Named and shamed

[bricolage]

This group is for those who realize that solidarity with Libyan Socialism is good... We suggest to the left and workers, that they not dismiss Libyan Socialism, without learning about it first. By reading The Green Book, and by researching Libya for themselves.http://www.revleft.com/vb/group.php?groupid=165

38 members, c'mon you lot start making your excuses. How's your Libyan socialism doing?

[Widerstand]

http://www.revleft.com/vb/group.php?groupid=165

38 members, c'mon you lot start making your excuses. How's your Libyan socialism doing?

Inb4 you are an Imperialist, Zionist, US apologist, liberal, etc.

[Wanted Man]

You don't get it, comrade. Just read the Green Book and all will become clear!

Luckily, group membership on Revleft doesn't necessarily imply support for anything. Right after making this post, I quickly checked whether I was a member of the group, but thankfully I'm not! But it is a reassuring thought that surely 38 people can't be this dumb.

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

I don't get it. I'm afraid I don't know much about Libya, apart from where to find it on a map. Is this serious?

[Sentinel]

I don't get it. I'm afraid I don't know much about Libya, apart from where to find it on a map. Is this serious?If you mean the situation, check the Libya Newsfeed thread in Ongoing Struggles -- the revolution controls the second largest city and possibly also the capital by now. They've taken over weapons from the military, and some military units have defected to their side. Gaddafi may have left the country.

As for Gaddafis socialism, no, it's not serious. He is your average despot and has forgotten about his ideals long ago.

[RedSquare]

Wha? Revolution has taken over the second largest city, but I thought Ghaddafi's government was the revolution? :confused:

[scarletghoul]

As someone who joined that group i guess i should make it clear why I joined.

I do not consider Libya socialist and disagree with the group description, but joined the group as solidarity with Libya against imperialism. Most people in that group probably don't agree with the group description; we've all joined groups without necessarily agreeing with the description..

Libya has long stood up to western imperialism, and no one could deny that. I supported Gaddafi against imperialism, but support the Libyan people against Gaddafi. Previously I was curious about the Libyan political system as there is not much info available on it, and was uncertain of its nature. The response of the government to these protests has cleared up that uncertainty.

I will stay in that group though, despite not agreeing with the description of Libya as socialist, and supporting the protesters, because i hope Libya can remain an independent country.

[F9]

Right after making this post, I quickly checked whether I was a member of the group, but thankfully I'm not! But it is a reassuring thought that surely 38 people can't be this dumb.

I can assure you, we do have people that are that dumb!!

[Os Cangaceiros]

Qaddafi and his goons seem to be big fans of the ol' "power comes from the barrel of a gun" adage.

[L.A.P.]

I'm not even a member of the group but I'll admit that I was starting to lean towards viewing Gaddafi as somewhat positive although no doubt there was an incredible amount of flaws in the Libyan government. I guess my only response to this is:

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRN3DfbmaJ0brOII6xyKJ3gJvWWIZtpo 53pL2kYu2NXh7xAvRwnyg

[Os Cangaceiros]

What is the proper way to spell "Qaddafi", anyway? I've seen it spelled like 10 different ways on news reports.

[Blackscare]

What is the proper way to spell "Qaddafi", anyway? I've seen it spelled like 10 different ways on news reports.

It's the second most mispelled name after Mao Zedong/Tse Tung/ZOMGDONGS

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

It's the second most mispelled name after Mao Zedong/Tse Tung/ZOMGDONGS

I always thought it was like the various spellings of Muhammed, Mohammad, etc. A leftover from the fact that the original language doesn't share the same sounds as English.

[Princess Luna]

As someone who joined that group i guess i should make it clear why I joined.

I do not consider Libya socialist and disagree with the group description, but joined the group as solidarity with Libya against imperialism. Most people in that group probably don't agree with the group description; we've all joined groups without necessarily agreeing with the description..

