This is how imperialist I am

[727Goon]

From the post that got me restricted:


I don't support the US military or it's objectives in Afganistan at all

Anyways I don't give a fuck, I'm done with politics and leftists havent done shit to better my conditions as a working class black man as much as they talk about that bullshit the last time they made a difference was the 70s, from now on fuck anarchism, fuck communism, I'm just gonna do me.
#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck*****

[☭The Revolution☭]

Are you really that stupid?...

[GallowsBird]

:confused:

[Omsk]

I don't care,i really,really don't care.

[727Goon]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

[GallowsBird]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_f6TWGiqLcn8/TTnk_EiU_wI/AAAAAAAAJfE/fxsprMgVODU/s1600/fuck-you-guys.jpg

[727Goon]

lol whatever mods you guys can delete my account im done with this bullshit

[Obs]

If you lose your faith in leftist politics after you're restricted on an Internet forum, I'm guessing you never belonged on a site for revolutionaries. Do enjoy your wage slavery.

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

Please don't make the mistake of thinking this forum represents "the left" in any meaningful way whatsoever. There are many, many people from all backgrounds, across the planet, who are working to better their condition and that of others for a greater good.

[☭The Revolution☭]

If you really are too stupid to see how our brave men and women are putting their lives on the line for our cause, then fuck you. I sincerely mean that. If you are going to shit on those brave revolutionaries after they fight and die for you, then go to hell and don't fucking come back.

[727Goon]

Pretty much bro this and conversations with people has been the extent of my political involvement sorry I've got better shit to do than hang out with a bunch of political hobbyists who think they're revolutionaries somehow relevant in todays world.

[psgchisolm]

From the post that got me restricted:



Anyways I don't give a fuck, I'm done with politics and leftists havent done shit to better my conditions as a working class black man as much as they talk about that bullshit the last time they made a difference was the 70s, from now on fuck anarchism, fuck communism, I'm just gonna do me.
#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck*****I love that last line.:lol:

Anyway I am imperialist :rolleyes:. Even through there's no actual evidence to support that as i have criticized the US for being in other countries affairs. Pro-military meh. I have a military fetish. Red Army, US Army, WW2, 1700s, B.C. military's(Hell South American and African military's as well). I like military's, so what. I mainly support the contributions and sacrifices of people of the Red Army like Alexander Matrosov and Yakov Pavlov. People who most of you don't know shit about and have never even heard of. If you checked my favorites most of the crap in the military folder is of the German Wehrmacht and Soviet Red Army. I just happened to live in the US. Most of the Soviet Generals and enlisted were in the Tzar's army before the revolution. Of course most of them got purged to hell and back but those that didn't made notable contributions to the Soviet cause. Hell who here has even heard of the fucking Black Death. How about the fact that the Soviets were innovators of Airborne paratroopers? The Soviets invading Manchuria? Clashes with Japan in early WW2 in Asia? Japanese-Russo War?

[727Goon]

If you really are too stupid to see how our brave men and women are putting their lives on the line for our cause, then fuck you. I sincerely mean that. If you are going to shit on those brave revolutionaries, then go to hell and don't fucking come back.

No ones putting their lives on the line for shit, not in the US at least.

[727Goon]

I love that last line.:lol:

Anyway I am imperialist :rolleyes:. Even through there's no actual evidence to support that as i have criticized the US for being in other countries affairs. Pro-military meh. I have a military fetish. Red Army, US Army, WW2, 1700s, B.C. military's(Hell South American and African military's as well). I like military's, so what. I mainly support the contributions and sacrifices of people of the Red Army like Alexander Matrosov and Yakov Pavlov. People who most of you don't know shit about and have never even heard of. If you checked my favorites most of the crap in the military folder is of the German Wehrmacht and Soviet Red Army. I just happened to live in the US. Most of the Soviet Generals and enlisted were in the Tzar's army before the revolution. Of course most of them got purged to hell and back but those that didn't made notable contributions to the Soviet cause. Hell who here has even heard of the fucking Black Death. How about the fact that the Soviets were innovators of Airborne paratroopers? The Soviets invading Manchuria? Clashes with Japan in early WW2 in Asia? Japanese-Russo War?

I actually hate the military but I dont like the Taliban so yeah I'm soo imperialist. But you make a good point about how most Soviet generals had been in the tsars army, most revolutionary leftists who these goofy ass kids jack it to would be restricted on this forum for one thing or another.

[Obs]

I love that last line.:lol:

Anyway I am imperialist :rolleyes:. Even through there's no actual evidence to support that as i have criticized the US for being in other countries affairs. Pro-military meh. I have a military fetish. Red Army, US Army, WW2, 1700s, B.C. military's(Hell South American and African military's as well). I like military's, so what. I mainly support the contributions and sacrifices of people of the Red Army like Alexander Matrosov and Yakov Pavlov. People who most of you don't know shit about and have never even heard of. If you checked my favorites most of the crap in the military folder is of the German Wehrmacht and Soviet Red Army. I just happened to live in the US. Most of the Soviet Generals and enlisted were in the Tzar's army before the revolution. Of course most of them got purged to hell and back but those that didn't made notable contributions to the Soviet cause. Hell who here has even heard of the fucking Black Death. How about the fact that the Soviets were innovators of Airborne paratroopers? The Soviets invading Manchuria? Clashes with Japan in early WW2 in Asia? Japanese-Russo War?

Actually I think you'll find a few of our posters are very interested in military history, and pretty much all of our resident MLs are familiar with Matrosov, Pavlov etc. and know pretty much every military action taken by the Soviet Union at any point in time. This is one reason we have a History subforum, in which many posters contribute with very knowledgeable posts.

The wrong way to act out this passion for military history is, of course, flying into a desert far, far away and shootin' up some brown people. Most sane people realise this, but sadly you seem to lack anything resembling human decency.

[southernmissfan]

You went on to REVOLUTIONARY LEFT and you're surprised that we restrict you for wanting to join the U.S. Army?

And if you think your dramatic "exit" will make us feel bad, you're mistaken. It sucks that as a "working class black man" you are turning to the United States military and are abandoning the only ideologies that have any hope of human liberation. But based on your posts, it's doubtful you had any genuine knowledge or interest in us to begin with. And we are trying to help you, trying to dissuade you from joining the military. It's not just about the imperialist implications but also the fact that you, as a black working class man, are willing to sign away your free will and multiple years of your life in the service of your enemy! The fact that you much prefer to join the military than to say, get loans or look into JobCorps or exhaust every other possibility speaks more for your personal integrity than it does for our credibility. And just so you know, I've personally known many people in the military and formerly in the military. I've also known a former recruiter very well, who openly acknowledges the dishonest techniques they use. Not a single one of these people have ever gotten the things they were promised. Hell, a large portion of the people I've worked with over the years have been veterans--and they were in the same boat as me, working at shitty, dead end jobs around or just above minimum wage.

[Queercommie Girl]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

Are you serious? "Pathetic Maoist group in the hills"? The Maoist Chinese Army was one of the greatest military forces of the 20th century.

[RadioRaheem84]

Those fucking white boys died fighting Fascists in Spain, France, Italy and all over Europe.

They fought tooth and nail to free the Scotsboro Boys while the NAACP was only considering it because they were too busy trying to not to be red baited by the NY Times!

Fucking white boy Che Guevara went off into the Congo to help the African struggle.

Fucking white boy Castro lent his troops to Angola to fight against their imperial onslaught.

I am sure you think the Black Panthers (one of the GREATEST revolutionary movements ever to form in the States) were a bunch of pansies reading Mao in their cushy lofts???

There is no one out there more than Leftists fighting on behalf to end some of the most brutal forms of exploitation out there. Without these brave people, we would be nowhere.

You want to try liberalism? Good luck. Black Nationalism? Again, good luck.

But do not come in here thinking that Communists never accomplished anything for the working class.

[psgchisolm]

If you really are too stupid to see how our brave men and women are putting their lives on the line for our cause, then fuck you. I sincerely mean that. If you are going to shit on those brave revolutionaries, then go to hell and don't fucking come back.I almost choked on my damn spit.:laugh::laugh::laugh: Besides protest, who has fought with communist rebels in any armed conflict around the world? Anti-fascists are the only ones who can really claim putting their lives on the line, and fuck we have a loyalist on here who's even an anti-fascist. The fact is most of the people here are doing the safe play and chilling on the internet shit talking about leaders who don't give a damn about them. We talk about all this solidarity one minute and shit talk the other. It's not all leftists here, but damn a good amount do this ALOT. A lot of leftists are looking to better the cause rather than shit on trotsky and insult each other. Hell I support my restriction as it makes sense. I'm joining and will support an imperialist Army. But calling half of these armchair generals and putting them on the same pedestal of actual revolutionaries? I'm sad that there WASN'T a large leftist movement in winconsin. Marxist Trotskyist. That's solidarity. A bunch of name calling immature people labeling each other trot or stalinist are not revolutionaries.

[Arlekino]

I think you are fed up of revolutionary leftist ideas, probably somebody hurt you and you blaming white race people, could you try take serious point of view, we all not that bad how you understand. I quite little agree with your first post, we don't do much as we could to change for better for all people no matter what nationality we are and I am sorry to write we little afraid of fascist scum as myself experienced, last Saturday was "Sant Georgians" day we have to stop giving leaflets and newspapers because many was supporters of EDL. Yes some worries for own safety and answer we still not united for the moment.

[Arlekino]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_f6TWGiqLcn8/TTnk_EiU_wI/AAAAAAAAJfE/fxsprMgVODU/s1600/fuck-you-guys.jpg

With this reactionary picture we would never united is even more divided.

[psgchisolm]

Actually I think you'll find a few of our posters are very interested in military history, and pretty much all of our resident MLs are familiar with Matrosov, Pavlov etc. and know pretty much every military action taken by the Soviet Union at any point in time. This is one reason we have a History subforum, in which many posters contribute with very knowledgeable posts.I understand and applaud this. Knowledge in these type of things is great! keep history of true hero's alive. Most of the time it's the same few posters. ALL leftists should know of the contributions of Matrosov. Sadly most don't give a shit about people like him. Who sacrificed their-selves for their Platoon. The important leaders will always be remembered in history Che, Castor, Stalin, Trotsky. But the people who serve below them will be forgotten.


The wrong way to act out this passion for military history is, of course, flying into a desert far, far away and shootin' up some brown people. Most sane people realise this, but sadly you seem to lack anything resembling human decency.Ahh the shooting brown people attack. Good seeing as how me and goon are black. Hell do you think the Generals cared if they fought for the tzar or for communism? Do you think they cared if they joined to shoot Germans or Turks?. They joined to be soldiers. Attempting to call me racist against brown people is wrong.

[Proukunin]

How does this guy have so much reputation if he's talking like this? Why are you even on here just leave. The fucking nationalism inside black panther politics these days, man.

[mosfeld]

#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck***** You're not really helping your case by using sexist slang.

[hatzel]

All I've learnt from this thread is that Goon is a big ol' imperialist...

[RadioRaheem84]

I'm joining and will support an imperialist Army

While you're at it do not forget to sign the Euston Manifesto!

