes a novel about taking a shit (The Poop That Took a Pee) which is praised for its profundity by the literary community.

lol what, u serious? who said that

i like Lil B but wtf, they cant be serious

i guess its nothing new though, NME type people loved writting shit like this about Grime when it was blowing up, giving it a different and deeper meaning then we, the actual fan base, the kids in tracksuits who listened to it on our phones and at under 18 club nights ever gave it

[Pirate Utopian]

Wale was on No Hands with Waka Flocka and Roscoe Dash.

[L.A.P.]

The problem is that everyone has a different idea about what is being constituted as "real hip-hop" and for what reasons. I don't really see much of "real hip-hop" being only political hip-hop and I've never seen this trend where working class kids listened to stuff like Lil Wayne and Rick Ross while the white upper middle class were into Immortal Technique and Jedi Mind Tricks. We also need to realize when this whole "real hip-hop" thing really started happening and why as I was big on the whole "real hip-hop is dead" thing. It all really had its peak when I would say hip-hop music was at a horrible decline with snap music and stuff similar to that. This is actually part of the many reasons why I started to become increasingly alienated from my upper middle class white friends, because I thought there music taste was conformist shit (understand music was my passion at that time). They were into what was popular and dancing to Soulja Boy while I saw that the black and hispanic working class kids may have been into some of that but not nearly to that far of an extent. I discovered fellow fans of Nas and who recognized my 2Pac shirt and also liked Lil Wayne (this was when Lil Wayne wasn't super popular). I think a lot of the "real hip-hop" people are getting confused with snotty hipsters, and there is a huge difference. Not to mention hip-hop has drastically changed since that time and I feel like for the better, the whole "real hip-hop is dead" I was into thing is irrelevant now because the shitty music like Soulja Boy and Hurricane Chris that I used to rage over is also irrelevant now. I completely stopped listening to hip-hop for a while and went to heavy metal but I feel like for what it's worth the music has experienced a bit of a rebirth due to the spark of interest in alternative hip-hop. Drake and Kid Cudi are overall good artists despite becoming mainstream but they spearheaded this wave of really interesting work coming out of hip-hop such as Odd Future, Lil B, etc.

By the way I never knew Lil Wayne was actually that looked down upon, the only people who I've seen actually think he sucks and is mainstream shit are stupid hipsters. I've seen many people who are Immortal Technique fans and Lil Wayne fans. I've always liked him and he still releases interesting stuff once in a while.

[Vanguard1917]

i guess its nothing new though, NME type people loved writting shit like this about Grime when it was blowing up, giving it a different and deeper meaning then we, the actual fan base, the kids in tracksuits who listened to it on our phones and at under 18 club nights ever gave it

Yeah, that's exactly it. A bizarre fascination.

[Pirate Utopian]

How can something be fake hiphop? It either is it or it's not. If you like it or not doesnt matter.

I'm not saying Jedi Mind Tricks, IT or Slug arent "real hiphop". They're just, to me, not interesting.

[Manic Impressive]

They are still Hip Hop in the same way that Hanson or Busted are still Rock.

[cogar66]

its like, the beat was screamin, murder me
and I'm a murderer
so I murdered it

It's not that he's not "REAL" Hip Hop, it's that he's just bad. I've never said that shit like Lil Wayne isn't real Hip Hop, just that it was terrible Hip Hop.

[Property Is Robbery]

I get why people don't like IT, he is annoying as hell, and I don't like when people say conscious or political hip hop is the only real hip hop, but Lil Wayne? Come on. I have tried listening to a lot of his songs. Way too many IMO. My best friend loves him but he is one of the most untalented "rappers" that I have ever heard. :thumbdown:

[L.A.P.]

Maybe you should try listening to his songs before 2009, believe it or not he made music during that time. every example of a bad Lil Wayne line was made when he was in decline. It's like saying Metallica overall sucks by citing St. anger and after as example while completely disregarding Master of Puppets and ride the Lightning to the point where you pretend those albums don't exist. No one can ever tell me Tha Carter II was not an absolutely great hip-hop album.

[Spawn of Stalin]

They are still Hip Hop in the same way that Hanson or Busted are still Rock.
But rock defines a sound, whereas sound is only a component part of Hip Hop.

