Don't you just love the rich.

[B5C]

Millionaire Dentist Busted in Pizza Fraud

A Michigan dentist who normally dishes out pain through root canals found himself behind bars in Florida this weekend for being a pain on the pocketbook.
Richard Lewis Ludwig, 54, was arrested up in Polk County Saturday on credit card theft and forgery charges after he went pizza shopping with a college student's lost credit card, according to the Orlando Sentinel.

Ludwig, from Okemos, Mich., was in town for his son's baseball tournament in Winter Haven.
Police say Harrun Majeed, a military veteran now studying at a community college, had dropped the credit card in a Publix parking lot. He realized he'd dropped it when he got home and he called to cancel it.
The credit card company said the card had been used at a pizzeria in the same shopping plaza as the Publix, and Majeed called the police.

When cops arrived at the pizzeria, they say they found Ludwig waiting for two large pizzas with extra olives he had ordered and paid for with Majeed's card.
Ludwig's bill was just $40.64, and he had $250 cash in his wallet.
Cops asked Ludwig if he was having money problems. "Absolutely not," the dentist replied, saying his net worth was between $3 million and $4 million.
Ludwig was also charged with impersonating and attempting to use the ID of another person without consent.
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Millionaire-Dentist-Busted-in-Pizza-Fraud-117518168.html



*sarcasm* They must be good honest people.

[T-Paine]

*sarcasm* They must be good honest people.

Does it make a difference that he was a millionaire?

[B5C]

Does it make a difference that he was a millionaire?

Yes. Because he HAS the money to buy the pizza, but instead to steal the money from a poor person because he can.

[GreenCommunism]

The rich are more and more immoral ,just because they don't care and want to change as well. Most of you should not underestimate how the working class is smart and how the bourgeois are as well. if this website would allow controversial people to write essays and for certain bright individuals here to write them back we could actually have something going. As in university thesis etc.

[#FF0000]

I think too many of oyu leftist forget that many of those rich people could very well be creating fake news such as those in order to shock people into creating a more just society without money changers and the crappy federal reserfve etc etc.

:mellow:

[RED DAVE]

I think too many of oyu leftist forget that many of those rich people could very well be creating fake news such as those in order to shock people into creating a more just society without [A] money changers and the [B] crappy federal reserfve etc etc.A + B = antisemitic conspiracy theory to me.

RED DAVE

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

I agree with the point that crime needs to be looked at in social context. I do not agree that this man using a credit card he found implicately means he was looking to make sure a poor college student goes bankrupt. I've committed acts of vandalism, for example, that had adverse effects on people which I did not consider beforehand and did not intend.


A + B = antisemitic conspiracy theory to me.

While certainly possible, please do not jump to conclusions. Political or economic points of view are more complex than a + b = antisemitism, though I see your point and given his recent history I can see why you would say this.

Let him sink his own ship, there is no need to make assumptions.

[GreenCommunism]

A + B = antisemitic conspiracy theory to me.

RED DAVE
i believe that the section of the bourgeoisie being the oligarchy itself is merely a group of people willing to use violence and more talented at it than the next guy.

banks is crime,speculation is crime, war is crime, murder is crime,profit is crime. the bourgeoisie raised itself there through crime and it is not true that bill gate has any influence whatsoever in politics.

as for the federal reserve, i was quite clearly sarcastic, don't you remember you when u was a kid and you made jokes.

[Thirsty Crow]

I love the rich very much. In fact, I love tham so much that I would relieve thzem of the terrible burden of responsibility that comes with economic and political power and instead I would advocate workers to engage in such problem ridden business...yep, I luv 'em!

[PhoenixAsh]

...well...thats how they get rich...stealing...so this doesn't surprise me at all...its just a more direct approach

[Bud Struggle]

Being from Florida I can tell you there is some funky stuff going down in Polk County.

[Geiseric]

Lol this is just kinda funny, I don't get why somebody would do that when they had 250 dollers in their wallet. I mean it's just disrespectful.

[Jazzratt]

Lol this is just kinda funny, I don't get why somebody would do that when they had 250 dollers in their wallet. I mean it's just disrespectful. The rich don't get rich by spending their own money. Come on, now.

[#FF0000]

The funniest thing is the offended tone this guy must have had when someone asked if he was having money trouble or something.

[AthenaAwakened]

He used the card because he's a thoughtless, inconsiderate, greedy bastard.