Seriously, how the hell do you think joining the most expansionist military power in the face of the Earth will promote socialism? Or for that matter social democracy? Or for that fucking matter even the slightest notion of the liberal democracy they're claiming to uphold?

Makes no fucking sense. The only way it does it through some Hitchean liberal interventionist Wilsonian paradigm that has captivated faux-leftists since the inception of the Blair administration.

[Rafiq]

From the post that got me restricted:



Anyways I don't give a fuck, I'm done with politics and leftists havent done shit to better my conditions as a working class black man as much as they talk about that bullshit the last time they made a difference was the 70s, from now on fuck anarchism, fuck communism, I'm just gonna do me.
#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck*****

:laugh:

Fuck you, you made me spit out my water from that last line.

I could just see you saying that really fast

[Optiow]

Pretty much bro this and conversations with people has been the extent of my political involvement sorry I've got better shit to do than hang out with a bunch of political hobbyists who think they're revolutionaries somehow relevant in todays world.
So get out.

[GallowsBird]

With this reactionary picture we would never united is even more divided.

:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

[GPDP]

If this is how you're gonna react to a restriction on a fucking internet forum, then perhaps nothing of value was lost.

[Tablo]

If it makes you feel better, this forum is a poor representation of the leftist community.

[GPDP]

If it makes you feel better, this forum is a poor representation of the leftist community.

Don't even bother with that line, even if it is profoundly true. To be dissuaded from communism and politics altogether due to EXTREME butthurt over an intertube site taking away your lollipop denotes a clear case of immaturity.

And before the OP rages some moar and calls me a *****-ass white boy or whatever the hell, I'm an undocumented Mexican. Get at me, bro.

[Tablo]

Don't even bother with that line, even if it is profoundly true. To be dissuaded from communism and politics altogether due to EXTREME butthurt over an intertube site taking away your lollipop denotes a clear case of immaturity.

And before the OP rages some moar and calls me a *****-ass white boy or whatever the hell, I'm an undocumented Mexican. Get at me, bro.
True, I can't say I'm upset that this loser rejects leftism entirely over a restriction on an internet forum.

[hatzel]

I've now decided that Goon is a GOON!!! I like it. Also he's a massive stupidhead...

[RadioRaheem84]

Goon. before you write your last witless post, would you mine explaining to me why you think joining the Army is a good thing for real revolutionaries to do?

Psgchisholm, same question.

It's not something I would wish on my worst enemy. I've seen friends come back mentally scared and change into totally different people with real problems.

[psgchisolm]

I think you are fed up of revolutionary leftist ideas, probably somebody hurt you and you blaming white race people, could you try take serious point of view, we all not that bad how you understand. I quite little agree with your first post, we don't do much as we could to change for better for all people no matter what nationality we are and I am sorry to write we little afraid of fascist scum as myself experienced, last Saturday was "Sant Georgians" day we have to stop giving leaflets and newspapers because many was supporters of EDL. Yes some worries for own safety and answer we still not united for the moment.THIS POST FOREVER. We need to stop worrying if the people we stand beside are Trots, Anarchists, ML and start looking at them as Revolutionary left. This forum is a place for revolutionary left. I'm not advocating leftist unity no argument bs. But namecalling assholes do nothing to support our cause. Insulting brainwashed working class? Wtf. None of this shit matters on here. Our politics matter in the real world. It's safe to say if you do this shit on a forum you probably do this shit irl and when you turn away possible revolutionary's and talk shit about how mis-informed the working class is. remember it's probably because they saw how you treated other leftists you were supposed to have solidarity for.


Seriously, how the hell do you think joining the most expansionist military power in the face of the Earth will promote socialism? Or for that matter social democracy? Or for that fucking matter even the slightest notion of the liberal democracy they're claiming to uphold?I don't The military is the product of the politics. Used whenever it betters them. The military is just a tool. I don't expect joining it to do shit. People will still hate the US if I join or leave. What do you think the revolutionaries in russia were thinking when they faced the army and they joined sides. Before that the Tzar probably saw them as loyal servants to die for his cause. What's different now? Same thinking different place and politics. What is talking on an internet forum about the faults of trotskyism gonna do to promote social-democracy or socialism. Restrict me. Shit goes on. I'll still think of myself as an leftist. You might hate me, but so fucking what you probably won't know who I am if you see me at a rally or protest. Hell under socialism the military will still be considered a tool. Just to fight for the revolution and not against it. The only difference is the USA isn't socialist. If it was would I be hailed as some defender of Socialism? Probably not. Military's are all the same. Ranks, awards, infantry, Field artillery. And tools of whoever is in charge.

how do you expect people to join socialism if you have reactionaries post pictures saying fuck you. How is that debating anything? How progressive is that? What purpose does that serve? Obviously goon had a nice way of saying fuck you too but to respond to it is dumb. It just shows how reactionary you are and divides the working class and leftists. Like tsukae said this forum isn't a good representation of Leftists irl. But if this is what possible revolutionaries see they'll just be alienated to look for something else. This is one of the small faces of leftism. Shit talking dicks that do nothing to support our cause need to be restricted as much as me and goon.

[psgchisolm]

Goon. before you write your last witless post, would you mine explaining to me why you think joining the Army is a good thing for real revolutionaries to do?

Psgchisholm, same question.

It's not something I would wish on my worst enemy. I've seen friends come back mentally scared and change into totally different people with real problems.The military isn't good period regardless of left or right. Whether under a socialist military or capitalist one if I was in a socialist military I'd still be a tool to fight. All I can say in defense of it is military members have legit solidarity. Regardless of branch or even Country. I've seen German SS crying with American Soldiers. That respect goes internationally. It's what the leftist cause SHOULD be. Support and understanding regardless of what Army you were in or what country you fought for.

[Omsk]

I've seen German SS crying with American Soldiers.
Iv seen photos of Nazi SS burning villages and shooting thousands of people in one day.Some of those photos were from the country i now call home.In fact,most of them were.


regardless of what Army you were in or what country you fought for.

Apologizing for millions of civilians killed and deported?Apologizing for the destruction of a peaceful country,for the deaths of over 60 million people?
The Nazi Wehrmacht deserves no apologizing.

[Arlekino]

[QUOTE=psgchisolm;2091804]THIS POST FOREVER. We need to stop worrying if the people we stand beside are Trots, Anarchists, ML and start looking at them as Revolutionary left. This forum is a place for revolutionary left. I'm not advocating leftist unity no argument bs. But namecalling assholes do nothing to support our cause. Insulting brainwashed working class? Wtf. None of this shit matters on here. Our politics matter in the real world. It's safe to say if you do this shit on a forum you probably do this shit irl and when you turn away possible revolutionary's and talk shit about how mis-informed the working class is. remember it's probably because they saw how you treated other leftists you were supposed to have solidarity for.

If this post refer to my post I did not name called anybody.

[Viet Minh]

Anyways I don't give a fuck, I'm done with politics and leftists havent done shit to better my conditions as a working class black man as much as they talk about that bullshit the last time they made a difference was the 70s, from now on fuck anarchism, fuck communism, I'm just gonna do me.
#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck*****

Nobody here can do anything for you if you don't get involved, posting on teh internet will not get us anywhere, period. This is merely a place for leftists to discuss leftist issues, the actual action takes place out there irl. Sorry if I sound condescending, I'm just saying if you're feeling frustrated its the same way we all feel, like we're going nowhere sometimes.

[psgchisolm]

Iv seen photos of Nazi SS burning villages and shooting thousands of people in one day.Some of those photos were from the country i now call home.In fact,most of them were.

Apologizing for millions of civilians killed and deported?Apologizing for the destruction of a peaceful country,for the deaths of over 60 million people?
The Nazi Wehrmacht deserves no apologizing.Lumping all in the Wehrmacht as murderers is dumb. They were conscripted for the most part. Those that did deport millions were in Special units where they volunteered and had to be in the Nazi Party. Shit I've seen Russians burning villages. What was left of the German 6th Army were sent to Siberia after Stalingrad. Only 6,000 came back to Germany. Neither side is excused from because both had elements that did these things. The average Germany, Russian, Italian, British, American, Romanian, Czech, French. For the most part just fought because someone told them to.



If this post refer to my post I did not name called anybody.Not you. You are legit. I'm talking about other "revolutionary leftists" who job it is to play general secretary(act like it) and show some epic solidarity by shit talking to each other.

[Obs]

Ahh the shooting brown people attack. Good seeing as how me and goon are black. Hell do you think the Generals cared if they fought for the tzar or for communism? Do you think they cared if they joined to shoot Germans or Turks?. They joined to be soldiers. Attempting to call me racist against brown people is wrong.

I actually wasn't calling you anything, nor did I make any implications. If you read carefully, you'll see I only described fairly accurately exactly what you're doing. I'm sure you can use a bunch of pseudo-historical bullshit to justify being a hired killer to yourself, if that makes you happy. Just don't go calling yourself a leftist while you're doing that.

[Omsk]

They were conscripted for the most part

Yet they still slaughtered the population of the occupied areas with ease,in quite horrific ways,as,rounding up civilians (thats what they did to my grandfather's family) in the village church and than burning it to the ground with flame-throwers?

Does that saves them from the crimes they commited?NO.


For the most part just fought because someone told them to.

Did the commanders order them to massacre beyond recongnision an entire school without a reason?There are thousand of examples of monstrous brutality and horrific crimes that were completely meaningless and were performed single-handedly.

Do not try to use the lines "Others did it too!" It is not an excuse.Especially not in the case of the fascists.However,i understand that a lot of people in the Wehrmacht were unwilling to perform such acts of brutality and un-humanity,and some of them were punished.

[psgchisolm]

I actually wasn't calling you anything, nor did I make any implications. If you read carefully, you'll see I only described fairly accurately exactly what you're doing. I'm sure you can use a bunch of pseudo-historical bullshit to justify being a hired killer to yourself, if that makes you happy. Just don't go calling yourself a leftist while you're doing that.Yes because indicating people of brown color was for nothing except proof:rolleyes:. Yeah that served no purpose right? gtfo. I really don't need to justify anything to myself or any of you asses but if it makes you feel any better about yourself sure w\e. I did it to justify it for you jackasses. You know to make you feel better. Ahh another telling how unleftist i am. Again I don't need to justify anything to you or myself so fuck off.

[psgchisolm]

Yet they still slaughtered the population of the occupied areas with ease,in quite horrific ways,as,rounding up civilians (thats what they did to my grandfather's family) in the village church and than burning it to the ground with flame-throwers?

Does that saves them from the crimes they commited?NO.I think I said that but cherrypick k?




Did the commanders order them to massacre beyond recongnision an entire school without a reason?There are thousand of examples of monstrous brutality and horrific crimes that were completely meaningless and were performed single-handedly.

Do not try to use the lines "Others did it too!" It is not an excuse.Especially not in the case of the fascists.However,i understand that a lot of people in the Wehrmacht were unwilling to perform such acts of brutality and un-humanity,and some of them were punished.I never did. All I know is one person(s) is never a good representation of an entire group.

[Red Future]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

I am Asian/White and working class so we aren't all middle class white boys or rich.