Libya has long stood up to western imperialism, and no one could deny that. I supported Gaddafi against imperialism, but support the Libyan people against Gaddafi. Previously I was curious about the Libyan political system as there is not much info available on it, and was uncertain of its nature. The response of the government to these protests has cleared up that uncertainty.

I will stay in that group though, despite not agreeing with the description of Libya as socialist, and supporting the protesters, because i hope Libya can remain an independent country.
well on account of the fact Gaddafi has expressed solidarity with U.S. backed dictators like Ben Ali and Mubarak, i am going to deny he is standing up to U.S. imperialism.

[Rusty Shackleford]

i havent really looked into libya that much. all i knew was that oil revenues per person was higher than most other regional nations. better housing and such.

i havent read the green book though.

[Widerstand]

As someone who joined that group i guess i should make it clear why I joined.

I do not consider Libya socialist and disagree with the group description, but joined the group as solidarity with Libya against imperialism. Most people in that group probably don't agree with the group description; we've all joined groups without necessarily agreeing with the description..

Libya has long stood up to western imperialism, and no one could deny that. I supported Gaddafi against imperialism, but support the Libyan people against Gaddafi. Previously I was curious about the Libyan political system as there is not much info available on it, and was uncertain of its nature. The response of the government to these protests has cleared up that uncertainty.

I will stay in that group though, despite not agreeing with the description of Libya as socialist, and supporting the protesters, because i hope Libya can remain an independent country.

Some leftists will support anyone that has an "Anti-Imperialist!" bumper sticker.

[Chambered Word]

I wish I could rep/make out with the OP so badly right now...

[PhoenixAsh]

green book:



“Women, are females and men are males. According to gynecologists, women menstruate every month or so, while men, being male, do not menstruate or suffer during the monthly period.”


BRILLIANT analysis from Gadaffi

:laugh:

[Devrim]

What is the proper way to spell "Qaddafi", anyway? I've seen it spelled like 10 different ways on news reports.


I always thought it was like the various spellings of Muhammed, Mohammad, etc. A leftover from the fact that the original language doesn't share the same sounds as English.

You make it sort of sound like its Arabic's fault there.

The problem is how to write sounds from different alphabets in English, added to which Arab pronunciation changes slightly in some dialects. In English itself though, not being a phonetic language, letter can represent different sounds.*

In Turkish, which is phonetic, it is always spelt Kaddafi.

Devrim

* Contrast (homophones):

The shirt is red.

I read the book last night.

and (homonyms)

There is a tear on your face.

I will tear the paper.

[Devrim]

I supported Gaddafi against imperialism,

What does this even mean?

Devrim

[Luís Henrique]

BRILLIANT analysis from Gadaffi

:laugh:

So I guess according to this extremely sophisticated theorist, women are males up to their first period, and return to that condition after menopause.

Why are reactionaries always so fascinated with gynecological details?

Luís Henrique

[Widerstand]

Why are reactionaries* always so fascinated with gynecological details?

*Anti-Imperialist Socialists

[Luís Henrique]

*Anti-Imperialist Socialists

No, I don't think so.

Luís Henrique

[Black Sheep]

Let's hope in a few years we will be having the same discussion about the 'hands of NK' group.
Catch my drift?

[L.A.P.]

Let's hope in a few years we will be having the same discussion about the 'hands of NK' group.
Catch my drift?

Preemptive response to that; fuck Kim Jong-il, fuck North Korean government, and fuck the people who think it's a socialist state. I still joined the group because having a US-puppet dictator is even worse, plus I wouldn't support the West invading Iran to spread "democracy" when it comes down to it.

[Panda Tse Tung]

I joined cause it's interesting and Kaddaffi is the best RL-troll ever.
Plus anti-Imperialism.
Just one example of his epic trolling:
http://polit-blog.ch/media/blogs/Polit-Blog//Silvio-Berlusconi-Gaddafi.jpg
The massive picture on his chest is Libyan partizans executing Italian fascists.