Money will no more improve his character than sunshine can sweeten trash.

If you think about it, trash left out in the noonday sun stinks more, and so do the bastards of the world when surrounded by money.

[Lt. Ferret]

i know this is a thread for you guys to bash the rich but poor people do this all the time as well.

[PhoenixAsh]

i know this is a thread for you guys to bash the rich but poor people do this all the time as well.

yes...but if you are poor its actually an understandable to need the money.

[Lt. Ferret]

no, its just people are dicks and like spending other people's money, whether they have 20 dollars or 20 million dollars.

[#FF0000]

I think it's considerably different if you have 20 million dollars.

[Lt. Ferret]

its the same basic rush, desire to get away with something. rarely is credit card fraud used on bread or basic necessities, most of hte time its on luxury or impulse items.

[Viet Minh]

no, its just people are dicks and like spending other people's money, whether they have 20 dollars or 20 million dollars.

Yeah you get dicks that are rich and poor. In fact in the poor it is more unforgiveable because they should know how it feels, but on the other hand they actually have more need of it. Generally you shouldn't judge people because of money (or lack thereof) but to make a lot of money you have to be either very motivated (read into that what you like) or very lucky to have wealthy family. I'm working class but I have a wide social scale, most of the time the most generous and good friends I have are the most poor.

[Revolution starts with U]

If the MILLIONAIRE had found some cash on the ground it might be ok. But he willingly used someone else's credit card, with $250 in his pocket. IMO he should get jail time, and a lot of it.
Stealing is bad. Stealing when you're rich is fucking disgusting. I don't support capital punishement... but I almost want to for this.

[Tim Finnegan]

The funniest thing is the offended tone this guy must have had when someone asked if he was having money trouble or something.
That got me, too. What it must be like to live in a world where being a heartless thief is seen as preferable to being poor!

[B5C]

That got me, too. What it must be like to live in a world where being a heartless thief is seen as preferable to being poor!

Well this thief has enough money to get good lawyers to help him get off with a lesser charge or a plea deal.

[Pretty Flaco]

its the same basic rush, desire to get away with something. rarely is credit card fraud used on bread or basic necessities, most of hte time its on luxury or impulse items.

When my family used to live in Florida, my dad's credit card info got stolen twice. The first person tried to buy furniture and the second one tried to use the money on online poker.

Not exactly life's bread and butter.

[PhoenixAsh]

its the same basic rush, desire to get away with something. rarely is credit card fraud used on bread or basic necessities, most of hte time its on luxury or impulse items.

yeah...go figure...when you are poor you steal money to buy the things you can normally not afford...strange...

[Lt. Ferret]

yeah...go figure...when you are poor you steal money to buy the things you can normally not afford...strange...


capitalist luxury items?


call the mother fucking wambulance. if some guy is doing credit card fraud to feed his family thats one thing, not a guy who's doing it to have the only rolex on the block. fuck him.

[Pretty Flaco]

People don't always steal shit from rich people either...

[PhoenixAsh]

capitalist luxury items?

call the mother fucking wambulance. if some guy is doing credit card fraud to feed his family thats one thing, not a guy who's doing it to have the only rolex on the block. fuck him.

Yet...when somebody who owns the most rolexes on the block does it...its exusable because poor do it as well...but when the poor do it...its because they want to own the only rolex on the block and that is somehow greedy?

Excellent logic...

[Lt. Ferret]

Yet...when somebody who owns the most rolexes on the block does it...its exusable because poor do it as well...but when the poor do it...its because they want to own the only rolex on the block and that is somehow greedy?

Excellent logic...


its not excusable in any case. but poor people and rich people have the same motives for doing this particular illegal activity.

excellent logic, indeed.

[Tim Finnegan]

People don't always steal shit from rich people either...
Well, nobody's perfect. ;)

[MarxSchmarx]

i know this is a thread for you guys to bash the rich but poor people do this all the time as well.

Huh that's funny, because I'm considered as someone who lives "at or below the poverty line" and I've never done anything like this, don't find it remotely tempting, and find this wealthy douchebag's behavior repugnant and despicable. And this woman I work with, she was telling me how she had to track down the owner of a wallet they found in a shopping plaza to return it to the owner and how long that took them, because they were worried that if they turned it in to the lost and found the person at the desk would pocket it.

I guess we're not really poor.