[psgchisolm]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/existence-police-and-t153727/index.html?t=153727

In reference to this thread. Alot of you say you discourage people from joining the military. But yet you want to keep a standing army. So how would you get people into that standing army if you discourage them all?

[El Chuncho]

There were deserters in the Wehrmacht, most ended up with a bullet in their back for their heroism, but Wehrmacht atrocities should be looked at with as much scorn as SS atrocities.

[Sperm-Doll Setsuna]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/existence-police-and-t153727/index.html?t=153727

In reference to this thread. Alot of you say you discourage people from joining the military. But yet you want to keep a standing army. So how would you get people into that standing army if you discourage them all?

I don't want the U.S. to have a standing army.

[psgchisolm]

There were deserters in the Wehrmacht, most ended up with a bullet in their back for their heroism, but Wehrmacht atrocities should be looked at with as much scorn as SS atrocities.Obviously. Same with Red Army atrocities. But keeping a standing army is a necessity!
http://www.revleft.com/vb/existence-police-and-t153727/index.html?t=153727
http://www.revleft.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2091822&postcount=2

I don't want the U.S. to have a standing army.No shit. Apparently you didn't click the link either.

[Red Future]

There were deserters in the Wehrmacht, most ended up with a bullet in their back for their heroism, but Wehrmacht atrocities should be looked at with as much scorn as SS atrocities.

One of the Wehrmacht battalions that shot Jews in Russia was comprised of ex social democrats if I remember correctly.

[Ele'ill]

727Goon, surely you don't believe all of what you've said to such an extent. You should get busy agitating and organizing in real life, if you're not already doing so, because that theory you said you still believe in isn't being exercised as you see fit. Perhaps you have talents that can make it more of a reality. Exciting? It's in your hands.

I disagree with your view of those who post on this forum because it isn't accurate at all- although I acknowledge it was an emotionally charged generalization.

Don't give up- ever.

[hatzel]

Mari3L is my new favourite :)

[gorillafuck]

fuck anarchism, fuck communism, I'm just gonna do me.
#NiggazHatinOnMeBrahButIDontGiveAFuck*****If you weren't restricted I would suggest making a tendency

[727Goon]

Are you serious? "Pathetic Maoist group in the hills"? The Maoist Chinese Army was one of the greatest military forces of the 20th century.

was

[727Goon]

Those fucking white boys died fighting Fascists in Spain, France, Italy and all over Europe.

They fought tooth and nail to free the Scotsboro Boys while the NAACP was only considering it because they were too busy trying to not to be red baited by the NY Times!

Fucking white boy Che Guevara went off into the Congo to help the African struggle.

Fucking white boy Castro lent his troops to Angola to fight against their imperial onslaught.

I am sure you think the Black Panthers (one of the GREATEST revolutionary movements ever to form in the States) were a bunch of pansies reading Mao in their cushy lofts???

There is no one out there more than Leftists fighting on behalf to end some of the most brutal forms of exploitation out there. Without these brave people, we would be nowhere.

You want to try liberalism? Good luck. Black Nationalism? Again, good luck.

But do not come in here thinking that Communists never accomplished anything for the working class.

Yeah and how much of that was post 1970s? And I'm not trying liberalism or black nationalism, I'm saying fuck politics unless a political movement comes around that will have a concrete benefit for me and my family.

[727Goon]

You're not really helping your case by using sexist slang.

Your not really helping your case of trying to get working class support for your cause by getting upset when people talk hood.

[727Goon]

727Goon, surely you don't believe all of what you've said to such an extent. You should get busy agitating and organizing in real life, if you're not already doing so, because that theory you said you still believe in isn't being exercised as you see fit. Perhaps you have talents that can make it more of a reality. Exciting? It's in your hands.

I disagree with your view of those who post on this forum because it isn't accurate at all- although I acknowledge it was an emotionally charged generalization.

Don't give up- ever.

The problem is that I don't really like or have much in common with most leftists in real life. Most are either idealistic college students, hippies, Uhuru niggas who dress like they from Africa, or old white people in unions. And to be honest your right I'm kind of trolling if I could use my talents for that I would but as of right now I don't see any good opportunities.

[hatzel]

The problem is that I don't really like or have much in common with most leftists in real lifeOh? So you're a capitalist? A card-carrying member of the ruling-class?

[727Goon]

Goon. before you write your last witless post, would you mine explaining to me why you think joining the Army is a good thing for real revolutionaries to do?

......
It's not. If I did it it would be to support my daughter, it would completely go against my political principles. I don't think I'm gonna join though, especially if the economy picks up.

[727Goon]

Oh? So you're a capitalist? A card-carrying member of the ruling-class?

thats me

[hatzel]

thats meYou can be Bud's new friend, then. Perhaps you could open a business together. Goon-Struggle Enterprises :)

[727Goon]

If you weren't restricted I would suggest making a tendency

nah I'm a card carrying hipster communist. I'm a future matyr steeled by the HCP bruh, fuck with me.

[Pretty Flaco]

Wait... why was goon suspended? because he opposed the US military?

wtf lol

[#FF0000]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

you kill people for the richest and whitest though so w/e

[#FF0000]

Wait... why was goon suspended? because he opposed the US military?

wtf lol

nope. he was restricted cause he was like US OCCUPATION BETTER THAN TALIBAN HURFUBGBUG

[hatzel]

Wait... why was goon suspended? because he opposed the US military?Something like that, yeah, but kinda the complete opposite, you know? :)

[727Goon]

you kill people for the richest and whitest though so w/e

I do? I didnt realize considering the military as a last resort option entailed magically killing people, I'll have to look into that.

[psgchisolm]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/existence-police-and-t153727/index.html?t=153727

In reference to this thread. Alot of you say you discourage people from joining the military. But yet you want to keep a standing army. So how would you get people into that standing army if you discourage them all?Bump. Answer fellow Sectarians! What's the difference between a socialist one and a capitalist one!

[#FF0000]

I do? I didnt realize considering the military as a last resort option entailed magically killing people, I'll have to look into that.

oh no you just joined an organization which is there to uh kill people. you didn't actually kill anyone yourself. you just get a paycheck for being a part of it and are too stupid to say "oh man this is a bad thing I'm doing".

I mean that'd be one thing if you did that. but you didn't. you tried to defend it.

[727Goon]

nope. He was restricted cause he was like us occupation better than taliban hurfubgbug

the us occupation is so fucking awesome i dont support the alo or anything

[TC]

Playing the "race card" is more effective if you're not simultaneously supporting a racist campaign of mass murder against people of less favored ethnicities in the middle east. You don't get to have it both ways.

[727Goon]

oh no you just joined an organization which is there to uh kill people. you didn't actually kill anyone yourself. you just get a paycheck for being a part of it and are too stupid to say "oh man this is a bad thing I'm doing".

I mean that'd be one thing if you did that. but you didn't. you tried to defend it.

Except for the part where I didnt join.
Or defend it. Holy shit you guys need to learn to read.

[#FF0000]

Bump. Answer fellow Sectarians! What's the difference between a socialist one and a capitalist one!

A socialist "army" could not, by definition, be an imperialist one.

A socialist "army" would not, by definition, serve the bourgeoisie.

Fucking moron.

[RedSunRising]

was

A black nationalist who slags off third world guerrilla movements, very weird, but than there is an anarchist Kermalist and an Ulster Loyalist who claims to big up the Vietcong here. Post-modernist degeneracy gone mad. At least the hipster communists have large elements of conistancy in their waffle.

[727Goon]

Playing the "race card" is more effective if you're not simultaneously supporting a racist campaign of mass murder against people of less favored ethnicities in the middle east. You don't get to have it both ways.


playing the "sex card" is more effective when you havent been shown to be hypersensitive, a supporter of snitching, and I guess a racist, because I've never met anyone who whined about people playing that card who werent racist as fuck. I'm sorry for oppressing you with affirmative action and Obama though.

[#FF0000]

Except for the part where I didnt join.
Or defend it. Holy shit you guys need to learn to read.

oh word
(http://www.revleft.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2087057&postcount=125)

I'm actually arguing in favor of the US military because the Taliban suck that bad. I don't support the US military or it's objectives in Afganistan at all, but it's certainly more progressive than the Taliban, and actually this position isn't some knee-jerk reaction, the more I learn about the Taliban the shittier I realize they are. And are you actually arguing in favor of the taliban regime as it was and not just the supposed "coalition" ? They resorted the opuim trade because they don't have the backing of imperialists any more. Instead of platitudes lets address real issues, here's why a Taliban loss would be progressive:
-The brutality of the Taliban regime when it was in power
-The fact that most Afgans oppose them
-The fact that they kill more of their own people than the imperialists do. Seriously, what the fuck good is an "Anti-imperialist" movement that's more brutal than the imperialists? And from everything I've seen you're wrong, they don't even see themselves as anti-imperialists but as Jihadists and holy warriors, I havent seen anything that supports the idea that it's actually a more broad coalition of nationalists like the Iraqi resistance.

[RedSunRising]

the us occupation is so fucking awesome i dont support the alo or anything

The Afghan Liberation Organization puts bullets in the US soldiers. Sends them home in body bags. Do you understand that? Thats being more mean to the US military than some web forum could ever be.

[727Goon]

A black nationalist who slags off third world guerrilla movements, very weird, but than there is an anarchist Kermalist and an Ulster Loyalist who claims to big up the Vietcong here. Post-modernist degeneracy gone mad. At least the hipster communists have large elements of conistancy in their waffle.

I wont "slag off" third world guerrilla movements if they dont fucking suck.

[727Goon]

The Afghan Liberation Organization puts bullets in the US soldiers. Sends to home in body bags. Do you understand that? Thats being more mean to the US military than some web forum could ever be.

Good, I oppose the US military in Afganistan and support the actions of the Afghan Liberation Organization.

[#FF0000]

playing the "sex card" is more effective when you havent been shown to be hypersensitive, a supporter of snitching, and I guess a racist, because I've never met anyone who whined about people playing that card who werent racist as fuck. I'm sorry for oppressing you with affirmative action and Obama though.

to be fair I don't know how you can go off on the rich white boys on this site and then literally join an organization that gets money to shoot non-white people for the richest of all white people.

like this is a simple thing

[727Goon]

I dont get why you people think I'm pro military what the fuck can you not read? Seriously.

[727Goon]

to be fair I don't know how you can go off on the rich white boys on this site and then literally join an organization that gets money to shoot non-white people for the richest of all white people.

like this is a simple thing

I didnt join the army... are you fucking dyslexic or what dude read my goddamn posts this is so frustrating.

[#FF0000]

I dont get why you people think I'm pro military what the fuck can you not read? Seriously.

um


I'm actually arguing in favor of the US military because the Taliban suck that bad. I don't support the US military or it's objectives in Afganistan at all, but it's certainly more progressive than the Taliban,

[727Goon]

Let me spell it out for you you fucking idiot is it really that hard to understand:

Taliban < US Military (slightly) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< the ALO/ Other progressive resistance

was that so hard?

[#FF0000]

so the US is better than the Taliban.

so if it's US vs. Taliban, who should win?

what I am getting at is that they are both actually equally bad. I mean, the US put the Taliban in power in the first place. The people the army fights as terrorists one day get American weapons and money and support the next, so saying which is worse or better is kind of a waste of time.

