What do the anarchist comrades think of grammar?

[UltraWright]

I am wondering what the anarchists think of grammar? Do you accept following it? Do you consider following it a form of compliance to some virtual authority that emerged over time?

[Landsharks eat metal]

Grammar is a good way to make sure people understand you. There are some pointless, stuffy old rules that should be done away with (like not ending your sentences with a preposition), but as a whole, I like grammar, and it bothers me a lot when people get it wrong. (I have similar beliefs with spelling.)

[Comrade J]

I'm not an Anarchist, but more an Autonomist Marxist, which has a lot in common with Anarchism. I would oppose anybody trying to do away with grammar. I've never heard anybody be generally opposed to it, and it is so integral to language that not obeying its rules would mean nobody would ever understand you.

[agnixie]

I am wondering what the anarchists think of grammar? Do you accept following it? Do you consider following it a form of compliance to some virtual authority that emerged over time?

Non-prescriptive grammar is the result of usage within a community, not some nebulous imposed rule from above.

[Obs]

yes talk like this should everybody that because grammar the state's authoritarian oppression symbol is of SMAHS THE STATE RAAN RAAN RAANISMO O MUERTE

[UltraWright]

yes talk like this should everybody that because grammar the state's authoritarian oppression symbol is of SMAHS THE STATE RAAN RAAN RAANISMO O MUERTE

The argument to end all arguments :D. Thank you comrade, you made my afternoon!

[praxis1966]

Anarchism doesn't mean that there aren't any rules. Anarchism means that the rules are agreed upon freely by everyone involved as opposed to dictated from on high. I don't see why grammar and spelling are any different.

[brigadista]

not sure im an anarchist but i have never understood grammar :confused:

[Princess Luna]

Arbitrary grammer is stupid, the whole point of language is to communicate. As long as the other person understands what you are saying, it doesn't matter if you use "then" or "than"

[praxis1966]

Arbitrary grammer is stupid, the whole point of language is to communicate. As long as the other person understands what you are saying, it doesn't matter if you use "then" or "than"

Tell that to the next person you speak with whose first language is something other than English. Generally, those folks have learned the language in school and therefore won't have a clue what the fuck you're talking about. It's not arbitrary any more than are internet protocols. Grammar rules are designed to promote effective communication and failure to adhere to them can only be inhibitive.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

grammar is not unjustified, it aids the ability of human beings to communicate with one another. communication is important and will be even more so in a communist society where all people have a say in organisation, therefore grammar is justified as a set of rules or at least guidelines (many of which i haven't followed, but i'm sure that people can understand me).

[Ele'ill]

I am wondering what the anarchists think of grammar? Do you accept following it? Do you consider following it a form of compliance to some virtual authority that emerged over time?

I am infinitely creative and smith words and phrases together because I understand their meaning, the meanings I may want to present and the sounds. I also think it helps to be able to communicate.

[Quail]

Grammar helps people to understand each other. Bad grammar can completely change the meaning of the sentence. Spelling is far less important than grammar, in that grammar puts words into context. Language without rules for grammar would be ridiculously hard to understand because there would be too much ambiguity.

[Magón]

Fuck yo gramar. I r duh beest of anarchism.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

Unurrkuy

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

wtf it wouldn't let me put that in caps lock. fucking fascist regime

[Os Cangaceiros]

Language and grammar is authoritarian and must be smashed. Humanity will only truly be liberated when we all speaks in grunts and whistles.

/John Zerzan

[RedSunRising]

Anarchism doesn't mean that there aren't any rules. Anarchism means that the rules are agreed upon freely by everyone involved as opposed to dictated from on high. I don't see why grammar and spelling are any different.

I know off topic but what is an anarcho-syndicalist doing with a Provisional Sinn Fein avatar?

I support the Irish national liberation struggle, which PSF no longer do, but they are like a capitalist party?