[Lt. Ferret]

Huh that's funny, because I'm considered as someone who lives "at or below the poverty line" and I've never done anything like this, don't find it remotely tempting, and find this wealthy douchebag's behavior repugnant and despicable. And this woman I work with, she was telling me how she had to track down the owner of a wallet they found in a shopping plaza to return it to the owner and how long that took them, because they were worried that if they turned it in to the lost and found the person at the desk would pocket it.

I guess we're not really poor.


cool story, bro.

[Exakt]

who the fuck orders pizzas with extra olives wtf lol

[ZeroNowhere]

I don't support capital punishement... but I almost want to for this.
...

What?

:laugh:

[RGacky3]

its not excusable in any case. but poor people and rich people have the same motives for doing this particular illegal activity.

excellent logic, indeed.

No, I'm pretty sure they don't. But its cute how your trying to stand up for hte rich guy, you just can't help yourself.

[Revolution starts with U]

Freakonomics has an excellent example of the actions of rich v non-rich in the realm of theivery. A guy began selling bagles at offices (put your money in hte bucket, take your bagle). He found executives and/or small offices were the most likely to steal bagels and/or money from him.

It should surprise no leftist that many (wealthy) people would shoot your grandma if it would increase their bank account.

[T-Paine]

dis·crim·i·na·tion -noun

treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit

I don't care whether the guy was rich or not. He did the wrong thing, as I would assume it would not be hard to return a credit card with all the information on it. However, this wouldn't even be a story if it was cash that was dropped on the ground...am I stealing when I pick up a dollar in a parking lot if I don't need it?

[#FF0000]

dis·crim·i·na·tion -noun

treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit

I don't care whether the guy was rich or not. He did the wrong thing, as I would assume it would not be hard to return a credit card with all the information on it. However, this wouldn't even be a story if it was cash that was dropped on the ground...am I stealing when I pick up a dollar in a parking lot if I don't need it?

There's a difference between picking up a dollar, or even a 20, and picking up a credit card.

[Revolution starts with U]

The difference is if you can very well buy it yourself. I'll forgive a starving man for stealing steaks... in fact I see nothing wrong with it. BUt a somewhat poor/middle class person stealing a TV/Rolex, or a rich person stealing pizza is clearly wrong.
What makes this case especially wrong is that the dentist could buy 100 pizzas and not even feel it in his pockets, and stole "money" which he knew belonged to someone else, and who that person he stole from was.
The difference comes in becuase the rich guy has absolutely no justifiable excuse. At least a lower middle class person could say "why does he have a flatscreen and I don't" (which is a bogus justification, but its an argument that could be made). All the rich guy can say is "I wasn't going to spend MY money on a flatscreen."
It's about accountability. This guy should be punished to the fullest extenet of the law, just like cops should be punished to the fullest extent when they break the law (which sadly, they are punished to the least extent :crying:). If you're at the top, you set the example.

[RGacky3]

treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group, class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit

I don't care whether the guy was rich or not. He did the wrong thing, as I would assume it would not be hard to return a credit card with all the information on it. However, this wouldn't even be a story if it was cash that was dropped on the ground...am I stealing when I pick up a dollar in a parking lot if I don't need it?

Its not discrimination to take into account the circumstances and background of an action.

[T-Paine]

Its not discrimination to take into account the circumstances and background of an action.

That's true. However, look at the thread title, and look at some of the remarks:


*sarcasm* They must be good honest people.

The rich are more and more immoral

thats how they get rich...stealing...

I don't see this as judging the dentist as an individual. Rather, this instance is being used to perpetuate your already strong negative stereotype of wealthier people. I see it as no different from how a lot fundamentalist christians treat muslims, or how a lot whites treat blacks. It's all discrimination in my opinion. I understand that there is less "justification" for stealing when you don't need it, but I'm for equal treatment of all people under the law. Obviously there was exaggeration when capital punishment was brought up, but I still think the strong reaction to this had more to do with his background than ordering pizza with someone else's credit card.

[RGacky3]

I don't see this as judging the dentist as an individual. Rather, this instance is being used to perpetuate your already strong negative stereotype of wealthier people. I see it as no different from how a lot fundamentalist christians treat muslims, or how a lot whites treat blacks. It's all discrimination in my opinion. I understand that there is less "justification" for stealing when you don't need it, but I'm for equal treatment of all people under the law. Obviously there was exaggeration when capital punishment was brought up, but I still think the strong reaction to this had more to do with his background than ordering pizza with someone else's credit card.