[psgchisolm]

I'm actually arguing in favor of the US military because the Taliban suck that bad. I don't support the US military or it's objectives in Afganistan at all, but it's certainly more progressive than the Taliban,I love how you debolded the important part.

[727Goon]

Trick question. The ALO should win.
Mussolinis fascists were better than the Nazis. If it's Nazis vs Fascists who should win?

[Ele'ill]

The problem is that I don't really like or have much in common with most leftists in real life. Most are either idealistic college students, hippies, Uhuru niggas who dress like they from Africa, or old white people in unions.

I'm going to assume that you are being honest. The reason I say this is that the leftist community is amazingly diverse. I have met people that I didn't mesh well with. I didn't like them but I liked their politics. I have met people whose politics I didn't care for but I liked various aspects of their personality and how they carried themselves while organizing. I've met folks who I thought were wingnuts but I still remember them because they were odd and interesting people. I've met non-anarchist anti-capitalist activists from wealthy backgrounds who have done things with their life and for leftist progress that I admire as a working class anarchist myself. I am continuously amazed with the people I meet and their backgrounds, current status and their dreams. If you haven't picked up on it yet I am also very critical of leftist action and I have met a ton, read about a ton, and conversed directly and indirectly with a ton who I absolutely disagree with. This is ok- in fact it's desirable. Your opinion matters.



And to be honest your right I'm kind of trolling if I could use my talents for that I would but as of right now I don't see any good opportunities.

Start planning. If you want help getting involved, ask. What's going on in your neighborhood?

[727Goon]

I love how you debolded the important part.

haha for real

[RedSunRising]

For the record goon unlike the other guy I dont think you should have been restricted but you are one confused kid. I mean bigging up both RAAN and the Black Panthers? Calling yourself a Black Nationalist and than saying that you are thinking of joining the US Army? I mean what sort of patriot joins the army that is occupying his own people???

[GallowsBird]

http://www.raraku.com/files/Macros%20and%20other%20pictures/Flamebait.jpg

[RedSunRising]

I wont "slag off" third world guerrilla movements if they dont fucking suck.

How much of India do the Naxalites control? :rolleyes:

Well if you are into cool strong winners than yes the US Army is for you!

[#FF0000]

Trick question. The ALO should win.
Mussolinis fascists were better than the Nazis. If it's Nazis vs Fascists who should win?

see this doesn't work because no one on the forum says one is "better" than the other or would really defend that position. You did though, between the US and Taliban.


I love how you debolded the important part.

I underlined it because it's the part goon quoted before, sans all of the context. He might not support the US Army but, uh, in that quote, it sure seems that he at least favors them.

[TC]

playing the "sex card" is more effective when you havent been shown to be hypersensitive, a supporter of snitching, and I guess a racist, because I've never met anyone who whined about people playing that card who werent racist as fuck. I'm sorry for oppressing you with affirmative action and Obama though.

Yah, see, you repeatedly referred to your own race, and your detractors race, as an argument in favor of your position. In comparison, I never refer to my own sex, and I don't refer to opponents sex as an ad hominem means of winning arguments.

If you don't want to be called on it, then don't do it - especially not when you implicitly advocate valuing the lives of Afghani people less than the lives of Westerners. Thats really racist.

[psgchisolm]

For the record goon unlike the other guy I dont think you should have been restricted but you are one confused kid. I mean bigging up both RAAN and the Black Panthers? Calling yourself a Black Nationalist and than saying that you are thinking of joining the US Army? I mean what sort of patriot joins the army that is occupying his own people???I also agree he shouldn't have been restricted. I hope he appeals it. I thought the US Army was occupying Afghanistan and Iraq? His own people? "His people" could be from Jamaica or another Caribbean island. What makes you so sure "His people" are from africa?


flamebaitI agree don't fall for it.

[727Goon]

I'm going to assume that you are being honest. The reason I say this is that the leftist community is amazingly diverse. I have met people that I didn't mesh well with. I didn't like them but I liked their politics. I have met people whose politics I didn't care for but I liked various aspects of their personality and how they carried themselves while organizing. I've met folks who I thought were wingnuts but I still remember them because they were odd and interesting people. I've met non-anarchist anti-capitalist activists from wealthy backgrounds who have done things with their life and for leftist progress that I admire as a working class anarchist myself. I am continuously amazed with the people I meet and their backgrounds, current status and their dreams. If you haven't picked up on it yet I am also very critical of leftist action and I have met a ton, read about a ton, and conversed direcatly and indirectly with a ton who I absolutely disagree with. This is ok- in fact it's desirable. Your opinion matters.

I dont have much experience outside of the Uhuru movement and (unfortunately) some work with Food Not Bombs so maybe thats why. Maybe I'll find a group or hell maybe I'll make my own but at the moment I dont think politics have a conrete effect on my life.



Start planning. If you want help getting involved, ask. What's going on in your neighborhood?

Aint shit really. Its just normal working class neighborhood shit that people have problems with, the cops, high rent, violence, no jobs, ect. Still there isnt too much I can do about it that will have a direct effect on peoples lives, at least not right now. Honestly I think I might try and get more involved once my daughter gets a little older, right now I'm functioning on like zero sleep haha so idk im too exhausted to fuck around with trying to organize people.

[Dumb]

So let me get this straight...this whole thread is about a restriction arising out of a post in which a member said the Taliban was worse than the U.S. military? That's it?

[TC]

For the record goon unlike the other guy I dont think you should have been restricted but you are one confused kid. I mean bigging up both RAAN and the Black Panthers? Calling yourself a Black Nationalist and than saying that you are thinking of joining the US Army? I mean what sort of patriot joins the army that is occupying his own people???

Seriously, he (ironically?) lists "black panthers" in his organization field, when the BPP included in its ten point program:

"We believe that Black people should not be forced to fight in the military service to defend a racist government that does not protect us. We will not fight and kill other people of color in the world who, like Black people, are being victimized by the White racist government of America. We will protect ourselves from the force and violence of the racist police and the racist military, by whatever means necessary." http://www.marxists.org/history/usa/workers/black-panthers/1966/10/15.htm

Thats what anti-racism really means.

[#FF0000]

So let me get this straight...this whole thread is about a restriction arising out of a post in which a member said the Taliban was worse than the U.S. military? That's it?

He kinda went on defending the US army and defending people's decisions to join the army as "last resort".

this is the crying part.

[psgchisolm]

I underlined it because it's the part goon quoted before, sans all of the context. He might not support the US Army but, uh, in that quote, it sure seems that he at least favors them.I'm gonna troll you a bit hear and ask who would you rather win WW2 US or Germany?

[RedSunRising]

I also agree he shouldn't have been restricted. I hope he appeals it. I thought the US Army was occupying Afghanistan and Iraq? His own people? "His people" could be from Jamaica or another Caribbean island. What makes you so sure "His people" are from africa?


The US government is occupying the Black nation within US borders (thats what Black Nationalist believe isnt it?). As the Black Panthers who he bigs up said a pig in Harlem is little different from a US soldier in Vietnam in essence. Where did I mention Africa???

[#FF0000]

I'm gonna troll you a bit hear and ask who would you rather win WW2 US or Germany?

Neither, guy. Proletarian Internationalism 4ever

[black magick hustla]

Your not really helping your case of trying to get working class support for your cause by getting upset when people talk hood.

i dont get "upset" when "niggaz talk hood". its a dumb copout for someone who reads forums like this though. if i was smoking a goddamn blunt with one of my boys or w/e i excuse it and shrug it off but most of em dont read shit like this. i could talk about "perras" all day or whatever and when called out i could say bofuckinboo dont like how mexicans talk heh. of course that would be dumb.

[727Goon]

see this doesn't work because no one on the forum says one is "better" than the other or would really defend that position. You did though, between the US and Taliban.

I think mussolini or franco were better than hitler because they werent massacring jews and whoever else by the millions.


I underlined it because it's the part goon quoted before, sans all of the context. He might not support the US Army but, uh, in that quote, it sure seems that he at least favors them.

I imagine you would have favored the US Army over the Nazis in World War II (inb4 someone says something about Islamofascists). Obviously it's a different situation because instead of being a lot more proggressive the US is only a little more progressive than the Taliban. I dont get how its not enough that I support the progressive resistance, this is pretty much just semantics because in reality I want the US to lose.

[#FF0000]

I imagine you would have favored the US Army over the Nazis in World War II

Nope.


this is pretty much just semantics because in reality I want the US to lose.

what a big thing this turned into over miscommunication

[psgchisolm]

The US government is occupying the Black nation within US borders (thats what Black Nationalist believe isnt it?). As the Black Panthers who he bigs up said a pig in Harlem is little different from a US soldier in Vietnam in essence. Where did I mention Africa???Well you said Army. Last I checked there's no army unless there's a random NG in harlem. Hardly occupation where as in Afghanistan and Iraq...well. Technically the US is occupying the Native Americans land.

[RedSunRising]

I imagine you would have favored the US Army over the Nazis in World War II (inb4 someone says something about Islamofascists). Obviously it's a different situation because instead of being a lot more proggressive the US is only a little more progressive than the Taliban. I dont get how its not enough that I support the progressive resistance, this is pretty much just semantics because in reality I want the US to lose.

It isnt though, its proven to a hell of a lot worse if that were possible. Thats the point.

[psgchisolm]

It isnt though, its proven to a hell of a lot worse if that were possible. Thats the point.:laugh: let me stop trolling. I'm gonna lulz myself into a coma.

[RedSunRising]

:laugh:

Drug production, child prostitution and wide spread gangsterism back in full effect? Thats worse honeybunch.

The US state isnt the nice guy youre mom told you they were.

[727Goon]

He kinda went on defending the US army and defending people's decisions to join the army as "last resort".

this is the crying part.

Show me where I defended it politically. It's not politically acceptable. I didnt really defend it as a personal choice either really, I said I'm cosidering it as a last resort.

[727Goon]

Drug production, child prostitution and wide spread gangsterism back in full effect? Thats worse honeybunch.

The US state isnt the nice guy youre mom told you they were.

The strictest form of sharia law seen in the modern world is just a little bit worse than the fucked up shit that goes on in most third world countries. Seriously Karzai is terrible but adulterers arent being shot in soccer stadiums. What about the fact that the Taliban are responsible for 76% of civilian casualties? Why is it acceptable for a so called anti imperialist movement to massacre it's own people?

[psgchisolm]

Drug production, child prostitution and wide spread gangsterism back in full effect? Thats worse honeybunch.

The US state isnt the nice guy youre mom told they were.That's the Afghan Gov. I'll give you drug production,but that's only because they banned it in 2000

[southernmissfan]

In all honesty, psgchisolm deserves the restriction much more than Goon. Goon simply seems confused in that he genuinely believes the Americans to be a slightly more progressive force in Afghanistan than the Taliban. Of course, the problem with this is that an imperialist occupier rarely, if ever, can be more progressive than the occupied people attempting to resist. It's just fact. And it's like that in Afghanistan. This also assumes that there is some big bad Taliban organization centrally controlling the resistance. While I admit I don't know a whole lot about the conflict, I'm willing to bet that it's not like that.

