Stop Scott Walker

[RGacky3]

http://www.thenation.com/blog/158522/dictator-governor-sets-out-cut-wages-slash-benefits-and-destroy-public-unions

This guy cannot get away with this, he's essencially banning unions, when you start off by taking away collective bargaining, your basically banning a union.

This has to be fought tooth and nail. If the right wing manages to get public sector unions, the US middle and working class is just deeper and deeper in the mud. Unions are the very few institutions that can actually fight on an economic level, don't let the right wing do this.

If your around Wisconsin, show up at the rallies.

[RGacky3]

http://socialistworker.org/2011/02/14/war-on-unions-in-wisconsin

This is a formative fight.

[ed miliband]

NcCZVzKXR-0

[bcbm]

big rallies today in madison... unions are coming, tea party is coming, schools are doing a walkout there is a big public hearing over the bill, then rallies afterwards with people going into the capital and making some noise, possibly other stuff going down. could be an interesting day

[RGacky3]

Anyone that can should show up, and real noise, this guy should be afraid of a recall he should be forced to back peddle so fast on this his bikes wheels fall off.

If they get the public unions in Wisconsen, a standard is being set, which will leave labor far far behind, and frankly, destroy one more hope the US has for economic recovery.

[bcbm]

i hope the national guard comes

[RGacky3]

i hope the national guard comes


Thats another thing what kind of wanna-be-dictator dickwad threatens to call out the NATIONAL GUARD against a strike? What is this ... Eygpt, Colombia?

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

He fucked up my county before the rest of the state.

[bcbm]

Thats another thing what kind of wanna-be-dictator dickwad threatens to call out the NATIONAL GUARD against a strike? What is this ... Eygpt, Colombia?

pretty american thing to do actually

[Havet]

I don't get it, why does he want to take away collective bargaining? Switzerland practically thrives with it.

I guess the reason is the same old reason: industry is too short-sighted to realize the benefits of collective-bargaining

[Bardo]

Saw this on Democracy Now! earlier.

He knows exactly what he's in for if he alerted the national guard ahead of time.

[Ele'ill]

Here's the DN! clip for reference http://www.democracynow.org/2011/2/15/wisconsin_governor_launches_attack_on_public

[Ele'ill]

So what can we do here in Portland to help out

[bcbm]

So what can we do here in Portland to help out

send us your delicious, cheap weed.

but seriously, idk call state offices here and tell them walker is an asshole? i guess there is a "sleep in" at the capitol building tonight, possibly tomorrow as well. definitely another rally during the day. call and tell walker's staff you were thinking about moving to wisconsin but hearing about all of his plans you would rather jump off the burnside bridge. (6oh8) 2six6-12one2

sounds like the turn out today was around 15,000 and we had firefighters and police (who are not being affected) out in solidarity, which is kind of cool (acab blah blah i know).

[The Fighting_Crusnik]

If Scott Walker gets his way, a lot of people that I know and a lot of people in my family as teachers will be screwed... And if he gets his way with unions and with several other things, he'll make things hellishly worse for those of us who live in Wisconsin...

[bcbm]

he's basically going to get his way unless a lot of people get behind the unions and/or they take some drastic action, because i think it is abundantly clear he doesn't care about us hanging around the capitol

[Ele'ill]

Autobots, rollout!

[bcbm]

wish they had a fax number...

[bcbm]

http://walker.wi.gov/business.asp?locid=177

pretend you're a pro-union business? lol

[Ele'ill]

Should I troll their office phones?

[bcbm]

yes please

[¿Que?]

This is giving me hope for my state. We're mobilizing against our shitty governor too. Problem is, we're in the South, so there's probably not going to be a lot of participation or publicity.

[bcbm]

meh i don't have very high expectations for this but who knows, maybe wisconsin will earn my love yet again

[Ele'ill]

I'll troll their offices with Pete Seeger's 'Solidarity Forever' playing through a megaphone

kYiKdJoSsb8

[RGacky3]

, because i think it is abundantly clear he doesn't care about us hanging around the capitol

Everyone says that, of coarse he cares. Also phone calls, letters and the such matter, I'm guessing this guy has ambitions beyond state, and when he realizes everyone hates him, maybe it will push his arm.

Nixon publically said he did'nt care about anti-vietnam protesters, but when the tapes came out we found out he really really cared and he was scared.

Anyone in Wisconsin or close go down, any one not close make a phone call, write a letter, send an email, get your friends to do the same.

Just want to say again, Wisconsin is a traditoinally progressive state, with traditionally strong unions, public unions are traditionally strong and stable unions and very much institutional.

If these Unions go, it sets a standard, American labor is just barely building back up form the destruction in the 80s and 90s, if thise guys by, they get beaten back.

[RGacky3]

BTW, California's next. My State is already in the crapper, and if a real right winger gets control (Good ol Arnold used to be a real right winger, now he's freaking Ghandi), California's public Unions and private Unions are gonna be under attack, especially if it can be done in Wisconsin.

[bcbm]

Everyone says that, of coarse he cares. Also phone calls, letters and the such matter, I'm guessing this guy has ambitions beyond state, and when he realizes everyone hates him, maybe it will push his arm.

idk i think he knows there will be a hubub over this but expects to carry out his plans and sit out the "resistance," relying on support from the general public which, for all intents and purposes, i think he has. i hope he calls in the national guard cuz that will make him look like an asshole.