[Aeval]

Grammar is just the standard form of the language, so if you got rid of the current grammar then however people then spoke would then be the grammar. It'd be literally impossible to get rid of grammar unless people just shouted words out at random, which could be fun but not particularly useful...

[Vendetta]

Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo

[praxis1966]

I know off topic but what is an anarcho-syndicalist doing with a Provisional Sinn Fein avatar?

I support the Irish national liberation struggle, which PSF no longer do, but they are like a capitalist party?

That's the anarchist "fuck you I won't do what you tell me" attitude leaking through. I've literally had that avatar for years; before the recent shifts. The more people criticize it, the more it makes me want to leave it up. Call it passive aggressive trolling, lol.

EDIT: For the record, there was a point when I think they could've been properly characterized as social democratic reformists...

[Johnny Kerosene]

We must also renounce vocabulary and come up with our own meanings for everything. And letters. Fuck it, every Anarchist must become a Primmie to escape the bonds of things like language, which wouldn't be needed in a hunter-gatherer society. GO FORTH COMRADES AND SCREEEEEEEEEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGHGGHHHHHHHH!

[Meridian]

Grammar, in the way it is taught in school, is a formalization of what is common grammar of languages that people who speak the language have learned through use and observation. Grammar is in this sense highly complex as it accompanies the myriad of ways we use language, and it is not static.

It's this that you compare to when a given sentence does not make sense to you, regardless of what any given anarchist may think about rule-following in a real or metaphoric sense.

[Magón]

9'1-13 19-15 3-15-15-12!

I present words/letters in numbers. After 2012, or maybe Saturday, everyone will write words out, according to the letter's that make them up, in their numerical order; but it's still limited to 26. (At least the English alphabet.) IT'S THE WAY OF THE FUTURE!

[RedSunRising]

EDIT: For the record, there was a point when I think they could've been properly characterized as social democratic reformists...


LOL...Its no skin off my back. Was just curious because the anarcho-syndicalists in Ireland have a phobia of anything that sniffs of Irish Republicanism.

And yup they are Social Democrats but to me that means nice capitalism but still capitalism to me.

[praxis1966]

LOL...Its no skin off my back. Was just curious because the anarcho-syndicalists in Ireland have a phobia of anything that sniffs of Irish Republicanism.

And yup they are Social Democrats but to me that means nice capitalism but still capitalism to me.

So what you're saying is my passive aggressive trolling worked...

[RedSunRising]

So what you're saying is my passive aggressive trolling worked...

I find it kinda funny.

I hope the Libcom crew get to see it some time!

[praxis1966]

I find it kinda funny.

I hope the Libcom crew get to see it some time!

Meh They can kiss my star, too. ;)

[Devrim]

And yup they are Social Democrats but to me that means nice capitalism but still capitalism to me.

To me it means another bourgeois party leading attacks on the working class such as water charges.


That's the anarchist "fuck you I won't do what you tell me" attitude leaking through.

I am not an anarchist, but I used to be one, and over the years I have met many anarchists, and to be quite honest I have never personally met one who said "Fuck you I won't do what you tell me, I will support a sectarian party which is in a participant in implementing austerity measures against the working class instead".

RSR is exactly right, and I thought supporting Everton was bad enough.

Devrim

[praxis1966]

I am not an anarchist, but I used to be one, and over the years I have met many anarchists, and to be quite honest I have never personally met one who said "Fuck you I won't do what you tell me, I will support a sectarian party which is in a participant in implementing austerity measures against the working class instead".

RSR is exactly right, and I thought supporting Everton was bad enough.

Devrim

Yeah, don't put words in my mouth, my son. What I was saying is that I don't take kindly to being told what to do... I haven't left it up because I support them, I've left it up because it infuriates the kind of people who would be egotistical enough to think they have a right to tell me what avatar I should or shouldn't use.

Is that plain enough, or should I explain it a third time?

[RedSunRising]

To me it means another bourgeois party leading attacks on the working class such as water charges.


