Che = Killer???

[RebeldePorLaPAZ]

in defence to one of our many arguments my sister has gave me a link to an article on how che is bad.

http://www.today.ucla.edu/html/971010cheshow.html

she still claims to be correct, and defends the article in every way.

[Rastafari]

you have to think about the majority of cuban-americans living in the USA. Many of them fled the country because they were middle-class or wealthy land-owners who enjoyed the yank's influence. So, to avoid losing money and becomming the poor that they so dearly hated, the left to the land of milk and honey, taking their money with them in some cases.

[Ctisphonics]

What does their money have to do with what's written in the picture.
Genocide is no laughing matter. Adolph Hitler got his idea of killing the Jews from the Turks in thier Armenian holocaust. Well over a million Armenians and halve a million greeks died at the Turks hands, and the Turks give VERY similar responses, saying they took at their rightful money. The Christian population had Icons for centuries that hand either Silver or Gold, and the Turks would kill the people, take the Icons and melt them down, ect. They would also take the Armenians land, drafting the men and sending them unarmed into workcapms, them would be executed. The Ottomans/Young Turks and then the Soviets nearly annialted a whole people eving excuses like "there middle class". Murder is a concern for everyone, no matter what economic class your in. A simple book on leadership could of offered an alternative to this insane, unjustifieble murder of people,THERE ARE BETTER WAYS TO MOTIVATE PEOPLE!

Even today on the internet it's mostly hush hush, despite the fact so many dies. Ever wondered why I listed Soghomon Tehliria as one of my favorite political leaders? He was an assassin how killed the man most responsible for the murder of his people, was prosicuted by the Germans, was legally found to of assassinated him, and was found not-guilty due to compulsion to kill after seeing what his people went through. Che was not a practitioner of his own philosophy, as Bolivia clearly showed.

[Urban Rubble]

What in the fuck does Che have in common with Genocide ?

Also, how was he not a practitioner of his own philosophy ?

[Ctisphonics]

By choosing unfavorable terrain in a country that wasn't quite ready for armed struggle. He alienated his support, ect.

[Urban Rubble]

Well, that is somewhat true. I don't think he went against his philosophy, I just think he made a mistake. I also think he was a little over eager and jumped the gun.

By the way, still wondering what this all has to do with genocide ?

[Firestorm]

Fuck it! UCLA is the biggest defender of the Cuban blockade and such fuckin' nonsense. Che was a revolutionary who was against US Imperial bastards spying and plotting assignation attempts against Communists in Latin America. The CIA had no problems killing Communists, so why is it so bad that they fought back?

Duh....

Che was fighting to save his life and other comrads.
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Long live Socialism!

[sliverchrist]

The article is really, well, bad.

I remeber Che becoming more of a nusance to the soviets than a supporter.

Oh, and his execution of people in Cuba, very true. They were spies or deserters and there was no way to hold to insure the safety of those fighting. This equals a quick "pistol shot to the back of the head"

[Anarchist Freedom]

haha if i remember the soviets didnt like che he told them to shape up ! oh 8 O but you see che did kill people the spies traitors and baitista goverment he which is justifiable anyways even if he was bad which he isnt he did more to help cuba after the baitistas i can tell you that!



:che:

[Vinny Rafarino]

Che did not support the policies of Khruschev. Who would?

It is a well known fact that comrade Guevara was utterly ruthless when counter-revolutionaries were concerned. What I find amusing is that the west will not bother talking about people being clipped by their own governments when "war" is declared aginst them but they are the first ones to ignore the fact that revolutions are also war. Western hypocracy in action. forgetaboutit, this article makes it look like Che was running around some barrio in Cuba just clipping people for the hell of it. Never mind that there was an actual war going on at the time.

Oh yeah, I remember now, only the USA is allowed to "declare war" and start wacking people. Every other declaration of war is simply not recognised by the yanquis and is considered "terrorism".

[Anarchist Freedom]

damn right comrade RAF !! ahaha he proves a point i am still suprised this shit is coming from cali the most liberal place in america i wold think they glorified che wouldnt you??





:che:

[Invader Zim]

In war those who are spies/deserters usually get shot. In many western countries those crimes are still often punished by death.

Why is it OK for them to do it and not che.

Also I realise many Cuban capitalists, were "put to the sword", just as many Nazi's were executed for their crimes.

Sorry if im not sympathetic to case made by some Alpha66 ***** but im not.

[Xvall]

Absolutely. That 7 paragraph essay, each paragraph consisting of little more than two sentences, most certainly lays down a strong and well-based argument.

[Invader Zim]

Originally posted by Drake [email protected] 2 2003, 10:02 PM
Absolutely. That 7 paragraph essay, each paragraph consisting of little more than two sentences, most certainly lays down a strong and well-based argument.
If your refering to my post, and taking the piss then, the fact you cant even count means that your entire post can be discounted as blatant hypocracy.

[Xvall]

Great argument. Too bad I was replying to the link provided by Juju, and not your post.

[Nobody]

The revulsion of Cubans to this event is as valid and honest as would be that of the Jewish community if confronted with the idealization of Adolf Hitler.

Yep, the oft used anology comparing Che to Hitler. Che, like Hitler, was fighting for the good of all people. Wait. Nope Hitler hated l9ots of people because their so-called race.