Anyone in Wisconsin or close go down, any one not close make a phone call, write a letter, send an email, get your friends to do the same.

Just want to say again, Wisconsin is a traditoinally progressive state, with traditionally strong unions, public unions are traditionally strong and stable unions and very much institutional.

If these Unions go, it sets a standard, American labor is just barely building back up form the destruction in the 80s and 90s, if thise guys by, they get beaten back.

for sure. i'm down to fight, just saying i think we have to be extra creative and push hard on this shit because this guy won't just rollover

[RGacky3]

just saying i think we have to be extra creative and push hard on this shit because this guy won't just rollover

Whatever it takes.

[RGacky3]

http://www.notmywisconsin.com/

[Iraultzaile Ezkerreko]

http://socialistworker.org/2011/02/16/workers-draw-line-wisconsin

Good article on the 20,000 strong protest against Gov. Walker.

[Proukunin]

Autobots, rollout!

HAHA! yes indeed.

[Bud Struggle]

Did this guy campaign on this point? If he did--then it's the will of the people. If he didn't then everyone has a right to protest.

http://politifact.com/wisconsin/article/2011/jan/01/look-scott-walkers-campaign-promises/

It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.

[¿Que?]

Did this guy campaign on this point? If he did--then it's the will of the people. If he didn't then everyone has a right to protest.
No Bud, regardless of whether he campaigned on it or not, the people should be allowed to recall any government official whenever they please, for whatever reason.


http://politifact.com/wisconsin/article/2011/jan/01/look-scott-walkers-campaign-promises/

It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.
He was also elected not to do things, like screw over the working class.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

I was right outside the door to Scott Walker's office chanting.

[Ele'ill]

Did this guy campaign on this point? If he did--then it's the will of the people. If he didn't then everyone has a right to protest.

http://politifact.com/wisconsin/article/2011/jan/01/look-scott-walkers-campaign-promises/

It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.

http://www.democracynow.org/2011/2/15/wisconsin_governor_launches_attack_on_public

He did not propose public sector ruination as a solution.

[Bud Struggle]

No Bud, regardless of whether he campaigned on it or not, the people should be allowed to recall any government official whenever they please, for whatever reason. I certainly agree to that. The people should also be allowed to change the rules of engagement with the municipal workers if they wish to do that, too. The question is is the Governor doing the will of the people?


He was also elected not to do things, like screw over the working class. Lets see how far he gets.

[RGacky3]

Did this guy campaign on this point? If he did--then it's the will of the people.

Show me where it was the will of the people to cut teachers pensions, strip unions of their rights to be unions, and lay off more teachers. (Check your links first)

What's wrong with you.



It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.


This has NOTHING to do with the budget, the money he'd be saving from this is minimal, and could be saved just be restructuring the budget, even if it was, there are other ways to do it other than screwing over teachers.

Also don't give me this will of the people shit, many things were the will of the people that you did'nt support nor did the Obama aministration put into policy.

This is blatently tyrannical, and violating basic human rights.

YOu are so blindly pro-establishment its amazing. You try and give the guy calling out national guard to stop labor protestors, and trying to strip peoples right to bargain collectivly, the benefit of the doubt, by saying "Oh maybe thats what people voted for."


The people should also be allowed to change the rules of engagement with the municipal workers if they wish to do that, too. The question is is the Governor doing the will of the people?


WHen were you calling for Obama to do the will of the people? Oh right, never.

ALso no they should'nt be allowed to STRIP PEOPLES RIGHTS TO COLLECTIVLY BARGAIN, that is a basic human right.


Lets see how far he gets.

Knowing you, if he wins you'd probably smile and pat yourself on the back, just because "hehe, labor lost" even thought teachers lost their jobs, their pensions are cut, and your kids (well not your kids but other peoples kids) have to go to crappier and crappier schools and we loose teachers, so your kids grow up in a country with more crime, more poverty, less human rights, more desperation, more ignorance.

[bcbm]

i don't recall the exact numbers, but walker's victory wasn't a landslide by any means so i don't think he has any sort of mandate to trash the unions. he talks about making wisconsin business friendly, but he already ruined high speed rail which would've brought money and jobs into the state. his plan for "business friendly" basically seems to be handing out appointments to his friends, increasing his power (fighting for more appointed positions), destroying unions and making wi a "right to work" state and trying to steal jobs from illinois. fuck this guy

sounded like the rally today was good i didn't make it, schools closed because of excessive teacher absence, there is another rally planned tomorrow and there is currently a sleep-in happening at the capitol building that has a lot of people.

[RGacky3]

BTW, this is'nt even just being team-America, its just being stupidly anti-left.

[bcbm]

labor activists strategize for 'class war' (http://host.madison.com/ct/news/local/grassroots/article_b8243b38-398f-11e0-a7bd-001cc4c03286.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+StatelineorgRss-Wisconsin+%28Stateline.org+RSS+-+Wisconsin%29)

[KC]

idk i think he knows there will be a hubub over this but expects to carry out his plans and sit out the "resistance," relying on support from the general public which, for all intents and purposes, i think he has. i hope he calls in the national guard cuz that will make him look like an asshole.