[Robespierre Richard]

This thread is now about Jadakiss

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[twenty percent tip]

is its funny that a white guy complained that white guys complainedabout music that was made by blacks people?:confused::lol:

[Stand Your Ground]

I severly dislike Soulja Boy and his music but this song is actually tolerable if you disreguard the stupid chorus.

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[Aspiring Humanist]

http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/7349/tybge.jpg

Thank you BasedGod

[apawllo]

Only heard a few tracks by Soulja Boy...not my thing, but I'm gonna preach about what anyone else listens to. My only issue, and this isn't even really genre specific, is that the radio rarely if ever plays music that I can get into. A lot of people feel the same way. There are diverse tastes out there, but every station shouldn't have the same stuff on it 24/7. And since Soulja Boy is a part of that and blew up so quickly he'll be demonized by a lot of people; those who feel their favorite artists should be getting that airtime. In summation: We want the airwaves back...word to Refused.

[The Vegan Marxist]

I'll be one to admit that I listen to both underground and mainstream hip-hop. When it comes to mainstream, I listen to various artists like Jay-Z, Waka Flocka Flame, Eminem, Fabolous, Kanye West, Nicki Minaj, Rihanna, etc. And when it comes to underground, I listen even more varying artists, like Immortal Technique, Lowkey, Dead Prez, Logic, Diabolic, Da Circle, Mohammad Dangerfield, etc.

And as for artists like Lil Wayne and Soulja Boy, god damn do they fucking suck! And before Bailey asks if I actually listened to Wayne's music, yes I have. My little cousin is a huge fan of Wayne and he listens to him all the time when I hang with him. I seriously just cannot listen to Wayne's simplicity and terrible voice.

Soulja Boy is just a fucking joke!

[Spawn of Stalin]

I'll be one to admit that I listen to both underground and mainstream hip-hop. When it comes to mainstream, I listen to various artists like Jay-Z, Waka Flocka Flame, Eminem, Fabolous, Kanye West, Nicki Minaj, Rihanna, etc. And when it comes to underground, I listen even more varying artists, like Immortal Technique, Lowkey, Dead Prez, Logic, Diabolic, Da Circle, Mohammad Dangerfield, etc.

Fuck yeah

[Pirate Utopian]

Pink Album was bad. She can go really hard. Like her verse on Monster but her album was weak.

[The Vegan Marxist]

Monster was an incredible track! Ruthless and hard! I love this song though with both Eminem and Nicki Minaj!

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[Pirate Utopian]

I love the face she makes in all her videos.

[Spawn of Stalin]

Yeah she is hardfuckingcore but her album was a pretty big disappointment considering what we heard from her before that, first two tracks were great the rest was filler. Still, I think she'll go places.

[bailey_187]

Her verse on Ludacris - My Chick Bad


omg
wRGEDF
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too hard

[Stranger Than Paradise]

This verse from Goblin sums this thread up:


People excited thinking shit is so tight
Getting co-signs from rappers that I don't even like
What the fuck you want me to do? Start to gobble his mic?
And start Jackson him off until his cock's blasting off?
Fuck that, these niggas ain't fucking with me
Cause I don't listen to the Immortal of Tech of the nique
And all this underground bullshit that's never gon' peak
On the Billboard Top 20 and Jam of the Week
I'd rather listen to Badu and Pusha the T
And some Waka Flocka Flame instead of that real hip hop
That's bull of the sheet but they want to critique
Everything that we, Wolf Gang, has ever released
But they don't get it, cause it's not made for them
The nigga that's in the mirror rapping, it's made for him
But they do not have the mindset, that same as him
I'm not weird, you're just a faggot, shame on him

[Octavian]

This verse from Goblin sums this thread up:
Tyler's also delusional and thinks that the Grammy awards are anything more than a corporate wank and gong show.

"And all this underground bullshit that's never gon' peak
On the Billboard Top 20 and Jam of the Week"
Measuring quality by popularity is pretty sad too.

[tachosomoza]

Rap went to shit after the Humpty Dance. :)

[Robespierre Richard]

I like that one Wiz Khalifa song that goes TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG TAYLOR GANG

[bailey_187]

same