Devrimci Yol

[Welshy]

While reading r/socialism on Reddit a while ago, I ran into a video by a Turkish band called Grup Yorum. Since I'm going to start learning Turkish next fall, I decided to look at more of their songs. So long story short, in one of the fan videos I saw pictures of an organization called Devrimci Yol.

I tried looking them up on wikipedia and it said that they were a Marxist-Leninist organization that rejected both the Soviet and Chinese models. So I was wondering if anyone could explain what this means. Also If anyone could tell me more about their politics, what they did, and an impact of their actions I would be grateful.

[MarxSchmarx]

I tried looking them up on wikipedia and it said that they were a Marxist-Leninist organization that rejected both the Soviet and Chinese models. So I was wondering if anyone could explain what this means. Also If anyone could tell me more about their politics, what they did, and an impact of their actions I would be grateful.

I am guessing it is a reference to Trotskyism? It's hard to summarize what is so special about their politics, but as best I gather it boils down to a belief that socialism requires advanced industrialization (and a large working class associated with it) as well as internationalism - both elements that were lacking in one degree or another under the Chinese and Soviet models. Of late it has become common for Trotskyists to also uphold democratic/civil liberties criticisms against the dictatorial systems in these countries, but I don't think that is a strict requirement of the Trotskyist critique.

As far as their impact as a group currently, I think somewhere along the lines of "historical curiosity" and "negligible" is about right.

Yet there are individual Trotskyist activists who arguably represent, and I choose my words carefully, the very best that our movement currently has to offer in terms of theoretical acumen, commitment as activists and moral rectitude. I cannot speak highly enough of many Trotskyist comrades I have worked with, although I admittedly cannot help but wonder about the ultimate futility of their dedication.

[Devrim]

I am guessing it is a reference to Trotskyism?

No, it is not at all.

Grup Yorum is generally associated with Dev-Sol (DHKP/C) which was a faction that split from Dev Yol in the late 1970s. Three of there members were arrested in a police crackdown on Dev Sol a couple of weeks ago. Dev Yol doesn't really exist anymore.

Basically Dev Sol are a sort of Stalinist group which promotes urban guerrilla tactics.

Devrim

[Sasha]

Grupyorum are awesome, with out doubt the nicest stalinists I ever met. They used to play my squat bar regularly, always an brilliant sight to see an circle of Turkish and kurdish comrades dancing traditional Turkish with one or two drunk punks among them.

[Sasha]

and Yeah, they are now called dhkc/p, the wiki is decent but their own website has an pretty big English section as well

[MarxSchmarx]

No, it is not at all.

Grup Yorum is generally associated with Dev-Sol (DHKP/C) which was a faction that split from Dev Yol in the late 1970s. Three of there members were arrested in a police crackdown on Dev Sol a couple of weeks ago. Dev Yol doesn't really exist anymore.

Basically Dev Sol are a sort of Stalinist group which promotes urban guerrilla tactics.

Devrim
Oh, I guess I misread the original post.

I thought the OP was asking about what it means to be
a Marxist-Leninist organization that rejected both the Soviet and Chinese models. . Which is why I thought they were making an oblique reference to Trotskyism. I guess it wasn't, oh well.

[Devrim]

Oh, I guess I misread the original post.

I thought the OP was asking about what it means to be . Which is why I thought they were making an oblique reference to Trotskyism. I guess it wasn't, oh well.

The term 'Marxist-Leninist' seems to be used a little differently on RevLeft that in the rest of the world. Historically Trotskyists were 'Bolshevik Leninists', and 'marxist-Leninists' referred to different types of Stalinists, most notably Maoists. If I didn't know about the details of the Turkish left, >I would presume that the phrase 'rejected both the Soviet and Chinese models' referred to some sort of Hoxhaist.

Devrim

[thälmann]

i dont know about dev yol. but as far as i know dhkp c is not very dogmatic in their view about history. they uphold stalin, mao hoxha and so on. they are more like guevarists in practice.

[Sasha]

Here is the dhkc/p wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DHKC
This the dev-yol wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devrimci_Yol

[MarxSchmarx]

The term 'Marxist-Leninist' seems to be used a little differently on RevLeft that in the rest of the world. Historically Trotskyists were 'Bolshevik Leninists', and 'marxist-Leninists' referred to different types of Stalinists, most notably Maoists. If I didn't know about the details of the Turkish left, >I would presume that the phrase 'rejected both the Soviet and Chinese models' referred to some sort of Hoxhaist.

Devrim

Perhaps the issue is that as soon as you get anarchists and other non-Leninists involved, it seems a little bit arcane whether one group is "marxist-leninist" and another "bolshevik leninist" in the bigger scheme of things. But your point about "Marxist-Leninist" referring strictly to groups that in some sense venerate Stalin's legacy is well taken.

Indeed, I think the phrase "Chinese model" is sufficiently vague that it could well include early Maoist China which Hoxha largely embraced. As such I must admit that Hoxhaists wouldn't have been my first reaction. But this is largely a moot point now.