Well he just beat out Feingold for his seat, which was a pretty big victory, so I think he was fully expecting this union outrage when he made all this public.

He's hoping that the unions, despite being large in numbers and economic power, are relatively-to-very isolated from the rest of Wisconsin voters. He's basically banking on the fact that all the hate speech directed at unions over the past couple decades about how they're leeching off taxpayers with their huge pensions and whatnot will ensure that the unions are isolated enough from his broad support base where he can take them on without worrying about his governership being threatened.

And yeah, I think he has the support, as well. Wisconsin might be traditionally progressive, and unions here might be stronger than in the rest of the country, but that doesn't matter if his support base holds firm. I have a feeling this is going to be much uglier than most people think.


Did this guy campaign on this point? If he did--then it's the will of the people. If he didn't then everyone has a right to protest.

http://politifact.com/wisconsin/arti...aign-promises/ (http://www.anonym.to/?http://politifact.com/wisconsin/article/2011/jan/01/look-scott-walkers-campaign-promises/)

It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.He was elected because of people's dissatisfaction with the Obama administration, which pushed Feingold's approval rating down, and also because the population in the US is for the most part wavering between left and right. The Wisconsin electorate swung right just around election time, which was lucky for Walker.


he talks about making wisconsin business friendly, but he already ruined high speed rail which would've brought money and jobs into the state.

He doesn't want government funding. He's one of those weirdo libertarians that wants to promote business but not with government funding.


his plan for "business friendly" basically seems to be handing out appointments to his friends, increasing his power (fighting for more appointed positions), destroying unions and making wi a "right to work" state and trying to steal jobs from illinois.Don't forget the $250,000 cap on workers comp cases.

[bcbm]

Well he just beat out Feingold for his seat

walker is governor

[KC]

walker is governor

Congratulations you've won! Click here to claim your prize!

[bcbm]

then how did walker beat out feingold for his seat?

[bcbm]

student walkout tomorrow at 10 am

[KC]

then how did walker beat out feingold for his seat?

By not getting enough sleep at night, you fucking asshole

[bcbm]

oh ok:thumbup:

[RGacky3]

By not getting enough sleep at night, you fucking asshole

and millions and millions and milions of dollars, and the repubican machine having their eye on fiengold for a long time. (Fiengold was, with Sanders the smartest in the Senate).


I have a feeling this is going to be much uglier than most people think.


Well I hope he either cancels his anti-union plans, or it gets really damn ugly, if he does'nt back down, then it should get ugly.


and also because the population in the US is for the most part wavering between left and right.

Its not that the US shifts right and left, its because at certain times voters just don't show up, last electoin progressives were done with democrats, and non political people, who are generally more progressive don'nt vote.


He's one of those weirdo libertarians that wants to promote business but not with government funding.


Don't hold your breath on that, watch him give out tax credits and government contracts. The only real honest libertarian is Ron Paul, the other guys, well ...

[RGacky3]

http://budget.wispolitics.com/2011/02/schultz-wanggaard-proposing-changes-to.html

2 GOP legislaters switch sides, this stuff works, you gotta fight hard, but it has an effect. keep it up everyone.

[Ele'ill]

Oh holy smokes, I just got off work and want to stay up to see what happens with this- I assume there isn't a result yet, will we know by noon because that's about all I got left in me after this overnighter.

[Bud Struggle]

Well if Walker pulls this off it will be open hunting season on all government unions all acroos the country. I'm sure our just elected Conservative governor here in Florida Rick Scott is taking notes.

It will be interesting to see the outcome.

[RGacky3]

If Walker Pulls this off, and it does'nt create a major backlash politically to the point to where walker is out. Watch the US economy slump even lower, watch it last longer and get progressively worse, public unions help support private unions, also education cuts are gonna have long term negative effects, and unions braking will also have short term negative effects on demand (other than the blatent class war).

Its time for the working class to step up the class war.

[Bud Struggle]

If Walker Pulls this off, and it does'nt create a major backlash politically to the point to where walker is out. Watch the US economy slump even lower, watch it last longer and get progressively worse, public unions help support private unions, also education cuts are gonna have long term negative effects, and unions braking will also have short term negative effects on demand (other than the blatent class war). The problem is that unions aren't a major player in American public life anymore. The few unions that are out there are for the most part bloated and breaucratic as any corporation, The National Teacher's Union for example. The teacher's that's I've talked to seem to feel is is just something out there that collects money from their paycheck. The reason the unions are in the state they are in is because of their own failures--and yes the corporations took advantage, but the unions put themselves in the position they are in.


Its time for the working class to step up the class war.Well, Ok.

[RGacky3]

The teacher's that's I've talked to seem to feel is is just something out there that collects money from their paycheck.

I wonder what teachers your talking too .... Because in wisconsin it sounds like the union is getting major support, beause the teachers I talk to, like having pensions, decent pay, and sick pay.


and yes the corporations took advantage, but the unions put themselves in the position they are in.


Only because they followed people like yours advice, i.e. trying to cooperate and compromise with buisiness instead of fighting back.

Really its labor laws being ignored by the state.


Well, Ok.

If your fine with your country going down the toilet, the fine.

[Bud Struggle]

I wonder what teachers your talking too .... Because in wisconsin it sounds like the union is getting major support, beause the teachers I talk to, like having pensions, decent pay, and sick pay. True--I've onlt talked to a few people. But I always do make the point of asking.