What made some of us mad was how, on RevLeft, we had a thread discussing joining the military, with people celebrating it and offering advice! Goon, I understand you have to provide for your family. I've been there! You know what I was doing? Working 50 hours a week at a shitty, 8.50-9 an hour job. Our society sucks and job prospects are bleak, us of all people know this. But don't join the military. There's a lot of reasons for that, which we have discussed. At it's most basic, it's doubtful it will even be beneficial for your family and well-being, the whole reason for considering it!

See my first post, on the first page (odd how the rational, coherent posts are always ignored right?).

[727Goon]

That's the Afghan Gov. I'll give you drug production,but that's only because they banned it in 2000

The Afghan gov is a US puppet.

[#FF0000]

In all honesty, psgchisolm deserves the restriction much more than Goon.


yeah.

i mean i don't like the idea of restriction but pgidsklfagjfngjon is def. more deserving of scorn at least.

sorry goon.

[hatzel]

Why is it acceptable for a so called anti imperialist movement to massacre it's own people?It's not. It's also not acceptable for anybody else to do it, though.

[727Goon]

In all honesty, psgchisolm deserves the restriction much more than Goon. Goon simply seems confused in that he genuinely believes the Americans to be a slightly more progressive force in Afghanistan than the Taliban. Of course, the problem with this is that an imperialist occupier rarely, if ever, can be more progressive than the occupied people attempting to resist. It's just fact. And it's like that in Afghanistan. This also assumes that there is some big bad Taliban organization centrally controlling the resistance. While I admit I don't know a whole lot about the conflict, I'm willing to bet that it's not like that.

I don't think the imperialists are more progressive than the occupied people, I think they are more progressive than the Taliban.


What made some of us mad was how, on RevLeft, we had a thread discussing joining the military, with people celebrating it and offering advice! Goon, I understand you have to provide for your family. I've been there! You know what I was doing? Working 50 hours a week at a shitty, 8.50-9 an hour job. Our society sucks and job prospects are bleak, us of all people know this. But don't join the military. There's a lot of reasons for that, which we have discussed. At it's most basic, it's doubtful it will even be beneficial for your family and well-being, the whole reason for considering it!

See my first post, on the first thread (odd how the rational, coherent posts are always ignored right?).

I wasnt defending it and I'm gonna do everything I can not to go.

[gorillafuck]

In comparison, I never refer to my own sex,.wait what?

[727Goon]

It's not. It's also not acceptable for anybody else to do it, though.

Which is why I oppose the US too.

[psgchisolm]

Where as for women
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2010/07/13/afghanistan-talks-shouldnt-ignore-taliban-abuse-women
Let's not forget the aid workers
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2007/07/31/afghanistan-taliban-should-immediately-free-hostages

[hatzel]

Which is why I oppose the US too.Well done.
Dude arent you like restrictedClearly I'm not. But you knew that already, didn't you? :)

[RedSunRising]

That's the Afghan Gov. I'll give you drug production,but that's only because they banned it in 2000

No you will give me child prostitution too.

Imperialist armies loving their kiddie fiddling though, dont they?

Afghan society is fucked up, that how the Taliban arose with people actually supporting those psychoes and the US Army comes in bombs weddings and generally fucks shit up and they are so cool because they got rid of the other fuck ups?

[727Goon]

Well done.Clearly I'm not. But you knew that already, didn't you? :)

yeah my bad haha I thought you were ComradeMan or whoever that dude is.

[hatzel]

yeah my bad haha I thought you were ComradeMan or whoever that dude is.He's restricted for the exact same reason you are, actually: supporting the US/NATO actions in Afghanistan. You guys might have something in common!

[727Goon]

So he supports the defeat of the US by a progressive anti imperialist force too? Tight.

[The Man]

I love how your title is 'Black Nationalist'

[psgchisolm]

No you will give me child prostitution too.

Imperialist armies loving their kiddie fiddling though, dont they?

Afghan society is fucked up, that how the Taliban arose with people actually supporting those psychoes and the US Army comes in bombs weddings and generally fucks shit up and they are so cool because they got rid of the other fuck ups?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/09/taliban-execute-pregnant_n_676203.html
So progressive. Actually there was a video of Taliban setting up mines for an ambush and women and children walking across the road and them trying to get them out the way. So not all Taliban are baby killers.

[727Goon]

I love how your title is 'Black Nationalist'

you're the man

[#FF0000]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/09/taliban-execute-pregnant_n_676203.html
So progressive. Actually there was a video of Taliban setting up mines for an ambush and women and children walking across the road and them trying to get them out the way. So not all Taliban are baby killers.

you're dumb

[RedSunRising]

you're the man

Goon seriously you are getting a lot of flack here and when most humans get a lot of flack they have a tendency to defensively entrench themselves in their position. Dont do that, read up on the history and reality of the situation and than make up your mind.

[psgchisolm]

tueDVG2nR5k
X_ON_LG5EGY

[RedSunRising]

you're dumb

Maybe he is, but you have a lot of intelligent reactionaires in the world, the point should be that his views are opposed to those of the working class on a global scale and not just that he is stupid.

Im not saying that he is particularly intelligent, but he is a reactionary.

[RedSunRising]

tueDVG2nR5k
X_ON_LG5EGY

Hey I like the idea of cannibis being illegal but if I posted "Refer Maddness" as an argument how would people react? :rolleyes:

[psgchisolm]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/existence-police-and-t153727/index.html?t=153727

In reference to this thread. Alot of you say you discourage people from joining the military. But yet you want to keep a standing army. So how would you get people into that standing army if you discourage them all?Is someone going to reply to this?

[psgchisolm]

Hey I like the idea of cannibis being illegal but if I posted "Refer Maddness" as an argument how would people react? :rolleyes:what does that have to do the videos? Also you were the one who brought up the Taliban making opium illegal so why don't you tell me.

[Thug Lessons]

nope. he was restricted cause he was like US OCCUPATION BETTER THAN TALIBAN HURFUBGBUG

This forum is so absurdly wrapped up in the minutia of US politics

[Ele'ill]

Is someone going to reply to this?


This is a side conversation not related to this thread which is why people are not responding to it. Perhaps you should create another thread.

[RedSunRising]

what does that have to do the videos? Also you were the one who brought up the Taliban making opium illegal so why don't you tell me.

Because they are cheesy propaganda, as cheesy as "refer maddness" is. Duh!

May F5000 was right about you being actually dumb...

Here is some porn for you to jerk off too, now stop trolling a Communist forum...

982tT4qQZJE

[The Man]

This is a good thread...
http://i.imgur.com/tCp90.gif

[Thug Lessons]

Yeah and how much of that was post 1970s? And I'm not trying liberalism or black nationalism, I'm saying fuck politics unless a political movement comes around that will have a concrete benefit for me and my family.

If you're waiting around for a political movement to come and save you then you've already lost.

[psgchisolm]

Because they are cheesy propaganda, as cheesy as "refer maddness" is. Duh!

May F5000 was right about you being actually dumb...

Here is some porn for you to jerk off too, now stop trolling a Communist forum...

982tT4qQZJE
LMAO anything you don't like is cheesy propaganda. You probably haven't seen them. So let me fill you in. The first one is from Frontlines: living with the Taliban(?)
The other was done by a norwegian journalist from journeyman productions. You can see who the foreign fighters are as they are the ones with Camo and mag pouches. Perhaps you are the idiot. Which really wouldn't surprise me.

[727Goon]

I love how I'm more anti imperialist that all the left coms and probably most of the anarchists on this forum but im still restricted because of semantics.

[synthesis]

I don't think 727Goon's position on Afghanistan is any different from a number of other people's positions on Libya. I strongly disagree with it, but it's not a very consistent justification for restriction.

[PhoenixAsh]

O fuck...this thread goes on to page 7. Skipping the last three pages.

I'd like to point out some major hypocracy here.

We restrict people for joining the military because its imperialism. I am not sure if the joining was the actual problem or the preceived defending of the involvement or glorification....but many users indeed seem to think joining the army is open support for imperialism.

Yet...we do not pounce the same way and allow users who defend and glorify imperialist actions by so called supposed socialist states to go unrestricted or uninfracted.

This is odd....and should be some serious food for thought.

Hungary, Prague, Tibet, Afghanistan, Eastern Bloc after the war...no matter how you look at these events and try to spin the politics into some warped excuse for counter revolutionary actions or the protection of communism all on behalve of the working class...this does not in any way shape or form reduce the imperialist nature of these military acts and the fact that military force was used to maintain control over workers.

Yet...this is accepted.

[Thug Lessons]

I don't think 727Goon's position on Afghanistan is any different from a number of other people's positions on Libya. I strongly disagree with it, but it's not a very consistent justification for restriction.

Yeah it's absolute absurdity, especially when it's coming from people who openly repudiate notions of anti-imperialism and national sovereignty and tell us that it doesn't matter whether the Nazis or the Soviets or the Americans conquer the world because it's all just different flavors of capitalism, maaaan.

[PhoenixAsh]

If you're waiting around for a political movement to come and save you then you've already lost.

hurry up already...damnit. :cursing:

[synthesis]

Yeah it's absolute absurdity, especially when it's coming from people who openly repudiate notions of anti-imperialism and national sovereignty and tell us that it doesn't matter whether the Nazis or the Soviets or the Americans conquer the world because it's all just different flavors of capitalism, maaaan.

Well, they're all different flavors of imperialism. What can working class people do except challenge the imperialism of the nation in which they reside?

[RedSunRising]

LMAO anything you don't like is cheesy propaganda. You probably haven't seen them. So let me fill you in. The first one is from Frontlines: living with the Taliban(?)
The other was done by a norwegian journalist from journeyman productions. You can see who the foreign fighters are as they are the ones with Camo and mag pouches. Perhaps you are the idiot. Which really wouldn't surprise me.

Im not the sharpest stanley knife on the shelf but I know which side of the barricades im on.

[Thug Lessons]

Well, they're all different flavors of imperialism. What can working class people do except challenge the imperialism of the nation in which they reside?

I agree with you completely. Many here do not, and see this as narrow nationalism that goes against the interests of the international working class.

[psgchisolm]

Im not the sharpest stanley knife on the shelf but I know which side of the barricades im on.You will probably sit at home and shit on any revolutions so the only barricades you'll be behind are the ones at your house.

[Nolan]

Nah this is how imperialist you are:

http://thestar.blogs.com/.a/6a00d8341bf8f353ef01348559bfae970c-800wi

[psgchisolm]

O fuck...this thread goes on to page 7. Skipping the last three pages.

I'd like to point out some major hypocracy here.

We restrict people for joining the military because its imperialism. I am not sure if the joining was the actual problem or the preceived defending of the involvement or glorification....but many users indeed seem to think joining the army is open support for imperialism.

Yet...we do not pounce the same way and allow users who defend and glorify imperialist actions by so called supposed socialist states to go unrestricted or uninfracted.

This is odd....and should be some serious food for thought.

Hungary, Prague, Tibet, Afghanistan, Eastern Bloc after the war...no matter how you look at these events and try to spin the politics into some warped excuse for counter revolutionary actions or the protection of communism all on behalve of the working class...this does not in any way shape or form reduce the imperialist nature of these military acts and the fact that military force was used to maintain control over workers.