By adhering to his anti-American feelings and pro-Soviet stance, he achieved a role in history that stands for one failure after another, both in Cuba, as well as in all the other countries where he went to promote and disseminate Castro’s Revolution.

I think Che promoted the Chinese more for reasons stated above. I think that's why he supported them in the Sino-Soviet War/conflict. Yes, the revolutions in Bolivia and Congo did fail in his life, but we may live to see those problems requitified.


This "idealized icon" is the one who, as a modern day Grand Inquisitor, eliminated many of his foes with a single pistol shot to the back of their heads.

You betray me, and I'm going to clip you too, you hear?


And he is also the same one who authored these enhancing words printed in the identity booklets of young Cuban soldiers sent to fight in Angola: "Blind hate against the enemy creates a forceful impulse that cracks the boundaries of natural human limitations, transforming the soldier in an effective, selective and cold killing machine. A people without hate cannot triumph against the adversary."

Note to self, when in war do love thee enemy, cause if you do no harm no harm shall come to you. Wait, the idea of war, correct me if I'm wrong, is to KILL YOUR ENEMY!! You hate to drive yourself farther and steel yourself for what your about to do. Finally, only revolutionaries are "motivated by love".


Being UCLA a first-rate research university and a place of knowledge, it is expected that the public conferences planned for October 24 and 25 will include exiled Cuban historians and intellectuals who will shed a different light from the one promoted by the exhibition. This way, history will be properly served.

Right, by choosing people who hate Castro and Che from the bottom of their souls will give the people a fair balanced look? More like polar opposites in my opinion. And the only way to see history is "properly served" would be to have a bunch of people who agree with you, right?

A note to Sara: nice paper, I like the quotes and sources to back up what you have said. You know sometimes people hold a different opinion then you and that's ok. The type of attiude you project is very Stalinist, the same ideology Che held to. Congrats, you're like Che!!

Hasta La Victoria Siempre, Comrade Sara.

[Alejandro C]

i'd like to get my hands around that *****'s neck. teach her about murder first hand. can you believe she's a teacher there. fuck.


if your sister believes that.... i hope you're adopted. (or she is)

[Goldfinger]

I'm sure I can find a bunch of articles written by "professoinals," proving that Jews were responsible for September 11th 2001, or that the Half-Life 2 delay is caused by an alien invasion.

The internet makes you stupid.

[Xvall]

The Half-Life 2 delay is not caused by aliens. That is just nonsensical. The Half-Life 2 delay is due to actions taken by the real-life G-Man to gather his administrative associates and ban the game.

[Ctisphonics]

Well, that is somewhat true. I don't think he went against his philosophy, I just think he made a mistake. I also think he was a little over eager and jumped the gun.

His mistakes were a blantant attack against his martial philosophy, just looking at a globe tells you starting a Guerilla war in Bolivia is a stupid idea, that's a place you take over after you have control of a coast with Soviet andCuban supplies comming in. Plus, he didn't have the vantage of surprise....everyone knows who Che is, and mass producing your tactical manuals is a very stupid thing to do if you plan a repeat performance.

He didn't even ensure the local communist support before going in...... this isn't a sign of mistakes, it's a sign of Dillusions of Grandure. He should of known he was in trouble before setting off.

[schumi]

What a fucking stupid article!!!!

the killing of (cuban) traitors and terrorists working for the USA isnt a crime... :ph34r:

[Kapitan Andrey]

This link is shit!!! :angry: :angry: :angry:

[Dataika]

Originally posted by [email protected] 4 2003, 08:34 AM

Well, that is somewhat true. I don't think he went against his philosophy, I just think he made a mistake. I also think he was a little over eager and jumped the gun.

His mistakes were a blantant attack against his martial philosophy, just looking at a globe tells you starting a Guerilla war in Bolivia is a stupid idea, that's a place you take over after you have control of a coast with Soviet andCuban supplies comming in. Plus, he didn't have the vantage of surprise....everyone knows who Che is, and mass producing your tactical manuals is a very stupid thing to do if you plan a repeat performance.

He didn't even ensure the local communist support before going in...... this isn't a sign of mistakes, it's a sign of Dillusions of Grandure. He should of known he was in trouble before setting off.
I'm new to this forum, but from what I gather from reading the book "Death of a Revolutionary," he was tricked by a communist named Monje, who was pro-Moscow. He wanted the funds from Fidel, and decided to play and sell the idea that Bolivia was a good place to start a revolution. Furthermore, they promised him supplies, manpower, and other things he would need for his revolution. Che had false information, he wasn't stupid, just tricked. It might have been foolish for him to trust them, especially when he suspected that they wouldn't help, but he was given false information, not only by pro-Moscow communists, but his allies as well. They were going by Monje and the communists in Bolivia who were feeding them lies.

Moscow seemed to picture Che as a nuisance anyway and wanted his revolution to fail. Hence, they gave him false information about the conditions in Bolivia. He didn't realize that the Bolivians reguarded their earlier revolution in (1952?) as the equivalent of a Cuban-type revolution. Hence, he was tricked by Monje and other communists to get his revolutionary ideals out of the way. So they could "peacefully co-exist"

[Kapitan Andrey]

Hmm...How interesing! :)

I like your post and position! :)