Only because they followed people like yours advice, i.e. trying to cooperate and compromise with buisiness instead of fighting back.

Really its labor laws being ignored by the state. You'd be suprised how few unions aqctually ask my advice. ;)


If your fine with your country going down the toilet, the fine. Now that's over the top. The country had some problems--America always has some problems, but it keeps comming back. I have no doubt it won't come back quite nicely again.

[bcbm]

democrats showed they have a spine for once and didn't show at the assembly and have left madison, forcing republicans to "call of the house" (get the police to find them) and adjourn because they didn't have enough senators to vote. protests continue, occupation of capitol planned through next week

http://www.50states.com/flag/image/nunst081.gif
forward!

[RGacky3]

You'd be suprised how few unions aqctually ask my advice. ;)


Bud they did do, what you've been suggesting unions do now, and it was a disaster.


Now that's over the top. The country had some problems--America always has some problems, but it keeps comming back. I have no doubt it won't come back quite nicely again.

If you don't see this disaster as absolutely unique and much more serious and systemic than past disasters your just not paying attention.

[Metacomet]

Not much to say, but props to the brothers and sisters in Wisconsin. If I was in the midwest I'd go camping with them.

[Os Cangaceiros]

democrats showed they have a spine for once and didn't show at the assembly and have left madison, forcing republicans to "call of the house" (get the police to find them) and adjourn because they didn't have enough senators to vote. protests continue,

Ha, fugitive Democrats on the lam. That's awesome.

[Ele'ill]

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2011/02/406241.shtml

http://www.fightbacknews.org/2011/2/17/call-act-support-wisconsin-workers-and-students

If anybody has any further info let me know

[KC]

BTW, this is a really big deal. There is a reason that this is getting global attention. This is a very crucial fight in the class struggle, not only in Wisconsin but in the entire country. Wisconsin is one of the most strongly organized union states in the country, with a rich labor history. Dismantling the unions here will send a wave of attacks on workers' rights throughout the entire country on a level that we have not seen in decades.

[Ele'ill]

BTW, this is a really big deal. There is a reason that this is getting global attention. This is a very crucial fight in the class struggle, not only in Wisconsin but in the entire country. Wisconsin is one of the most strongly organized union states in the country, with a rich labor history. Dismantling the unions here will send a wave of attacks on workers' rights throughout the entire country on a level that we have not seen in decades.


I do not know where you live but if you live in the United States you need to be on the phone with your local labor chapters/coalitions and pushing for them to engage in everything from defensive/offensive planning to solidarity actions/marches- you are absolutely correct when you say this isn't a WI thing.

[KC]

I live in WI. I'm going up to the capitol tomorrow after work to shoot some photos.

[Ele'ill]

I live in WI. I'm going up to the capitol tomorrow after work to shoot some photos.

Be revleft's independent journalist- I'm looking forward to a report back.

[¿Que?]

I do not know where you live but if you live in the United States you need to be on the phone with your local labor chapters/coalitions and pushing for them to engage in everything from defensive/offensive planning to solidarity actions/marches- you are absolutely correct when you say this isn't a WI thing.
I was going to email someone I know somewhat high up in the ranks of our state union, but I thought that maybe I should wait a little while and see if they want to make an official statement. No need to chatter up the internet. Or what would you suggest?

[Ele'ill]

I was going to email someone I know somewhat high up in the ranks of our state union, but I thought that maybe I should wait a little while and see if they want to make an official statement. No need to chatter up the internet. Or what would you suggest?


Do it. Twice. Those 'high-ups' or experienced labor activists better feel encouragement from phone calls and emails on such topics otherwise they have no business being there.

Make noise.

[RGacky3]

Or what would you suggest?

I suggest you write a letter, and make a phone call, If you are union get your rep, like Mariel said get the local chapter, write a letter make a phone call (they open the letters, its more likely to get looked at), if your not union call the local public union, or a local AFL-CIO or Change to win chapter.

Get you Senator and congressman, get your govener, state representative.

Make eveyone hate Scott Walkter.

(Ps any one seen that sign of Scott from south park saying "Scott, he's a dick"? Made me chuckle)

[RGacky3]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/17/dnc-expands-mobilization-protests-ohio-indiana_n_824743.html

Look at that the DNC wants to latch on to this, as if they've ever cared about unions, where was the DNC with card check? Where were they defending unions from union busting? where were they fighting "fight to work" laws? Where were they doing anything for unions in the last 20 years? Where were they fighting the public sector pay freeze? Where were they fighting for ANYTHING for workers?

Now they want to latch on to this as if they are for the workers, pathetic.

The Wisconsin democrats hiding to stop the vote, good for them, there are some REAL progressives.

[Ele'ill]

Fuck that shit- no co-opt of struggle here. We'll be burning your applications at the door.

[Ele'ill]

Alright, Wisconsin solidarity update from Oregon- nothing definite but dialogue nonetheless. Marches to be held Monday in Salem Oregon on the capitol steps for OEA public education rally with encouragement to wear red, bring pro-labor banners, signs and to stand in solidarity with Wisconsin Public Sector workers. http://www.oregoned.org/site/pp.asp?c=9dKKKYMDH&b=123024

[RGacky3]

For those of you that are there, I've heard there are a small group of Americans for prosperity clowns trying to make a counter protest, any news on that?

