National Union of Students Leader chased out of protest, UK

[The Idler]

Aaron Porter was chased away from the young peoples protest organised by trade unions in Manchester, UK today. Other reports suggesting anti-semitic chants are unverified.

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

Heh. Take that boring liberal douchebag.

[TheGeekySocialist]

anti semetism is unaceptable

Aaron Porter is a useless NUS president nonetheless, he needs to be kicked out and replaced with someone who will support the student movement.

[El Rojo]

@ Geeky Socialist: im fairly confident we can say the reports of Porter being heckled with racist abuse "fucking tory jew" were "fucking tory too". come on guys, its the torygraph for fucks sake.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/8290571/Student-leader-Aaron-Porter-barracked-with-anti-Semitic-insults.html


that was a massive result. although some of my conrades we divided on the sucess of the unpermitted march, take a look at the helo coverage and commentary. the guy is bricking himself so much about students "walking through" police lines. hes talking us up like we're special forces or some shit.

i think it means that he is terrified :D

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/8290571/Student-leader-Aaron-Porter-barracked-with-anti-Semitic-insults.html

[Stranger Than Paradise]

anti semetism is unaceptable

Aaron Porter is a useless NUS president nonetheless, he needs to be kicked out and replaced with someone who will support the student movement.

Students essentially need to abandon the NUS altogether and control their own struggle. Replacing one bureaucrat who doesn't say the right things with one who does say the right things will not change anything.

[TheGeekySocialist]

Students essentially need to abandon the NUS altogether and control their own struggle. Replacing one bureaucrat who doesn't say the right things with one who does say the right things will not change anything.

had this debate the other day, lol

anyway, my view is that the NUS can be useful, but only with democratic reforms and with a strong leader who backs students struggles, which includes calling more protests, backing occupations, etc

at the moment, NUS presidents are elected by sabatical officers only from each Uni...so we only get a say through them who we do elect

[The Garbage Disposal Unit]

had this debate the other day, lol

anyway, my view is that the NUS can be useful, but only with democratic reforms and with a strong leader who backs students struggles, which includes calling more protests, backing occupations, etc

at the moment, NUS presidents are elected by sabatical officers only from each Uni...so we only get a say through them who we do elect

No student "leader" (political authority) will ever back student struggles, since the spontaneity and breadth of those struggles will always lead to their irrelevance and the end of their political authority.

[Stranger Than Paradise]

No student "leader" (political authority) will ever back student struggles, since the spontaneity and breadth of those struggles will always lead to their irrelevance and the end of their political authority.

I don't think that's necessarily true. I think it would be possible for a leftie student leader to come out in support of struggles if it was clear that was the only direction they could take to control a struggle. Still wouldn't get us anywhere though.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

I don't think that's necessarily true. I think it would be possible for a leftie student leader to come out in support of struggles if it was clear that was the only direction they could take to control a struggle. Still wouldn't get us anywhere though.

An NUS leader is to the student struggle as a Labour Party leader is to the student struggle - irrelevant and not representative of those he or she is meant to represent.

The fact that Porter was chased away shows that the movement has radical elements. There is little adherence to the illusion that the NUS actually represents the students and this is very healthy.

Lets understand that the only way the NUS could 'control' this movement is if they did support the will of the students, but we have heard Porter continue to even denounce elements of the movement that he wishes to lead (his words on the events and on the fact that a separate demo was called for on the 29th of jan etc.). That's the nature of the NUS.

[Stranger Than Paradise]

An NUS leader is to the student struggle as a Labour Party leader is to the student struggle - irrelevant and not representative of those he or she is meant to represent.

I understand this. That's what I said.


The fact that Porter was chased away shows that the movement has radical elements. There is little adherence to the illusion that the NUS actually represents the students and this is very healthy.

But it's possible for such an organisation to try and manipulate a movement by going along with radical tactics and tendencies.

[scarletghoul]

Aaron Porter is fucking scum, too bad he was allowed to escape. If there were any anti-semitic comments then thats stupid and shouldnt be tolerated, though I would like to see more evidence than just some media guy saying he heard it.

If we could get some red as leader of the NUS it would obviously be great news and be good for consciousness and so on, even if the NUS as an organ is incapable of revolutionary activity.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

I understand this. That's what I said.



But it's possible for such an organisation to try and manipulate a movement by going along with radical tactics and tendencies.

True but the NUS would need a radical change for this to happen. It is a reformist org that has ties to Labour. What would be more likely in Britain would be the formation of a new student union with those radical elements. The NUS is far tangled in the web of government and beuracracy that put the cuts in place for it to become truly radical.

[Stranger Than Paradise]

If we could get some red as leader of the NUS it would obviously be great news and be good for consciousness and so on, even if the NUS as an organ is incapable of revolutionary activity.