Theres a huge difference, most rich people became rich through other peoples work, many of them also did so through very unethical means (sweat shop labor and so on), so theres a REASON for that.

[T-Paine]

Theres a huge difference, most rich people became rich through other peoples work, many of them also did so through very unethical means (sweat shop labor and so on), so theres a REASON for that.

There are reasons behind almost any stereotype and discrimination. I don't think that justifies it. It's not hard to make a distinction among people instead of lumping them all in one group to hate. We don't know the dentist's story in this case, so do we automatically assume that he became a millionaire unethically? Does that give us justification to dump his personal act of using another's credit card on other millionaire dentists?

[RGacky3]

We automatically assume that he became a millionaire through an unethical system, Captialism, its like monarchs, some are nice, some are dicks, but they all got their power through unethical means. The difference is Capitalism usually rewards dicks :P.

[Che a chara]

There are reasons behind almost any stereotype and discrimination. I don't think that justifies it. It's not hard to make a distinction among people instead of lumping them all in one group to hate. We don't know the dentist's story in this case, so do we automatically assume that he became a millionaire unethically? Does that give us justification to dump his personal act of using another's credit card on other millionaire dentists?

I think the circumstances surrounding this incident give the precedent to criticise this man.

He's a millionaire who picked up a dropped credit card and then made his way to gorge himself on pizzas using the now stolen credit card to falsely assume a stolen identity to pay for his feed, despite having $250 in his wallet. i see no signs of him showing any weaknesses that may have contributed to him doing what he did, especially seeing as he's a millionaire with a well respected and seemingly well paid job.

In any future similar situation if the circumstances are different then of course others might take a more subjective view to it, but the evidence shows this rich bastard to be lacking in morals and character and as a methodical opportunist.

[Revolution starts with U]

I was just joking about the capital punishemnt thing (sort of). But as you can see, I wasn't saying we should hang all rich people because 1 dentist stole a credit card.
But I do think this individual, considering the circumstances should face the fullest extension of the law possible.
This is just utterly disgusting to me.

[PhoenixAsh]

That's true. However, look at the thread title, and look at some of the remarks:

I don't see this as judging the dentist as an individual. Rather, this instance is being used to perpetuate your already strong negative stereotype of wealthier people. I see it as no different from how a lot fundamentalist christians treat muslims, or how a lot whites treat blacks. It's all discrimination in my opinion. I understand that there is less "justification" for stealing when you don't need it, but I'm for equal treatment of all people under the law. Obviously there was exaggeration when capital punishment was brought up, but I still think the strong reaction to this had more to do with his background than ordering pizza with someone else's credit card.


The objective fact about this current economic system is that you derive surplus value from labour to gain money. If you accumulate money you therefore deny surplus value to go to those who create it and therefore undervalue their work. You take away money which is not yours.

In my opinion that is stealing.



There is no equal treatment under the law in regards with the nmature of the crime. If there is...this is blatantly wrong...arguing to do so will generalize every action and motive to the same level. which is most definately not the case.

Crimes are assessed towards their individual case and context....or should be.

One murder is not the other murder. A murder committed under huge emotional and psychological stress does not have the same weight as a murder committed with cold calculated intent for gain.

The same way being rich and stealing is actually aggravating the weight of the crime as opposed of the weight of someone who steals because he does not have money. (It rarely is though...mostly rich people get off with a fine and a slap on the wrist and the poor guy gets three to four.)

The fact that he did not need to steal makes the fact that he did all the more abject.

[Tim Finnegan]

I wasn't saying we should hang all rich people because 1 dentist stole a credit card..
I agree, that is not why we should hang all rich people. ;)

[Lt. Ferret]

No, I'm pretty sure they don't. But its cute how your trying to stand up for hte rich guy, you just can't help yourself.


and you cant help yourself from bashing some guy being an asshole because hes rich.

[RGacky3]

I'm not bashing him because he's rich .... I'm taking that into account, which is what thoughtful people do.

[Bud Struggle]

This is like watching "Cops" or "Jerry Springer" and "take in account" that is is how all Proletarians behave.

[RGacky3]

I was'nt saying this is how rich people act, not at all, I'm saying that Capitalism rewards those with that mindset (greed), also that its more condemnable when a rich man steals, because its out of greed rather than a last resort.