[¿Que?]

Alright, Wisconsin solidarity update from Oregon- nothing definite but dialogue nonetheless. Marches to be held Monday in Salem Oregon on the capitol steps for OEA public education rally with encouragement to wear red, bring pro-labor banners, signs and to stand in solidarity with Wisconsin Public Sector workers. http://www.oregoned.org/site/pp.asp?c=9dKKKYMDH&b=123024
I went to an activism conference on Saturday, and I was thoroughly disappointed by the lack of enthusiasm concerning Wisconsin events. It got a mention, and so did Egypt, but there was no sense of urgency to take advantage of the moment. I suppose there really isn't much of a base to mobilize around this issue, seeing as my state tends to be anti-union, but there are a lot of yuppie liberals and apolitical discontents that could be mobilized if only someone knew how to get to them. I'd bet in my state (particularly in the capitol), there are a lot more people sitting around, wishing for a mass mobilization like Wisconsin than people realize.

[RGacky3]

80,000 yesterday ... Get it wisconsin, The Packers also side with the workers.

[ComradeMan]

Do public sector workers ever go on strike in solidarity of private sector workers? Private sector workers with shit contracts and no powerful unions to back them up? I don't know about in the US but here there are a lot of public sector workers who sit on their asses and do nothing knowing fully that they cannot be dismissed unless they do something totally crazy and in the meantime doing their jobs as badly and to the minimum effort required for not such a bad salary.

[RGacky3]

you don't know what your talking about Comrademan, if you want me to explain the history of the American labor movement and the attack on it I will, but stuff does'nt just happen, building movements is very very difficult.

As far as public sector workers, yeah, the work less, for more, thats the way its SUPPOSED TO BE, juts because private sector workers have it bad does'nt mean public sector workers should too, both should have it good.

BTW, with education public sector workers get less pay.

[ComradeMan]

you don't know what your talking about Comrademan, if you want me to explain the history of the American labor movement and the attack on it I will, but stuff does'nt just happen, building movements is very very difficult.

As far as public sector workers, yeah, the work less, for more, thats the way its SUPPOSED TO BE, juts because private sector workers have it bad does'nt mean public sector workers should too, both should have it good.

BTW, with education public sector workers get less pay.

Well I do know what I am talking about and where I don't know I state, quote "I don't know about the US but here...." - so what are you talking about?

Now, when was the last time public sector workers went on strike in solidarity of the private sector workers losing their jobs- afterall, private sector workers often have a much shittier deal.

[RGacky3]

Now, when was the last time public sector workers went on strike in solidarity of the private sector workers losing their jobs- afterall, private sector workers often have a much shittier deal.

It happens. However keep in mind that public sector unions are a very different animal than private sector unions.

[ComradeMan]

It happens. However keep in mind that public sector unions are a very different animal than private sector unions.

It happens.

When? Where? Source?
;)

As far as private sector unions go, they are a waste of time in my opinion and do nothing. Also, a lot of private sector workers aren't even unionised.

[RGacky3]

It happens.

When? Where? Source?


I'll look it up for you if you state here that you absoltely believe that it does not happen, and the apologise if I prove you wrong deal?


As far as private sector unions go, they are a waste of time in my opinion and do nothing. Also, a lot of private sector workers aren't even unionised.

Well if thats your opinion good luck, btw, enjoy your weekends, and evenings off from work, also enjoy pretty much all working class advances that europe has.

Unions are the only democratic force in the economy. So if you think thats a waste of time, good luck with whatever you think is NOT a waste of time, voting in liberals I'm guessing.

[Ele'ill]

If I'm not mistaken- there are efforts right now in Wisconsin to divide the public and private sector workers because a united front like that would be a huge threat to the ruling class- unionized or not.

[Ele'ill]

Ohio- don't remember if you all posted this or were talking about it

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/02/18/ohios-turn-to-revolt-thousands-flood-statehouse-over-anti-union-bill/

[ComradeMan]

I'll look it up for you if you state here that you absoltely believe that it does not happen, and the apologise if I prove you wrong deal?



Well if thats your opinion good luck, btw, enjoy your weekends, and evenings off from work, also enjoy pretty much all working class advances that europe has.

Unions are the only democratic force in the economy. So if you think thats a waste of time, good luck with whatever you think is NOT a waste of time, voting in liberals I'm guessing.

Like the Unions did the FIAT workers a lot of good.

Unions are lobbies, but at the end of the day they don't control capital.

[bcbm]

For those of you that are there, I've heard there are a small group of Americans for prosperity clowns trying to make a counter protest, any news on that?

they claimed they would have 60k and outnumber the anti-walker folks. bussing people in from across the state and possibly out of state, they had maybe 1-2k at most, maybe not even that. it was a joke.

all the news media predictably reported the total number of protesters, which was around 50k at any given time, not mentioning the pro-walker people were seriously outnumbered.

[RGacky3]

This is a hard thing for the Americans for prosperity people to rally their lemmings around.


Like the Unions did the FIAT workers a lot of good.

Unions are lobbies, but at the end of the day they don't control capital.

Without a union the fiat workers would have been screwed a long long time ago, and would have been far more screwed than they are right now.

BTW, whats your alternative ....?