[F9]

Let's hope in a few years we will be having the same discussion about the 'hands of NK' group.
Catch my drift?

we had the discussion lots of times.

[Toppler]

Let's hope in a few years we will be having the same discussion about the 'hands of NK' group.
Catch my drift?

Yeah.

And everybody who thinks "an US sponsored dictator would be worse" is fucking wrong when it comes to NK because it is one of the worst regimes in human history, compare it with South Korea.

[Chambered Word]

Yeah.

And everybody who thinks "an US sponsored dictator would be worse" is fucking wrong when it comes to NK because it is one of the worst regimes in human history, compare it with South Korea.

That's quite a long stretch. Anyway, living conditions might get better in the short term with a US invasion, but we're talking about 'worse in terms of class struggle'. Socialists should never support the subjugation of the working class by an even more powerful regime, although I'm not very good at explaining why. I'm starting to read Lenin's major work on imperialism, by the end I'm sure I will have learned a thing or two.

[Devrim]

That's quite a long stretch. Anyway, living conditions might get better in the short term with a US invasion, but we're talking about 'worse in terms of class struggle'.

Of course being massacred on behalf of their own nation state wouldn't be particularly good for the workers on North Korea. A US invasion would in no way make things better for the workers of North Korea in the short term. It would lead to massacre and the destruction of necessary infrastructure, such a clean water supplies and electricity. Iraq provides a good example.

Devrim

[Tommy4ever]

That's quite a long stretch. Anyway, living conditions might get better in the short term with a US invasion, but we're talking about 'worse in terms of class struggle'. Socialists should never support the subjugation of the working class by an even more powerful regime, although I'm not very good at explaining why. I'm starting to read Lenin's major work on imperialism, by the end I'm sure I will have learned a thing or two.

Well North Korea is not so far removed from the feudal system. So even capitalism would be a step forward for the working class of North Korea.

[StalinFanboy]

As someone who joined that group i guess i should make it clear why I joined.

I do not consider Libya socialist and disagree with the group description, but joined the group as solidarity with Libya against imperialism. Most people in that group probably don't agree with the group description; we've all joined groups without necessarily agreeing with the description..

Libya has long stood up to western imperialism, and no one could deny that. I supported Gaddafi against imperialism, but support the Libyan people against Gaddafi. Previously I was curious about the Libyan political system as there is not much info available on it, and was uncertain of its nature. The response of the government to these protests has cleared up that uncertainty.

I will stay in that group though, despite not agreeing with the description of Libya as socialist, and supporting the protesters, because i hope Libya can remain an independent country.
Good thing you did, too! They might fail if not enough people join revleft groups.

[Chambered Word]

Of course being massacred on behalf of their own nation state wouldn't be particularly good for the workers on North Korea. A US invasion would in no way make things better for the workers of North Korea in the short term. It would lead to massacre and the destruction of necessary infrastructure, such a clean water supplies and electricity. Iraq provides a good example.

Devrim

That's true, actually. Thanks Devrim.


Well North Korea is not so far removed from the feudal system. So even capitalism would be a step forward for the working class of North Korea.

How is North Korea feudal at all? If the DPRK is not capitalist or a worker's state of some kind (cue flaming and whatnot) then what is it?

[Wanted Man]

What does this even mean?

Devrim

It means the same thing as supporting Prince Charles against monarchism, supporting BP against pollution, etc. Basically it means nothing, because Gaddafi has been firmly in the imperialist camp for a long time.

I do think it's very funny that some people are turning this thread into one about supporting a US invasion of North Korea. Frankly, these people and "anti-imperialists" deserve each other.

[ʇsıɥɔɹɐuɐ ıɯɐbıɹo]

I want to say that this thread feels wrong, we're supposed to point and laugh at the Libyan Socialists group even though we in turn are laughed at by other groups as a whole; instead of picking on them, let's either ignore them or talk to them, but this thread seems kinda not leftist in spirit, laughing at our misguided comrades is funny sometimes, but this isn't funny to me.