I don't think it would be good for consciousness. Consciousness/class militancy won't be achieved through some "red leader" talking about stuff, leading a centralist, bureaucrat structure towards more radical politics. It'll be won in struggle, through self organisation.


True but the NUS would need a radical change for this to happen. It is a reformist org that has ties to Labour. What would be more likely in Britain would be the formation of a new student union with those radical elements. The NUS is far tangled in the web of government and beuracracy that put the cuts in place for it to become truly radical.

I won't argue it could become truly radical, such a structure can't ever become truly radical, and existing in such a time also. I was merely arguing that it could try and assimilate a radical movement, as has been done in the past by other unions worldwide.

[bricolage]

If there were any anti-semitic comments then thats stupid and shouldnt be tolerated, though I would like to see more evidence than just some media guy saying he heard it.
Most reports seem to indicate 'you're a tory too' was interpreted by the press as 'you're a tory jew'.

If we could get some red as leader of the NUS it would obviously be great news and be good for consciousness and so on, even if the NUS as an organ is incapable of revolutionary activity.
I doubt it would be that 'great news'. Jack Straw used to be NUS President and call for immediate communism and the like, it didn't get anywhere and he ended up being... well Jack Straw.
'Consciousness' isn't something shoved down throats by structures like the NUS, it emerges from real struggles, real struggles that said structures are incapable of participating in. Even beyond that the constant palava of left group x to fight left group y to unite with left group z to fight labour student to have control of the NUS to be ignored by whoever is in power is pretty much a waste of time. If we are talking about allocation of the limited energies available to the 'left' then I'd imagine they would be better placed in other areas.

[scarletghoul]

I don't think it would be good for consciousness. Consciousness/class militancy won't be achieved through some "red leader" talking about stuff, leading a centralist, bureaucrat structure towards more radical politics. It'll be won in struggle, through self organisation. What ?? I never said anything about trying to lead the NUS to radical politics. I just mean it would be a great propaganda platform. How could anyone dispute that ?

[Stranger Than Paradise]

What ?? I never said anything about trying to lead the NUS to radical politics. I just mean it would be a great propaganda platform. How could anyone dispute that ?

Sorry for suggesting you said that, I thought it was implied. As a propaganda platform no I don't think it would be particularly positive. The crux of it is, no matter what a union bureaucrat says they are by position opposed to radical, self organised struggle. As bricolage pointed out, people participating in actual struggles is where militancy/consciousness is built.

[TC]

Aaron Porter probably made up the anti-Semetic chants - because it sounds way better for him to be a victim chased off by anti-semitic rightwingers than for him to be rejected by students as a rightwinger

[Stranger Than Paradise]

Aaron Porter probably made up the anti-Semetic chants - because it sounds way better for him to be a victim chased off by anti-semitic rightwingers than for him to be rejected by students as a rightwinger

The Telegraph and Mail manipulated the protests and the anti-semetic claims emanate from them. "Aaron Porter, we know you, you're a fucking tory too" was what was chanted and you can see how they could easily claim otherwise.

[The Grey Blur]

anyone who thinks the left should abandon the NUS or that some sort of new revolutionary NUS will be created is an ultra-left idiot. "self-organisation" is just a buzz word, it means literally zero in this context. unfortunately the NUS does represent the majority of student opinion at the moment, although the leadership is clearly playing catch-up with the average student. the NUS' democratic structures should be reformed and left students should work inside and outside of it in building the anti-cuts fight, not attempt to create a 'pure' union which will be tiny, with zero resources, and will be an ultra-left circle jerk. i realise a lot of you bellends have the same approach to any union, not just the NUS, but this is addressed to those who have an understanding of the ebb-and-flow of class struggle and how the trade unions shift politically within that.

[bricolage]

unfortunately the NUS does represent the majority of student opinion at the moment,
In what way? Do you know how few people vote for NUS delegates? Do you know how little political influence the NUS has on most campus'?
While this argument could easily be made about more trade unions in terms of students the actual influence of the NUS is very marginal. It's only Labour Students and SWP/AWL/WP types that actually pay any attention to it. Most people don't even know or care when a conference might be taking place or have any idea what things come out of it.

"self-organisation" is just a buzz word, it means literally zero in this context.Except for the self-organisation of students on the streets, the self-organisation of University occupations, the self-organisation of anti-cuts groups etc etc. I'm not even giving politically judgement on these things just providing examples.

not attempt to create a 'pure' union which will be tiny, with zero resources, and will be an ultra-left circle jerk.I don't think anyone has suggested this.

i realise a lot of you bellends have the same approach to any union,Lovely...

not just the NUS, but this is addressed to those who have an understanding of the ebb-and-flow of class struggle and how the trade unions shift politically within that.Yeah and while I'm sure this argument would make a lot more sense in regards to actual trade unions I don't think you are really taking account of what role the NUS plays.