[RGacky3]

Egypt stands with Wisconsin (http://socialistworker.org/2011/02/22/egypt-stands-with-wisconsin).

Workers of the world Unite! :)

[Bud Struggle]

And this entire protest is being televised by American media. If they were really just shills for the Republicans--you would have thought they would keep t it quiet.

[RGacky3]

Its pretty hard to not televise almost 100,000 people. It takes 1000 corporate funded tea-partiers and 80,000 Progressives.

I hav'nt seen this much on Amreican TV, but I'm pretty sure its framed in a certain way.

[Bud Struggle]

Its pretty hard to not televise almost 100,000 people. It takes 1000 corporate funded tea-partiers and 80,000 Progressives.

I hav'nt seen this much on Amreican TV, but I'm pretty sure its framed in a certain way.

American media was responsible for getting the word out about the demonstrations. It's been all over the place.

[RGacky3]

American media was responsible for getting the word out about the demonstrations.

The demonstrations happened before the media reported it.

[Bud Struggle]

The demonstrations happened before the media reported it.

Sure but demonstrations happen all over the place for all sorts of reasons but this was an interesting topic and the media played it up and brought it world wide.

[RGacky3]

Sure but demonstrations happen all over the place for all sorts of reasons but this was an interesting topic and the media played it up and brought it world wide.

Are you trying to give the news media credit, for reporting GIANT news?

[Bud Struggle]

Are you trying to give the news media credit, for reporting GIANT news?

I'm saying it's a lot more even handed than you give it credit for being.

[ComradeMan]

The demonstrations happened before the media reported it.

Well the media couldn't report the demonstrations before they happened, could they? :lol: I think you'll find the media report most events after they happen- unless someone invents some kind of time-machine for news corporations.:rolleyes:

[RGacky3]

I'm saying it's a lot more even handed than you give it credit for being.

No, its not, it would be even handed if the covered the protests on wall street over the last 2 years that were just as big as the tea-party protests the media has had a hard on for over the last 2 years.

It would be even handed of the covered them based on the facts, rather than a corporate narrative.

[RGacky3]

yhuxjF_F26c

"America is going to be community organized no more."

"If your movement is so sacred why are anarchists central too it."

"We are the modern day peace movement, thats where the anarchists are."

This is the pathetic little counter-protest, the Koch and Walton brothers are laughing in their yacts right now at the tea partiers.

From Sam Sedar "there were more free pizzas sent over from the middle east to the pro-union protesters than there were tea partiers."

Which is true, people in solidarity from the middle east have ordered pizza for the protesters.

[RGacky3]

I wonder if any of the tea partiers are thinking in their heads "wait a minute, anarchists are for total freedom ... we are for freedom .... but the anarchists support the unions, and we support the Koch Brothers ..... Maybe we should re-think our position."

I wonder, but I seriously doubt it, considering they have about 2 brain cells between all of them, one consisting of an image of the American flag, another that stores the narrative of the day from Freedomworks and Americans for prosperity.

[RGacky3]

BTW, if you can't be there, order them a pizza.

Info : Ian's Pizza state
115, state street, Madison, WI
Phone : 608-257-9248
Website : http://www.IansPizza.com

EVERYONE should do this, revleft Pizza drive for everyone that can't be there.

[RGacky3]

From http://www.ianspizza.com/



Monday, February 21 (12:15pm)
Thank you all so much for visiting!
If you are here to learn how help feed the protesters in Madison, here's how you can do that:
Call us at 608-257-9248, then press 1. As we have just three phone lines it may take a while to get through, and we apologize in advance for that.
For online ordering we have partnered with both badgerbites.com and campusfood.com to process our online orders. If you would like to order online, please put 115 State Street as the delivery address, and add in the notes that you would like to help feed the protesters.
While we thought about it, we will not be setting up a Paypal account, even though we realize that would make it easier. Please understand it's not because we don't want to help you out; we really just don't want to over-promise & under-deliver.
It's important to us as a business and as individuals that if we say we are taking your hard-earned money to help feed supporters, that we will make sure that happens. By taking phone calls and online orders only we can ensure that the money you spend with us does indeed get made into pizza that goes to the capital.
We truly appreciate all the enthusiasm, and know that many of you want to help feed the protesters, but we are also just one small business. Believe us when we say we are not really accustomed to getting pizza orders from the entire country (let alone internationally!)
Thank you for your understanding!


Common people.

[RGacky3]

http://www.badgerbites.com/Welcome.do

Good way to do it out of country.

[RGacky3]

General strike might happen.

If a General strike happens, this is history. General strikes are the begining of revolutions.

(I don't mean storming the gates 1917 style blablabla, I mean fundemental change in the power structures of America).

[Ele'ill]

Posted this in the other thread too-

http://news.infoshop.org/article.php?story=20110222195

[RGacky3]

Thats the one problem with being restricted, when shit goes down, I can't discuss it with the serious people, I get some of them here, then a lot of Budstruggles and comrademen who just clown around.

[Ele'ill]

You can view the other thread- if you like what some people are saying pm them and invite them to discuss things in this thread too- I know it isn't the same but I think quite a few good posters would be willing to do this.

[RGacky3]

4_8qrlyZKx4

Our funkiest wobbly out there out there.

[¿Que?]