Yet...this is accepted.didn't you get the memo?


A socialist "army" could not, by definition, be an imperialist one.

A socialist "army" would not, by definition, serve the bourgeoisie.

Fucking moron.Socialist imperialism isn't actually imperialist.

[#FF0000]

Socialist imperialism isn't actually imperialist.

I don't think you know what imperialism is.

[RedSunRising]

You will probably sit at home and shit on any revolutions so the only barricades you'll be behind are the ones at your house.

Macho man!

[psgchisolm]

I don't think you know what imperialism is.Yeah yeah inequality imposed by another nations ect. But as hindsight said. We defend socialist states that did it. Even if you don't consider them socialist then you would still be defending imperialism right?

[Dumb]

Socialist imperialism isn't actually imperialist.
I don't think you know what imperialism is.

It all comes down to whether or not somebody considers the USSR, Mao-era China etc. to have been actual socialist societies. If they were true socialist societies, then they weren't imperialist; otherwise, then they were in fact imperialist.

In my view, the evidence against those states seems rather damning.

[#FF0000]

We defend socialist states that did it.

No.


Even if you don't consider them socialist then you would still be defending imperialism right?

uh no because i don't defend them

you are bad at this

[psgchisolm]

No.



uh no because i don't defend them

you are bad at thisThere are people who do. I didn't mean you in a specific term I meant in a General term.

[RedSunRising]

There are people who do. I didn't mean you in a specific term I meant in a General term.

I would a can of beer that I could smack you shitless.

[hatzel]

I would a can of beer that I could smack you shitless.And how exactly is that related to the topic at hand, remind me? Or otherwise necessary? :confused:

[psgchisolm]

I would a can of beer that I could smack you shitless.?? I would bet a can of beer?

[psgchisolm]

I would a can of beer that I could smack you shitless.
^

Macho Woman!:thumbup:

[Lenina Rosenweg]

Is someone going to reply to this?

The US working class does not need to be burdened with a standing army. If you are into legalese, technically the US military is illegal. The US constitution does say that the US shall not have a standing army. That's why every year Congress has to go though contortions to pass yet another gargantuan military budget.

The US military is a "capitalist" military, it is impossible for it to be otherwise.It serves the interest of the state, the "executive committee of the ruling class" Its very existence is against the best interests of the US and world working class.

A worker's militia, accountable to a system of worker's councils would be needed. Its much different than anything we have now.

If you have an interest in military affairs or a warrior instinct, that's okay.You can put it to other uses other than the service of imperialism.

[psgchisolm]

The US military is a "capitalist" military, it is impossible for it to be otherwise.It serves the interest of the state, the "executive committee of the ruling class" Its very existence is against the best interests of the US and world working class.

I don't The military is the product of the politics. Used whenever it betters them. The military is just a tool.


A worker's militia, accountable to a system of worker's councils would be needed. Its much different than anything we have now.Legit.


If you have an interest in military affairs or a warrior instinct, that's okay.You can put it to other uses other than the service of imperialism.
I'll make sure to do that when F.A.R.C. comes to the US.:cool:

[Che a chara]

The military isn't good period regardless of left or right. Whether under a socialist military or capitalist one if I was in a socialist military I'd still be a tool to fight. All I can say in defense of it is military members have legit solidarity. Regardless of branch or even Country. I've seen German SS crying with American Soldiers. That respect goes internationally. It's what the leftist cause SHOULD be. Support and understanding regardless of what Army you were in or what country you fought for.

With all this solidarity between you and your US Army brothers and sisters, would you find it difficult during a socialist revolution to turn the gun on them and other counter-revolutionaries within the imperialist and security force infrastructure that you have made acquaintances with if they start brutally oppressing the working class uprising ?

[Lenina Rosenweg]

I realise this is an emotionally charged topic. For what its worth 727Goon said he did not join the military. He understands that US imperialism and the Taliban are both shit.Maybe he's politically confused but many of us have been. Its not always easy bucking the ideas of the ruling class.
He is struggling with the idea of enlisting. Leftists would oppose this of course.Instead of restricting him it may be more helpful to explore alternatives.

No one I know who has been in the military has liked it or thought it was a worthwhile experience. The level of PTSD is huge and for the most part the Federal gov't doesn't give a shit. The US isn't just involved in Afghanistan, The US is still in Iraq and is in Yemen. There is a not insignificant chance that we'll see "boots on the ground" in Libya and Syria within this year.

I know the economy sucks and most of us are being treated like shit but, to be honest. I'm not sure if the military would make anything better.

[psgchisolm]

With all this solidarity between you and your US Army brothers and sisters, would you find it difficult during a socialist revolution to turn the gun on them and other counter-revolutionaries within the imperialist and security force infrastructure that you have made acquaintances with if they start brutally oppressing the working class uprising ?No I wouldn't. I would try and get them over to our side through. (I'm pretty sure the FBI will be bustin down my door soon lol)

[Dumb]

Eight months ago, I myself was exactly one day away from stepping into the navy recruitment office when I was offered the job I now have. If not for the job offer, I would have had to choose between the military, sleeping on my alcoholic father's couch (bad enough, all the more so as a 22-year-old college graduate), or homelessness. I've always hated war, always hated the military, but after spending a year looking for alternatives (including over 120 job applications), literally nothing panned out until that one job offer.

Having faced that choice, I can understand where 727Goon is coming from. When you're called up by the poor man's draft, you don't answer enthusiastically - you come crawling with your tail in between your legs, scared, desperate, and ashamed. You're the dregs of America. Had I not gotten that one job offer, I would have strolled into that navy recruiting office (because Afghanistan is land-locked), enlisted, and regretted every moment while hating myself every step of the way.

There are times, though, when nothing else works (grad school, AmeriCorps, "friends" etcetera), when enlisting is about survival - and ultimately, survival trumps politics. If it didn't, then there'd be no point to being a Marxist; we could just moralize all day long without changing the system one bit. By calling ourselves Marxists, we acknowledge that the capitalist system makes evil necessary for survival. I can't judge my fellow proletarian for the way he handles that pressure.

[psgchisolm]

I can't judge my fellow proletarian for the way he handles that pressure.You can judge me through.:D

[Dumb]

You can judge me through.:D

Done.

[ComradeGrant]

I would say don't feed the trolls, but those are some fat and happy trolls at this point.

[Obs]

I'll make sure to do that when F.A.R.C. comes to the US.:cool:

I've had this nagging feeling for a while, but it just sounded so crazy to me I told myself I'd been imagining it, but... I just need to be clear, are you seriously saying that while you'd prefer to fight for a progressive cause, you just want to be a soldier because any uniform will do as long as you get to go hiking and killing people?

[Thirsty Crow]

I think the real problem is the general, naive comparative approach - "X is better than Y, but they both generally suck, though if I were forced to support a side, it would be X".
Tankies and "anti-imperialists" (oh the irony) are the best when it comes to shit like this.

That being said, I can't say that I would hold Goon to particular personal responsibility for that statement. Others do it all the time. To go at it, what about ardent Gaddaffi supporters who also have the guts to proclaim that anyone who does not support the regime is not "Marxist"? Where's the restriction hammer here?

And as far as the military is concerned, I think that economic neccesity and destitution are important factors when it comes to making that choice. But what should follow, a demonization of every poor guy and girl who cannot make ends meet and has chose this path?
Though, what was fishy in the original statement was the declared "support" for the US military.

[Lt. Ferret]

army kicks ass, i train soldiers all day in southern california on conflict resolution and how to help afghan and iraqi villagers, deal with their leadership, respect their cultural sensitivities, and when needed, how to deal with IED's and kill insurgents. get paid handsomely for it. better than working for capitalists directly. indirectly is better than that, for me.

[Geiseric]

You could join the army and the navy to travel around and get money for college, the marines are where all the "Imperialists" go to. Not everybody in the U.S. Military is a boodthirsty killer who hates everything not american :P

[Drosophila]

Revolutionary leftist ideas = sitting in front of a computer

If you don't mind me, I'll just go ahead with my reactionary, right-wing, corporatist Green Party.

[Lt. Ferret]

i really need to start a blog about my work, i think even the commies here would enjoy it, considering my job is to basically fuck with the soldiers about to deploy from the point of the view of iraqis or afghanis.

[#FF0000]

Revolutionary leftist ideas = sitting in front of a computer

i think you're bitter.

i also think you don't actually know anything about "revolutionary leftism"

which is probably why you're an anarchist who votes green or democrat or whatever dumb thing it is you do.

[Le Socialiste]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.

Speak for yourself. :rolleyes:

[Lt. Ferret]

he's right. what do you dorks do besides message board?

[The Douche]

he's right. what do you dorks do besides message board?

You know, full well, that the security policy of this board prevents anybody from revealing their personal information.

So even if we were to post stories involving our real life work, they would be removed.

Keep trolling though. If I thought I would have the opportunity to frag you I might actually consider reenlisting.

[Lt. Ferret]

you do nothing.

[The Douche]

you do nothing.

http://www.answercoalition.org/march-forward/statements/veterans-active-duty-troops.html

I'm in there. So are plenty of other communists who are active duty/veterans, at an event organized through the work of many communists.

This is only the most recent example I can give.

[RGacky3]

he's right. what do you dorks do besides message board?



you do nothing.


Do you really want to get personal here?

[Rusty Shackleford]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich ass fucking cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white. I'm not arguing against it as a theory but in real life yall aint shit, at best you guys just jack off to some pathetic Maoist group in the hills of some third world country that doesnt do shit.
and a few pages later

Good, I oppose the US military in Afganistan and support the actions of the Afghan Liberation Organization.
:tt2:


he's right. what do you dorks do besides message board?
8YHGTc-moRw
Teabaggers hit first, but they (they posted the video) claimed they were attacked
AteV2L9pc-U
KUXZHEx0rYI







http://www.funny-email.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/lol-dog.jpg

[Obs]

you all have something to prove of me because i am insanely important to you.

OK.

[Lt. Ferret]

messageboard warriors who work for multi national corporations and go to symbolic but ineffective protests in order to pat each other on the back. keep up the good work .

[RGacky3]

We do that, and overthrow middle eastern dictators, and hold larger protests without corporate backing than right wingers could ever hold.

then we go and bang your wife.

[Thug Lessons]

messageboard warriors who work for multi national corporations and go to symbolic but ineffective protests in order to pat each other on the back. keep up the good work .

How can you say you oppose capitalism when you yourself work for capitalists? In addition, how can Al Gore say carbon is bad when he himself is made of carbon? Words of wisdom.

[miltonwasfried...man]

727 goon: "Pretty much bro this and conversations with people has been the extent of my political involvement sorry I've got better shit to do than hang out with a bunch of political hobbyists who think they're revolutionaries somehow relevant in todays world."

Che, Marx, Gandhi, Mandela, Malcolm X, Dr. King and many others all probably had 'better shit to do' pal. But if no one tries, no one succeeds

[The Douche]

messageboard warriors who work for multi national corporations and go to symbolic but ineffective protests in order to pat each other on the back. keep up the good work .

