"debate" between "yankee imperialist swines" and "dictator gaddaffi cheerleaders"...

[Sasha]

Split from thread about killing of black africans mistaken for mercenarys by anti-gadaffi insurgents

while i completly agree that this is very bad and needs to stop may i implore why you, here and on your blog, only post anti-resistance stories and other news that only benefits the gadaffi regime, while "dozens feared killed" by mobs mistaking them for mercenaries is bad, very bad, it pales by the thousands probaly killed by the regime.
if your pro-gadaffi out of some misguided anti-imperialism or something just come out and fucking say it and we can have us some debate already, but this is pathetic...

[The Vegan Marxist]

I post what I find important. I also run my blog through facebook as well, which I have a facebook link to the right of my blog, in which I've posted videos and links that show interesting events in areas that are taken over by the protesters. Like the very interesting event of self-governance.

UPDATE: Plus, I also make sure that people are aware that I'm in support of the Libyan people's right to self determination. If they oppose Gaddafi, then more power to them! In fact, I just posted an MRZine article where, not only does it go against imperialism and shady elements being supported by the US, it also denounces Gaddafi as a neo-liberal dictator that he is. So please stfu if you don't know know what you're talking about.

[Nolan]

I think everyone knows that Vegan revisionist deep inside wants NATO to invade so the country will rally around Gaddafi and save what he thinks is "progressive."

[The Vegan Marxist]

I think everyone knows that Vegan revisionist deep inside wants NATO to invade so the country will rally around Gaddafi and save what he thinks is "progressive."

I think you're just being deluded now. I don't support Gaddafi for what he became. Claims of me "supporting Gaddafi" are far from the truth. I want the Libyan opposition to handle these things on their own. If supporting the right to self-determination and opposing imperialism is "supporting Gaddafi", then so be it. Clearly no one can make reactionary people like yourself understand.

[Fungy]

I think everyone knows that Vegan revisionist deep inside wants NATO to invade so the country will rally around Gaddafi and save what he thinks is "progressive."

What a joke. The reality of the situation is not only has the pseudo-Left in the West cheerleaded these anti-black racist, pro-Monarchy pieces of human trash, but now they're silent when the US is actually about to invade.

[Nolan]

I think you're just being deluded now. I don't support Gaddafi for what he became. Claims of me "supporting Gaddafi" are far from the truth. I want the Libyan opposition to handle these things on their own. If supporting the right to self-determination and opposing imperialism is "supporting Gaddafi", then so be it. Clearly no one can make reactionary people like yourself understand.

Then why, Vegan Revisionist, do you take the regime's side while pretending to sit on the fence? (Oh, Libya didn't kill thousands of people! They're not really hiring mercenaries, that's bullshit! But yeah whatever go protesters!) < sums up your posturing over the last few days.

[Nolan]

What a joke. The reality of the situation is not only has the pseudo-Left in the West cheerleaded these anti-black racist, pro-Monarchy pieces of human trash, but now they're silent when the US is actually about to invade.

Dumb post is dumb. Please take your dunce hat and go sit in the corner.

[KC]

Wow big surprise that TVM posted this. :rolleyes:

[Fungy]

The question is, when Tripoli is burning and US tanks are rolling down the streets, will you eat your words, or will you stick with the Trotskyites, liberal, conservatives, and bourgeois imperialists to the end?

[Os Cangaceiros]

:lol:

[Crux]

I post what I find important. I also run my blog through facebook as well, which I have a facebook link to the right of my blog, in which I've posted videos and links that show interesting events in areas that are taken over by the protesters. Like the very interesting event of self-governance.

UPDATE: Plus, I also make sure that people are aware that I'm in support of the Libyan people's right to self determination. If they oppose Gaddafi, then more power to them! In fact, I just posted an MRZine article where, not only does it go against imperialism and shady elements being supported by the US, it also denounces Gaddafi as a neo-liberal dictator that he is. So please stfu if you don't know know what you're talking about.
(http://kasamaproject.org/2011/02/27/the-logic-of-the-anti-anti-qaddafis/)The logic of the anti-anti-Qaddafis (http://kasamaproject.org/2011/02/27/the-logic-of-the-anti-anti-qaddafis/)
It wouldn't be the MRZine article referenced there would it?

As for your original post it is very unfortunate but also highlights the point of how little support the regime has inside of Libya itself and the fact that it is now dependent on foreign mercenaries, rather than the Libyan army.

Fungy: How desperate you are to defend someone who claims he is being attacked by Al-Qaida. Only a revisionist liek yourself would see anything anti-imperialist in that ally-of-Berlusconi and fellow fighter in the War Against Terrorism Qadaffi. Thankfully your position is reduced to political insignificance, and your only way out is to build a strawman claiming anyone here would favour imperialist intervention. I assume your position on Egypt is the same?

(http://kasamaproject.org/2011/02/27/the-logic-of-the-anti-anti-qaddafis/)

[Crux]

Just as an aside, TVM, as a supporter of PFLP how do you feel about their position on libya? (http://www.revleft.org/vb/showthread.php?t=150764)

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

I kind of figured this would be the end result of Gaddhafi's use of mercenaries. When people have been victimized by brutes who happen to be from X community, they have to be fairly enlightened not to start generalizing about individuals from X community. I can't think of many times in history when conflict hasn't resulted in this kind of ethnic dispute.