[Tablo]

I want to say that this thread feels wrong, we're supposed to point and laugh at the Libyan Socialists group even though we in turn are laughed at by other groups as a whole; instead of picking on them, let's either ignore them or talk to them, but this thread seems kinda not leftist in spirit, laughing at our misguided comrades is funny sometimes, but this isn't funny to me.
This is kinda how revleft operates...

[Blackscare]

Well North Korea is not so far removed from the feudal system. So even capitalism would be a step forward for the working class of North Korea.

I am no apologist for north korea, but what the fuck do you mean by this?
How are they feudal?

[Dimentio]

green book:



BRILLIANT analysis from Gadaffi

:laugh:

SIZPO COMMUNISM: To give birth legally, you have must the following characteristics:

A: Has to be woman...

[bricolage]

laughing at our misguided comrades is funny sometimes, but this isn't funny to me.
that assumes they are actually comrades in the first place.

[ʇsıɥɔɹɐuɐ ıɯɐbıɹo]

This is kinda how revleft operates...

By being divisive instead of inclusive?


that assumes they are actually comrades in the first place.

They're here aren't they? I think they want to be friends.

[bricolage]

They're here aren't they?
On revleft? That doesn't really mean anything. Between most of the tendencies here there is little 'unification'. It might appear that way because they are on the same webforum yet outside of the internet it's quite different, especially when there is a history of a bunch of them massacring the rest of them.

I think they want to be friends.
I'm sure I could be friends a Stalinist I just don't have any political commonality with them.

[Tablo]

By being divisive instead of inclusive?
Yeah, pretty much.

[Chambered Word]

Maybe now more people here will start trying to view the world in terms of class conflict and not Great Men and their 'socialist' rhetoric and policies.

[mosfeld]

Im a member of this group. To those who are "name & shaming", try and remember that before this recent uprising, Libya was under constant threat from the imperialists and was even framed as one of the "Axis of Evils" or something. Compare the Mubarak toppling to Qadhafi's -- did the U.S imperialists say that they were going to sanction Egypt? No, actually, Joe Biden was being an active apologizer for the Mubarak dictatorship. I joined this group because I support Libya from an anti-imperialist standpoint, I have absolutely no sympathy for the ruling party, or Qadhafi, just like I have no sympathy for the Cuban revisionists but I believe that the U.S.-imperialists have no right to meddle in their affairs. I joined "Solidarity with Zimbabwe" and "Hands off the DPRK" for the same reasons. This does not automatically translate into support for the current regimes. Im a member of the "Palestine solidarity group", does that automatically mean I support the Zionist collaborator, capitulationist, belly-crawler club they call Fatah?

Get real :)

[ÑóẊîöʼn]

You make it sort of sound like its Arabic's fault there.

Really? I wasn't thinking in terms of assigning blame. I was thinking in terms of languages having phonemes that don't cross over too easily. Different doesn't have to mean inferior, or any other kind of value judgement.

Isn't there also a more formal kind of Arabic that Korans are traditionally written in, or am I totally off base here?


The problem is how to write sounds from different alphabets in English, added to which Arab pronunciation changes slightly in some dialects. In English itself though, not being a phonetic language, letter can represent different sounds.*

In Turkish, which is phonetic, it is always spelt Kaddafi.

Devrim

* Contrast (homophones):

The shirt is red.

I read the book last night.

and (homonyms)

There is a tear on your face.

I will tear the paper.

English is a fucking mongrel language, that's why it's pronounciation is so inconsistent.

[Devrim]

Isn't there also a more formal kind of Arabic that Korans are traditionally written in, or am I totally off base here?

The Koran was written in what is now referred to as classical Arabic. There is also a 'Modern Standard'.

Devrim

[Vladimir Innit Lenin]

I look forward to the day when the people of the DPRK and PRC stand up to their anti-worker 'dear leaders', the shitstorm on here will be fantastic.:)