[ed miliband]

Will not back down to intimidation, and certainly not to racial abuse. We need unity to win for students.

http://twitter.com/AaronPorter

lol

[El Rojo]

you know that you are fucked when you need to call your opponents nazis to get ahead

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

anyone who thinks the left should abandon the NUS or that some sort of new revolutionary NUS will be created is an ultra-left idiot. "self-organisation" is just a buzz word, it means literally zero in this context. unfortunately the NUS does represent the majority of student opinion at the moment, although the leadership is clearly playing catch-up with the average student. the NUS' democratic structures should be reformed and left students should work inside and outside of it in building the anti-cuts fight, not attempt to create a 'pure' union which will be tiny, with zero resources, and will be an ultra-left circle jerk. i realise a lot of you bellends have the same approach to any union, not just the NUS, but this is addressed to those who have an understanding of the ebb-and-flow of class struggle and how the trade unions shift politically within that.
I think you have mistaken the NUS for a genuine trade union and not an organization that is essentially known for getting students discounts on condoms (or free condoms perhaps), putting pool tables in common rooms and putting on charity events. It is not a political body, its whole political direction has been in line with the Labour position - cut less, over time, don't raise the cap on fees (but don't remove them!). Do you think that the Labour Party has the same potential as the NUS in this regard? Could we reclaim the Labour Party? Can Red Ed be our new hero, side by side with Porter, in opposition to the government's neoliberal agenda?

Maybe I'm just a 'bellend', but I do not see the NUS as being capable of being a revolutionary force, and I lean more in favour of that crazy buzzword about students self organizing, as they have pretty much been doing, whilst the NUS continuously denounce them for their actions. I think that a new student union is more likely to be formed, one that is genuinely left and that genuinely represents the students, than the NUS adopting a truly radical position that reflects that of the students - this is only a hypothetical scenario; neither things are likely to happen, its just that one scenario is more likely than the other.

As another poster pointed out, student participation in the NUS is very low and the NUS is not a political force. The fact that their platform has been shunned by students, to the point of Aaron Porter being chased out of a demo, shows us that the NUS do not reflect the will of the students at all. We should listen to the students and accept their position with regards to the NUS. They do not feel represented by them and the left has to take that into account if it is to post as the alternative. If we tell the students that the NUS can represent them, then we are lying to them as much as if we tell them that the Labour Party can, or the Lib-Dems, or even the Tories.

NUS leaders are essentially New Labourite leaders in the making, NUS reps are yesmen to their paymasters. We have seen this on campuses local to me; since the student movement here (albeit small in this region) has drawn anti-capitalist conclusions, the NUS has shyed away from it completely. They are employed to 'represent' the students, but to the extent that this representation can be radical is small based on the NUS as an institution - one that is not independent as most trade unions are.

Again, maybe I'm just an ultra-left bellend.

[scarletghoul]

http://twitter.com/AaronPorter

lol
Its funny because he backed down to intimidation.

[Admiral Swagmeister G-Funk]

http://twitter.com/AaronPorter

lol
What a piece of shit. I can't believe he's actually using that shit to his ends!

[Stranger Than Paradise]

anyone who thinks the left should abandon the NUS or that some sort of new revolutionary NUS will be created is an ultra-left idiot.

Not quite sure what ultra-left means. Frankly I don't care what "the left" do. The majority of students have proven already that the NUS doesn't represent them. I don't know where this "revolutionary NUS" idea has come from. I can only think you were referring to my comments that it is not out of the question for trade union bureaucrats to adopt a radical stance to assimilate to a changing tide of militancy.



"self-organisation" is just a buzz word, it means literally zero in this context. unfortunately the NUS does represent the majority of student opinion at the moment

The same context where students have continually acted against the wishes of NUS stewards at demos. Where students have occupied their universities without union interference. The NUS has effectively become irrelevant in a short span of time, university anti-cuts groups have been set up independent of unions. It's not just a buzz word, it's the next step that we must see if this movement is going to grow, progress.

[ed miliband]

you know that you are fucked when you need to call your opponents nazis to get ahead

It's a bit like how the CPI and associated trade unions smeared Italian autonomists as fascists, including students who mobbed a CPI figure during a university occupation.

I think the guy was called Mario Lama, and they chanted "lamas belong in Tibet!" as they hauled him out. :)

[scarletghoul]

I think the guy was called Mario Lama, and they chanted "lamas belong in Tibet!" as they hauled him out. :)
:laugh:

[brigadista]

anyone know if he is related in any way to Shirley Porter?

the chant was " aaron porter we know you- you're a fucking tory too"