On the other hand, this shouldn't be used to attack all of the protesters. I saw many black guys amongst the protesters in some of the pictures, so clearly this racism isn't universally held.

[Fungy]

Fungy: How desperate you are to defend someone who claims he is being attacked by Al-Qaida. Only a revisionist liek yourself would see anything anti-imperialist in that ally-of-Berlusconi and fellow fighter in the War Against Terrorism Qadaffi. Thankfully your position is reduced to political insignificance, and your only way out is to build a strawman claiming anyone here would favour imperialist intervention. I assume your position on Egypt is the same?

(http://kasamaproject.org/2011/02/27/the-logic-of-the-anti-anti-qaddafis/)

It makes sense for the Trotskyite scum of the CWI to be enthralled with any Western military adventure. After all, no one will ever forget your treachery with the Falklands.

But my question was directed to someone who claims he isn't counter-revolutionary trash, so I don't know why you answered.

[Crux]

It makes sense for the Trotskyite scum of the CWI to be enthralled with any Western military adventure. After all, no one will ever forget your treachery with the Falklands.

But my question was directed to someone who claims he isn't counter-revolutionary trash, so I don't know why you answered.
Military adventure like Libya taking part in the War Against Terrorism you mean?
Obvious troll is obvious. Hey moderator you better double-check if this isn't a banned member of this board.

[The Vegan Marxist]

Just as an aside, TVM, as a supporter of PFLP how do you feel about their position on libya? (http://www.revleft.org/vb/showthread.php?t=150764)

I think their position comes from two factors:

1) Due to Gaddafi's brutal response to the protesters; and

2) Gaddafi expelling them from Libya when they signed the Oslo Accord.

#2 was really just an action taken due to Libya's opposition against Israel, but I still find what he did as being a big error on his part.

In other words, I find their position understandable.

[Fungy]

Military adventure like Libya taking part in the War Against Terrorism you mean?
Obvious troll is obvious. Hey moderator you better double-check if this isn't a banned member of this board.

My, my, aren't you welcoming.

I suppose, for someone of your ilk, backing Western imperialism, while simultaneously spouting bullshit to justify it, must come easy. I just wonder you would think anyone else is fooled.

[A Revolutionary Tool]

The question is, when Tripoli is burning and US tanks are rolling down the streets, will you eat your words, or will you stick with the Trotskyites, liberal, conservatives, and bourgeois imperialists to the end?
So it's either support Qaddafi or support the U.S./Nato?U.N.? It's like being asked Germany or U.S. during WWI. How about neither?

[Os Cangaceiros]

Don't feed the troll.

[Sasha]

hey fungy, why are gadaffis sons having milions and gadaffi himself bilions of dollars on private bankacounts in taxhavens? how could they pay Beyonce and several other celebs 2 milion dollars per star too perform 45 minute private shows for them and their mates? why is gadaffi part owner of juventus fc, coincidentally the favorite team of one of his sons?
does this look like an sober diplomatic meeting an brave socialist anti-imperialist would organize or an extravagant bash the spoiled son of an plundering dictator would trow:
zD7RjXqphVk

i dont think the libyan people need "the imperialists" to plunder their oil money, it seems the current regime was doing an dandy fine job on its own.

[Rafiq]

A Libyan told me that the Libyan people said if the US tries to come and 'help' them they are going to turn their guns on the US :laugh:

[Omsk]

And that would result in a bloodshed and chaos.Lets hope that anything like that does not happen.And it would automaticly 'justify' a US 'invasion'.

[khad]

Not that I particularly care for this debate, but I find these proclamations of resistance in the event of foreign intervention ludicrous. By any normal measure, what is happening militarily in that country is insignificant. In terms of population, Libya is only slightly larger than Georgia, and as you all remember, one 1980s-era Russian division was more than adequate to overrun that country, despite Georgia possessing a relatively modern and well equipped military.

As for the Libyan military, their claim to fame is getting entire armored brigades annihilated by numerically inferior light infantry on toyota hiluxes. Libya's also a place where just a few thousand troops can make you the biggest player in the field. All together, the resistance movement only has about 8,000 troops of various affiliations scattered across the country.

With or without Gaddafi, if the West wanted Libya, they would have it. At this point Gaddafi seems like he's cooked, so I'm far more interested in seeing what the West has planned.

[Luís Henrique]

The question is, when Tripoli is burning and US tanks are rolling down the streets, will you eat your words, or will you stick with the Trotskyites, liberal, conservatives, and bourgeois imperialists to the end?

I would gladly eat my words.

If... you do the same when Gaddafy falls without any US tanks driven by American soldiers rolling through Tripoli streets.

Deal?

Luís Henrique

[Sasha]

report about the uprising and battle in benghazi that triggered this rebellion: http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/spotlight/libya/2011/03/20113175840189620.html

yup, pretty clear it was all an premeditated plan of the yanks to get their hands on the oil.

[Geiseric]

quick question, Wiki says that a "Trotskyite" is an enemy or trotsky's ideas. So when people say "Trotskyite," here are they saying pro-trotsky or anti-trotsky?

[Sinister Cultural Marxist]

Trotskyite is basically an insult, if you're a Stalinist or a Maoist. If you're not a Stalinist or a Maoist, you probably don't care either way about whether or not someone is a Trotskyist. And there are readers of Trotksy of course who take his name with pride.

[el mosquito]

I have a question? Where was the American Left when NATO was carpet-bombing Tripoli? Cheerleading Obama and Hillary I guess.