JN-2H5TcOM

Our funkiest wobbly out there out there.
Hey Gack, can you fix that link, I think it's messed up. The video doesn't load for me...

[bcbm]

things got hairy today

http://o.aolcdn.com/photo-hub/news_gallery/7/0/706755/1298501748404.JPEG

[RGacky3]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/24/wisconsin-assembly-deal-vote_n_827530.html

[Ele'ill]

Make total destroy- then copy paste.

[#FF0000]

4_8qrlyZKx4

Our funkiest wobbly out there out there.

this is beautiful and i love being alive right now.

[Ele'ill]

this is beautiful and i love being alive right now.

We don't need celebrities to give validity to our movement. :cool:

[gorillafuck]

It seems he promised to lower the government budget by 3 billion. This might be the way he proposes to di it.

He was elected to a do a particular job.Class struggle isn't about adhering to elected officials on the basis that they were elected.


Sure but demonstrations happen all over the place for all sorts of reasons but this was an interesting topic and the media played it up and brought it world wide.If you think that the media plays up left demonstrations then you're just straight up wrong. Because the media almost never covers strikes or anti-foreclosure demonstrations. This isn't an example of leftist mainstream media. It's an example of hard-to-ignore.

I mean that's like saying the US has substantial anti-war mainstream media because the media tried to save face by turning against their previously unconditional support for the vietnam war.

[Bud Struggle]

Class struggle isn't about adhering to elected officials on the basis that they were elected.

Is this class struggle? Who is the Bourgeoise? THe people of Wisconsin? They employ these workers. And the Governor is their representitive. They elected him. Yea, he's an ass and yea, he's corrupt but he is their representitive.


If you think that the media plays up left demonstrations then you're just straight up wrong. Because the media almost never covers strikes or anti-foreclosure demonstrations. This isn't an example of leftist mainstream media. It's an example of hard-to-ignore.

This is a case of straight up sexy news. Union strikes are complicated and dull for most people. A union striking against some company is an ingrown business dispute It just isn't "news." This is interesting--it has broad national implications. Wlaker is trying to change the course of how business is done on state level.

It's NEWS--and so it's reported.

[Ele'ill]

Is this class struggle? Who is the Bourgeoise? THe people of Wisconsin? They employ these workers.

What?



And the Governor is their representitive. They elected him. Yea, he's an ass and yea, he's corrupt but he is their representitive.

And now they learned a lesson and are more radical in the right direction.

[#FF0000]

Is this class struggle? Who is the Bourgeoise? THe people of Wisconsin? They employ these workers. And the Governor is their representitive. They elected him. Yea, he's an ass and yea, he's corrupt but he is their representitive.

The problem here is that you are making the mistake of thinking that governments -- any government today -- actually represents "the people".

[RGacky3]

Is this class struggle? Who is the Bourgeoise? THe people of Wisconsin? They employ these workers. And the Governor is their representitive. They elected him. Yea, he's an ass and yea, he's corrupt but he is their representitive.

haters gonna hate.

You did'nt say that with the tea party did you.


We don't need celebrities to give validity to our movement. :cool:

No, but its still nice.

[Bud Struggle]

The problem here is that you are making the mistake of thinking that governments -- any government today -- actually represents "the people".

I definitely think some more than others. Gadaffi at the low end. But I think the US is pretty good. My same old speech: you can change things in America if you can sell you ideas to enough people and get them enthused about what you propose.

You can do it with elections or with Revolution. Both will work equally well and both have equally as much chance to happen.

[Bud Struggle]

haters gonna hate.

You did'nt say that with the tea party did you.

I'm no fan of the Tea Party's politics. I don't think I ever said anything supporting them. I do admire their organizational abilities and their ability to move and inspire people to work and vote for them.

[RGacky3]

You said "see .... look America is conservative ... see look."

I'm not saying this proves that the US is progressive (protests are a bad judge of that as are elections).

But your reasoning is bullshit, thats what democracy is about, if the people don't like it they get it undone. THe people did'nt vote to undo collective bargaining, the Koch Brothers and other billionaires paid for that.


You can do it with elections or with Revolution. Both will work equally well and both have equally as much chance to happen.

Elections are the most innefficient way to do it, why would we want to play the Capitalists in an insitution they already have controlled and made the rules for.

[RGacky3]

BTW Bud this is what you always are saying "if Americans wanted something they should get out there and do it." Well here its happening, and its actually Americans (not corporate astroturf), why don't you support them and buy them a freaking pizza.

[Ele'ill]

Bud Struggle, why are you not replying to my posts. Do you hate me?

Alex Jones moves people too. Do you believe in reptile people serving the Illuminati?

[Bud Struggle]

BTW Bud this is what you always are saying "if Americans wanted something they should get out there and do it." Well here its happening, and its actually Americans (not corporate astroturf), why don't you support them and buy them a freaking pizza.

You are right there. I will.

Actually I'll buy 10.

[Bud Struggle]

And now they learned a lesson and are more radical in the right direction.

Let's see where the next election takes us. But I DO support these protesters. This is what political action should look like.

[Ele'ill]

Let's see where the next election takes us. But I DO support these protesters. This is what political action should look like.

No, Yes, No party politics. The dems do no better. No coop of struggle here.

[Bud Struggle]

No, Yes, No party politics. The dems do no better. No coop of struggle here.