I think its unfair to call them sectarian. However fair point about the water charges. Lets say they put forward a nicer image than most Irish capitalist parties.

[Devrim]

Yeah, don't put words in my mouth, my son. What I was saying is that I don't take kindly to being told what to do... I haven't left it up because I support them, I've left it up because it infuriates the kind of people who would be egotistical enough to think they have a right to tell me what avatar I should or shouldn't use.

First please don't refer to me as 'my son'. I am almost certainly old enough to be your father. Second, I don't think I have any 'right' to tell you what to do. If you like you can fly the banner of the Democratic Party, the Republican party, or the KKK for all I care. They are all equally anti-working class.

Devrim

[praxis1966]

First please don't refer to me as 'my son'. I am almost certainly old enough to be your father. Second, I don't think I have any 'right' to tell you what to do. If you like you can fly the banner of the Democratic Party, the Republican party, or the KKK for all I care. They are all equally anti-working class.

Devrim

See, that's what I'm talking about. That paternalistic "I'm old enough to be your father" attitude. Obviously, you are in the exact head space I figured at the outset...

[Devrim]

See, that's what I'm talking about. That paternalistic "I'm old enough to be your father" attitude. Obviously, you are in the exact head space I figured at the outset...

Ok, that is fine, and you are in the 'never been to Ireland, have no idea what I am talking about, but holding attachments to reactionary ethnic nationalism' attitude that I figured from the outset. Personally I would rather be a little patronizing than lining up with sectarian death squads, and wouldn't have even said anything like that if you hadn't referred to me as 'my son'; pot, kettle, black.

Devrim

[praxis1966]

Ok, that is fine, and you are in the 'never been to Ireland, have no idea what I am talking about, but holding attachments to reactionary ethnic nationalism' attitude that I figured from the outset.

Yeah, I'm sorry I'm not bourgeois enough to afford the plane fare. That's totally my fault. And to be fair, I've read more than 99% of the people I know on the subject so accusing me of not knowing what I'm talking about just demonstrates that you don't know what you're talking about. Pot, kettle, black.


Personally I would rather be a little patronizing than lining up with sectarian death squads, and wouldn't have even said anything like that if you hadn't referred to me as 'my son'; pot, kettle, black.

The 'my son' bit was bait to see if that's really where you were coming from and you took it. Well played.

[Devrim]

The 'my son' bit was bait to see if that's really where you were coming from and you took it. Well played.

There is an easier way to deal with this that insisting we are right, which involves one of us, in this case myself, just apologizing for being patronizing. I'm sorry.

Devrim

[praxis1966]

There is an easier way to deal with this that insisting we are right, which involves one of us, in this case myself, just apologizing for being patronizing. I'm sorry.

Devrim

You know what? I am too, sorry for being an asshole about it. And for what it's worth, even though you were being a condescending jackass, you're a condescending jackass whom I happen to respect... Check out this thread: http://www.revleft.com/vb/avatar-change-t155055/index.html You're the primary motivation, so if you wanna go in and gloat, by all means do so, lulz...

[Tablo]

Grammar dumb to be. I grammar to burn.

[ʇsıɥɔɹɐuɐ ıɯɐbıɹo]

Because I don't understand what is said, I mis-speak my response, unintentionally saying not quite the opposite of what someone else wants to hear, but not exactly what they wanted to hear. This leads to conflict, but so does imposing grammar on a language meant to be shared as it comes to your mind.

Grammars a ***** because Free Form Prose slapped her in the face and then kicked her in the stomach while screaming obscenities about leaving Prose alone

[jake williams]

Regarding grammar: elaborate prescriptive rules are about as equally ignorant of human language as any sort of dismissal of "grammar" as such. Human language inevitably follows particular patterns or it wouldn't be communicable; at the same time, such rules aren't static facts of history, they're dynamically developed. English (or any other language) hasn't existed forever, and at no point has it become some especially good form of a language.