Communists had nothing to do with the struggle in wisconsin. :rolleyes:



Notice how quickly he backpedals, first we're "dorks who do nothing", then we show things we do "oh yeah, but those don't mean anything". No, to you it doesn't, to us, we're mobilizing people, bringing them into the revolutionary movement, and learning how to lead. You think it doesn't mean anything to oppose tea partiers? I bet you would feel different if you a hispanic person and they were in your neighborhood, it would mean a lot that somebody was willing to stand up to them.

[black magick hustla]

Communists had nothing to do with the struggle in wisconsin. :rolleyes:



Notice how quickly he backpedals, first we're "dorks who do nothing", then we show things we do "oh yeah, but those don't mean anything". No, to you it doesn't, to us, we're mobilizing people, bringing them into the revolutionary movement, and learning how to lead. You think it doesn't mean anything to oppose tea partiers? I bet you would feel different if you a hispanic person and they were in your neighborhood, it would mean a lot that somebody was willing to stand up to them.
dont feed the trolls he is some loser that spent some four years in a bullshit major and couldnt get a real job so now he pontificates about how he kills insurgents or w/e i hope that fucker gets fragged

[Ele'ill]

better than working for capitalists directly.

You are working for them directly- more so than most other jobs. You are the militant enforcer of capitalist monoculture.

[Ele'ill]

messageboard warriors who work for multi national corporations

That's a big part of why we fight. There are no other options available.



and go to symbolic but ineffective protests

If the demonstration is symbolic- spectacle- lively and loud don't you think it has served its purpose? Actually pretty effective, right? ;)



in order to pat each other on the back. keep up the good work .

Thanks, we're building this ourselves- not jumping in line with an already existing infrastructure.

[The Douche]

dont feed the trolls he is some loser that spent some four years in a bullshit major and couldnt get a real job so now he pontificates about how he kills insurgents or w/e i hope that fucker gets fragged

The really sad thing is he's mad cause he hasn't gotten to deploy. I'm sure it really gets under his skin that I have and don't think it was all fun and fond memories.

[Drosophila]

i think you're bitter.

i also think you don't actually know anything about "revolutionary leftism"

which is probably why you're an anarchist who votes green or democrat or whatever dumb thing it is you do.

I don't think I'm bitter. In fact, I couldn't care less what people around here do to me on this virtual self.

I also don't think you can prove to me that the majority of people around here don't get out much, and they don't do much of anything to promote their cause.

Protests like the one above are an ineffective and immature way to reform the system. Here's my idea of an effective protest: everyone calls their congressional representatives and demands that they vote for or against an important piece of legislation, or propose a new piece of legislation. Then they all go to a town hall meeting and make their voice heard to the people who actually matter.

[#FF0000]

I don't think I'm bitter. In fact, I couldn't care less what people around here do to me on this virtual self.

http://img815.imageshack.us/img815/9766/1302270984472.jpg


I also don't think you can prove to me that the majority of people around here don't get out much, and they don't do much of anything to promote their cause.I actually know a ton of people on here who are deeply involved in this or that organization. I also know a lot of people around here who are kind of isolated, and thus have a hard time working with established groups. Either way, this line of discussion is completely irrelevant and comes down to you throwing a tantrum because you got restricted because you don't understand what "Revolutionary" means.

What is it with this influx of anarcho-kiddies with hard-ons for the American Green Party?

[Property Is Robbery]

Ahh the shooting brown people attack. Good seeing as how me and goon are black. Hell do you think the Generals cared if they fought for the tzar or for communism? Do you think they cared if they joined to shoot Germans or Turks?. They joined to be soldiers. Attempting to call me racist against brown people is wrong.
You're a pig. So because you're black means you're justified in murdering brown people who are defending their homeland?

[727Goon]

http://www.answercoalition.org/march-forward/statements/veterans-active-duty-troops.html

I'm in there. So are plenty of other communists who are active duty/veterans, at an event organized through the work of many communists.

This is only the most recent example I can give.

"Generals lie, service members die"

Seems like your group isnt as obsessed with the death of US soldiers as you are.

Like yeah I get the rationale for the whole "I hope you die in Afganistan" bullshit, but on the other hand your going to alienate yourself and the anti-imperialist movement from about 99% of Americans, many of whom would probably listen if you werent such a rightous asshole about it.

[The Douche]

"Generals lie, service members die"

Seems like your group isnt as obsessed with the death of US soldiers as you are.

Like yeah I get the rationale for the whole "I hope you die in Afganistan" bullshit, but on the other hand your going to alienate yourself and the anti-imperialist movement from about 99% of Americans, many of whom would probably listen if you werent such a rightous asshole about it.

And that's not the line I take when I talk to frustrated soldiers who are protential allies. Though I am open and honest with them, that I think we should get out, and that I think we should "loose" the war. That Afghans should decide what to do in Afghanistan, free from our influence. And that they're in the right for struggling to kick us out.

But thats not the situation here, we're talking about a dude (who is banned now and can't participate in the conversation, so I would prefer not to talk about him after this, since he won't be able to respond) who called himself a socialist, but attempted to justify imperialist military service.

Do you see the difference I'm trying to get at? Bringing somebody into the movement for socialism, vs. somebody betraying the working class, while claiming to stand with them?

[Lt. Ferret]

you support religious reactionary fundamentalists and you call yourself a socialist? :lol:

[The Douche]

you support religious reactionary fundamentalists and you call yourself a socialist? :lol:

You are a literal moron.

[Lt. Ferret]

That's a big part of why we fight. There are no other options available.




If the demonstration is symbolic- spectacle- lively and loud don't you think it has served its purpose? Actually pretty effective, right? ;)




Thanks, we're building this ourselves- not jumping in line with an already existing infrastructure.


there are other options available. start a co-op. start your own company. work for yourself. get off the grid. you're too infatuated with bourgeoisie luxury to ever be a threat.

and if thats what you go to demonstrations for, to be lively, then yeah, thats about as ineffective as possible.

you aren't building much. iv seen this shit for a decade now and it never did anything.






dont feed the trolls he is some loser that spent some four years in a bullshit major and couldnt get a real job so now he pontificates about how he kills insurgents or w/e i hope that fucker gets fragged


you must be right, i studied political science, minored in history and sociology, all liberal arts with a healthy dosage of studying marxism. keep up the good work.

how have i ever pontificated about killing insurgents? i hang out in the desert and teach soldiers how to resolve conflicts. if they follow my training, soldiers and civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq live to fight and play another day.


these ridiculous, ignorant and baseless attacks are getting really repetitive. i mean, theyre cute and all. but youre really, really stupid.

[Lt. Ferret]

You are a literal moron.


no, you cling to the idea of a vague sense of anti-imperialism so tightly that you give your support to the same people who would purge you as soon as the oppurtunity arose. do you think the afghan warlords, taliban, and tribal leaders want anything to do with your secular, marxist, internationalist spiel?

[skep]

you give your support to the same people who would purge you as soon as the oppurtunity arose. do you think the afghan warlords, taliban, and tribal leaders want anything to do with your secular, marxist, internationalist spiel?

Today I learned that my opposition to U.S. military endeavors necessarily means I support the Taliban. Wait, what? Surely there is an undistributed middle.

[Lt. Ferret]

yeah, a stable secular government in afghanistan with the support of its people so the US soldiers can finally come home. its happening in iraq.

[The Douche]

no, you cling to the idea of a vague sense of anti-imperialism so tightly that you give your support to the same people who would purge you as soon as the oppurtunity arose. do you think the afghan warlords, taliban, and tribal leaders want anything to do with your secular, marxist, internationalist spiel?

I dunno, the Iraqis who I dealt with on a daily basis seemed to think that socialism was an idea which was much better than both Baa'thism and imperialism, to bad they recognized that the US and it's puppet state would never allow that to happen...

[black magick hustla]

and baseless attacks are getting really repetitive. i mean, theyre cute and all. but youre really, really stupid.
w/e man you are not gonna get under my skin. i liked it when in the 60s fuckers in the military were all about smoking grass and shooting their officers

[black magick hustla]

yeah, a stable secular government in afghanistan with the support of its people so the US soldiers can finally come home. its happening in iraq.
i like more the idea of lining up officers and taliban leaders against the wall

[Lt. Ferret]

cute fantasy. my soldiers love me. officers and enlisted come from the same class backgrounds, and theyd rather have all the fun while i do the paper work anyway.

[black magick hustla]

:)

[black magick hustla]

cute fantasy. my soldiers love me. officers and enlisted come from the same class backgrounds, and theyd rather have all the fun while i do the paper work anyway.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/21/afghanistan-trophy-photos-us-soldier

they seem having a lot of fun

[black magick hustla]

cute fantasy

as cute as your story about secular democracies

[Lt. Ferret]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/21/afghanistan-trophy-photos-us-soldier

they seem having a lot of fun


yeah, thats called a war crime, and theyre going to wish they were dead pretty soon. your point?

[skep]

its happening in iraq.

Stand in front of the new embassy complex in Baghdad and tell me that Iraq is a sovereign, self-determinant republic. Never mind the 100,000+ civilian deaths to that end. It is now part of the American empire.

You seem to think that you are doing good work, and I don't necessarily contest that. What you fail to understand is that you are a nurse administering a band-aid to a patient that was dismembered by your colleagues. It is our broken, evil, self-serving foreign policy that necessitates your existence in the first place.

[black magick hustla]

yeah, thats called a war crime, and theyre going to wish they were dead pretty soon. your point?
what type of comradeship is that????? letting em rot just like that. bad soldier

[lines]

Communism aint shit anymore, and it's because communists are a bunch of white boy rich [censored] cowards who reject anyone who doesnt toe the party line and see the world in black and white.

You certainly see the world in black and white, what you said is very racist.

[Ele'ill]

there are other options available. start a co-op. start your own company. work for yourself.

Oh yeah, why not. :rolleyes: "But why do all these successful things when you can go to school for poli sci and then join the Army?"

Fucking spare me.


get off the grid. you're too infatuated with bourgeoisie luxury to ever be a threat.

"Off the grid" means isolation- you wish. Bourgeoisie luxury as in a steady job, shelter and medical. I want it and I fight to win. Your leaders spend 'a bit' of money defending against anti-capitalist organizing- I think it's clear what they view as a threat.


and if thats what you go to demonstrations for, to be lively, then yeah, thats about as ineffective as possible.

No just kidding, I go to demonstrations like everyone else to not make any noise at all so that it draws no attention to serious issues. It's reassuring knowing you're the opposing force.



you aren't building much. iv seen this shit for a decade now and it never did anything.

Judging from your absurdly pathetic posts I have to say you never were involved in any type of movement building. What the ruling class has you doing now is not movement building, baby bomber, it's damage control for a system about to tip.

[Ele'ill]

cute fantasy. my soldiers love me. officers and enlisted come from the same class backgrounds, and theyd rather have all the fun while i do the paper work anyway.

Remember when you denied that rape was rampant in the US military? Talk about blinders. :rolleyes:

[Thug Lessons]

cute fantasy. my soldiers love me. officers and enlisted come from the same class backgrounds, and theyd rather have all the fun while i do the paper work anyway.