I agree that is SHOULDN'T be but I think the Dems are going to try to be the heros here.

[Ele'ill]

I agree that is SHOULDN'T be but I think the Dems are going to try to be the heros here.

Ah yes, they are trying but only those at the top of other hierarchies are buying it and trying to roll over half-fight as success. The dems are basically saying 'we'll pump money into this and give you call centers and buses and money and time for you to except a different loss, sound good?'

Fight to win.

[bcbm]

They employ these workers. And the Governor is their representitive. They elected him. Yea, he's an ass and yea, he's corrupt but he is their representitive.

every public opinion poll has come down with the majority opposing walker's plan to eliminate collective bargaining. a "representative" would listen to the people, not push through plans to help his business buddies, don't you think?

[Bud Struggle]

Ah yes, they are trying but only those at the top of other hierarchies are buying it and trying to roll over half-fight as success. The dems are basically saying 'we'll pump money into this and give you call centers and buses and money and time for you to except a different loss, sound good?'

Fight to win.

I agree. Fight to win. The Capitalists certainly do. Maybe it's time the Proletariat gives it a try.

[RGacky3]

You are right there. I will.

Actually I'll buy 10.

I tip my hat.

[Bud Struggle]

every public opinion poll has come down with the majority opposing walker's plan to eliminate collective bargaining. a "representative" would listen to the people, not push through plans to help his business buddies, don't you think?

This is where a Soviet would come in handy, don't you think?

[RGacky3]

I agree. Fight to win. The Capitalists certainly do. Maybe it's time the Proletariat gives it a try.

I absolutely agree, but one thing you gotta realize, the logistics are way stacked against them.

The Koch brothers and Walton Family need to just spend a couple bucks, hire a union busting firm, call up a poletition and spend money on a PAC.

Workers need to organize, on their free time (which is few and far between), and take drastic action which threatens everything they still have.

So when it happens, its amazing.

But even though the stacks are majorly against them, when it actually comes together, its a major force and they can make history and change power structures.

[Ele'ill]

I agree. Fight to win. The Capitalists certainly do. Maybe it's time the Proletariat gives it a try.

Capitalists need cheat codes- we don't. :cool:

[Bud Struggle]

I tip my hat.

Well thanks, but you are right. This IS what power looks like and if people don't want collective barganing removed they should get out there and tell the government what they want.

This is exactly the thing people should be doing.

[bcbm]

its... exactly what they are doing?

[Bud Struggle]

its... exactly what they are doing?

Eating pizza and starting a Revolution. Not necissarily in that order.

[Ele'ill]

Someone's jealous :rolleyes:

[Bud Struggle]

Someone's jealous :rolleyes:

About the pizza? Definitely. :)

[#FF0000]

You are right there. I will.

Actually I'll buy 10.

Bud Struggle: Doin' It Big

[Bud Struggle]

Bud Struggle: Doin' It Big

Yea. And 20"ers too. WITH TOPPINGS. :)

[Edit] I forgot to mention--I sent them courtesy of the "Golden Che of RevLeft.com."

[Ele'ill]

Yea. And 20"ers too. WITH TOPPINGS. :)

Since I'm going to a solidarity rally I think it's grounds for you to buy me food and alcohol and also pay off any debt I have as well as rent into the foreseeable future.

[RGacky3]

Kknr-advKkg

Right hand over your heart Bud :)

[bcbm]

how a bunch of pro-union, anti-republican protesters turned the hallways of the wisconsin state house into a commune (http://www.slate.com/id/2286418/)

wisconsin protesters turn capitol into the world’s largest commune (http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/article.php?article=32479)

police association urges members to sleep at capitol (http://www.wausaudailyherald.com/article/20110225/WDH0101/110225083/-Police-assoc-urges-members-to-sleep-at-Capitol)

[RGacky3]

incredible.

[#FF0000]

how a bunch of pro-union, anti-republican protesters turned the hallways of the wisconsin state house into a commune (http://www.slate.com/id/2286418/)

wisconsin protesters turn capitol into the world’s largest commune (http://www.thedailypage.com/daily/article.php?article=32479)

police association urges members to sleep at capitol (http://www.wausaudailyherald.com/article/20110225/WDH0101/110225083/-Police-assoc-urges-members-to-sleep-at-Capitol)

Welp, that settles it. I'm taking a bus to the demo in Philly tomorrow.

[Ele'ill]

Was at the demo, rally, march here- fantastic turn out on short notice.

At a rally organized in two days, about 850 people came together to stand in solidarity with public employees in Wisconsin and across the country

http://portland.indymedia.org/en/2011/02/406571.shtml

[B5C]

Do You Hear the People Sing?

uNsnbLqgLK0

[RGacky3]

Over 100,000 people larger than ANY TEA PARTY RALLY EVER, and its just one state.

I've been saying all along, the tea party is way over hyped and most Americans are progressive (even thought most americans are less active than tea partiers, because they are under retirement age and have shit to do).

[Bud Struggle]

I heard that now that they've abolished collective bargening--they are not going to implement it. I heard it on NPR--but I can't find anything on google.

[Dimentio]

Whatever you do, don't assassinate him.

Assassinated politicians turn into martyrs, no matter how deplorable they are.

Moreover, only those politicians which are less of douchebags get murdered...