Note that the 'fun' in question here is assembling necklaces out of the fingers, ears and genitals of Afghan children, committing sex crimes, &ct.

[Lt. Ferret]

yeah there are some bad apples and they get punished severely when caught. i promise you, id rather die than go to a military prison.

[Ele'ill]

yeah there are some bad apples and they get punished severely when caught. i promise you, id rather die than go to a military prison.

Bad apples like both occupations. I'm glad the motivating factor here is prison. :rolleyes:

[WeAreReborn]

cute fantasy. my soldiers love me. officers and enlisted come from the same class backgrounds, and theyd rather have all the fun while i do the paper work anyway.
Yes nothing says fun like killing civilians and getting blown up in car bombs..

[Ele'ill]

Btw- This user isn't deployed as far as I know.

[Lt. Ferret]

id rather drive around in a humvee than fold clothes all day in target.

[Lt. Ferret]

and no, im not deployed. never said i wanted to be, never yearned for it, if it happens, it happens, and if i stay in long enough it will happen.

[skep]

id rather drive around in a humvee than fold clothes all day in target.

We are demeaning labor now? Are you just here to troll?

[Ele'ill]

id rather drive around in a humvee than fold clothes all day in target.

Only touching on this because of past conversations- I've never worked for target but let's be honest- you do more than drive a humvee all day and those who work at target do more than 'fold clothes all day'. The difference would be the target worker's alarming lack of civilian casualties while earning something resembling a living.


So are you 31b?


I have a flame derailing question here if you don't take exception to me asking- When you get out what are your plans?

[Lt. Ferret]

im 14A. i plan on getting out i think in 2013 april 8, go back to school and get a masters degree in diplomacy or something, join the Peace Corps, and help people.

[Ele'ill]

im 14A. i plan on getting out i think in 2013 april 8, go back to school and get a masters degree in diplomacy or something, join the Peace Corps, and help people.

If you're comfortable chatting about it what do you dislike about the military? Your posts always come through as pro-military but I see it as a defensive mechanism. I think you're defending yourself regardless of your beliefs because you might be having regrets. This is not a loaded question.

[727Goon]

And that's not the line I take when I talk to frustrated soldiers who are protential allies. Though I am open and honest with them, that I think we should get out, and that I think we should "loose" the war. That Afghans should decide what to do in Afghanistan, free from our influence. And that they're in the right for struggling to kick us out.

But thats not the situation here, we're talking about a dude (who is banned now and can't participate in the conversation, so I would prefer not to talk about him after this, since he won't be able to respond) who called himself a socialist, but attempted to justify imperialist military service.

Do you see the difference I'm trying to get at? Bringing somebody into the movement for socialism, vs. somebody betraying the working class, while claiming to stand with them?

Yeah I guess I misunderstood where you were coming from. I mean yeah I guess in a strictly political sense the death of soldiers in Afghanistan is progressive, but to be honest I don't really wish death on anyone.

Also as i said in the "unfair restriction" post I would support Taliban victory if as you claimed they killed less civilians, had popular support, and were a broad coalition of anti imperialists including progressives and apoliticals. However I've yet to see anything that backs this up.

[Lt. Ferret]

If you're comfortable chatting about it what do you dislike about the military? Your posts always come through as pro-military but I see it as a defensive mechanism. I think you're defending yourself regardless of your beliefs because you might be having regrets. This is not a loaded question.


i think people here bash the military in an ignorant sense. i have met lots of fantastic people in the service, and a lot of them have stories of men who died protecting them in combat, or protecting civilians. to think that theres a million man strong force of child rapists running around is ridiculous.

i hate some of the excess machismo in the military but its easily avoided. most people come in, do their 3-5 years, and get out and go to college and move on with their lives. very few people i have ever met are like YEAH LETS GO KILL SOME HAJJIS. its just not a widespread mentality from what i saw.

i might stay in, quite honestly. im in the air defense so i have a cushy career awaiting me. im thinking of calling my branch manager and trying to get a UN humanitarian job, or to go to kosovo or haiti. the military is so big that it has the potential for incredible good or speechless evil. i didnt support iraq or afghanistan but i am of the opinion of building up governments there and then leaving.

the US military does a lot of humanitarian work, and if some people want to analyze helping tsunami victims in indonesia as imperialism, so be it.


what i dislike about the military i suppose is the excess hierarchy, and the attention to details on shit that really doesnt matter. petty little things. but iv never had a private sector job that i didnt hate. im not much of a capitalist, and i was never an anarchist, so the military didn't hold such a burden to overcome to join, but i had no intention to do so until i graduated college and they said i could come in, do 3 years, get my debts paid off, then go do my own thing, which is what im doing.

[Revolution starts with U]

And also "liberating them with bullets." But no, there's no ultra-machismo attitude in the military :rolleyes:
You just don't see it because you're so close to it.

[RGacky3]

id rather drive around in a humvee than fold clothes all day in target.


A: Start your own buisiness, since thats just the pure solutoin.
B: I'd rather fold clothes and be able to hold a wife.

[#FF0000]

god, gacky is the worst

[Lt. Ferret]

A: Start your own buisiness, since thats just the pure solutoin.
B: I'd rather fold clothes and be able to hold a wife.


:rolleyes: oh my fragile ego. and i might start my own business, i got into home brewing wine a while back and its pretty tasty at this point.

[RGacky3]

and i might start my own business, i got into home brewing wine a while back and its pretty tasty at this point.

Well good luck.

[hatzel]

i got into home brewing wine a while back and its pretty tasty at this point.

Oh, cool! Do you mean wine-wine, with grapes, or...country wine, I think we call it, which is often made with strawberries or plums or literally anything else we find lying around. My granddad used to make it, but it was pretty much just alcoholic jam, almost...me, I brew beers and ales, now and then a bit of mead. That's pretty easy, mead, give it a go sometime :cool:

[Revolution starts with U]

Did he steal your GF, #F? I really don't see what was so bad about that comment.

[#FF0000]

Did he steal your GF, #F? I really don't see what was so bad about that comment.

Gacky throws tantrums and attacks users on a personal level constantly. I mean, I definitely call people fucking morons all the time, but


B: I'd rather fold clothes and be able to hold a wife.

That's too far.

[Revolution starts with U]

That's right. I forgot about Lt's marital troubles. Maybe it was a little too much.
But seriously, tantrums.... where?

[Lenina Rosenweg]

For what its worth, while we're discussing "I hope you die in Afghanistan", the WSW put it best


Young American soldiers, Marines and airmen are paying a terrible price in this colonial-style war. Since the war began, 1,562 American troops have lost their lives in Afghanistan, together with another 874 British, Canadian and other foreign troops. More than half of that toll has taken place over the last two years, since Barack Obama took office and organized his military “surge.”
Many thousands more have suffered catastrophic wounds. In 2010, 171 of all the casualties brought to the Landstuhl US military hospital in Germany underwent amputations―11 percent of the total―while 61 of those wounded soldiers lost more than one limb. This is triple the rate of multiple amputations suffered by troops the previous year.
Among the recent casualties in Afghanistan is Capt. Joshua McClimans, who was killed last Friday when Afghan resistance forces fired on a forward operating base in Khost province, where he worked as part of the medical team. A native of western Pennsylvania, he left behind a wife, a young son and a step-daughter.
Among the comments posted on his death in the local newspaper was one from his uncle, who wrote that his nephew “only did the tour to better himself and his son, but instead it cost him his life.” He added, “I just wish that this government would get their s--- together and stop all of this stupid fighting for other countries. There are people in our country that could use our help with all of the money we are spending…. Josh did not deserve this and neither does our family.”
These are sentiments felt by masses of American working people, who know that they are being lied to by the Obama administration, just as they were under George W. Bush, about the real reasons for this unbearable human sacrifice.
After 10 years, the claim that American soldiers are killing and dying in Afghanistan as part of a “war on terrorism” stands exposed as a bloody fraud. According to the US military’s own assessment, there are barely a handful of Al Qaeda operatives in Afghanistan, and none of the armed Afghan groups resisting the occupation have been linked to overseas acts of terror.
The war’s real aim has nothing to do with protecting the American people, or bettering the lot of the Afghans. Rather it is being waged against the interests of both, to further the geo-strategic and profit aims of a ruling financial elite by asserting American hegemony over the energy reserves of the Caspian Basin and the pipeline routes to funnel them to the West.
Working people are forced to bear the cost of this imperialist adventure, both in terms of the young American troops, their sons and daughters, who are killed there, and in the hundreds of billions spent on this war, even as politicians of both major parties incessantly claim that there is no money for jobs, social services, education or health care.


For its part, the media treats the continuous bloodshed in Afghanistan as virtually a non-event. Mass killings of American troops, like the one that took place at Kabul airport Wednesday, barely make the news.
A genuine fight against war can be organized today only through the independent political mobilization of the working class against the two big business parties and the profit system, which is the source of militarism. The struggle for the immediate and unconditional withdrawal of all US troops from Afghanistan and Iraq and an end to US-led attacks on Libya must be linked to the fight to defend jobs and living standards against the relentless attacks of the banks, the corporations and their government.

[#FF0000]

That's right. I forgot about Lt's marital troubles. Maybe it was a little too much.
But seriously, tantrums.... where?

basically every post

[RGacky3]

Gacky throws tantrums and attacks users on a personal level constantly. I mean, I definitely call people fucking morons all the time, but


I did attack Lt. Ferret on a personal level, because thats all he does here to other users.


That's too far.

Then he should'nt go around attacking Mariel, or other people that have a hard time on a personal level, if he can dish it out he can take it.

I'm frankly tired if his elitist, if your poor its because you suck, or get a better job you lazy bum, or you guys don't do anything except sit around, bullshit, if he's gonna make personal attacks here, he better expect them back, especially if he's posting his personal stuff, while shitting on other people.


basically every post

Its only you and Bud that calls my posts tantrums (as in pointing out that people die due to lack of healthcare and old ladies get kicked out of their homes), so your in good company my friend.

[Revolution starts with U]

I mean, it really does seem like you like to kiss Bud's ass #F. And it all stems from there.
I don't see any tantrums. I see well reasoned arguments backed up by facts and statistics.
If you would like to provide evidence....

[#FF0000]

I mean, it really does seem like you like to kiss Bud's ass #F. And it all stems from there.

As much of a troll as he is a lot of the time at least he's cordial.


I don't see any tantrums. I see well reasoned arguments backed up by facts and statistics.
If you would like to provide evidence....

all of his posts sound angry/whiny though. regardless of what evidence he posts or whatever.

[RedSunRising]

As much of a troll as he is a lot of the time at least he's cordial.


How is he a troll? Most of his posts are chit chat just waffling and teasing. If it was where serious stuff was being discussed THAN he would be a troll.

[#FF0000]

How is he a troll? Most of his posts are chit chat just waffling and teasing. If it was where serious stuff was being discussed THAN he would be a troll.

A lot of the time he just posts the same thing over and over regardless of counterarguments.

[RedSunRising]

A lot of the time he just posts the same thing over and over regardless of counterarguments.

Thats because he is trying to psychologically convince himself that his views are right when he knows he doesnt really believe in capitalism, its neurosis, not trolling and he keeps it to chit chat so he isnt really a troll.